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FK | unnamed
11-27-2003, 10:58 PM
xMOD 2 test server @

64.81.143.34 - Featuring the return of flip-kick


Hex and the =X= mod crew are back in biz and like they did in Jedi Outcast, they are dedicated in putting out a serious competition mod that addresses game play issues instead of focusing on Yoda models and kissing emotes.

In Outcast =X= mod was one of the most updated mods made. They constantly were listening to the competitive community and making tweaks and adjustments so as to bring the game play as close to perfect as possible, and Iím sure it wonít be any different in Academy.

So for those of you who run servers and feel that the force/saber aspects of Academy are just too simplistic and mundane to provide a true serious competitive environment, keep an eye on this mod and consider running it on your servers once the full version goes live.

A lot of things still need to be done, but their main goal is the removal of a lot of the nerfing that was done from the Outcast to Academy transition, as well as just plain tightening up a lot of the sloppy, random game play that is present in base JA.

Darth Kaan
11-27-2003, 11:10 PM
I am not an Elite competitive player, but I am glad to hear the competitive community will be firing back up in JA!

Lathain Valtiel
11-27-2003, 11:12 PM
Yawn.... Next.

vert1go
11-27-2003, 11:15 PM
Any idea if/when this is available for download? Also I know it's made by players who know basically everything about the sabers/force side of the game, but, any changes to anything that'll effect Guns play?

I know I could go and play it hehe, but it's a US server and well, I'm not into jka enough anymore to go and play somewhere with high ping. :x

Lathain Valtiel
11-27-2003, 11:17 PM
Meh. This title is by default provocative and laughable, but I digress. Why not rename it to: "Want Jedi Academy turned Jedi Outcast gameplay? Join here!" So much more.. true.

FK | unnamed
11-27-2003, 11:51 PM
do me a favor, go start a "who would win in a fight: master yoda or spider-man?" thread over in the swamp and gtfo of this thread.

this thread was to inform the general public as well as server admins, that this mod provides an alternative for players who dislike the sloppy, random and insanely simplistic Full Force Saber Only game play in Academy.

You want to run around pretending to be darth Chewbacca?

Great, more power to you, have fun.

But the fact remains there are a hell of a lot of people bought this game and didn't like all the nerfing, and hence this mod turns things up a notch and gives them back more complex game play.


Like I said, you don't like it, gtfo of here.


check out the mods progress here:

http://x.fragism.com/forum/index.php?sid=a79af894783d044dd0893c4a342a3822


the =X= guys are very supportive when it comes to player feedback, find a bug? Tell them. Feel some tweaks are needed here and there? Same thing.

Lathain Valtiel
11-28-2003, 12:03 AM
Now now child, while i expected such a response the fact of the matter is that you are basically turning JA into JO. Hell, you practically admit it in the post.

To describe turning JA into JO as 'hardcore' (LOL) JA gameplay is thus by default plain idiotic and actually fairly provocative. Be honest to yourselves and rename the title to something more to the point as I described above.

That response is also doubly stupid as most people who know me will say that your generalization of me is so way off it's funny. I make it a point to hunt down the people you described.

I have the right to my opinion, and it is also not in your power to tell me to not state it here. So do yourself a favor and cut the bull.

Tesla
11-28-2003, 12:39 AM
No thank you, i don't plan on playing JO MP ever. :p

JA MP is fine, minor bugs and glitchs...but everything else is fine IMHO, have fun with you "Jedi Out-ademy MP" though. ;)

FLaM-DraG
11-28-2003, 12:50 AM
Sounds like some of us want to turn this game into Counter-Strike or Quake 3... How about we play the game for what it is? Star Wars. It's a game where you swing lightsabers, it's original enough. Even if it's not 'optimized' to meet your needs, it still keeps most of us from watching paint dry all day. :D

Lathain Valtiel
11-28-2003, 01:32 AM
Originally posted by Tesla
No thank you, i don't plan on playing JO MP ever. :p

JA MP is fine, minor bugs and glitchs...but everything else is fine IMHO, have fun with you "Jedi Out-ademy MP" though. ;)

That make me chuckle.

Darth Kaan
11-28-2003, 01:34 AM
To me, Unnamed was simply letting those interested in high level competition know about a server to play on and mentioned the issues being solved that concerns those players.

I'm glad to see the possibility of JA actually having a high level competitive community in its future. Why are some of you so threatened by that?

geeesh...

Lathain Valtiel
11-28-2003, 01:39 AM
Oh i don't really care about the so-called elite community.

I simply do not like the ridiculously elitist tone he is setting. Hardcore JA MP that happens to look suspiciously like JO Reloaded? Surrre.

FLaM-DraG
11-28-2003, 01:47 AM
Originally posted by Lathain Valtiel
I simply do not like the ridiculously elitist tone he is setting. Hardcore JA MP that happens to look suspiciously like JO Reloaded? Surrre.

Well said. I don't have a problem with it either, but he could tone it down a notch. Personally, I see nothing wrong with JA the way it is.. No reason to diss the game, making it seem like it's not good enough for the truly skilled players. ;)

Darth Kaan
11-28-2003, 01:47 AM
Originally posted by Lathain Valtiel
Oh i don't really care about the so-called elite community.

I simply do not like the ridiculously elitist tone he is setting. Hardcore JA MP that happens to look suspiciously like JO Reloaded? Surrre.

If you don't really care, you would not be posting repeatedly
on this thread. Sounds to me like your flame baiting. Oh well to each their own.

Lathain Valtiel
11-28-2003, 01:51 AM
Originally posted by Darth Kaan
If you don't really care, you would not be posting repeatedly
on this thread. Sounds to me like your flame baiting.

That would work.. except i haven't thrown a single insult in this entire thread. I was giving my overall opinion of his attitude and the idea.

It would also work if i didn't state my qualifier. How unfortunate for what you say, as said qualifier shoots it down mercilessly. Try not to ignore qualifiers next time..

eniaC
11-28-2003, 01:54 AM
Originally posted by Darth Kaan
To me, Unnamed was simply letting those interested in high level competition know about a server to play on and mentioned the issues being solved that concerns those players.

I'm glad to see the possibility of JA actually having a high level competitive community in its future. Why are some of you so threatened by that?

geeesh...


ditto

Lathain Valtiel
11-28-2003, 01:55 AM
You are entitled to your opinion, I won't kill you for it... Unless of course you seem ridiculously elitist in the prospect...

Darth Kaan
11-28-2003, 01:59 AM
Originally posted by Lathain Valtiel
That would work.. except i haven't thrown a single insult in this entire thread. I was giving my overall opinion of his attitude and the idea.

It would also work if i didn't state my qualifier. How unfortunate for what you say, as said qualifier shoots it down mercilessly. Try not to ignore qualifiers next time..

LOL. I don't need a qualifier. I never said you used any insults, I said you were baiting him.

Lathain Valtiel
11-28-2003, 02:01 AM
Not the intent, simply a statement of my views. You also must admit he reacted somewhat badly...

div3rse.jello
11-28-2003, 02:03 AM
Originally posted by Lathain Valtiel
I make it a point to hunt down the people you described.



You don't want us coming back. Trust me.

Darth Kaan
11-28-2003, 02:03 AM
Originally posted by Lathain Valtiel
Not the intent, simply a statement of my views. You also must admit he reacted somewhat badly...

I will admit that he took the bait, yes.

Syzerian
11-28-2003, 02:06 AM
im more interested in hard core singleplayer cuz its too easy i want consant jedi battles like double or triple what chandrilas like:D
when i looked at KOTOR screen shots it looked like this but it isnt a FPS i goes "command your party around the star wars universe" sound fimiar to anyone? (dungeon siege) to me it seems like one of those games where u click the enemy ur guy does a flashy move and u think WOW COOL then in half an hour u get bored of it

Lathain Valtiel
11-28-2003, 02:07 AM
Originally posted by Darth Kaan
I will admit that he took the bait, yes.

Again, not intended as bait.

div3rse.jello
11-28-2003, 02:19 AM
I have no idea what you're talking about Syzerian.

FK | unnamed
11-28-2003, 02:47 AM
uhh yeah.... whatever.

:rolleyes:


Like I said, many people disliked changes such as:

-The removal of double tap kicks
-Force pool restrictions for basic special moves
-The grip line of sight restriction
-Ghoul2 2 hit detection in Multiplayer
-The restrictions on the player roll move

Because those changes slowed the pace of the game down considerably and eliminated a lot of combos and the potential for new combo/move development (due to the various restrictions in place for a lot of things now).

Hence, people wanted faster more complex game play and turned to a mod that was supported by the competitive community in Jedi Outcast.

How I'm taking an "elitist" attitude is beyond me, I simply was informing people there are now other options at their disposal.

And considering the very large volume of disgruntled posts and threads people have made on these very forums regarding their dislike for the game play changes in Academy multiplayer, it's obvious there is an audience for this mod and what it's going to do.


And as for "hunting me down"....

yeah ok, sure.... just please don't tell me you wear boba fett pj's while you play this game. That kind of stuff creeps me out.


But if you would like a match with me in either Outcast or Academy, I would be more than happy to oblige you, just post a challenge on our forums and we can set it up.

http://fk.fragwhore.com/gl-bin/forum/

I'm totally sure you will drop by and make that challenge though...

:rolleyes:

Lathain Valtiel
11-28-2003, 02:58 AM
...You misread my post buddy. I meant i hunt down the Darth Chewbacca wannabes. Nor am I at all interested in a match.

Nor am I interested in arguing with you... It doesn't help you didn't exactly disprove what i said anyway...

FK | unnamed
11-28-2003, 03:02 AM
Originally posted by Darth Kaan


I'm glad to see the possibility of JA actually having a high level competitive community in its future. Why are some of you so threatened by that?

geeesh...




They can't hang with anything more complex than holding down mouse1.

It's as simple as that.

I'm not trying to be a dick, but it's the truth.

Remember guys, all of the whining about DFA's, back stabs and kicks was not coming from our camp... we were totally able to deal with them.

Now as for not wanting this mod to catch on?

Ask yourself when was the last time you saw a competitive player getting his ass kicked on public servers in Outcast?

It simply didn't happen.


When guys from clans like ours or [div3rse] would "pub" (play on public servers) it was pure murder.


Outcast had much more complex game play and mechanics because of the lack of restrictions put on powers/moves etc.

No one is saying we want to remove anything from Academy that was added (beyond the nerfs).

Now once the nerfs are gone, not only can all of the old combos be done again, many, many new ones can be created.

Grip-kick into a roll+stab finish?

That's just plain brutal... and now possible.

That's what I mean by hardcore game play, more options at ones disposal = more complexity and in turn, players being more creative with move/combo development.

div3rse.jello
11-28-2003, 03:05 AM
lemme join M.I.L.F.

Lathain Valtiel
11-28-2003, 03:07 AM
You just proved my entire point for me with the first three lines. As for me, I don't hold the button like a mindless drone. In fact you can ask Kaia, Corto, and Wudan about my public statements of those types of players.

And for the record, I learned how to dodge all of the things you mentioned (And out of sheer spite used Dark Rage and blue backstab to wreak havoc).

Kurgan
11-28-2003, 03:08 AM
I just want to say to those of you who are "putting your money where your mouth is" with the complaints about JA, I am proud of you.

And best of luck!

Lathain Valtiel
11-28-2003, 03:08 AM
Well, at least they're doing what they set out to do. I at LEAST wouldn't mind kick back...

FK | unnamed
11-28-2003, 03:09 AM
hunter/seeker/abuser/stalker/beater are all taken, think up a decent name and you're in.


server is going up soon too.

Lathain Valtiel
11-28-2003, 03:11 AM
Waaaiiittt, what is so dodgy about JA 1.01's hit detection, besides the fact that at lag it completely evades all forms of coherence?

eniaC
11-28-2003, 03:11 AM
Originally posted by FK | unnamed
not only can all of the old combos be done again, many, many new ones can be created.


sounds great, can't wait.

FK | unnamed
11-28-2003, 03:12 AM
Originally posted by Lathain Valtiel
You just proved my entire point for me with the first three lines. As for me, I don't hold the button like a mindless drone. In fact you can ask Kaia, Corto, and Wudan about my public statements of those types of players.

And for the record, I learned how to dodge all of the things you mentioned (And out of sheer spite used Dark Rage and blue backstab to wreak havoc).


good for you, now go away if you have nothing to contribute.


Originally posted by div3rse.jello
lemme join M.I.L.F.

hunter/seeker/abuser/stalker/beater are all taken, think up a decent name and you're in.


server is going up soon too.

Kurgan
11-28-2003, 03:13 AM
Oh and let's knock off the flames & flame-baiting (you know who you are).


Now that the SDK is out, we finally have a chance to make peace and resolve this. Let the folks who said they could improve JA give it a shot and let's see what they come up with. Can't be any harm in that can there?

And if it ends up not being what you want, simply don't use the mod (or make yourself a better one). Simple! Everybody wins!

Imperial_thug
11-28-2003, 03:15 AM
Hey thx for the info:D , I've been waiting for a mod like this forever now. How do I get this? Do I dl it, or is it a server-side thing?

I agree, I liked the gameplay of JO better it was fast paced like Quake3 or something. This is a dream come true for me at least. Can't wait to play this. Thx

Oh btw, Does this mod do anything to make weapons strong again? Maybe it's just me but it seems like some weapons don't do as much damage as they used to, or it could just be the hit detection thing that you referred to.

Lathain Valtiel
11-28-2003, 03:22 AM
Originally posted by Kurgan
Oh and let's knock off the flames & flame-baiting (you know who you are).


Now that the SDK is out, we finally have a chance to make peace and resolve this. Let the folks who said they could improve JA give it a shot and let's see what they come up with. Can't be any harm in that can there?

And if it ends up not being what you want, simply don't use the mod (or make yourself a better one). Simple! Everybody wins!

Personally, I think you'd be interested in whatsome people I know (Hush hush, not supposed to talk) are going to come up with. Some people are gonna be pissed, but if it works and catches on it'll be the END of the fools who hold down Attack.

div3rse.jello
11-28-2003, 03:22 AM
Visit xMOD 2 test server @ 64.81.143.34

and it'll auto download the mod

noide
11-28-2003, 03:26 AM
haha uj.
<-- method from ET.

you know stalker? he only got that name after i was talking about milf clan at his house while we were playing.

ps. i own him :p

and for you ja ppl, xmod2 isnt made to turn jamp into jomp but rather to make jamp as enjoyable as jomp, not to mention add at least 1 notch of skill to the game.

FK | unnamed
11-28-2003, 03:30 AM
Originally posted by Imperial_thug
Hey thx for the info:D , I've been waiting for a mod like this forever now. How do I get this? Do I dl it, or is it a server-side thing?

I agree, I liked the gameplay of JO better it was fast paced like Quake3 or something. This is a dream come true for me at least. Can't wait to play this. Thx

Oh btw, Does this mod do anything to make weapons strong again? Maybe it's just me but it seems like some weapons don't do as much damage as they used to, or it could just be the hit detection thing that you referred to.

Well in Outcast =X= mod was the same as the admin mods, you didn't have to download anything.

