PDA

View Full Version : Does anyone remember the good old days?


WD_ToRMeNt
08-05-2004, 10:10 PM
*Points at registration date*

I was a JK player on the zone, back in the days when FF BGJ/Oasis was fun. We had destruction, grip was awsome, force speed and jump were insanely fast and we had power ups and guns that didn't suck. We had seeing+map which added a new dimention to FPSs. It was the fastest and most demanding FPS ever, hands down.

It's saddening to see what has happened to MP in JO/JA, Raven carried nothing from the orginal JK that the hard core players liked into the new game. JK1 MP lasted 5 years, yes FIVE years. I was there for the JO 1.03 and 1.04 patchs, when huge portions of the player base finally gave up on the game after only a few months.

I just bought JA out of bordom. The SP was good, better then JO I think but the MP is crap. *Sigh*

TK-8252
08-05-2004, 10:19 PM
Play Siege, man. You'll get hooked. :)

Or just wait for Star Wars Battlefront... ;)

_PerfectAgent_
08-05-2004, 10:21 PM
I like JA MP.....

Anyway, don't forget about force throw. That was my favorite force power. Minimal force usage, lots of damage, quick use and reuse. Too bad that some mappers get lazy and don't put debris in their maps.

=tom=
08-07-2004, 11:07 AM
general i dont like JKA either
siege was fun for a while , but most servers r to laggy
but oh well i play JA again , but only the Moviebattles mod
it really gives another dimension
when ur a team player u might check here (http://www.moviebattles.com)

*edit*
oh and yes i remember the good old days (also on the zone)
when there was asskicker/narz/narbes/vipraven/luke16 etc etc

Syzerian
08-09-2004, 04:38 AM
Yeah, I play moviebattles because its pretty much the closest thing to the fun of JKI, when the server is full of course ;)

Crow_Nest
08-09-2004, 06:45 AM
JA MP is better than the first JK IMO. You cant even do any cool stuff in JK only force powers. In JO and JA you can do more cool moves and i find it more fun than JK.

Oh and siege pwns! :D

txa1265
08-09-2004, 10:48 AM
Originally posted by WD_ToRMeNt
JK1 MP lasted 5 years, yes FIVE years. I was there for the JO 1.03 and 1.04 patchs, when huge portions of the player base finally gave up on the game after only a few months. JKII & JA are still both top MP games - not at *the* top, but certainly in the top 20. Was JK in the top 20 for MP? I don't remember ... anyway, have we still not resolved the fact that the only thing 'dead' about JKII/JA MP is the brains of the Chicken Littles running around lamenting 'JKII is dead' ... 'JA is dead' ...

Oh well ... JK was a great game - still is. I still have it installed.

Mike

shukrallah
08-09-2004, 05:02 PM
Yeah, I still have it installed too, but by the time I got internet JK2 had been out for almost a year. :-(

Kurgan
08-10-2004, 12:48 AM
Yes I remember the good old days (points to registration date).

The Zone was a hell-hole for most of the time I can remember. Of course back in the REAL OLD DAYS I refused to use it primarily because it was IE only (and Netscape was so much better for so long) and then they had so many problems requiring you to download and install their software every week and stupid sysops that banned you for any little thing then ignored you when you had a real problem or question, etc.

Canyon Oasis was a fun map but people way overplayed it. There were entire clans who refused to play anything else but "FF Oasis" as they called it. And there were plenty of whiners and (real) cheaters in the JK/Mots community.

"Honor" existed, but it was less whiney than it is now. There were no admin mods (thank God!), but the "honor code" sort of made sense back then. After all there were no saber challenges, there wasn't even a real "duel" mode (you still had blasters and there were still healthpacks, bacta, force boosts/surges and shield pickups lying around). So to have a real saber fight you really had to make up SOME rules in order to have one.

JK & MotS didn't have dedicated servers, and they worked on a peer to peer model. This worked well for modem & LAN players back in the day. The decision to force it only on the Zone for most of its life I think hurt the game though. And the decision not to include dedicated servers was made by the higher ups at LucasArts, due to some (stupid) policy of fearing this technology, that it would somehow "let players compromise the Star Wars story" or something (I got this from the XvT post-mortem from Gamasutra, which covered the same ideas basically). Thankfully now LucasArts doesn't apply that same rule anymore!

But, while the online numbers for those games were never as big as some other hyped games, I think it shows some real dedication that so many people continued to play and make mods for the game for so many years. The fact is no game really did what they did from 1998 to mid-2002, so it had that market cornered.

Those were some fun games. I played JK/MotS from the time they came out (Oct 97 & Feb 98 respectively) until JK2 came out. I stopped playing JK2 briefly when the first patch came out, and only played sporadically during the time of 1.04. I really didn't play much after that until JA came out. It wasn't because I didn't like JK2, I just didn't have the time (though in some ways I didn't enjoy JK2 as much as JK/MotS, but in many many ways it was equal to or better than the first game).

Now that 1.01 is out and with mods like OJP and unofficial official enhancements like Asteroids and the Bonus Mappack, I feel that JA really is the "best" game in the series in terms of Multiplayer. That won't change for a long time, since there is so far no sequel announced (the closest thing would be the "Darth Vader game" but that sounds to me like it's going to be along the lines of a console friendly movie-hype game, not a JK style game like we'd expect).

I've run a commercial quality dedicated server for 3+ months and while it's on hiatus now I plan to run one again real soon. It's been a fun ride and I've enjoyed it immensely. There are a lot of jerks and whiners out there, but by not giving them the satisfaction (in game, I know I've ranted about them plenty of times on the forums in the past), I've had more fun and not let them ruin it for me.


