View Full Version : Cantina 6: PTH Part V Revenge (Discussion)

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08-17-2004, 07:45 PM
the discusion thread. yay

08-17-2004, 08:39 PM

08-17-2004, 08:48 PM
Before anything else, a little explanation in case new people join ^_^

"PtH", or, "Postlude to Holocaust", is about a quest to undo the end of the galaxy. It's a spinoff of another RPG;
"Cantina", Part Six (http://www.lucasforums.com/showthread.php?s=&postid=711225#post711225), but you don't have to read that to know what's going on. (Although if you read that and Part Seven onwards, you may get some idea of how this all ends...)

This RPG is very character-, group-, and story-oriented. Thus, it's kind of hard to join sometimes, because the story might be taking place on some planet where no one could just show up off the street. ;) But that's what this thread is for; post here, and you'll be worked in. ^_^


With that out of the way, a subject for everyone.

Admiral and I have done alot of (if not all of) the PtH plotwork for the past few threads, in case no one noticed... ;) The end result, unfortunately, is that everything seems to happen to our characters, while everyone else just reacts.

So, we can plan stuff here. Plots always work better when coordinated with other people. (If you're big on secrets, like me, there's always PMs :p)

There's going to at least ten, probably eleven, chapters to Postlude to Holocaust. Admiral and I have a rough framework for these eleven threads (which I'll post if anyone wants to see it), but it's not entirely filled in, and there's plenty of room to add stuff.

What do you want to happen in the upcoming quests? What do you want to happen to your characters? What do you want to happen to the galaxy?


08-17-2004, 09:03 PM
i'll start on plot thing

I'd like something better then my characters "going away" when I leave for basic training

*glares at admiral*

08-17-2004, 09:16 PM
I can always kill them. and when do you leave?

08-17-2004, 10:33 PM
1 no, unless they can be resurrected w/o cloning :P
2 mid to late November

08-17-2004, 11:01 PM
I have an idea, but need to talk to Red a little more about it.

In rough: The Irvines and possibly others will be captured and seperated. The Irvines will seem to be dead and the group will not look for them. Afterwards one of the Irvines can talk to Drode and be sent back while the other one escapes/freed/rescued.

08-18-2004, 11:05 AM
((i was going to have this in the main thread, but then i noticed it turned out to be less of a brief decription and more of a bio...))

Name: Irvine Palpatine/RH Irvine/Sir-Vin: He is a human in his mid-late twenties, roughly 2 meters tall. He grew out his facal hair, while keeping it well groomed, makes him look a bit more older then his counterpart. He keeps his hair long. He makes solid claim that he is well trained in Jedi arts, in which he shown a fair enough to prove his logic. Not only that he had been training himself to become more Jedi-like in a more mentality state, rather in just phsical stature.
For the meantime he trains Matt, keeping his promise to Svafa, while not exactly made clear on his reasons to do so...

Name Irvine Cracern/WH Irvine: Also human, a clone of an infant Irvine Palpatine, whom had been though dead. He keeps his hair short, in which in attempts to not confuse the rest fo the group. His hair also lacks pigment due to a strange illness when he was young.
Other then that, he pocesses a decent grade of force training, unmastered in meny areas, he makes up for it in the variety of how often he can switch between each skill. He also is able to wield a Force ability that is unique, he able to allow the Force to augment and amplify his phsyical strength, and not just agility.

08-18-2004, 02:10 PM
Just an FYI: superthrawn (remember him? the guy who started this RPG?) is coming back. ^_^

(He didn't say whether he'd finally wake Josine up or make a new character, but either way ^_^)

Scar: (Yeah, I'm using that tag to get people's attention, now) Why not just post a full bio here, and put descriptions (plus the names of your characters that the group knows in the main thread?

In a normal RPG (or something like Cantina) people are scattered round the galaxy and may never even meet. But in something like this, where everyone has known each other for at least eight months, everybody should at least recognize their looks, or will eventually if they join.

Bios, etc, tho, can go in here.

08-18-2004, 03:42 PM
but i was going to make it brief, but i got carried away >.<

oh yeah, i chat w/ superthrawn every now and then on AIM

08-18-2004, 05:16 PM
Erm, just posting to say I'm still in it, and I hadn't noticed a new thread had been made.

Anyway, I'm gonna take some bets: Who bets wildjedi is joining?

08-18-2004, 05:31 PM
Dunno, but I think he ought to. ^_^

'Course, I'm trying to get people to join now, while the group is on a colony world, because in the next place everyone is going, well...let's just say it'll be a tad difficult for new characters to just pop in :D

I'm going to post a version of the PtH plot framework in a while...

08-18-2004, 05:44 PM
Originally posted by Redwing
Dunno, but I think he ought to. ^_^

'Course, I'm trying to get people to join now, while the group is on a colony world, because in the next place everyone is going, well...let's just say it'll be a tad difficult for new characters to just pop in :D

I'm going to post a version of the PtH plot framework in a while...
Work my character in there somewhere important will ya?
*hands RW 100 bucks*

08-18-2004, 06:41 PM
Hey, you don't need to pay me to do that. :p I'm posting it so other people can add their own stuff to it ;)

08-18-2004, 07:57 PM
JM, your character is already with the group so he will have a part to play. You do need to decide on how much he has learned in the eight month time lapse. I will say Matt will eventually need to handle himself against some powerful enemies (something to keep in mind).

The main difficutly is getting others to join the group.

08-18-2004, 08:13 PM
Originally posted by Redwing
Hey, you don't need to pay me to do that. :p I'm posting it so other people can add their own stuff to it ;)
Yeah, but I have no imagination. if you notice most of my stuff is ripped off from other places/people/real life.

08-19-2004, 01:08 AM
Posted in my next couple of posts is the PtH plot framework, such as it is, in outline format. Consider this an immense experiment.

I hope the categories are self-explanatory.

This is for major stuff. If it won't affect other people's plots, you don't need to put it here. Be more detailed than my examples if required (I was lazy.)

If you have a secret, you can always post vague details on what it will involve ;)

Also, this is unofficial. I've filled out stuff for the previous four chapters just to give examples. (by the way, don't kill me if I missed some Themes or Plots, coz I'm sure I did)

For new material, quote my post and add to it. The next person can do the same, and so on. ^_^

For everything you add in the outline, put in parentheses afterwards - i.e. "(" ")" - to indicate who came up with it. [i.e. "I want blah-blah-bah to happen. (Redwing)]

See below...

08-19-2004, 02:05 AM
These are Examples. Here for completeness' sake. Skip this post entirely if you don't care about them.


I. PtH I - [No official title]: Completed

A. Locales
1. Coruscant
2. Freedon VII [Space station]
3. Midgard [Home of the Aesir]

B. Running Themes
1. Adjustment
2. Trust
3. Anger
4. Secrets
5. Fighting Imperials/Shadows/Other enemies

C. Quest

1. The "Time Matrix", described as a silver ball, is a device that can change time itself. Its hiding place was destroyed when the Aesir destroyed the stars. A group is formed to retrieve it. The group obtains a mysterious key and directions to where to start. Prophecy: "To find [the Time Matrix], seek ten keys, seven gates, fire, eye, and ice." (Redwing/Admiral)

2. The first key is given to the group. It is made of crystal, engraved with runes, and has no color. (Redwing)

D. Plots

1. After the Holocaust, the Imperials make an alliance with the remainder of the New Republic, claiming they know how to find the Aesir. The "Imperial Republic" is formed. Everyone who is an enemy of those in power is labelled part of the "Aesirian Alliance" and hunted down. In reality, no one knows what happened to the Aesir after they blew up the stars. (Redwing/Admiral/Deac)

2. A strange man in a coat (calling himself only "T"), who can walk through walls and knows information he was never told, brings some of the group together for an unknown purpose. (Redwing)

3. Syrnl Darkstar, reformed former Dark Jedi under the Empire, leads a revolt against the Imperial Alliance. (Deac)

4. Other-dimensional beings, assassins, and Imperials attack the group. (Everyone)

5. An ancient evil in the form of a wolf, named Fenrir, has escaped his prison and is beginning to ravage the surviving galaxy. In twenty-two years, he will have completed his destruction. That is the deadline for the group to find the Time Matrix. (Admiral)

E. Suggested Titles (Note, this is only here for entertainment value, since it isn't really necessary to retroactively name old chapters)
1. "Beginning" or "The Key" (Redwing)


II. PtH II - [No official title]: Completed

A. Locales
1. Fenrir's Tomb [Space station where Fenrir was formerly imprisoned by the Aesir]
2. Coruscant - Abandoned Buildings
3. Coruscant - Jedi Temple
4. Coruscant - Darkstar Towers
5. Balmora [Desert planet] - Aesir Outpost

B. Running Themes
1. Wisdom
2. Knowledge
3. Cooperation
1. Patience
2. Characters beset by many different enemies

C. Quest

1. The group reaches the first gate in Fenrir's Tomb. They must pass a test of knowledge (through a set of questions), and a test of wisdom (through a room that causes the group to be trapped in an illusory world made up of their own memories and fears, which they much "solve" in different ways to escape). Finally they are faced by an opponent (a mysterious beast) which they must work together to defeat. (Redwing/Admiral)

2. The group obtains the second key. It like the first, except violet in color.

3. The group also obtains an enchanted, ever-changing map to guide them to their next destination(s).

4. The group, following the map, meet a strange figure that offers them a choice. They can take one of two paths next. Either they can take a path of speed, or a longer, more dangerous path. If they take the longer path they can obtain something valuable in the rest of their quest. (Redwing/Admiral)

5. The long path takes them to find the separated pieces of a strange sword that emanates positive ("good") energy. They go to several locations and win several hard fights to get them. (Redwing/Admiral/Deac)

D. Plots

1. A mysterious being (ascended Sith ghost) called the Spectar tries to interfere in the quest. (Scar)

2. When the mysterious beast (Caloslocke) is destroyed by the group the crystal powering it, called the Crystal of Orthaeur, is destroyed with it. The side effect of this seemingly small act is that ancient magical forces, locked away somehow for centuries, are now being unleashed upon the galaxy. (Redwing)

3. A strange being named Sakara, apparently an enemy of "T", tries to align things against the group, create enemies for them, and generally make life difficult without ever directly confronting them. (Redwing/Scar)

4. Mysterious creatures appear from portals and attack the group, apparently attracted to magic forming inside of them (placed there by whatever force is running the quest itself) (Redwing)

5. Sakara goes to the lower planes to ally himself with an ancient enemy of the Aesir named Hel. Hel sends immense dragons to attack the group. (Redwing/Admiral)

6. Halren Flax (Hal) joins the group. (Battledog)

7. RH Irvine (Sir-Vin) joins the group. (Scar)

E. Suggested Titles (Note, this is only here for entertainment value, since it isn't really necessary to retroactively name old chapters)
1. "The Shattered" or "Unleashed" (Redwing)


III. PtH III - "Shadows of the Past": Completed

A. Locales
1. Balmora [Desert planet] - Aesir Outpost
2. Dagon Fel (Ancient Sith world) - Forest
3. Dagon Fel - Sith Temple
4. Dagon Fel - Dwarven Underground City

B. Running Themes
1. Infighting amongst characters (the most runningest theme of them all ;))
2. Mercy

C. Quest
1. The group reaches the second gate in an underground city inhabited by ancient dwarves. They pass through a Sith temple to get there. (Admiral)

2. The group obtains the third key. [I never specified, but it was probably red in color. This can be changed if that color is more appropriate for later use] The group also obtains a new map.

D. Plots
1. Ancient, evil enemies of the Aesir are gathering an army of Sith for an unknown purpose. The Sith were killed long ago, and have been resurrected. (Admiral)

2. Misae (Jedi character) hears a Sith's voice in her head that urges her to join them. (Redwing)

3. Elella, Orthos' sister, is introduced. (Deac)

4. Guy has strange visions of man and a "demon" making a bargain. (Redwing)

5. Guy finds out that the group is being secretly followed by unknown strangers. (Redwing)


IV. PtH IV - "Dark Surprises": Completed

A. Locales
1. Enoy [Mining world] - Crystal Mines
2. Enoy - Forests/Hills/Town [we really tore that place apart]

B. Running Themes
1. Trust
2. Trickery
3. Infighting
4. Surprises (especially nasty ones...or dark ones, obviously)
5. Dark/Evil vs. Light/Good

C. Quest
1. The group reaches the third gate in the inner depths of a mine, in shafts full of magical crystals. (Redwing)

2. The group obtains the fourth key. It is black in color. The group also obtains a new map.

3. Just after obtaining the key and map, mind-altering crystals start to affect those of the group unlucky enough to touch them (Marin, Aidan and Heimdall). They turn on their friends, nearly bury them in a cave-in, and leave to cause destruction and chaos. The map does not give a new direction for the remainder of the group.

D. Plots
1. A great darkness eclipses all light from all the suns/stars in the galaxy as the quest begins. The darkness stays there till the end of the quest. (Admiral)

2. Gerd, a mysterious girl, arrives in an escape pod out of nowhere. The Aesir take her in. (Admiral)

3. Heimdall, Aidan and Marin gleefully slaughter innocents after being changed by crystals. Finally, the sword from the previous quest restores the three to their normal states of mind, but not before the trio toys with the group enough to cause it to start coming apart at the seams. (Redwing/Admiral/Battledog)

4. Matt is introduced. (jokemaster)

5. Gortick, Orthos' brother, is introduced. (Deac)

6. As the group prepares to leave, three strangers attack the group. These strangers have technology (magic) the likes of which most of them have never seen before. One is Guy's sister. Several of the group are seriously injured, and are clearly outmatched. However, everyone manages to escape once they try to retreat, leaving before the strangers' allies arrive. [The strangers are the ones Guy detected following the group last chapter.] (Redwing)


Okay, now my next post will have the current stuff, that actually matters. ;)

08-19-2004, 02:11 AM
First, the present:


V. PtH V - "Revenge" :

A. Locales/Locale Suggestions

1. Yevoh [Poor colony]
1. Midgard: Vidgard
3. Midgard: Lieskirnir
4. Midgard: Yggdrasil
5. Midgard: Vigrid

B. Themes/Theme Suggestions

1. Revenge (an obvious one)
2. Courage, Honor and Valor (see Plot)
3. Doing one's duty (following orders)
4. Loss
5. Hate
6. Choice and loyalty (see Plot)

C. Quest /Quest Ideas

1. The fourth gate will be reached, and the fifth key obtained. It will probably be dark green in color. (Redwing/Admiral)

2. The fifth key is in enemy territory, and the group will have to cross a no mans land. (Admiral)

3. The Eye of Odin [an artifact to be used later in the quest (Redwing)] will be entrusted to an innocent. (Admiral)

D. Plot/Plot Ideas

1. The group is lead to Midgard by the map. Midgard is undersiege and the Aesir are being pushed back. (Admiral)

2. The gate is within occupied territory. The group will have to move quickly and try to keep undetected. (Admiral)

3. After the fifth key is reached and the group leave the castle Heimdall and any who choose to go with him head towards Yggdrasil to retrieve a horn. (Admiral)

4. When the group arrives at Vidgard they are given a choice, they can stand with the Aesir and fight in a huge battle or they can stay in Vidgard until the fight is over. (Admiral)

5. The Horn retrieved by Heimdall is blown calling all the Aesir to the battlefield of Vigrid to fight a Gentlemen's war. (Admiral)

6. Something may happen involving Misae and Guy, furthering their plots from earlier chapters. (Redwing)

7. The group who attacked our characters earlier will probably make another appearance. (Redwing)


And finally, the future.


