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eidospsogos
01-30-2004, 12:02 AM
[EDIT] there is finally a host for the armor. here is a link to the files as they exist right now. a slight re-skinning project is in mind as well, but check out the stats of the armor and share your opinions. here's the link (and a very big THANK YOU to Shimaon for hosting the files):

http://www.gknetworks.net/kotor/Exar_sArmor.zip

okay, first of all it looks the same. i loved the look just thought the stats were fairly laughable.

so i created two versions of it myself. both are UPGRADABLE. i made one for early in the game, so things wouldn't be TOO easy running around with a super bad@ss armor. which would bring me to my second armor. now titles as Exar Kun's Battle Armor. trust me you won't find any other in-game armor as good as this. :)

i gave these items to myself using the override folder and the holowan emporium. both arnors override the original armor for exar kun. so you pretty much would have to buy one of them, save, exit, swap the files in the override folder, load the game and get the other one. files in your inventory are NOT overriden by item overrides. only new items, such as those in stores, or found along the way are affected by item files in your override folder.

now as to why i started this thread. i have seen many people, who liked exar kun as much as myself and thought the poor stats of his armor insulting. :) so i figured why should all exar kun fans be disappointed.

so if some nice person wants to host these two mods on their site then i would be forever grateful. otherwise, if you would like the armor, leave your email, or pm me with your email, and i will send it to you.

i really don't know how many people will truly be interested in these, i just know i had seen some posts reflecting the same disappointment i had in his armor.

Darth Stryke
01-30-2004, 12:12 AM
I agree that his armor needed new stats. I am also working on reskinning it, because for some reason I did not like the copper color of the armor for Exar Kun. I liked the look of the armor itself, I just do not think it fit Exar Kun's personality and look.

eidospsogos
01-30-2004, 12:16 AM
actually the reason i liked it was because it did fit exar kun. if you look at the avatar to the left, that is a pic of exar kun in his armor. they did a VERY good job of making the armor look like something he did wear or would have worn. i know he was a sith lord. but NOT the stock character sith lord, in all black with a red saber. and that's what made him so great in my opinion. he was not the stock villian. and the brown/neutral/tan/copper, whatever color you want to call it, fits his character perfectly.

Darth Stryke
01-30-2004, 12:22 AM
Well, I agree with you about the character itself, but I have not seen a picture of Exar Kun wearing Copper-colored armor before. Every picture I have seen of Kun, he wore silver or black armor.

eidospsogos
01-30-2004, 12:36 AM
well the pic i have came straight from the comics. i'll email it to you if you like, as the actual image is much bigger than the avatar.

Darth Stryke
01-30-2004, 01:08 AM
Well, I have seen that picture of him before, I just assumed it was the lighting that did that. Anyways, how big is the file to be hosted-I might be able to host it temporarily on my angelfire site.

eidospsogos
01-30-2004, 01:22 AM
altogether, in one folder, it is a whopping 64 KB. as by the size on disk reference anyway. the actual size is 5.25 KB. :) so zipped up pretty small.

and by the way, though i love exar kun, i tend to still lean towards the lightside. :) so the pic i have is probably either shortly before, or shortly after his fall. i am sure his armor became more darkside oriented as time passed. but bioware's representation of it was fairly close to what it originally was.

Darth Stryke
01-30-2004, 01:27 AM
I will host the file-at that size it is no problem. I just hope too many people don't hit it too fast, otherwise angelfire will suspend the download temporarily. Send it to StrykeAzrael@aol.com

eidospsogos
01-30-2004, 01:55 AM
i will email it to you as soon as i can figure out what the original baseitems.2da defense rating for this item is. i edited mine, and as i just clean-sweeped my main hard drive, have yet to install kotor again. i would like anyone downloading this to get at LEAST the same item i had. so if i upped anything in my baseitems.2da, then they would be getting less than what i intended the armor to be.

Darth Stryke
01-30-2004, 02:05 AM
I sent a reply, but I can post it here as well. The base ac for any class 6 armor is 6. The class number that the armor has corresponds to its base ac.

eidospsogos
01-30-2004, 02:13 AM
okay. i'm getting ready to send it to you. i included a readme with instructions. first time i've distributed anything i've done. :)

do me a favor and test it out, and see if everything looks and works alright. if you don't find any bugs, post alink for the download. if you do find bugs, email me and let me know.

Darth Stryke
01-30-2004, 02:34 AM
Just a fast question before I post it. It worked fine, but I am just making sure. The only difference between the 2 armors is the defense bonus, correct? Just making sure because the "weaker" version is the same, just with a lower def bonus.

eidospsogos
01-30-2004, 02:40 AM
well, there is a huge difference once the armor is upgraded. did you upgrade both? if so, and you did not see the bonuses added for the one with the higher defense bonus let me know. i may have to install kotor again over the weekend if not.

Anach
01-30-2004, 02:43 AM
Screenshots and pics?

Darth Stryke
01-30-2004, 02:47 AM
Oh, I was talking about non-upgraded. The upgraded ones have the different bonuses and seem to work fine. So, with that said, this link *should* work.

http://www.angelfire.com/cantina/stryke/Exar_sArmor.zip

eidospsogos
01-30-2004, 02:56 AM
as said in the first post, the armor looks no different than exar kun's light battle suit. since i personally liked the look of that armor and felt it a very good representation of exar's armor (before his long trek down the dark path as stryker and i have discussed). if people want to re-skin it, that's up to them.

eidospsogos
01-30-2004, 06:48 PM
thnaks alot for hosting the items. i appreciate it. as i said before, i'm not too sure how much interest this will actually generate. but i saw no reason to just leave it sitting on my hard drive. :)

anyone with any opinions feel free to share.

Darth Stryke
01-30-2004, 08:06 PM
Well, between the 2 mods I had on my site, angelfire stopped the downloads because of too many people downloading. So, we need to find someone else to host this now. I was afraid it would happen. I am really sorry about this-thats why i was worried about it when i offered to host it. Does anyone have a site they can host like 2 mods on?

Jolinar
01-30-2004, 09:09 PM
I dont have a site to host that stuff on but I would like to cheat and have one of you email me that Exar Kun armor... :cool: If you dont mind please send it to eugcheradm@socket.net

Thanks!

Jolinar

Darth Stryke
01-30-2004, 09:14 PM
I sent the armor to you Jolinar, should be there soon.

eidospsogos
01-30-2004, 09:39 PM
thanks alot stryker. for the attempt, and for keeping up with the posts as well. i do appreciate it.

drakenon
01-31-2004, 01:46 AM
I just tried to download the Exar Armor myself and got the, "This site you attempted to access violated the Terms of Service, blah blah blah" message. I gathered that there were a lot of downloads off your site for it Stryker. If you wouldn't mind until another site is found sending them over to incoming@adelphia.net :D I would be grateful.

Oh BTW in anyone's time playing through KotOR did they try the dancedancemalak cheat? Truly worth it I think!

