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The Undisputed
11-02-2003, 10:29 PM
Allright,

It is undoubtedly the most eminent truth that Saber only ctf players are the most highly skilled players in most of the jedi outcast game itself. Even all that kept aside, the clans like div, f/<, rk, ms3 prove that with the right team play, anything is possible.

As the metamorphosis of a butterfly, gamers evolve from being "Padawans" to more experienced players through time.

But as many have already stated ( and I, quite so agree with them), with the advent of Jedi academy many things have been ignored leaving the game, to an obvious end.

Ctf used to be so much better in jedi outcast, and it is of no surprise to see, people still play s/o ctf in jedi outcast, in itslef, proving that s/o ctf is much better in jedi outcast. And the question of killing an fc (lol) will forlong remain a really hard task to accomplish with the removal of kicks, pull throw and the special moves being nerfed to the force.

Well, just want your opinions, which game has better saber only ctf, jedi Academy or jedi outcast? Feel free to post your comments, but please, do not flame or take things said by other people personally

Master_Payne
11-02-2003, 10:50 PM
Ok. I might be the only one who likes JA s/o ctf but well, please din't flame.

I like JA because its diversity(SP?) it has a lot of moves that when pulled correctly work fine.

I'm a hardcore CFT full guns players, but I also play some S/O and taking apart the fact that I (note "I") like more ctf full force full weapons s/o in jo is not that bad, a good team can do everithing, we play like this:
Damge on sabers default, regen on 100 (half default) that's because the force nerf, but if you get used it works. oh, and g_debugmelee 1 (the unlimited wall hanging has proved to be very usefull for us).

So before the flame on me starts:

s/o ctf in jo was good and I enjoyed a lot, but it becomes monotone as hell, now JA has variety, but without team is complety f***ed up, so I agree from a certain point of view with most of you.

Or maybe we are just more adaptable than others because our community cover all gametypes (we miss jedimaster! we might be crazy :P).

Well that's all, please don't flame because anyways we will never meet on a server because I play with weapons and seems that you (the s/o community) has no tolerance for them.
In case you wonder I prefer Duel over all gametypes and I'm not a N00b :P.

Again please don't flame on me ;).

[fk]myth.
11-02-2003, 10:59 PM
First off I'd like to state that JO S/O CTF is much better in every aspect than JA. Especially seeing as how the ratio of Full Weapons to Saber Only CTF servers is about 10:1.

The variety in JA is only good when you're playing against some random newbie who doesn't know what the hell he is doing. The new moves that were added to this game were: Kata, roll-stab, and butterfly. The only way you could be hit by any of these moves is that if you are standing still or walk right into one. With the removal of kick, there is now no way to attempt to stop a Flag Carrier who a) Has skill and b) Has an energizer, which sums up the entire Flag Carrier population in clan matches. The game ends in a stalemate. That's why all of the top S/O CTF clans like fk, diverse, etc have all stayed in JO. There is no competetive gameplay in JA, and hopefully once it is patched, or if it isn't patched, the SDK is released, we can all get back to playing the gametype we love.

The moral of the story is: CVARs are not evil

The Undisputed
11-02-2003, 10:59 PM
lol hehe

this is not a flame, I play ctf guns too!! but i prefer ctf saber only(imo it takes more skill, but thats just my opinion, heh)

Instagib rocks too btw!!!

The Undisputed
11-02-2003, 11:01 PM
Totally agree with myth on that one.

Sam Fisher
11-02-2003, 11:05 PM
Originally posted by The Undisputed
Instagib rocks too btw!!!


I hear ya! That is like the only reason I play JO anymore, especially, the Chop Shop Instagib server:D

Kurgan
11-02-2003, 11:07 PM
All of what you said is an opinion.

What makes Sabers Only CTF the "most skilled gametype" or the players of this gametype the "most skilled" in JK2?