VI. Later PtH Chapters (6 through 11)

A. Locale Suggestions

1. PtH VI (Six) will probably take place in an alternate dimension, in a world of magic, not the Force; with an alternate Earth possibly being a visited locale. (Redwing)

B. Theme Suggestions

1. PtH VIII (Eight) will have a Fire theme. (Redwing)
2. PtH IX (Nine) will have an Eye/Wisdom theme. (Redwing)
3. PtH X (Ten) will have an Ice theme. (Redwing)

C. Quest Ideas

1. Note that in the end, a stranger named Ken'atra Sorack Darkstar ends up with the Time Matrix. This either means that in the end, the group fails to get the Time Matrix, or gets the Time Matrix and does not use it, or are stopped from using it. The group is being prepared for another fate, possibly, under the guise of having them obtain the Time Matrix. Details are up in the air, but remember that someone else must end up with the Time Matrix when all is said and done. (Redwing/Admiral/Everyone who posted in Cantina 7 ;))

2. The fifth, sixth, and seventh gates will be reached in PtH VI, VII, and VIII (6, 7, and 8) respectively. (Redwing)

3. The sixth, seventh, eighth, ninth, and tenth keys will be obtained, one per chapter except for the possible 11th chapter (for the finale). (Redwing)

4. The eighth key will probably be orange (for fire). The ninth key will probably be blue (the color of the Eye of Odin). The tenth key will probably be white (for ice). [Keys 6 and 7 might be Rose/Pink and Yellow/Gold. Or one can be orange, and the Fire key can be yellow instead] (Redwing)


D. Plot Ideas

1. Possibly introduced: Acompletely non-humanoid group of Jedi, which encompasses most or all remaining Jedi in the galaxy. All human Jedi except the ones in the group have been killed by . This is partly to remedy the fact that everyone in the group is human or a non-SW alien :p (Redwing)

2. Possibly Introduced: (In PtH VI/6) Some characters from the magic world that will probably end up joining the group. (Redwing)


E. Title Suggestions

1. PtH XI (11) might be called "Eleventh Hour". [Kudos to anyone who gets the reference...] (Redwing)



Comments? Got a better idea, or do you like these funny outlines? :p

(I'm wondering if we ought to do color-coding, to more easily figure out whose plot is whose...but anyway ^^;;[i])

Edit: Also, if you're too lazy to quote this and add to it, just post your stuff in this thread and I'll update it myself. ;)

08-19-2004, 11:46 AM
Well if the group will be hitting the 'new' dimension in the next episode, then that *could* be a way for the 'twins' to be separated from the group, like in the end of pth 5

they could just be left behind

and if its all going to be on earth, then i think maybe those two are left on the asgardried, in which for some reason (which ever it maybe that the group travels through), the ship cant travel likewise

08-19-2004, 02:27 PM
The problem being Scar, you will probably be gone in the midst of the current thread..

The last thread lasted for essentially 6 months. Since after basic you will most likely want to rejoin the RPG we need a way for your character(s) to easily rejoin. Having them in seperate dimensions makes that a little difficult.

I also see this as a perfect time for WH Irvine to meet with Drode and be sent back in time.

My plan for getting your characters inactive: A couple of days/weeks before you go to basic.

1. Irvines and perhaps some other characters will be captured and seperated from one another. The Sith and Jotuns will essentially make it appear like they are dead.

2. The group thinking they are dead does not look for them. When you return from Basic, the Irvines can escape and find the group again.

However, I would rather have only RH Irvine escape and return while WH IRvine is taken back in time/trained (whatever needs to happen to get him ready for his C7 appearance).

This way Scar you can easily rejoin the RPG.
I haven't decided if the Asgardried will go through to the new dimension or not, since we haven't talked about the cross over yet.

One thing though the ship is going to get more residents by the end of PTH. So the Irvines would not be left alone in that idea.

08-19-2004, 07:33 PM
again, can you work me in there somewhere important...thanks to my lack of imagination?

08-19-2004, 07:38 PM
don't worry about that.

Just keep in mind this is still mainly in the introductory stage. Nothing important has happened yet. That is for the near future.

08-23-2004, 04:13 PM
What's this? Trying to start without me!?



08-23-2004, 04:26 PM
no, just getting the first posts out of the way and waiting for others to post (looks at Superthrawn, Wildjedi and BD).

08-26-2004, 11:17 PM
Discussion from main thread:

Originally posted by Redwing
((OOS: JM, Matt has seen Marin shapeshift. ;) Remember, she was posing as Raschel for a large part of last chapter.

Will post in a bit. Looks like I need a deus ex machina for superthrawn's mouse. ;)))

Originally posted by Scar Da Kookee
((OR allow that character to use the shapeshifting cube to undo himself

or if thats what your talkinga bout (cus well i dont play deus ex))

Scar: Um...the morphing cube can't change someone's natural form. Also it only allows shapeshifting for two hours at a time (yes I ripped this off of Animorphs, for anyone who's read that series ;)

Since NO ONE seems to know what a deus ex machina is, here's the Webster's Dictionary definition:

de·us ex ma·chi·na
Pronunciation: 'dA-&s-"eks-'mä-ki-n&, -'ma-, -"nä; -m&-'shE-n&
Function: noun
Etymology: New Latin, a god from a machine, translation of Greek theos ek mEchanEs
1 : a god introduced by means of a crane in ancient Greek and Roman drama to decide the final outcome
2 : a person or thing (as in fiction or drama) that appears or is introduced suddenly and unexpectedly and provides a contrived solution to an apparently insoluble difficulty

(And let's try and keep discussion in the discussion thread. ;))

08-26-2004, 11:27 PM
Doesn't staying in different form for more than 2 hours in animorphs result in your being in that from permanentely?

EDIT: And there's a difference between switching to another humanoid form and changing to a giant bird.

08-27-2004, 08:44 AM
I knew what Deus Ex Machina meant. Did none of you play the games of the same name?????

08-27-2004, 09:03 AM
Originally posted by jokemaster
Doesn't staying in different form for more than 2 hours in animorphs result in your being in that from permanentely?

EDIT: And there's a difference between switching to another humanoid form and changing to a giant bird.

1. Yup, and it's the same thing for this RPG. ^_^

2. Uh...good point. :D (Me forgetting there are already natural shapeshifters in SW, like Zam Wessel...)

Deac: No, but Scar has, and apparently never understood the title. :D

08-27-2004, 11:21 AM
I blame it souly on the education system :P

08-27-2004, 01:25 PM
I haven't played the game cause I can't find it, but I knew what Deus Ex Machina is. Like guy trapped in a crashing plane tries to level it out then suddenly 'miraculously' finds a parachute under the seat.

09-11-2004, 02:34 PM
Ok there has been some questions about the layout of the Asgardried. So here is a description of the ship:

The Asgardried is a very large ship. The design of the ship is similar to that of other Aesirian ships. In other words it is shaped to resmeble western/european dragons (not Easter/oriental ones). The ship is propelled by four Mark II Dagur engines. Weapons emplacements are concealed so that when the ship is not fighting it appears to have no weapons. The ship has just three levels, much of the space is devoted towards weaponry, power, etc. The ship also has quantum armor, a cloacking device, and normal shields. Cortosis is also weaved throughout the entire ship making it resilent to lightsabers.


1st level: Essentially the maintence level. Access: Restricted.

The first level of the asgardried is devoted to critical systems. Towards the aft of the ship the engine room is located. there contains the fusion reactor that powers the ship, the hypdrive generator, and slipstream drive.

Shield generators are also found on this level. Entrances include an exterior access hatch, and turbolifts. A large part of the 1st level is for storage of various supplies.


2nd Level: The living level: Access: More or less unrestricted.

The second level of the ship is where the group has access to.

Crew quarters: These rooms are the ones assigned to the group. They are comfortable if a little small. They are furnished with a single bed placed in an alcove above and below the bed are cabinets allowing for the storage of personal effect. A cabinet next to the bed allows for the storage of clothing/armor ect. The rooms also contain a desk with draws with a chair. The desk has a computer terminal that allows the group to access the holonet (or what is left of it). No messages can be sent though. There is basically a reading light above the bed.

Every two quarters share a refresher, which under current circumstances means the majority of the group have private refreshers. (With the exception of Sir Vin, WH Irvine sharing one. Gortick and Orthos sharing another).

The Lounge: This is the common room of the ship. It has a couple of large round tables with marble centers. The tables have cletic traids engraved into them. Benches provide seating. Also serves as the mess hall. Has monitors that can connect to the holonet, play holodramas. Futhermore, the lounge servers as a briefing room, fully equiped with holoprojectors and all the other necessary items. When it is being used as a briefing room the tables retract into the floor benches turn around to face a podium that is raised up and next to the podium is the holoprojectors.

Main Cargo hold This large cargo hold is spare in decoration and houses Guy's ship. Located in the aft of the ship. There are some large closets for storage of items that need to be secrued.

There is a large cargo lift to the first level here to take things into long term storage. From the main cargo hold is a secondary one and past that is the a very large bulkhead and then the engines.

Kitchen Relatively small, contains a refrigertor, oven, stove etc. It also has a couple of taps that lead to mead. The kitchen is manned by droids who also restock it.

Bridge The bridge has five stations: Pilot, Copilot, Navigation, and communications, as well as a weapons control. There are an additional two chairs for passangers.

Staterooms: Larger then the crew quarters and more elborately decorated. They have private refreshers, more storage then the crew quarters as well as two large comforatalbe chairs and a small table. The Aesir all have staterooms.


The bridge is at the bow slightly raised (have to go up a ramp equal to about half a flight of stairs. The main entrance is located at the bow of the ship, below and to the right of the bridge. you have to walk down a ramp (again about half a flight of stairs) to reach the entrance. There are two corridors that run parallel to each other and seperate the brige from the entrance (aka you have to walk a little before getting to the entrance). Both corridors bring you to the lounge, the right side fo the lounge houses the kitchen. After the lounge there is a single corridor that leads to the quarters. Almost immediatly after the lounge are four staterooms (two starboard, and two port). After the foru staterooms come twenty crewquarters (again half to port and half to starboard). After the crew quarters there are six more staterooms (these are currently unoccupied). After that the corridor turns to a smaller lounge (single table and some benches) and a finally to the cargo hold. There are also turbolifts at the bow and aft.

*The cargo hold opens doors are in the starboard, and the corridors when the two corridors that lead to the bridge and main entrance meet they form a cross. Going starboard you will find an airlock where the ship can dock. To port is a secondary entrance.*


3rd level: Access: Only the Aesir, Marin and Aidan are allowed up.

Layout: In the bow you have the forward observatory, which is basically a lounge with large windows. There is a single door in the rear bulkhead that leads to the central corridor. Once leaving the forward observatory you will find on the immediate left the bow turbolift. After that there is another two doors on either side The Starboard door leads to a practice room. This room is sparesly furnished having really only tumbling mats and practing dummies. On the other side of the corridor is the armory. Going further down the corridor you get the central lounge very similar to the forward observatory (large windows). This room also serves as a pilots ready room. Past that are two hangers Likewise is seperated and house two viking fighters (for a total of four fighters). At the very end of the corridor is the aft turbolift and the rear observatory. It is small room with windows like the others similar to a meditation room.

09-17-2004, 10:38 AM
Been looking up loose/forgotten plot threads lately. Was really looking for my own stuff, but I found a couple things other people seem to have forgotten about, too! :)

BD, whatever happened to this plot thread (http://www.lucasforums.com/showthread.php?s=&postid=1140317&highlight=Malken#post1140317)?

Originally posted by BattleDog
Hal: As an aside, I doubt even you know about the base in Retari. We should go there. There's no way you have a copy of the book of Malken.


The book is hardcopy, it's 25,000 years old and contains the recorded location of every Jedi, stronghold, Warlord, force surge and weird mojo since it was written. It will tell us where Drago was when the Galaxy went boom.

I assume you know who he is?


Hal: He's an imortal vampire hunter, he's one of the few links between the old world and the new. *Shrugs* The way things are going having someone who can survive the destruction of a star might be useful.

Curious to know what you plan to do with this, if you still plan on doing anything with it that is. :)

As for you, Deac, I thought I'd found something of yours (http://www.lucasforums.com/showthread.php?s=&postid=1155398&highlight=figure#post1155398) as well, until I realized that the 'mysterious figure' was actually Ellela. Oops. :D

09-18-2004, 11:37 AM
And as for the Lokpihet thread, I felt that needed to be shelved as you and Admiral have obviously had this whole thing planned for a while. If there's an opening for the evil old dude, let me know by PM or something.

09-19-2004, 11:25 AM
Post eaten.

Ask questions here and I will answer.

09-19-2004, 11:29 AM
Well, uh, see my previous post about Drago. :D

(That's solely out of curiosity, btw.)

09-21-2004, 07:32 PM
Although I'm not sure what to do with him next, hell i'd like to discuss it with reddy of course first before implementing it

speaking of returning characters, I might have to discuss what to do with my 'sith' character that is within the ranks of admiral's army of undead sith (cus i didnt exactly killed him off, nor removed him permanently (maybe))

although I do have an for both *shrugs*

09-22-2004, 02:25 AM
A Legion of Agamarian Warriors is currently headed towards Midgard, Dago will reappear then.

Composition of an Agamarian Legion

The Levy:
These warriors form the bulk of the legion, their personnal fighting skills are impressive but because of their rural location they rarely have time practice in large units.