But this time around there may be a small client file due to the some of the changes.

and like before, setting cl_AllowDownload 1 in the console will get you the file when you connect to any server running it.

noide
11-28-2003, 03:32 AM
actually i believe you needed to download the xmod1 client to have script protection or whatever in xmod servers.
you could not play in a xmod server without xmod client: from what i remember. you couldnt play in div server w/o getting xmod from sourceforge or @ x server first

div3rse.jello
11-28-2003, 03:36 AM
Noide be right. Wonder if Hex is importing script detection..

FK | unnamed
11-28-2003, 03:40 AM
Originally posted by noide
actually i believe you needed to download the xmod1 client to have script protection or whatever in xmod servers.
you could not play in a xmod server without xmod client: from what i remember. you couldnt play in div server w/o getting xmod from sourceforge or @ x server first

I played in div and I never had the client.

Then again I had auto-dl off all the time.

the client file was just for the script detection and I'm not sure if he's putting that in this time around.

now if the server has the script thingy running pure, then yeah, the clients have to have it, but I never had it and I played on div now and then.

noide
11-28-2003, 03:42 AM
cool now i can script kata and roll stab !!!~

FK | unnamed
11-28-2003, 03:45 AM
heh, to be honest the only script worth using/stopping was a team energize one.

But there is a small delay in base JA (the one good nerf they did) in how fast you can fire it off so it's not an issue this time.

noide
11-28-2003, 03:47 AM
yeah i noticed about the te rate of fire. not a big deal though. my biggest annoyance though is that they nerfed absorb v grip

//actually lunge script was pretty useful

Rumor
11-28-2003, 03:55 AM
hi you people who are happy with the gameplay as is, GOOD. now go post in the threads pertaining to it which we do not touch, and STAY there.

god damn people just stay the **** out of our topics you just derail them.

Lathain Valtiel
11-28-2003, 04:20 AM
Are you God? No. I am. Therefore, be quiet and bow to me. (Inside joke, Kurgan gets it.)

Tesla
11-28-2003, 04:25 AM
Are you God? No. I am. Therefore, be quiet and bow to me. (Inside joke, Kurgan gets it.)

So do i. ;)

No, you [R.I.P] God and im [R.I.P] Jesus and Kurgans, [R.I.P] Holy Ghost. XD

Lathain Valtiel
11-28-2003, 04:27 AM
Originally posted by Tesla
So do i. ;)

No, you [R.I.P] God and im [R.I.P] Jesus and Kurgans, [R.I.P] Holy Ghost. XD

Same thing. Now get my cheese.

bodstevens
11-28-2003, 05:20 AM
This is great news thanks to the good old =X= guys..
I've stopped playing JA because its not fun and no good comp players are playing to learn and be challanged by...
And this is good news for us s/o CTF players.
:)

As for the flame baiter (and you know who you are...)
I find its funny how players who don't play comp style always creep into the threads and ruin them.
Its also funny when they get challenged the always back off like children.
PLEASE IF YOU HAVE NOTHING TO CONTRIBUTE DON'T FLAP YOUR GUMS.....
Players looking for a deeper gameplay experince don't need to hear your garbage...
We all sound like a broken record but please repect others and just be quiet if you don't play s/o (ff) CTF...
I played every day (or at least tried to on the matrixcpa and FK and =X= JW servers with the likes of JW FK =X= div and others...
THEY ARE THE BETTER PLAYERS IN THIS GAME
period...
I have seen it over and over
So no big man talk please ,all they are trying to do is help.
They don't need noddleheads blabbering like fools.
The JA MP is busted and needs fixing.
So again if you don't play the game type butt out.....
AHHH.....
Sorry just getting a little fed up at the childish behavior.

As far as Im concerned =X= mod was awsome it made the game so much better and HEX and the =X= guys are great giving so much to the s/o comp players of JK/ now JA.
So please show some brains and stop flame baiting....

Astrotoy7
11-28-2003, 07:00 AM
Originally posted by Kurgan
Oh and let's knock off the flames & flame-baiting (you know who you are).


Now that the SDK is out, we finally have a chance to make peace and resolve this. Let the folks who said they could improve JA give it a shot and let's see what they come up with. Can't be any harm in that can there?

And if it ends up not being what you want, simply don't use the mod (or make yourself a better one). Simple! Everybody wins!

Well stated.

...Im not gtfo of anywhere, this thread is informative. frivolous and fun, with just the right amount of 'Juj'


MTFBWYA

Gabrobot
11-28-2003, 07:17 AM
Well, I'm glad that now there can be peace between those with conflicting ideas of fun gameplay. I would like to point out to some people, that this is just a mod, and isn't something they have to use...I may not agree with the changes they're making, and you may not, but there's no reason why some people can't make a mod suiting their tastes and have fun with it.

I wish the mod and it's users the best of luck, and hope there will be no further conflicts. :)

div3rse.jello
11-28-2003, 08:43 AM
Nice post Bod.

P.S. Did Al die? :eek:

Kurgan
11-28-2003, 10:36 AM
bodstevens wrote:

(*snip*)

It doesn't matter your motivation (even perceived justification) for flaming or flame-baiting, it's not something you should do here, period.

I never said no debating, mind you.

Amidala from Chop Shop
11-28-2003, 01:11 PM
Reading this thread piqued my curiosity, so I downloaded the xMod v1.2.0 for JK2 to read the readme and look at the cvars.

Completely ignoring the gameplay enhancements, it is the best server-side admin mod I have seen.

Wow, how did I overlook this one? (See, not all admin mods are evil).

Not only does it have all the good stuff (moves ban list out of g_banips, IP address logging, multi-line MOTD, center-screen broadcasting, preventing /kill in certain situations), but it also has some cool unique features:

-- profanity filter for chat and names, replaces listed naughty words with *%#$ or whatever you want.

-- can mute all global chat but allow team and private chat. (no more killtracker spam!) Can also mute by IP address so I can silence instead of ban players who can't resist killtracker or chatbind spamming, or excessively naughty language, but are otherwise OK.

-- granular control of subadmin powers, so the rcon admin rather than the mod designer can determine exactly which powers subadmins have or don't have.

-- flexible handling of scripters, from allowing it to automatically kicking them

If anything, I think they suffered from a little "me too" -ism and put in some stuff that should be taken out (slapping, tripping, and either sleeping or freezing, don't need both, emotes if they make you semi-immortal).

If the JA version is this good I will probably use it on Chop Shop. Very impressive.

griff38
11-28-2003, 02:49 PM
Amidala may I assume you will have this available at your servers in the near future?

Thanks FK_Unamed for bringing this to our attention. I could have guessed you would lead the charge back for some more serious gaming.




P.S. Don't feed the Trolls.

Lathain Valtiel
11-28-2003, 04:13 PM
Tip: Griff, it's suggested you try not to bring up day old commentary.

On a side note, I'm fairly disturbed that there's a large chance Spider AL would take my side on this one. So nightmarish.

For the lovely purpose of not returning this thread to quasi-flamewar, I'm not going to reply to the post of Bod, which i could so easily tear to shreds it wouldn't be worth my time. As i have painstakingly and with detail stated that I did not intend to start anything. Sheesh, how negative opinions are taken by you chaps...

Sheesh if I pity any intent based justice system.. Heh.

Remind me to download if only for the flipkicks... Yummy.

bodstevens
11-28-2003, 04:41 PM
good its nice to see peeps being nice

Darth Kaan
11-28-2003, 04:56 PM
Originally posted by Amidala from Chop Shop
Reading this thread piqued my curiosity, so I downloaded the xMod v1.2.0 for JK2 to read the readme and look at the cvars.
Completely ignoring the gameplay enhancements, it is the best server-side admin mod I have seen

No doubt. I am really looking forward to -X- mod being released for JA, I will be using it on my server as well.

Amidala from Chop Shop
11-28-2003, 05:00 PM
xMod 2.0.0 has been released this morning here:
https://sourceforge.net/project/showfiles.php?group_id=87536

bin is for Windoze, nix is for Linux.

Documentation is sparse, but I assume the commands and cvars have been carried over from the JK2 1.2.0 version, documented here:
http://xmod.cat5camp.com

with the changes for 2.0.0 listed in the readme.

Lathain Valtiel
11-28-2003, 05:08 PM
*Rubschin* Hmm.. Kaia might like this for now.

PG|Prometheus
11-28-2003, 05:09 PM
Excellent news, gret job hex :D
I'm sure we'll be setting up a JA ff s/o ctf and JA s/o ff duel ladder soon that runs xmod as mandatory.

Imperial_thug
11-28-2003, 05:29 PM
I downloaded the x-mods2.0 files this morning, after about an hour fiddling around trying to get it to work, I finally got it lol. I can't join the server for some reason, but I was able to try it against bots. I loaded up ns_streets in JA, it was so fun to kick them off ledges again, I love it. You can kick someone down, then they can kick back at you from a knockdown, then you can kick back, it kind of reminded me of tennis or something lol.

There's still a lot to be done, like sideways kicks have to be implemented, but so far I am liking it a lot, a lot.

BTW- Is there a cvar in JA to stop saber-moves from drawing force power?

Agen
11-28-2003, 06:45 PM
I'm glad that now people can have their fun their way with the release of the sdk and some of those features are really interesting... (assuming you're re-implemented them)
-The removal of double tap kicks -pff, I assume this is merely a jo 'leet' pleaser andm eans the flip kciks are back in.... Ah well, I didn't mind kicks but
-Force pool restrictions for basic special moves - Sounds good but could be potentially unbalanced
-The grip line of sight restriction - sounds good :)
-Ghoul2 2 hit detection in Multiplayer - EXCELLENT, NO MORE RANDOMNESS (assuming that's what makes the saber go through players with no damage)
-The restrictions on the player roll move- DITTO THE ABOVE MINUS THE RANDOMNESS :D


--Things i would like to see -

--Limit the kicks so you can only do 2 or 3 in a row so it forces them to do something original or different.
--Kicks someone straight on can cause damage to themselves because of the saber... it's unrealistic (in context :p) to be able to kick someone consistently in the facewith a saber in your balls.
-- Ability to roll backwards
-- Ability stop and wall grip while wall walking :)

--------------- Stupid unimportant
-- Knock down by force speeding into someone
-- Blood?
-- Ability to kick while jumping (so you can jump into someone and uh... karate kick them) Should require a few force points
--More power in the whacking off walls with mp players with head hitting the wall meaning more damage

Anyway, I was planning on creating my own mod (after learning much more :p) with a few of these ideas but if this mod adopted them, I'd hope it becomes amazing popular :D
GL

Lathain Valtiel
11-28-2003, 07:12 PM
One thing though... I don't think you should remove the restriction on back roll, if only for the fact that it was fairly annoying to do the two handed backstab without said restrict and not have it seen coming miles away.

Prime
11-28-2003, 07:22 PM
Even though I am not a competative player, I'm going to give it a try. Who knows, maybe I'll end up liking it more than base JA. It certainly sounds like it might be worth it for everyone, competative and non-competative to give it a try, just to see what it offers.

Certainly with more kicks there will be more opportunity to use the knockdown roll/kick stuff, which should make those who are kicked down less helpless. I find that pretty appealing...

At the very least, those who don't want to play it don't have to. There will be plenty of regular servers for those who don't find it fits their tastes. Personally, I can see myself playing regular JA and Xmod from time to time. A little variety in gameplay will keep the game fresh.

kazesan
11-28-2003, 07:38 PM
Can one of the authors post a full list of changes for JA. Really this seems like it wouild only be useful in the SO/FF/CTF league. Not that this is a bad thing it would probably make those games alot more intense. However...I don't want the return of "teh 1337 kick" from JO. Or any other abused/overpowered moves. The saddest thing is seeing a SO server where no one needs or uses the saber. Its like playing on a no sabeer full force server.

Still I will give this a try probably. Maybe it will interest me in CTF again. Or bring back my no honor ways. Ironically I joined a clan based on FFA dueling for the most part. Honor code included. Also ironically I totally kick ass with the saber now. On basic FFA servers I can just kick everyones ass because they spam katas and twirls. Kinda off topic but hopefully this mod reduces the need for kata and butterfly spamming. One spammed move "kick" is better than 8. (twirl, butterfly, kata, stab, lunge, dual backstab, anything using uber sensitivity and or yaw, and butterfly again just because it IS spammed that much)

eniaC
11-28-2003, 08:32 PM
Originally posted by Amidala from Chop Shop
xMod 2.0.0 has been released this morning here:
https://sourceforge.net/project/showfiles.php?group_id=87536

bin is for Windoze, nix is for Linux.

Documentation is sparse, but I assume the commands and cvars have been carried over from the JK2 1.2.0 version, documented here:
http://xmod.cat5camp.com

with the changes for 2.0.0 listed in the readme.


excellent, time to own some 1337 n00bs, ;)

*goes to download*


/edit/ I just need to turn on autodownload and find a server running it correct?

Imperial_thug
11-28-2003, 08:40 PM
I have heard a lot of ppl complain about how kicks were way too spammed in JO, I always thought that there were a few better ways of solving that problem other than removing it. For one thing they could have made it so it draws from force power so that way it could only be done 2 or 3 time before the person runs out of force power, or they could have simply toned the damage that it does down then it really would'nt matter how many times a person used it. To remove such a cool and useful move from the game is just IMO downright silly.

I like all the new moves like katas and saber twirls, but if someone does'nt want to get hit by them all they have to do is just back away from you. You could try to land any move in the game and all a person has to do to avoid it is simply run away while the whole time you are using up your force power. Imo this is'nt how the game was supposed to be, ppl are actually supposed to fight not play ping-pong running back and forth from eachother. If you had kick in there all you would have to do is pull that person in, kick em' down, and it kind of forces them to stop and actually fight you. It's easy to see how having kick back in the game would make for some fun fast-paced action.

fome
11-28-2003, 09:09 PM
Originally posted by eniaC
excellent, time to own some 1337 n00bs, ;)

*goes to download*


/edit/ I just need to turn on autodownload and find a server running it correct?

its a server side mod, no need to download to play

Darth Kaan
11-28-2003, 09:26 PM
Originally posted by Amidala from Chop Shop
xMod 2.0.0 has been released this morning here:
https://sourceforge.net/project/showfiles.php?group_id=87536

bin is for Windoze, nix is for Linux.

Documentation is sparse, but I assume the commands and cvars have been carried over from the JK2 1.2.0 version, documented here:
http://xmod.cat5camp.com

with the changes for 2.0.0 listed in the readme.

Outstanding! Thanks for posting the link and info!

Darth Kaan
11-28-2003, 09:28 PM
Originally posted by Prime
Even though I am not a competative player, I'm going to give it a try. Who knows, maybe I'll end up liking it more than base JA. It certainly sounds like it might be worth it for everyone, competative and non-competative to give it a try, just to see what it offers.

Certainly with more kicks there will be more opportunity to use the knockdown roll/kick stuff, which should make those who are kicked down less helpless. I find that pretty appealing...

At the very least, those who don't want to play it don't have to. There will be plenty of regular servers for those who don't find it fits their tastes. Personally, I can see myself playing regular JA and Xmod from time to time. A little variety in gameplay will keep the game fresh.

