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View Full Version : Should the Wookiees be in SWGB2?


Darth Windu
02-11-2004, 09:41 AM
Hi everyone. Just thinking about civs. As you should know, the list of civs in my template is as such
- Confederacy of Independant Systems
- Galactic Empire
- Galactic Republic
- Hutt Cartel
- Rebel Alliance
- Naboo Coalition
- Trade Federation
- Wookiees
with the Yyuzhan Vong being a bonus civ, only becoming available after completing the single-player campaigns on the hardest difficulty. They would then be available for multi-player and 'Conquer the Galaxy'.

What im wondering, is would you prefer
- Royal Naboo
- Gungans
with the Wookiees as a minor, unplayable civ

or

- Naboo (Royal Naboo + Gungans)
- Wookiees

swphreak
02-11-2004, 10:29 AM
The Naboo and Wookiees have laughable armies (if you're going by "canon"), I'd rather have the Yuuzhan Vong then them.

I never got why Naboo had the best Air (the stats and bonus), when in the movies, they were weak aircrafts.

lukeiamyourdad
02-11-2004, 11:22 PM
Well, their aircrafts weren't weak, just heavily outnumbered and unable to pierce a Droid Control Ship's shields...

I don't know know I'd rther have all of them, Naboo, Gungan and Wookiee.

Darth Windu
02-12-2004, 02:18 AM
Phreak - the YV would be in regardless of the outcome of this poll.

luke - well, that would be good, but im trying to keep it down to 8 civs plus one bonus.

Compa_Mighty
02-12-2004, 04:34 AM
Gungans should be in. As for Naboo and Wookiees I'm not sure.

Darth Windu
02-12-2004, 11:16 AM
Compa - they would be anyway, either as a civ by themselves or as a joint-civ with the Royal Naboo (which i prefer)

DarthMuffin
02-15-2004, 09:48 PM
Why are the wookies so popular anyway? Ok, Chewie is quite charismatic (a modifier of about +5, DnD terms) but he's the only wookie (apart from the senetors in the prequels) we see in the movie. I'd get them out, and keep the gungans.

lukeiamyourdad
02-15-2004, 10:40 PM
It has been confirmed that we will see Kashyyk(spelling?) and a lot of Wookiees in Ep.3 They have the right to remain there.

Admiral Vostok
02-15-2004, 11:08 PM
Well if I had to choose between those two options I'd prefer to have the Naboo and the Gungans as separate and leave the Wookiees out. However, I'd much prefer to have all three (Wookiees, Naboo and Gungans) and drop the Hutt Cartel. I've said it before and I'll say it again, you won't see the Hutt Cartel on a battleground. Their wars are waged in secret through underhanded means, not with two armies lined up on opposite sides of a grassy plain.

Darth Windu
02-16-2004, 12:22 AM
Vostok - and as i've said before, Jabba and his minions play an important part in the SW saga, and i think it's important to have a civ that represents Tatooine and the underworld. As compared to SWGB, this civ would also add more variety, both in terms of gameplay and visuals.

Darth Windu
02-19-2004, 02:53 AM
Okay, if there will be no more voting here, i will declare the result of this poll a voctory for
- Naboo (Royal Naboo + Gungans)
- Wookiees

Admiral Vostok
02-19-2004, 06:07 AM
Why? It's a three-way tie as far as I can see.

Darth Windu
02-19-2004, 09:03 AM
True, but then, as it's my poll, i give myself the deciding vote :)

PS: i meant Victory, not Voctory.

saberhagen
02-19-2004, 05:35 PM
Originally posted by Darth Windu
True, but then, as it's my poll, i give myself the deciding vote :)


So what's the point of having a poll if you're going to decide the result yourself?

Darth Windu
02-20-2004, 06:31 AM
...because it's a tie. If there was a definte result, then that would be it - but there is no definite result.

Admiral Vostok
02-21-2004, 06:15 AM
You are quite an amusing fellow, Darth Windu.