The fact is, the self-proclaimed "masters" of this gametype from FallenKnightsClan all universally hate Jedi Academy for the reason that they say that Sabers Only CTF is "ruined" because of "nerfs" (whatever those might be) and because flip kicks aren't available.

Thus they say a "Flag Carrier is unstoppable" and since this is the only gametype they truly enjoy and believe requires any skill, they refuse to play the game.

There's nothing that can be done at this point to satisfy their demands.

All I can suggest to them is that when the SDK comes out (if it's not possible to code such a mod already), they go ahead and make a mod that "fixes" the game to how they want it to be. In the meantime they should just play JK2 and enjoy it since it's "the perfect game" for them and stop whining hear as if this community is to blame for the decisions Raven made in making their game.

Personally it doesn't bother me if Sabers Only CTF is truly "ruined" as they say, since I never really cared for it. They can call me a "n00b" all day long if they like, but as before, that's only their biased opinion.

Likewise I would say that since they have not mastered the intricasies and skill of fists only Duel, they cannot compare to my skill. It's a likewise biased opinion.

One doesn't have to be stupid, a n00b, or a little kid if they disagree with an opinion about a subjective gameplay choice.

The fact is they unfairly blame this community at LucasForums for "ruining" "their game" because they assume that Raven Software looked at these forums, read the posts of a few vocal "saber n00bies" and changed the game to how those few people wanted it, and so they must have their revenge by spamming whining threads about it every so often. Honestly that will accomplish nothing... talk to Raven and LucasArts.

If they won't listen to you, oh well...

Personally I don't think many of these Sabers Only CTF advocates are really interested in making mods or debating, but rather "rubbing in" what they see as collective blame based on a superiority complex. A few may wish to argue this point, but the behavior of certain individuals shows otherwise...

They're welcome to their opinion, I'm just sick of hearing the whining, that's all. So get to work on that mod already...

The argument is almost two months old already (it began as soon as the warez version came out and people started judging the game based on it).

All you're doing is beating a dead horse.


To sum up: Chances are you aren't going to be happy with the patch, so put your money where your mouth is and make the mod or stop whining about it fruitlessly and scape-goat flaming.

The Undisputed
11-02-2003, 11:14 PM
Ok kurgon, I asked for your opinion, i didnt ask u to correct my faults.

thank you

The Undisputed
11-02-2003, 11:17 PM
Who mved this post? Why is it in editing? wtf...read the topic... this is pathetic

Master_Payne
11-02-2003, 11:24 PM
Well about the line "a flag carrier is unstopable on JA"... I agree I once get the enemy flag and with just a friend aiding me (and two newbies dooing nothing) keep a 8 players team at line until one by one they get bored, disconnect and we win :p

Also we play without timelimit yes we are crazy and now for more fun "we" are a community of about 40 players :P funny because in our contry 7 of each 10 players are n00bs. but this is not totally true.

With even teams (skills more than number) is possible kill a fc (needs at least 8 per team that now what they do)

I have the flag and a teammate protects me (not necessary heal/energize) push and pull seems prety usefull to take the of (unless they have absorb :S) the idea is survive while you have half your team attacking the enemy fc and the remaining 2 in mid-line so yes it requieres a lot of skills, take the 1 to 3 fc protecters and then the fc before they respawn, really challenging, way more the full weapons (blastech may work as sniper :)"

and with diversity I left katas out, because they rarely work on ctf, katas are meant to... kill n00bs? I haven't died once from a kata, but rolling stab, lunge and the yellow special sometimes work.

In my experience CTF is all about timing, hit the fc when he least expect it and at the same time someone takes care of the "helpers".

Maybe is because 70% of the people wich I play are N00bs, or maybe I'll just shut up and go study phisics :P.

I agree s/o ctf on JA is a hell to play but is also really fun, for me s/o ctf on jo becomes monotone and JA s/o ctf ends about 80% 1 - 0 on scores... well I'm stuck with weapons I hope you get an easy solution for your gametype, but just for realism if you manage to get kicks back please leave them with 10 damage (half that in jo) for a) in ctf is most used to throw off a ledge and b) in ffa will be not so whored, I mean my character is a Jedi/SIth how can recive less kicks than I do? ... I have never been kicked on the face tough?.