Exactly! :D

eniaC
11-28-2003, 09:35 PM
Originally posted by fome
its a server side mod, no need to download to play

Yeah, figured it out, just played on the test server.

thanks though.:)

Leebs
11-28-2003, 09:58 PM
Hi everyone. first post :cool:

I was just wondering...if it is a pure server and running the Xmod, would the clients need the file.

Amidala from Chop Shop
11-28-2003, 10:10 PM
Originally posted by Leebs
Hi everyone. first post :cool:

I was just wondering...if it is a pure server and running the Xmod, would the clients need the file.

No. Good question though.

There is an optional client file if the server wants to manage clients using scripts (combinations of moves bound to a single key, which some consider "cheating"). If it is on, a pure server will have autodownload on (and clients must allow downloads) to send the file.

If the server is configured to ignore scripts, then it is a server-side only mod (clients need nothing).

div3rse.jello
11-28-2003, 11:05 PM
ahah VGG

Master William
11-28-2003, 11:21 PM
Looks nice, I might try this... ;)

And what is Windoze, Amidala from Chop Shop?
And this mod doesn't have JK2 kicks... Right? *Trembles of fear that JA will become Kung-Fu Academy*

div3rse.jello
11-28-2003, 11:42 PM
Originally posted by Imperial_thug
BTW- Is there a cvar in JA to stop saber-moves from drawing force power?


Xmod is still being tweaked. I think Hex said he would add that feature.

fk | screed
11-29-2003, 12:00 AM
Originally posted by Lathain Valtiel
Now now child, while i expected such a response the fact of the matter is that you are basically turning JA into JO. Hell, you practically admit it in the post.

To describe turning JA into JO as 'hardcore' (LOL) JA gameplay is thus by default plain idiotic and actually fairly provocative. Be honest to yourselves and rename the title to something more to the point as I described above.

That response is also doubly stupid as most people who know me will say that your generalization of me is so way off it's funny. I make it a point to hunt down the people you described.

I have the right to my opinion, and it is also not in your power to tell me to not state it here. So do yourself a favor and cut the bull.

do what the man says and gtfo of our thread if you dont care for the mod.

Rumor
11-29-2003, 12:15 AM
dude i have to say that i played 2 hours on the =X= ctf server and it was a ****ing blast.

even the katas and butterflies were made useful with the addition of kicks. its like so fast paced (moreso than in jk2, aside from slower gameplay speed) and we had a ball.

i even had the chance to spam my "WTF LAMER BOW BEFORE YOU SHOOT" bind when i was taking on 3 guys when i was capping.

rumor: "WTF LAMER BOW BEFORE YOU SHOOT"
*rumor bows
*rumor kicks

wash rinse and repeat for every kick and the four of us about died laughing.

noide
11-29-2003, 12:16 AM
the xmod just released was just a beta type. it will be tweaked over the weeks and made alot better.

Agen
11-29-2003, 12:25 AM
Right, I just played on the X-Mod server.. now my views :)

Kicking is more difficult that jk2 was (which is a good thing) but it's too difficult (mind you, I had a 180-210 ping) and only the x team could use the kick well :)
Iíve noticed the hit detection hasnít been improved too much but it performed much better in the last round (or I was imagining it :p) but overallÖ it just seemedÖ too similar to JA :-/
Still, that that (:D) was changed was pretty cool, a few tweaks here and there and itíll be one of the top mods
:)
EDIT: Changed the jk2 to JA, it's too similar to JA but since it's ongoing it doesn't matter :)

fk | screed
11-29-2003, 12:31 AM
I havent had a chance to try it out yet, I came home from wrok last night hit the sack and didnt wake up till 5pm today :eek: .

When I get home tonight im gonna try it out.

Amidala from Chop Shop
11-29-2003, 12:48 AM
I have posted instructions for server admins who want to use xMod in the Dedicated Server forum here:

http://www.lucasforums.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=118725

Lathain Valtiel
11-29-2003, 01:41 AM
Originally posted by fk | screed
do what the man says and gtfo of our thread if you dont care for the mod.

Little late by.. 24 hours child.

On that note, technically the owners of the server the thread resides on are who own the thread...

div3rse.jello
11-29-2003, 01:44 AM
Al's son? :eek:

Lathain Valtiel
11-29-2003, 01:45 AM
No.

You may refer to me as God, also known as your Lord. Either is appropriate.

FK | unnamed
11-29-2003, 01:49 AM
yeah, the thing every one needs to keep in mind is =X= mod in Jedi Outcast was constantly being updated and tweaked and I assume this time will be no different.

What you are seeing now is just the "baby steps" of the mods life, there will be plenty more tweaking and fine tuning so don't worry if something did not get addressed in the initial release.

Not to mention in the previous mod, the =X= team kept their ear finely tuned to what the players who used their mod wanted to see fixed/tweaked, so if by chance some one did find some type of insanely cheesy move/exploit, you can pretty much guarantee that this mod would be the first (and in many cases as with some things in Outcast) the only mod that addressed them.


/edit


change the title of this thread if you want, but this really should be pinned for a while.

not so much as to promote the mod (not that promoting it would be a bad thing) but so as to let people who come here saying "JA blows", know that there is an alternative that will fill what they are looking for.


There is another mod team (unrelated) working on a mod (that does what this mod intends to do, fix bugs, fine tune game play) for the gunning world, and once a working build is out I'll inform every one here of it as well.

PG|Prometheus
11-29-2003, 11:00 AM
People always have to interfer with other people. Valtiel, its obvious you don't want the mod, so I see no reason why this thread concerns you at all.

Amidala: Binding more than one move (or a single move that requires more than one key) to one key is scripting. I wasn't aware of anyone who didn't think this was cheating, but there are some people who think that?

griff38
11-29-2003, 01:43 PM
I think the overwhelming interest in this thread is a clear indicator =x= mod will be a big success.

Glad we have something to look forward too, JA was getting old much faster than JKO ever did.



PS I am an Athiest.

Amidala from Chop Shop
11-29-2003, 02:13 PM
Originally posted by PG|Prometheus
Amidala: Binding more than one move (or a single move that requires more than one key) to one key is scripting. I wasn't aware of anyone who didn't think this was cheating, but there are some people who think that?

Originally posted by Amidala from Chop Shop
... scripts (combinations of moves bound to a single key, which some consider "cheating").

Umm, didn't we define scripting the same way, LOL?

I don't use scripts. But there are some who say it is different from for instance using a wall hack or an aimbot because "it is available to everyone, and therefore it isn't a cheat". I guess it's a gray area or debatable, or depends upon the meaning of "is" is, as a former President might say. I think it is a crutch that keeps people from getting "skillful" (and we are defining skill by how well you use a computer keyboard and mouse, not hitting a tee shot or a baseball or kicking a field goal or performing surgery).

//stratosph34r
11-29-2003, 03:55 PM
daddy like!
maybe we can get some balls back into this community now with this, since with Raven the competitve community has gone to ****.

:jawa

Lathain Valtiel
11-29-2003, 03:56 PM
On the bright side, scripting is fairly easy to see from miles away if you're at least paying attention to your screen...

But there are some who say it is different from for instance using a wall hack or an aimbot because "it is available to everyone, and therefore it isn't a cheat".

On that note, you could argue that since there on aimbots on public websites (Including for JA), it is in theory available to everyone with an internet connection, which of course you must obviously have if you're playing JA MP. And on the art of scripting, you need to know such a thing is possible in the first place, and so on and so forth. I don't think it's mentioned in the manual. It's something of a really bad argument to me.

Agen
11-29-2003, 05:46 PM
Scripting isn't really all that useful, a good play can probably out [insert scripted move here] the scripter.

Rad Blackrose
11-29-2003, 05:52 PM
Considering the fanbois of the base JA are coming out of the woodwork once again to attempt to belittle those who want to stir the competitive scene again, I guess it's time to find a napalm canister... There she is.

You people bitched at us for wanting JA to be different, to inspire an aura of competitiveness.

You bitched at us when we were doing the same thing you did in JKII when you didn't get your way: You raised a crying ****storm and got Raven to nerf things across the board.

Then you proceeded to tell us to shut up or change it.

Guess what, now we're changing it, and now it's our turn to tell you to put up, or shut the **** up and get out of this thread.

This goes especially for Lathain, who right off the bat had nothing constructive to say, and instead opened the door with flamebait. Taking lessons from William, have we? Oh wait, there's the grandmaster of the fanboi trolls right now! Gee, two birds in one stone, how could it ever be so grand!

Find the closest high rising cliff you can find, and proceed to throw yourselves off it. Society has exceeded its capacity for mentally incapable attention whores, here's your ticket. GOODBYE!

Now, on to XMOD.

I haven't had a chance to pick it up due to JA being on my CPU back in Milwaukee, but just thinking about the counters to standard JO kick introduced in JA will make this a much better experience. Clue card please to those who says it will be too JOish.

And is the LOS restriction going to be off grip anytime soon?

Darth Kaan
11-29-2003, 07:13 PM
Originally posted by griff38
I think the overwhelming interest in this thread is a clear indicator =x= mod will be a big success.

Yes, let's hope it is. :D

PG|Prometheus
11-29-2003, 07:57 PM
Yes, and hopefully hex will add script detetction like he did with the jk2 versions of xmod.

I don't quite understand, when I've read posts here in the past, there have been numerous people almost crying about not letting kicks back into the game (even under cvar activation/deactivation). But now its actually happened, you all seem happy.

Hehe, anyway, watch out for the s/o ff 5v5 ctf ladder coming soon to www.provinggrounds.com

Darth Kaan
11-29-2003, 08:07 PM
Originally posted by PG|Prometheus
Hehe, anyway, watch out for the s/o ff 5v5 ctf ladder coming soon to www.provinggrounds.com

Hey P,

I would love to get in on that! Is it for organized teams/clans only?

Rumor
11-29-2003, 08:59 PM
scripting is not cheating guys. the only one ever to give anyone an advantage would be the te script and thats been dealt with.

scripted kicks? who cares they are stuck kicking in one exact fashion from one exact distance. nowhere near as good as a natural kicker.

scripted kata/butterfly/lunge ? whats different with those than doing them by hand? so what if they have it on one button.

i fail to see the advantage other than you have more keys to make chat scripts with.

competitive players just accept that the people they face have scripts (stems from quake series its a big tradition) and have to be secure in that if they don't know their **** well enough they will get beaten.

g//plaZma
11-29-2003, 10:49 PM
Originally posted by Lathain Valtiel
No.

You may refer to me as God, also known as your Lord. Either is appropriate.

Wow you just took on that "elitest" attitude that you accused UJ of having. gj!

Anyways the mod looks pretty good. Still lacking some things. My JO/JA days are over most likely. GL guys!

Rumor
11-29-2003, 11:04 PM
Originally posted by g//plaZma
Wow you just took on that "elitest" attitude that you accused UJ of having. gj!

Anyways the mod looks pretty good. Still lacking some things. My JO/JA days are over most likely. GL guys!

there is a not-so-fine line between "eliteist" and pompous asses.

the eliteist people (as many of you call them) are more humble than many of you and are simply stating facts, not waveing them out saying 'HAHA I OWN YOU FAGGOT NEWBS U SUK!!!!"

hell 99% of the time they are simply telling the person to put up or shut up so they don't have to hear their bull**** anymore.

KaiaSowapit
11-29-2003, 11:37 PM
Originally posted by Lathain Valtiel
You may refer to me as God, also known as your Lord. Either is appropriate.
My god is a woman... how do you look in a skirt? ;)

I must admit I'm intrigued with the profanity filter of xMod, but what's this nonsense about banning the Jawa model? Also, is the amsleep, etc. crap really necessary?

Lathain Valtiel
11-29-2003, 11:43 PM
Originally posted by g//plaZma
Wow you just took on that "elitest" attitude that you accused UJ of having. gj!

Anyways the mod looks pretty good. Still lacking some things. My JO/JA days are over most likely. GL guys!

Buddy, if you were paying any sort of attention to this thread you would've noticed that I said this was an inside joke previously. Last Thursday I played on Kurgan's server as [R.I.P] God, Tesla was [R.I.P] Jesus, and Kurgan himself was [R.I.P] Holy Ghost. The Sam that posted in this thread will also get it, I was considering asking him to be R.I.P Apostle. LOL

MasterSidious
11-29-2003, 11:45 PM
Originally posted by Lathain Valtiel
Now now child, while i expected such a response the fact of the matter is that you are basically turning JA into JO. Hell, you practically admit it in the post.

To describe turning JA into JO as 'hardcore' (LOL) JA gameplay is thus by default plain idiotic and actually fairly provocative. Be honest to yourselves and rename the title to something more to the point as I described above.

That response is also doubly stupid as most people who know me will say that your generalization of me is so way off it's funny. I make it a point to hunt down the people you described.

I have the right to my opinion, and it is also not in your power to tell me to not state it here. So do yourself a favor and cut the bull.

WTF
lol
Sooooooooooo much complicated words!

Stop this ****.

I'm not taking any sides here. I'm a moder myself. I can make this JA chalenging. And damn, wtf is up with the fk? Gotta love um :D Played on fk servers for years. They'll never surprise you how crazy ass they can be. I know what makes them all tick. It's that god damn ****ing peice of **** front kick. I'll make a mod as soon as I get JA so that I can make a one click super kick that I can be a complete ****ing whore in. Lol. IT'll be so much ****ing fun!

Lathain Valtiel
11-29-2003, 11:46 PM
Originally posted by KaiaSowapit
My god is a woman... how do you look in a skirt? ;)

Well, considering I am all-powerful, I could in theory change gender and looks at will. I'm the (wo?)man of your dreams baby.

*Busts a gut laughing*

g//plaZma
11-29-2003, 11:47 PM
Originally posted by Lathain Valtiel
Buddy, if you were paying any sort of attention to this thread you would've noticed that I said this was an inside joke previously. Last Thursday I played on Kurgan's server as [R.I.P] God, Tesla was [R.I.P] Jesus, and Kurgan himself was [R.I.P] Holy Ghost. The Sam that posted in this thread will also get it, I was considering asking him to be R.I.P Apostle. LOL

LOLOLOL K CAN I B [R.I.P] CHEWBACCA????

g//plaZma
11-29-2003, 11:50 PM
BTW plz stop hijacking this thread with your inside jokes. No1 likes you. Thx.

Lathain Valtiel
11-29-2003, 11:52 PM
Originally posted by g//plaZma
LOLOLOL K CAN I B [R.I.P] CHEWBACCA????

All I have to say is, I hope for the sake of general respect by the public your maturity level does not reflect that of the 'elite' (loosely used) community.

g//plaZma
11-29-2003, 11:57 PM
Originally posted by Lathain Valtiel
All I have to say is, I hope for the sake of general respect by the public your maturity level does not reflect that of the 'elite' (loosely used) community.

Ok can we have tea sometime? I'd love to exchange bows with you, oh great honorable jedi master. Please teach me the ways of the force.

fome
11-30-2003, 12:01 AM
but what's this nonsense about banning the Jawa model?


