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Ostra
09-13-2003, 06:22 AM
Ive played Dark Forces, DF2: Jedi Knight, MoTS, and JK2:Jedi Oucast.

In JK you could use force pull in MP and take guns from a player. In JK2 they all but disabled that. I say it this way because i was never successful but from reading forums have heard others were so I dont want to say it was impossable, but i think it was.

My question is, even though its not in the FAQ and the games not out, does anyone know if you can only stop the enemy from firing for a second ala JK2? Or actually take the gun from their hands ala JK?

I ask for purely selfish reasons, i have very little luck against a gun user in MP. Alt fires in alot of guns can get away from your deflections and unless i ran away, i pretty much always died. The disarming was a way to even the battle up to give you a chance to close. Also stratigy came into play as i know some good players that would keep the best weapon (concussion) as a secondary so i pulled the first and they could quickly start hitting with the Concussion rifle. To me thats fair because it took thought and tactics rather then ALWAYS running around with the best weapon and just firing at anything you see.

So, anyone know the answer??

Kurgan
09-13-2003, 09:59 AM
In JK/MotS you pulled the gun away from the person. In JK2 you pull the whole person AND the gun (on level 3 anyway).

In all games, Absorb counterered pull, but now Push can counter pull (an equal or higher level) with that "block" animation (that then leaves you vulnerable to saber throw or other attacks for a split second.

In JK, the only weapon you couldn't pull away (besides fists) was the Lightsaber. In MotS it was very very difficult to pull away a characters primary weapon or just about any weapon from the Soldier class (if he had mana at least).

In JK2 they made it so the Bryar Pistol and Stun baton couldn't be pulled either.

I would guess that in JA MP you won't be able to pull the BlasTech or any of the sabers or fists (what else will non-Jedi have for a fall-back weapon?). I'm guessing that other classes will at least have their primary weapon unpullable. It kinda sucks, but it's Raven's choice on how to balance the game.

One thing that bugged me was the whole strategic aspect of pulling away objects from the environment (to yourself or to deny them to the enemy) in JK/MotS that was gone in JK2. This was present in both JK2 and JA single player, but it was NOT in JK2 Multiplayer.

I *suspect* and this is just a suspicion, that Push/Pull in JA MP will be the same as they were in JK2 MP, just with those new "round magnifying glass" visual effects.


That's a mod I'm surprised nobody ever tried to make. It would totally change the game. Playing tug of war with items. ; )


Of course we should remember that these are Jedi (or Sith) fighting each other, so it's hard to just yank weapons from each other all the time. Then again other dynamics have changed too.

In JK/MotS you could either block shots with your lightsaber or you had to dodge them. Explosives couldn't be blocked, so you had to dodge until you could get close enough to pull. And if they had absorb on? You just better be a bigger crack shot than the other guy!

In JK2 pulling was harder and more rare, but you could PUSH away most projectiles (some were harder than others of course). Of course you can't keep pushing forever until they run out of ammo (except with the Merr Sonn and maybe with the Concussion Rifle, we don't know....). The trick will be manuvering in for the kill while you do this, or working on getting that weapon to nail them (or distracting them long enough for your buddy to line up the shot). Protection is far weaker in JK2 than in JK or even MotS (now it is completely vulnerable to Force attacks and only reduces damage rather than absorbing it). But, it is still an effective means to surviving gun assaults for saber users (whereas absorb is for surviving force attacks).

The interesting part will be how the non-Jedi are balanced with the Jedi in Siege(remember Jedi vs. Merc? Or ProMod?).

Thazac
09-13-2003, 10:47 AM
Well, there ARE a few mods that allows you to pull items on the ground, namely the JediMod and most mods based on it's soure code...

Kurgan
09-13-2003, 10:57 AM
Thanks for pointing that out, didn't know that! Too bad the other changes aren't so great. ; p

I suppose with the source that one option could be isolated and used on its own...

TiBo
09-13-2003, 12:08 PM
Kurgan, try the Jedi Academy mod, i think the latest version is 3.0. It allows you to pull the items towards you and it still remains close to the original jk2 game(I mean without mods on). MInd you, there are a lot of stupid emoticons in the Jedi Academy mod, but its still good. And its server side only, so you dont have to download it.

Kurgan
09-13-2003, 02:53 PM
As long as it doesn't "nerf all the cheap moves" and add invincible emotes or "admin empowerment" then it's probably worth a look.. thanks.