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MasterN64
12-01-2003, 10:48 PM
I think that after SWGB II there should be a SWGB III with the Expanded Universe Star Wars Characters and civs from the books. You know civs like the Yuuzghan Vong and Characters like Jacen Solo. You will have campaigns based on some of the books and adventures of some of the characters and civilizations. Mara Jade would have a purple lightsaber (as seen in MOTS) and her name would change to Mara Jade Skywalker. Kyle Katarn would be in this game(I would LOVE that.) You know thinhs like that. And anything else such as weapons, places, etc. I's be the first buyer!

Frozted_MM's
12-01-2003, 11:42 PM
I'm not buying a game based on expanded universe.

Darth Windu
12-02-2003, 01:45 AM
First of all, we need to have SWGB2 produced before there is a third.
Also, you say you would be the first buyer, and you probably be one of the ONLY buyer's, because most people dont know, or dont care, about EU, myself included.

Admiral Vostok
12-02-2003, 04:30 AM
What a shame the first three replyees in this thread are Purists.

One thing you must understand, young mastern, is that Star Wars fans are divided into two categories. Those who love EU and accept it as part of the greater Star Wars mythology, and those who hate EU and reject any notion it could exist in the same universe as the movies. Among the more die-hard fans, the split is pretty much fifty/fifty, but if you look at all the Star Wars fan base there are more people who dislike or are oblivious of EU than otherwise. So whenever you include a large amount of EU in a game, you may appear very attractive to less than half of the Star Wars community but totally repellent or at least unfamiliar to the majority.

Both categories, the EU Fans and the Purists, do have something in common: they both love the movies. While some EU Fans like the EU more than the movies, a love of the movies is still in existence. Therefore, the best way to maximise sales to the Star Wars fan base is to center on the movies, not the EU. EU can play a minor role, but if the game focuses on it you are in for trouble.

The Lord of the Purists has spoken.

DK_Viceroy
12-02-2003, 12:45 PM
SOmone else who sees sense thank you for coming to this forum Mastern we now have another person who isn't tighter than a baboons butt.

Personally though i think it should have some EU in since practically every game that is star wars has a large part of what the un-enlightend call EU but sensible people know as part of the greater truth since to say EU is evil is wrong since you need it to fill in the gaps because i think nobody on this froum is that stupid to think it is realistic to for the rebels to be yavin than to be magically teleported to hoth and then next movie to have suddenly built up this impresive starfleet. Little Details like those in EU bind the star wars universe together to deny EU is to be a fool since it is plain stupid to think the only planets in the star wars universe are Kamino Geonsis Tatooine Dantooine Courscant Endor and it's Moons Yavin and it's Moons Alderaan Bespin Dagobah and Hoth since most galaxy's have more than 11 planets.

Shame on you all you complain about not enough people coming to this forum and yet you chase people off by ghoing off the deep end with them

Enough of this hipocrasy

MasterN64
12-02-2003, 06:16 PM
!!! I cant beleive what i am reading. I didn't realize so many people didn't like the EU books and games. Those books and games are still part of Star Wars!!! I mean sure there isnt a movie about the EU, but still that shouldn't matter!!! (Apparently there isn't gonna be a SWGB III with so many people sayin they wouldn't like it, but its still a slight possibility)

lukeiamyourdad
12-02-2003, 07:23 PM
Now come to think of it, an EU game doesn't seem so bad anymore from a marketing perspective. Look at KOTOR. Huge success, 100% EU. Although KOTOR ain't based around the NJO(which sucks).
If they want an EU SW RTS, they'll have to make up a lot of stuff or the game must be amazing(like KOTOR) to compensate for the Yuuzhan Vong, New Republic, etc. crap.

Sithmaster_821
12-03-2003, 12:46 AM
Ok, Vostok, there is also a lunatic fringe in your SW universe. They dont know/care about any thing beyond the movies, and thus are against EU, but are not purists. This would comprimise the most general buyer of the games, and the person that the marketer should pander to. I am one of them.

Admiral Vostok
12-03-2003, 02:12 AM
Sith - yes I acknowledge those people - the majority of Star Wars fans in my opinion. I called them "oblivious" though maybe this word carries too many negative connotations.

