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Grendal_p
12-22-2003, 01:35 PM
I've read a number of threads thus far about laming, and I thought it was high time I made one of my own. I commonly log in during the evenings, and it normally takes me serveral tries (3 or 4) to actually find a server in which I am not kicked from almost immediatly.

Servers like:
Fairy-Forest
!SoS!
H//ero's Server
KWSN's Server

all the servers like the above mentioned ones, that think that a first person combat game, is really IRC with pictures :/

Why is it if someone gets on there and decides to actually run around and fight, is it laming?

Why is it that pushing/pulling a person in mid jump off a ledge is laming, to me it sounds like a rather good tactic :/

My favorite occurance, and this happens multiple times every night, is that I will finally find a server in which they won't kick me immediatly, but instead they rally a "Lamer Hunt" which is mucho fun for me, being a though its the sheep leading themselves right into the den of the wolf. Usually prior to this point I have surpassed there current leaders kill count in about 1/3rd the time, and they feel the need to get vengence.

So the hunt begins...

All the players are after Grendal... Shouts of "Get the yellow Tw'ilek" rain out... yet getting the yellow Tw'ilek never seems to happen. I end up getting anywhere from 2 to 4 kills for every one they get of me, to eventually get booted from the server...

So I guess my question goes out to some of you out there, whats the deal? If you are one of the regulars on those servers, please tell me what i'm missing, what i'm doing wrong, because I honestly just don't see it.

If you are one of those people that think the people I just spoke of are idiots, then please let me know what you do about it when you encounter such tards on a server?

Thx...

- Grendal

Don't hate me because you think I am better than you, hate me because you know I am.

Tinny
12-22-2003, 01:48 PM
hey i have an idea. how about a bunch of us get together over irc or aim or something and set up a time. we all go on a honor/rpg server and bind name switches, and lame ALL day.

GothiX
12-22-2003, 01:48 PM
They are the idiots. You're just playing the game like it was intended to.

AxVegetA
12-22-2003, 01:50 PM
Well, if you dont wana get kicked, just dont piss people off.
Just lame noobs and/or lamers.
KWSN sux by the way, they are all gay, they lame, but they dont want to be lamed. Just kick their ass.

scoobz1
12-22-2003, 01:57 PM
I had that the other night... it was a FFA and few were just chatting. I kept challenging them to a duel, and I got told that FFA is for chatting and that if I want a fight I should go to a duel server.

I'm sorry - but I didn't shell out 50 EUR for a fancy IRC proggy! It'll get to the stage where we don't even need the game any more - we can just log into IRC and play it :confused:

EDIT: and I just want to add... there is no such thing as a lamer - if you don't want to fight, then you shouldn't be in the game. (or at the very least - run off and hide away somewhere where you can't get hurt.

EDIT EDIT: I just had another idea.... become a spectator and chat as much as you like!!

- The only lamer is someone who calls another a lamer.

Grendal_p
12-22-2003, 01:58 PM
Don't get me wrong... I do bring the fight to them.

I will kill people with sabers down

I will kill people with chat up


My favorite tactic is to Mind Trick someone, and then chat that person with a taunt whilst following them, and the minute they stop to "respond" i kill them with a 1-move whilst there chat bubble is up.

I will get in the middle of 3 or 4 guys standing around with sabers down to await a duel, and I will begin a yawgspeed spin with dual sabers... I am not about to say I am a nice guy... But when someone does any of that to me, I don't cry, I merely reload and hope I run into them to inact a little revenge in the form of a kill count for me.

As of yet, I have never found a "honor guy" that can actually fight. Most of them think they can, but when it gets right down to it they can not. I fought one clan last night, and all they kept saying was "all you do is the backstab" and i'm thinking to myself, why change up my move if you have yet to figure out how to avoid it :/

To humor them I switched to a single saber and began abusing the lunge move. But yes, if an entire clan is after me, expect me to be using moves that deals with multiple opponents at once.