1000 Longbow Men.

These warriors are equipped with longbows and two quivers with a total of 60 arrows. They wear leather jerkins and helmets. They are also equipped with 1 1/2 foot diameter round shields, stored on the back and an axe with a 1 1/2 foot haft.

These men fight primarily as archers but can act as a light infantry, they should remain behind the shield wall unless needed to fight hand to hand.

2000 Men at Arms

Warriors armoured in scale shirts, helmets and leather on wrists and shins. They carry 3 foot diameter round shields, 8 foot spears, topped with an 8 inch leaf point made, sharped down both edges and two edged 28 inch swords.

These men are good all round medium infantry, able to use their spears against cavaly or as javalins hurled before closign to fight enemy infantry with swords. These men form the shield wall.

400 Light Infantry

Un armoured except for a light leather jerkin and leather cap, they carry 1 foot diameter bucklers and 45 inch two handed swords.

These men are employed in small groups to take out exposed enemy artillary and engage and hold enemy archers before the men of the shield wall arrive to cut them to pieces. Comming from the rugged Northern provinces they move very fast afoot.

The Militia:
Drawn from the twons these men are a more cohesive unit, more ordered and more diciplined in battle.

1000 Billmen

More heavily armoured than the House Gaurd Billmen protect the flanks of the shield wall, eqipped with bill axe-hooks and short swords they are capable of carving enemy cavalry and infantry to pieces.

800 Light Cavarly

Lightly armoured and eqipped with swords, shields and bows, these men well trained and fast moving but will not stand long against heavy cavalry.

These men are charged with providing scouts during marches and battle and with protecting the flanks of the army where needed

The House Gaurd:
1,200 House Gaurds march with the army, of these 600 are foot and 600 horse.

600 Foot

Armoured in scale coats, greaves, gauntlets, collars and open face helmets these men carry a Battle Axe with a 4 foot haft as well as a 28 inch sword and a 3 foot diameter round shield.

These men are the elite heavy infantry, their axes are equipped with hooks for openeng enemy armour and dragging men from their horses. They move fast considering their armour and fight to the death. They are deployed where needed.

600 Horse

Armoured in the same way as the foot except for their full face great helms and teardrop shaped shields they carry heavy 16 foot lances with 1 foot steel tips. Their secondary weapon is a two handed longsword. Their horses are fully barded.

These horsemen function as the primary attacking force of the Legion, heavily armoured as they are they are able to break enemy formations and fight against heavy odds. Their lances make them particually deadly.

The General's Gaurd 20

Twenty mounted House Gaurds selected for their skill and loyalty are charged with defence of the General of the Army.

Total: 6,421

An army is generally compased of between 2 and 6 Legions and the entire military is composed of 24 Legions of roughly 160,000 men.

09-22-2004, 12:14 PM
A couple of things BD: Although compared with the rest of the post these are veyr minor.

1. How do they know where Midgard is?

2. Why are they taking a legion with them? Since they do not know what is going on .

3. Considering the advance weapons used in the galaxy why does the Agamarian legion(s) still have longbow men and calvary with horses? Seems rather pointless as they would be slaughtered.

About the final battle. To save everyone some frustration.

1. The battle will be a slaughter for the Aesir and those who fight with them. Few are going to survive. (This will not change).

2. Even if the Agmarian legion arrives in time they will not be allowed to fight or even land on the planet. A spell is going to prevant it.


The will get slaughtered and there is no need for that to happen. So the Aesir will refuse and if necessary have their droids prevant interferance.

Calvary and archers are in direct violations of the rules of the fight. (See below for a complete list of the rules below). This will be a pure foot battle.

Third and maybe most important. Their inclusion would destroy the plot and purpose behind the battle.

Rules of the Battle:

1. Once Heimdall retrieves a horn (the artifact) all fighting will cease until the battle of Vidgrid.

2. The battle will begin an hour after dawn and end at dusk. At dusk both sides withdraw from the battle. The group and any surviving Aesir have that night leave the planet. With the dawn of the next day all rules are off.

3. Noncombatants will not be attacked.

4. Ranged weapons, calvary etc are not going to be used. It is purely foot combat using solely melee weapons.

5. The survivors of the losing army (the Aesir and group) have one full night to leave the planet.

6. At dusk at a rooster crows fighting immediatly stops. If you are about to give a killing blow it is to late.

Basic outline of what will happen at the battle.

Dawn: The two armies awaken, get suited up and march to the field. An hour after that the fight begins.

Dawn-Dusk: The fight is long and hard and very fierce the opposing army is huge (saving exact numbers on size for dramtic reasons). and the Aesir get slaughtered.

Dusk: Roosters crow and the both sides stop fighting. Droids then go in to the battle and retrieve the bodies of the dead and wounded.

Night: The dead Aesir are cremated and the group leaves.

A couple of things: I have planned out this battle (as Red can attest) for a very long time. At this point I am not willing to change anything drastically (like the inclusion of the Agamarian legion, or having the Aesir win).

There is a certain mood and effect that I'm going for and I think everything will work out the way it stands. I'm not divulging everything and the exact details for effect although if your really need to know just PM me and I'll send you some details

BD: If you want just Drago to join I can work something out but the Agamarian legion would in a way destroy the point and plot of this paticular battle.

Sorry all, I should have posted this sooner and would have saved a lot of trouble.

09-22-2004, 01:36 PM
Admiral, worry ye not.

1. The Will of the Force

2. Hal is the last male heir to the Earldom of the Black Wall, (Lords of Agamar.)

3. The weapons aren't exactly "normal" and the Legion is perfectly capable of fighting with modern weapons. In General Cavaly use Heavy Tanks, Longbowmen are Infanty, the Shieldwall becomes mechanized infantry etc.


Notes on Agamarian weapons:

(Would have posted this before but ran out of time.)

Fire Horses:

These animals are not native to Agamar and their exact origan is unknown however they make cavalry a viable proposition on the modern battlefield.

A. Fire Horses are built like war horses but their size is considerably bigger.

B. Fire Horses run at a top speed of 45 miles an hour average.

Static Bows:

Filiment wires in the bows energise the arrows apon release, alowing them to puch through heavy armour and energy shields.

As to how the Agamarians know whats going on, I'll leave that under raps until at least the end of this chapter.

09-22-2004, 02:48 PM
BD, even if the Agamarians were allowed on the planet, their calvary would violate the rules of the "gentlemen's battle". (as Admiral said)

Also, to be quite honest, if they are allowed to take part in the battle, they will probably/definitely all die.

Our characters have a higher chance of survival due to certain circumstances that wouldn't apply to the Agamarians.

If the Aesir took away their horses and their bows and let them join the battle...well, they'd just be cannon fodder, wouldn't they?

However, the whole idea of the Legion sounds pretty interesting to me. I'm sure there's something else that can be done with them...

09-22-2004, 02:54 PM
Yup what Red said.

Your legion does sound well thought out and there will be plenty of other chances for them to be used. Especially considering that enemy is not going to just disappear when the fight is over. There will be other encounters.

09-22-2004, 03:00 PM
sry to cut in, but even I was told that

1) Midgard is completely invisable to anyone with any sort of telekenetic prowless, even if someone's on the planet that someone distinctively knows

even detection through scientific methods (Ie scanning the space for gravity wells common for a planet, although one would need to know where in all the universe where to look)

3) well i JUST saw reds post (didnt appear until i hit the reply button)

the battle has been told to be a gentleman's war, both sides have been given rules that they must follow, most likey agreed upon with Hel and commanding Aesir

The Sith are undead, and practically in some sense dont have a will of their own, so thye have no chioce BUT to follow those rules

and although i cant speak for admiral, but i can very well guess that the aesir wont let outside interferences occur, thus preventing that one controlled war to spill outside the planet

although i also agree with red about your army/legion that you can bring, but one question arrises. How come Hal hasnt told about them yet?

oh and another, how does this 6k+ legion survive the holocuast? (surely the aesir would have targeted THAT planet, no offence)

09-22-2004, 03:31 PM
Originally posted by Scar Da Kookee
sry to cut in, but even I was told that

1) Midgard is completely invisable to anyone with any sort of telekenetic prowless, even if someone's on the planet that someone distinctively knows

even detection through scientific methods (Ie scanning the space for gravity wells common for a planet, although one would need to know where in all the universe where to look)

It's not specifically invisible to just anyone with telekinetic prowess.

Admiral will have to clarify the rest. :)

oh and another, how does this 6k+ legion survive the holocuast? (surely the aesir would have targeted THAT planet, no offence)

Why is that? They targeted Imperial worlds, then population centers. And alot of Imperials survived because fleets are mobile. Eighty percent of the galaxy's intelligent life gone leaves plenty of room for a 6k+ legion to survive.

09-22-2004, 03:57 PM
About the Sith:

The Sith are dead and and have been brought back to life. The thing is that they can't die permantly. Each time they die they are slightly disfigured *a broken neck will remain twisted sort of thing. A man who had his hand cut off may get it regrown backwards.*

Hel does have some power over them but they are not mindless drones. A mindless drone is worthless, you want someone who has some initiative.

A good example for this army of Sith is the ancient Spartans. The Spartans concentrated almost entirely on martial skills ignoring scholarlly skills like reading and writing. They were educated enough to follow orders but not much more then that.

This is true for this Sith army (this is an ancient army). They barely have an education, in other words they do not know anything else but to follow orders of their superiors. The higher the ranked Sith the more educated. At the same time are less likely to rebel since they have power over poeple and know rebellion is a quick way to a painful death. Obedience quick way for promotion. The Dark Sith Lords are the most highly educated but there are not many Dark Lords and they have no real reason to try an rebel.

Just a note on details:
Hel Brought the Sith army back and gave it to the Jotuns, which originally had the army to begin with.

The overall leader is Loki. This doesn't mean he is the strongest that falls to Fenrir however Loki is the father of Fenrir, Hel, Jormungand and as such is the leader.

About Midgard: The Aesir hide themselves in the force so one cannot find the planet by trying to sense them. Hal however doesn't (unless BD says otherwise). As such you could find the Jedi by sensing him. I may have argued that however it has been done in Empire Strikes back and the book Dark Saber.

Under normal circumstances. Hal, Orthos, Misea, Tanara etc would not be on teh planet so that is not an issue. You can't simply sense a planet. Further more the is a planetary cloaking device and shields, and other measures that prevant the idle explorer from finding the planet.

Now having the legion reach the planet ok. Setting down and fighting is not ok. They can stay in orbit and Drago can come down but no more with no horses.

About the rules: The Aesir and Loki, Hel Fenrir didn't sit down and talk about them. They ages ago by Odin and some others (Surt included among them).

09-22-2004, 05:01 PM
see, i said i couldnt speak for you :D

09-23-2004, 02:58 AM
The Legion will not Land or take part in the battle, they're bassically neccessary for character developement. Yes 6,421 men are neccessary.

09-23-2004, 06:28 AM
Ok BD you have me interested in this character development.

09-23-2004, 11:14 AM
Ditto. :D

09-23-2004, 02:07 PM
Ok, I'm on a role. The Legion exists for several reasons.

1. Tradition.

2. Trial by Tourument.

3. As a base for a modern army.

This is an Outer Rim Law (I made up). As you may have gathered in the Cantina Flax has been made dictator (King) for six months. Under certain circumstances a challenge to his right to rule might be brought. The challenger could ask for Trial by Personnal Combat or Tournument.

Obviously no-one is going to challenge a sword master like Taklin Flax. In the second case two armies draw up and fight a war using archaic weapons. In this instance Flax would Deploy his legions and call on his allies. Flax' Definate allies are:

House Windrider

House T'nassae

House Relinion.

Each of these houses holds about half the number of Legions House Flax does. The Layout is virtually the same. The only signifficant differences are as follows.

House Windrider's House Gaurd are all mounted and have some additional armour. Also in place of Halbadiers they have a medium cavalry which when dismounted are bassically the men at arms.

House T'nassae has a larger number of light infantry and some dedicated light horse archers but they have no Longbowmen, only crossbows.

House Relinion's Gaurds use two swords in melee combat.

09-23-2004, 02:28 PM
Originally posted by BattleDog
This is an Outer Rim Law (I made up). As you may have gathered in the Cantina Flax has been made dictator (King) for six months. Under certain circumstances a challenge to his right to rule might be brought. The challenger could ask for Trial by Personnal Combat or Tournument.

Obviously no-one is going to challenge a sword master like Taklin Flax. In the second case two armies draw up and fight a war using archaic weapons. In this instance Flax would Deploy his legions and call on his allies.

That sounds eerily like a Blade tradition which will probably come up later in the Cantina RPG (although PtH, while it will DEFINITELY have Blades in it, may not for a while) in which a Blade can challenge another's authority and jurisdiction through a tournament/duel.

Oh, I guess I should clarify why I was asking about Drago...

I'm going to be introducing K'Warra to PtH in this chapter (in a rather unusual fashion, and believe it or not, it is an intrinsic part of the plot, not just something I randomly threw in). Since Drago and K'Warra are both immortals, they have wildly clashing personalities, and they have a bad history (Mrear/Crisis), the inclusion of both of them in the same chapter, in the modern day, would be interesting...

09-23-2004, 03:57 PM
Admiral.....can I borrow you for my history test tomorrow? :D

09-23-2004, 06:30 PM
Trial by tournament: That reminds me of the Aesir's big celebration (The Tournament) of martial skills.

JM: Test on what point in time?

09-23-2004, 07:45 PM
Not so much a period in time than a bunch of civilizations plopped together in a test: Greeks, Romans, Egyptians and Aztecs. Plus we begin covering Vikings in about January....

09-24-2004, 02:58 AM
Actually Admiral the Tournument of Martial Skills was what gave me the idea. To be honest I'm feeding off you a bit for inspiration.

You've brobably detected the Saxon/Viking Influence the culture I've created. There's also some Roman in there.

The Agamarian Culture, along with the local sector of the Outer Rim is based on England C900 A.D.

Flax would be more properly termed an Earl, he has power and land but he does not own all the Land he has aurthoriety over.

In oder to become King Flax would have to be elected by the Council of Lords. This has not happened in 15,000 years.

Also, all Agamarians have an obligation of military service based on the amount of Land they hold. The more wealthy they are the higher up the military food chain.

The Bowmen are generally tennants or manual labourers.

The Shieldwall are independant farmers.

The Militia are drawn from those in the cities with enough money to divert time to military training and to buy effective weapons and armour.

The House Gaurd are part of a Lord's household and are a standing army, trained from youth. As a point of interest the name "House Gaurd" was inspired by Huscarle variously translated as House Carl and Gaurd.