Well I'll go to eat now, boss is calling me out of the PC.

The Undisputed
11-02-2003, 11:30 PM
lol

This is a random ctf server in Jedi academy saber only:

Everyones just scattered like flies 1)either trying to get the enemy fc 2) trying to get the enemy flag.

This is a random ctf saber only server in Jedi Outcast:

In about a team of 8 players, 2 are the fcs(or more), one caps while the other flag sits to make sure they opposite team doesnt score, two most definately gaurd the fc, both of whom are dark and keep energising eachother so they dont run out of force, and the rest return

more organized? most definatelty yes, team play? muuch better

Kurgan
11-03-2003, 02:37 AM
Ok kurgon, I asked for your opinion, i didnt ask u to correct my faults.

thank you

Relax... every person who posts this argument acts like it's an undisputed (pardon the pun) fact and that it's the first time anyone has heard it. Maybe you're new around here and didn't realize that this was a well worn and cliched argument, and so I hope you didn't take my reponse the wrong way.

That post was also my opinion, you don't have to agree with it at all. I moved it here to Editing Requests because that's basically what it comes down to.

JA and JK2 are different games. You want JA to be more like JK2 and so the logical way to accomplish that is through editing. Thus, it fits here just fine. Many of your S/O FF CTF buddies have admitted as much and thrown their hopes in with the editing community. Why not join them?

I just don't see the point in recycling the same arguments every week about how JA Sabers Only CTF sucks.

Unless of course you believe that complaining on the forums will lead the Raven team to patch the game to your specifications, but I think in that regard emailing or PMing them with your thoughts would be a much more direct route (and would avoid the flame wars that usually erupt from these kinds of threads).


As for my experience, I don't play Sabers Only CTF (not since the original JK, where I found it to be boring and frustrating for the most part). In regular CTF (with all weapons and powers) it's usually quite fun and the vast majority of people I've played with know what they're doing and play offense and defense quite well. And these are your public servers, not some organized clan-based tournament ladders, and despite the stereotype of "clueless n00bs" most people at least know the basics of the game and try to work as a team.

About the only gametype I play where people are often clueless is Siege, but that's understandable because there's no real bot support and it's a new thing in the series (though anybody who's played RTCW and Assault in UT probably has some idea how to play). Though again, there are also plenty of people who know how to play who "teach" their teammates as they play. I go out of my way to show people how to play as well, when I have time.

But anyway, lack of experience or "good players" is not a sign of a problem with the game. Though it could be possible that many "good players" don't know about the server bug (hard as that may be to believe) and so can't hook up, I think that eventually people will learn and you'll have the same level of competition you had in JK2. Though again, if the gameplay is your trouble, turn to editing...


Though, this discussion COULD move into the Strategy Shack if you're going to discuss strategies, rather than simply bemoan the death of the game type... just let me know.

Kurgan
11-03-2003, 02:56 AM
This will probably be my last post in this thread, but some stats I just pulled off of ASE:

JK2 (CTF):

88 CTF players total.
25 players on "Sabers Only" CTF servers.

Total players in ALL JK2 games at this time: 430.


JA (CTF):

22 CTF players total.
0 players on "Sabers Only" CTF servers. (There was only one German server listed for Sabers Only CTF).

Total players in ALL JA games at this time: 866.

I did this scan at 10:40pm CST on Sunday night.


Incidentally out of all the JK2 mods that ASE filters for (Vulcanus Admin Mod, OmniMod, JediPLUS, JK2++, ProMod, JediMoves Mod, JediMod, xMod, Duelers, Gen-X, ForceMod, Balance of the Force, Jedi Academy Mod, other) Jedi Academy Mod was by far the one with the most players, 248. xMod had 10 people and JediPlus had 19, the rest (if they had any players at all) were single digit.