PS: JK/MotS are great games. If you get a chance and haven't before, I suggest playing through the Single Player games. You'll find the parts where you don't use sabers much much better than their counterparts in JK2. The puzzles are more forgiving and the storylines are a bit neater. Finding secrets actually has a purpose, etc.

If you can ignore the now primitive graphics, it's really a fun ride.

As for MP, again, if you can experience it with a friend (again, it's a bit tougher without DS and without official bot support... though you can always check out http://rbots.massassi.net for some bots that were created by Raynar and worked on by some other fans for both games.) I highly recommend it. For sheer speed, the game is probably 2x, maybe even 4x faster than JA or JK2. Likewise there are more force powers that can be used simultaneously (in MotS at least). While you can't drive vehicles, there's synched AI mods and people even put together some Coop missions. The mod community was small, but over the course of the 4+ years they really built up an impressive collection of quality stuff to try out, free. Massassi.net is a good place to start, likewise there's some hosted sites right here on JK.net that will bring back memories or give you a sense of what went on during that golden age! ; )

_PerfectAgent_
08-10-2004, 03:05 AM
Originally posted by Kurgan
Canyon Oasis was a fun map but people way overplayed it.
Don't forget about the sheer amount of Canyon Oasis remakes! Too many! Some were just retextured of the same thing, while others were an extended Oasis, one even featured an exention into an upside-down Battleground Jedi!

Battleground Jedi was also another abused map, but much less than Oasis. There was a retextured map of BGJ in black and white! I think the author called it "Battleground Jedi 1938" or something....

Kurgan
08-11-2004, 07:07 AM
Yeah, there were quite a few map makers with zero originality. The Oasis/BGJ remakes were the worst.

Many of those were so horrible, the random textures, the excessive concussion rifle placement, the horrible framerates... argh!!

But, that said, there were a lot of great maps made for the game too. About my biggest complaint with JK/MotS (other than the whole stupid thing with the Zone) were the cheaters, but that waxed and waned in its frustration level for a year or so.

shukrallah
08-11-2004, 12:32 PM
Finding secrets actually has a purpose, etc.

Yeah, when I got JK2 I always wondered what the secrets would do (because in JK you would get another force star) and I was hoping they would implement into JA (since you have something simular to force stars.) Oh well.

And Kurgan, they still make JK maps. I tried once.. before I mapped for JK2, but couldnt get it (I just loaded the program and made a box... I put a big lizard in there though!) :D

For sheer speed, the game is probably 2x, maybe even 4x faster than JA or JK2.

Yeah, the runner speed is like double JK2/JKA speeds. And then you hold down a button and you can run even faster :) Not to mention you could jump higher (just normal jump, not force jump) in JK than JK2/JKA.

I love the levels with traps... like you press a button and thermal detonators come raining down on people. Or you press another button and lightning zap people. I used to hit force speed and run through that to see how far I could make it. Of course.. without internet its not that much fun.

acdcfanbill
08-12-2004, 10:13 AM
what the... holy crap wd torment posted wow.

Wilhuf
08-15-2004, 10:47 AM
Jedi Knight multiplayer lasted seven years (as of this October). You can still find plenty of JK games on Gamespy Arcade.

Many of us remember 'the good old days' starting in Fall '97 when Jedi Knight was published.

Even though the novelty of multiplayer Star Wars may have thinned a bit over the past seven years, the actual gameplay mechanics of Jedi Academy are still excellent. So is the Jedi Academy fun factor.

As a hardcore player of the original Jedi Knight/MotS since the beginning, I find the root of what made Jedi Knight fun is very much alive and well in Jedi Academy. The changes from Jedi Knight to Jedi Outcast and Jedi Academy made a lot of sense. Better game security, better network play, servers, level editing and scripting tools, demorecording, bots, support for vehicles, better weapons and force balance, better tempo, better visuals. Besides, there is no need (except for a few who are stuck in the past :) ) for a facelifted Jedi Knight with the exact same gameplay, especially when the Jedi Knight mod community is still alive.

Obi_Kwiet
08-16-2004, 04:19 PM
I liked the MP in JK. I just couldn't get into JO or JA MP. It's just so boring!

JDKnite188
08-16-2004, 10:12 PM
Yes, I remember the good ole' days. JK was an award winning FPS. The mod community was huge. The expansion pack, MotS, was sweet.

Things have settled down with JO and JA. Graphics have obviously improved (along with all editing aspects and AI), there is an actual saber system, and multiplayer is more secure and developed. The series has no doubt been fun.

I liked JK's SP the best. Big maps, good plot (though JK's basic story themes can only be done once, JA's mission based gameplay was a great idea), high quality.

I liked JO's MP the best. Fast fun (though all the games were fun) and more social for some reason. The competitive community also lasted longer.

Master_Keralys
08-18-2004, 11:37 AM
I loved the original Jedi Knight. In terms of its story and the feel of the levels, it had one of the best SW games nailed - until KotOR came out, but that's a different story entirely.

However, I also love the gameplay dynamics of particularly the SP in JO a lot. JA was fun, but unrealistic in many ways: the whole two lightsabers and double-bladed lightsaber thing was fun for a while, but in the end, it was JO SP saber combat that I found most satisfying.

The MP is fantastic for all three games, but honestly, I think the "good old days" of JK are being beaten out by what some of the creative teams have and are doing with JA: the Asteroids development, the OJP team, etc. In my opinion, the only thing that JO and JA didn't have the JKI did was the sheer size and epic feel of every single level. Other than that, the games are actually better, at least in my mind.