Shimaon
01-31-2004, 03:39 AM
Hey guys, send it over to me at webmaster@gknetworks.net and I'll host it on my site for ya, I'd love to see this myself as well.

eidospsogos
01-31-2004, 05:07 AM
sent and sent. i really appreciate the offer to host the file. feel free to put it up and post a link for it somewhere in the thread.

and any of you out there who have tried it out at all, let me know what you think. i know it's a minor mod, but i wouldn't mind a little feedback. :)

Supreme-Lord
01-31-2004, 07:50 AM
Cant wait, can anyone e-mail to me plz
meelis.kodu@mail.ee

eidospsogos
01-31-2004, 12:14 PM
your armor has been sent. here's hoping for a nice little link at the end of the thread soon. :)

Ellderon
01-31-2004, 12:38 PM
I allways tought that Jedi/Sith don't wear armour - too restrictive...

I mean, the only thing that keeps Cath, Canderous and other non-Jedi on pair with Jedi charachers in the group IS their heavy armour ability (and kick-ass long range fighting)

eidospsogos
01-31-2004, 12:55 PM
sigh. i suggest everyone stop stereotyping things into nice neat little categories. if a jedi decided to wear armor, then he could wear armor. whether it was common for them to or not.

it said in-game, that exar kun was rarely seen wiothout a suit of armor and this is true.

and since the first sith lord ever introduced was darth vader, and he was always armored as well, why is this a big surprise. and not to mention that there really are NO armor restricted force powers. this was merely an in-game balancing feature. did anyone see vader having any problems using force powers in armor.

anyway, if for some reason a jedi decided to wear armor, there would be absolutely nothing stopping him from doing so. there are no rules concerning this.

STOP applying in-game logic and reasoning to an already existent Star Wars Universe. Exar kun came around long before this game or any other RPG game rules for Star Wars.

if armor would help common soldiers stand up against jedi, (which outside of the game would be rather ineffective in doing so anyway) why would a jedi not want the extra benefits of having such armor as well. the Star Wars Universe outside this game, is NOT interested in a complete and total balancing of all of its character classes.

Darth Stryke
01-31-2004, 03:54 PM
Many, these guys are gonna flip in episode three when we see a bad jedi using a blue lightsaber and there will be a yellow lightsaber as well as yoda fighting alongside wookiees. Not even to mention Sidious using his lightsaber...

And that is just the stuff that has been confirmed on the official site (I am a hyperspace member) :D

eidospsogos
01-31-2004, 04:09 PM
good, i hope they continue to do away with the stereotypes. exar kun used a bright blue/white lightsaber. very similar to the blue special crystal from yavin.

Jolinar
01-31-2004, 06:22 PM
The armor is pretty good, the only thing I donít like about it (and most the armor in the game) is that pants and the sleeves. They just look odd to me; I think it has something to do with the strips. I call for new pants and sleeves! *cracks whip* Get to it! :D

Anyway I'm a fan of Exar Kun myself although I donít know much about him. Also it does hint that Exar Kun may have used that Guardian of the Force crystal in it's description. Oh one question though, I have seen some conflicting information on Exar Kun. What style of lightsaber did he use?

I have read from two places he used a double bladed blue lightsaber but most of the pictures I have seen have him using ether a single bladed blue or green saber.

Jolinar

Darth Stryke
01-31-2004, 06:29 PM
In fact, Kun had 3 sabres. His first was a single-bladed green lightsabre. Later, he built a single-bladed blue lightsabre, but then he made that into a double-bladed blue sabre. Originally his double-bladed blue sabre was the length of a normal single bladed sabre, but eventually it was made longer, almost like Darth Maul's double-bladed sabre, but just a few inches (approx) shorter.

Muskrat
01-31-2004, 07:13 PM
Thats a bit misleading. he didn't "have 3 lightsabers" but over the course of his life owned 3. I don't know what happened to his first, but the second one he built into his double-bladed one.

Exar Kun, up until Episode 1 came along(and ruined everything), was the only Jedi/Dark Jedi to ever use a double bladed lightsaber.

The lightsaber had a few interesting characteristics. The blade lengths could be adjucted from 1/2 meter to 1 1/2 meters. It's intesity could also be modified. At it's highest setting it was like any other lightsaber, at it's lowest, it was a thin shaft of light that delivered no damage and could not block incomming lightsaber attacks. The use of this was to trick his opponents into over extending their attacks (by suddenly shortening the blade length or lowering it's intesity) and giving him the opportunity for a very deadly counter-attack

An iteresting fact, Ulic Qel-Droma (Qel-Droma's robes anyone?), a former diciple for Exar Kun, actually led the Jedi, and the Republic, to victory againt Exar Kun at his main fortess on Yavin 4. His lightsaber, and many other artifacts, were destroyed.

eidospsogos
01-31-2004, 07:33 PM
just because he was the first notable character to use a double-bladed lighsaber does NOT mean he was the only one to ever use one. in fact it states that he constructed his double-bladed lightsaber as a tribute to sith masters from the past. he was DEFINITLEY NOT the first to use one, and certainly wasn't the last.

it is a little narrow-minded to assume that just because he made it famous he had been the only one to use it. the saber is listed as a rare weapon even among a weapon as rare as a saber to bein with. and it is most readily associated with the sith, which is why exar kun constructed his to begin with. so he was NOT the only person in the SW universe to use a lightstaff.

everything else you said is dead on, and completely accurate. but to assume that just because he was the first notable figure to use one, that he was the ONLY one to use one is flawed logic at its best.

Muskrat
01-31-2004, 07:57 PM
Please give me a name. I assumed that only because I have NEVER, not even in passing, in all the SW books I've read, heard of anyone else using a double-bladed lightsaber. If I'm wrong, I'll gladly accept it.

you do have to admit though, that since episode 1, the double bladed lightsaber has been blown way out of proportion. It's way over used just because it's "cool"

eidospsogos
01-31-2004, 08:24 PM
i will readily agree with you there. it is thrown around quite abit these days.

and though i cannot give you a name, that was my entire point. it was said that exar kun's construction of a lightstaff was in tribute to sith lords of the past. meaning it must have been a weapon used by at least one sith lord prior to his construction of the weapon.

but my point more than anything was that even though the SW universe is fictitious, it is a huge universe. so just because exar kun was the first historically notable figure to use a lightstaff, does not mean some more minor sith or jedi could NOT have used one before he did. it is merely a weapon. a rare one yes. but we have to be open enough here to realize that just because he made the weapon famous doesn't mean he was the first or only one to use it. as star wars.com refers to his wepaon this way:

He brandished a Sith lightsaber with twin blades that increased the potent weapon's lethality.

the idea was this, simply because there is only one person, though now two people, famous for using a weapon, does not mean they were the only ones to ever use it.