Sithmaster_821
02-26-2004, 10:01 PM
Now the poll is definitely in favor of no wookies. Happy to help.

General Nitro
03-20-2004, 01:40 PM
keeep the wookies.

FroZticles
03-20-2004, 11:39 PM
Is there much point in saying I'm sre Windu has made his decision already.....

Darth Windu
03-20-2004, 11:44 PM
As for now, i've decided to keep the Wookiees. However, if more people come online and vote to have the Wookiees removed, then i will re-visit the decision.

General Nitro
03-20-2004, 11:48 PM
why would you remove them anyways?

Darth Windu
03-21-2004, 12:15 AM
To replace them with a more 'important' civ. Mainly because, at the moment, the Wookiees really arent that important in Galactic matters, and we've only seen Chewy and a few Wookiees senators.

pbguy1211
03-21-2004, 01:08 AM
You guys are all f***ing high.
You talk about removing wookiees due to lack of canon items.
The Vong are ENTIRELY EU! They won't be in the next game! Get over it!

I pardon your ignorance because most of you are too young to realize no one knows who the hell they are, and that they aren't marketable because of that.

Then Windu claims a victory in his poll... when EIGHT people voted! :lol: What a character. I wonder what the name of his little world is. Because it sure as hell isn't this one. I swear I think the kid lives in his room and never goes outside his door. No clue. No grasp of reality.

General Nitro
03-21-2004, 01:20 AM
W-O-O-K-I-E-S!!!!

lukeiamyourdad
03-21-2004, 01:40 AM
LOL! It's wookieEs

Darth Windu
03-21-2004, 06:13 AM
pbguy - i'd suggest that you use some air freshner and some cleaning tools, because that it the biggest pile of manure i've seen here for a while.

I have never suggested that the Wookiees be replaced with the Yuuzhan Vong (is that right?). What i WAS asking was wether the Wookiees should be replaced with another civ that had more screen time than they did, the Mon Calamari would be one candidate. However, as no-one came up with any other alternatives, i have decided to keep the Wookiees.

I'll probably never know how you come to these incorrect, loony ideas about what i say, but i would ask that you actually read and try to understand posts before you respond and make a fool of yourself.

pbguy1211
03-21-2004, 06:46 AM
Originally posted by Darth Windu
I have never suggested that the Wookiees be replaced with the Yuuzhan Vong (is that right?). What i WAS asking was wether the Wookiees should be replaced with another civ that had more screen time than they did, the Mon Calamari would be one candidate. However, as no-one came up with any other alternatives, i have decided to keep the Wookiees.


You have a very strange thought process. It skips a few steps pretty often.

First of all, give up on the Vong. It ain't gonna happen. I will personally buy your next Star Wars RTS if they're in it. You can quote me on that. It will never happen.

Oh yeah... the mon Cal had SOOOOO much more 'screen time.' How many movies were they in? And how many of them were in them? You might want to re-think that theory.

I'll probably never know how you come to these incorrect, loony ideas about what i say, but i would ask that you actually read and try to understand posts before you respond and make a fool of yourself.

You say it, I just laugh at it and make fun of it and point out how you're wrong. Me a fool? Isn't that the pot calling the kettle black... And hey, I like your posts. If for nothing more than a good laugh and to feel very fortunate that I'm not you.

General Nitro
03-21-2004, 02:24 PM
curse the lack of a spell check!

lukeiamyourdad
03-21-2004, 04:37 PM
We only saw a handful of Mon Calamari in one movie while we see Chewie all the time.

Wookiees will be a part of Ep3, it has been confirmed that they'll be in it. They'll get more screen time then the Mon Calamari.

Admiral Vostok
03-21-2004, 08:53 PM
Wookiees already have more screentime than Mon Calamari, I have no idea what Windu is on about.