I've been on servers before where people have rallied to help me, which usually turns into a realy fun fight, with most of the people screaming lamer, actually having some fun when all is said and done. Its suprising, how much fun a 3d First Person Shooter game running the quake engine can be, when you actually treat it to be more than just a really fancy chat room :/

- Grendal

scoobz1
12-22-2003, 02:02 PM
Originally posted by Grendal_p
Don't get me wrong... I do bring the fight to them.

I will kill pe................fancy chat room :/

- Grendal

I agree with all you say...... if you have a move that works - abuse it. If they can't counter, then they should learn how to. Why should you play any less - because they need a handicap?

Grendal_p
12-22-2003, 02:09 PM
Originally posted by scoobz1
I agree with all you say...... if you have a move that works - abuse it. If they can't counter, then they should learn how to. Why should you play any less - because they need a handicap?

I often times am forced to use the dual saber spin, especially when clans are ganged up on me. So I often get accused of only knowing that move. However the majority of my kills in a single night can easily be contributed to either the Backslash and/or Backstab moves, the occasional lunge happening as well.

I mean I know a lot of people think that a saber duel involves running around jumping up and down like an idiot and spamming single swings, but lets face it, you don't kill anything doing that. There is really only a small handful of legitamate moves that can be used that will guarantee victory.

From a Dual Sabers Standpoint:
Single Saber Lunge
Dual Saber Spin
Dual Saber stab behind (nothing fancy)
Backslash
Backstap
Saber Throw

And thats about it... using any other move is just about pointless in my opinion.

My favorite thing though, is to get some guy I have killed like 10 times in a row, and he finally gets me once, and boy oh boy does it make his day. So I made up a special bind just for people like that.

It says "Even a blind squirrel finds a nut every now and then"

This usually does a very good job of irrating said player even more.

I don't know, maybe I an entirely to cocky, but I know I am good at this game. I know at best that I will only ever find an equal. Yes that is a very cocky attitude to take, but it is one that I can back up, and do so on a nightly basis. I love games like this, i'm just good at them. Put me in a twitch fest game and yes, I will twitch the fastest. I commonly was the guy accused of using aimbots in counterstrike, based souly on the fact that I was very good at Aim at head/Fire in .0001 seconds move....

Ohhh well... I still very much love to be the most hated person... infact most of my binds are setup to annoy people in the game further... Spamming "owned" after all kills against certain clan members usually results in a "Kill Grendal Rally" which is more fun for me :)

- Grendal

Sam Fisher
12-22-2003, 02:15 PM
I think their definition of a 'lamer' is someone who doesn't do exactly what they want. Fo instance, you lame a lamer, he calls you a lamer, gets his buddies together, you get kicked. Its sad, really...

Grendal_p
12-22-2003, 02:16 PM
My favorite quote from 95% of the servers I dispise...

"Was that a lame?"

As that admin/tard in charge tries to weed out as to rather or not my move I just did, or my kill I just made was "a lame" whatever that means :/

I usually respond by saying... "I think it was..." :)

- Grendal

Master William
12-22-2003, 02:20 PM
Well, I guess you have to follow the rules of a server... The problem is, some "honor" servers have problems actually listing them, making everyone assume it is a normal FFA server.

scoobz1
12-22-2003, 02:29 PM
Originally posted by Grendal_p
So I made up a special bind just for people like that.

It says "Even a blind squirrel finds a nut every now and then"

This usually does a very good job of irrating said player even more.

I don't know, maybe I an entirely to cocky, but I know I am good at this game. I know at best that I will only ever find an equal. Yes that is a very cocky attitude to take, but it is one that I can back up, and do so on a nightly basis- Grendal

OK - that might be a little too cocky - but that's your choice; at the end of the day you're only setting yourself up for the fall if someone does get you... but, "it is you're choice" to make! It's a free world!

.....and there's never anything wrong with some friendly banter. It brings some fun to the game :D

.... I wouldn't mind dueling you if you're around later?