09-24-2004, 09:16 AM
JM: The vikings. If your teacher says anything about them wearing horned helms hit him/her.

BD: :) If I can inspire you in another area don't have Hal wear a sword across his back. It is a pet pev of mine that people think swords are normaly worn across the back. This is not the case except for the Great Swords, Claymores, True-Two handers etc. In other words swords that cannot possible be worn at the side do to their large size.

Any sword that could be worn at the hip is worn at the hip. Reason: You cannot draw a blade over your shoulder (I say this from experience).

If you or anyone here is really interested in reading more about swords I direct you to this thread: Swordsmanship School (http://www.lucasforums.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=99242)

I have a couple post talking about length and classes of swords.

09-24-2004, 10:38 AM
BD: I did notice the Saxon influence. Also noticed the Admiral influence. :)

My cultures tend to be a mishmash of a whole bunch of different cultural types rather than based on one or two. This might not be obvious since I haven't really done much more than hint at cultural details so far, but you will see alot more of that when I get to put the group in my dimension next thread.

[I did throw some stuff in Crisis, but it wasn't terribly detailed either, not to mention outdated since I placed it in my world's past.]

Admiral: I took the liberty of fixing your link, hope you don't mind. :)

09-24-2004, 10:46 AM
Red: Not at all.

09-24-2004, 02:25 PM
Admiral, he wears his Longsword on his back because his short sword is on his hip. Thats the only reason. The reason he wears two swords at the moment is because he is currently tending towards sword and shield, so the Longsword is effectivly "stored".

09-24-2004, 08:10 PM
BD: You use a long sword with a shield. ;)

Swords that you can't use a shield with require two hands. Long sword is a one handed.

09-24-2004, 09:35 PM
Unless you believe diablo II physics are real, and a barbarian can wield two two-handed swords :P

09-25-2004, 09:30 AM
Maybe they have big hands. ;)

09-25-2004, 03:18 PM
Then I have it named wrong. Hal's blade is around 40 inches long with a 10 inch hilt (ish).

Taklin's was 36 inches long because he is considerably shorter than his son. 5 foot 10 vs 6 foot 2.

09-25-2004, 03:46 PM
BD: For reference this is a long sword.

3. Long Sword: This refers to swords that have a handle that will fit both hands, and has a long blade. The name was recorded in 1450, but most likely was used before then. A long sword length is usually 40-48 inches. Weight around 2 ½ to 3 ½. It is believed these swords were used as early as 1150.

I think you desire a Great Sword

5. Great Sword: These are even larger war swords, the term started also in the 1300s, evidence suggest that these swords were in use as early as 1180. These are not true two handed swords (those will be covered later). They weigh enough to require the use of both hands. Where a long sword could be used with a shield, and on a horse. These swords cannot be used with a shield and are a pure infantry weapon. Length is 44 to 53 inches. They weigh 3 to 4 pounds. Usually these swords have a fuller running down half the blade length and a rounded point. Great swords are most famous for the early Scottish claymore (The one William Wallace used in Braveheart).

09-25-2004, 05:03 PM
Aye laddy, it be 'ne o' my mo favor-it-a-ble films :swrd2:

09-25-2004, 05:12 PM
Originally posted by Admiral
JM: The vikings. If your teacher says anything about them wearing horned helms hit him/her.

Congrats, I am now suspended from school and grounded thanks to you......

09-25-2004, 05:17 PM
Well that is what you get when you try to prevant people from teaching the wrong information. :D

09-25-2004, 05:18 PM
suspended? thats usualy cause for expelsion :P

09-26-2004, 02:12 PM
So I am right, Longsword. The Agamarians use a two handed weapon with a 40-44 inch blade. Oh, I made a mistake, Flax' weapon was 38 inches. I know technically that falls outside the range but as I said he's quite short.

09-26-2004, 02:20 PM
No BD. A long sword's overall length (blade and hilt) is 40-48 inches, and only requires one hand.

From your description the overall length of Hal's sword is around 50 inches putting it out of the range of a long sword and into the range of a Great Sword. Also by saying that you can't use a shield with it implies that it requires both hands to use and as such falls out of the Long Sword category.

09-26-2004, 07:14 PM
Originally posted by Scar Da Kookee
suspended? thats usualy cause for expelsion :P
Well, I hit him with a 300 page book a bunch of papers, so they took pity on me.

09-27-2004, 02:18 AM
Okay, right I have it. Hal uses a Great Sword. All my other Agamarians use Longswords. I have my visualizations's wrong.

The average sword used by mounted housgaurd and Flax is 44 inches long with a 36 inch blade. The Weapon can be used one or two handed. Hence Forth this will be known as a Gaurd's Sword.

The average weapon is around 34 inches long with a 28 inch blade. This will be known as a Common Sword. In future anyone confused must refer to this thread.

Hal's Sword is an examply of a weapon used by the Light Infantry and will be known as a Barbarian Sword.

09-28-2004, 02:27 AM
Admiral: I'm currently working under the assumption that Drago would be apreciably older than Odin's childran and must have encountered the Asier before. Simply through virtue of being so old.

If you have a serious problem with any of this please say.

09-28-2004, 06:15 AM
BD: Being older then Odin's children is not a problem, except maybe for Vidar (the eldest son). How old is Drago? (that way I can say whether or not he is older then Vidar and some of the others).

And it depends on how he encoutered the Aesir.

09-28-2004, 09:21 AM
Not to answer for BD, but definitive answer for that is difficult since no one really knows WHEN the Mrear world existed (where IIRC Drago was born), when it stopped existing, and when magic was "bound" in the galaxy/went away on its own/something else happened. (This as well has never really been clear.)

09-28-2004, 10:37 AM
I know but even if it is a general idea of age I could give a better answer.

09-28-2004, 11:20 AM
Well, If Mrear developed at the same rate as the human homeworld and they were roughly the same age Drago would be around 50,000 years old, maybe as much as 70,000, maybe more.

This is all based on the fact that SW technology is so advanced and we know they were firmly intergalatic around 30,000 BBY. So I figure add 20,000 for them to go from the dark ages to there. Then we have to consider that Mrear is probably older than the HHW. So I'd say between 50-80,000, with those being the far outsiders.

As to the other question I would think an Imortal would be fairly impressive even to the Asier and second simply through virtue of being so old he must have met them several times. In general I would expect him to have gotton on well with them.

He might even concievably have spent several years/decades with them. That would help to explain how he found Midgard.

09-28-2004, 12:25 PM
Hm, if so that would probably have been pre-Loki from what Admiral has told me...

Going by theforce.net (http://www.theforce.net/timetales/tt1-1/Sect1-1.shtml), which is generally reliable and backs up its sources, the Star Wars galaxy formed c. 5,000,000,000 BBY.

Considering C8-9-10, with Kvana's appearance on Coruscant, Mrear probably existed between c. 200,000 and 100,000 BBY so that the sun-blocking citadel could have been constructed by someone he knew. (Running out of time here, so check the site to see what I mean.) Which makes Drago older by an order of magnitude. This is just conjecture, however.

Pardon my cluelessness, but what does "HHW" stand for?

09-28-2004, 12:32 PM
prolly "human homeworld"

09-28-2004, 12:35 PM
I really do need to sit down and do a timeline for the Aesir would make this much easier anyways:

Well I don't know how impressed they would be with a single immortal human. The drakes are immortal and the Aesir have yet to discover their natural life-span (no Aesir has yet to die of old age).

So if Drago was to spend any appreciable amount of time with the Aesir it would have to be before the explusion of Loki, and after the first war. A lot of time passed between those two events mind you but Vidar, Tyr, Heimdall, Svafa and the rest of Odin's children would've been born and old with the exception for Vali who was Born after the expulsion of Loki.

Now if Drago did encounter the Aesir he would have meet Odin and some others (Odin generally travels with his children and Loki given the time period) on one of Odin's jouryneys. (He does that a lot so them meeting serveral times could happen). As far as spending time with the Aesir, Drago could have joined Odin on one of his journey's. Odin journey's tend to last a long time (7+ Years). Drago wouldn't of been taken to any of the Aesirian worlds though nor told of their location.

About Age and how the Aesir view it.

The Aesir do not view age as important so generally they don't keep track of how old they are once they are past 100. 100 marks a milestone in a life of an Aesir and once they are past that their age no longer matters and the Aesir don't ask each other how old they are.

Past the century mark, an Aesir when asked for his/her age generally picks a number. Sometimes randomly other times just a number they like. For instance Odin likes 4,000 and whenever someone asks him how old he is, Odin answers with either "4,000" or "over 4,000". Odin is much older then that (to be honest I haven't sat down and done the math, but at the very least around Drago's age most likely older). Heimdall likes to say 300. This by the way is to other Aesir/people who know they are Aesir.

For non-Aesir and those who have no idea that they are Aesir they will pick a human age that they look like. For example if Svafa is infiltrating the Empire she may say that she is 20. Odin maybe 50 or so.

You should get the idea to their practices. Also Drago would be older then Vidar but by how much I'm not sure (really need to figure out a time line). He would not be older then Idun.

Any questions?

09-28-2004, 12:40 PM

if a tree falls in a forest and theres no one around to hear it, does it make a sound? :)

09-28-2004, 12:51 PM
yes it does

09-29-2004, 01:53 AM
Ok, thats fine, the point has to do less with actual age and more to do with life experiance as a result of age. Where as the Asier are inclined to look down on humans somewhat simply because they have a far greater level of knowledge and experiance they can't do this with Drago.

So the Asier are going to have deal with Drago from a position of relative equallity. The point is further driven home by a measure of shared knowledge, magic, dragons, etc; thats not a point I'm going to stress though.

As a note Drago stopped counting at 1,000.

09-29-2004, 09:56 AM
BD: You have a slight misconception. They Aesir do not look down upon humans because they lack experience etc. They look down on some of them, because the way they act. As one of them said earlier they judge a Jedi in comparison to other Jedi. Humans compared to other humans and so on.

I must ask how much knowledge would you like Drago to have of the Drakes (Odin would have traveled with one of them)? I also need to point out that he doesn't have knowledge of the Futhark.

09-29-2004, 11:58 AM
Admiral, What I mean is Drago has practical experiance of fighting Dragons and dealing with magic. As to Drakes I would think a general overview, weaknesses, temperment, level of intelligence etc.

As to your other point whatever your intentions your characters gonvey a different attitude.

09-29-2004, 12:50 PM
Drakes are immortal, extermly smart, all but Nidhogg and his gang of 4 others are the only ones that went bad so to say.

Age wise Drakes were around since the begining.

BD: Exactly and what does that imply about they way the Aesir feel about the group?

09-29-2004, 01:14 PM
Originally posted by Admiral
BD: You have a slight misconception. They Aesir do not look down upon humans because they lack experience etc. They look down on some of them, because the way they act. As one of them said earlier they judge a Jedi in comparison to other Jedi. Humans compared to other humans and so on.

I must ask how much knowledge would you like Drago to have of the Drakes (Odin would have traveled with one of them)? I also need to point out that he doesn't have knowledge of the Futhark.

well, i can recall clearly you saying once that aesir consider humans as 'children' in age wise and the amount of intelligence one could gain in that time (well obviously in their life spans) but considering that

that would technically be comparing humans to themselves, dont you think

09-29-2004, 01:32 PM
to clear somethings up.

When you use totals as in the entire human race the Aesir must compare humanity to themselves. Like the entire Jedi Order the Aesir compare it to themselves.

Now idividuals they compare to other members. Jedi to other Jedi, Human to other Human.

Now for the PTH group, yes the Aesir see a good portion as childish like the Irvines and since the Irvines should be more mature the Aesir treat them like they do. Marin they treat better because she seems mature, and they have no other to base a comparison on.

I will say this. Age does not play into how they treat people. It is how they act and behave and a comparison relative to that individuals culture and to the Aesir themselves.

09-29-2004, 01:42 PM
Originally posted by Scar Da Kookee

if a tree falls in a forest and theres no one around to hear it, does it make a sound? :)
Depends on how big the tree is.

If a hobo dies in the sewers, does anyone find out?

09-29-2004, 01:57 PM
Maybe, but what does that have to do with PtH? ;)

An interesting question is how much the Aesir know about/have used magic in the past.

I should also point out that Mrearan magic and Aetherian magic [the Aether is the common name of what I've always referred to as "the magic world" of Earth] are two different although similar things.

I can't really say similar in what ways unless Deac cares to explain exactly how Mrearan magic works, which isn't really relevant at this time.

I need to explain how Aetherian magic works myself, but I can put that off until PtH VI. :p

09-29-2004, 02:00 PM
Originally posted by Redwing
Maybe, but what does that have to do with PtH? ;)

An interesting question is how much the Aesir know about/have used magic in the past.

I should also point out that Mrearan magic and Aetherian magic [the Aether is the common name of what I've always referred to as "the magic world" of Earth] are two different although similar things.

I can't really say similar in what ways unless Deac cares to explain exactly how Mrearan magic works, which isn't really relevant at this time.

I need to explain how Aetherian magic works myself, but I can put that off until PtH VI. :p
I dunno,I just saw the question aobut the tree and needed to post my own. Plus hobos are cool :cool:

09-30-2004, 12:20 AM
Okay, just for fun: Hal beef with the Asier.

As a direct result of their actions Hal has lost his family, his people, his entire way of life.From his point of view blowing up 80% of the Galaxy seems like a very childish overreaction on the part of Odin's children for the following reasons.

1. Destruction of that many stars will make much of the Galaxy A. untravelable and B. highly unstable. In a matter of years the Galaxy will swollow its self. Actually I'd say the Asier may actually have brought an apocalypse foward a few years.

2. People should be allowed to choose how to meet their end. Most relevant, the Lahara Sector found have fought to the last man, woman and child against Sith, Demons, you name it.

3. The very casual offhand way the Galaxy was destroyed. I don't recall any remorse at all thew the destruction of all those people. Bear in mind that Hal and all the other Jedi felt every death and if the Asier use the Force they should have too.

Other stuff he doesnet like:

The Asier DO treat the group like children, even after months of fighting by their side they still refuse to trust Hal an inch and treat him as though he is stupid, and they were doing this before the episode in the last thread.

Before you point out that episode with the Sith in the temple I'll point out that they were in a place strong in the dark side and given their general mental state it made all the Jedi a bit odd.

Another of Hal's problems has to do with hypocracy. Particually Svafa's very violent and foolish response to being accused in the last thread, obviously a neccessary plot device but in Hal's view it reflects particually badly on her character.