Luke's Dad - I did have KOTOR in mind when writing what I wrote. The thing about KOTOR is it still strongly resembles the movies, even if it is set thousands of years before the movies. You have Jedi (which everyone knows), Sith (which everyone knows) and the Republic (which everyone knows). To introduce things like the Vong (which few people know), the Chiss (which few people know) and Mara Jade (who few people know) is what I object to.

Viceroy - I have nothing against the EU that fills in the gaps, but when it clashes with the movies I hate it. And it does the latter far too often for my liking. You have to understand my classifications of EU to appreciate my viewpoint: Extrapolations are okay, but stuff that relates in no way to the movies can't really be Star Wars, can it?

Frozted_MM's
12-03-2003, 10:00 AM
I like EU and think it is interesting but I'm not interested at all at it getting turned into an RTS when an RTS based from the movies could be made.

JediStickmanBob
12-17-2003, 12:21 PM
I'm new here, but im leaning towards mastern's idea. (is there any chance that we could put green wing ((from Return of jedi)) in it?((i really like A-wings...:deathii:)))

MasterN64
12-17-2003, 01:59 PM
Well from what i can tell people have some strong feelings for EU or anti-EU. There are still EU people out there (such as myself) that would like to see more games based on the EU. I like both movie based games and EU based games equally.
I know Mr. Lord of purists here hates EU but thats fine, he can miss out on a game he says he wouldn't like. But for the rest of us i think that a year or two after SWGB II there should be a SWGB III based on EU. Sure some people wouldn't buy it, but some would. Heck, maybe Lucasarts doesn't like the idea of a SWGB III and most of em are all purists! :( . Hope not. Maybe they love the idea and is gonna start making it after a while. (of course they would have to concern on how many people would actually buy the game, maybe they would put up a poll)
So, any1 else got anymore ideas? (if ur a purist plz hesitate to post!:p)

Darth Windu
12-18-2003, 02:10 AM
Mastern, you're completely missing the point. First of all, KOTOR is NOT 100% EU like luke says.
Anyway, ask yourself a question now. If you want to sell the most number of copies of a game as you can to the general public, will you base it on the films, which almost everyone is familiar with, or on EU, which the majority are not familiar with?

Do you seriously believe that the genral public would prefer to fight EU battles rather than the opening of the clone wars, or the battle on Endor? I think not.

Frozted_MM's
12-18-2003, 09:47 AM
Well personally if you can't except EU you can't except Star Wars cause once the movies stop thats the end of the purists there whole storyline is stuck in those walls and will never expand.

MasterN64
12-18-2003, 12:01 PM
Originally posted by Frozted_MM's
Well personally if you can't except EU you can't except Star Wars cause once the movies stop thats the end of the purists there whole storyline is stuck in those walls and will never expand.

Frozted_MM's has a good point. Once the movies are done EU will be the only thing in Star Wars that is expanding. Eventually either purists will die, or Star Wars will die.
Im sure there will be a few more games based on the movies but eventually EU will be the only thing left of Star Wars that is still going. Or dieing. You purists must understand that once the movies are done there will only be the EU, and if no one likes it, Star Wars will die!!!!!! (So what i am expecting now is some purist to reply to this post saying something that Star Wars won't die because blah blah blah.)
And to awnser ur question ur question Darth if u dont wont Star Wars to die then become familiar with EU!!!!

Darth Windu
12-18-2003, 01:20 PM
Frozted - no offense, but learn to spell. The word you were looking for was accept , not except .

Mastern - Star Wars wont die because the movies have replay value, and becuase new generations will be exposed to it. EU is mearly a tag-along for the films.
I AM aware of Star Wars EU, some of it is good, some of it is shockingly bad.

The problem with EU is that some of it contradicts the films, with the result that the EU material becomes far less interesting and desirable. Furthermore, these inconsistances will push film-fans away from EU related products. Some of the inconsistances are-

Film: Boba Fett dies in Sarlacc Pit (GL said so)
EU: Boba Fett survived

Film: Geonosians designed Death Star
EU: some Imperial scientist in 'the maw' designed the Death Star

Film: Jedi do not get married
EU: some Jedi chick whinging that Mace Windu needs to get married coz everyone's doing it

Film: Jedi have Blue or Green Lightsabre (with one exception), Sith have Red
EU: anyone can have any colour (eg Leia with a Red Lightsabre in the Corellian trilogy!)

need i go on?