MasteR PudsLiG
12-22-2003, 02:30 PM
Indeed, william, servers that say in the rules "no laming" are not stating the rules clear enough, i have to say on the server your admin at i went just to annoy with lightning, and i was put to sleep for using force when it was enabled, even though this wasnt down to you william, you even said wait for force to be disabled ,"its confusing". If rules say "no laming", ask the admins to make the rules more clear, i do think it was unfair when you put everyone to sleep when only few was "laming", william, and i was in trouble alot when i was fighting people with saber up and admins got in the way and got zaped by my lightning, not my fault but i had fun anyway

Master William
12-22-2003, 02:36 PM
You have no idea how frustrating the job of an admin is... You finally manage to get this guy who just got the game to talk (Nexus: "Press Y button chat") with you, and learn him the rules of our server... It did work out... But then after I learned him the rules, some other guy who I had talked to 10 times just kept breaking the rules. So basically, many people were breaking rules everywhere, and it's too hard to keep track on people...
I'd rather admin a No Rules server, and that force thing really sucked, I think it should be allowed until it is disabled...

And the MOTD, it should clearly say the real rules for the server, not "No Laming", most people don't know what that mean...

Grendal_p
12-22-2003, 02:40 PM
Being put to sleep by an admin is a very common occurance to me. In the end though, it brings me great pleasure to know that i've more than likely made some whiner cry in real life at the ownage he is receiving in game :/

Being put to sleep or booted by an admin is usually a badge of honor to me... its like saying... "we couldn't handle you any other way".

Just out of curiosity... Master William... what server do u admin?

- Grendal

Master William
12-22-2003, 02:48 PM
Nothing you should know... I say go try to find servers with normal FFA, don't break rules of servers with their server rules... Instead, try going to Amidalas chop shop or Kurgans meatgrinder.

Grendal_p
12-22-2003, 02:50 PM
Why not tell me which server u admin?

Thats a fairly simple question isn't it?

- Grendal

Amidala from Chop Shop
12-22-2003, 02:52 PM
Originally posted by Tinny
hey i have an idea. how about a bunch of us get together over irc or aim or something and set up a time. we all go on a honor/rpg server and bind name switches, and lame ALL day.

Everyone here should know that I think that "honor codes" are a perversion of the original design and intention of the game.

But I think you should leave those people alone. Let them be. You are wasting your time if you think you are going to change any minds that way.

Many people have said in Jedi Outcast there were so few servers that let you actually play the game that out of frustration and boredom they went on any random server (since 98% were "honor servers") and "lamed" people.

We aren't in that situation with Star Wars® Jedi Knight®: Jedi Academy(tm) (yet) so just leave those folks alone and go to a server that lets you really play the game, like my servers (look at my sig below for names and IPs) or any of these (http://www.lucasforums.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=119950).

MasteR PudsLiG
12-22-2003, 03:52 PM
You have no idea how frustrating the job of an admin is...

I was a admin for a jk2 clan server running ja mod, william

AxVegetA
12-22-2003, 04:07 PM
Do whatever the **** u want to have fun, as simple as that.

BobaFett8765
12-22-2003, 04:51 PM
Once I was on a server where 2 girl jedis walked every where and yelled at people for fighting. So I rallied a bunch of people to the cause and we fought the admins! They couldn't stop us. There was atleast 15 in the server and I got about 10 to help me. It was sooo funny. The Admins were crying "lamer! lamer!lamer!" and their 5 body guards were getting killed whenever they spawned.

I cant remember the name but it was fun. :D


:fett:

Vulkan_HFB
12-22-2003, 05:53 PM
Unfortunately, it's a common occurance... I've been to a good number of servers where there are no rules listed, only to get kicked out eventually. Being called a lamer on your own server is also rather funny, except the one that gets kicked isn't the lamer, but rather the lamee. =)

I was playing gas mine with a few clanners that joined in last night, and what you say couldn't be more true, it seems that pushing some dork into the abyss because he failed to put points into push for defense or absorb to avoid being pushed in the first place makes you a lamer.

Then they start making with the insults... But I think it's surprising when *they* end up getting kicked. I guess the idea of a lamer admin is something of a revelation to them. =)

Too bad that 90% of the people that play this game are of the "you lamer!" variaety, it's been terribly lonely at my server since most of the true FFA crowd has already picked a favorite server and probably stays there. But oh well, pushing and kicking honor d00ds is plenty of fun in its own right.