23 JK2 players were still playing 1.03. 95 were still playing 1.02. The vast majority of JK2 players were playing FFA on 1.04 though.

Most JA players are also playing FFA. With Siege being the third most popular gametype (93 players at this time).The Second most popular JA gametype is Duel with 122 players.

Interestingly, "No Force" (although ASE may be counting even one force power disabled on a server as "no force") is more popular than "Full Force" in Jedi Academy, the opposite of Jedi Outcast (at this moment).

JK2 of course has FFA first with CTF being second place (and the other gametypes being so small as to be insignificant in comparison).

Just interesting... Last week there were a lot more people playing, but anyway, food for thought.

The Undisputed
11-03-2003, 08:21 AM
Allright Kurgon, I wasn't gonna do this but...

use that rusty brain of yours once in a while and think, no one was arguing untill you came, the topic was going really good with very decent replies, but you had to kill it, damn.

and for your idiotic post to back up your reason for moving this post, hahahaha that is the most stupid thing I've heard in a long time, I'm the one that made this topic so I should know what I'm asking in this topic, I'm asking for other people's opinions as to which game they like better in saber only ctf, lol hahahahahah, How is that "You want JA to be more like JK2 and so the logical way to accomplish that is through editing."? lol gez, they hire such goofballs for admins, I think should I apply to lucasarts forums admin, just to be fair to people.

Allright, I dont want to hold grudges or anything, but 1) My opnion is a self-proclaimed opinion and in truth, is a fact until and unless you can prove otherwise 2) If you think people who play saber only ctf in ja are better and "more skilled" than us (ppl who play jo s/o ctf) lets have a match, and I'm dead serious, for once and for all, let us own your newbie asses and throw it to your face, for all your blabbering that, you are nothing but an idiot, who likes to whine on other ppls decent topics just because they think our opinions suck, do you live in America? if you don't I'd really not be surprised, lol, we have this amendment in the constitution, that says "freedom of speech", hence freedom to express yourself, if you don't like our opinions, its fine, but don't degrade us by saying our opinions are worthless 3) if you have an opinion of yourself, post a topic about it to get replies from ppl who agree with you, dont post replies saying our opinions suck, just post your opinion instead, thats all we need thanks 4)once again, think before you make hasty decisions, and if you can, try and understand what other people are talking about, I know it can be hard when your ego shows up all the time , but its better to do it. I was looking for opinions, not suggestions on how to make Jedi academy better, so in future, when you are about to make a stupid decision like moving this topic to a totally irrelevant section, please think about it.

And your not the one who decides "There's nothing that can be done at this point to satisfy their demands", Lucasarts is, so stop your whining and grow up for once.

"Personally it doesn't bother me if Sabers Only CTF is truly 'ruined' as they say, since I never really cared for it."

If it doesn't, then don't reply to topics that don't concern you.

"To sum up: Chances are you aren't going to be happy with the patch, so put your money where your mouth is and make the mod or stop whining about it fruitlessly and scape-goat flaming."

Allright, YOU dont THINK for US, if the patch is released with the suitable alternate, ofcourse we will be happy. Dude, you need to realize, not everyone is a mod designer, WE don't know hardcore programming so we can't do what your asking us to, or atleast I can't.

"All you're doing is beating a dead horse."

Then why the hell are you replying to topic thats already been fortold a thousand times?Jesus christ, even your assumptions are lame.

Lol hahahahaha you talk about cliches inn other peoples arguments right? Want to see a major cliche in your argument, I just read your other post :

"I just don't see the point in recycling the same arguments every week about how JA Sabers Only CTF sucks."

Read the topic, I didn't make a topic asking people if they thought Jedi Academy saber only ctf sucked, I asked them which one was better, IF YOU really think that Jedi Academy ctf is good the way it is, then why do you ASSUME that this is a topic saying Jedi Academy ctf sucks?