Episode I: Wookiees - Yes, Mon Calamari - No
Episode II: Wookiees - No, Mon Calamari - No
Episode IV: Wookiees - Yes, Mon Calamari - No
Episode V: Wookiees - Yes, Mon Calamari - No
Episode VI: Wookiees - Yes, Mon Calamari - Yes

Just because there are a number of Mon Calamari in half of Return of the Jedi doesn't make up for the fact that Chewbacca is a main character who features the whole way through three movies.

And going on what pbguy said - I will personally buy everyone on this forum a copy of the next Star Wars RTS if it features the Yuuzhan Vong as a civ, that's how confident I am they won't be there.

lukeiamyourdad
03-21-2004, 09:55 PM
Originally posted by Admiral Vostok
And going on what pbguy said - I will personally buy everyone on this forum a copy of the next Star Wars RTS if it features the Yuuzhan Vong as a civ, that's how confident I am they won't be there.

WOOOO!!! Now, that being said, I'm wishing for a Vong Civ!:p

pbguy1211
03-21-2004, 09:55 PM
Amen Vostok... amen.

FroZticles
03-22-2004, 04:12 AM
Wookiees should stay they have earned the rights to after SWGB.

Darth Windu
03-22-2004, 05:29 AM
pbguy - why oh why do you never listen. I have said twice now on this thread that I NEVER INTENDED TO REPLACE THE WOOKIEES WITH THE VONG - get it through your think skull!

luke - my point is that we see a lof more of the Mon Cal's than we do Wookiees. The grand total so far is about 3 or 4 Wookiees compared to many, many Mon Cal plus their Cruisers. They are a lot more prominant as a race than the Wookiees are, even though we see Chewie more.

FroZticles
03-22-2004, 08:46 AM
Damn Windu can't believe your replacing Wookiees with Vong and you go on about how you don't support EU.

General Nitro
03-22-2004, 01:35 PM
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Darth Windu
I NEVER INTENDED TO REPLACE THE WOOKIEES WITH THE VONG - get it through your think skull!


listening skills froz, listening skills.

Admiral Vostok
03-22-2004, 03:37 PM
They are a lot more prominant as a race than the Wookiees are, even though we see Chewie more.
That is such an incorrect statement. You walk up to your average Joe Nobody and ask him to name a Wookiee, there is a fair chance he will say Chewbacca. Go up to him and ask him to name a Mon Calamari and he might refer you to the squid rings he had for lunch.

Chewbacca is such a popular and prominant character, so much so they felt it necessary to include Wookiee senators in Episode I and the character of Chewbacca in Episode III. Explain how a race whose name isn't even mentioned throughout the entire saga is more prominant than that.

If I need to go to external sources, name a single piece of pop culture that includes the words Mon Calamari. Off the top of my head I'd include The Simpsons, The Bloodhound Gang, South Park, and View Askew movies that have on more than one occaision mentioned Wookiees. The only thing I can remotely think of relating to Mon Calamari is that in the South Park movie, the guy giving the war briefing has a voice similar to Admiral Ackbar, but that's a stretch and any non-Star Wars fan would not get the reference.

So I ask you once again Windu to explain your bizarre logic.

lukeiamyourdad
03-22-2004, 07:48 PM
Yes we saw a few cruisers...yay that sure makes them a better civ for SWGB2 then the Wookiees...

pbguy1211
03-23-2004, 12:32 AM
Yes... we definately shouldn't use them as part of the Rebels for their cruisers... which could work as an air cruiser... Definately their own civ... yeah... definately...

Darth Windu
03-23-2004, 09:01 AM
Vostok - you missed the point i was trying to make. Sure, the Wookiees due to Chewbacca are more prominent BUT we see more of the Mon Calamari civilisation. I'm not suggesting they should be a seperate civ in SWGB2 (i have them as part of the Rebels), just as an example of a possible replacement.

pbguy1211
03-23-2004, 02:57 PM
You must have such an ungodly amount of free time on your hands...