Darth Stryke
01-31-2004, 08:46 PM
I would also like to point out that it is amusing that Episode 1 "ruined" the double bladed lightsabre concept when the fact is that Ray Park (Darth Maul) is a martial arts expert and that was one of the most well-done fights in film history as far as staff-weapon combat and the staff-style combat with the double saber in that film was just about perfect. As far as I am concered, because of that, in a pure sabre battle (No force), Darth Maul would destroy Kun. Now with the force, it would obviously be Kun destroying Maul. :D

eidospsogos
01-31-2004, 09:27 PM
i hate to have to keep disagreeing with you, but i have to once again.:) i must seem like a real @ss by now.

exar kun is renowned for being the BEST swordsman the jedi have ever known. the tactics he used in the construction of his lightsaber, were well thought out tactics that added to his already proficient use of the weapon. as far as proficiency with a saber, and tactics and strategies used while wielding one, he was pretty much unsurpassed. muskrat pointed out several of these tactics above, and most important of all of them was the asdjustable blade length feint.

so, i will go as far as to say that were it to come down to hand-to-hand combat, a proficient martial artist could win. but i don't feel one should go as far as to say that because someone is a martial artist they could defeat someone who is a MASTER of their chosen weapon.

the other thing that is important here, is not to confuse the skills of an actor with the actual skill level of the character. the actor may have been a good martial artist, but obviously maul himself was not all that much an expert. as he was defeated by obi-wan kenobi. and while one must give obi-wan respect, he was easily bested by someone similarly focused on swordmanship. dooku was well known for his prowess as a swordsman as well.

eidospsogos
01-31-2004, 09:45 PM
but as far as the original topic is concerned, wasn't someone saying they would host the files? if so, please post a link in this thread. and chances are i will copy it into the first post and give you credit and great thanks for allowing exar kun fans the stats his armor deserved.

Jolinar
01-31-2004, 10:03 PM
Very interesting information about Exar Kun. *cough* New Pants & Sleeves *cough* :D

Jolinar

eidospsogos
01-31-2004, 10:16 PM
yes, i would have to agree with you there. the stripes thing was about the only downside to the armor. though they look better than some of the stripes on some of the other armor.

however, and unfortunately, i have banned myself from skinning as it seems to distract me VERY much from my other graphic design related duties. a little modding here and there doesn't take away from the time or creative energy i need to be putting into other projects. that is why i chose to mod what was my favorite armor overall aesthetically from the game. because i am TOO detail oriented when it comes to these types of things, and i would spend weeks on one skin. so i picked one i liked and gave it good stats. trust me i would like to do skinning, but it's not good for my livelihood. someone else will have to step in there.

Shimaon
02-01-2004, 01:57 AM
alright, sorry, but I seem to be having trouble connecting to my FTP server at the moment... I'll have the file up as soon as I can.

eidospsogos
02-01-2004, 02:25 AM
hey, no need for apologies. as far as i see it you're doing me, and anyone interested in the armor a huge favor. i appreciate the hosting alot. hope everyone enjoys the armor.

Darth Stryke
02-01-2004, 02:41 AM
Alrighty, 2 things. First off, you apparently know a lot more about Exar Kun than I do, so I will just agree with you on that. I was just giving my opinion. Secondly, I am going to see what I can do with reskinning the Kun armor. I was thinking either black pants and sleeves, or perhaps tan or brown. I need opinions on what you all think would be best.

eidospsogos
02-01-2004, 02:52 AM
you are more than entitled to your opinion, whatever it may be. i was simply sharing mine. and maul had one small advantage with his saber: were it to be damaged he could use it as a single saber. as it was two sabers fused together. such was not the case with kun's. his double blades stemmed from a single crystal and power source, unlike the two separate ones that made up maul's saber.

as for skinning, my suggestion for armors would be this. his armor by the time of the war, was pretty much black gray and silver, with occasional green and purple accents. i know it sounds ugly, but in comics it doesn't look that bad. :) (but the purple and green are also the reason i liked the brown/neutral armor better) so, i would focus on using grays, blacks and silver if you wanted the sith exar armor. brown and tan for those who loved the guy, but still like the lightside. :)

and if you actually undertake this project, i would be more than willing to chip in and/or collaborate. :) i know i shouldn't, but it's just becoming too much fun. :)

if you go the sith armor route it might be fairly easy to start with the textures for the cinnagar war suit, or the environmental bastion armor for references, as they have colors similar to what you would be looking for.

Darth Stryke
02-01-2004, 03:31 AM
Alright, for my first version, I simply made the "stripes" black and darkened the pants to dark-brown. It is still shiny and the armor itself retained its color. This is just a quick version to get an idea of how it would look like without the gaudy stripes and more of a "sithlord" feel. I Personally think if I did this, changed the armor color to silver, and added blue accents that it might look nice. But for now the armor is brownish-copper and I just darkened the pants and stripes.

Edit: Alright, here is the correct link. Sorry that the image is a little small.

http://stryke.fotopic.net/photo.php?id=2618621

Shimaon
02-01-2004, 03:46 AM
Alrighty, sorry again for the delay, but heres the file:
Linky (http://www.gknetworks.net/kotor/Exar_sArmor.zip)

eidospsogos
02-01-2004, 05:07 AM
hey, stryke. got something for you. i'll email it to you. pop it in your override folder and load it up. it gives some pretty cool shader effects. and be sure to let me know what you think.

Muskrat
02-01-2004, 05:26 AM
I hate to derg up old(ish) arguments, but, those sith lords fo the past may have used a double bladed lgihtsaber, there is no histpry on that (as far as I know). My assumtion came from this line in my SW Weapons dictionary: "Some unique objects are invariably associated with their owners." First line in the except about Kun's lightsaber. I'm sure the IDEA of a double-bladed lightsaber was readily out there, but no one took the time, or saw the nessesity to construct one. Same thing for Duel sabers. The idea was out theer, but there was never any need to carry around 2 lightsabers.

What are the comics about Exar Kun, I'm very interested in reading them.

Stryke - I doubt Maul (or the actor who played him) woudl win against Kun. he was an excelent tactician (you gotta be to almost wipe out the Republic AND the jedi), and no doubt this played a large role in how he fought. He could be considered one of the the best swordsman in the SW history.

eidospsogos
02-01-2004, 05:59 AM
the comics are as follows:

Tales of the Jedi: Dark Lords of the Sith #1-6


Tales of the Jedi: The Sith War #1-6

the OFFICIAL Star Wars website, www.starwars.com says this:

found at:

http://www.starwars.com/databank/technology/sithlightsaber/?id=eu

As the Jedi had not faced the Sith for centuries, lightsaber dueling had become a lost art.
To focus their training and their skill, Jedi still partake in practice duels and sparring
contests, but to face an actual saber-wielding opponent was not something any Jedi expected
before the Naboo crisis. In the past, the double-ended lightsaber was reserved only for training
purposes.

Unlike the Jedi, who use natural crystals mined from such worlds as Ossus in the Adega system,
the Sith prefer synthetic crystals to generate their lightsaber blades. While the crystals are
being forged in a blazing furnace, it is not uncommon for a Sith to reach out with the Force and
manipulate the process, focusing his hatred for the Jedi to increase the potency of the crystals.