Finally, Hal is bound by several codes of honour which prevent him from lying, betrayal etc so the Asier's continuing mistrust is a personnal insult, which they continually remind him of.

I should point out, counter to all I have just said that Hal has a proffessional respect for Heimdall and an instilled respect handed down from his father for all Asier but this is being erroded by his current experiance.

He has a genuine personnal conflict with Svafa.

09-30-2004, 02:34 AM
Originally posted by Admiral
Now for the PTH group, yes the Aesir see a good portion as childish like the Irvines and since the Irvines should be more mature the Aesir treat them like they do. Marin they treat better because she seems mature, and they have no other to base a comparison on.

oh i'm hurt :rolleyes:

09-30-2004, 07:40 AM
Interesting BD.

You will not see the Aesir show remorse for their actions mainly since they believe they did the right thing and yes they did feel the deaths. Also any remorse that they do show would not be in front of the group.

Now about Svafa in the previous thread. Keep in mind that Heimdall is her brother and attacked and injured her a couple of times before Marin/Raschel accusation. She was also emotionally beat up from the strong belief that she would have to kill her brother. The Accusation pushed her over the edge as such her violent reaction.

Svafa personally doesn't like Hal. reasons:

1. He in her opinion is a poor Jedi. In this thread, the previous one etc. Hal has shown a lack of control over his emotions, being quick to anger and outbursts.

2. In the previous thread Hal (in Svafa's opinion) threw a tantrum and ran away. That completly destroyed any and all trust she had in him. It also took away a lot of her respect for him and Jedi in general (Misea is far from helping).

3. The most current thing. Hal being angry over Matt's training yet he did nothing during the eight months. If he really cared then he should have checked in or at least asked Sir Vin on how it was going.

Later on I'll explain some of the reason why they treat others as Children. Although I don't see them really treating Orthos, Gortick, Ellela, Marin, and Guy and for the most part Aidan like children. Tanara and Ritchet are new members so they don't really know.

Mainly it is Misea, the Irvines and Hal.

09-30-2004, 11:04 AM
Originally posted by BattleDog

1. Destruction of that many stars will make much of the Galaxy A. untravelable and B. highly unstable. In a matter of years the Galaxy will swollow its self. Actually I'd say the Asier may actually have brought an apocalypse foward a few years.

Um, what science - Star Wars or real world - is this based on? This doesn't seem to make logical sense.

Even if this were so, the galaxy is going to end within twenty years according to prophecy anyway. If the galaxy was going to swallow itself it would happen over thousands or millions or even billions of years making that irrelevant anyway.

I really have nothing to add to the rest of your post since Admiral and I have already fiercely argued this out on AIM :) (while it was happening, in fact)

Scar: You shouldn't be, you are not your characters and your characters are not you ;)

09-30-2004, 01:14 PM
note the sarcasm in my post redy :D

yeah, and in this thread, i'm trying to fix up the personality querks I have with the Irvines ^_^;

although i'm going to almost keep WH Irvine the same, but letting RH irvine to grow a bit (note any noticeable attitude changes already with the two, and any mistakes thus far, were my fault ^_^)

RH Irvine's still got a bit to go, note his reactions and questions ^_^ (also note his somewhat abserd question was to get an idea on the numbers of the aesir or the number of sith.)

he's more annoyed at hal then anything (hell I am too) especally almost saying "You screwed up I'm taking over". no offence JM, but for story sake I had RH Irvine thought that matt wasnt mentally ready for hard combat training. But hell either way you look at it how would he know that they'll be pit up agenst a full day's worth of battle. again its nice to be prepared, but my logic is, especally with that first act with matt in the closet ^_^

it is also RH irvine's first apprentice ;)

09-30-2004, 01:48 PM
Well since a black hole causes a different hyperspace shadow to a star (We've seen this with the Maw.) it follows that all those black holes will make large tracts of space unpassable.

As to the other thing its a Star Wars style exageration, but that said all those black holes are going to start dragging towards each other and joining up and on it will go.

As to what Admiral said I take your points, however counterpoint to what you said about Svafa I'd like to elaborate on Hals mntal state:

1. His entire family dead, either directly or indirectly because of the Asier.

2. These guys blew up the galaxy! :)

3. The destruction of Agamar makes Hal feel personnally guilty because as soon as his father died those people became his responsibility. Consider if this had happened a couple of threads later when Flax had gained more power after the armastice he would have been responsible for the death of everyone in a sector.

4. Hal has his father's temper. Flax shows it less because of his age.

5. Consider the Hal here with the much more reserved and reasonable Hal in the other thread.

Also, I think he's been very well behaved this thread.

I got around to reading "Sword School", talking about swords, you made one or two boobs:

1. The Gladius is worn on the Right, even early Spatha were worn on the right. The didn't start wearing swords on the left until C 250 A.D. at least.

2. You missed some interesting types:

Mycenaean Rapier.

Naue II.

Sorry, I just couldn't resist :D

I wouldn't expect you to know those, since its Pre-Roman Classical knowledge.

I just had to say also 13th Warrior, I was screaming, "Its pattern welded you **%^%&&$%%$%%& :D

09-30-2004, 03:31 PM
btw bd: my last post, sir-vin offering a drink to hal ;)

thats just him trying to 'mend' the differences between the two ^^

just to infrom about waht i'm on about :)

09-30-2004, 07:25 PM
Originally posted by BattleDog
Well since a black hole causes a different hyperspace shadow to a star (We've seen this with the Maw.) it follows that all those black holes will make large tracts of space unpassable.

No, the Maw has a ton of black holes close together. Gravity is what causes hyperspace shadows. Any black holes that may have formed are no closer together than the stars were.

Also keep in mind that 80% of intelligent life is not the same thing as 80% of stars. The reason for the stars being out now is the mysterious darkness that instantly shut out all light eight months ago. Also, stars have to be a certain size (larger than our sun, a medium star) to form a black hole after going supernova.

Large tracts of space are not going to be unpassable anyway because black holes have yet to form where they will form. I base this on the fact that just scant research tells me that although many stars have been observed going nova, a black hole has never been observed forming.

As to the other thing its a Star Wars style exageration, but that said all those black holes are going to start dragging towards each other and joining up and on it will go.

I don't remember Star Wars science being exaggerated in that way. That seems like a BD-style exaggeration. ;)

Black holes *cannot* be formed in twenty years, certainly.

And again, see what I said before about the millions to billions of years thing for the gravity of the black holes to drag each other towards each other over such vast distances...even if there were enough stars destroyed for this to happen, which looks extremely unlikely.


A comment on Hal's/Flax' quite un-Jedi-like temper/attitudes; my theory on this is their dual Jedi/Agamarian heritage - are those conflicting? This has been my observation, and I'm curious to know if you think it's an accurate one :)

09-30-2004, 08:05 PM
About Swords BD: When wearing them I was referring to Medieval ages, and Renaissance. 13th warrior made me cringe a lot with what they did but still a decent movie.

About the explosion of the Stars.

Only extermly massive stars would create blackholes. Other large stars would create Neutron Stars that they spin rapidly can generate pulsars.

The galaxy is not littered with tons of black holes many of the stars that exploded didn't have the mass to generate black holes or Neutron stars. Neutron stars would be the next most frequent event with black holes being the least likely.

Concerning the Aesir and trust. As Red knows the Aesir do not trust, they are prone to mistrust. This roots itself in Loki and the death of Balder. After that point the Aesir basically only trust each other fully. After the destruction of the galaxy, the Aesir are despised (and understandably I will add). To reverse everything and save their lord the Aesir must work with people who in all likely hood hate them. This makes trusting those people much harder since they could just be bidding their time for Revenge. I think only Orthos has really seen any benefit from the holocaust (finding his brother, and cousin)

That is the starting point of their inherint mistrust in PTH.

Now for certain individuals it is increased:

Hal: His lack of control over his emotions is dangerous especially for Jedi. The Aesir know this and will not trust him until he can exert control his emotions. There is also another question that is Hal is having trouble following the Jedi code will he also have trouble and be unable to follow his other codes?

Misea: Has no control over her emotions and is sliding to the dark side. Definetly not going to trust.

Guy: Mysterious, not very sure where he stands and they don't know much about him so they hold him at arms lenght.

The Irvines: The Aesir didn't like them at first because of their family history. Since then the Aesir have continually been forced to repeat themselves. They complain, whine (take the armor for example) and have made some stupid comments. The Irvines are prone rash actions, don't think things all the way through. Sir Vin lost a lot of ground with what the Aesir see as a failure in his responsiblity to train Matt.

I will note at this point that Hal also lost ground. If Hal in their opinion was truely concrened about Matt, Hal would have inquired about his training during the past 8 months. Then instead of trying to immediatly take over it would have been better if Hal offered his help (much more Jedi like).

Matt: His little snopping adventure set him far back with the issue of trust.

Out of the Group Marin is the most trusted. Aidan is coming along since they first meet him. Same with Orthos, Raschel, and Ellela. Gortick, not sure of just yet same with Tanara and Ritchet.

Now for some fun. I'll reveal a little bit about Svafa state of mind:

1. She blames herself for her fathers death (Odin). Svafa is convinced that if she did her job as a Valkyrie better then Odin would not have been killed. Combine this with Svafa's already beating herself up over the death of Balder and failing to find Loki's true nature.

2. As a Valkyrie, Svafa has spent many years infiltrating groups like the Empire. Acting as a spy one doesn't make actual friends and generally trusts no one. She can only really relax around other Aesir otherwise she is always on guard.

3. She doesn't think she is going to survive this to the end. Her death will have less of an impact if she keeps the rest of the group at arms length and is generally hostile to them.

At the same time by keeping them away from her she insultates herself from their deaths.

I can gon on and on as I delve deeper into her pysche but at least everyone should understand her a little better now. maybe Tomorrow I'll do Heimdall and Idun (this is rather fun). With luck you should be able to notice a difference between PTH Svafa and C13 Svafa as things progress.

10-01-2004, 03:33 AM
Red, yes very perceptive. Its less of an Issue for Flax as he was raised by his father and mother relativly insulated from the court because of his Jedi herritage, Flax spent his years up to 17 on a farm dusting crops in an old headhunter under an assumed name.

At age 17 Flax was preparing to take his headhunter, refitted with cannon and missiles out into the world the seek the Rebellion, his father having judged him sufficently well trained to protect himself against the dark side.

Moments before Flax launched his fighter the assult on Agamar began, he watched a TIE-GT proton bombed his father's home as the garage door opened. Flax launched and destroyed the GT.

His home was totally destroyed, killing his entire family, father and mother as well as his older brother and sister. Flax' only surviving relative was his Grandfather, the then Lord, who he could not contact for both their safeties.

Flax was pursued star-side by Imperial Fighters, although he managed to escape to highperspace and was picked up by a passing Rebel Dreadnaught.

After review of his flight logs he was fast tracked thoguh training and assigned to Blue Squadron aboad the Defiance. Six months later he persuaded the Alliance to send Mon Mothma to Agamar to recruit some of its warriors. This was the point at which Kayen Farlander and Jan Lo were recruted, as well as the Twins Sophae and Sellenna Windrider.

Flax participated in the mission to knock out the cominication's array for the first Death Star but he was hit and cracked some ribs and declared unfit for the final attack.

Flax and Sophae married six months after Yavin when he was 20 and she 19.

(There is a point to this.)

Their first son Hal was born during the evacuation of Hoth just before the transport jumped to hyperspace.

The couple traveled from post to post with young Hal in tow. From the earliest the child learned the sword, the blaster and the force. More than once a base had to be evacuated and Flax would carry his son on his back while fighting his way to the escape craft. Hal would be handed over to his mother and then watch his father fight back through Imperial Troops to his X-Wing, in order to escort their transport out.

Hal was litterally born a warrior, with the death of his Father, a man he viewed as indestructable, not to mention his Mother who worked hard to educate him morrally during his violent early childhood, he has lost his reference points in the galaxy.

Without the Jedi Order to adhire to Hal has devoted himself to his martial skills and the brutal and unforgiving Agamarian code of honour. Only over the last two months has Hal begun to recover his moral compass and spiritual centre, however he is still quick to anger and slow to forgiveness.


As to Matt's training that was Sir-Vin's responsibility, in the normal course of events you don't interfere with a Padawan and a master. I was going to do a scene origionally which implied Hal had been teaching Matt the sword over the last few months but it got buriried because I was late joining the thread.

Since that didn't happed Hal's reaction has a lot to do with guilt. He has been too wrapped up in his own problems to see Sir-Vin's difficiencies and as a result the anger is dirrected equil parts at himself and Sir-Vin.

As a general aside Flax' other children don't have the same issues as they were both born after Endor.

10-11-2004, 03:26 AM
BD: Continuing the discussion, yeah Scar misspells sometimes, but rarely is it as hilarious as Floorless.

10-13-2004, 03:57 AM
His grammer is pretty funny though. Trying to work out what he's saying hurts sometimes.

Noble Houses

All Houses in the Lahara Sector a ruled by a "First Lord", his heir is styled "Second Lord".

Aside From this Ranks are thus.

King: (None)
Earl: Example is Taklin Flax They control the loyalty of lesser Lords and can usually equip 12-24 Legions.

High Lord: Senior Nobles, most Second Lords hold a High Lord title. Usually have enough money to equip 6-12 Legions

Lord: Lesser Nobles, generally control small tracts of land, they usually have enough money to equip 2-6 Legions.

Lords are ranked by holdings, therefore if an Earl is impoverished and sells most of his land he ceases to be an Earl and becomes a High Lord or even just a Lord.

10-13-2004, 11:35 AM
I was asked when my ability to post might improve... I'm afraid it may be a couple more weeks, if not 3. Until then, I'll get only a very little chance to do so. I am still interested in this thread and want to continue using Tanara in it.


10-13-2004, 01:07 PM
Originally posted by BattleDog
His grammer is pretty funny though. Trying to work out what he's saying hurts sometimes.


*pulls out his cattleprod and tackles BD, and repeatedly shocks him one after another*

10-13-2004, 01:30 PM
Noble Succesion

When a first Lord dies his oldest surviving son inherits his title, if he has no sons then the title passes to the husband of his oldest daughter. If the Lord has no daughters the title passes to his oldest brother, if the Lord has no brothers then it passes to his oldest sister. If the Lord has no siblings it passes to his cousans in the same way.

The idea is to keep as close to the direct line as possible.

Simple, yes.