And I could care the least what game types you play, because I play a lot of gametypes too, but out of all of them ctf stands out to me, because its not just hit eachother with a saber, its pure teamplay, and if your team fails to accomplish such task, then you loose.

MOVE this TOPIC back where it belongs, (watch that sky reaching ego of yours kick in right now).


"That post was also my opinion, you don't have to agree with it at all."

your right, I don't agree with it, and you don't agree with posts either, but just post your opinions, don't tell other people their opinions are faulty, jesus.

If your sick of ppl complaining about the kicks or whatever, just ignore it, don't have to reply to every single topic they post.

Akshara
11-03-2003, 01:37 PM
Undisputed... you're way out of line.

the topic was going really good with very decent replies
No... it was basically being ignored because it's a dead subject that most of us are sick of debating. Why not run a search and add your opinion to the prior discussions before posting a new thread with a poll.

I'm asking for other people's opinions as to which game they like better in saber only ctf

Ok... I like JA S/O CTF better. A whole lOt better. Now we'll see if you can actually accept a differing opinion gracefully or not.

My opnion is a self-proclaimed opinion and in truth, is a fact until and unless you can prove otherwise

If you're so sure that your self-proclaimed opinion is a fact, then why even bother posting a poll? There's no point in having a poll on a subject if the outcome is pre-destined... unless your desire is to simply create a home for all those who hate the game, and stir things up a little bit... having read your heated reply to Kurgan, that's definitely what it appears you wanted to do in the first place.

Kurgan's post speaks for a lOt, if not the majority, of people around here. If you don't like hearing it - and other opinons which disagree with yours - then maybe don't start a subject asking for opinions.

I for one did play S/O CTF in JK2. I've also been playing the extremely enjoyable and competitive CTF in EF:Voy for almost four years. And IMHO, the CTF in JA is a whole lot more fun than it was in JK2... and yes, I'm referring to S/O CTF as well. I've played on several public S/O CTF servers where we had awesome teamplay happening with only 6 per side.... rarely have I encountered this supposed "unorganized" style of play in where it's "impossible" to catch the FC which you and a few others say fills the JA servers - and I've probably logged at least as much, if not a whole lot more, actual time playing S/O CTF in JA than you have.

But see... according to the few JK2 l337 who repeatedly bring this subject up as a "fact, not an option"... simply because I feel this way must mean that I'm a noob who couldn't play S/O CTF in JK2 very well and who's opinion isn't worth the screen space it's typed on. Puh-leeezzz...

Bottom line, and the reason why this discussion is dead on these forums, is anytime someone like me steps forward and says, "Hey it's awesome! There's nothing wrong with S/O CTF at all!", then the same small group of JK veterans who are l337 spem'n the bordz will pop up and say one of a few things: 1) "You're obviously not a good player"; 2) "Get your head out of your ass"; 3) "You should sit in on a league match and see how real players do it"; or 4) "Well only nOOb players would think that way"... followed by a disertation on how it requires absolutely no skill to play JA, that it's impossible to catch the FC and pointless for competition, and that anybody who doesn't agree obviously is an inferior player.

And so you're gonna tell me that the above somehow does not apply to this supposed "Poll", and that you genuinely are looking for the opinons from this community on this subject from an impartial POV? Right... sure.

The other reason this thread got moved is to keep it from flaming the main forum with yet another thread about how much the JK2 l337 TWL thinks JA sucks ass. It IS a mod request, and I for one am glad to not have to see it on the main page everyday.

The truth is that most (not all) of the people repeatedly screaming about JA sucking eggs for CTF all come from the same batch of beta testers who labelled that game as crap and stopped even bothering to play it less than a couple of weeks after it was released. Meanwhile, the rest of us who love it have been playing and getting both pretty good and used to the new gameplay. If one doesn't compare JA to how it's "supposed to be" and simply plays it with an open mind, it has every bit if not more of the potential to be a truly competitive and engaging online experience as JK2 did when it first came out too.