Millennia ago, the Sith Lord Exar Kun fashioned a modified lightsaber with two blades. During the
events of the Great Sith War, Kun modified his existing weapon to increase its lethality. Customized
controls allowed him to extend the length of each blade from half a meter to one-and-a-half meters.

and this:

found at:

http://www.starwars.com/databank/technology/sithlightsaber/

The lightsaber is the weapon of the Jedi, but it is also used by the evil Sith. The deadly Darth Maul
used a double-ended blade as his primary weapon. In his skilled hands, the swinging blade becomes an
arc of destructive energy, capable of cutting anything it comes into contact with. The Sith lightsaber
is basically two lightsabers end-to-end. It can be selectively used with only one end ignited.

so i would think those two definitions make it quite clear that more people than exar kun had used the lightstaff.

but just in case that's not good enough, here's one more:
(from swe.starwarsclub.org History of the Darkside Part 4)

found at:

http://swe.starwarsclub.org/darkjedi/history4.htm

Master and student it used to be and now it was Master of the Light versus Dark Lord of the Sith. The two fought. Exar Kun with his lightsaber and Vodo Siosk-Baas with his wooden staff. Vodo fought with all of the combined might of the Jedi behind him. Exar Kun fought with all of the dark treachery of the Sith on his side. Exar Kun had made some modifications to his lightsaber since the two had last fought some six months ago. Exar Kun had uncovered the dark ways of Sith weaponry. Exar Kun had made a double-bladed lightsaber. Lightstaff versus Jedi staff. Vodo Siosk-Baas, Jedi Master to hundreds of Jedi, teacher to countless Jedi, teacher to Exar Kun, was gone.

i think that all makes it very clear that the technology existed before kun, and that he was not the first nor the last to use it.

Muskrat
02-01-2004, 06:26 AM
i agree the technology was around, and the idea of using it, but no one ever did. in all of those, Kun (and Maul :( )were the only ones to have stated as being users of it (in the last one he uses a wooden staff). No one used it because it wasn't expected to be needed. And it wasn't. Even Kun modified his only after starting the Sith War (i think..), when he had greater need for a deadlier lightsaber. Your first example says this clearly. No one used it as a weapon, but it was used for training.

eidospsogos
02-01-2004, 01:04 PM
oh, come on. read between the lines a little. you should not need to have them spell it out for you to understand what is being said. they stated that Exar Kun had discovered SITH WEAPONRY, in order to modify his saber. which obviously implies that the weapon was once USED by the SITH. how would the thechnology for something exist, without ANYONE EVER using it. It would undoubtedly not be called SITH weaponry had it never been USED by the Sith. things just don't work that way. i am the first to agree that Exar Kun was great. BUT he was not the FIRST user of the light staff. (which the star wars encyclopedia defines as a weapon once USED by the old jedi knights)

so, it is obvious that no matter how illogical the idea that exar kun being the FIRST to use one of these is, that you are bound and determined to completely ignore everything anyone might sate that would prove otherwise. you are deadset that he was the first to use it,(and i understand why, i like exar kun too....) even though he would have never even known how to make it had he not been possessed by a sith ghost that knew how to construct it. he was the first to use it even though the weapon is referred to as a SITH lightsaber. implying it was conceived of, designed, and used by the SITH. and there were many many Sith around long befoire exar kun was invaded by one's spirit. and by this point there were practically no sith left at all. so were it to be referred to as sith weaponry, during a point in time when there practically were NO sith, it fits to reason they used it enough beforehand for people to know that a double-bladed saber was a sith weapon. it's not called the kun-saber, now is it. and if the weapon were USED for practice, i am sure occasionally at least one student decided they liked the weapon enough to continue using it.

and even without every example i gave that positiively denies that kun was the first to use one, just because only two of the users of this weapon were famous enough for people to know they USED the weapon, in NO WAY means some jedi that no one had ever heard of before might have used one as his primary weapon. i mean would you look back at biblical history and state that because david is the only specific person mentioned as using a sling, he was therefore the FIRST and ONLY person to ever use a sling.

and i found the rather flawed history of kun that you cited your unique weapon quote from, and it is wrong in so many aspects it's not funny. first of all exar's saber looked like maul's only in the aspect of it having two blades. nothing else was the same. second, ulic DID NOT lead the republic forces that finally destroyed Kun. when his force powers were stripped away from him by nomi sunruider after he killed his own brother, he was coerced into betraying his master by telling them where his bases of operation were. he then went into exile. by the time he got back to yavin IV the war was long over and kun long dead.

AND the site continually refers to Kun's FALL to the darkside etc etc. never once mentioning that when all this began he has perfectly good intentions and was in no way attempting to becaome a sith or gain power in the darkside. he was possessed by the spirit of a sith, and fought it as often and as hard as he possibly could, only resorting to the darkside as a last resort for saving his life. he never completely gave in and stopped fighting until the yavin IV massassi blood ritual.

so, i understand why it would be easy to believe, and to want to belive that exar kun was the first to use a saber of this sort. but he wasn't.

Darth Exar Kun
02-01-2004, 02:08 PM
for the override to work do i have to start a new game ?

Darth Stryke
02-01-2004, 02:39 PM
If you are talking about the armor properties changing, you must either start a new game or use cheats to spawn a new armor since all armors that existed in your savegame keep their properties.


I check out your reskin-my main issue with it is that the stripes are still there and more obvious than before. :D Other than that, it is just a bit too dull (as you said) I am thinking I might completely redo mine to be based off of blue instead of brown. Not sure though, have to play around with the colors more.

eidospsogos
02-01-2004, 03:45 PM
hey, updated version without the stripes(on the armor if that is the stripe you are referring to).kept the shader effect, and reversed a little of the color washout that had occured. i'm emailing it to you right now. check it out.

Darth Exar Kun
02-01-2004, 04:21 PM
Originally posted by BoL_Stryke
If you are talking about the armor properties changing, you must either start a new game or use cheats to spawn a new armor since all armors that existed in your savegame keep their properties.


I check out your reskin-my main issue with it is that the stripes are still there and more obvious than before. :D Other than that, it is just a bit too dull (as you said) I am thinking I might completely redo mine to be based off of blue instead of brown. Not sure though, have to play around with the colors more. i figured out what i doing wrong when i extracted them they created new folders in my override so i had to it from there to the main Override folder

Hax0redCardz
02-01-2004, 06:11 PM
So... ummm... is Exar Kun supposed to be better than Revan/Malak/Vader/Palpy? Just curious, since I've never read any EU stuff :D

eidospsogos
02-01-2004, 07:12 PM
Well, i will try my best not to ruffle any feathers. but i would say yes. he has pretty much been one of the most powerful Sith lords ever. while Palpatine succeeded in doing what exar kun could not, he was aided by the one master one apprentice ONLY rule, that was NOT in effect at the time of exar kun. (darth bane destroyed all the sith/dark jedi and decreed that from that day forward there would be ONLY one master and ONLY one apprentice. that way the power of the darkside would not be spread so thin.) exar kun nearly succeeded in gaining what the emperor had gained merely through open war. while palpatine used political maneuvering and trickery to achive his goals.

so, i would say yes. though some will disagree with me i am sure.

pmshand86
02-01-2004, 09:54 PM
I may have missed it in the thread but where is this armor available? I mean in the game...

eidospsogos
02-01-2004, 10:15 PM
you can buy it from the czerka store on korriban. it is past the first desk where the rodian sells cassus fett's pistol. but before you get to the cantina area, take a right into a room with another desk. talk to the man at the desk and ask him to show what he has for sale. exar kun's light battle suit is one of the items offered here.