Hear's the problem. If a Lord's oldest daughter is unmarried then the title in held "In trust" by her oldest paternal uncle or father's male cousan. These "Regents" have considerably reduced power, their main function is to maintain the holdings of the family until their "charge" is married.

Essentially without a First Lord a House is very vulnerable.

To further complicate things; if the daughter of a First Lord marries a First Lord then on the death of her father the two Houses fuse, unless she has more than one son. In that case the second son would inherit her title apon her husbands death. Until that time her husband holds her title "In trust".

If she never marries it passes to the Regent on her death. If everyone dies out then the title returns to the Crown, since there is no crown there has been a steady fall in the number of house in the last 5,000 years.

Still with me? Okay.

How this relates to Drago's problem: Since houses rank themselves by relative power and wealth the big starbust has seriosly shaken up the pecking order.

The result is that house Flax and Relinion's have deadlocked on an equil power basis. With no King to resolve the dispute the Council of Lords is bickering. The big problem is that all Allessa's male relatives got atomised. So she's it. The problem is she's madly in love with Halren Flax (To be fair she hasn't seen him in nine months) and refuses to brake her betrothal and marry someone else, which under the circumstances she can do.

So Drago has to get them wed and have Hal name him Steward and Marshal-General so that he can get things moving. Although he already holds Marshal-General as a title its not technically legal.


The Highest Rank within a House is the First Lord, who is styled:

Earl: Lord-General

High Lord: Lord-Leutenant-General

Lord: Lord-Major-General

Not all First Lords are military officers. If a Lord proves himself competant he will be awarded the additional land to raise his rank, which will be stripped from the man he replaces.

All other Noble Officers are styled: Knight-(Rank)

There is another General rank, this is Marshal-General, these men are non noble and are invested with their power by a Lord-General and therefore outrank all other officers. When the Lord dies his Marshal-General loses his superiorety but retains the Legions he directly commanded.

Complicated, eh?

10-13-2004, 02:51 PM
Scar: No comment. :D *runs*

BD: Yep.

Just wait until we get to next thread, and I have to explain all this - for a whole bunch of cultures. My fingers are going to hurt. :D

wildjedi: That's perfectly alright. We'll just assume Tanara doesn't have much to say during this time :D or something ;)

10-13-2004, 03:18 PM
WJ: Don't worry bout it.

10-13-2004, 05:09 PM
Be nice everyone.

Ok I want to make sure of this so: In PTH terms:

Hal is an Earl, which is below The King. Allessa is also ranked below the King.

Under this then Allessa would be of lower rank then Vidar. Although she really wouldn't know that, since no one knows how the Aesir's government really works.


A little on the way the Aesir rulling system works:

The Aesir live in what can be caled the Aesirian Empire/Kingdom. The names can be used interchangeable. That said rankings and power. We start with the Royal Family.

Emperor/King: Rules the entire Empire/kingdom. Armies wise he has the full army and navy at his disposal. Vidar is now the emperor.

Queen: The Queen rules when the Emperor/king is away from the throne. As such she shares much of power. On a side note, the Frigg being the queen is Odin's most trusted advisor.

Crown Prince: The heir to Odin (aka Vidar). As such he takes on many duties to prepare himself for the job of rulling the nation. Many times Odin will give Vidar critical assignments that Odin himself would handle. Vidar also travels extensivly with his father. *Note: If the emperor is killed and the queen lives plus a prince the queen becomes the Queen mother and the Prince the Emperor/King. If only there is a princess the Queen rules and anyone she marries is ranked no higher then a prince*

Princes: They are next in line of power and if Vidar is killed with no heir the eldest prince takes power. Heimdall would be next in line.

Princesses: If all the princess are killed then the eldest princess takes over being Burnhilde (she being dead puts Svafa in that position).

That ends the royal family. Below them are:

Dukes and dutches: They govern a planet. They are assigned by the Emperor.

Earls/Counts and Countess They are the regional govenors on planets. Essentially they govern continents/hemispheres Assigned by a Duke

Viscounts: These would be provicional govenors (They are in charge of lands rougly the size of the US). Elected by the populace

Barons/Baronesses These are the head of the local governments. also elected

The use of the phrase Lord and Lady is used for the Royal family, its more of an informal address.

The Ruling Council: Made up of the royal family, Dukes and Duchesses. The council are 12 individuals who advise the Emperor and when the Royal family is off rule in their place.

Another side note: There is a lot of mobility in the society mainly through military service and achievements. Thus ends the political structure of the Aesir. Just a little note on the military of the Aesir.

The Aesir have 10 Knightly orders, and any aesir is free to join any of them each order emphasizes something different, from skill with a sword to use of the Futhark. May list them later. Anyways the Aesir military is divided into essentially four independent groups (each having their own starfighter squadrons, capital ships etc). Military service is seen among the Aesir as a duty, and while not mandatory all Aesir are part of the military in some form.

The Regular Army and navy: The regular army and navy is seen as a stepping platform for those who are seeking a pure military career. The regulars tend comprised mainly of Aesir who pursue other careers like being a scientist. This has caused the regular army/navy to not have one specific armor but rather actual uniforms.

Besersk They wear green armor with gold trim, usually with cape of similar design (green with gold hem). Beserks will tend to handle guard duty along the frontier. Compared to the regular army they would be special forces. Entrance to the Beserks is done by application from the regular army/navy. Overall leader C13: Beowulf, PTH: Ragnar

Einherjar: Their armor is dark blue and with silver trim, and is usually worn with a dark blue cape with a silver hem. The Einherjar are the best of the elite forces of the Aesir (aka the Beserks). To become an Einherjar you have to be chosen by a Valkyrie. Einherjar take on the most dangerous missions and guard the royal family. (more of an honorary role on Asgard and other Aesirian planets) Overall leader: C13: Sigurd. PTH: Viddall

Valkyries: This is an entirely woman orginization. Their armor is red with gold trim, like the Beserks and Einherjar their cape is red with a gold hem, for real formal occasions Valkyries wear skirts. Valkyries are Odin's messangers, watchers, hunters, intell among other things. Again highly skilled. Becoming a Valkyrie is like an Einherjar. New Valkyries are chosen by the leaders of the Valkyries (Odin's daughters). Overall leader: C13: Brunhilde, PTH: Svafa.

I may do military ranks and actual orginization of the military later.

10-13-2004, 05:12 PM
Me is confused :( :confused:

10-13-2004, 05:16 PM
About what JM?

10-13-2004, 05:35 PM
You guys talkin' bout the same order or different ones?

10-13-2004, 05:45 PM
Seperate groups JM.

My post, Emperor down is about how the Aesir set up their government. And a brief description of the military forces.

10-13-2004, 05:49 PM
ok thanks

10-15-2004, 01:59 AM
Admiral, yes. I think you have it.

10-18-2004, 02:01 PM
BD: I don't mean it's a power of the Dark Side. I mean, a technique for creating fireballs through the Force doesn't exist that I know of. ;)

Originally posted by Scar Da Kookee
((I think red was questioning weither or not that would Hal resort to something like that inorder to create something like that.

IE: if a jedi needed to use the dark side to defend himself, someone would need to be pretty desprite, imho ^_^ ))

Uh, no, see above.

I can easily believe that Hal would resort to the Dark Side to defend himself. I mean after all, he isn't exactly stable ;)

10-18-2004, 03:10 PM
well i was jsut stating it :rolleyes:

meh, sometimes i just need more descriptive wording from more people to make up my mind :)

10-19-2004, 12:15 AM
Red: Fireball is perhaps the wrong word. Think of it more as a ball of intense heat and light energy.

As to the darkside issue, no specific use of the force is "light" or "dark" even force lightning can be used be a jedi, though obviously not on people. The key is intent, Hal was preparing to defend himself, albeit in an aggressive manner. Besides he wouldn't have used them on living people. His mindset about these Sith is more like the Obi-Wan and the battle droids.

10-19-2004, 03:08 AM




10-20-2004, 07:03 PM
First, note this little fight is not going to last very long. (Or Admiral will kill me.) So this is really all for just one or two posts or so.

Okay, what the attackers can do, and what you can do to them: (Assuming as well you know who's attacking you from my post/s XD)

For Everyone:

They are all resistant to telekinesis, so you can't Force-pull guns, etc, away. Force powers may or may not work, so don't post assuming they do.


1) Eudoxia: (Guy's sister) Blasters will bounce off leaving a small burn. Same for lightsabers. Using physical force on her is unlikely to work, she's very strong.

2) Kyrill: (Guy's brother) See Eudoxia.

3) White Trenchcoat Man: Blasters will harm him, and so will lightsabers, but good luck hitting him. He is very fast and agile. Plus he can defy gravity (walk on perpendicular surfaces). Get hit by his bullets, and you're screwed [they're enchanted and will severely injure you.]

4) Elf With Satchel and Wand: Blaster bolts will bounce off. Don't expect to safely get within melee range.

5) Gray Armor Being: Basically a tank. Blasters, lightsaber useless. Slower than the others, though.

6) Lizardman: Shielded. Hit him, you get zapped. Blaster bolts bounce off.

7) Girl In Blue: Blaster-shielded. Don't expect to safely get within melee range.

8) Dark Elf: See above.

9/10) Orcs: Blaster-shielded. Morningstar is enchanted, a hit will stun, and it can't be cut by a lightsaber. The stun-gun...well...stuns. Less so if you're a Force user.

11) Animals: Are armored, can't be easily injured, except in the mouth, etc. The Force will work on them but they are fierce brutes so it may not do as good of a job as you might think.

12) Yellow Gargoyle: There's a shield based in his shoulder cannon. Getting hit by the cannon shots would have about the same effect as having a whole string of blaster bolts pumped into you. (Hence pulse cannon)

10-20-2004, 08:11 PM
I would only maim.

Important note:

Heimdall is heading off to retrieve a horn. Once this horn is sounded all fighting stops on the planet (no exception). This is impart due to two reasons:

1. It signales that each side should begin marching to Vigrid.

2. Weapons don't work, rather they cannot harm anyone on the planet (again no exception). Example: A lightsaber hits someone on the head and instead of cleaving the head the saber bounces off doing no damage. A balster bolt is absorb and so forth.

And for those who are wondering why not get the horn first, that is because there is a certain time in which it has to be sounded. Doing it before then does nothing.

10-20-2004, 09:49 PM
Those shields can absorb some physical force as well, incidentally. So even if you could hit someone, maiming is unlikely. :)

Those who aren't wearing shields are wearing some form of armor.

Also, can we assume no one can be harmed at all through any force, physical or other? Or is it just if you're using a weapon?

10-21-2004, 03:49 AM
I believe Admiral is reffering to the horn of [insert name here.] which will signal the begging of the last battle, call the Asier to fight and do some other funky stuff Admiral probably doesn't want spoiled.

10-21-2004, 10:23 AM
Yes, I do know what he is talking about, in fact it was me who suggested he post it in this thread. ;)

BD, What is Hal doing and what effect does he expect it have on the ork/orc/etc? Magic interaction aside.

Otherwise I have no idea what to post. :D

edit: Also, I apologize for totally forgetting to have anyone attack Hal. :D

10-21-2004, 11:01 AM
The horn is named: Gjallar

and Red: no one can be harmed regardless of the method used.

10-21-2004, 02:04 PM
Red: Hal is using a really big, powerful and sharp sword in a downward hack, two handed. The sword has the power of the living force pulsing through the blade and he is using the force to power his swing.

Under normal circumstances this would be a death blow.

Against plasteel, death blow.

Against Agamarian Steel, a really big dent.

Against Mithril, less of a dent, but still enough that you'll want to be seeing an armourer after the battle.

I'll briefly explain Agamarian armour and weapons now.

In general the metal used in armour, fittings, horse bardings, etc is Agamarian Steel. This is actually an alloy which conbines several metals to create a very strong material that is also relativly light. Three of the components are steel, cortosis and a small amount of silver. The alloy is general dull grey, therfore ceremonial armour is silver plated.

As far as strength goes the Agamarian Steel is Second only to Dwarf Steel (Mithril). The major disadvantage versus Mithril though is the weight, Agamarian Steel is considerably heavier, though still much lighter than other metal armour; it's weight falls between that of plasteel and conventional high carbon steel.

Most melee weapons are made of a high quality version of Agamarian Steel, better able to hold an edge and much less likely to break. Both weapons and armour will deflect lightsabers but they will probably be ruined.

The swords used by the ruling houses are something different. Like normal weapons they are pattern welded but after the forging process is completed the structure of the metal is altered by a powerful force surge being sent through the blade. These weapons will never break, never need sharpening and can actually conduct the force, if the user is strong in the Living Force, that is. When two such blades meet there will be sparks.

The first instance of these weapons we see is in Cantina 7, they later make a re-appearece during the vampire episode.

These weapons are incredibly sharp and are capable of punching through mithril, on ocasion.

As to the other thing:

Admiral: thanks

Red: Figures :roll2:

10-25-2004, 01:15 AM
Okay, that pretty much answers my questions. (Especially since I have a good idea at how mithril armor should interact with stuff from my dimension.)

A couple notes on my most recent post, since I designed it with the clear objective in mind of incapacitating/injuring everyone. XD

Everybody's wounds can be healed by the Force or by the Futhark.

The magic stun affect on Ellela can't, but it will vanish after a few minutes, and the Force can be used to cut its effects in half, or get rid of it faster, as long as it's Ellela doing it. The Futhark can't be used to do this (because Ellela can't use the Futhark.)

The bullet that hit Cracern is of a kind referenced in C13; the bullet itself is less important than the payload it releases, which ignores tough unliving substances but rips up organic substances and disrupts electrical systems.

The sleep spell on Sir-vin should wear off pretty quickly, simply because of contact with the freezing snow and the fact that he's Force-sensitive and a sort-of Jedi. The spell can only *keep* him asleep for about half a minute.

Admiral: Since I didn't know if the Futhark shields around Svafa and Idona were one-way, I didn't specify whether the shields were forced against the two, the magic hit them. I chose to assume that the shields were moveable in relation to Svafa and Idona, since I had to make a choice one way or another, but if they are not, then the magic punctured the shields and hit them. (and I will edit to say so.) Either way, the same effect.

They will be severely bruised and possibly sustain concussions (up to you, and I'm sure Idun can fix concussions ;)) [edit: No concussions if it's impact, they weren't hit in the head.] but if the mithril works as impact armor they shouldn't be further injured.

Note this is NOT an ordinary magic effect, so it is extremely unlikely Idun would know this could happen (relating to our earlier discussions).

Any other questions, I will answer here.

