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View Full Version : More people in Jedi Outcast than in Jedi Academy?


Master William
10-25-2003, 03:05 PM
I played Jedi Outcast one hour ago, and the server list went just boom.
I was using All Seeing Eye, and I compared the number of players and servers of JO with JA.

JO has more players. Why? JA is so much better. Or are they like those Counter-Strike guys who still play 1.5 when 1.6 is out?

snowman21
10-25-2003, 03:14 PM
well, jedi academy is a fairly young game. its possible that the JO players are just playing it until they can go to the store and buy JA, or save up enough money. maybe some people haven't even heard of academy yet 0_0.

Darth Kaan
10-25-2003, 04:15 PM
Originally posted by snowman21
well, jedi academy is a fairly young game. its possible that the JO players are just playing it until they can go to the store and buy JA, or save up enough money. maybe some people haven't even heard of academy yet 0_0.

That and the fact A LOT of servers are not showing up in JA because of a problem with the ingame browser.

Comm539
10-25-2003, 09:20 PM
yes but ase isnt an ingame browser.
You are correct william, there are more players in JK2 than JA. As i said, JA is dying although people dont like to admit it. Only a month after release, figures peaked and are now falling. Reason= obvious problems i frankly cant be bothered repeating. In short, raven better sort out the gameplay bugs in s/o combat...the main selling point of the game otherwise JA dies. The End.

MasterAristotle
10-26-2003, 02:14 AM
Only a month after release, figures peaked and are now falling. Reason= obvious problems i frankly cant be bothered repeating.

One sample does not a trend make.

noide
10-26-2003, 02:41 AM
Originally posted by MasterAristotle
One sample does not a trend make.

wtf.

Syzerian
10-26-2003, 04:59 AM
hes talking like yoda just mix the words around and it makes perfect sense

Akshara
10-26-2003, 09:04 AM
Several reasons...

1. The ingame server bug is keeping new players from seeing all the servers.

2. Anytime a sequel to a game is released, an infusion in the original game's interest happens in that community.

3. JO hardcores don't like the changes made in JA, and are sticking with what they know.

4. The economy sucks in America, so less people are rushing out to buy it right now, and fewer are investing in servers.

5. Many people who can't justify spending $50 right now are picking up JK2 instead since it's price has dramatically dropped.

6. JK2 was released in late spring right around the time of Episode II and the community's foundations grew over the summer break, which are still very strong today. JA was released after the summer was over with no supporting film release, just as school started... wait until around the holidays and early this summer. Things will change.

JA is not dying... it's just begun. More kids will get into this game closer to the Christmas break, and it will be a standout on the shelves for parents looking to buy a game as a gift for their kids. As anticipation to the next film rises, more people will join in as well. College students just spent all their cash on books and stuff for starting school again, and simply didn't have an extra $50 to blow. Plus the Jedi Academy books are extremely popluar with the young teen set, and I'm sure LA will target them with an ad campaign over the holiday season. Once winter settles in, many will join to get a break from the duldrums.

In the meantime, practice your skills and become a better player. By the time Episode III comes out, you'll be a Master Jedi on the servers. And when that time arrives, remember how you've been treated during this time by the noob snobs from JK2. Choose to not treat new people that way when your time comes... and it will.

"There's always a bigger fish." ~ Qui Gon Jinn

IG-64
10-26-2003, 11:40 AM
"There's always a bigger fish." ~ Qui Gon Jinn

ahh, the words of wisdom of Qui Gon. :rolleyes:

Scythefall
10-26-2003, 02:26 PM
Jedi Academy also limits playing on the same machine you're running a server on. It's true that with some basic browsing of forums you can find out how to select which ports you run your server and play out of to *work around* that flaw, but most people don't touch these kinds of forums with a 10 foot pole because of the huge amount of crap you have to sift through to find the post you need.

That's how I ended up here in the first place, was not being able to run a server and play on my machine which worked perfectly in the Jedi Outcast game. Now I just check back to see if Raven is offering a fix to their master server. It's amazing to me they're just letting it go like this.

Kurgan
10-26-2003, 04:12 PM
Just checked ASE (11:57 AM CST)

Jedi Academy: 1185/7681 players

Jedi Outcast: 726/4902 players


JK2 has been out 1 year 7 months.

JA has been out little over 1 month (1 month 8 days as of this post).

Also about a month ago I fired up a JK2 server for the first time (I had never really hosted before) and it showed 3 million "players" had connected to the master server (I assume since Raven restarted it in preparation for the launch of JA). Likewise a similar number of players were listed for JA around that time. So unless the master server is tallying both games as one (doubtful since they are seperate.... masterjk2 vs. masterjk3) then both games are getting played.

Keep telling yourself, JA is a sequel, not a patch. So people don't have to "upgrade" they can continue to play or run servers for both (like Amidala does for example).