Darth Stryke
02-02-2004, 12:54 AM
I want to offer a SLIGHT disagreement. The one master/one app only rule is strictly for the sith. At the time of palpy, there are still (supposidly) dark jedi floating around. The major thing is that the Dark Jedi could not usurp the sith and there was but 2 sith (kinda like a jedi council in that the sith ruled over the dark jedi) THis is mentioned in many books, for instance Mara Jade began as a dark jedi serving palpy while vader was his apprentice. So there were still dark jedi, but they were under domain of the sith around palpy's time instead of trying to dominate, since Darth Bane forbid that way back when. And by the way, Palpatine is probably the most powerful sith ever. He and only he completely took domain over the Galaxy and decimated the Jedi Order. And George Lucas made up Star Wars and said Palpy was the strongest so, ya, thats pretty much it.

EDIT:

And I also want to add that Palpatine only died because he was betrayed by the chosen one of the prophecy, which stated that When the chosen one kills the dark lord of the sith, the dark lord's apprentice shall fall as well. :D But as we all know, Exar would have chewed up vader and spit him out for breakfast, and Maul would have as well probably defeated vader due to his superior physical prowess. And Don't bring up how maul died, maul won the fight and obi wan got lucky.

Shimaon
02-02-2004, 01:18 AM
Originally posted by BoL_Stryke
I want to offer a SLIGHT disagreement. The one master/one app only rule is strictly for the sith. At the time of palpy, there are still (supposidly) dark jedi floating around. The major thing is that the Dark Jedi could not usurp the sith and there was but 2 sith (kinda like a jedi council in that the sith ruled over the dark jedi) THis is mentioned in many books, for instance Mara Jade began as a dark jedi serving palpy while vader was his apprentice. So there were still dark jedi, but they were under domain of the sith around palpy's time instead of trying to dominate, since Darth Bane forbid that way back when. And by the way, Palpatine is probably the most powerful sith ever. He and only he completely took domain over the Galaxy and decimated the Jedi Order. And George Lucas made up Star Wars and said Palpy was the strongest so, ya, thats pretty much it.

EDIT:

And I also want to add that Palpatine only died because he was betrayed by the chosen one of the prophecy, which stated that When the chosen one kills the dark lord of the sith, the dark lord's apprentice shall fall as well. :D But as we all know, Exar would have chewed up vader and spit him out for breakfast, and Maul would have as well probably defeated vader due to his superior physical prowess. And Don't bring up how maul died, maul won the fight and obi wan got lucky.
WAIT!

Anakin was really the chosen one???
I thought Luke was this entire time!
I've been living a lie!

BTW, can one of ya let me know what the filename of Exar's Armor's Texture?

Thanks

Darth Stryke
02-02-2004, 01:47 AM
Yes, Anakin was the chosen one you will find out the info about the chosen one killing the master and apprentice falling in Episode 3. :D

eidospsogos
02-02-2004, 01:50 AM
there is no luck, there is only the force.

but though one can attempt to rationalize why there are still dark jedi in this time period other than the one master and one apprentice, this is only the case because the star wars universe was constructed in a haphazard patchwork, randomly here and there. and so certain things like there being more than two sith in a certain time era, when there should NOT be, occurs because the era was created before the era in which darth bane's concept of the sith came about. basically i think he came about as an explanation for why there seemed to be alot more jedi than sith, but no one took into account these timelines you discussed when there were more than two. sith and dark jedi became synonomous as the two intermingled. and as the sith spcies died out completely, and all that was left was dark jedi that followed the sith ideal, sith and dark jedi become synonomous terms.

but what i was mainly trying to point out, was that power wise, exar kun nearly succeeded in conquering the entire universe in open war. while palpatine achieved his domination through trickery and deceit. that was all i was attempting to point out, as it shows the difference in the particular strengths of the characters. in a lightsaber duel, kun would win. in the sheer power they commanded that is debatable. but that is also why i was ponting out the different approaches. kun decimated nearly the entire jedi council by himself in an attempt to free his apprentice. palpatine always relied on others to achive his goals.

so, there approaches to conquering the galaxy differed, and though palpatine succeeded and kun did not, this is really due to how they went about their plans, and not who was more pwoerful. i think kun would stomp a hole in just about anyone one on one.

as for the chosen one prophecy, i won't even get into that. if you wan't to call vader the chosen one, fine by me. that's debatable as well. after all qui-gon was renowned for huge flaws in judgement. but you could say he brought the force back into balance, as he cut the jedi numbers down to two as well. :)

Darth Stryke
02-02-2004, 02:42 AM
Alright, 2 quick things. First off, Palpatine conquers the galaxy by open war, but he sets up his war by deceit. You will see this in episode 3 when palpy's war starts as the clone wars end. And trying to compare EU to the films is crazy, so I will not debate any further as to who could beat who. Palpatine is meant to be the most powerful, simply because George Lucas designed it that way. And Vader/Anakin is the chosen one. I gave away some episode 3 spoilers about that, but that will be shown as well. When the chosen one (anakin) kills the dark lord (Sidious/palps), the apprentice (Vader/anakin) falls as well, thus restoring balance to the force. Its confusing and can be annoying to those who didn't think/want anakin to be the one, but he is. I am not here to worry about my opinions anymore, because those are different for everyone-but these are the facts as set by the films, so you cannot change that. And Palpatine will shor his full power in episode 3 as well. He will fight and kill jedi and MAJOR SPOILER, he will kick yoda's butt in a sabre duel and that is why yoda goes to hide because even he cannot contend with palpatine. And nobody helps him fight yoda (this is a rumor of course), palpatine does it himself. Power will be shown in Ep3.

Also, there were more than 2 jedi at the time of the original trilogy. Even Lucas has said that it was impossible for the sith to kill them all. But like yoda and obi wan, that doesnt matter because they were not really doing anything because they didn't want to die.

lord_blodgett
02-02-2004, 12:55 PM
And as a quick technicalaside just to be annoying, ther can be only two SITH, not only two dark jedi.

In the EU there are a lot of dark jedi, not to mention other traditions. The Sith just happen to be one of them. OK the most infamous one, but there are others. For example the Night Sisters. of Dathomir.

Lil' Jawa
02-02-2004, 01:43 PM
I think ep 3 will either be a complete failure with too much "power show-off" or, an excellent end to the prequal series :)
This I do know though; ep 1 sucked pretty much overall cept in the end duel with maul and ep 2 was pretty anticlimax the whole movie thru although that is to be expected from a mid-movie.
Anyone know if Lucas really is going to stay to the claim that there will be no more SW movies or is he already planning sumthin(like one happening 4000 years earlier maybe? :))

Supreme-Lord
02-02-2004, 02:58 PM
Lucas indeed said that he will not make a new movie but i doubt it, because such a big success. I think maybe some 3-4 years after ep3 and he will make a new one :atat:
It can be like what happens after luke died.... :deathstar
Well i hope that. :D

deadevil
02-02-2004, 04:29 PM
hi

does anyone think about made Exar Kun Double-Bladed Lightsaber?

It would be interesting to make an item like this but without bonus like 15000 critical damage or something else.

Just a Double-Bladed Lightsaber a little bit more powerful than the others because of its perfect manufacture.