Spider AL
08-18-2004, 12:41 PM
I played JK and MotS in the old old days, on the crap, crap Zone.

Kurgan is correct, the Zone was an awful place, full of meagre script-kiddies invading no-hack games, full of abuse and childishness, full of lowbrow idiots with either zero skill or just enough skill to puff up their already turgid and engorged egos beyond breaking point. (My breaking point, that is.)

Yes, I met some good people on the Zone over the years I played there, no I wouldn't trade my time there for anything as it gave me necessary practice, but on the whole, it's an experience I'd rather forget. Now Wireplay in the UK... that was a wonderful JK experience. Prize money, good sportsmanship, a tournament every week... That was a golden era for Star Wars FPS playing.

As for JO and JA, the only thing that ruined them for me was the realisation that the same whining morons that used to bug me on the Zone were intent on playing the new games as well... and THIS TIME, Raven was going to alter the games to suit THEM.

That's why I don't play JA, not because it's inferior to any other game, it is NOT inferior, but because of the people I'd have to play it with:


Admins so young that they're barely out of nappies,
Admins that ACT as though they're barely out of nappies,
Players who scream "honour" every five seconds when they don't know the meaning of true honour,
People who spend all their time insulting the game but still PLAY IT, especially on MY FAVOURITE SERVERS...
The nine out of ten players that do nothing but vent their spleen after every kill, swearing and name-calling, bitter inferiority complexes both justified and unjustified, whining, screaming and general rubbish.


I love the game, but the people suck. So it's not worth it, for me at least. Enjoyment? Not while they're alive.

Prime
08-18-2004, 01:36 PM
Originally posted by Spider AL
I love the game, but the people suck. So it's not worth it, for me at least. Indeed. I've pretty much stopped playing JA all together, and I have a been a pretty big defender of it in the past. Like you all the fun has been sucked out of it by most of the players I encounter. Every now and then I get the urge to play, but then I am quickly reminded why I stopped in the first place.

I don't get much free time to play games these days, so when I do I really don't want to spend it playing with people that drive me nuts.

Good to see you AL. Long time no see. :)

acdcfanbill
08-18-2004, 02:01 PM
look at teh people coming out of the woodwork to post :) i think there are only a few people who even played during the good ole days. to some that might even be jk2 :s

Prime
08-19-2004, 12:33 PM
Originally posted by acdcfanbill
i think there are only a few people who even played during the good ole days. to some that might even be jk2 :s Only to silly people :)

Cosmos Jack
08-19-2004, 04:58 PM
There are simply to many stupid people playing the JK games to get anything out of it fun. :o

Not much else to say on that.

Good game
Stupid People

TK-8252
08-19-2004, 05:34 PM
Okay... well, basically, I feel that pretty much, the entire Jedi Outcast/Academy communities are pretty much... crap. Back in the ol' JK2 days and early JA days things were better, but everything has changed for the worst. 99% of the servers are Saber Only with restricted Force powers, and ruled by "all-powerful" admins. The game developers coded in blasters, missile launchers, grenades, mines, and Force powers, and it's a shame that 99% of the servers out there waste the great stuff that Raven Software equipped the game with, and instead focus on one thing and one thing alone: lightsaber dueling. No firearms, no Force, just lightsabers. But guess what... lightsaber combat ain't the greatest thing of the game. Just point-and-click like a madman and that usually does the trick.

But the real destruction of the communities has got to be the arrival of admin mods. Giving the so-called "admins" the ability to have "god-like" powers and cheats, completely unfair for the average player. You can have full Force on a No-Force server or a full inventory of weapons and ammo on a Saber-Only server. Don't like the way someone just killed you? You can just slap them around, or kill them at will! Most servers let you have a jetpack and grapple hook which eliminates the need to navigate properly around the arena and often saves any falling person from certain death. Or, just put up your chat bubble and become invulnerable to many kinds of damage and attacks. Where's the skill here?

Gameplay issues aside, having a decent fight online is pretty hard to come by - because of the players. So much of the community is full of foul-mouthed whiners who spout sexual slurs along with the usual "LAMER" that it's almost impossible to attack someone without worrying what they're going to throw a fit about. It's gotten to the point that any fighting outside of private lightsaber duels (make sure you bow over and over if you don't want to have sexual slurs thrown at you) is entirely out of the question.

But don't get me wrong about this - I support servers if they want to set up rules, as long as it doesn't turn into the typical whining and abusing that most servers have. If a server wants to set rules against chat-killing and saber-down killing that's entirely their business and any decent person should understand this. Those people who take it upon themselves to "lame" any server with these rules for the sole purpose of ticking people off and seeing them whine to the admins for help are not helping the situation at all - instead are making it worse, worse because this only makes admin abuse more common, seeing as admins get used to it and players expect that "lamers will be punished."

But overall, the Jedi Outcast/Academy communities really should learn to be tolerant of other people and their wishes on how they want to play, instead of forcing their views upon other people and labeling them with vulgarities and other forms of abuse if they think differently. But, I suppose this is just too much to ask for. I believe that the Jedi Outcast/Academy communities are doomed to be in a constant "civil war" among each other over such silly issues, and this is something that will never end.

Spider AL
08-19-2004, 05:38 PM
I don't get much free time to play games these days, so when I do I really don't want to spend it playing with people that drive me nuts.

Good to see you AL. Long time no see.Likewise Prime, likewise. Maybe the old pro-JO/JA lobby should all get together on a server (Perhaps Kurgan's, if and when) and we can have a decent game for once. Perhaps even regularly.

These things are hard to arrange, however.