10-27-2004, 12:19 AM

Okay, BD:

Originally posted by BattleDog
((Red, whats the name for that last move? "Prat with stick hits Swordmaster's blade" WTF? If you ever make one of my characters look like a prat again I'll confine all you're extradimentionals in pan-universe customs check points for smugglings shoddy fighting styles into my galaxy!:D ))

In short, because I don't want to bloody type all this again:

1) Hal's attacker was the strongest of the enemies. Many times stronger than Hal. He disarmed him through main force. Sure it didn't have much style, but sometimes the simple way is the most efficient way to go.

2) Just so you know, any normal weapon would have been shattered, which is what the tank-guy was going for.

3) A small note on an earlier event, Hal's first attack would've caused problems if he had tried it on anyone else [i]there. But he picked the Tank, encased in ridiculously thick armor. So, nope.

Deac, wondering if Gortick kept the sword that the ork stabbed him with. It's shiny, at the very least. Oh, and post, goddammit. :)

Admiral, see PMs.

Scar, post, goddammit. :)


I expected more people to have comments and/or complaints, because I got as close to borderline godmoding as I ever have. Or maybe people are still reading my post and haven't even quite caught up yet? :p

I should've had the attack all happen in one post, with the element of surprise eliminating everyone's chances to react. Although that would've been a bitch to write, it would've been less complicated. Anyone who wants to write a super-powered-bad-guys scene in five posts or less, take note. ;)

Speaking of super-powered, note that the group's attackers are superior to the group in the same way that any of our characters from Cantina could kick the asses of any of our characters here. Everyone is still inexperienced or underpowered or both. [Or simply extra-flawed.] SO FAR. These villains would be about on equal footing with the Cantina characters.

With the exception of Admiral's characters (Gerd is even superior to her C13 version), which is why they survived pretty much unscathed.


This bloody post [i]better not get eaten this time.

10-27-2004, 12:08 PM
Red: One word, bull.

I'm not angry but think about this.

Hal is holding a sword with both hands in a gaurd position, he's just holding it. The hilt is roughly at waist level and the blade is pointed foward about 30 degrees from straight up.

Now don't get me wrong, the Halbard is one bitch of a weapon but its best used against cavaly, its an axe-hook-spear. So if Tank man is just swing the weapon the best he could hope for is to knock Hal's weapon out of the way, which is no good as Hal would just drop his blade, disgage and stab the guy. Fair enough it wouldn't hurt tank man but he's look an idiot.

The only way I can see to disarm a swordsman with a Halbard is get the hook under the quillions and sort of leaver upwards, which probably wouldn't work unless you managed to slice the his fingers off.

Admiral may correct me but is seems like a cheaper shot the the one I pulled last wednesday during fencing when I just hit the guy's blade and then poked him in the chest.

10-27-2004, 12:33 PM
Sorry Red. I find it kinda hard to follow that up. Gortick hasn't yet removed sword...but I may once I've read the thread. I always go to discussion threads first, you see.

10-27-2004, 12:48 PM
Well, the idea was the if Hal tried to hold on to his sword his hands/wrists would have broken.

I agree with everything else. Really what I did was a cheat because you left till Wednesday. And it was an extremely cheap move. :) My thinking was that Hal would have parried rather than simply dropping his weapon, thinking "WTF is he doing?" since Hal does seem to like making his opponents look like idiots. ;)

If you want, I can edit, and have Hal simply drop his weapon, because that takes care of keeping him occupied. He probably would've gotten shot with a spell like Sir-vin while picking up his weapon [tracer spells, which is how the second try hit Idun, and hit Sir-vin], but if you think that makes him look like less of a prat, I'll do that. ;)

Deac: Ahhh, alright.

10-27-2004, 01:18 PM
Halberd are generally most effective against calvary since they have a very long reach to them. THis poses a problem for a swordsman since they have to get under the halberd to be effective. The more skilled on is with a halberd the harder it is for a swordsmen to get under the weapon*.

Now disarming an opponet is usually not done simply by hitting weapons against each other (unless one party has a very lax grip). The disarmer has to pin his opponents weapon and generally wrench it from their grasp. (simple explanation btw, don't feel like going into details)

A little bit about Halberds/polearms. There are some design with a hook in them allowing for trapping of an oppenets weapon. Rather effective and deadly.

Rules on parrying with a sword:
1st rule: If you given a choice between doding and parrying you dodge. No need to hurt the weapon.

2nd: Parry with the flat side of the blade if absolutely required.

*Under the weapon: Based the head of the halberd where the blade is and to a range close enough to use a sword with any effect.

Red by dropping his weapon, BD means lowering the blade. Putting it back in the ready position is something that takes a second. I should also note that dropping the blade is usually done to as part of a fient in an attack. EX: Heimdall takes an slashing swing over his head aimed at a Sith head. He then drops the blade mid swing and attacks the legs.

BD: Since you said quillins I take it BD's blade has a compound/complex hilt and not just a simple cross guard?

10-27-2004, 01:24 PM
Can't believe the MOD for the JKII RP forums is godmoding. For shame. Oh well, I guess I can now godmode without you stopping me cause then you'd be a hippopotamus hypocrite

10-27-2004, 01:40 PM
Oh. Well I feel somewhat more like a doofus. :)

Tell you what, I'll just go ahead and edit. :p

JM; Shaddup ;)

10-27-2004, 01:54 PM
Just so everyone has a rough idea on the amount of tents it is about 1.8 million

10-28-2004, 02:34 PM
Admiral: No, simple crossgaurd. Its just a straight bar with some engraving and the trademark wolf's heads.

As to what I meant, Hal lowers his blade, causing the Halbard to pass through the air, then, before the guy can get the weapon back across he steps foward and lunges, aiming roughly at the midsection.

Red: The Halbard is not really a great weapon for one guy on his own. You can't use it in a close packed situation and if you fail to engage your enemy's blade you have to be able to bring that six foot pole back across fast to block his repost.

As to breaking anyone's hands thats more rubbish, any swordsman knows that have to keep a firmt but relaxed grip. The blade is held firmly but your wrist has to be able to take the impact of a blow, if you lock your arm up you will break something, you'll aslo end up with very bad cramp :D

As always, if I am wrong I bow to Admiral's greater knowlegde of individual combat. I know how to use the men who know how to use the weapons.

10-28-2004, 03:42 PM
The halberd is this guy's weapon of choice because he's strong enough to rip apart a close-packed situation with his 'six-foot pole', and he doesn't need to be blocking very many blows with that armor.

And, you don't get what I was trying to say about breaking wrists. The idea was that Hal's sword would've been hit with such force that there was no way he could've kept holding it. You can't "take the impact" of being hit by enough force to send a truck flying.

Of course, I didn't take into account that Hal could've just lowered his blade, as you also mentioned, which is why I edited.

10-28-2004, 07:06 PM
BD: Remember that a body can only take so much before something gives (aka bones breaking).

More on Halberd fighting. Keep in mind that every part of a medieval weapon had a use in hurting your oppenent. Halberds, Polearms, spears are sometimes designed with a spike on the butt of the weapon. Allowing for the weapon to be ramed down on the foot of an opponet.

As in one on one combat the Halberd definetly stands on it's own. One can argue that a Halberd has the advantage over a sword especially in skilled hands.

Given the sparse facts on the fight I would say Red's character had a very good chance to defeat Hal.

I will also note that this isn't a very important occurance and really isn't worth getting to angry over.

*Side Note*

Once this scene with Tanara is over I plan on doing another time skip to the feast. This will be where the group can ask any questions about the coming battle.

10-29-2004, 08:47 AM
Admiral: I thought we were just discussing this to pass the time.

As to the force of a truck hitting his hands, well okay. I can live with that. You didn't state that Tank Man's armour was stength inhancing.

On a general halbard point, I'd say that its one of those cases where it depends who's using it. That aside the weapon is undeniably effective, provided you have the space to use it.

10-29-2004, 10:43 AM
I didn't?


5) Gray Armor Being: Basically a tank. Blasters, lightsaber useless. Slower than the others, though.

Hm, oops.

A few details, while we're on the subject, and because I can:

Tank Man [Trern] has to be super-strong already just to wear the armor. The armor itself is made of dense material of a sort normally worn in a thin sheet. Blades and Shadows both incorporate this material in their suits, but they don't use more than that standard thin sheet. You need extensive training just to use a full suit of THAT efficiently; it's very stiff. Trern's armor is made up of many, many layers of this material. Anyone without strength enhancements already wouldn't be able to move in it. So actually his strength is being lessened (but still far greater than a normal being) but on the other hand he's protected enough that he won't break his OWN hands hitting something at full strength - something like the truck I mentioned. Plus, obviously enemies are going to have a difficult time getting through all those layers.

10-31-2004, 07:10 PM
JM: From my understanding Matt was soley on Enoy before the group found him, and the Aesir's camp on Midgard was the first time that Matt encountered Drago.

Under these facts how did Matt know Drago's name?

10-31-2004, 07:19 PM
Admiral: Trust me..........Just do, OK?

11-01-2004, 01:00 PM
JM: If ONLY that excuse worked with so meny things I have come up with... XD

11-01-2004, 06:15 PM
Uh...JM...I trust you PMed BD about this?

Otherwise he's gonna be pretty lost...like I am ;)

Are we supposed to recognize Car'nessa? Lord Briscoe?

Also, Drago hasn't exactly been a public figure...

Again, I hope this was done with BD's approval ;)

11-04-2004, 11:17 AM
Battle of Vidgrid Information

Loki's Army:

Fenris Brood-----------1,078,082,181

((The five missing are Hel, Loki, Fenrir, Jormungand, Lokpihet))

Vidar's Army



1. Fighting will occur between Dawn and Dusk, roughly 14 hours. Battle will commence when a Rooster crows and ends when it Crows for a second time at Dusk.

2. THe Figthing will be in the plains of Vidgrid. No side will have an advantage in terrain

3. No ranged attacks. Anyone trying to use a range attack will be thrown into the mist of the opposing army where they will be swiftly killed

4. No communication between Noncombatants and those fighting. If one try's to use telepathy, a communicator etc. Noncombatant status will be removed and the offending person be thrown into the mist of the opposing army

5. No Calvary

6. At Dusk each side will remove themselves from the field. Attacks will not be effective after the Rooster crows a second time. Noncombatants after dusk may enter the battlefield and the wounded or dead may be removed.

7. No one may leave the planet or land on the planet between the Sounding of the Horn Gjallar and the end of the battle.

8. The dawn of the following day all the above rules are no longer applicable.


Info for those in the group wanting to fight:

Group members fighting will be assigned to a unit. Disobedience will not be tolerated within that unit. The group members fighting will be expected to:

1. Follow orders without questioning them or complaining. Failure to follow orders will result in execution. Complaining about them means the group members will not be allowed to fight or they get assigned a worse task.

2. Act in a mature manner. Failure in this will be treated similar to the punishment for complaining.


Any Questions?

11-04-2004, 12:27 PM
Is there a possibility of retreat for non Aesir? Suppose one of them got wounded and wanted out.

11-04-2004, 01:58 PM
Have you ever sconsidered creating a compasionate character? :)

I take it the Asier are going to fight stupid (honorably)?

11-04-2004, 06:50 PM
Deac: No, once a character is on the field they have to stay until the end of the battle. No Retreating.

BD: Compasionate character is Idun, and no it is not stupid for the Aesir to fight.

11-04-2004, 07:20 PM
To BD and Admiral: Well wether or not it's stupid depends on your point of view....

11-04-2004, 07:41 PM
JM: The Aesir are fighting in the hopes of reducing the number of Fenris Brood and Heloki. As well as having a chance at removing the Jotuns. This would make things easier for the group and is well worth it.

There are other reasons but that is the main one.

Remember there is also just one ship off the planet, and the Asgardried cannot hold all the Aesir.

The Aesir are doomed one way or another. This battle gives them the best chance to do the most damage.

11-04-2004, 07:46 PM
Originally posted by Admiral
JM: The Aesir are fighting in the hopes of reducing the number of Fenris Brood and Heloki. As well as having a chance at removing the Jotuns. This would make things easier for the group and is well worth it.

There are other reasons but that is the main one.

Remember there is also just one ship off the planet, and the Asgardried cannot hold all the Aesir.

The Aesir are doomed one way or another. This battle gives them the best chance to do the most damage.
Ah, OK.

11-05-2004, 04:34 AM
Admiral, not to put too finer point on it but the best chance of doing the most damage would have been not to blow up the galaxy.

As to my last comment a better way of putting it would be, will they fight Saxon or Roman.

11-05-2004, 08:42 AM
Wrong BD: Things would have been worse. Much worse if they didn't.

and they will be fighting in Schiltrons.

The reason why I choose Schiltrons vs PHalanxs, or other formations is that Schiltrons form an entirely circular defense. Where a phalanx tends to have their backs and a side exposed. (Not good when surrounded).

Schiltrons basically form a shield wall with weaker units in the center, stronger ones along the perimeter. Now those in a Schiltron need to be very disciplined and have had a lot of practice with the formation, especially when the formation moves For obvious reason.

And this is going to be the Key to why the Aesir are not dead in 20 minutes. At the center of each Schiltron will be a healer like Idun.

As an Aesir becomes wounded the formation will essentially walks over the soldier until the wounded man is at the center with the healer. Once the soldier has been treated they take up a place in the last ring.

BD. As you see this formation creates the shield wall Drago had initially suggested also allows for the rotation of troops. Those who had been fighting the most can drop to the ground and the formation walks over putting the tired soldier at the center fresh ones in the front.

I will also point out that ranged attacks can quickly destroy schiltrons. And people wonder why I outlawed such attacks early on. ;)

and you may wonder why the group not encouraged to fight: well they have had no practice with schiltrons. It is also why there is no room for people not following orders. When the one in charge tells the formation to move right they all must do so as one.

11-05-2004, 11:11 AM
About the battle:

I need to know who is and who isn't fighting. If I don't get a reply I'm assuming your characters are not going to fight (that being the smart choice). Reason don't need to be given, that can be done in RPG just name something along the lines: Orthos if going to fight, Ellela and Gortick are not.

Currently those fighting (that I'm positive of):

Not Fighting: Everoyone else *at this point*

11-05-2004, 11:29 AM
Aidan is going to fight.

Guy, Marin, and Raschel are not.

11-05-2004, 02:08 PM
well you already know that the Irvines gotta take part ;)

11-05-2004, 03:34 PM
So the answer would be smart:D

Drago and Hal will fight.

The House Gaurds will try to fight but Hal will try to get them to protect Allessa instead.