The server browser bug in JA is the most likely culprite of the seemingly small online community right now. Most people who bought the game probably fire up the list and go "hmm... all the servers are full or password protected, bummer, oh well I guess I'll play some bots, oh the bots are too easy, time to play checkers on the zone." : (

NaiLz
10-27-2003, 12:26 AM
how about the concussion rifle sucking has left out the gunners from jedi knight 1 out in the dark because of all you newbs who dont like to do nothing but sabers. the gunplay in jk1 was elite and still is to this day. why cant they just bring back the concussion rifle like it was in jk1 just so the gunplay community from jk1 will play. they will get alot of people that way.

Amidala from Chop Shop
10-27-2003, 01:03 AM
Did you ever play Instagib in Jedi Knight II: Jedi Outcast? There was no Concussion Rifle in JKII but the Instagib mod eliminated all weapons but the Tenloss Disruptor Rifle and made it a 1-hit kill weapon. If you never bought JKII you can get it at a discount now. Then go to one of these servers:

Chop Shop Disruption Instagib 64.246.58.192

Wireplay.co.UK Instagib CTF 62.105.80.7

bygames.com Instagib CTF 194.117.138.253 (unfortunately will be shutting down next month)

Or you can make an Instagib mod for JA when the SDK comes out.

Kurgan
10-27-2003, 01:22 AM
Once the MP SDK is released you can mod the game to your heart's content.

There is a Jedi Knight Dark Forces II mod team out there, maybe you should track them down and lend them your help. If nobody does the work, it'll never happen...

Comm539
10-27-2003, 08:18 AM
Originally posted by Amidala from Chop Shop
Did you ever play Instagib in Jedi Knight II: Jedi Outcast? There was no Concussion Rifle in JKII but the Instagib mod eliminated all weapons but the Tenloss Disruptor Rifle and made it a 1-hit kill weapon. If you never bought JKII you can get it at a discount now. Then go to one of these servers:

Chop Shop Disruption Instagib 64.246.58.192

Wireplay.co.UK Instagib CTF 62.105.80.7

bygames.com Instagib CTF 194.117.138.253 (unfortunately will be shutting down next month)

Or you can make an Instagib mod for JA when the SDK comes out.


Thats the only gun game i liked :) (Unless they use aimbots, which most ultimately did)

Rumor
10-27-2003, 04:06 PM
too bad the aimbot was ****

Amidala from Chop Shop
10-27-2003, 06:15 PM
Originally posted by Comm539
Thats the only gun game i liked :) (Unless they use aimbots, which most ultimately did)

Although Quake III had an aimbot, according to http://www.counter-hack.net there was no Jedi Knight II-specific aimbot

http://www.counter-hack.net/content.php?page=jediknight2

There are some incredible Instagib players who play nothing but Instagib CTF for hours every day who are sometimes unfairly accused of using aimbots or other cheats. They rightly point out they wouldn't miss so often if they were using an aimbot. I do know some of them did things like alter their r_picmip values to greatly simplify the map's textures, making opposing players much easier to spot. That might make them appear to be using an aimbot since they could pick out their targets much more easily than players using normal settings. It sure makes the maps look strange, though.

ManaMana
10-27-2003, 06:41 PM
JK1 was actually the best, and still is, shoot-em up game...

But... Saber Batles? Pfff... :p :rolleyes:

But, I'm still playing JK1 :D :D !!!

Comm539
10-28-2003, 12:35 PM
valve detects ogl hacks.

Droniac
10-28-2003, 07:13 PM
ASE doesn't list all servers either...
ASE doesn't even show the correct server information unless you refresh each selected server about 10 times.
It's too bad there isn't a Pathfinder for Jedi Academy (or a functional in-game browser ;)).

Gamespy stats indicate that Jedi Knight 2 is losing players (as of about 1 week ago).
While JK2 was able to keep up the pace of JA (playerwise) since it's release, it's starting to 'lose' the race.

Whereas Jedi Academy is still following in the footsteps of Halo and Return to Castle Wolfenstein, Jedi Knight 2 had dropped to the very bottom of the page (below, believe it or not, Quake 2).
Sure, gamespy stats are incomplete, they show only part of all servers, but the same goes for ASE.


Besides, with the horrid clan-situation in Europe right now (there's basically no active ladders, save the ESL, because clanbase is still 'taking JA under consideration'), there's not much to 'go online for' (especially when it comes to Siege clans, as ESL doesn't provide Siege ladders, because their admins don't understand the gamemode (they actually think the minimum setting should be 8v8 :eek: lol)).

Ofcourse a little server browser patch would probably boost the amount of online players a little, as there's bound to be people out there who don't know of any replacements for in-game browsers.

Kurgan
10-28-2003, 11:28 PM
ASE doesn't list all servers either...
ASE doesn't even show the correct server information unless you refresh each selected server about 10 times.
It's too bad there isn't a Pathfinder for Jedi Academy (or a functional in-game browser ).

Well what DOES list all the servers then? (please tell me if you know...)

Tell me why ASE would list more JA servers than JK2? Is this a conspiracy involving some rapid JA fans working for ASE?