MasterN64
12-18-2003, 02:49 PM
OK, darth u have a point. There are a few things in the EU that do interfere with the movies, but not all don't have explinations. But u r wrong on a few things.

Boba Fett didn't actually die in the Sarlacc. Yes we dont know how but he has been used in many EU games and books.

The Death Star designers are a puzzle. So yes i do agree that this is a interference with the movies.

Yes, even master luke got married. The Old code does say for jedi not to get married. Anakin even said that love was forbidden. But times change and was seen that jedi can have feelings for others, but it was recognized that love can be dangerous at times, it can destroy a jedi, but jedi can get married now, but its not common, from what i have read.

Jedi can have any colored lightsaber they want, to suit there personality or favorite color. Where in the world did u get that rumor? There are a few jedi who have red sabers and there are a few dark jedi who have yelo(yun), white(Sariss), etc. However it is traditional for sith to have red sabers, but it does not apply to dark jedi.

And plz do go on darth. Any more questions for me to awnser?

lukeiamyourdad
12-18-2003, 06:24 PM
Yes Darth, KOTOR is almost totally EU. Most thing contained in it we're based off the movies but nevertheless that'S considered EU.

This isn't really about contradictions anymore, a game almost always contradict the movies. It's basically inevitable.

If someone wants to make an EU based game, they can hope for it(here I'm talking about a game based around the Yuuzhan Vong on other crap).

It'll probably never happen but let's leave them alone with it.

Admiral Vostok
12-18-2003, 11:39 PM
Mastern: While you did request that Purists refrain from posting I feel I need to respond to your attacks on the Purist community.

You think Star Wars will die without EU? This I feel is a major difference between Purists and EUFs (Expanded Universe Fans - phrase coined by Vostok). EUFs don't see the movies as being strong enough for some reason, whereas Purists believe the Star Wars movies are timeless. Did Shakespear's Romeo and Juliet need accompanying literature to survive hundreds of years? What about the centuries that Homer's Odyssey or Sophocles' Oedipus Rex have endured? Why don't people need to know what happened to Oliver Twist or Huckleberry Finn when they grew up?

Star Wars doesn't need anything extra. It is a modern classic, powerful enough to stand the test of time - to be honest I question the fandom of the people who think the movies aren't good enough to survive on their own.

As for the EU contradictions:

George Lucas has explicitely stated he considers Boba Fett to have died in the Sarlaac. Allowing him to survive is in direct opposition to Lucas' vision, so how can it be Star Wars?

According to EU, Luke went out of his way to replicate the Jedi Order of old, traversing the galaxy in search of holocrons. The fact Jedi can love and get married, as well as begin their training in their mid twenties, directly contradicts the movies - I'm sure in his search Luke would have managed to find the Jedi Code, which according to the movies directly forbids both love/romantic attachment and over-age training.

With regards to lightsaber colours, the accompanying material on the Episode II DVD sees an exchange between Samuel L. Jackson and George Lucas. Sam asks "what colour can I have?" and George says "good guys are green and blue, bad guys are red". Sam says "no one has purple?" and George says "you could". To me this says Mace Windu's lightsabre is unique amongst lightsabres. All others are green and blue (for Jedi) and red (for Sith). In fact recently developed EU supports this, which makes a case of new EU contradicting old EU.

Darth Windu
12-19-2003, 03:35 AM
Mastern - well, Vostok said exactly what i was going to.

MasterN64
12-19-2003, 12:52 PM
First of i want so say that i am not a total EUF. The movies are just as good as EU.

Second of all i am afraid i have to agree with Vostok that George Lucas did say that boba fett did die in the Sarlacc. I am proven wrong.

I am still not sure about the lightsaber colors. I think George just wanted to keep it simple with the lightsabers so its easier to keep it organized. Technically Jedi are allowed any color they want. (Note: I did not get this info from EU based sources)

I do agree that Luke did go look for holocrons looking for information on the Jedi Order. However the love rule wasn't created until EPII, and mara jade had married luke already be4 EPII came out. So technically it was the movie interfering with the EU.