Admiral Vostok
03-23-2004, 07:20 PM
You can't seriously think the Mon Calamari will be a better civ to play than the Wookiees.

Darth Windu
03-24-2004, 07:57 AM
Vostok - no i dont, all i was saying is that they were an example of a POSSIBLE replacement, not that i would replace them with Mon Cal.

FroZticles
03-24-2004, 09:56 AM
Well you bought it up so at some time you must have thought they would be a better replacement.

Darth Windu
03-24-2004, 11:29 AM
ForZ - i'd would love to see you prove it. Kinda like WMD's in Iraq i guess, i never believed that the Mon Cal would be a good replacement for the Wookiees, as i said, i was using them as an example of a possible replacement.

I'm also curious as to your position with the Vong, why is it you want them in the game so badly?

Admiral Vostok
03-24-2004, 07:27 PM
Well I don't think there is any possibility of Mon Calamari replacing Wookiees. If the Wookiees aren't in the game, the Mon Calamari definitely won't be. If the Mon Calamari are in the game, Wookiees had better be too.

General Nitro
03-25-2004, 09:35 PM
keep wookies, but spruce up units. i think the wookie units were a bit weak. buildings made of scrap metal and such. i suggest using wood. not just any wood, but metallic wood. wood with a stainless stellness to it. keep the dinosour mounty though. it was cool.

FroZticles
03-26-2004, 02:22 AM
Wookiee units weak??? What game were you playing?

General Nitro
03-26-2004, 03:32 AM
everything was scrap metal...

FroZticles
03-26-2004, 05:19 AM
It definately wasn't weak scrap metal or not.

Admiral Vostok
03-26-2004, 04:51 PM
Wookiees are the least played civ (I believe) but it isn't because their units are weak. I'm sure Saberhagen and Sithmaster can recite a list of what makes the Wookiees a good/bad civ for SWGB1, but I also believe the fact that most of their units are not from the movies has an impact on how much they are played.

saberhagen
03-26-2004, 05:42 PM
I think it's very hard to account for why some civs aren't popular. Maybe it has something to do with fashion or herd mentality or something. It seems to change over time anyway, eg sometimes confeds have been very popular and other times they haven't. Wooks (can't spell it ;)) certainly have an interesting combination of strengths which you would think people would want - air, heavy weapons and troopers, but maybe people find it harder to play because it doesn't fit the normal pattern of air/jedi or mechs/heavies. I also think they arguably have the least annoying sound effects. But who knows?

BTW nitro, what is metallic wood? And how would it look different from metal???

General Nitro
03-26-2004, 05:52 PM
well, the wookie homeworld (dont feel like trying to spell) has alot of trees right? therefore, they have hardwood...maybe we should just pretend i never said anything in the first place.....

FroZticles
03-26-2004, 11:17 PM
A lot of the noobies start out with your basic mech whoring so thats where the Wookiees are not the best at so they get those first impressions and just don't play them again and move onto an easier civ like the empire. Wookiee troops are the best in SWGB. There air is also one of there benefits. Heavy weapons is what adds that extra fire power. There is a nice art/troop stratergy there is very effective if done right can be impossible to stop. There carbon collecting is the best in late game because of there tech 3 carbon bonus. Lets not forget there beserkers :)

Sithmaster_821
03-26-2004, 11:19 PM
Pre-CC and in DM forever, the Wookiees have been the leaders of the game. Right now, I'd say that they are in the middle somewhere. Anyone who says that Wookiee units are weak has never been at the recieving end of the art/peater combo. Nothing stops it, especilly w/air or aa. And, in case you guys are wondering, people dont give two ****s whether a unit is canon. They only care if its worth building.