Basically this is how it worked for me (and some of this may be due to "adding favorites" and whatnot):


1) ASE (most servers)

2) Qtracker (almost exactly the same, minus a few, probably due to ASE saving servers and refreshing them I'm told)

3) Gamespy Arcade (mislabels CTF servers as CTY and lists a few JK2 (??) servers in the JA list) Lists probably 1/3 as many servers as ASE.

4) In-game browser (shows about 30 servers or less depending on when you refresh it)

And correct me if I'm wrong, but most external server browser programs can be set to refresh constantly if you want to.

FK | unnamed
10-29-2003, 12:14 AM
Originally posted by Amidala from Chop Shop
Although Quake III had an aimbot, according to http://www.counter-hack.net there was no Jedi Knight II-specific aimbot

http://www.counter-hack.net/content.php?page=jediknight2

There are some incredible Instagib players who play nothing but Instagib CTF for hours every day who are sometimes unfairly accused of using aimbots or other cheats. They rightly point out they wouldn't miss so often if they were using an aimbot. I do know some of them did things like alter their r_picmip values to greatly simplify the map's textures, making opposing players much easier to spot. That might make them appear to be using an aimbot since they could pick out their targets much more easily than players using normal settings. It sure makes the maps look strange, though.

Donít be too sure about that, I could link you if you liked.

;)

There were actually 3-4 open gl wall hacks, 2 server crash exe's (for 1.02/03) and two aimbots for jk2.

But you are correct in saying that 99.99999999999999999% of most instagib players played "clean".

Reason I say this was the 2 bots for jk2 were total crap compared to human aim.


There was one bot made for quake 3 (an older one, not ogc) that does work great in jk2 and gives you unreal instagib game (it's what was called an "auto shooter" not a true aimbot, it just fires when any client gets in the X hair).

This bot simply rapes in jk2 instagib (it was made for rail only instagib in quake 3) but I don't think almost anyone other than maybe a handful of people who came from quake 3 would even know what the name of it is let alone where to find it (it's a very old hack).

auto shooters are almost impossible to detect because the client does not jerk like with a bot that does the aiming.

the thing about an AS is all you need to do is "play normal" and just sweep the X hair in the direction of the client.

The bot does the "timing of the shots" part for you but it will look totally legit.

The only dead give away is the insane % of accuracy.

Even some of the best quake 3 players on the planet, and I'm talking about professionals who play in tournaments for thousands of dollars, don't have a 99% accuracy rating.

A 100% accuracy rate would be possible in a 1v1 match where few shots are fired, but I'm talking about a 10 man FFA where the guy is doing like 200-300+ shots per match.

MasterSidious
10-29-2003, 02:26 AM
I'm in JO but not in JA because I don't have it. I've heard of A LOT of ppl on JO saying that they will get it on Xmas (I will too) so maybe say 4 months from now there will prolly be more servers for JA than there ever was in JO due to the fact that JA is much better and more attuned to the gamer who wants a lot of unique stuff (vehicles flyable ones, siege, ect.) with also the enhanced saber :D and of course better SP.

BTW, QTracker really shows a lot of stuff, there's like 400 - 500 serers for JA all the time on that so if you really want to try right now to hook up with a lot of Ja players, go and get Qtrakcer 3.76 :D

Kurgan
10-29-2003, 03:49 AM
Just so you know, I won't tolerate any posting of aimbots or server crash hacks, etc. If you're going to discuss that, do it someplace else.

I know cheats exist, scripts are fine, but keep that other crap out of here. And if you want to be productive, email the info to Raven so they can patch it (if that's possible).

; P

Comm539
10-30-2003, 02:55 PM
Originally posted by Kurgan
I know cheats exist, scripts are fine


wtf???? Why are scripts fine?

Actually theres a kata script going around rofl. Seriously it must be for the people with fat fingers who cant press 2 kin buttons.

Prime
10-30-2003, 03:03 PM
Originally posted by Comm539
wtf???? Why are scripts fine?

Actually theres a kata script going around rofl. Seriously it must be for the people with fat fingers who cant press 2 kin buttons. Seriously. I can understand some people wanting to script complex moves, but this is pressing two buttons at the same time, for goodness sake. Are some people that inept?

Comm539
10-30-2003, 03:05 PM
cough...kick was double tap jump...cough

Prime
10-30-2003, 03:09 PM
I know some people scripted that too, but I never saw the need...

Rumor
10-30-2003, 03:23 PM
haha lots of times with my kata's the kata starts and does like half a swing then it throws my saber and when it comes back it finishes the kata rofl. tons of damage doing that :P

Kurgan
10-31-2003, 12:19 AM
Well because scripts were always intended to be in the game and absolutely no effort was made to remove them, even though the capability existed in the hands of Raven.

Cheats on the other hand (or I should say exploits, as opposed to cheats using devmap etc) were not intended to be in the game (they are bugs after all) and so they were removed whenever discovered in official patches.

If the developers knew about them and had the ability to remove them and made no effort to remove them, I think we can safely say that they were intended to be used.

Would a toggle switch for the admin to remove all binds that used more than one key or a vstr command be nice?

Sure, but it's never been done in JK2 or JA, so I don't see it happening in the next patch.