Darth Stryke
02-02-2004, 04:34 PM
I loved all the star wars films equally, my favorite 2 (tied for first) are Episodes 2 and 6. I HOnestly think Episode 3 will be my all time favorite once it is done. It will have a LOT of action, but by what I have seen and read, it will be on par with the others (Depending on how much you liked each of the others, how good Ep3 is may differ) By the way, Episode 3 will have the LONGEST fight sequence in Cinematic history. This is the final duel between Anakin and Obi Wan and right now it is 12-13 minutes long according to Rick Macallum (Producer) and Nick Gillard (Stunt Coordinator) :D 12 minutes doesn't seem like too much until you actually compare it to the rest of the film-thats is a LONG fight.

Edit: Oh, by the way, LOTS OF rumors have been floating around about him making episodes 7, 8, and 9. Supposidly They have signed a few contracts involving it and when Mark Hamil (Luke Skywalker) asked Lucas if it was true or not, All Lucas would tell him is to wait and see and that if he did make them, Mark Hamil would come back as Luke Skywalker (And Hamil agreed that he would do it way back then the originals were made) So keep your fingers crossed. :D

Hax0redCardz
02-02-2004, 06:45 PM
Originally posted by deadevil
hi

does anyone think about made Exar Kun Double-Bladed Lightsaber?

It would be interesting to make an item like this but without bonus like 15000 critical damage or something else.

Just a Double-Bladed Lightsaber a little bit more powerful than the others because of its perfect manufacture.

I think the Mantle of the Force is supposed to be made from shards of Exar Kun's saber crystal.... at least that's what the description suggests...

Shimaon
02-03-2004, 12:15 AM
Hey, can someone let me know what the filename of Exar's Armor's texture is?

EDIT: nm, I got it

Darth Exar Kun
02-03-2004, 01:05 AM
Originally posted by BoL_Stryke


Edit: Oh, by the way, LOTS OF rumors have been floating around about him making episodes 7, 8, and 9. Supposidly They have signed a few contracts involving it and when Mark Hamil (Luke Skywalker) asked Lucas if it was true or not, All Lucas would tell him is to wait and see and that if he did make them, Mark Hamil would come back as Luke Skywalker (And Hamil agreed that he would do it way back then the originals were made) So keep your fingers crossed. :D if there is a loving and caring god we will not let this happen there is too much EU content after episode 6 or if it does happen it will be like like that episode of South Park where Lucas and Spielberg re-do Raiders of The Lost Arc and the audience is destroyed due to the sheer horribleness of the new version

eidospsogos
02-03-2004, 01:33 AM
as far as 7,8, and 9 are concerned, i read that he had sold away too many rights after the first trilogy, and thus could not make any more sequels due to the amount of history that had already been established.

and how can one say, this is this because lucas said so? Lucas didn't even know what a sith was when he called vader a sith in the first trilogy. it just sounded cool. the history of the sith was an afterhtought following the trilogy, and probably only involved lucas's nod of approval.

Lucas is not God. he cannot say let there be light, and see that it is good. he is human. and most of the star wars universe was NOT constructed by him.

as far as Palpatine is concerned, you could be very right. after all just because no one has seen him fight up until now, does not mean he is not extremely powerful. i just can't really say as i have never seen him fight.

as far as the Sith and Dark Jedi, i was merely stating that at the beggining when those initial jedi fell, and fled, or were driven away. they settled on the sith planet and the two groups intermingled into one, until basically they were one and the same.. it states this in-game if i remember correctly. well, then the sith race pretty much goes into extinction. but what happened before this, you have jedi who learn of sith magic and this leads them to the darkside which leads them to the sith homeworld, which brings the two goups together. so in a way the sith were the original dark jedi, and the original dark jedi were sith. then the race goes extinct. and all that is left of the sith is an ideal, that is followed by what.....dark jedi. so i say once again, the two terms are pretty much synonomous. if you are to be a true dark jedi, in some way you are following the sith ideal. and if all sith are in this day and age are followers of an ideal, then what would that make those who follow that ideal. Technically Sith.

Darth Stryke
02-03-2004, 02:25 AM
I never said Lucas was a God. But Lucas made up Star Wars, he approves the EU and he makes the films which are the ONLY things I take with more than a grain of salt. The EU is filled with too much crap and contradicts itself far too many times for me to buy into it all, so if Lucas says something goes, well he is right in my book since he made up Star Wars and he does in fact own the rights to it all. If he wanted to make 7,8, and 9 he could and nobody would stop him. Now I am not saying EU is total crap, because there are SOME good storylines like Exar Kun and the Sith wars and stuff. But I only consider the films canon, anything else is taken with a grain of salt as I said before. No offense, anyone who buys into the EU **over** the films is NOT a Star Wars fan, they are simply another Sci-Fi fanboy (or girl) who likes a book that may (or may not) be any good or have any relavance to the story it is based on. Now I apologize if I upset anyone, but it does get annoying when people try to take something that the films establish and simply discredit it for the Expanded Universe. The Films are the bottom line, if EU contradicts that, the film is correct-this is not like Lord of the Rings or something based off of a book, Star Wars is first and foremost comprised of the films. Discuss :D

Kitty Kitty
02-03-2004, 04:26 AM
heh...

I've actually got a lot of arguments about this whole topic.. but I've also learned a long time ago that it's not generally worth the effort. Once this sort of debate begins, it pretty much winds up the same..

"well this is the way it is because..."
"well actually no, because so and so said...."

etc.. on and on. I've seen some interviews over the years which directly contradict a lot of what's been said through this little debate.. but considering they were merely bits and pieces which I personally happened to watch at the time, it's not like I can cite perfect references and quotes anymore. Some of this stuff goes back about 20 years after all. ;)

Anyways.. I guess the real point to my posting this is to say that several of you might have to consider the option of agreeing to disagree. Of all the various times I've seen debates exactly like this one pop up, I've never yet seen everyone in agreement in the end, except by simply agreeing to stop arguing. :)

Meh.. just my 2 cents.. or at least, the only 2 I really feel like tossing into this mess right now, as I don't want to get swept up arguing my side of many of the points I've seen. lol

-Kitty

Lil' Jawa
02-03-2004, 10:23 AM
Me I don't think Hamill would play Luke again very well, just look at the bloke he looks horrible like he's really gone down in life since the movies now he's like a little lucas-wannabe(he even changed from his famous pot to lucas beardy-style :D).

Lucas did originally draw it out so Palpatine was to be the most powerful sith, just because Vader managed to do old-man toss with him dosn't make him less so as Vader was *pretty* strong too and caught him by surprise.
Oh and I've heard you'll see Palpy/Sid fighting Yoda in ep3, and Palpy winning(that's why Yoda goes into hiding). Sweet :)

lord_blodgett
02-03-2004, 11:53 AM
Originally posted by Lil' Jawa
Me I don't think Hamill would play Luke again very well, just look at the bloke he looks horrible like he's really gone down in life since the movies now he's like a little lucas-wannabe(he even changed from his famous pot to lucas beardy-style :D).

Lucas did originally draw it out so Palpatine was to be the most powerful sith, just because Vader managed to do old-man toss with him dosn't make him less so as Vader was *pretty* strong too and caught him by surprise.
Oh and I've heard you'll see Palpy/Sid fighting Yoda in ep3, and Palpy winning(that's why Yoda goes into hiding). Sweet :)

Yes, but he's also changed quite abit about the series. Let's see, Grand Moff Tarkin's no longer designed the Death Star. Anakin built C3-PO, etc...