Banning jawa model is optional, so it doesn't have to be disabled, but if you're wondering why anyone would want to ban the cute jawa it's because in team games its harder (not impossible by looking at the crosshair colour)to see which team the jawa is on, as it has no team colours. Thats the only explaination i can think of :amidala:

//stratosph34r
11-30-2003, 12:41 AM
:amidala:

fk | screed
11-30-2003, 01:34 AM
Originally posted by MasterSidious
WTF
lol
Sooooooooooo much complicated words!

Stop this ****.

I'm not taking any sides here. I'm a moder myself. I can make this JA chalenging. And damn, wtf is up with the fk? Gotta love um :D Played on fk servers for years. They'll never surprise you how crazy ass they can be. I know what makes them all tick. It's that god damn ****ing peice of **** front kick. I'll make a mod as soon as I get JA so that I can make a one click super kick that I can be a complete ****ing whore in. Lol. IT'll be so much ****ing fun!

Wrong, i would kick your ass with sidekick too :p

fk | screed
11-30-2003, 01:36 AM
Originally posted by Lathain Valtiel
All I have to say is, I hope for the sake of general respect by the public your maturity level does not reflect that of the 'elite' (loosely used) community.

Any time you wanna challenge the "elite" community than so be it. You know where to find me and all the other "elites". Any game, any time, any where. Hell, I can probobly whoop you in pong too.:D

Master William
11-30-2003, 02:16 AM
Originally posted by fk | screed
Any time you wanna challenge the "elite" community than so be it. You know where to find me and all the other "elites". Any game, any time, any where. Hell, I can probobly whoop you in pong too.:D

After that, challenge me and the other ''titans and champions''. :p

eniaC
11-30-2003, 02:31 AM
Originally posted by Master William
After that, challenge me and the other ''titans and champions''. :p

Ollie...truck to head...nuff said. gg.

When 'r ya changin yer name too Darth William, tis fit thee better.

KaiaSowapit
11-30-2003, 02:51 AM
Originally posted by fome
Banning jawa model is optional, so it doesn't have to be disabled, but if you're wondering why anyone would want to ban the cute jawa it's because in team games its harder (not impossible by looking at the crosshair colour)to see which team the jawa is on, as it has no team colours. Thats the only explaination i can think of :amidala:
Ahh... that makes sense (though I'd still argue that huge floating team icon over people's heads should be clue enough ;)).

I was just concerned people were still buying into that "Jawas are magically indestructible" myth.

Again, the mute/squelch/profanity filter really appeals to me, I'm just curious though... can this be run server-side only, or does it require clients to have the patch as well?

Lastly, as far as the previous discussion goes regarding this thread's title; soon as we have instagib and LMS (last man standing) gameplay options, I'll call it hardcore. Right now it just sounds like JA with flipkicks... whooptie doo. ;)

Rumor
11-30-2003, 03:05 AM
Originally posted by Lathain Valtiel
All I have to say is, I hope for the sake of general respect by the public your maturity level does not reflect that of the 'elite' (loosely used) community.

i hope that your maturity level doesn't reflect that of dendrophiliacs. hell i hope it doesn't reflect anything as it would be an insult for an ant to have your level of maturity.

eniaC
11-30-2003, 03:06 AM
no-respawn would be gnifty,:D

Rad Blackrose
11-30-2003, 04:35 AM
Originally posted by eniaC
Ollie...truck to head...nuff said. gg.

When 'r ya changin yer name too Darth William, tis fit thee better.

Ditto.

Prime
11-30-2003, 05:55 AM
A couple of times I have tried to connect to the xMOD 2 test server at 64.81.143.34 and I have "waited to join". Is the server still up or full or something? Or might it be a problem at my end?

Just thought I'd give it a go... :)

Amidala from Chop Shop
11-30-2003, 05:55 AM
Originally posted by KaiaSowapit
Again, the mute/squelch/profanity filter really appeals to me, I'm just curious though... can this be run server-side only, or does it require clients to have the patch as well?

Lastly, as far as the previous discussion goes regarding this thread's title; soon as we have instagib and LMS (last man standing) gameplay options, I'll call it hardcore. Right now it just sounds like JA with flipkicks... whooptie doo. ;)

Not only can you filter profanity, you can add any word to the "profanity" list such as "lamer", "lame", "chatkill", "honor", etc. All will be replaced with a string of your choosing, such as "@#$%!^" or "ima loser". That feature and the other adminmod features were in the JK2 version (1.2.0) but aren't in the current JA version. I think they wanted to get something out quickly (remember the SDK just came out) for the people who wanted flip kicks. Apparently the author Hex is very receptive to input, so now is the time to tell him what you want, Kaia:
http://x.fragism.com/forum/viewforum.php?f=12

It is server side right now. If he adds a scripter management feature like he had before, and if you choose to manage scripters, you can autodownload a small client file. You can read about the JK2 version to see what Hex is capable of:
http://xmod.cat5camp.com/help_index.html

Instagib for Jedi Academy is under developement. Read about it here (thanks to Supes of BF for the heads-up):
http://www.teamwarfare.com/forums/showthread.asp?forumid=104&threadid=98389

Rumor
11-30-2003, 06:14 AM
Originally posted by Amidala from Chop Shop
Not only can you filter profanity, you can add any word to the "profanity" list such as "lamer", "lame", "chatkill", "honor", etc. All will be replaced with a string of your choosing, such as "@#$%!^" or "ima loser". That feature and the other adminmod features were in the JK2 version (1.2.0) but aren't in the current JA version. I think they wanted to get something out quickly (remember the SDK just came out) for the people who wanted flip kicks. Apparently the author Hex is very receptive to input, so now is the time to tell him what you want, Kaia:
http://x.fragism.com/forum/viewforum.php?f=12

It is server side right now. If he adds scripter management feature like he had before, and you choose to manage scripters, you can autodownload a small client file. You can read about the JK2 version to see what Hex is capable of:
http://xmod.cat5camp.com/help_index.html

Instagib for Jedi Academy is under developement. Read about it here (thanks to Supes of BF for the heads-up):
http://www.teamwarfare.com/forums/showthread.asp?forumid=104&threadid=98389

i would replace lamer with "HELLO I"M A ****ING NEWB PLEASE KILL ME AND ALL MY DENDROPHILIAC FRIENDS"

noide
11-30-2003, 07:16 AM
hahaha :cool: :cool:

.:Silver:.
11-30-2003, 07:47 AM
Okay, time for my take. I've played this mod for two days now.

The mod really doesn't do anything but add kick into the mix.

If you liked JO, then your in for a real treat.

However, since this mod makes katas the only real difference between JO and JA, I am curious as to why those who want competitive matches, don't choose to just continue playing JO. With this mod, it's the exact same game except katas. Oh, and now the pull throw doesn't work.

In the end, this mod is all about kicks. And if you have a modest knowledge of kicking from JO, plus a very low ping, then you'll do quite well.

If kick matches aren't your thing, then this is not your server.

Rumor
11-30-2003, 08:46 AM
its disabled by a cvar. =X= has always hated pull throw as a clan as have others, yet others just accepted and adapted. and you know what? those that accepted it were the top in jk2

as for why not stick with jk2? well no ladders and a community that went bye bye with the advent of 1.03 and 1.04, and you ask why?

eniaC
11-30-2003, 08:50 AM
Originally posted by .:Silver:.
I am curious as to why those who want competitive matches, don't choose to just continue playing JO.

Well I wouldn't consider myself a competitive player,

/snip *edit*

That's like asking why you bought a new car to replace your old one...kinda...another horrible example, I'm going to bed. Ignore this post, I'm delirious.

eniaC
11-30-2003, 08:52 AM
Originally posted by Rumor
as for why not stick with jk2? well no ladders and a community that went bye bye with the advent of 1.03 and 1.04, and you ask why?

sounds much better than my response.

Darth Kaan
11-30-2003, 01:07 PM
Didn't XMOD for JO also have a feature where the server would ignore scripts so they would not work and it was still all server side, or am I mistaken about that?

Imperial_thug
11-30-2003, 01:54 PM
Prime wrote:
"A couple of times I have tried to connect to the xMOD 2 test server at 64.81.143.34 and I have "waited to join". Is the server still up or full or something? Or might it be a problem at my end?"

I am having the same exact problem, dunno why. :(

fome
11-30-2003, 02:44 PM
it gets full very fast

g//plaZma
11-30-2003, 03:06 PM
Originally posted by .:Silver:.
Okay, time for my take. I've played this mod for two days now.

The mod really doesn't do anything but add kick into the mix.

If you liked JO, then your in for a real treat.

However, since this mod makes katas the only real difference between JO and JA, I am curious as to why those who want competitive matches, don't choose to just continue playing JO. With this mod, it's the exact same game except katas. Oh, and now the pull throw doesn't work.

In the end, this mod is all about kicks. And if you have a modest knowledge of kicking from JO, plus a very low ping, then you'll do quite well.

If kick matches aren't your thing, then this is not your server.

Well, this is an early version of xmod2. Hex is planning to add a lot of other stuff into it.

PG|Prometheus
11-30-2003, 04:54 PM
Yes there were multiple updates of xmod for jk2, more to come for xmod2.
The best thing about xmod is that hex believes people shouldn't be forced to play how he wants. He adds loads of cvars to turn things on and off, thatway, everyone is happy.

xmod needed a small client file for script detection, but I dont think there was a way of script detection without downloading the small file. If a script was detected, there were three options: ignore completely, kick or don't kick but upload ip/info to a log file.

FK | unnamed
11-30-2003, 05:58 PM
New in this version:
x_newmotd - New centerscreen MOTD cvar
x_newmotd_time - Time (in seconds to display this motd)
x_flipkick - Enable front flipkick
x_health_disable - Disable health items
x_shield_disable - Disable shield items
x_medpac_disable - Disable medpac items
x_powerup_disable - Disable powerups
x_black_enable - Enable the use of black in a name
x_pullthrow_disable - 1 doesn't allow push/pull while saber throwing, 2 makes the saber return
x_red_lock - Lock the red team
x_blue_lock - Lock the blue team
x_suicide_disable - 1 Disable The use of suicide, 2 smart kill award system
x_fallfadetime - Ammount of time it takes to fall to death
x_jawa_model - 0 disables the use of the jawa model
x_menu_model - 0 disables the use of the kyle & luke /menu models
-Fixed name color code back to the old xmod1 jk2 style
-Minor code adjustments to allow flipkick



as you can see, there is much more work to do.

side kicks are not in yet and quite a few tweaks that he put in JO, not to mention suggested tweaks he stated he wanted to put in for JA, have not made it in yet.

Keep in mind, he kind of snuck this one out the door real quick the day before Thanksgiving, so given the fact that he took time out of what ever personal/family things he had going on, to gave us a small teaser, was pretty cool.

WadeV1589
11-30-2003, 06:51 PM
I've had a post deleted on this page.... :mad:

MasterSidious
11-30-2003, 11:11 PM
How is that, it edits for you? Xmod :rock: Its hardcore? Do you have to double tap jump to kick then? I know for shizzy the answer will be yes. Its an FKs dream. Well, is it? You fks specialize in front kick, no are obsessed with it. Do you actually have a bind for it? I mean, holy **** you guys kick well. Absolute ****ing kick whores :D

MasterSidious
11-30-2003, 11:15 PM
Not that anyone gives a ****. But I just realized something :eek: holy ****! I can just look the kick question up for myself. ROFFLMFAO! (<---- no)

Rumor
11-30-2003, 11:58 PM
nah its all natural.

razorace
12-01-2003, 03:39 AM
I don't see the point in reinstalling the flip kick. The only reason why people liked it/used it was becuase it was unbalanced compared to the actual basic saber combat.

fk | screed
12-01-2003, 03:49 AM
Originally posted by razorace
I don't see the point in reinstalling the flip kick. The only reason why people liked it/used it was becuase it was unbalanced compared to the actual basic saber combat.

umm, no. Kick was put back in b/c its the most affective way to set your opponant up for a finishing move.

Rumor
12-01-2003, 03:52 AM
yeah totally. kick was so powerful man. it had no counters or nothing.

it adds absolutely nothing to the game.

razorace
12-01-2003, 03:55 AM
Originally posted by fk | screed
umm, no. Kick was put back in b/c its the most affective way to set your opponant up for a finishing move.

Yeah, from a fresh respawn!

g//plaZma
12-01-2003, 03:58 AM
Originally posted by Rumor
yeah totally. kick was so powerful man. it had no counters or nothing.

it adds absolutely nothing to the game.

Yeah I kno d00d it did liek 20 dmg and it was so hard to avoid/counter unless you knew how to move out of the way or use pull within that small time period when the guy who kicked you is still in the air and then kick him back (which ofcourse was impossible to do)

hahaha g1 ;)

g//plaZma
12-01-2003, 04:24 AM
Originally posted by razorace
Yeah, from a fresh respawn!

dude you have no idea what you're talking about. Pipe down and learn.

Kick was essential to FF s/o CTF and made FF dueling a lot more challenging with the combos kick brought to the table.

Again, this mod is more targeted towards the competitive saber only full force community and the guys who simply liked kick and the kick-based combos in JO, while doubling as a very nice admin mod. You don't have to play it if it's not your thing and if you simply can't cope with kick and tactical play.

razorace
12-01-2003, 05:15 AM
Just because the game mechanics basically forced you to spam kick to stop flag carriers in s/o CTF doesn't make it a good move.

There are other ways to fix the issue without reintroducing kick, which was spammed constently like newbies and vets alike.

Rumor
12-01-2003, 05:31 AM
exactly how would we do this? ramping up saber damage?

Lathain Valtiel
12-01-2003, 05:42 AM
That actually works surprisingly enough...

Rumor
12-01-2003, 05:57 AM
surprisingly enough it doesn't. we want complexity, not another reason to hold w and mouse1.

Lathain Valtiel
12-01-2003, 06:13 AM
Actually, in my experience holding down mouse1 with ramped up saber doesn't work too well... Judging from the complete and total imbeciles who use it only to drop from a swipe with yellow as their chest is exposed or such.

Rumor
12-01-2003, 06:32 AM
again. complexity. more damage doesn't make the game more complex.

Lathain Valtiel
12-01-2003, 06:51 AM
True enough, was only pointing out holding mouse1 on lethal saber servers does not work and will get you killed really fast unless the opposition are total idiots who don't have any sense of timing or aim.

Rumor
12-01-2003, 08:12 AM
yeah i figured.

=X=Master HeX
12-01-2003, 08:56 AM
First off, I'd like to thank everyone here for their opinion on my old JO mod and my new JA mod. I put a lot of work into the entire Xmod project and it's nice to see there are at least a few people who enjoy it.

Second I thought I'd give you a bit of a .plan here on what I'll be working on during the week:

Xmod 2.1.0 .plan

- Making changes to the default SDK to make a vanilla source that can be compiled in .net and with gcc.
I know lots of you can't wait for the next feature list for 2.1 but none of this can happen without a simple way to compile the code for linux and then windows. Since raven felt the need to go back to DLL, mods need a seperate SO file to be compiled for linux dedicated servers. Lame, but I can deal with it

- Adding in a few other features like #health chat replacement and /name private tells

- Putting level .fix files back in the game
To block off errors that map developers (learn from your mistakes please) leave in their maps. For example on top of buildings, etc... These files will block off areas players shouldn't be able to jump to.