Amidala from Chop Shop
12-22-2003, 06:47 PM
Originally posted by Vulkan_HFB
Too bad that 90% of the people that play this game are of the "you lamer!" variaety, it's been terribly lonely at my server since most of the true FFA crowd has already picked a favorite server and probably stays there. But oh well, pushing and kicking honor d00ds is plenty of fun in its own right.

Be patient, your server was just recently "reborn", so give people a chance to find it. I predict you will see an increase in traffic around Dec. 25 or so. Have a few bots and\or be there yourself to play people who show up, and make sure they have a good time (ie, let them win, but don't make it obvious). You can also run Siege games for awhile or every so often, Siege servers seem to be pretty popular.

There are a lot of "casual" clans that need a home server. If you play on some other servers and meet some clan guys that you like, and they are lacking a server, maybe join their clan and make your server the clan's server.

Alegis
12-22-2003, 07:07 PM
Originally posted by Amidala from Chop Shop
Many people have said in Jedi Outcast there were so few servers that let you actually play the game that out of frustration and boredom they went on any random server (since 98% were "honor servers") and "lamed" people.
I don't think 2% is a lot, as you just said. Why were most servers honor? Why? Because the ppl that favored that were in majority, not the ones that only use binds to chat and 24/7 play; (*) so you don't have to put an act together that there is a little pest somewhere that needs to be terminated.

(*)->only bit of personal opinion in this post, I didn't say I was for honor or not, which isn't the meaning of this post, it's that you're trying to alienate a majority. People host honor coded server, you didn't pay for those so why are you complaining, they're not yours and you don't have any right of them. since the ones that share your opinion here are with many, and you guys have lists of servers where you can play w/o all this honour stuff, why complain. You did NOT pay for them, and you're not forced to join them. Sure I agree it's fun with many servers with the settings you want, but those servers are not yours and why put actions and all this stuff against them. you can't akways get what you want

Amidala from Chop Shop
12-22-2003, 07:53 PM
Originally posted by Alegis Gensan
I don't think 2% is a lot, as you just said. Why were most servers honor? Why? Because the ppl that favored that were in majority, not the ones that only use binds to chat and 24/7 play; (*) so you don't have to put an act together that there is a little pest somewhere that needs to be terminated.

(*)->only bit of personal opinion in this post, I didn't say I was for honor or not, which isn't the meaning of this post, it's that you're trying to alienate a majority. People host honor coded server, you didn't pay for those so why are you complaining, they're not yours and you don't have any right of them. since the ones that share your opinion here are with many, and you guys have lists of servers where you can play w/o all this honour stuff, why complain. You did NOT pay for them, and you're not forced to join them. Sure I agree it's fun with many servers with the settings you want, but those servers are not yours and why put actions and all this stuff against them. you can't akways get what you want

Free cookies for those who actually understood this post

I guess I won't be getting any free cookies.

I hope you read my post. I am against people going to "honor" servers just to cause trouble. I said leave those people alone and go to a server that let's you play the game.

I already explained how I think the "honor" players became the majority in Jedi Outcast here (http://www.lucasforums.com/showthread.php?s=&postid=1387737#post1387737). It's not because "honor codes" are "more popular" or "better", it's three things:[list=1]
They took advantage of the naivete and susceptibilty to peer pressure of new players and brainwashed\initimidated\seduced them into the honor camp.
"Honor" players tend to spread like missionaries preaching a false religion, invading and infesting other servers
The player abuse from abusive admins so common at "honor" servers simply drove a lot of players away to other games (UT2003, RTCW, etc.) where they didn't have to deal with immature abusive "honor" admins and their power trips
[/list=1]
So before you so smugly assume that "honor" players and servers were the majority in Jedi Outcast (at the end) because "honor" is so superior and popular, the sad truth is that the "honor" players killed the community, so in the end all that was left were "honor" players. We are trying to keep history from repeating itself in Star Wars® Jedi Knight®: Jedi Academy(tm).