Darth Stryke
02-03-2004, 01:25 PM
I am not arguing to get someone to change their opinion, I simply like debating the ideas behind the whole SW universe. I do not expect anyone to change what the think or know is true. I am just giving my spin.

eidospsogos
02-03-2004, 10:28 PM
i completely agree with you in most of what you said. however, what bothers me about it is this.

Lucas sold the rights to other people. he approved storylines, that may or may not contradict his original plots and intentions. HE allowed these contradictions to be constructed. and did so merely in the interest of money. yes the movies SHOULD always be taken above anything else established. but my problem is that Lucas himself allowed these contradictions to exist.

and in the case of him being able to make 7 8 and 9 if he wanted to, i am notm sure i can agree there. when he sold the rights to the timeline after the first trilogy, he lost the legal rights to EVER contraduict anything established by the authors he sold those rights to. so, he could make 7 8 and 9 ONLY if he made his sequels adhere to the history he sold the rights to.

this isn't a good versus bad plotline issue. this is a legal issue arising from the rights lucas himself sold away.

and how that change of who designed the death star crept in i will never know.

Darth Stryke
02-04-2004, 12:15 AM
Hmm, I never heard that Tarkin was supposed to design the Deathstar. I personally liked that the Geonosian's designed it and a lot of the other Imperial gear as well. And of course the Kaminoans designed the other half was the future Imperial stuff, so it is interesting the way the belnding of those 2 cultures and designs came together to create the Empire. Even though it was an afterthought of Lucas', I think he did it quite well.

juleswindu
02-04-2004, 12:50 AM
Originally posted by eidospsogos
i completely agree with you in most of what you said. however, what bothers me about it is this.

Lucas sold the rights to other people.


Well, that's not exactly true. Lucas didn't sell the rights, he still keeps them. A publisher negotiates a license agreement with Lucasfilm to write some books, but the rights of the story and characters belong to Lucasfilm (even the new ones). The publisher just gets the right to exploit these characters in some books for a limited period of time.

he approved storylines, which may or may not contradict his original plots and intentions.

It's not Lucas who approves the storylines, it's the Production Editor of Lucasfilm Licensing Office (Lucas Licensing, LucasBooks or Lucas-whatever :p) who has the last word. And yes, Lucas owns these companies, but I don't think that he is very involved in this stuff.

As far as I know, he is only consulted when a mayor character is involved (as it was done with 'the Chewie issue' in Vector Prime).

HE allowed these contradictions to be constructed. and did so merely in the interest of money. yes the movies SHOULD always be taken above anything else established. but my problem is that Lucas himself allowed these contradictions to exist.

Certainly, but as you said, the movies are above everything else. The contradictions are allowed 'cause they don't care about them.

From a creator point of view, Lucas don't want to get his hands tied up because some spin-off books or comics. And from a business point of view, the UE is very profitable. So they let the UE be, with all his possible contradictions, and put the films on a higher 'layer'.

[i]and in the case of him being able to make 7 8 and 9 if he wanted to, i am notm sure i can agree there. when he sold the rights to the timeline after the first trilogy, he lost the legal rights to EVER contraduict anything established by the authors he sold those rights to. so, he could make 7 8 and 9 ONLY if he made his sequels adhere to the history he sold the rights to.

this isn't a good versus bad plotline issue. this is a legal issue arising from the rights lucas himself sold away.[/B]

But that's not true. As I said above, Lucas owns ALL the Star Wars stuff (well, Lucasfilm owns it), even the ones created by other people. He owns Exar Kun, Kyp Durron, Mara Jade, Talon Karrde, .... It's not Lucas who sells his stuff, it's the writers who sell their creations to him.

And because all these characters and storylines belong to him, he has all the right to ignore them, or to rewrite them.

PS: If someone is interested in the process of writing a SW book, here (http://www.randomhouse.com/delrey/drindex/22DRINNov.html) is an article where Sue Rostoni, Production Editor of Lucasfilm, explain it (it's almost at the bottom of the page, in the section named 'IN DEPTH'). It's dated in 1994 but I'm sure that the things have not change very much since then.

eidospsogos
02-04-2004, 01:24 AM
hmmm. interesting and nice to know. thanks for clearing all that up. i was unaware it worked that way. especially after all i had read regarding the difficulties he had writing the first three movies to work it in with history constructed by others, and the greater problems dealing with the original plan for the 7, 8 and 9 sequels. maybe he was just trying ti be nice in amking them fit. who knows. but thanks for the info.

lord_blodgett
02-04-2004, 12:11 PM
Originally posted by BoL_Stryke
Hmm, I never heard that Tarkin was supposed to design the Deathstar. I personally liked that the Geonosian's designed it and a lot of the other Imperial gear as well. And of course the Kaminoans designed the other half was the future Imperial stuff, so it is interesting the way the belnding of those 2 cultures and designs came together to create the Empire. Even though it was an afterthought of Lucas', I think he did it quite well.

Oh, I don't have issues with it. I see SW as a work in progress myself. (Unlike some who throw a hairy fit over every little change.) But, I have played the PnP rog for some time now, and the original story line was that Tarkin had a think tank that designed most of the Empires toys. I.e. the Death Star, the AT-AT's, the command (or super) star destroyers.

Besides, if Lucas is willing to let us play in his backyard, I'm cool with it. :D

eidospsogos
02-04-2004, 11:22 PM
well, i don't think a hairy fit should be thrown. you can't take a fictitious universe that seriously. but i do think it best to at least attempt to not establish contradictions within a created history of a universe. obviously with hundreds of different people contributing that cannot be completely avoided. but i think they should try alittle harder than they have been. i mean it could be worse, it could be the marvel comics universe. there is no way to take that universe seriously anymore. but i do not want to see the star wars universe turned into the jumbled up chaotic mess that is the marvel universe. especially if it's for the same reasons the marvel universe got so screwed up. money. "whoops looks like we killed a popular character, better find a way to bring them back whether it makes sense or not." i just think more care should be taken in approval of plotlines that could cast a shadow of doubt on the validity of the curently established history.

lord_blodgett
02-05-2004, 07:29 PM
The problem is I don't think that Lucas ever really planned for it to get this big. There are what? A couple of hundred books, at least a dozen or so comic books and one x-mas special that every one would rather forget. Not to mention Star Wars Droids, all the different computer games and pnp game.

That's a lot to keep track of, not to mention try to keep in as a cohesive whole. Lucas Arts could either be a bunch of total storm troopers and say everything has to be completely approved by them first.

This involves reading everything. Approving everything. Knowing exactly what Lucas himself wants. This would eventually take all of the creativity out of th SW universe. Bleah!

Or doing what they're doing, which is approving things as they go and trying to keep the timeline intact as much as possible. It leads to inconsistanseis (sp?) but allows for a great deal of creativity.

Myself, I prefer the latter option. Sure it means that the history gets revised every time you turn around, but at least authors and game creators are given free reign to create immersive stories. That's why kotor was so good.

Ellderon
02-06-2004, 09:49 AM
Personaly, I didn't like the second moive too much.

In my oppinion, Yoda should be all force, no saber fighting.

I mean, look at him...800 years old, knee high, OLD...
Sure, very wise, his longevity would allow him to master the Force better then anyone.