Rumor
08-19-2004, 07:39 PM
ltns Al ;)

as for getting a good pug going once in a while, i'm sure some xover guys would be up for it.

txa1265
08-19-2004, 10:01 PM
Originally posted by acdcfanbill
look at teh people coming out of the woodwork to post :) i think there are only a few people who even played during the good ole days. to some that might even be jk2 :s Originally posted by Prime
Only to silly people :) Well, quite frankly, I consider people who refer to JK/MotS as 'back in the day' to be silly ... heck, calling Doom 'the good ole days' seems silly to me ... but then I'm a certified old fart ;)

As for gaming time, I agree - I want to make every hour count ... so I don't even bother with MP anymore ... for *any* game.

Mike

Prime
08-20-2004, 12:22 PM
Originally posted by Spider AL
Maybe the old pro-JO/JA lobby should all get together on a server (Perhaps Kurgan's, if and when) and we can have a decent game for once. Perhaps even regularly. Damn, I'd be so down with that.

Druid Allanon
08-20-2004, 12:53 PM
What TK said hit the nail right on the head. I can't find a good server to play in because majority of them are saber only, force and guns disabled. This is utter bullcrap. Force and guns are part of the game, and idiots are wasting it away. Honestly, what fun is using saber alone? Killing people with a saber is so slow and boring. I want to be able to throw people off pits, and to blast them with a rocket launcher. Saber? I'll use that when I get close enough to the person to finish him off with a swing or two. People just get good at saber, and think they're the elite. They fail to realise that they have to be good at force and guns to be entirely good at the game. What good is a saber if I have guns? Come charging towards me with a lightsaber and I'll just dodge and blast you. Instead of asking 'how do you do that', they WHINE. Nowadays, whenever I kill someone with force or saber, I have to put up with their whinings like 'duel me noob' or 'that takes no skills'.

I didn't even have a chance to experience the good old days... x_x

acdcfanbill
08-20-2004, 03:13 PM
there are still FF Gun pugs about nightly on the refresh servers. i havent played all summer cause im on 56k, but i assume there will still be people there until battlefront comes out.

Mex
08-20-2004, 04:02 PM
A meet up would be great, finally have a proper game. :D

SITH_ShadowCat
08-22-2004, 02:35 AM
Originally posted by Druid Allanon
What TK said hit the nail right on the head. I can't find a good server to play in because majority of them are saber only, force and guns disabled. This is utter bullcrap. Force and guns are part of the game, and idiots are wasting it away. Honestly, what fun is using saber alone? Killing people with a saber is so slow and boring. I want to be able to throw people off pits, and to blast them with a rocket launcher. Saber? I'll use that when I get close enough to the person to finish him off with a swing or two. People just get good at saber, and think they're the elite. They fail to realise that they have to be good at force and guns to be entirely good at the game. What good is a saber if I have guns? Come charging towards me with a lightsaber and I'll just dodge and blast you. Instead of asking 'how do you do that', they WHINE. Nowadays, whenever I kill someone with force or saber, I have to put up with their whinings like 'duel me noob' or 'that takes no skills'.

I didn't even have a chance to experience the good old days... x_x

Isn't that the complete truth. The only thing left decent of JA online is siege mode, even that is questionable. My biggest grip is 90% of servers are running an admin mod, and the problems become apparent. I don't need to repeat what TK and Druid said because they stated it better then I ever could. JO was fun when it first came out and there were no such things as admin mods or any of the problems that are so comman with JA these days.

I played JK for the longest time, probably the single game I played the longest of hours. Everything was straight forward, you wanted to play a mod you really like? No problem, just set up a room and people should join in no time. There was nothing that felt frustrating in JK/MotS, it was all in great fun. JA doesn't give me such a rush as these games did because most fights are saber fights and you waste half your time jumping around holding the attack button in hopes that the opponent has his back turned. RIP JA, for you have been replaced by "JA+" the new kid on the block, and unlike JA, JA+ has a pocket knife, so all the kids think he's cool!

Druid Bremen
08-22-2004, 05:57 AM
Siege is getting stupid now. Everytime I join a game, the teams are balanced 9 to 3, and there is usually at least 2 "lamers" (people who grab the objectives and run away) doing stuff so stupid I feel like running to their house, rip JA from their CPUs and shoving it down their throats. What do I call good Siege? A game where everyone plays fair, where the teams are even, where people are united and follow good tactics, where people don't whine and bi*** about "LAMER! HE LAMED ME!" and "OMGWTFBBQ HAX0RZ!". That's what I call a hell of a good game.

Druid Allanon
08-22-2004, 07:08 AM
In my opinion, JA is, or rather was, better than CS. CS only have guns, whereas in JA, you have guns, saber, and force. It would be fun, except that majority of the servers only allow saber, which makes CS better in comparison. If only the honor noobs will understand that this is JUST A GAME, and NOT A ROLE-PLAYING GAME, then I believe JA would be one of the top games played in the world.

Lathain Valtiel
08-22-2004, 09:58 AM
Originally posted by Druid Bremen
Siege is getting stupid now. Everytime I join a game, the teams are balanced 9 to 3, and there is usually at least 2 "lamers" (people who grab the objectives and run away) doing stuff so stupid I feel like running to their house, rip JA from their CPUs and shoving it down their throats. What do I call good Siege? A game where everyone plays fair, where the teams are even, where people are united and follow good tactics, where people don't whine and bi*** about "LAMER! HE LAMED ME!" and "OMGWTFBBQ HAX0RZ!". That's what I call a hell of a good game.