1 more thing. Vostok i do hope that Star Wars wouldn't need EU to survive.

Just to clear some things up.
1. I am NOT a EUF or purist, i like both equally.
2. I only like EU because i want to know what happened after the movies. If i was a purist i would only focus on the movies, which would get old after time.
3. If u r a purist please feel free to post. I take back my want for no more purists posting. Plz post ur ideas.

Admiral Vostok
12-19-2003, 11:37 PM
There you go thinking the movies will get old and tired. That's fine if that's what you believe, in that case you should indulge in EU which will hopefully keep the movies interesting for you. As for me, I love the movies so much I'll never get tired of them, so for me EU is a corrupting influence that taints the perfection of the movies.

You are technically right that Episode II is the movies interfering with EU, but this really emphasises my point: George Lucas doesn't consider the EU worthy of the Universe he created, so he contradicts it to set the story right.

You say you got lightsaber colours from a source other than EU. What is that exactly, considering it isn't in the movies?

JediStickmanBob
12-21-2003, 12:27 AM
1st: BF did not die is sarlacc, he's too important.
2nd: Yes, in movie episode II the geonosians did have plans for the Death Star, but maybe (I looked this up and it is his real name) Bevel Lemilisk (I misselled his name and misspelled ((probably)) ), well, you know Imps... They always think they're entitled to something so *Bevel's thoughts* FINDER' KEEPERS, LOSER'S WEEPERS HAHAHAHAHA! MINE ALL MINE HAHAHAHAHAHA!
3rd: Leia got married and had kids, Luke married Mara Jade and they were both Jedi.


(see? I do make sense sometimes)

JediStickmanBob
12-21-2003, 12:30 AM
Oh and how do you think Jedi reproduce? They just magically appear? (sorry...frustrated...no offense)

lukeiamyourdad
12-21-2003, 02:31 AM
1. Boba Fett died. period. Jango died. period. Vader died.period. Palpatine died.period.

2. We'll get our answers in ep3 hopefully about the Death Star.

3. Even in EU, Leia was never truly a Jedi. As for Luke and Mara, although I like the Mara Jade character, I'm gonna have to say that this is totally untrue. If you go by the movies, we actually don,t have any idea of Luke having any offsprings with anyone. It's something that George Lucas did not create therefore cannot be considered a quite reliable argument/source.

4. Yes Anakin Skywalker did not magically appear. "There was no father". Huh...

And besides, this is a bad argument. Nothing proves that two Jedi having a baby will make that baby force sensitive. If your parents are good looking, you might not be. If you're very good looking, your parents can be ugly. That doesn't prove anything. Shmi Skywalker for example doesn't seem to be force sensitive at all. Think about Luke and Leia too. They were both weaker then Vader. Going through this kind of logic, the force power of Padmé(although small) should add up to the one of Anakin right? Well it isn't obviously the case.

Darth Windu
12-21-2003, 06:24 AM
Bob -
1. Boba Fett died, George Lucas, the master of everything Star Wars, said so.
2. "I'll take the plans to my Master on Coruscant where they will be safe" - yeah, that really sounds like Sidious/Palpatine didnt know a thing...
3. That's all according to EU. As for where Jedi come from, as luke said, not everyone is force-sensative, its pretty much random. In fact, it is obvious that Jedi do NOT get married or get some lovin, becuase those sort of attachements can lead to the Jedi going to the dark side like Anakin.

Admiral Vostok
12-24-2003, 01:39 AM
Here's another interesting tid bit for EUFs: recently Peter Mayhew (who plays Chewbacca) was asked what he thought of Chewie's death in the NJO series. Mayhew dismissed it, saying that only George Lucas' work is the real Star Wars. As you can imagine finding this out delighted me.

MasterN64
12-24-2003, 06:59 PM
Originally posted by Admiral Vostok
Here's another interesting tid bit for EUFs: recently Peter Mayhew (who plays Chewbacca) was asked what he thought of Chewie's death in the NJO series. Mayhew dismissed it, saying that only George Lucas' work is the real Star Wars. As you can imagine finding this out delighted me.