- Admin commands
I really want to put admins back into control and I will be spends lots of time putting admin commands back into the game one at a time. This includes the ip bans in a file, mute by ip, etc.

- Profanity Filter
This needs a little rework but should be an issue

- Cvar Saber damage
For all sabers and styles... I know many people would like to change the damage system for specific moves.

After all of this I will then be going through our forums and adding things into the game that players request. Remember that I'm making this mod for the players (I include myself in this group) and I will put pretty much anything reasonable into the game. Everything will be cvar optional, of course.

Kurgan
12-01-2003, 11:14 AM
Looks interesting, I may try out the latest version tomorrow.

One thing though, why option to ban the Jawa model?

Didn't we establish the "Jawa model is bugged!" thing was just a myth?

So why encourage it?

fome
12-01-2003, 11:27 AM
in team games it has no colours so you cant tell whos team there on, other than the crosshair colour

Originally posted by fome
Banning jawa model is optional, so it doesn't have to be disabled, but if you're wondering why anyone would want to ban the cute jawa it's because in team games its harder (not impossible by looking at the crosshair colour)to see which team the jawa is on, as it has no team colours. Thats the only explaination i can think of :amidala:

Kurgan
12-01-2003, 11:49 AM
Fine, but the same is true of many other "secret skins" and in fact you can play as Kyle without the team skin.

There is a mod that lets you use team colors for the Jawa, why not simply add that to Xmod and forget the banning of the skin?


Also you're wrong about "the only way to know what team they are on."

-Force Seeing (reveals their team color)
-Radar (they show up as a green icon at close range if on your team)
-Team Beacon (if they're on your team they'll have a beacon showing it)
-Saber color (always team color)
-Stationary Shield color (only in certain maps but you get the idea, same as the saber color thing)

I suppose the only time it would be a real problem is if the guy switches teams a lot, if they are lots of Jawas or friendly fire is on. But still...

I say remove the "ban jawa model" option and just add in the "team colors for Jawa" mod, which is really tiny. I believe it's available from a variety of sites including pcgamemods.com.

Something needs to be done. As it is now, the mod is perpetuating the myth that the Jawa model is "a cheat."


PS: Banning the kyle & luke "menu" models is also pointless since the patch already does that, but I figured xmod2 was either made before the patch or else they figured people who didn't use the patch in MP (for whatever oddball reason) would still get to ban those exploits.

Sam
12-01-2003, 11:52 AM
I love this mod.........:cry8: <-----tears of joy.



the force on the server is abit Slooooow though.

DevilzFan
12-01-2003, 01:26 PM
Hex, and XMod Rock!

Thanks again for doing this for us man.

-|JW|MasterMunkee

Master William
12-01-2003, 02:04 PM
I played the Xmod, and I noticed no difference in gameplay... Except that JK2 kicks are back. As long as they are not spammed, I'm fine with them.

Also, when somebody does a kata/spin/whatever move, you can easily interrupt it all with a JK2 kick. This turning the game into JK2, where katas and the new spins become totally useless. Heck, I kicked away a guy doing a staff butterfly on me :(

Sam
12-01-2003, 02:32 PM
Originally posted by Master William
I played the Xmod, and I noticed no difference in gameplay... Except that JK2 kicks are back. As long as they are not spammed, I'm fine with them.

Also, when somebody does a kata/spin/whatever move, you can easily interrupt it all with a JK2 kick. This turning the game into JK2, where katas and the new spins become totally useless. Heck, I kicked away a guy doing a staff butterfly on me :(



they arn't useless, they just wont be used every second like they are now.

Rumor
12-01-2003, 04:44 PM
well i'll be sure to whore kicks (along with many others) whenever mw is around.

and thats where you are wrong mw.

they only stop the move if you do it during windup. i did get immense satisfaction kicking a guy who tried to rs me in the air. he landed on his ass :D

as for doing it during katas you had better time it right or you will die, simple as that. esp with the saber barrier. its great to send one guy into his teammates with teamdamage on while he is doing a sb. its just fun.

Lathain Valtiel
12-01-2003, 06:49 PM
Which reminds me I need to remaster kicks.

g//plaZma
12-01-2003, 07:44 PM
Originally posted by Sam
I love this mod.........:cry8: <-----tears of joy.



the force on the server is abit Slooooow though.

The force regen is set to default, 200 which is the only setting ever used in any matches/tourneys. It balances the game out pretty much so you won't see fcs (flag carriers) seemingly being able to switch force speed on all the time when they don't have a team energizer. It also adds more complexity and a responsibility to watch and use your force pool correctly.

eniaC
12-01-2003, 07:56 PM
Originally posted by g//plaZma
It also adds more complexity and a responsibility to watch and use your force pool correctly.

Tell me about it, there are hardly any g_forceregentime 200s' out there.
I am so damn use to the high respawn settings.

div3rse.jello
12-02-2003, 01:08 AM
Originally posted by Kurgan
Fine, but the same is true of many other "secret skins" and in fact you can play as Kyle without the team skin.

-Force Seeing (reveals their team color)
-Radar (they show up as a green icon at close range if on your team)
-Team Beacon (if they're on your team they'll have a beacon showing it)
-Saber color (always team color)
-Stationary Shield color (only in certain maps but you get the idea, same as the saber color thing)


I ain't going to use 20 force just to see whose team this guy is on.

Who the hell has time to look at the radar.

And if their saber is off?

g//plaZma
12-02-2003, 01:15 AM
Originally posted by div3rse.jello
I ain't going to use 20 force just to see whose team this guy is on.

Who the hell has time to look at the radar.

And if their saber is off?

^No1 uses the radar in any team based game except for Siege. It's pretty crappy and not really useful.

With the chewbacca skin, it's harder to tell what team they're on too but Hex is probably not gonna touch that.

Rumor
12-02-2003, 01:42 AM
actually i use the radar to see where my partner is in 2v2's. either above or below me.

fk | screed
12-02-2003, 02:07 AM
Originally posted by Rumor
actually i use the radar to see where my partner is in 2v2's. either above or below me.

Your always on the bottom cause your a bish :p

Kurgan
12-02-2003, 02:28 AM
Who the hell has time to look at the radar.

Radar IS useful. Ideally it would show ENEMY UNITS (say, as red arrows) as well as friends (combined with Force Seeing, like the JK1/MotS Map)... ah well, wasted opportunity (HINT, HINT MOD MAKERS!).

Radar takes no more time to glance at than your HUD, in other words, no time at all. Lazy!

And in Siege radar saves TONS of time.

I ain't going to use 20 force just to see whose team this guy is on.

And if their saber is off?

Team Beacon. If they have one, they're on your team. If they don't, they're an enemy, shoot to kill!

You have no excuse! ; )

You can also do it by name. Look in the upper righthand corner of the screen. You'll see the names of all teammates, weapons they are holding at the moment (I know the pictures are small) and relative position (in Siege). Aim at somebody and their name appears. Green for allies and red for Allies (IIRC).

But I just use the Team Beacon. pretty hard to miss...

---------------------------------------

fk | screed wrote:
Your always on the bottom cause your a bish

YOU FARGIN SNEEGY BOSTAGE!

Rumor
12-02-2003, 03:25 AM
Originally posted by Kurgan
Radar IS useful. Ideally it would show ENEMY UNITS (say, as red arrows) as well as friends (combined with Force Seeing, like the JK1/MotS Map)... ah well, wasted opportunity (HINT, HINT MOD MAKERS!).


yeah no **** thats what i say.

g//plaZma
12-02-2003, 03:44 AM
I get your point, Kurgan but when you're playing CTF, it's so fast-paced that you don't want to look up at your radar when some guy wearing the jawa skin comes by just to see if he's on your team or not since he can be running after your fc to return his flag. Having the jawa skin on is an advantage in high-paced CTF gameplay where every second counts. So just to avoid complications and confusions and to ensure fair gameplay, Hex has made a cvar to disable this model.

fk | screed
12-02-2003, 04:46 AM
I would disable it just cause having a 6 foot jawa saying WOOTANI! is ghey.

div3rse.jello
12-02-2003, 07:52 AM
:jawa WOOTANII

Rad Blackrose
12-02-2003, 01:32 PM
Originally posted by Kurgan
Team Beacon. If they have one, they're on your team. If they don't, they're an enemy, shoot to kill!

You have no excuse! ; )

You can also do it by name. Look in the upper righthand corner of the screen. You'll see the names of all teammates, weapons they are holding at the moment (I know the pictures are small) and relative position (in Siege). Aim at somebody and their name appears. Green for allies and red for Allies (IIRC).

But I just use the Team Beacon. pretty hard to miss...


Not everyone has the team overlay on by default.

Kurgan
12-02-2003, 03:07 PM
Not everyone has the team overlay on by default.

That's true, and not everybody has Radar on either.

But... maybe they should turn it on?

Then they wouldn't complain so much. ; )



would disable it just cause having a 6 foot jawa saying WOOTANI! is ghey.

Bah, go watch A New Hope again. Did you hate tall Jawas back in 1977?

Then again we've always had tall Ughnaughts in JK2. People are so fickle... you know you can already just make it so everybody uses the same dang model right?

Rumor
12-02-2003, 04:39 PM
kurgan ctf is faster than any other gametype. you don't have time to look at them with your crosshair (which is hard to do colors don't show up anymore so you only have a split second to try and make sense of their name) and you don't have time to compare with your teamoverlay.

=X= has always hated pt's but then again the clans that got used to them came out to be the top ctf clans.

hex may be taking input but in the end its still his mod and anything that bugs him he's gonna make an option to turn off.

razorace
12-02-2003, 10:23 PM
Hex: You have blocked your PMs and emails so I'm going to post this here...

You sounded like you're associated with the xmod2 so I figured I'd send this heads up.

Me and several other modders looked over the sourceforge license (and talked to the sourceforge admins) and JKA mods can't legally be on sourceforge. As part of the requirements for sourceforge, you must be fully "open source" which includes full commerical distribution possibilities. That is fully banned by the JKA EULA and ethical development rules. As such, sourceforge isn't allowing JKA mods and your project is at risk of getting bumped when they find out.

From what I can gather, sourceforge didn't notice since whoever started the project didn't put down 100% correct data for the project description

Anyway, I'm not going to say anything to Sourceforge since I understand that CVS hosting for mods is hard to get. But, if you have problems I recommend you check out www.freepository.com. They don't have the full "open source" requirement and has been pretty good for my CVS needs

Kurgan
12-02-2003, 10:48 PM
Rumor wrote:
Kurgan ctf is faster than any other gametype. you don't have time to look at them with your crosshair (which is hard to do colors don't show up anymore so you only have a split second to try and make sense of their name) and you don't have time to compare with your teamoverlay.

Which is why you use the team beacon. My point was that there are numerous was built into the game to tell what team a person is on, not just the hue of the skin they happen to be using.

Hell, in Siege you can't even rely on team colors. ; )

I'll say it again though, if the Jawa model is such a problem, take two seconds and add the Jawa team colors mod that was made a long time ago, problem solved. Somebody just took the Jawa skin, gave it an icon and shaded it red and blue for use in CTF and TFFA.

That makes more sense than banning it, at least to my mind.


=X= has always hated pt's but then again the clans that got used to them came out to be the top ctf clans.

Exactly my point. Obviously the makers of xmod/2 and the "elite sabers only ctf community" are not of one and the same mind. That's too bad (for the elite ctf community), they should start modding themselves to get the mods they really want. I falsely assumed that "=X=" had the same ideas, but I guess there's a bit of disagreement.



hex may be taking input but in the end its still his mod and anything that bugs him he's gonna make an option to turn off.

Yeah that's true, he can put in amslap if he wants as well. My point was if he's properly informed, he has no logical reason to make changes like that, except stubborn personal bias.

The Jawa model isn't an exploit, and it makes more sense to add team colors if that's the problem than to ban it. In the meantime, there are plenty of ways to adapt to its use, simply through common sense use of already existing gameplay features, like the team beacon, radar, names, team overlay list, force seeing, noticing sabers/shield colors, etc.

If I were playing a CTF match where everyone was using the Jawa model, I could still distinguish friend from foe instantly by using the team beacon alone in fact. Silly, but it would work.

Kurgan
12-02-2003, 10:56 PM
In fact, what's the author's email addy? I can send him this link:

http://www.pcgamemods.com/2363/

"Jawa Multiplayer Skin

Description: this makes the jawa skin avaible in multiplayer without typing in console. i also included botsuport and ctf colors enjoy."

File size: 462.24 KB
Posted Date: 10-21-03

g//plaZma
12-02-2003, 11:43 PM
Originally posted by Kurgan
Which is why you use the team beacon. My point was that there are numerous was built into the game to tell what team a person is on, not just the hue of the skin they happen to be using.

Maybe, but the Jawa skin makes you only rely on Becon(best thing next to skin), Radar (no one looks at this in CTF unless things start to get slow), Team Overlay (who wants to look at the team overlay to find out if someone with the jawa model is on your team or not?) and crosshair color (in most cases you won't be able to put everyone in your line of vision under a crosshair).

Hell, in Siege you can't even rely on team colors. ; )

Yeah but in siege the radar comes in use and any idiot can tell the difference between an imperial/sith/merc and a rebel/jedi.

I'll say it again though, [b]if the Jawa model is such a problem, take two seconds and add the Jawa team colors mod that was made a long time ago, problem solved. Somebody just took the Jawa skin, gave it an icon and shaded it red and blue for use in CTF and TFFA.

At this time, xmod2 is server-side only and even if this was server and client-side the download would take a bit longer than it should. Why put dead weight on this? It's a lot easier to just make a cvar that allows the server admin to allow/disallow the jawa model.

That makes more sense than banning it, at least to my mind.

There is an option to enable/disable it and if the server admin wants to, he can add the jawa skin fix to his server.

Exactly my point. Obviously the makers of xmod/2 and the "elite sabers only ctf community" are not of one and the same mind. That's too bad (for the elite ctf community), they should start modding themselves to get the mods they really want. I falsely assumed that "=X=" had the same ideas, but I guess there's a bit of disagreement.

=X= does have different ideas about pull-throw and bad language on their server but they do listen to the rest of the ff/so CTF community, seeing as Hex made cvars for basically everything. If a certain aspect of xmod is not your cup of tea, you can just turn it off. It's a lot better and a lot less selfish of him than completely turning pull-throw off or putting the soon to come language filter on with no option to disable it.

Yeah that's true, he can put in amslap if he wants as well. My point was if he's properly informed, he has no logical reason to make changes like that, except stubborn personal bias.

Wrong. He's been listening to the rest of the community and everytime he comes into the =X= server he gets thank yous from basically all the players logged on. Like last night someone on the =X= server suggested that he turned off the auto saber sheathing after being gripped. I said that I liked the auto saber sheathing thing so he replied that he might make it so that after an x amount of seconds of being gripped, you sheath your saber. That's not what I call being stubborn and it pleases everyone.