My vote... leave both S/O CTF and this thread right where they are. So stick that in your pipe and smoke it.

scarlet
11-03-2003, 02:12 PM
Originally posted by Kurgan
There's nothing that can be done at this point to satisfy their demands.

Personally it doesn't bother me if Sabers Only CTF is truly "ruined" as they say, since I never really cared for it.

Likewise I would say that since they have not mastered the intricasies and skill of fists only Duel, they cannot compare to my skill. It's a likewise biased opinion.

One doesn't have to be stupid, a n00b, or a little kid if they disagree with an opinion about a subjective gameplay choice.

1. there is something that can be done: release the SDK

2. that's great, but a lot of people do care for it, so i don't get the relevance here

3. do you really believe there is as much complexity in a fists only duel as s/o ctf? wait, you don't care for s/o ctf, so i'm guessing you've never gotten to play with anyone halfway good.

4. ok... this can be looked at both ways: are you saying that we have the right to not want/agree to playing other modes? because that's what we're already doing.

but the main point is this: they could settle it if they just released the SDK or created the server option of allowing kicks or not. until then, competitive s/o ctf is nothing at all, and i don't care if you don't worry about it (since you don't play s/o ctf), but i know many people who do.

scarlet
11-03-2003, 02:24 PM
and akshara, i don't care if you don't like being told that you're not good, get your head out of your ass, etc., but i HAVE tried playing ja s/o ctf and, for example, i was playing with a buddy of mine from jo, we were on opposite teams, 12 people in the server, and my friend and i had the flags. we held them for 20 minutes, from the beginning of the map until we disconnected because it was ridiculous. i had one energizer and i'm guessing he did too, and that was ALL i needed to stay alive the whole time. so, although i hate to say this to you, it is extremely simple to stay alive as an fc, and if you were playing people who found it difficult, then obviously they have no idea how to evade being killed.

oh, and just to let you know, in s/o ctf in jo i wasn't even a capper, i was a returner. i couldn't imagine the bore it would be with actual skilled cappers.

and it sounds like you didn't like jk2 s/o ctf much, so i'm guessing you didn't play it for long? i have never seen your name in ANY ctf server, so would you post any other names you've gone by? because i'm doubting you have any real experience in jk2 s/o ctf, and how it makes ja s/o ctf look ridiculously easy.

Akshara
11-03-2003, 03:50 PM
i don't care if you don't like being told that you're not good, get your head out of your ass, etc.,
This isn't about me personally... I've seen this kind of reply posted to just about anyone who says they think that JA S/O CTF is either a lot of fun or just fine as it is. And it is tiring getting insulted all the time by self-proclaimed "experts" for simply participating around here...

so, although i hate to say this to you, it is extremely simple to stay alive as an fc, and if you were playing people who found it difficult, then obviously they have no idea how to evade being killed.

And so again, we meet another who presumes one must be an idiot or playing with idiots to actually make a kill on a skilled FC. :Sheesh...:

I'm not talking about playing with only idiots or "noobs" online. What I am saying is that I've experienced playing JA S/O CTF on a public server with other good players in a strong teamwork environment, and though it wasn't easy to get the flag back, it was by no means impossible.

If one's defensive team has sufficient skill and determination - along with good anticipation of the techinques the other team will probably employ to hold onto the flag - then it is not impossible to kill the FC and return one's flag. Another technique for winning the game is to have a strong defense that doesn't allow the flag to be captured in the first place; or if it is, doesn't allow the FC to escape the base. There are lots of ways for a relatively skilled and thoughtful team to win. But I've already had this argument several times now on this forum alone, and am not going to get drawn into another debate having to prove this is possible. Believe what you want...

and it sounds like you didn't like jk2 s/o ctf much, so i'm guessing you didn't play it for long?
I got bored with the game and went back to EF:Voy CTF shorty after the release of the 1.03 patch. It just wasn't much fun for me - which was simply a personal taste preference combined with the amount of time available for me to play then. It was not a decision made because I had noobish skill and couldn't stand the heat, as is usually implied when I say that it wasn't fun to play anymore and so I stopped.