Who wouldn't be angry that his/her character dies in a unofficial book about the movie? And, a lot of EUF's didn'y like the idea of Chewie dieing either. So that wasn't exactly i likeable part in Star Wars in general for all Star Wars fans. Even I don't like it, i hate it so much i want to burn the book.

Plz do continue Vostok.

MasterN64
12-24-2003, 07:04 PM
And another thing that i want to bring up in this Star Wars character death subject.

EU authors only write about SW characters dying(Chewie) or coming bac to life(Boba) because they think it will give the books high sellings. They don't care if it messes with the movies or makes SW fans angry. If they sell the books its all good for them. Half of them probably haven't seen the movies, just the characters in general. (I know this goes against EUF's, but hey, im not a EUF)

JediStickmanBob
12-24-2003, 10:18 PM
Windu: (Somehow) "Ani" was a special case.
Everybody else+Windu: good point.
Everybody: I am not sure if I am an EU fan or purist. I like them both (again, somehow) probably because *sigh* I am a critic. (bum bum bum!) :eek:
*NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!*

:nut:
:wstupid:

JediStickmanBob
12-24-2003, 10:24 PM
Isn't it weird how this idea of SWGB III spawned into talk of how Jedi turned to the Dark Side, who died and who didn't?:D :rolleyes: :p ;) :) :( :mad: :eek: :confused:

JediStickmanBob
12-24-2003, 10:35 PM
Oh, and can we Please talk about A-wings and how COOL they are since they are both in EU and purism we can both enjoy and appreciate them since they were an important part of the destruction of the Death Star and the annihilation of half the Imp's Starfleet? *gasp of air*:D

Darth Windu
12-25-2003, 10:00 AM
Bob - well, considering that no other Jedi in the films has a love interest, and Padme, a Senator and former Queen is under the impression that 'love was forbidden for a jedi', i think we can pretty much assume that jedi dont get married

As for A-wings, i disagree. I think the Jedi Starfighter is MUCH cooler than the A-wing.

lukeiamyourdad
12-26-2003, 10:56 PM
NO! The A-Wing is better!:D

Stop this EU vs. the Movies debate. I've just seen so many in my stay here...god...

IG-64
12-27-2003, 04:36 AM
I read most of the apprintace siries and loved it but I don't really have any transportation to get more. And when I do I always forget :o

anyways, on topic, I think we should wait for SWGB2 before we talk about this

Admiral Vostok
12-28-2003, 10:28 AM
My point about Chewie dying wasn't so much that his death was an outrage, but that Peter Mayhew, like me, considers EU to not really be Star Wars.

In fact character deaths aren't so bad, and are much more attractive that character resurrections. In the case of Chewie I wish it had happened sooner so he didn't have to be the Solo kids' nanny. One of the things that I used to hate about EU was that no-one ever died, it was like a bad sitcom where everything was back to normal at the end of the novel. There was one particular novel - either The Courtship of Princess Leia, which was the biggest load of rubbish I've ever read, or one of the Jedi Academy books, which many will know I have no love for - where Mon Mothma became very ill and was in danger of dying. I was reading the book thinking "finally some dramatic development" when at the end of the book Mon Mothma gets better. Not that I wish Mon Mothma dead, but it would have made a much better story if she had died.

Darth Windu
12-28-2003, 12:45 PM
Vostok - that was the Jedi Academy trilogy.

I'm actually enjoying EU, im up to the 7th book of the 'X-wing' series, and have 'I, Jedi' and 'The Courtship of Princess Leia' ready to go when i have the other two books of the series.

My view on EU is that it's just fun - dont take it too seriously and its ok. As you may or may not know, im a big Star Trek fan. With the current series, Enterprise, i think that as a 'Star Trek' series, it is repulsive, but as a sci-fi show it's pretty good - this is the same sort of attitude i take with Star Wars EU.

IG-64
12-28-2003, 08:17 PM
Originally posted by Darth Windu
Vostok - that was the Jedi Academy trilogy.

I'm actually enjoying EU, im up to the 7th book of the 'X-wing' series, and have 'I, Jedi' and 'The Courtship of Princess Leia' ready to go when i have the other two books of the series.