The Jawa model isn't an exploit, and it makes more sense to add team colors if that's the problem than to ban it. In the meantime, there are plenty of ways to adapt to its use, simply through common sense use of already existing gameplay features, like the team beacon, radar, names, team overlay list, force seeing, noticing sabers/shield colors, etc.

I've already replied to this.

If I were playing a CTF match where everyone was using the Jawa model, I could still distinguish friend from foe instantly by using the team beacon alone in fact. Silly, but it would work.

This may sound hard to believe but if everyone on both teams were using the jawa model it would be a lot easier to distinguish who is who since you have to rely on team becon in this situation since you are forced to only focus on team becon whereas most players in a CTF game where all players are using different skins would mostly tell friend from foe by the skins.

div3rse.jello
12-03-2003, 12:04 AM
Originally posted by Kurgan
Exactly my point. Obviously the makers of xmod/2 and the "elite sabers only ctf community" are not of one and the same mind. That's too bad (for the elite ctf community), they should start modding themselves to get the mods they really want. I falsely assumed that "=X=" had the same ideas, but I guess there's a bit of disagreement.

Don't make stuff up plz.

=X= = old school


They = personally don't like PT

They = part of "elite ctf community"

They = basically made s/o CTF popular with the life of their
server back in JK2

lllKyNeSlll
12-03-2003, 12:56 AM
Can someone make these requests to hex
1. ground kick needs to be taken off, I can understand roll, but now with the new flip kick returned, people kicking back on the ground just takes away some of the skill when u want to finish with another kick to keep them down (remember jk2 where a good player can use throw and kick and keep another player down on the ground until they die)
2. Iím not sure I only played for 5 minutes but is the kick the one where u jump then hold down jump again and it automatically kicks on contact (similar to a wall run). Uj u know what Iím talking bout. Itís alright but personally the original jk2 kicks felt better and took more skill I think than the so called beta kicks.
3. PT lock should be a cvar to enable and disable the thing. PT could be disabled on default and enabled for other purposes. I mean this mod could be better for ff/so 1v1 duel if pt was enabled for ptk purposes. If some newb is on yer ass with drain and you finally regain to 100 force on the run, you will have a weapon to take him down (2 ptks and a lunge to finish). But otherwise youíd have to go pkpkpk or gk which is a lot less reliable in my opinion.

lllKyNeSlll
12-03-2003, 01:06 AM
Originally posted by Lathain Valtiel
Buddy, if you were paying any sort of attention to this thread you would've noticed that I said this was an inside joke previously. Last Thursday I played on Kurgan's server as [R.I.P] God, Tesla was [R.I.P] Jesus, and Kurgan himself was [R.I.P] Holy Ghost. The Sam that posted in this thread will also get it, I was considering asking him to be R.I.P Apostle. LOL

you could have just said
"this is an inside joke and you are on the outside"


well anyway, I think xmod could be improved if it was more customizable with cvars, maybe it is and i just don't know.

I'm just wondering will the script detector throw out talk scripts? I think jk2 xmod detected mainly vstr scripts. I use vstr sometimes for stringing together alot of force changes and talk binds into one button

FK | unnamed
12-03-2003, 01:31 AM
Originally posted by razorace
I don't see the point in reinstalling the flip kick. The only reason why people liked it/used it was becuase it was unbalanced compared to the actual basic saber combat.

All about the comboís man, it's all about the combos.

Saber throw > pull > rotate > side kick > down toss the saber (after it has returned and you are still in the air) onto his head > front kick > snap lunge


Stuff like that was just plain wicked, not to mention hard to do on living, skilled, *thinking opponents on the fly.

But it was all possible in Outcast, that and much, much more.

Try this one next time you fire up Outcast:

Running side kick > as opponent falls away, center you cross hair and catch him in a grip *before he lands on the ground > bring him back in for a quick frontal kick and upon the knock back sway > release > pull > throw > kick

Things like that made players who got hit by them say one of two things:

Holy ****!

Or

WTF!?


Now enter Academy and all of the nerfs...


Grip > shake mouse around > let go


....

Hot damn, some serious ball breaking moves there huh?


Kick adds such an incredible dynamic to the game and unless you have a "let's see, what's the most wicked combo I could ever create?" mentality going in, you simply will not to see how it plays a much larger part than just a 20 damage double tap move.

FK | unnamed
12-03-2003, 01:43 AM
Originally posted by Master William


Also, when somebody does a kata/spin/whatever move, you can easily interrupt it all with a JK2 kick. This turning the game into JK2, where katas and the new spins become totally useless. Heck, I kicked away a guy doing a staff butterfly on me :(

William you just hit the nail right on the head and don't even know it.

Outcast had one key factor that base Academy does not:

Players who **** up and don't think before they execute an attack, have nothing to fear in Academy.

In Outcast if you did a DFA you sure as hell better be 200% positive it's going to connect, because if you just "let one rip" you are in for one hell of a nasty kick in the back side (to be followed up by even more damaging follow up moves is you fall).



And let's be honest for a second, all I ever saw in any and all saber only servers was people mindlessly letting Katas and roll+stabs fly and rejoicing when they connected with a solid object that was not a wall.

So you have to think now before you hop around and twirl your saber all over the place?

Well, to reclaim a phrase so many of you tried to take from usÖ.

Learn and adapt.

Learn and adapt.

;)

Khier
12-03-2003, 01:52 AM
Originally posted by FK | unnamed
Well, to reclaim a phrase so many of you tried to take from usÖ.

Learn and adapt.

Learn and adapt.

;)

That's my favourite saying to use whenever I encounter whiners. In fact, I should bind it since I know I'll be using it until either JA collapses or the fanboy empire collapses. :)

g//plaZma
12-03-2003, 01:58 AM
Originally posted by lllKyNeSlll
Can someone make these requests to hex
1. ground kick needs to be taken off, I can understand roll, but now with the new flip kick returned, people kicking back on the ground just takes away some of the skill when u want to finish with another kick to keep them down (remember jk2 where a good player can use throw and kick and keep another player down on the ground until they die)

Yeah I know what you mean dude but so far while playing xmod2, the biggest satisfaction I got was kicking someone to the ground, wait till they try to spring back up at me, move back and saber throw so that they jump right into my flying saber.

2. Iím not sure I only played for 5 minutes but is the kick the one where u jump then hold down jump again and it automatically kicks on contact (similar to a wall run). Uj u know what Iím talking bout. Itís alright but personally the original jk2 kicks felt better and took more skill I think than the so called beta kicks.

No, they're identical or almost identical to JK2 kicks, man. No worries.

3. PT lock should be a cvar to enable and disable the thing. PT could be disabled on default and enabled for other purposes. I mean this mod could be better for ff/so 1v1 duel if pt was enabled for ptk purposes. If some newb is on yer ass with drain and you finally regain to 100 force on the run, you will have a weapon to take him down (2 ptks and a lunge to finish). But otherwise youíd have to go pkpkpk or gk which is a lot less reliable in my opinion.

It does have a cvar already.

FK | unnamed
12-03-2003, 02:00 AM
Jawa Model

Yes it does suck the loins of George Lucas in team based games that have a fast, *close-range pace.

I.E. Full Force saber only TeamFFA/CTF.

In a full weapon game of either TeamFFA/CTF you could look up at the radar to see if that guy 150 feet away is on your team, but in FF/SO when you have a pack of 10 players fighting in a space of about 5 feet wide, it's just not a realistic option.

I could say just using any generic model like Luke, then using the "force model" cvar would solve this, but it's just not useful in a realistic situation either.

In FF/SO the nature of the combat is basically a bunch of people all crammed in the same *small/close area duking it out.

Now toss in the constant blue and red color flashes from team energize/drain/rage and you can start to see how players don't rely on colors or icons in FF/SO team based games.

I can say I personally (and I'm sure I'm not alone) relied mainly on model identification.

I knew that /model rebel was break_dF, just as he knew that the /model stormpilot was unnamed.

And while yes, the other team could use models we used, the color identification would have to come into play, but only in the case of 2-3 of the same models running around the map (1/2 the time the whole other team looks like kyle due to custom clan skins, so this was almost never an issue).

div3rse.jello
12-03-2003, 03:32 AM
ahaha plazma said that to me too the other day..what a homo :p

id rather have jk2 104 get ups

g//plaZma
12-03-2003, 03:57 AM
Originally posted by div3rse.jello ahaha plazma said that to me too the other day..what a homo :p

I <3 u 2 jell-hoe :)

Rumor
12-03-2003, 05:29 AM
Originally posted by FK | unnamed

I can say I personally (and I'm sure I'm not alone) relied mainly on model identification.

I knew that /model rebel was break_dF, just as he knew that the /model stormpilot was unnamed.

And while yes, the other team could use models we used, the color identification would have to come into play, but only in the case of 2-3 of the same models running around the map (1/2 the time the whole other team looks like kyle due to custom clan skins, so this was almost never an issue).

yeah. for us me and remij were always the stormpilot (2v2 partners), plaz was always swamptrooper (with those secksi shaders) and prime was always a shadowtrooper.

noide
12-03-2003, 05:34 AM
jk2 get-ups were so much better

Prime
12-03-2003, 03:34 PM
Originally posted by lllKyNeSlll
1. ground kick needs to be taken off, I can understand roll, but now with the new flip kick returned, people kicking back on the ground just takes away some of the skill when u want to finish with another kick to keep them down (remember jk2 where a good player can use throw and kick and keep another player down on the ground until they die) But isn't that nerfing, and thus something competative players hate? I mean, it is more options for players, isn't it?

I would think that this makes things more interesting, since players who are knocked down aren't as helpless. I don't see how removing this adds skill to the game. Don't get me wrong, I have no problem with killing defenseless players, but where is the skill in killing them? Isn't there more skill in killing someone who can defend themselves?

Kurgan
12-03-2003, 04:07 PM
Well that's the thing... "nerfs" imply that the game is somehow unbalanced (ie: that some things are overpowerful) and thus they "need" to be "nerfed" (made weaker or less effective).

I always got the impression that the competative community was angry because of "nerfs" (ie: what was fine in JK2 was made weaker, and thus boring/silly/etc).

It's a complex question and obviously not everybody agrees on the best way to "fix" the game (much in the same way that nobody could agree on the "best" way to "fix" JK2, after all the hullabaloo with the patches).

That's okay, people just have different opinions. Some people love the game how it is, some people want to change it, and the people who want to change it want to change it in different ways. At least with the tools finally available, theoretically everyone with the time and desire (and talent) can make their own version of the game that they like.

Kurgan
12-03-2003, 04:27 PM
Don't make stuff up plz.

=X= = old school


They = personally don't like PT

They = part of "elite ctf community"

They = basically made s/o CTF popular with the life of their
server back in JK2

Excuse me... I'm not "making stuff up."

The people I heard complaining about the "good old days" being gone were the guys from the FK forums. =X= was only ever mentioned as being the "saviors" who were making xmod2 for JA, that would fix everything for Sabers Only CTF.

Obviously LF isn't the whole community, so there's bound to be a lot I miss out there, but for their part, they were the "voice" of the disaffected elite community from JK2 in JA.

Now you say =X= IS the elite community, and yet, they are the ones who want to "nerf pull throw" and ban the Jawa model, etc, why are they being criticized by FK members?

I thought FK described itself as part of the elite community, ie: old school. Or is this proof that not all of the elite community agrees on how to fix the problem (as I suggested)? There's nothing wrong with that, it's just an observation.

I just was pointing out where members of the "elite community" of old were disagreeing with one another, not saying that =X= were somehow outsiders that knew nothing. I considered them part of that "elite community" (otherwise they wouldn't be making the mod in the first place and getting all the support from FK), but maybe that didn't come across in my post.

The only reason I'd bring this is up at all is to contest the notion that the elite community all were in agreement about everything and they all knew "what was best" for JA. In the end, the people making the mod get to decide, whether the rest of that community agrees with them or not, but that's ok, mod maker's perrogative.


This is comparable to the folks (in JK2 and I predict the same will happen in JA) who want to make the game more "honorable" or more "movie like." There are large numbers of people who have these as their stated goals (If only this or this happened, the game would be truly honorable/movie-like... etc), but since they can't agree on exactly HOW to accomplish that goal, they end up making multiple mods with different solutions. I predict that's how this will turn out (unless of course the =X= team can have a big pow-wow with all the other elites to decide in council what should and should not be done in the mod).

PG|Prometheus
12-03-2003, 05:06 PM
Kurgan, as pointed out several times, hex designs his mod so that for every change he makes, he also creates a cvar to turn it on or off. These clans were united over key issues such as returning kicks, however, they don't and shouldn't have to agree over everything.

At the end of the day, it is certainly not hex (and his team) that decides what features should be turned on, but the server admins and tournement/ladder organisers. And the only way they decide is through going with the majority of the community.


Well that's the thing... "nerfs" imply that the game is somehow unbalanced (ie: that some things are overpowerful) and thus they "need" to be "nerfed" (made weaker or less effective).

...there have been numerous threads I've read depicting how s/o ctf became pointless. Apparantly the flag carrier couldn't be killed, which would certainly indicate a very large imbalance.

Darth Kaan
12-03-2003, 05:30 PM
If XMOD for JA ends up being like it's JO counterpart, it will provide server ops with many options to make the gameplay more complex or not.

From what I have seen on the =X= forum, Hex is very receptive to adding cvars for the things people want added and in such means, they can be turned on or not. That means having choices we otherwise would not have.

That in a nutshell is why it is and will most likely stay popular amoung players and server ops alike.

Just my .002

Imperial_thug
12-03-2003, 05:40 PM
Originally posted by Master William
I played the Xmod, and I noticed no difference in gameplay... Except that JK2 kicks are back. As long as they are not spammed, I'm fine with them.

Also, when somebody does a kata/spin/whatever move, you can easily interrupt it all with a JK2 kick. This turning the game into JK2, where katas and the new spins become totally useless. Heck, I kicked away a guy doing a staff butterfly on me :(

That kind of sucks, hopefully someone will adress that issue, balance it out somhow, I don't have the slightest clue how they would though. I'm all for kicking, but I don't want it to nueter every other move in the game. I like the new moves also, I just wish there was a move that can knock ppl down to set up combos in JA.

Lathain Valtiel
12-03-2003, 05:47 PM
Originally posted by FK | unnamed
William you just hit the nail right on the head and don't even know it.

Outcast had one key factor that base Academy does not:

Players who **** up and don't think before they execute an attack, have nothing to fear in Academy.

...So I suppose a counter lunge is nothing to fear? Don't be biased please.

Master William
12-03-2003, 06:02 PM
Originally posted by FK | unnamed
William you just hit the nail right on the head and don't even know it.

Outcast had one key factor that base Academy does not:

Players who **** up and don't think before they execute an attack, have nothing to fear in Academy.

In Outcast if you did a DFA you sure as hell better be 200% positive it's going to connect, because if you just "let one rip" you are in for one hell of a nasty kick in the back side (to be followed up by even more damaging follow up moves is you fall).



And let's be honest for a second, all I ever saw in any and all saber only servers was people mindlessly letting Katas and roll+stabs fly and rejoicing when they connected with a solid object that was not a wall.

So you have to think now before you hop around and twirl your saber all over the place?