I've got an extremely radical idea: lets take the Wookiees out and replace them with NOBODY! *gasps are heard* *Windu faints from the shock* Jesus, I'm tired of people peddling pissant civs that just eat up variety and uniqueness and CPU, and add little to the game. In my ideal world, only the big four should be players, but I have to relent to the enormous pressure to have a Naboo/Gungan cov ncluded. But thats freakin it! You people want a 3d game with good graphics, but at the same time want hordes of unique civs, with tons of units and special features. You want distinct civs, but are suggesting so many that true uniqueness is near impossible. You cant have things both ways.

lukeiamyourdad
03-27-2004, 12:39 AM
Yeah...

True very true...

Which is why I'm down to:

-Rebel Alliance
-Galactic Empire
-Galactic Republic
-Separatists
-Royal Naboo/Gungan

5 isn't impossible to balance.

General Nitro
03-27-2004, 01:33 AM
froz- i like the wookies. the units are just a bit funky looking. and since we dont any wookie units in the movies, everybody would have a different opinion as in what wookie should look like. i wouldve made them look differently. thats all im sayin.

Admiral Vostok
03-27-2004, 01:56 AM
Actually Nitro, much of the Wookiees' look is based on the Star Wars Christmas Special which was shown on TV between the release of A New Hope and The Empire Strikes Back. George Lucas made this reluctantly, but it was still made. Also, much of the Wookiee architecture has been seen in EU, so there's not much point recreating a whole new look for them.

General Nitro
03-27-2004, 02:36 AM
oh yes, the notorious christmas special. in that case, the wookie stuff is alrite. i was under the impression that the creators of SWGB just made it all up as they went. my bad.

Sithmaster_821
03-27-2004, 10:47 PM
Luke, those are the civs that I would recommend.

Admiral Vostok
03-29-2004, 03:39 AM
Yes, as much as I would like the Confederacy and Federation separate and the Naboo and Gungans separate, I don't think this can be done adequately. Five completely unique civs is probably the best we can hope for.

FroZticles
03-29-2004, 09:46 PM
Even five unique sivs is a tall order and it can be hard to balance I guess 50 patches down the track theyll get it.

lukeiamyourdad
03-29-2004, 10:06 PM
If they can balance 4 civ, they can balance 5.

FroZticles
03-30-2004, 12:20 PM
There is only one game that has over 2 civs and isnt all the same set of units. And thats WC3 that I've played that has balanced them perfectly.

Sithmaster_821
03-30-2004, 05:49 PM
What about AoM? C&C? SC? Any number of other RTS's that are balanced and with 3-4 unique civs?

FroZticles
03-31-2004, 02:32 AM
Thats why I said that I've played and I have played a few. In C&C if your referring to generals your mistaken there civs are the worst balanced I have ever seen. Every patch one of them gets the advantage its really sad.

I played SWGB for 3 years online I did not want to leave to another RTS because I know all the egos and smart ass teenagers that are attracted to them. So i dropped RTS for now and moved to SWG where at least most teens have been cut off from since it requires a monthly fee.

Admiral Vostok
03-31-2004, 04:05 AM
Froz, are you saying you aren't a teenager? Because judging by your grammar and sentence structure I had pictured you as such. If you're from a non-English speaking country then I apologise.

The balancing in WarCraft 3 wasn't any better than that in C&C Generals. Both are still fun to play and the imbalance isn't strong enough to make a certain civ unbeatable.

4 unique civs is becoming the new standard. First we had WarCraft 3 with the Humans, Orcs, Undead and Night Elves. Then along comes Age of Mythology: the Titans Expansion with the Greeks, Eqyptians, Norse and Atlanteans. Soon EA Games will release the eagerly anticipated Battle for Middle Earth, with Rohan, Gondor, Isengard and Mordor. The next Star Wars RTS could stick to four civs with just the four major political powers, Empire, Rebellion, Republic and Separatist, but if everyone else is doing four it won't stand out. Five civs seems like a workable number, and allows the inclusion of the Naboo peoples, who I think deserve at combined civ at the very least.