Alegis
12-22-2003, 08:05 PM
Your vision of honor servers is this; just an IRC room. nothing more. Most clanmembers etc actually get to know each other better and use the server indeed as a communication program, and duel. People like to do this because i've asked many and many and they all say they bought this game for the duelling with the saber and all. The reason JA is not like UT is because the melee weapon is actually a damn good weapon, in other games you'd spawn with a knife or a straw (or nothing at all). This melee weapon called lightsaber has a big past witht he movie and all...if you see people who just watched a star wars movie for the first time they're slicing imaginary lightsabers the next days

I can't see how honor servers destroyed all the l4m3r servers (I don't think they're lamers if you use guns and all, i'll just call this group l4m3rs for simplicity) I mean if there were more l4m3r than honor, how could honor have won if those l4m3rs server didn't want honor? same goes if they were equal in count. people just like to chat a bit and duel and that stuff in this game, it's unique in the jediknight series. If something destroys a community I understand by that there are NO servers, in your eyes the community is destroyed because all the l4m3r servers turned to the dark side. I like playing on guns servers and duelling on honor servers, i'd say one cannot go without the other. I also like your chopshop servers with increased saber dmg+instagib, it's a great diversity in gameplay. Oh well I'll back off here now and leave you all since i'm not up ATM for any discussions and defintely not these

TK-8252
12-22-2003, 08:10 PM
Originally posted by Alegis Gensan
I don't think 2% is a lot, as you just said. Why were most servers honor? Why? Because the ppl that favored that were in majority, not the ones that only use binds to chat and 24/7 play; (*) so you don't have to put an act together that there is a little pest somewhere that needs to be terminated.

(*)->only bit of personal opinion in this post, I didn't say I was for honor or not, which isn't the meaning of this post, it's that you're trying to alienate a majority. People host honor coded server, you didn't pay for those so why are you complaining, they're not yours and you don't have any right of them. since the ones that share your opinion here are with many, and you guys have lists of servers where you can play w/o all this honour stuff, why complain. You did NOT pay for them, and you're not forced to join them. Sure I agree it's fun with many servers with the settings you want, but those servers are not yours and why put actions and all this stuff against them. you can't akways get what you want I couldn't have said it any better myself. Now I deserve that cookie you promised in your signature.

Originally posted by Master William
You have no idea how frustrating the job of an admin is... You finally manage to get this guy who just got the game to talk (Nexus: "Press Y button chat") with you, and learn him the rules of our server... It did work out... But then after I learned him the rules, some other guy who I had talked to 10 times just kept breaking the rules. So basically, many people were breaking rules everywhere, and it's too hard to keep track on people... I feel your pain, Master William.

Originally posted by Amidala from Chop Shop
But I think you should leave those people alone. Let them be. You are wasting your time if you think you are going to change any minds that way. Sounds good to me.

Originally posted by AxVegetA
Do whatever the **** u want to have fun, as simple as that. No, see, wrong. Because you are taking away other people's fun. And you have no right to do that. Infact, you have no right to join a multiplayer server. Multiplayer servers are a priviledge, NOT a right. Your problem is, you think that you have a right to join a server and play how you like to. Instead of how everyone else in the server likes to play.

BTW, AxVegeta we were having some fun with you at the JK3Files server. You are one funny person. And since you keep coming back after we take the fun out of your game it just shows how much you lack intellegence. You can't get the hint to STAY OUT. That's what a ban means: STAY OUT.

ExcelsioN
12-22-2003, 08:15 PM
Another 'laming' thread...:rolleyes:

Here's what I do:
Never join some server that you've never heard of before, join decent servers that you hear about on forums like Amidala's Chop Shop server. Man that server kicks @$$!

LEC or RAVEN need to host their own servers (like EA do with BF). Official servers are always the best.