Well, to reclaim a phrase so many of you tried to take from usÖ.

Learn and adapt.

Learn and adapt.

;)

Learn and adapt? Bull****. The last thing I would do is run around slashing crazy -- which you are claiming I do. And I was not the one getting kicked away. You can even kick away butterflies and all, and butterflies are not something they just spammed, but if I wouldn't have kicked him away while he was doing it, I would have died.

Darth Kaan
12-03-2003, 07:34 PM
Originally posted by Master William
Learn and adapt? Bull****. The last thing I would do is run around slashing crazy -- which you are claiming I do. And I was not the one getting kicked away. You can even kick away butterflies and all, and butterflies are not something they just spammed, but if I wouldn't have kicked him away while he was doing it, I would have died.

So what's your point? You don't like having kick as a counter to the butterfly?

g//plaZma
12-03-2003, 07:35 PM
Originally posted by Master William
Learn and adapt? Bull****. The last thing I would do is run around slashing crazy -- which you are claiming I do. And I was not the one getting kicked away. You can even kick away butterflies and all, and butterflies are not something they just spammed, but if I wouldn't have kicked him away while he was doing it, I would have died.

Weren't many people complaining about how butterfly doesn't have a counter besides for trying to completely avoid it? Kicking out of the way is the penalty for butterflying like crazy, much like DFAing like crazy was for JK2. It's not always guaranteed that a butterfly would be kicked out of the way automattically, it's all reflexes.

Hey here's a strategy. Score a knockdown with kick and then use butterfly as they're getting up with the new JA getups so they jump right into you.

This hasn't been tested but I assume it probably would work. Try it out next time.

Master William
12-03-2003, 09:26 PM
Well, IMO the ''counter'' is too easy to use on any type of attack. A spin, a butterfly, anything can be just kicked away. So now, everything has a counter, or I must be wrong.

g//plaZma
12-03-2003, 09:35 PM
Originally posted by Master William
Well, IMO the ''counter'' is too easy to use on any type of attack. A spin, a butterfly, anything can be just kicked away. So now, everything has a counter, or I must be wrong.

If you kick someone when they're in the middle of a saber swing straight up in front of them, you will get hit by the saber. You gotta sort of go around them to kick them. Same with butterfly. If you kick from right in front of them and their saber hits you while you're trying to pull off a kick, you will take some damage, if not die.

Anyways, this is only a mod and if you don't like it, you don't have to play. It's more aimed at the FF crowd.

Rumor
12-03-2003, 10:08 PM
in terms that marker can understand, mw:

buzz the **** off if you don't like it. we aren't forcing you to play it.

Tinny
12-03-2003, 10:15 PM
woahhh, i missed flip kick and side kick from jo sooooo much. is there a way i can download this mod and put it on a server i put up?

lllKyNeSlll
12-03-2003, 11:02 PM
william, u can still do things with a saber to kill someone on kick. I"ve been killed in xmod when trying to pull someone who was swinging. So if you can tell they will pull when you swing they take a risk sometimes also. Also, many players can use red and time their swings so that someone in a kick lands in their swings (aka crow and reborn). I mean this all may be useless in ctf, but it can help in ffa (which is what i think you play) and duels

KaiaSowapit
12-03-2003, 11:24 PM
Originally posted by g//plaZma
Weren't many people complaining about how butterfly doesn't have a counter besides for trying to completely avoid it?
Okay, so the solution is to add yet another move that virtually has no counter and can be spammed to death?

Sorry, not trying to take anything away from you s/o ff ctf flipkick fans, but I prefer to keep my Star Wars & Kung Fu separate.

Too many bad memories of people using nothing but flipkicks in JK2... the saber became irrelevant. Not my cup of tea.

g//plaZma
12-03-2003, 11:58 PM
Originally posted by KaiaSowapit
Okay, so the solution is to add yet another move that virtually has no counter and can be spammed to death?

Wrong, as Kynes stated, you can easily kill a kicker by timing a red swing as he jumps forward to kick you. It takes time to perfectly master this and I've only seen a few people in JK2 who were able to do it. Crow and Reborn included. Besides that method, there are always the JA get-ups. You have a chance of rolling to the side and returning the favor ;) never press back/forward when on the ground though. That just makes it easier for whoever is kicking you.

Sorry, not trying to take anything away from you s/o ff ctf flipkick fans, but I prefer to keep my Star Wars & Kung Fu separate.

No one's forcing you to play the mod, or enable flipkicks if you're a server admin running the mod. If you don't like the idea of kicking in starwars, that's fine.

Anyways, I'm more of an ff dueler than ff s/o ctf player and the main reason why kicks were so important in my gametype was that they were chainable with other things and doing sick force combos with kick was just a blast.

Too many bad memories of people using nothing but flipkicks in JK2... the saber became irrelevant. Not my cup of tea.

That's your choice, and a valid one.

Master William
12-04-2003, 12:14 AM
Originally posted by KaiaSowapit
Okay, so the solution is to add yet another move that virtually has no counter and can be spammed to death?

Sorry, not trying to take anything away from you s/o ff ctf flipkick fans, but I prefer to keep my Star Wars & Kung Fu separate.

Too many bad memories of people using nothing but flipkicks in JK2... the saber became irrelevant. Not my cup of tea.

I agree to 100%.

MasterSidious
12-04-2003, 12:39 AM
Originally posted by fk | screed
umm, no. Kick was put back in b/c its the most affective way to set your opponant up for a finishing move.

RIGHT HERE! HERE IT IS! This shows perfectly well how it is on an fk server. The ONLY thing they do is kick, kick, and dfa (along with a FEW OCASSIONAL things of course too). Without kick, its a balanced game, and the fk can't handle balanced. But now I have a new comp. :D and I can kick (could not kick before with 3 fps), so watch out you mother ****ing kick whores! :D

div3rse.jello
12-04-2003, 12:41 AM
There are ****ing cvars for ****s sake and the website doesnt say FOR ELITE CTF COMMUNITY only or anything like that. If you have a suggestion, you tell Hex. If he thinks it's good, he'll put it in. Simple as that.

But =X= PREFERS having pull throw OFF because they think it's a cheap way to return the flag. =X= = CLAN = PART OF "ELITE COMMUNITY". And since it is THEIR server they turn it OFF.

BTW, PART OF DOES NOT EQUAL IS

The people I heard complaining about the "good old days" being gone were the guys from the FK forums. =X= was only ever mentioned as being the "saviors" who were making xmod2 for JA, that would fix everything for Sabers Only CTF.

There's a little history between FK and =X=. I'd prefer not talking about it here.

MasterSidious
12-04-2003, 12:43 AM
BTW, becaue I had a bad comp. before and I'm not skilled in the art of whoring the front flip kick move, I too agree that the front flip kick should be taken out.

BTW, I'm not a noob or anything, and the front flip kick wasn't taken out, if you put the game in the debug mode you can use the front flip kick just like in JK2. So, this isn't really anything specail that was added through the xmod.

Darth Kaan
12-04-2003, 12:46 AM
Originally posted by MasterSidious
RIGHT HERE! HERE IT IS! This shows perfectly well how it is on an fk server. The ONLY thing they do is kick, kick, and dfa (along with a FEW OCASSIONAL things of course too). Without kick, its a balanced game, and the fk can't handle balanced. But now I have a new comp. :D and I can kick (could not kick before with 3 fps), so watch out you mother ****ing kick whores! :D

You almost made a post that actually had a point without using profanity....

FK | unnamed
12-04-2003, 12:57 AM
A few things...

1-New version of the mod is out; side kicks are now back in.

Talk about some damn good mod support huh?

;)


2-No counter for Kicks? Wrong. How do you counter heavy swings? You anticipate and move out of the damn way. Try putting some thought into your game before you start whining people.


3-Kurgan, about FK and =X= and the competitive community.
In the competitive CTF community you had (in Outcast) two sides, those who played base JK2 like FK and had no problems or issues with the pull+ throw combo, and then you had =X= and those who viewed the combo as an exploit. And yes in the past, FK and =X= were not always on what one would call the best of terms.

Now *personally I don't how anyone can argue the combo is an exploit because it functions on the same principal as pull+kicking:

You use the push/pull power to quickly stun an opponent by throwing them into the "block animation" then proceed with a follow up attack (like a kick or saber throw).

Now some will try and argue that pull+ kicking is different because you are drawing the opponent towards you and not stunning him, but the last time I checked, absorb users don't slide, level 3 push/pull users don't slide... they go into the stun animation.

And those who would argue that the longer range makes it an exploit, all I have to say is, if you can't anticipate and side roll a pull+throw from outside of say, 6-8 "feet" away... you have a lot of "training to do".

The reason I see =X= not liking pull+throws is obvious:

It's the one major weakness the Absorb power has.

An Absorb user can be pull+throwed to death in just a matter of seconds because he will constantly go into the "block animation" due to the way the power functions.

Now you look at the most common power used by flag carriers in CTF... yep absorb.

See the connection now?


But regardless, those are my *personal opinions.

The fact still remains that I have a tremendous amount of respect for Hex and the mod he's bringing us.

And the main reason for that is not just the game play changes, it's because he's not *forcing changes upon people.

Don't think pull+throws are an exploit?

You have the option to leave it on or off.

It's all up to you.

Same goes for kicks or whatever other changes he makes, he lets the user (server admin) decide for him/her self.


/edit

4-MasterSidious, please take your medication before getting on the computer.

;)

g//plaZma
12-04-2003, 01:16 AM
What the hell is up with MasterSidious? Most of his posts contain profanity in like every sentence. Are you 12 or something? Using profanity in all your posts does not make you look cool. It just makes you look preteen and immature. It is possible to convey your messages (whether they have a point or not) to people without using "f*ck," "sh*t", "a$$," "b*tch," etc. and they will understand you.

Anyway, William and the rest of you, besides kaia, since he posted his personal preference instead of saying that this mod shouldn't include kick...

This is a mod and no one is forcing you to play. This mod will just un-nerf (or simply change) things that the competitive community feels fit to change. Otherwise, there won't be any competition in JA ff s/o-wise and the competitive guys would just go play other games. We like this game but just feel some things need improvements. It would be a total waste if we didn't do anything about it.

So please... leave this thread if you don't have anything to contribute. Saying stuff like "I don't like kick, it should be removed from this mod cuz ppl spam it & then I die. /amcry." That's not much appreciated since the whole point of this mod was to un-nerf the game for the competitive ff s/o players and players who just liked kick, not to please everyone.

Rad Blackrose
12-04-2003, 01:37 AM
This is a mod and no one is forcing you to play. This mod will just un-nerf (or simply change) things that the competitive community feels fit to change. Otherwise, there won't be any competition in JA ff s/o-wise and the competitive guys would just go play other games. We like this game but just feel some things need improvements. It would be a total waste if we didn't do anything about it.

Better yet, someone write this on multiple pieces of paper and pass me the nailgun. I think it's time to staple this message to some foreheads.

FK | unnamed
12-04-2003, 01:39 AM
rofl, rad should be a mod here.



:eek:

Rumor
12-04-2003, 01:41 AM
lol owned.

Rumor
12-04-2003, 10:49 PM
Originally posted by FK | unnamed
rofl, rad should be a mod here.



:eek:

yeah.

SpecialForces
12-04-2003, 11:51 PM
lol, fk's couldnt play JA without kick...
fk's back to kick whoring again :)

FK | unnamed
12-05-2003, 12:12 AM
Are you mentally retarded or just very young?

Not a flame, it was a serious question.

fk | screed
12-05-2003, 12:15 AM
Originally posted by SpecialForces
lol, fk's couldnt play JA without kick...
fk's back to kick whoring again :)

Its not that we couldnt play, its that it was a total BORE when we did play it. You go onto your server list and look for a Full Force Saber Only Duel server, yep thats right NONE. Now that we have this mod out, I for one have ordered a server and it will be Full Force, Saber Only, Duel. Hope to see you huys there.

SpecialForces
12-05-2003, 12:17 AM
niether

and why was that statement retarded?

You kick whored all the time in jk2
I know you did because when your server had people playing on it I played with you all the time Fallen.

FK | unnamed
12-05-2003, 12:25 AM
I'm not Fallen, F.Y.I.

And we didn't "whore" kicks, we used them.

It was just a tool that got the job done.

No different than a saber user sticking with certain moves or a certain stance that produced results for him.

fk | screed
12-05-2003, 12:30 AM
Originally posted by SpecialForces
niether

and why was that statement retarded?

You kick whored all the time in jk2
I know you did because when your server had people playing on it I played with you all the time Fallen.

go find another thread to troll on.

g//plaZma
12-05-2003, 12:43 AM
Originally posted by SpecialForces
niether

Probably telling the truth but just ignorant or uninformed.

and why was that statement retarded?

Because in JK2 duel/CTF mode, the sabers were crap and kicks and force-based combos (ptk, pk, pt, gk and all variations and personalized combos including kick in them) were the only way to go if you wanted to win and be effective. Competitive players tend to always go for the strategies that help them win. (And I don't see any mostly saber users winning anything against a player like that)

You kick whored all the time in jk2
I know you did because when your server had people playing on it I played with you all the time Fallen.

So if someone uses kick-based and force-based combos mainly they are called "kick whores" but if someone uses saber swings mainly, they're not called "saber whores?" I don't understand your logic. Contrary to popular belief, kicks have as much (or even more) possibilities than sabers, with more effectiveness, complexity, the need to be precise, creative, have fast coordination and reflexes. With sabers you couldn't really chain combos together, but with kicks combined with force, you could.

BTW, I don't see Fallen here. Just uj and screed.

razorace
12-05-2003, 02:24 AM
Originally posted by FK | unnamed
I'm not Fallen, F.Y.I.

And we didn't "whore" kicks, we used them.

It was just a tool that got the job done.

No different than a saber user sticking with certain moves or a certain stance that produced results for him.

Yeah, ok Kick Whore.

g//plaZma
12-05-2003, 02:32 AM
Originally posted by razorace
Yeah, ok Kick Whore.

What's the point of this post (aside from trolling and providing easy flamebait)?

Leave please.

razorace
12-05-2003, 02:53 AM
The point is that FK | unnamed is trying to defend kick whoring by calling it a "tool".

There's a big difference between occasionally using a move and whoring it by using it nearly exclusively.

If you do more than, say, half your damage by kicking, you're a kick whore.

fk | screed
12-05-2003, 02:58 AM
Originally posted by razorace
The point is that FK | unnamed is trying to defend kick whoring by calling it a "tool".

There's a big difference between occasionally using a move and whoring it by using it nearly exclusively.

If you do more than, say, half your damage by kicking, you're a kick whore.

We could also argue that if you do more than half damage with a saber than your a saber whore ;) .

Theres always another side to the fence, you've stated your opinion and we've stated ours, now shut up or your trolling and need to be /amslapped :D

Master William
12-05-2003, 02:58 AM
You're right, plazma, thank god I don't play x-mod regular. As said before by somebody else, I prefer to keep my kung-fu and saber duels separated. No offense, it is just my opinion. Therefore this is my last post in this thread. Enjoy your x-mod ;) (Not being sarcastic)

And do tell the people who whine ''butterfly spammer'' or ''kata spammer'' the same thing - it is a tool used in the game. Even if it can get annoying many times, it is just a part of the game/mod.