THIS ladies and gentlemen is why I miss Meatgrinder II Siege. It was very nearly the last thing that kept me solidly hooked to JA. Me and Kurgan took no bull**** like that. You hold something like Korriban staff to hurt the offensive team, you were kicked and banned. You unbalanced the teams unfairly and refused to correct it, you were kicked, and if it was excessive you could very well find the map restarted.

It was awesomeness incarnate.

Amidala from Chop Shop
08-22-2004, 01:42 PM
Originally posted by TK-8252

But don't get me wrong about this - I support servers if they want to set up rules, as long as it doesn't turn into the typical whining and abusing that most servers have. If a server wants to set rules against chat-killing and saber-down killing that's entirely their business and any decent person should understand this. Those people who take it upon themselves to "lame" any server with these rules for the sole purpose of ticking people off and seeing them whine to the admins for help are not helping the situation at all - instead are making it worse, worse because this only makes admin abuse more common, seeing as admins get used to it and players expect that "lamers will be punished."


TK, don't you see that "setting rules" about "chat-killing" and "saber-down killing" inevitably leads to all of the problems you properly decried earlier in your post? It follows like night follows day.

Think about it: if you are going to have these artificial, made-up, contrary-to-the-very-nature-of-the-game "rules", they have to be enforced, and enforced constantly and consistently if they are going to be fair. So who is going to enforce them, and how? It means you have to have one or more "admins" to act as enforcers, constantly patrolling the server, watching the "players" like prison guards watching the prisoners in the exercise yard, and responding to and ajudicating every cry of "so-and-so lamed me". Pretty soon, some of these "admins" look upon being "admin" as their "job" or career (*cough*M.Chrono*cough*) and start taking themselves way too seriously.

And how will they enforce these made-up "rules"? Admin mods of course! People don't like giving out rcon, so they use admin mods, which leads to the popularity of jetpack-grapple-rancor spawning-amabuse noob-magnet mods like JA Plus. Jetpacks and grapples in Siege? Why not, it's "fun". Just don't lame me!

All of this angst, and for what? All of this to prevent what horrible, terrible "crime"? Chat-killing? Saber-down killing? Who cares, what's the big deal? So someone gets one easy point in a videogame, who cares? Most of the people on "honor" servers aren't trying to win anyway, so what difference does it make? And so what if the "lamer" gets the highest score on one insignificant map on one insignificant server in one insignificant game? Who cares! It's just a video game!

There is only one way to avoid all of these problems, as I and others have been shouting to deaf ears for ages: play the game the way it was meant to be played, because adding fake made-up "codes" inevitably leads to stupidity, abuse, and the death of the game. As we are seeing and discussing here.

Amidala from Chop Shop
08-22-2004, 01:52 PM
CTF was the last refuge of fast-action, full-weapon, full Force, no silly made-up "honor" code gaming in Jedi Academy. My CTF server still has 10-22 people 24/7 playing fast and furious CTF, including many "pure" FFA refugees who were disgusted with the no-guns, no-Force, 0 forceregentime, kata-spamming, jetpack and grapple enabled, chatting-and-whining, JA Plus amabuse-enforced "honor" code servers that infest Jedi Academy.

But, as Yoda would say, now "There is another".

I ran a small ForceMod III FFA server and was pleasantly suprised that there are still some FFA players out there who actually want to PLAY, instead of chat, play-act, "saber dool" (rhymes with drool), and whine and nag about "laming". So I am now running a 24-player ForceMod III, all kills are legal but no killtracker spam allowed FFA server.

Thank you Azymn for reviving "real" FFA in Jedi Academy. JA Plus Mod may have suffocated it but ForceMod III is bringing it back to life.

old man
08-22-2004, 07:45 PM
Amidala WHEN ARE YOU GOING TO GET IT ?
jA plus didnt suffocated anything.
people dont play this game because IT SUCKS !
get over it good god. :mad:

shukrallah
08-22-2004, 09:26 PM
I got it! How to save JA:

All we have to do is... wage war. Hear me out:

Maybe 10 people at a time, join a server (with random names)
and lame the crap out of it. The admin and all the players would be so angry. We keep doing it to different servers. We keep using RANDOM names, so no one will know when there server will be "targeted"

The IP ban list will have to be cleared eventually, so... then we keep doing it untill they give up.

They did it to us.. really, Amadala, don't honor n00bs join chopshop and cry when a gunner shots them down. How about when an actual 1337 saber master cuts them down to size? They invade your server don't they? Of course they quickly leave, which is the point of the above plan. They invade all the servers, even normal REAL FFA servers.

Isn't that what happend when JA first came out? They joined the servers and cried because they couldn't play how they wanted. Now they "took over"

Of course they have the help of admin mods. Thats where numbers come into it. We get like... 10 people and the admin (normally theres one or two) will get overwhelmed. While it is possible that they will ban everyone, it will cause a lot of "commotion" in the JKA community. Not to mention, it is fun to join a server and cut everyone up. Lets do exactly that. Lets make all the JA servers a playground for lamers.

So yeah, im being a bit of a n00b myself, and chances are this won't happen, but it would be awesome. Yeah, its kinda sad too, but I don't care :-p :D

txa1265
08-22-2004, 10:02 PM
Originally posted by old man
Amidala WHEN ARE YOU GOING TO GET IT ?
jA plus didnt suffocated anything.
people dont play this game because IT SUCKS !
get over it good god. :mad: ... other than the ~1600 people logged in at any given time on servers that show up on GameSpy. No - it isn't CounterStrike numbers, or one of the WWII clones, but for a sci-fi game that is SP-focused, it is very good. In fact there is NO Sci-Fi based, SP-focused game that has done better in the past several years at having a MP audience than JKII & JA (don't talk about UT series - they have *no* SP mode, just disconnected bot MP play).