Amidala from Chop Shop
12-22-2003, 10:53 PM
Originally posted by Alegis Gensan
Your vision of honor servers is this; just an IRC room. nothing more. Most clanmembers etc actually get to know each other better and use the server indeed as a communication program, and duel. So in other words, by your own description, it's an IRC room with occasional dueling. Wow, big difference. Originally posted by Alegis Gensan
People like to do this because i've asked many and many and they all say they bought this game for the duelling with the saber and all. The reason JA is not like UT is because the melee weapon is actually a damn good weapon, in other games you'd spawn with a knife or a straw (or nothing at all). This melee weapon called lightsaber has a big past witht he movie and all...if you see people who just watched a star wars movie for the first time they're slicing imaginary lightsabers the next days Duh, tell me something I don't know. Why do you think I increased lightsaber damage and Force regeneration speed? To enhance the two things that make this game unique, and to make a lightsaber-armed Jedi, with the Force as his ally, a most formidable opponent. What does that have to do with saber down = peace and amslapping kids around?
Originally posted by Alegis Gensan
I can't see how honor servers destroyed all the l4m3r servers (I don't think they're lamers if you use guns and all, i'll just call this group l4m3rs for simplicity) I mean if there were more l4m3r than honor, how could honor have won if those l4m3rs server didn't want honor?Since you clearly didn't understand or pay attention the first time, I'll repeat myself:Originally posted by Amidala from Chop Shop
I already explained how I think the "honor" players became the majority in Jedi Outcast here (http://www.lucasforums.com/showthread.php?s=&postid=1387737#post1387737). It's not because "honor codes" are "more popular" or "better", it's three things:[list=1]
They took advantage of the naivete and susceptibilty to peer pressure of new players and brainwashed\initimidated\seduced them into the honor camp.
"Honor" players tend to spread like missionaries preaching a false religion, invading and infesting other servers
The player abuse from abusive admins so common at "honor" servers simply drove a lot of players away to other games (UT2003, RTCW, etc.) where they didn't have to deal with immature abusive "honor" admins and their power trips
[/list=1]
I have only two objections to "honor servers":[list=1]
Most of the player abuse by abusive admins that drives players out of the game and kills the community occurs on "honor servers". I have seen it with my own eyes. Read the "laming" threads in this forum and the Jedi Outcast forum and you'll see that player abuse, even though I am sure it never, ever, ever happens on your favorite server, happens a lot on "honor" servers
"Honor" servers serve as breeding grounds\indoctrination camps for honor missionaries who try to spread their false religion to other servers by whining and peer-pressuring other players, often with a lot of name-calling and profanity (not very honorable behavior if you ask me)
[/list=1] If it wasn't for that, I couldn't care less what people do on those servers. Actually, I still don't care.

lllKyNeSlll
12-22-2003, 11:04 PM
Grendal_p= the new UJ of jk3?

amidala do you ever play on your server? what is your name if you do?

Kurgan
12-22-2003, 11:22 PM
"Laming" is a psychological phenomena.. a state of mind.

It's the victimhood assumed in the head of the person running the server or joining the server that somehow the manner in which they were killed/are losing is "unfair" and that they deserve another chance, regardless of how much their own behavior put them into the situation to begin with and regardless of how adversely their behavior may be affecting others on the same server.

It's a rather self-centered mentality when you think about it, because it assumes that the whole game must stop until they are finally "ready" to play and by their rules, as they alone interpret and define them (over and above the rules built into the game itself as intended by the designers).

Often this attitude is accompanied by a desire to "punish" those who they percieve as having victimized them (ie: "the lamer").

Thus it can lead to behaviors like call-vote kick (towards the percieved "Lamer"), kickban, amslap/sleep/slay, etc.


"Laming" is actually merely playing the game as it was designed to be played... ie: killing enemy players to score points, towards the goal of attempting to win the match/round.

Calling people "Lamers" is simply a continuing phenomena from the very earliest days of online gaming, essentially a display of poor sportsmanship (the "sore loser" mentality... whom will blame anything for their losing: the map design, the weapons balance, lag, their hardware, the weather... in short, anything except their own lack of skill).

In the JK2 and JA communities this persecution complex... shall we call it "Lamephobia" (irrational fear of "lamers")... has been fueled, inspired and supported by the spread of the "honor codes" (philosophies that strictly define most anything short of one on one saber duels combined with bowing rituals beforehand and usually restricted force and while not chatting or with their saber off is "dishonorable" and therefore "lame") and "admin mods" (game modifications that add "administration" features, sadly many of which also include features that allow an admin to "cheat" by killing random players at the touch of a button, making their weapons/powers disappear, teleporting them around the map or rendering their opponents unable to move, while making their own player invincible or more powerful).