Ah, come to think about the AWP-whiners in CS... ''omg awp whore''

g//plaZma
12-05-2003, 03:04 AM
Originally posted by razorace
The point is that FK | unnamed is trying to defend kick whoring by calling it a "tool".

There's a big difference between occasionally using a move and whoring it by using it nearly exclusively.

If you do more than, say, half your damage by kicking, you're a kick whore.

Yeah, ok Saber Whore.

/AMSLAP

gg

Rumor
12-05-2003, 03:14 AM
Originally posted by Master William
You're right, plazma, thank god I don't play x-mod regular. As said before by somebody else, I prefer to keep my kung-fu and saber duels separated. No offense, it is just my opinion. Therefore this is my last post in this thread. Enjoy your x-mod ;) (Not being sarcastic)

And do tell the people who whine ''butterfly spammer'' or ''kata spammer'' the same thing - it is a tool used in the game. Even if it can get annoying many times, it is just a part of the game/mod.

Ah, come to think about the AWP-whiners in CS... ''omg awp whore''

haha.

in cs i'm called that faggot who warps in and shoots you and is gone by the time the bullet hits. aka The Faggot Experience (inside LAN joke w/ my best friend, you're on the outside so don't try flaming)

SpecialForces
12-05-2003, 03:17 AM
Originally posted by g//plaZma
Probably telling the truth but just ignorant or uninformed.



Because in JK2 duel/CTF mode, the sabers were crap and kicks and force-based combos (ptk, pk, pt, gk and all variations and personalized combos including kick in them) were the only way to go if you wanted to win and be effective. Competitive players tend to always go for the strategies that help them win. (And I don't see any mostly saber users winning anything against a player like that)



So if someone uses kick-based and force-based combos mainly they are called "kick whores" but if someone uses saber swings mainly, they're not called "saber whores?" I don't understand your logic. Contrary to popular belief, kicks have as much (or even more) possibilities than sabers, with more effectiveness, complexity, the need to be precise, creative, have fast coordination and reflexes. With sabers you couldn't really chain combos together, but with kicks combined with force, you could.

BTW, I don't see Fallen here. Just uj and screed.

um:confused:

im 15 years old, I have a 4.0 in school, and I have 3 best friends and 9 friends all together.
please dont flame.

Kicking is fine.
Pullkicking/kicking without useing the saber most of the time is not.
That might be why they took kick out of JA.
the saber is why we play jk2/JA the constant kicking is not.
the saber is a weapon ment to be used, but kick is not.
Do you see kick being used allot in the movies, NO. They just added kick to protect yourself and use to do damage every now and then.
It takes skill to kill people with the saber and im sorry you dont have that (noob?) but thats still no excuse to be a kick whore.
I respect the FK as well as allot of other players. But its anoying when JA fixes the kick whoreing, this mod brings it back.
And yes I know, im not forced to play it.

ok now ill stfu :)

fk | screed
12-05-2003, 03:30 AM
Originally posted by SpecialForces
um:confused:

im 15 years old, I have a 4.0 in school, and I have 3 best friends and 9 friends all together.
please dont flame.

Kicking is fine.
Pullkicking/kicking without useing the saber most of the time is not.
That might be why they took kick out of JA.
the saber is why we play jk2/JA the constant kicking is not.
the saber is a weapon ment to be used, but kick is not.
Do you see kick being used allot in the movies, NO. They just added kick to protect yourself and use to do damage every now and then.
It takes skill to kill people with the saber and im sorry you dont have that (noob?) but thats still no excuse to be a kick whore.
I respect the FK as well as allot of other players. But its anoying when JA fixes the kick whoreing, this mod brings it back.
And yes I know, im not forced to play it.

ok now ill stfu :)


9!?!?!? Holy cow! Mr. Popular here! I bet all the girls in 7th grade want you, and all the little boys want to be like you.

Hell! I wanna be you!

edit: God im such an @sshole :D

g//plaZma
12-05-2003, 04:34 AM
Originally posted by SpecialForces
im 15 years old, I have a 4.0 in school, and I have 3 best friends and 9 friends all together.
please dont flame.

I have no interest in your personal life.

Kicking is fine.

Yup.

Pullkicking/kicking without useing the saber most of the time is not.

Because it doesn't suit your gamestyle, it's not ok for you so i guess it shouldn't be ok for everyone else, right? WRONG. We (competitive players) took advantage of the fact that kick was very powerful and indeed can beat anyone who doesn't take advantage of the chainable kicks.

That might be why they took kick out of JA.

Maybe. Or maybe because it was of whiners like you.

the saber is why we play jk2/JA the constant kicking is not.

The saber is why you and some other people play jk2/ja.

the saber is a weapon ment to be used, but kick is not.

But kick was used and we see it as a useful thing. Do you think they purposely included the ability to rocket jump in quake3? No, but it was possible.

Do you see kick being used allot in the movies, NO. They just added kick to protect yourself and use to do damage every now and then.

Maybe, but this isn't a movie. It's a game and it's entirely up to the gamer what he/she chooses to use.

It takes skill to kill people with the saber and im sorry you dont have that (noob?) but thats still no excuse to be a kick whore.

Wow. Bold statement. How about a 1v1 FF duel in JK2? It may take "skill" to kill a guy from the competitive ff duel community with a saber but that really will never happen because force-based combos rape sabers in many ways.

I respect the FK as well as allot of other players. But its anoying when JA fixes the kick whoreing, this mod brings it back.

I don't think you're clear about why this mod brings it back. It's because it was an essential tool in JK2 ff s/o CTF and literally matches between ex-jk2 ctf players end up in a complete stalemate without kick. Plus, FF Dueling with kick and force based combos was awsome. If you want more info about why kick was needed, do a search on these forums.

And yes I know, im not forced to play it.

Glad we got that clear.

ok now ill stfu :)

That'd be a good idea because you obviously don't know jack about JK2 gameplay dynamics.

lol@screed

Master William
12-05-2003, 04:35 AM
Originally posted by Rumor
haha.

in cs i'm called that faggot who warps in and shoots you and is gone by the time the bullet hits. aka The Faggot Experience (inside LAN joke w/ my best friend, you're on the outside so don't try flaming)

Unlike certain people, I'm not an opportunity flamer... I can also agree that the kicks are annoying as people use them agressively and alot, just ruins the feeling and annoys me IMO. Ok, now this is my LAST post in this thread. I hope.

and plazma, that ''not seen in the movies'' is just what honor-haters say as well. ''Did you see bowing in the movies? did you see them saying good fight?''. Well, did you see them spam matrix kicks in duels? now IMO a game shouldn't be based on a movie too much, because details like that can be left out or put in. It's all about sacrificing realism of a movie/book/whatever for gameplay, I believe...

Rumor
12-05-2003, 07:12 AM
Originally posted by SpecialForces
um:confused:

im 15 years old, I have a 4.0 in school, and I have 3 best friends and 9 friends all together.
please dont flame.

Kicking is fine.
Pullkicking/kicking without useing the saber most of the time is not.
That might be why they took kick out of JA.
the saber is why we play jk2/JA the constant kicking is not.
the saber is a weapon ment to be used, but kick is not.
Do you see kick being used allot in the movies, NO. They just added kick to protect yourself and use to do damage every now and then.
It takes skill to kill people with the saber and im sorry you dont have that (noob?) but thats still no excuse to be a kick whore.
I respect the FK as well as allot of other players. But its anoying when JA fixes the kick whoreing, this mod brings it back.
And yes I know, im not forced to play it.

ok now ill stfu :)

ok so you choose how everyone else plays? do what you said and stfu now please.

Rumor
12-05-2003, 07:16 AM
Originally posted by Master William
Unlike certain people, I'm not an opportunity flamer... I can also agree that the kicks are annoying as people use them agressively and alot, just ruins the feeling and annoys me IMO. Ok, now this is my LAST post in this thread. I hope.

and plazma, that ''not seen in the movies'' is just what honor-haters say as well. ''Did you see bowing in the movies? did you see them saying good fight?''. Well, did you see them spam matrix kicks in duels? now IMO a game shouldn't be based on a movie too much, because details like that can be left out or put in. It's all about sacrificing realism of a movie/book/whatever for gameplay, I believe...

no you just bait everyone to flame. keep your trap shut and try just reading if you don't have constructive input. we can go around and aorund about how kick is "bad" or "lame" or whatever. its all about weather or not you are willing to adapt to something that is beating you, or even adapting to USING it.

as for the second thing you are taking that way out of context.

personal foul, 15 yard penalty, loss of down and possession.

the thing that honor people are all about is "being honourable jedai from teh movaiz" so we use the fact that they never bowed and how it was always a fight to the death with sabers in the movies against those who bow and do teh sabar down = peas.

FK | unnamed
12-05-2003, 08:32 AM
Originally posted by razorace
The point is that FK | unnamed is trying to defend kick whoring by calling it a "tool".

There's a big difference between occasionally using a move and whoring it by using it nearly exclusively.

If you do more than, say, half your damage by kicking, you're a kick whore.

I really hope this is sarcasm, because this is pure frustrated newbie dribble 101 I'm hearing once again.


So if in a full weapon FFA I don't ever whip out a melee weapon and I just blast people, that's a bad thing?

:rolleyes:

psst... when some people play video games they try to get "the high score".

past it on.

Rumor
12-05-2003, 03:47 PM
you know what happens when people start trying to make a game that is meant to be a go in blow **** up and do it again into something with morality? people ruin the game for others.

Amidala from Chop Shop
12-05-2003, 06:37 PM
I gave Master Hex my wish list of admin functions, and he was very responsive, as some of you have said. Admin functions will be greatly expanded in version 2.1, which he will release in the next few days. Details here:
http://x.fragism.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=2540&highlight=#2540

It also has a bugfix that prevented use of "sets" information cvars http://x.fragism.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=429&highlight=

lllKyNeSlll
12-06-2003, 11:48 PM
What most of you guys don't realize is that without kick, there is no way of killing anyone good ever especially in ctf or 1v1. PEople say FK can't play without kick. Thats a wrong statement, they can play and they would still beat most other players in 1v1 ff duel or ctf ff, it just would be pointless. The reason why its pointless is simply because each duel would last forever and in ctf one would not return the flag easily and technically a good player can avoid death for the whole 20 minutes in ctf and probably avoid death for an hour in 1v1 duel without kick. However, most of you who antipathized versus users of jk2 kick, lacked knowledge of the fundamentals of drain and how it works (you probably only know that its cheap and you can't escape it). FK could still dominate most players simply by draining after every special saber attack they use until their opponent has 0 force. Most other players would try to drain completely which would make their force pool go down faster than their opponents (if they have high FPS).

Some of you guys complain that their is a lack of counter vs kick. There are many counters vs kick, but you could only know them well if you played jk2 ff s/o alot. You could simply run backwards and kick back (when the approacher misses or comes too close) or you can drain back every bit of health you lost.

The only gametype that would make any sense without kick is ffa. Even then its still a game style taking much skill. I can almost always take lead by running around with double sabers and lv3 rage and backstabing everyone. Thats using about 7 keys alone, (4 for movement, one for primary fire, one for jump, and one for rage), thats 3 keys besides movement keys. While in a true 100% effort ff fight with kick one would need something more like 14 keys to win, near twice as much as without kick. One would use 4 for movement, 1 for jump, 1 for pull, 1 for push, 1 for duck, 1 for alt attack, 1 for attack, 1 for grip (optional), 1 for drain, 1 for lightning, and 1 for saber stance change. 14 keys VS 7 keys, which one takes more coordination and skill?

Lathain Valtiel
12-07-2003, 01:16 AM
...You immediately assume we're all using keyboards.

lllKyNeSlll
12-07-2003, 01:23 AM
Did I say you are using keyboards? I only said keys not keyboards. If you are talking about mouse than I misstated and I include mouse into my description, but if you are talking about a gamepad or anything, the user of the gamepad is limiting themselves to even less buttons and slower turn speeds. But no I did not mean to limit my thesis to keyboards alone, I meant keys as any sort of button or output.

Lathain Valtiel
12-07-2003, 02:21 AM
Meh, yawspeed as it is is absurdly abusable anyway, I'm happy i can't use it to dswing red stance hits 360 degrees. Hah... I prefer a gamepad, yes.

SpecialForces
12-07-2003, 02:57 AM
Originally posted by FK | unnamed
I really hope this is sarcasm, because this is pure frustrated newbie dribble 101 I'm hearing once again.


So if in a full weapon FFA I don't ever whip out a melee weapon and I just blast people, that's a bad thing?

:rolleyes:

psst... when some people play video games they try to get "the high score".

past it on.
OMFG, thats not what we are talking about!!!
If you abuse kicking like allot of people did in jk2 its KICK WHOREING!!!!!!!!
Kicking every now and then is FINE but if you think the saber is useless like some pathetic noobs out there that cant use it, you put the saber away and kick everyone all the time!
at least disable pull kicking...
And kicking takes NO SKILL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
The ONLY reason why most people dont kick is because unlike the saber, if you have low fps you cant kick for ****!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
ITS RETARDED!!!!!!!!!
HE IS no noob its you that is the noob.
I played lots of fk, they coudnt kill me at all if they didnt use kick, or when I got them to low health they would start kicking me again and say "OH SORRY I FORGOT!!!!!!" and **** like that.
Kick is rediculous. YES it should be used but NO if it gets whored and unfortunently thats all everyone does!!!!!
**** this IM GOOD I KNOW HOW TO KILL PEOPLE HAHAHA I KICKED YOU TO DEATH HAHAHA YOU SUCK HAHAHA crap!!!
If you use kick all the time, you have no skill, no pride, no honor, no SKILL. And you are a tottal crapy noob.
Didnt want to flame but sometimes you have to to get the point across. ;)

Sam
12-07-2003, 03:36 AM
Originally posted by SpecialForces
OMFG, thats not what we are talking about!!!
If you abuse kicking like allot of people did in jk2 its KICK WHOREING!!!!!!!!
Kicking every now and then is FINE but if you think the saber is useless like some pathetic noobs out there that cant use it, you put the saber away and kick everyone all the time!
at least disable pull kicking...
And kicking takes NO SKILL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
The ONLY reason why most people dont kick is because unlike the saber, if you have low fps you cant kick for ****!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
ITS RETARDED!!!!!!!!!
HE IS no noob its you that is the noob.
I played lots of fk, they coudnt kill me at all if they didnt use kick, or when I got them to low health they would start kicking me again and say "OH SORRY I FORGOT!!!!!!" and **** like that.
Kick is rediculous. YES it should be used but NO if it gets whored and unfortunently thats all everyone does!!!!!
**** this IM GOOD I KNOW HOW TO KILL PEOPLE HAHAHA I KICKED YOU TO DEATH HAHAHA YOU SUCK HAHAHA crap!!!
If you use kick all the time, you have no skill, no pride, no honor, no SKILL. And you are a tottal crapy noob.
Didnt want to flame but sometimes you have to to get the point across. ;)




I think this post is gonna get the crap beat out of it.