Mike

Rad Blackrose
08-22-2004, 11:18 PM
Originally posted by old man
Amidala WHEN ARE YOU GOING TO GET IT ?
jA plus didnt suffocated anything.
people dont play this game because IT SUCKS !
get over it good god. :mad:

When are you going to use proper spelling and grammar? Huh? Or should we just knock you off per Darwin's request?

I'd say something, but I would just rehash the same crap I've been saying for more than a year.

EDIT:

Luke, there's a beautiful thing we like to call a router... That or get a 56k modem. Reconnect to the internet, and bingo. It's like an instant reset button. ;)

old man
08-22-2004, 11:26 PM
When are you going to use proper spelling and grammar? Huh? Or should we just knock you off per Darwin's request?
Go ahead knock me off do me the favor .

I'd say something, but I would just rehash the same crap I've been saying for more than a year.

at least your smart enough to give it up maybe you can help Amidala

Rad Blackrose
08-23-2004, 10:59 AM
Or maybe we can help you proceed to shut up, because unlike your feeble minded brain, Amidala knows the past and the present. So why don't you proceed to pull your head out of your rectum and see what the hell is going on, you half-witted, short-bus-riding, two-bit ninny.

-Zack-
08-23-2004, 11:08 AM
JA sucked for me first, when I played it for a day, the next day it got much better cause my skills started to come back and it was pure fun to kill someone with a cool move.

Siege kinda sucks I think. It's so bland and not fun at all, servers should allow like 32 ppl to play siege cause then it would be fun. But right now it's nah :P

And yeah, the guns suck too I think, part of why I don't play siege too. But if we would have dual blasters and a Calo Nord model... then it would pwn hahaha :D

Oh yeah anyone knows the minimum requirements for SW: Battlefront, I didn't see them on the official page O.o

old man
08-23-2004, 06:32 PM
MY,MY Rad Blackrose
Touchie arent we ?
Amidala dont know squat peeps dont play beacuse it sucks aint no fun.
Thank god for the mods or this game would have died sooner.

txa1265
... other than the ~1600 people logged in at any given time on servers that show up on GameSpy. No - it isn't CounterStrike numbers, or one of the WWII clones, but for a sci-fi game that is SP-focused, it is very good.

Those numbers suck for a online game only HALO pulls in less players.

old man
08-23-2004, 06:53 PM
BTW
txa1265
I just checked http://www.search.hlsw.net/
84,610 playing Half life
1,702 playing JK3
out of the players on JKA only 349 of them are playing without any mod.
1,012 are playing some version of JA+ mod
The rest of the players are playing some of the other mods.
Like I said thank god for the Mods or this game would die sooner .
The mods are the only thing keeping it alive.
Not for long Im sure.

shukrallah
08-23-2004, 07:10 PM
Those mod stats mean nothing!

I can join a JA + server and not even know it. Its not marked on the list or anything. If people were made to download the mod to play JA+ the mod would die fast. Most servers run JA + so of course more people will be on it.

old man
08-23-2004, 07:22 PM
lukeskywalker1 STATS dont lie.
Numbers my boy thats all they are they cant lie.

If people were made to download the mod to play JA+ the mod would die fast.
lukeskywalker1 nobody has to download the mod,the mods keep the game alive.
If not for the mods the game would die.
UMM...... die sooner I mean.

Mono_Giganto
08-23-2004, 08:19 PM
They did it to us.. really, Amadala, don't honor n00bs join chopshop and cry when a gunner shots them down. How about when an actual 1337 saber master cuts them down to size?

Chop Shop's one of my favorite servers; I know exactly what you mean. It's specifically fun to kill a saber-only honor player with the pistol. All they do is run at you swinging their saber, and you're 20 meters away! It's so very funny.

shukrallah
08-23-2004, 09:24 PM
You missed my point old man, I know you don't have to download the game. But I know, no-one joins a server for the JA+ mod. Its just there. I was saying:

[i]Of course the servers running that mod will have the most players because JA+ is on 75% of the servers!

The stats on the mod part don't matter (even if they are true) because I can randomly join any servers, and there a 2/3 chance it will be running JA+. Most people will randomly join a JA+ mod running server so the stats will look like it is a more popular mod!

Druid Allanon
08-24-2004, 06:54 AM
They did it to us.. really, Amadala, don't honor n00bs join chopshop and cry when a gunner shots them down. How about when an actual 1337 saber master cuts them down to size? They invade your server don't they? Of course they quickly leave, which is the point of the above plan. They invade all the servers, even normal REAL FFA servers.

Your plan is fun, but trust me, it won't help. On 99% of the servers out there, there's bound to be 't3h 4dm1n' there having /amsleep, /amslap and /ampunish bound to keys, waiting for a great chance to use all 3 on the 'lamers with no skills'. If we go in and lame, you know what will happen. I'm not saying we shouldn't lame in servers, I always do it too. Because staying on the few no-rules servers isn't enough as hardly anyone goes in there, I go to the honor-infested servers to have some fun. ;) Hearing the whinings never fails to make me laugh.

Prime
08-24-2004, 03:31 PM
Originally posted by Druid Allanon
Because staying on the few no-rules servers isn't enough as hardly anyone goes in there, I go to the honor-infested servers to have some fun. ;) Hearing the whinings never fails to make me laugh. Isn't it sad that that is the only way to gleen any fun out of JA MP?

Lathain Valtiel
08-24-2004, 07:59 PM
The problem is, there is practically nobody with any real skills on those servers... Plus, NF Saber gets boring fast, Duel anyway.

I raped a couple of fools on a NF Saber FFA server, and they thought I was using an aim mod. LOL

shukrallah
08-24-2004, 09:36 PM
Either way, I don't think anyone has made an aim bot for JA.. yet. I know they are out there for Q3.. but oh well.

Those are actually annoying. I remember, the first time I played Q3:

I joined... the map just starts, some guy joins, gets 25 kills in 3 minutes. Map changes... 25 kills in 3 mins. It was insane. The guy left, and... then people were like "I'm glad he is gone now, because he was using an aim bot"

I mean really.. everyone else had like 3 kills (I had none, but I was/am a n00b at q3)

The thing I noticed (now that I think of it) is... THEY DIDN'T COMPLAIN WHILE THE GUY WAS CHEATING! Man, this community sucks... the quake 3 guys held their breath! (I would think of it as a challenge to kill a guy with an aim bot!) But, this JA community will cry if you even get lucky and kill them. Imagine what would happen if you met there kill limit in like 3 minutes... everyone would go insane (even some of the 1337 saber dudes) would go crazy yelling insults at the cheater.

But instead, the Quake 3 community tries to outmatch the guy (even though they fail) they didn't start yelling "GET OFFF THIISS SERVER YOU LAME CHEATER!!!!111" "QUIT USING THATTT AIIAM BOTT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!111 /\/O0wB!"

Prime
08-24-2004, 09:49 PM
Originally posted by lukeskywalker1
Man, this community sucks... And there you have it.

acdcfanbill
08-25-2004, 08:35 AM
lol there are aimbots for jk2/ja but they are pretty useless since disruptor is the only hitscan weapon.

Darth_Misery
08-25-2004, 01:29 PM
Cool thread. Ahh, the MSN Gaming Zone...... the memories....

I spent a lot of time playing JK/MotS on the Zone. Lots and lots of time. Looking back on the whole experience, that was some good fun. Not that it didn't come without it's problems.

My big thing back then was the SBX mod. Does anyone remember that?? Well, once SBX came out, there was no other way to play JK/MotS for me. SBX really drew out the saber fanatics and I got to play against some really excellent players. The buddy system on the Zone was kinda cool. It was great entering the Zone and getting asked to hurry up over to someone's game lobby for a serious smack session. To MotL_Robinton, man....you were a vicious opponent and I'm sad that we only had a few encounters during the Outcast and Academy runs.

The Zone had it's issues. I think at any given time, the JK lobby had 3 admins babysitting. The chat was pretty awful and was a real good representation of what was bad on the internet. I was new to all of this at the time and really was surprised that people would actually talk like that to one another.

I thought that when Outcast came out with dedicated server support that I could leave all the nonsense behind. No such luck. I stuck it out with Outcast because I loved the online saber fighting and couldn't get that experience anywhere else with the level of speed, control and visual goodness that the Quake 3 engine offered.

I thought that the fiasco that Outcast turned into would be remembered somehow when Academy came out. Again, no such luck. It was just the second part in a really sad tale that we can read here in these forums over and over again.

Then, something strange happened. Around Christmas 2003, the power supply on my PC died. Once I got it replaced, I didn't go back.

Do I miss it? Sure, I do. I miss playing the game against really good saberists. But that's a microscopic grain of sand in the ocean of negativity that surrounds the two Quake 3-based Jedi Knight games.

I still play occasionally in direct connect games with friends who own these titles. I dont' think that I'll ever return to the public servers and I'm really skeptical about the future of this series as a viable, long-lasting online multiplayer experience.

It was great while it lasted........

shukrallah
08-25-2004, 05:14 PM
Aye, very good while it lasted. Maybe the next game (which will, most definatly be on another engine) will solve most of the honor problems.

Druid Allanon
08-26-2004, 07:23 AM
Not if Raven includes a feature that slaps you around the map whenever you shout 'LAMERZ' or 'n00bz'. :p

vert1go
08-28-2004, 09:53 PM
Totally agree with what you've said Torment, after playing jk1 for ~4 years, 1998-2002, I find the direction the series has gone with jk2/jka to be hugely disappointing, I really can't believe it's the same series. I played and enjoyed jk1 so much, I even enjoyed the zone (shock horror), because of how almost everyone who played jk1 online used it, and it created a pretty tight community, although most of that community were immature 3 year olds hehe.

When jk2 first came out I talked to only a handful of jk1 players who were even willing to give the game a chance, the rest were so disappointed that they quit straight away. The entire game was a disaster, it was basically a clumsier quake 3 with "magic powers", and while I certainly love quake 3 and play it several hours every day, it was a catastrophe for the jedi knight series to pretty much become a quake 3 mod.

I don't think this series will ever re-live the quality of jk1, especially with Raven developing it (I dread to think what they will do to quake 4). I know I'll personally always keep an eye on this series, jk1 got me in to online gaming and introduced me to people that I still talk to 3 years down the line, but I don't ever expect that there will be another good jk game, as far as online play is concerned and to me that's a real shame, however I can always hope I guess. =)

vert1go
08-28-2004, 10:09 PM
Originally posted by lukeskywalker1
Either way, I don't think anyone has made an aim bot for JA.. yet. I know they are out there for Q3.. but oh well.

Those are actually annoying. I remember, the first time I played Q3:

I joined... the map just starts, some guy joins, gets 25 kills in 3 minutes. Map changes... 25 kills in 3 mins. It was insane. The guy left, and... then people were like "I'm glad he is gone now, because he was using an aim bot"

I mean really.. everyone else had like 3 kills (I had none, but I was/am a n00b at q3)

The thing I noticed (now that I think of it) is... THEY DIDN'T COMPLAIN WHILE THE GUY WAS CHEATING! Man, this community sucks... the quake 3 guys held their breath! (I would think of it as a challenge to kill a guy with an aim bot!) But, this JA community will cry if you even get lucky and kill them. Imagine what would happen if you met there kill limit in like 3 minutes... everyone would go insane (even some of the 1337 saber dudes) would go crazy yelling insults at the cheater.

But instead, the Quake 3 community tries to outmatch the guy (even though they fail) they didn't start yelling "GET OFFF THIISS SERVER YOU LAME CHEATER!!!!111" "QUIT USING THATTT AIIAM BOTT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!111 /\/O0wB!"
Heh I know this'll be off-topic but I'll post it anyway. 25 kills in 3 minutes in a q3 FFA is extremely common, even with a small number of people in the game. If the kill limit was 25 with say 8 people playing on a map like q3dm6 then I wouldn't expect the game to last more than 2 minutes.

Don't get discouraged, quake 3 is an awesome game to get into if you are willing to accept that for your first few weeks you'll get totally dominated. If you persevere you'll improve and possibly improve to the extent that you hit 30%+ LG and 50%+ Rail. Then you'll be the one getting accused of botting. =)

Of course cheats are widely available for q3, but in the last year I've played against only one cheater (wallhack) which I certainly can't complain about because I put in a lot of hours, it's certainly not as bad as CS hehe.

Kurgan
08-31-2004, 02:12 PM
According to those stats Half Life (or some version of it, remember there have been several commercial expansions and mods sold for it over the almost 5 years it's been out) is the top FPS, with more people playing it than many superior and more recent games.

But, that said, RPG's still have all of these games beat. It's hard to find exact statistics, but 2 years ago EverQuest had 500,000 subscribers. And Lineage at the time had ten times that (5 mill!). And something like 200,000 people were playing The Sims (prior to the announced launch of Sims Online) and that's a game with no multiplayer! Then there's battlenet (again, hard to find statistics, but each game, either RTS or RPG probably has at least 10,000 players at a time on average).

Suffice to say, Star Wars games aren't nearly as popular (with the exception of SWG, which I imagine has some incredible numbers at least in the tens of thousands if not as high as EverQuest), but because they are Star Wars (and not throwaway trash like Jedi Power Battles) they have a built-in longevity that most other games don't.

Prime
09-01-2004, 09:03 AM
Originally posted by vert1go
The entire game was a disaster Sorry, I have a hard time believing that JO, especailly SP, was a disaster.

txa1265
09-01-2004, 09:27 AM
Originally posted by Prime
Sorry, I have a hard time believing that JO, especailly SP, was a disaster. JKII rated ~87% scores on average, which puts it pretty close to Doom III. Which seems like a reasonable score. JA was ~80%, which is still a good, solid game.

It is a difficult business creating sequels which innovate yet are still interesting (in the PC based FPS genre, especially), Thief 1/2/3 are all good and worth playing, and each adds something. Deus Ex 2 was utter mediocrity in the face of Deus Ex greatness.

I know I'm gonna get b1tch-slapped for saying this, but hindsight has shown me that JKII obviated the usefulness of JK/MotS. What was my #1 game in early March of 2002 was quickly #3, as JKII became #1 and DF hit #2. JA and KotOR each pushed it further down, as did NWN, BG2, Gothic II, to the point where it is just barely in my top 10, if at all. Sort of the way I played countless hours of Doom 10 years or so ago, but it isn't even in my top 25 at this point. But DF is still in my top5. JK/MotS hang in the top 10 for the story and *despite* the gameplay mechanic.

Mike

Kurgan
09-02-2004, 06:46 PM
I won't let a few people with bad tempers spoil the mood here. Psssst... the JK2 vs JA debate is in another thread!


It's great to see some familiar faces (or rather handles) from the early days and especially the anecdotes from the JK/MotS era.

We really should get together sometime for some old school gaming. Even if it's just a quick one on one.
; )

Druid Allanon
09-02-2004, 10:23 PM
I sincerely hope so, Kurgan. I'd like to get a taste of the good old days.

vert1go
09-03-2004, 05:09 PM
Sorry, I have a hard time believing that JO, especailly SP, was a disaster. It was a disaster for most jk1 players who had waited in anticipation of the game for 2+ years and had hoped it would build upon the unique jk1 gameplay, rather than rehash q3 and create not much more than a high profile q3 mod.

We really should get together sometime for some old school gaming. Even if it's just a quick one on one. Would be great to play jk1 again sometime, been a year or so since I last tried it. If you ever try to set up a game PM me please. =)

Sam Fisher
09-03-2004, 05:37 PM
Yeah, I was just playing JK SP over again (took me 6 hours :P) but I think its one of the best games I've ever played, but the only problem is, is that I've never played it over the net :D

txa1265
09-03-2004, 06:12 PM
Originally posted by vert1go
It was a disaster for most jk1 players who had waited in anticipation of the game for 2+ years and had hoped it would build upon the unique jk1 gameplay, rather than rehash q3 and create not much more than a high profile q3 mod. A disaster? Really?!? A disaster?!?

C'mon - a disaster is thinking that the PC version of Spidey 2 is the same as the console version ... and finding that instead of an excellent ~85% console game you get the lame ~25% PC game.

I don't qualify the ~88% JK2 follow-up to the 92% JK as a 'disaster'.

Of course, I don't claim to be objective - although JK & MotS will always hold a special place for me, I greatly prefer JKII.

Oh well, that is why we all have opinions, and tastes ...

Mike

vert1go
09-04-2004, 08:21 AM
lol ok then. =)