This sad development has left a bad taste in the mouths of hundreds (if not thousands) of players, who can't play the game as it was designed to be played on one out of every 2 servers they join without being whined at and called names ("lamer," "n00b" or harsher things inappropriate in mixed company).


Possible Solutions: Support servers that shun honor codes and abusive admin mods. Send your (constructive) criticism to the authors of abusive admin mods and abusive admins, and voice your disagreement (in public debate) with those who promote honor codes.

Host your own server and don't stoop to their level. Encourage others to do the same!

If you make an admin mod, don't put in abusive commands and keep your mod closed source, so that some "individual" can't add abusive commands to it and ruin it.

Amidala from Chop Shop
12-22-2003, 11:38 PM
Originally posted by lllKyNeSlll
Grendal_p= the new UJ of jk3?

amidala do you ever play on your server? what is your name if you do? I sometimes go to my JK2 server to play Holocron, Jedimaster, or CTF. I usually play under different common names like "Padawan". Recently I was "Lando" and "Neo the One". If I'm leading in Jedimaster or Holocron, I'll change my name to Admin Amidala if I'm about to win (I'm vain). I prefer to be anonymous so I can see what really goes on. Also, if I play under my "real" name everybody heads for me so they can kill the admin, like it's that hard and something to brag about, LOL.

I am way over my time budget for this game activity, and it is already taking too much time away from other things I should be doing, so I can either spend my time running servers, which I am good at and which benefits many people, or I can stop running servers so I have more time to play, which I am so-so at and which would benefit only me. So I have played only one full game on my Jedi Academy servers (and somehow won). I hope to have time to play the single-player game (haven't yet), then bots to learn the maps, then dueling and other servers to gain experience, then finally my own servers. But I probably never will. But I'm having fun anyway!

lllKyNeSlll
12-23-2003, 01:57 AM
Can i smurf you and let them come at me?

FK | unnamed
12-23-2003, 06:15 AM
Originally posted by lllKyNeSlll
Grendal_p= the new UJ of jk3?


hahah, you know one of these days I'm going to start making demos again.

All I have been doing is hanging out in screed's server messing with people, I need to start pubbing again.

Kurgan
12-23-2003, 07:31 AM
Great thread.

If "honor nubs" restricted themselves to ganging up on people rather than vote kicking or getting the admin to ban/amslap people... the community would be a lot more fun place.

PS: And I thought *I* was hardcore taking a month to beat the SP campaign.. ; ) (well technically I still have yet to finish it on Dark Side, but still...)

ExcelsioN
12-23-2003, 09:10 AM
Originally posted by Amidala from Chop Shop
"Honor" servers serve as breeding grounds\indoctrination camps for honor missionaries who try to spread their false religion to other servers by whining and peer-pressuring other players, often with a lot of name-calling and profanity (not very honorable behavior if you ask me)

I remember the time when some honour player joined chop shop. About 5 minutes after he joined, he couldn't understand why he was getting 'lamed' so to speak. He got so frustrated after he was taunting and his head chopped off from behind. (that was a classic :D). Then he left calling us all laming gay n00bs. Or something like that.

Side
12-23-2003, 12:57 PM
I still dont understand why people even care if they got chat killed-saber down killed,

i mean cmon you spawn again and u can go back to your IRC mentality,the guy that just killed u while u were typing know he didnt own you why take it so badly then?

Respect?...if it FFA then it a freaking FFA,you kill to get ur icon on top of the game screen,no matter what it not disrespectsdlfjfullable(w/e my frenglish pwnz u all)and if ur mad about the guy that just type killed u just go and chase him down if he ownz u......he ownz u end of story hes better and your not why would u even care?...it not like competition is hella important point into jka

Kurgan
12-23-2003, 05:21 PM
I think it's because they have VERY FRAGILE EGOS.

They want to "look cool" in front of their "friends" (or at least in front of a few complete strangers on an online server not using their real name... go figure).