i have never seen your name in ANY ctf server, so would you post any other names you've gone by? because i'm doubting you have any real experience in jk2 s/o ctf and how it makes ja s/o ctf look ridiculously easy
This isn't a discussion on whether JK2 s/o ctf is more difficult than JA or not... that's been proposed in great detail by the JO veteran community, and though that's still a debatable issue, to many of you it's obviously the truth. The question is which version is better than the other... and imho, the answer is JA. I actually like that it's accessible to a wider audience, instead of simply the uber-skilled JO l337 class. To me it makes for a more varied and enjoyable online experience in the public non-clan/league domain, which is where a lot of us prefer to play. Plus I'm one of the original JO players who thought the introduction of the Kick Spam was simply idiotic... somehow it eventually became a preferred skil. Whatever...

However to your other comments...

:roleyess:

Whether one chooses to play online in an "official" capacity or not with a consistent name under a clan, league, ladder, or whatever, has absolutely nothing to do with whether or not they have any skill as player. There are a lot of players online (ie, the majority) who don't participate in an official capacity, or use a consistent and recogniable identity, yet have the potential to kick serious ass on any given day.

However, I have nothing to prove to you, nor do I feel compelled to. Though it's likely this stance will increase your presumptions that I obviously must suck... who exactly cares? Over the years I've used many names online depending on where my life was at. Currently my ingame persona is Zhen Jou, though that might very well change at some point as well. If you see me in the servers, challenge me to a duel or something. Otherwise, may the schwartz be with you...

[fk]myth.
11-03-2003, 06:49 PM
=X=Master HeX has already decided, with a team of modding experts, to fix the errors in JA S/O CTF in the 2nd installment of xMOD, all he is waiting for is the SDK.

The problem is that if two good teams are playing a game, it is not possible to kill the flag carrier without luck. I understand CTF isn't the most popular gametype, but it is to most of us. We coughed up our 50 dollars to play this game, so our voices can and will be heard. Our gametype is, yes, ruined. Why? Because it is unplayable. In my mind, it is a defect. Every game ends in stalemate, unless by chance a team scores. That is not how CTF is supposed to be played.

I know Raven was thinking "everyone is whining about kick whoring, so lets remove it". They have to realise that by removing a concept from a game, you are going to get the other half of the community after you. Let's say they added kick in without a cvar in the next patch. I'm sure their would be just as many threads wanting kick to be removed just as there were wanting kick returned. Thats why if they added a CVAR, everyone would be happy, and this argument would be once and for all done.

Again, if they only added a cvar, like they do everything else, there wouldn't need to be so many hours wasted on this pathetic argument that will go back and forth until xMOD or a patch adding a cvar is released. A simple g_allowkick 0-1 would be fine. If Raven doesn't do it, Hex will, end of story. Why Raven leaves up all this editing to modders I will never know.

Raven: Removing or adding gameplay elements without a cvar is bad practice. There are tons of other cvars, why can't we have this one?

The Undisputed
11-03-2003, 07:19 PM
Omg Myth, Your my Hero!!!!!

ALL hail to MASTER X!!!!!

The Undisputed
11-03-2003, 07:24 PM
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Akshara
[B]Undisputed... you're way out of line.


"No... it was basically being ignored because it's a dead subject that most of us are sick of debating. Why not run a search and add your opinion to the prior discussions before posting a new thread with a poll."

Aha, and how come I'm still getting replies?

"Ok... I like JA S/O CTF better. A whole lOt better. Now we'll see if you can actually accept a differing opinion gracefully or not."

Lol, like I said, thats your opinion and I respect it just like I would expect you to respect mine

"If you're so sure that your self-proclaimed opinion is a fact, then why even bother posting a poll? There's no point in having a poll on a subject if the outcome is pre-destined..."

Because I want to know other people think, and so far, I think outcast got 8 votes :cool: :cool: