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Marker0077
12-12-2003, 09:40 PM
You know what's worse than people who change the saber damage scale? Not being able to tell that they changed it. Most server settings are viewable out of game (like if it was set in a sets variable) but the damage scale is not one of them.

I think there should be as many viewable settings out of game as possible. TBH, you could see what the saber damage scale was out of game with JK2, why it was changed with JK3 is beyond me.

razorace
12-13-2003, 11:38 AM
That should be easy to do. I'll try to add that when I have time.

Wudan
12-13-2003, 02:03 PM
The real problem here is server configurability. You can't pick any server and play the same game twice, which isn't a problem (for most) because most everyone plays the same server over and over again.

Why should you have to worry about server settings - shouldn't you be able to drop in the game and play?

How can we ever tell who is a good player, when we haven't played the same exact game?

razorace
12-13-2003, 07:29 PM
Agreed, that's why all the cvars I've added so far are client side stuff only.

Marker0077
12-14-2003, 02:46 AM
Originally posted by Wudan
The real problem here is server configurability. You can't pick any server and play the same game twice, which isn't a problem (for most) because most everyone plays the same server over and over again.I don't & because of the server browser proggy I use, I can tell what kind of server it is for the most part before I even get in the game.

In JK2, you could tell what the damagescale was set ot out of game & the fact you can't in JK3 is probably a mistake on Raven's end. The damagescale is a huge thing & should be fixed.Originally posted by Wudan
Why should you have to worry about server settings - shouldn't you be able to drop in the game and play?It saves alot of time to know what kind of a server it is before you even enter the game. Hell, with my server browser set up, I can have any type of server I don't like not even show up in my list at all.Originally posted by Wudan
How can we ever tell who is a good player, when we haven't played the same exact game? Huh? You lost me here. I have no clue what you are referencing this comment to.Originally posted by razorace
Agreed, that's why all the cvars I've added so far are client side stuff only. Well Basic is client side only (last I heard) so there wouldn't be any server CVar settings for client only mods.

If you are making changes in Enhanced that are optional to the host, they should be viewable via the net (like a "sets" variable would be).

The bottom line is Raven obviously intended it to be this way (otherwise it wouldn't have been set up this way in JK2) & this is a simple fix. So why not?

Looking back at the way I posted it, it does come out a little wrong with the "there should be as many as possible" because that's not what I meant. The saberdamagescale is a *huge* thing, that should be viewable. Unless there are some other features installed by Raven that were either viewable out of game in JK2 or we just think something else should be viewable out of game, then the only other ones that should be viewable are the new ones you are implimenting that are obviously optional via the host, but last I checked, you were making alot of your new features without an option to go back to default so it would be pointless for those types of features.

razorace
12-14-2003, 03:01 AM
Basic is client and server at this point.

And I just added the change to my copy and it will be on the repository soon.

Wudan
12-14-2003, 01:25 PM
Originally posted by Marker0077
Huh? You lost me here. I have no clue what you are referencing this comment to.Well Basic is client side only (last I heard) so there wouldn't be any server CVar settings for client only mods.

Slow down and read carefully. The very first line I wrote:
[B]The real problem here is server configurability.
This is my key point.

I can tell you're the kind of guy who'd like to be able to configure the hell out of a server, so there's no point arguing with you about this - I simply disagree.

Marker0077
12-15-2003, 03:05 AM
Wudan, either you have no clue what I am talking about or... I dunno what, I think you just have no idea what I am talking about.

All I am suggesting is that whatever the saberdamagescale is set to be shown out of game - that's it. I'm not saying set it one way or the other, although I do prefer defaults, but the *only* thing I am recommending here is that whatever the thing is set to be viewable out of game - that's it.

All these configurations & whatnot I've been talking about are about gaming browsers, not servers. Just thought I would clarify in case there is any miscommunication because what you are saying doesn't seem to make sense.

Wudan
12-15-2003, 09:51 PM
I understand that you're talking about server configuration and viewing it from the server browser.

The change I was hinting at won't be allowed by OJP - it would piss too many people off.

Marker0077
12-15-2003, 11:33 PM
Originally posted by Wudan
I understand that you're talking about server configuration and viewing it from the server browser.Not the in-game server browser no; That's way too limited of a browser for something like this. It would be in the existing server CVar list that *is* viewable with real server browsers, like ASE or GameSpy.

GameSpy 3D is awesome & GameSpy Arcade sucks. ASE is like a more limited version of GameSpy 3D, however, it updates from the Raven master which GameSpy 3D does not. So I import the ASE server list into GameSpy 3D, this way, I get all the Gamespy master servers, all the ASE master servers (including the Raven master) & all the totally kickass configurability of GameSpy 3D. The in-game server browser couldn't even hold a candle to that.Originally posted by Wudan
The change I was hinting at won't be allowed by OJP - it would piss too many people off. I think you meant the change I was hinting at but anyways, it's already been added to OJP & it doesn't piss anyone off. Again, you are not really getting what it is I am saying. Perhaps I didn't explain myself correctly & if that is the case, I apologize, but I never intended on changing the in-game server browser & why anyone would use it (aside from the fact they don't know any better) is beyond me.

The in-game server browser not only doesn't give you as many servers as I get, it also has pretty much no configurability at all.

Wudan
12-15-2003, 11:36 PM
The change I was implying was to remove a great deal of server configurability.

This hasn't been implemented in OJP.

Marker0077
12-15-2003, 11:43 PM
If you are referring to the g_saberdamagescale CVar, Raven implimented that into the base game. That's the *only* CVar that's been talked about in here so I can't imagine you talking about any other. This CVar existed in JK2 as well, however, the CVar was viewable from the net in JK2, where in JK3 it's not.

I like rolling with the defaults, especially with the damage scale but people like to go changing things - which if it is their server, that's their right, however, as a client I feel I have the right to know if the settings of the server I'm playing on have been changed because if the damage scale has been tampered with, I'm going to filter that server out of my browser list altogether.

razorace
12-16-2003, 12:36 AM
There's no point of arguing about it. I already the modification in the game.

However, I'll repeat my opinion that we need to keep the cvars to an absolute minimum. If we put too many cvars in, it will become too complicated to just start up the game and play.

If people honestly want a specific feature, they can either do a custom sub-mod for their server or submit the changes to the project.

Wudan
12-16-2003, 01:30 PM
Originally posted by Marker0077
If you are referring to the g_saberdamagescale CVar, Raven implimented that into the base game. That's the *only* CVar that's been talked about in here so I can't imagine you talking about any other. This CVar existed in JK2 as well, however, the CVar was viewable from the net in JK2, where in JK3 it's not.

I like rolling with the defaults, especially with the damage scale but people like to go changing things - which if it is their server, that's their right, however, as a client I feel I have the right to know if the settings of the server I'm playing on have been changed because if the damage scale has been tampered with, I'm going to filter that server out of my browser list altogether.

NO. THAT IS NOT WHAT I WAS REFERING TO.

I was making inference to a change not mentioned on this thread. I don't care what info the Master server gives out, or what proprietary server browsers show.

My oppinion, to put it as simply as I can, is that less configurability equals more playability.

We're arguing because you give me snide replies when you don't know what it is that I'm talking about - I'm sorry I trounced on your thread with one comment, I thought that Open Jedi Project was Open To Discussion - clearly an aggregious error on my part.

Marker0077
12-17-2003, 12:22 AM
ummmmmm, ooookay. I never meant any offense towards anyone & I apologize if it came out like that but again, it was not my intent.

Secondly, if you were talking about something that we weren't in this thread, you should let us know otherwise how are we supposed to know what you are talking about?

Thirdly, the "less configurability" thing didn't really apply to this CVar. It's something that's in the base game so it's there for everything JK3. I just wanted to be able to tell what it was set to, nothing more.

Fourthly, this is open to discussion if we can see from a point of view why it would be a bad idea, but we're talking about one thing, you come in here & talk about another without saying anything to us & then get upset about the whole ordeal. Again, I didn't mean any offense to you dude, that was your interpretation, not my commentary. Perhaps I phrazed myself a little poorly but either way, I do apologize for any "snide" comments or whatever other commentary you took offense to.

Wudan
12-17-2003, 01:23 PM
Ok, no problem, I think we've burnt this fire out.