If they die, it's them losing face, so they need an excuse... ie: you were cheating/scripting or somehow breaking the rules, there was lag, the game is unbalanced, they weren't "really ready" (ie: you sucker punched them in the back or something), etc.

They can't admit that when they got killed it was either through their own incompetence, or else they simply got "owned" by a superior player.

Thus the excuses and the "honor" system to boost their ego.

I've had people explain it to me that it's about "showing respect to the other people playing the game with you." Ie: they're not "role playing" being a Jedi, but rather saying "Hey there Bill Smith playing Jedi Academy with me, I respect you."

That is, all the bowing and honor talk, etc.

The only trouble is, even if I assume that respect is automatic and not earned (ie: bow and respect everyone, no matter how crappy a player they are or how informal the setting), the BEHAVIOR of the so-called "honor" believers is anything BUT honorable.

These are the guys who are the first to flame and use profanity, the first to callvote kick/whine to the admin to kick the "lamer."

Is acting like a tattle-tail, whining like a baby and taking a "I'm taking my toys and going home!" attitude a show of respect or honor?

More like the exact opposite. Maybe all this time I'm really justified by laughing in the face of their so-called "honor" because they don't even know what the word means. At the very least, they don't practice what they preach.


The great paradox is that the honor system seems designed to eliminate competition... that is to make winning not a goal, but rather "playing the game" (dueling) is the end all-be all. It's like "Role playing." It's doing the stuff that's fun, not winning or losing.

But then they turn around and anything that makes them lose becomes something they whine and moan about and try to get revenge on you for. If winning doesn't matter to them, why do they get upset?

They treat it as a sleight on their "honor." They take it PERSONALLY and thus it's no longer a game for them, but a test of their manhood, and the only way for them to regain their honor is to get you banned from the server.


Here and I thought "honorable warriors" LIKED to get defeated by superior skill. Guess not.

If they were truly honorable they would suck it up when they make a mistake and just keep playing. Let them "right the wrong" by being a better player and SHOWING their skill, rather than trying to disqualify their opponents. What a cowardly way out...


But I guess logic doesn't really enter into their thinking. I still think it's all about saving face, and trying to make them "the star" no matter how ridiculous the situation.

A quicker way to sum it all up is that they are just sore losers, and so they devise a scheme to make "losing" for them logically impossible (make excuses, remove superior opponents from the game, etc).


I'm just trying to understand the psychology of it here...

But if somebody wants to honor ME in Jedi Academy, they can do so by playing the game and trying their darndest to beat me, holding nothing back (short of actual cheating of course).

THAT will earn my respect.

And if they want to say "gg" afterward (and know they mean it with all the effort they put into the game), that's a lot more meaningful to me than all the honor BS.

ExcelsioN
12-23-2003, 06:02 PM
To be honest, I think the honour code would work if it was used rightly. If the honourists (or whatever they're called) actually got on with some fighting, then I wouldn't mind it. Actually, it makes the game more civilised, unlike something like UT2k3.
Then comes along all the admin abuse, and this is where I go against it. They abuse their position.

But I won't go and kill them all, even if they are just standing around talking. I'll go join Chop Shop.

BawBag™
12-23-2003, 06:41 PM
Originally posted by Excelsion
To be honest, I think the honour code would work if it was used rightly. If the honourists (or whatever they're called) actually got on with some fighting, then I wouldn't mind it. Actually, it makes the game more civilised, unlike something like UT2k3.
Those h0n0rz suxxorz n00bz whatevers should simply be left alone. Don't encourage them. You should be patient and find a server to your liking. Although a few can crop up on any server.
But I don't think "honor code" can ever be used. Wait a sec, it definetely can't be used. ;)
Originally posted by Excelsion
Then comes along all the admin abuse, and this is where I go against it. They abuse their position.
Yes, but I don't think that will ever stop. A bit like giving a juvenile a "Bruce Almighty" :rolleyes:
Originally posted by Excelsion
But I won't go and kill them all, even if they are just standing around talking. I'll go join Chop Shop.
Quite right - like I said, if you find a server you enjoy, stick with it.
:)

Cupid
12-23-2003, 10:08 PM
I got called a lamer for using force drain