My view on EU is that it's just fun - dont take it too seriously and its ok. As you may or may not know, im a big Star Trek fan. With the current series, Enterprise, i think that as a 'Star Trek' series, it is repulsive, but as a sci-fi show it's pretty good - this is the same sort of attitude i take with Star Wars EU.

I watch star trek, I like the originals, next generation, and voyager, they have some really great episodes. But to me deep space nine and enterprise were losers, and now that I think about it, it I just think of them as sci-fi shows.... their still repulsive

Darth Windu
12-29-2003, 06:20 AM
Really? I loved DS9, it was tied with TNG as my favourite Star Trek show. Voyager and the Original series were alright, but Enterprise is shockingly bad.

I think the main reason that i liked DS9 was that it was a lot darker than any of the other series, dealing with conflict and death a lot more than the others did.

Speaking of, anyone here seen the 'Ki-Adi-Mundi droid control ship raid' deleted from Ep2 but viewable on Star Wars Hyperspace? I've heard that its pretty good, but havent been able to see it coz im not going to pay any money for what should be free to loyal Star Wars fans - which i consider to be an outrage but still...

IG-64
12-29-2003, 06:32 AM
Originally posted by Darth Windu
Really? I loved DS9, it was tied with TNG as my favourite Star Trek show. Voyager and the Original series were alright, but Enterprise is shockingly bad.

I think the main reason that i liked DS9 was that it was a lot darker than any of the other series, dealing with conflict and death a lot more than the others did.

Speaking of, anyone here seen the 'Ki-Adi-Mundi droid control ship raid' deleted from Ep2 but viewable on Star Wars Hyperspace? I've heard that its pretty good, but havent been able to see it coz im not going to pay any money for what should be free to loyal Star Wars fans - which i consider to be an outrage but still...

'cmon, it's just $20 for a whole year, it's worth it, believe me. I've forgot about the money by now

saberhagen
12-30-2003, 11:17 AM
And LF would probably say that if you're not prepared to pay then you're not a loyal Star Wars fan...

MasterN64
12-30-2003, 08:11 PM
Wow, this thread goes from SWGB III to EU then to Star Trek. What next?

lukeiamyourdad
12-31-2003, 01:02 AM
Battlestar Galactica :D

Darth Windu
12-31-2003, 04:43 AM
Well, personally i find it disgusting that i payed to see the films at the Cinema, then i pay to hire out the DVD's to see the deleted scenes, then i pay to buy the VHS' (gonna get the DVD's later) - and now they want me to pay even more to see one f**king deleted scene that should have been on the Ep2 DVD.
Quite frankly, i would burn all of my Star Wars related products before i pay to see material that should be free.

saberhagen
12-31-2003, 10:17 AM
Why should it be free? They're a business, they exist to make money.

Disgust is a vice.

Admiral Vostok
01-01-2004, 07:38 AM
Yeah, what saberhagen said. I don't see why it should be free at all. And considering all the other stuff you get for joinging hyperspace.com, I'd say it's quite fairly priced.

Darth Windu
01-01-2004, 08:18 AM
You dont have to pay to see deleted scenes on starrek.com. You dont have to pay to download additional items for 'The Sims' from Maxis.

Many, if not all, new DVD's have deleted scenes on them along with other bonus material. Only some pieces of scum, like Lucasfilm, ask you to pay to see deleted scenes on a DVD, then pay again to see others online, that should have been on the DVD.

To me, all this is, is trying to squeeze every last cent out of fans. Star Trek doesnt do it, they didnt do it with Indianna Jones, James Bond, Aliens etc etc. Why Star Wars?

lukeiamyourdad
01-01-2004, 07:02 PM
Complain all you want Windu, if you were the owner of some very popular serie, you'd do the same thing. As we all would...

Darth Windu
01-02-2004, 05:42 AM
Exactly how is that an excuse? Apart from no-one here knowing me well enough to predict what i would do, there is absolutely no justification in what lucasfilm and starwars.com has done.

Being such a successful and wealthy franchise, there is no need to charge fans to see extra footage.

saberhagen
01-02-2004, 08:13 AM
And what kind of Star Wars fan calls Lucasfilm "scum"???

The price of anything is as much as someone is prepared to pay for it. The very fact that you are so desperate to see these scenes suggests that there is a market for them. Also there is a need to charge for web content because making it available incurs extra costs on top of the costs of making the films. Video clips tend to be huge files and if there is significant demand for them that's going to use a lot of bandwidth. I doubt that hyperspace makes a huge profit when you take its running costs into account.

If you don't want to pay to see this stuff, don't buy it, but stop complaining. I won't be paying for this scene cos I don't think it's worth seeing. The deleted scenes on the TPM DVD just confirmed that scenes are usually deleted for a good reason...

lukeiamyourdad
01-02-2004, 04:03 PM
Besides, consider hyperspace like a magazine. You have to subscribe to the magazine or buy it at the newstand in order to read it and get whatever is inside right? Then Hyperspace is like a magazine that grants you exclusive stuff from the set of Ep.3 + they give you the chance of watching a deleted scene.
It's all natural.

MasterN64
01-02-2004, 09:36 PM
I agree.

Darth Windu
01-03-2004, 04:17 AM
saberhagen - so, because im a Star Wars fan, that means that im not allowed to be annoyed with the people who make the films? No offense, but thats a pretty stupid statement.

luke - actually, no. At the newsagent, i read the magazines but dont buy them unless there is a lot of good stuff, and there is only one thing in 'hyerspace' that interests me. I mean, really, who gives a crap about coloured bulletin board nicknames? Aside from that, i dont want to know anything about Ep3 because i want everything to be a suprise when i go see it - so why should i pay all of this money to see a deleted scene that isnt even completed?

lukeiamyourdad
01-03-2004, 05:39 PM
Then why do you want to see it if it's uncompleted therefore not worth seeing?
I don't how newstands work in Australia but in North America they don't let you read the magazines without paying...

Look, think like a businessman. You see all these fans who really want to see a particualr deleted scene. You own all the rights to the movie in question and can do whatever you want with it. As a bussinessman, do you:
A) Give it away making 0$ in the process?
or
B) Charge money because some fans are ready to pay to see it?

Lucasfilm ain't no charitable organization. They're here to make money. Don't expect them to give away so much free stuff.
Hell, for everything that's on regular starwars.com they should charge us something(if any owner of Lucasfilm is reading this, that is NOT a suggestion).

Darth Windu
01-04-2004, 11:36 AM
No, in Australia, the mags and newspapers are set up so that you can look through them rather than having to buy them first.

Anyhow, yes, Lucasfilm is a business, but i see the two options a little differently.
1. Allow fans to see the scene for free as a reward for their devotion to Star Wars and paying all of their money to see the films - of which this scene was originally a part.

2. Make fans pay, thereby squeezing even more mobney out of them, and shutting off content from those who cant afford it or object to being forced to pay to see an unfinished scene.

The reason i want to see this scene is because it sounds interesting as i heard quite a bit about it but have never seen it. If it had been completed with special effects and whatnot, i can see the justification for charging fans for access - but the point is that it ISNT finished, they didnt spend any extra money on the scene, so why should i pay them to see it?

lukeiamyourdad
01-04-2004, 03:23 PM
Because it's their property. They do what they like with it. They could have completely kept it away from everyone.
If you're that desperate go try to download it from kazaa or something like that.

Darth Windu
01-05-2004, 08:09 AM
Actually i tried Kazaa but couldnt find it :)

As i said though, if the scene had been completed with special effects, i can understand why they would charge people to see it, as the completion of the scene would have cost a bit of money. My point is though that they DIDNT spend any money on it, so there is no good reason to charge people to see the scene.

lukeiamyourdad
01-05-2004, 01:41 PM
They did spend money on it. Hell, you have to pay the actors, the scenery...even if it's deleted they get paid. Since Lucasfilm lost money in this scene, they charge people money to sompensate for it.

DarthMaulUK
01-05-2004, 02:50 PM
This has gone WAY off topic - but for now, i will just be keeping an eye on it.

DMUK ;-)

lukeiamyourdad
01-05-2004, 06:35 PM
Eh well, we only have two thread alive right now so...

DarthMaulUK
01-05-2004, 06:48 PM
Thats why im only watching ;-)

DMUK

swphreak
01-05-2004, 07:11 PM
This is why I don't get involved with the EU vs Canon. Too much to read, and I'm too lazy to type a long reply to all the remarks.

Either, way, EU rules.

And Star Trek doesn't.

Darth Windu
01-06-2004, 02:57 AM
luke - not true. The money spent on that scene was part of the Episode 2 budget, the same as all of the other deleted scenes. Therefore, there are no extra costs that fans should have to pay for. Do you really beleive that the actors got payed when starwars.com put this scene on its site? Lets start living in the real world.

You still havent been able to come up with a good argument against my assertion that, if the scene was completed, there would be a good reason to charge fans to see it, but because it wasnt completed, there is no good reason.

Phreak - i disagree about EU, but agree about Star Trek at the moment - 'Enterprise' is a complete disaster.

Admiral Vostok
01-06-2004, 09:16 PM
On the subject of living in the real world, perhaps you need to realise, Windu, that nothing in life is free.

lukeiamyourdad
01-06-2004, 10:15 PM
Originally posted by Darth Windu

You still havent been able to come up with a good argument against my assertion that, if the scene was completed, there would be a good reason to charge fans to see it, but because it wasnt completed, there is no good reason.

Argh, God they give you a chance to see it already. They don't have to do that. They don't have to set up hyperspace, they don't have to set up an official site or do anything.

You that use so many real world examples, you should be more realistic. Vostok is totally right. As sad as it is, NOTHING in the world comes free, nothing is totally free, if you want some freebies, grow them in your garden. As long as you don't own it, it's not you who decides its fate. This scene was never supposed to be shown but fans heard about it and then everybody wants to see it.
Look, I'm not rich, not anything near rich but I've come to realise that in the world, in this world, making money is basically the only way to survive. These people are making their money here, you pay 20 $ for a year of special exclusive content from ep3.
Now here, if a magazine has an exclusive playable demo for some console game, you have to pay for the magazine to get that demo. Same thing here, this magazine has the exclusive right to this one deleted scene and you have to pay for the magazine to get it.

Is that so complicated? Why don't you send an e-mail to Lucasfilm complaining about this? They would turn you down so easily. You have to realise that these guys are businessmen and women. You have to realise that these people are here to make money and they don't really care about â few persons who complaint about this because most of the other hyperspace members are quite happy with their services and the content they're getting from it. Some of them even paid only to see this deleted scene and the businessman thinks about it for a second and says :"Hey, people are willing to pay money to see this! Let's rip them off!"
Unless you live in a certain utopia, where everyone is so nice and charitable to the others including businessmen, you have to face reality that nothing can stop these people from doing what they want with what they own. Hell, if you wanted to charge people for seeing your home movies after you bought the rights to them, you could!

You believe what you want to believe, you live in your little utopian dream, I'm going to try to iomprove my real world, not stupidly trying to change everything.

JediStickmanBob
01-22-2004, 12:01 PM
CAN WE PLEASE STOP ARGUING??!!!!
Windu: I have seen all of Star Trek and "Enterprise" is WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY off subject. I agree
IT SUCKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!:confused: :( :mad:

MasterN64
01-22-2004, 03:00 PM
As the starter of this little thread i feel that WE SHOULD STOP THE ARGUING!!!! You guys can continue this little argument on another thread.

Moderators: Feel free to close!!!!! I'm tired of this thread!!!!! MAKE THEM MAKE ANOTHER THREAD FOR THIS!!!!!! PLEASE!!!!! OR AT LEAST CLOSE IT!!!!!!

Thank you.

lukeiamyourdad
01-22-2004, 09:29 PM
It's been over for quite awhile now. Because of you guys, it's been ressurrected. Besides, it's very common for threads to go off-topic and arguing is what we do best.

MasterN64
01-28-2004, 10:12 PM
Well i am glad everyone has stopped posting in this little thread. A little less arguing in the world wont do any harm. :devsmoke:

JediStickmanBob
02-08-2004, 10:06 PM
I resent that. (no offense):D