But seriously...swordfighting? He doesn't have the physical strength for something like that (and he has a shot lightsaber)
There's no way he could block attacks from someone 3 times his size.

I mean, if you gave the Rancor a lightsaber to match his size and sent him to fight Luke or Vader....sure...they could win...but they couldn't BLOCK his swings...

lord_blodgett
02-06-2004, 11:14 AM
Originally posted by Ellderon
Personaly, I didn't like the second moive too much.

In my oppinion, Yoda should be all force, no saber fighting.

I mean, look at him...800 years old, knee high, OLD...
Sure, very wise, his longevity would allow him to master the Force better then anyone.

But seriously...swordfighting? He doesn't have the physical strength for something like that (and he has a shot lightsaber)
There's no way he could block attacks from someone 3 times his size.

I mean, if you gave the Rancor a lightsaber to match his size and sent him to fight Luke or Vader....sure...they could win...but they couldn't BLOCK his swings...

Yeah, it's kind of like having a player say I want to parry the great wyrm red dragon's bite.

DM: Umm, dude, it's like big enough to eat you and your horse without chewing. How are you going to parry it?

Player: With my short sword!

DM: Um ... ok. That fails miserably.

Player: You are so unfair! I'm never playing with you again!

Kitty Kitty
02-06-2004, 11:23 AM
1. Size means nothing... Granted.. the Yoda bit was a bit over the top, but honestly... it makes no difference if you're 400 lbs or 130. It's all in what you know how to do with it. And... we have to bear in mind that these are all beings who command the force. That tends to change the rules in ways that (presumably) we cannot even immagine. It'd be like if you watched first hand as some 120 lb "wimp" beat up the school bully by doing nothing other than pointing at him... The force moves those who understand and wield it in ways that those of us who cannot command it can't even begin to guess at.

Also, Yoda isn't *quite* so old in the prequels.. but that's another ball of wax.. ;)


2... And this will probably meet with a lot of crap.. but I've bitten my tongue too long.

I've seen interviews with Lucas.. at first, he DID try to control every last aspect of the SW universe. If you look back, you'll find that there were very few "add ons" to the EU back then. He HAD to have the final say in everything. Recently, he's relaxed that posture (note.. recently means about the last 15 years give or take...) He's only making himself richer by doing so.

But anyways... the way he told it in the interview I saw was that he had this whole thing planned (within reason).. but was unable to sell the screenplay for EP 1... He instead managed to sell the idea for EP 4, hence the first movie. But as I understand it.. the whole plot was (more or less) laid out and set down. Yes, he's made adaptations and changes as needed, but basically it all stil follows the pattern he laid out 20+ years ago.

Maybe I'm wrong... though if I am, he lied straight to the cameras... and even if that's the case.. he's a damn genius. No one has ever built somehting completely made up into what it's become today. I mean.. you can NOT say the words "Star wars" and have anyone say, "huh?" EVERYONE knows what you're talking about. So who cares if this matches that and if X is perfectly in line with Y.... It's a very cool fantasy universe, and he's rich as hell.. and laughing his way to the bank regardless of whether or not book Z follows the perfect plot or not eh? ;)

-Kitty

*edit - spelling error =p*

Jolinar
02-06-2004, 06:25 PM
Well that was a drawn out and boring read... :D

So how is the retexturing coming along?

Jolinar

Ellderon
02-06-2004, 06:42 PM
Granted that the Force can boost his strenght, but Dooku allso uses the Force. so if let's say it increases their strenghth by a factor of 10, Dooku would still clober Yoda, for he had greater strenghth to begin with...

lord_blodgett: LOL

:D

Shimaon
02-07-2004, 02:03 AM
Originally posted by Ellderon
Granted that the Force can boost his strenght, but Dooku allso uses the Force. so if let's say it increases their strenghth by a factor of 10, Dooku would still clober Yoda, for he had greater strenghth to begin with...

lord_blodgett: LOL

:D
In my opinion, its kinda like this:
Yoda's species, whatever that is, appears only to become "old" within the last 5-10 years of their life, thus, in essence, Yoda was in his prime in Ep 2. Dooku, however, is a relatively old human, thus, their strengths are nearly equal, and Yoda's command with the force helps quite a bit.

Darth Exar Kun
02-09-2004, 12:10 AM
what defines your prime when you live over 900 years?

F-Bomb
02-10-2004, 12:50 AM
^^ Good point Exar.

My thing is that the Force wouldn't increase Dooku's and Yoda's physical skill by an equal amount. Yoda is much more skilled with the Force, thus the Force would increase his strength by a greater factor, correct?

So say Dooku gets a Force factor of 10. Yoda might have a Force factor of 15 or more. Thus, Yoda might be much more powerful, or equally as strong.

lord_blodgett
02-10-2004, 01:01 PM
Originally posted by F-Bomb
^^ Good point Exar.

My thing is that the Force wouldn't increase Dooku's and Yoda's physical skill by an equal amount. Yoda is much more skilled with the Force, thus the Force would increase his strength by a greater factor, correct?

So say Dooku gets a Force factor of 10. Yoda might have a Force factor of 15 or more. Thus, Yoda might be much more powerful, or equally as strong.

"It's not what ya got it's how ya use it."

The Dragonball series deals with this all the time. Yoda could, in theory, use the Force to buff his stats to keep up with a younger, stronger, and let's not forget, faster force user. He definitely would have experience on his side.

Or as the old saying goes "Old and sneaky beats young and brash any day"

Closter
02-10-2004, 07:47 PM
the same would happen when obione would kick anakin ass in the lava.The latter fight in death star do not apply since obione have not intention to live.

Darth Exar Kun
02-10-2004, 08:39 PM
^^it was his intent to loose that fight he didn't actually try he wanted vader to kill him

xphs_shinhwa
02-13-2004, 02:01 AM
hey dudes,

look to argue about exar is pointless unless u hv read all things related to him eg comics/novels/extracts etc.

anything else u want to know eg the 'truth' go ask the star wars personnel for heavens sake.

notes: kun did not decimate the entire jedi council to free ulic, that was the republic grand council; he only killed his master vodo siosk baas.

kun's dual saber was different to the kotor ones; note esp the hilt which is much shorter.

that avatar of eidospsogos, i believe was ulic qel droma not kun, who had long braided hair. that episode was also pretty much on ulic.

exar was notably one of the most powerful dark lords (not merely sith lord if u've read ur stuff). certainly better than anyone else after him. kun was also one of the more calculating types; he did not declare open war on the republic; that was ulic who had to 'prove his manhood'. kun sought greater planning. the debacle at coruscant lowered republic morale. the destruction of the jedi library on ossus was another calculated maneuveur. he lost essentially becos of ulic qel droma.

kun may very well hv been one of the greatest swordsman of that time, but so was ulic 'both were master swordsman'

even if not advented at that time, kun essentially followed the one master, one apprentice rule with him as dark lord n ulic as apprentice as so marked by the apparition of markos ragnos. sith may be dark jedi but dark jedi r not necessarily sith lords. that is common sense to anyone who hv read the star wars universe well enough.

geez....im getting a headache listening to all these comments from underknowledged ppl. pls research properly b4 making groundless statements.