Darth Windu
03-31-2004, 07:48 AM
I say 4 or 6. Republic, Empire, Confed and Rebels need to be in, if you want extra variety the Naboo and TF could be included as well.

saberhagen
03-31-2004, 04:42 PM
LA seem to be heading in the direction of only having the 4 major powers. That's what they've done with Battlefront, so I wouldn't be surprised if they do it with the next SWRTS. They might include the Wooks to tie in with Ep III though.

FroZticles
04-01-2004, 04:17 AM
Vostok I could do perfect spelling and that if I wanted to, but I just could not be bothered and you probably just run yours through microsoft word anyway and do a basic spell check.

And I thought Windu was the most annoying person on the forums but Windu is looking better after every post you make.

Admiral Vostok
04-01-2004, 10:54 PM
Thanks Froz, always a pleasure.

Saberhagen: That's true, but I think after SWGB, it would be hard to cut it down to half the civs, even if those civs are entirely unique with 3D graphics and everything, and especially when everyone else is making four-civ games.

I personally think a Naboo-Gungan civ would be better than a Wookiee civ, because while the rumours do say the Wookiees play a large part in Episode III, I don't think they'll play as big a part as the Naboo/Gungans did in Episode I (and II for that matter).

Sithmaster_821
04-02-2004, 12:07 AM
Jesus Froz, sounds like you have a little pent up anger to deal with...

FroZticles
04-02-2004, 02:36 AM
No when I start throwing out personal insults I get shot down, but Vostok can say whatever he likes and nothing is said....

He has no special stance on these boards I don't care if he has thousands of posts. If he is so worried about my grammar leave the boards. He is tough behind a computer screen in his little trailer but in real life I bet he is a pu**y.

saberhagen
04-02-2004, 04:44 PM
Vostok only throws personal insults at Windu, and only when he deserves them. ;)

lukeiamyourdad
04-02-2004, 11:37 PM
Calm down Froz, he was only making comments on your grammar.

Even I thought you were an angry little teenager;)

joesdomain
04-23-2004, 06:36 AM
I think Wookies should be allowed for wookie homeowrld maps, ewoks for endor maps, gungans for naboo maps, geonosians for geonosis maps, kaminoians for Kamino maps, and then have both sand people and jawas in tatoonie maps.

MasterN64
04-25-2004, 09:42 PM
What next!?

Of course there should be wookies!!! I mean comeon, we will probably see Kashyyk in Ep. III, Chewie was already in the movies and he pwned, and if we didn't, that means getting rid of Chewie, which is one of the best people in the movies!!!

joesdomain
05-03-2004, 12:07 AM
If you can't have a wookie civilization then I suggest maybe adding certain buildings to specific civilizations like Republic and Rebel Alliance that make units other than basic rebel troopers. Maybe for Rebel Alliance have a building make different kinds of wookie troopers, ewoks, bothans, etc.

rolexdude
05-29-2004, 12:19 PM
how about an ewok civ?
(jk)

Compa_Mighty
05-29-2004, 01:00 PM
OK, after a long time on the margin of this discussion, and after reading it all, I have to say a few things.

About the balance, it's clear you need fewer civs. 5 at the most.

However, having the four political powers as "unique" civs wouldn't turn out that good.

Besides being entirely anachronical, it would turn out to be one huge civ divided in four factions. Makes no sense? Think about it.
The Empire is the Republic AND The Confederacy. Yet, the Rebels ARE also The Republic. And wait a minute! Weren't Rebels and the Confederacy fighting against the central power? Add the fact that the Confederacy is almost an illusion, being a branch of the Republic designed by the own Republic to bring itself down?

All four civs are exactly the same. Name it X-Wing Fighter or Tie Fighter, they're different in a merely aesthetic way.

Last but not least, don't you think it's a little silly to get personal fights due to a silly discussion about something, that at least for the time being, isn't happenning?

Take it easy people. We have a good community, let's not tear it apart upon baseless arguements. ;)