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Admiral Vostok
04-05-2004, 07:03 PM
Both WarCraft III and C&C Generals, two of the most successful RTS games released recently feature no buildable water units for water-based combat. Interestingly, both of these game's predecessors (WarCraft II and Red Alert 2) did have buildable water units. Does this mean anything?

Recently there has been much discussion as to whether or not the Naboo/Gungans should be included as a playable civ in SWGB2. I would like to suggest that if they are in fact no longer included as a playable civ that water-based combat be done away with as well. The only water craft we've seen in the entire Star Wars saga have been the Gungan Bongo and the tiny little gondola Anakin and Padme used on Naboo. Neither of these were military vehicles. Admittedly the Clone Wars cartoon features water combat, but on the whole I'd suggest it isn't entirely Star Warsy. If the Naboo and Gungans are not in SWGB2, I see no reason to keep water combat in either.

Thoughts?

lukeiamyourdad
04-05-2004, 10:21 PM
Well we can remove them if we want. The gungan/naboo still have other strengths. I can see how they're not necessary, but on island maps, doesn't it make non-air strong civ stronger?

Admiral Vostok
04-05-2004, 11:30 PM
You mean weaker? Not any weaker than they currently are on asteroid maps.

The SWGB2 I envision is one where every unit has a purpose, not like SWGB1 where things like Gungan and Confederacy Air were too weak to usually bother with. This means that even civs with weak air forces will still have decent enough units to give support to a landing transport.

General Nitro
04-06-2004, 12:35 AM
keep water combat. its cool.

lukeiamyourdad
04-06-2004, 01:15 AM
I personally would like to see water combat but I can't really imagine how it could be developped. In all of our templates we've given such a minor role to navy perhaps in everyone's subconscious we want to get rid of it...

FroZticles
04-06-2004, 01:18 AM
Confederacy air was far from weak, there geonosians could take a worker out with 1 hit and that x5 5 dead workers every second and if he has no aa the game could be over.

I don't care about water combat it is a really boring area of combat. And since the Confed,empire,rebels and republic are the main military here and we have not seen any of there boats.

lukeiamyourdad
04-06-2004, 01:23 AM
The Trade Federation's airforce was by far the weakest.

swphreak
04-06-2004, 02:42 AM
I don't really see a reason for a Navy. Technically, I think they considered the Spaceships the "Navy." You know, the "Imperial Navy." So I could do with out water combat in Star Wars.

And I hated that Clone Wars episode. Where the hell did underwater lasers come from? And that Kit Fisto did some crazy DBZ ****.

As for CnC Generals, In Zero, they had those Battleships, and Carrier that you could call airstrieks and artiller from, but in the end, I don't think I'd like any water combat in Generals/Zero Hour. I'd rather have SWGB2's complete focus on ground, and I guess Air Units.

FroZticles
04-06-2004, 10:38 AM
Of course you want air. Star Wars is based on its huge space battles.

Darth Windu
04-06-2004, 10:52 AM
I honestly dont see the point of Water combat. It's extremely difficult to come up with anything unique without the Gungans, and if you think about the civ's we will be using, what use are water-craft to them when air and ground forces are so much more versitile?

MasterN64
04-06-2004, 02:10 PM
It is true that you don't see too much naval combat in Star Wars, actually, none at all. But think, only on Naboo could you use ships at all. You cant use naval ships on Tatooine, Dagobah (swamps are not big enough bodies of water), Endor (possibly, but its mostly forest), Kamino certainly has enough water, what the water itself would destroy the ships. I make my point. I certainly hope we see some naval combat in Episode III, however. Besides, naval combat is part of war!!! Personally, i think we NEED naval combat.

Admiral Vostok
04-06-2004, 06:01 PM
I was under the impression in SWGB1 that (with the exception of the Geonosian Warrior) the Confederacy's air was the weakest. They had access to fewer upgrades than the Gungans :confused:.

Anyhow I think unless we see some sort of water combat in Episode III or at the very least a military water vessel, that water combat should not be in a future Star Wars RTS.

lukeiamyourdad
04-06-2004, 09:01 PM
It goes this way:

1. Naboo
2. Rebel
3. Republic
4. Wookiees
5. Empire
6. Confederacy
7. Gungans
8. Trade Federation

(Confederacy and Empire could be evenly matched)

The gungan aircrafts could be healed by regular medics. That's what really makes them stronger(at least in the earlier techs).

FroZticles
04-07-2004, 03:21 AM
Empire air is better than Confederacy. Empire aircraft costs 5% less than all the other civs. it goes based on fighters not unique air.

1. Naboo/Rebels (tied)
3. Republic
4. Wookiees
5. Empire
6. Confederacy
7. Gungans
8 Trade Federation

The reason why naboo and rebels are tied cause the naboo have superior nova collecting and excellent fighters.

The Rebel A-wing is the fastest fighter and kills workers and troops faster than any other unit.

lukeiamyourdad
04-08-2004, 03:23 AM
Personally, I would tie the Confederacy and the Empire just because of the Geonisian Warrior and the 5% of the Empire. Oh well...

And I think you're right about the Rebels. They do get a bigger array of aircraft and the deadliest anti-mech weapon(well I really like the Airspeeder).

FroZticles
04-08-2004, 03:27 AM
Your prolly right but I only based mine on the fighters, not the unique units.