Obviously a couple of my legions would rip your precious Asier apart. *Ridiculas boast.*

11-05-2004, 03:57 PM
Prolly not, I would favor the Aesir in a fight agenst your legions

from a human training all his life, to an aesir who had been training for ragnarok for eons

the aesir would win no contest :)

11-05-2004, 04:05 PM
If it's a matter of training, and quality of weapons, the Aesir win. If BD's legions are Force-sensitive and trained in arts that the Aesir were not trained in, then it's more up in the air. ;)

11-05-2004, 04:59 PM
Isnt the Aesir also force sensitive?

11-05-2004, 05:31 PM
Ya, but there are different ways of using the Force...

Too much discussion over BD's joke ;)

So, so far we have:

Fighting: Orthos, Aidan, Tanara, Sir-Vin, Cracern, Hal, Drago.

Not fighting: Guy, Marin, Raschel, Matt, Ellela, Gortick.

That leaves...well, that really just leaves Ritchet. And I dunno if Ritchet could really fight in the battle according to how the Aesir are playing this XD but really it's up to superthrawn...

11-05-2004, 07:26 PM
Matt's definetely not fighting. He couldn't realistically survive.

11-05-2004, 08:49 PM
Don't know what is funnier, BD's comment or that Scar was argueing about it.

anyways in case any of you think that your characters are going to survive this battle without a scratch think again. They will be hurt, there is simple no way to avoid this except for them not fighting.

11-06-2004, 03:44 AM
I was in an arguementive mood :)

it just happens to be not with you or red at the time :D

11-06-2004, 04:31 AM
One on one my Legions would rip Admiral's current forces to bits. Why?

Longbows, Horse Archers, Lancers, not to mention Barbarian Northmen and Car'nessa javalin men, plus the myriad other special troops.

Then We have 30,000 Battledogs, 6,000 Golden Lions, 12,000 Sword Brothers and 8,000 Men of the Shore.

The fact is though that I can only field 200,000 Legionaries and around 400,000-500,000 Reserves and I can't use all of those for one battle.

Fielding all 56,000 Noble Warriors is also impossible.

11-06-2004, 04:39 AM
cus admiral's forces are roughly 5 million

11-06-2004, 08:36 AM
That is funny BD, wrong but funny.

Your are making many assumptions about the Aesir's forces based on a battle with specific rules that outlaw Calvary, and ranged weapons.

You are also forgetting the Drakes that fight alonside the Aesir. Given no rules against ranged weapons they would reign fire down upon your legions before they got in range to use their longbows.

Also forgetting about the Futhark users who could put up shields that would make your legions ranged attacks useless, and well could refelct such attacks back at them. (handy trick).

You assume that the Aesir would not field calvary, again that is wrong. They actually have a long tradition of mounted combat. (In the true form of Ragnarok, Calvary is not outlawed, nor is ranged weapons btw).

Then you assume that they wouldn't have any ranged attacks of their own. Again that is wrong, Archery is another popular form of combat for the Aesir.

The beauty of living for so long is that you can train and become proficient in many different types of weapons.

Oh, you also forgot that if ranged weapons are allowed, they have weapons that fight on their own (remember Raschel's gun in the last thread). Each Aesir on the field could have a number of guns hovering over them and shooting at the enemy.

and that is just the tip of the iceberg. This battle is as limiting to the Aesir as it is to their enemies.

Reaons why Ranged attacks are outlawed:

1. Didn't feel like using them.

2. 5 Drakes with their fire would make the battle end very quickly. Even with the 3 friendly drakes, there is still 2 free enemy drakes that can send fire at the Aesir and kill many in a single pass.

3. Jotuns can launch fire balls, and frost/ice balls a great distance wanted to limit that ability in this fight (make things more interesting)

4. The Aesir's "mages" could caste defensive shields that would repulse attacks of the enemy and possible send them back at whoever initiated the attack (this is considered a ranged weapon/attack). I wanted to limit this as well.

and some more.

Reasons for No calvary:

1. Wanted to make things harder on the Aesir by depriving them of that option. Heloki in a way are the enemy form of calvary.

2. I wanted a pure melee fight.

and a some more reasons.

11-06-2004, 03:24 PM
I said my forces, if they numbered five million, would waste your no ranged attaks current force. I am quite aware that without these restrictions you'd wipe my forces off the face of the earth.

However, since we're on the subject I have few surprises of my own.

As you may by no have gathered force sensitivity is more common among Agamarians.

As a rough figure, if a Lord has five sons one of them will be strong enough in the force to be trained. If he has five daughters then two will be strong enough for serious training.

This makes the Futhark rather less funky.


I have a mental image of the two armies playing tennis with all those arrows :D

11-08-2004, 07:36 PM
Some more battle information:

Each of the characters fighting will be in a seperate Schiltron. The schiltrons are controled soley by the Aesir and they will ignore any recommendations any characters make.

The characters in the schiltrons are in the center of the formation with the healer and are somewhat safe, they will not be rotated to the font of the formation. Their combat will truely begin once the Schiltrons begin to fail (this will be due to taking loses and them no longer having the ability to hold the formation due to lack of people.

Certain characters who have specific enemies to fight will not be in a schiltron. They will be at the front of the army and will be ignored by the enemy army (Example: Heimdall is going after Loki, and loki after him. Each army is going to ignore the two and let them fight to their hearts content). Reason it is how Ragnarok occurs.

Characters in Schiltrons:
Sir Vin

Characters in the front:

Posting: Hopefully tomorrow I will advance time again and have it be dawn right before the battle begins, allowing for some reactions if anyone wants to.

2nd post will be a short talk between the two sides.

3rd post will advance time again bringing to a point where all characters will be involved in the fighting.

Deac, WJ your two characters will be fighting against their opponents from the start so please don't think I'm trying to limit your characters action just don't want don't want to have everyone waiting a while.

*This may change depending on work etc.

11-08-2004, 11:00 PM
Um, I assume the schiltrons form after the short talk between the two sides, considering that's the point when everyone will know who's facing who?

Further explanation: See PMs.

11-09-2004, 11:14 AM
Wow! Tanara's at the front? Red only told me that Tanara was supposed to be in the battle! Gosh, can I have a little more info or am I going to find out who my opponent is when we actually start the fight? Either way works for me... whatever you decide.

11-09-2004, 05:59 PM
The short talk will be between the commanders of the two armies. The most of the group (that is fighting) will be well within the Aesir's formation. But since all have a Jedi's ability to increase their sight and hearing they should be able to hear what is going on.


Vidar vs Fenrir
Heimdall vs Loki
Tyr vs Jormungand
Freya vs Hel
Forseti vs Surt A Fire Jotun
Svafa vs Geirrod A Frost Jotun
Hirst vs Kari A Fire Jotun
Idona vs Blast a Fire Jotun
Gunn vs Gjlap a Frost Jotun
Sigrun vs Greip a Frost Jotun
Orthos vs Lokpihet
Tanara vs Darth Hellion (A High Dark Lord of the Sith)

Why is it that I have assigned Tanara to fight a Sith Lord?

It is rather simple. When I compare all the jedi characters, Tanara is the best Jedi around and at the moment the only one who really can claim the title of Jedi Knight in my opinion.

11-09-2004, 07:19 PM
Originally posted by Admiral
The short talk will be between the commanders of the two armies. The most of the group (that is fighting) will be well within the Aesir's formation. But since all have a Jedi's ability to increase their sight and hearing they should be able to hear what is going on.


Vidar vs Fenrir
Heimdall vs Loki
Tyr vs Jormungand
Freya vs Hel
Forseti vs Surt A Fire Jotun
Svafa vs Geirrod A Frost Jotun
Hirst vs Kari A Fire Jotun
Idona vs Blast a Fire Jotun
Gunn vs Gjlap a Frost Jotun
Sigrun vs Greip a Frost Jotun
Orthos vs Lokpihet
Tanara vs Darth Hellion (A High Dark Lord of the Sith)

Why is it that I have assigned Tanara to fight a Sith Lord?

It is rather simple. When I compare all the jedi characters, Tanara is the best Jedi around and at the moment the only one who really can claim the title of Jedi Knight in my opinion.
Really? I thought you'd put her against a sith lord to solve her personality disorder.

11-09-2004, 08:30 PM
JM, you don't need to quote the entire post especially since you posted right after me.

Secondly it could make Tanara's second personalty come to the surface and possible take control. Of course that is up to WJ.

11-09-2004, 08:39 PM
Admiral didn't say that was his ONLY reason, you know. :)

(Disregard my last post, Admiral and I have had (more) extensive discussion about it over PMs/Instant Messenger, which is really unnecessary to relate here.)

11-09-2004, 09:43 PM
But the bottom line here is that none of us are going to escape this battle without injury, right? Will any of us defeat our opponents? or is that up to us?

11-10-2004, 05:49 AM
*Grumble. Grumble.*

I'm not even going to say it this time, but if you want a great warrior to fight a Sith....................

Beyond that, what about Elella, doesn't she have a sabre staff as well?

11-10-2004, 08:51 AM
Elella has an orange lightsaber. She's never had a double one...

11-10-2004, 10:00 AM
Ok, I'm not going to argue with you about your own characters.

11-10-2004, 10:05 AM
Ellela is not fighting.

WJ: Given the size of the enemy army it is impossible to fight and not recieve some kind of wound (and a small cut doesn't count). Your charater only needs to worry about Darth Hellion and there is always a chance for them to be victorious.

11-10-2004, 12:06 PM
Am I right in thinking that somebody else will be controlling Darth Hellion? So therefore it would be that person's decision if Tanara wins... I can only defend her as best I can... BTW, she'll be loosing an arm if I have anything to say about it... her left arm. That's not a minor cut if you ask me!:p

11-10-2004, 12:52 PM
Ah, that I missed, Admiral.

I'm not sure whats going to happen to Hal. I don't want to perminatly cripple him so I'm not sure what to do. I mean I've given the guy so many knocks, he's now lost his whole family, he almost slipped over to the darkside in that temple, the Asier hate him.

The guy has just started to recover. I mean compared with the last two threads he's on the up.


Or does he still seem like a psychotic meat head with two lightsabres and a ridiculasly inflated ego?

11-10-2004, 01:33 PM
Um, thats how all your characters are :P

j/k XD

11-10-2004, 02:22 PM

Flax is the classic Warrior Statesman, adept both on the field and in the Senate. He is also a deep thinker, a compassionate man. However he has a naturally violent temper which occasionally erupts.

Kal is the apprentice Jedi, any of his faults are a result of Deac's neglect. :D He is generally thoughtful and given to considered action, his brother thinks he is not decisive enough

Mirra Is the ideal noblewoman, kind compassionate, she can play the harp and the flute. She's still very young so she's not as asertive as she might be. She's also more than politically competant, although again because of her age and station its not that evident, yet.

Sophae is politically deadly and and if she hadn't married Flax at 19 she might have been a bit of a man eater. She knows she's gorgeous and she likes to pull men's stings a little from time to time.

Sellenna: She's politically deadly and she didn't marry Flax, or anyone else so she really enjoys wrapping men around her little finger, that said she doesn't exactly have a mile long list of lovers.

Dasken works, fights, does his laundry. He's a carier officer who started out as a pilot, went spook and is now a pilot again. He's not contrained by Jedi morals and he's willing to do what needs to be done. That said he's a good guy.

Allessa she comes from a culture where women are spoiled and being beutiful and marrying a handsome man are the two most impotant things in the universe. For some reason I can't fathom she's head over heals for Halren Flax (He's tall, so what?). She has a good heart but its burried under a fair bit of fluff.

Drago is a fanatically devoted warrior, he drinks, gambles and practices cutting the left wing off flys with his longsword. In PtH he still hasn't got his wife back so he dies of alchohol poisaning at every opertunity. In the Cantina he's concerend with keeping his hugely traumatised wife sane and helping her adapt to the wider galaxy, so he's off the source. He generally has good advice and he'll stay sober until you tell him he has a day off.

Hal, well; He's pretty screwed up in PtH, in the Cantina he's a combination of his two role models, his father and Drago.

11-10-2004, 02:26 PM
He will not be permanetly crippled.

using Hal as an example:

When the battle is over Hal has multiple shallow cuts to his arms, A cut on his thigh, and has a lot of bruses.

Maybe he has a bloody nose, a couple cuts on the face

He can walk off the field and will heal in a couple of days.

The reasons for this is that the numbers of the enemy army and the type of fighting dictate that one can't leave unscathed and a single shallow cut doesn't count.

Also the Aesir do not hate Hal (You will see..)

WJ: That is something I think we can accomadate rather easily.

11-10-2004, 04:17 PM
Deac, I hope you're not planning on killing Orthos just because he died in Cantina. He's an interesting character! :D

Besides, the universe deals EVERYONE a death card...;)

BD: Hal is an interesting character, but he rarely acts very Jedilike. :D He's not quite a psychotic meathead, though ;)

11-10-2004, 04:44 PM
*wonders if putting "j/k"'s and "XD"'s in posts actually means for someone to be taken more seriously*

WJ: Yeah, even I would have a Sith to play ^_^

11-10-2004, 07:02 PM
WJ: Actually here anything less than a coma-inducing injury is minor.

11-11-2004, 03:54 AM
He is getting better though, when he's not in the threads I have him in perminant therapy.

*Hal is sat on the counch while Freud sits in a comfy chair.*

Freud: Tell me about your mother.

Hal: She's dead.

Freud: Ah, then tell me about you father.

Hal: He's dead.

Freud: Ziss may take a vhile.

Actually I was planning on having his hield arm shattered by a Heloki.

11-11-2004, 11:55 AM
Well, wildjedi, now that I can actually answer your questions...:D

Originally posted by wildjedi
Am I right in thinking that somebody else will be controlling Darth Hellion? So therefore it would be that person's decision if Tanara wins... I can only defend her as best I can... BTW, she'll be loosing an arm if I have anything to say about it... her left arm. That's not a minor cut if you ask me!:p

Obviously, I will be. :D But it's not my decision, so to speak, as to who wins, or what actually happens. ^_~

Note, Misae will be much more powerful as a Sith than the group knew her as a Jedi. All that (hardly secret) anger, hatred, and lust for vengeance she's been carrying with her since the Holocaust...

Finally, for those introducing new characters, or family of new characters (;)), note that the current plan is that early next thread, the group is going to be crossing dimensions. (Not without a few stops first, though.) Also, there will be no several-month time skip between threads; just a day or so, this time. However, there may be a time skip of years involved near the middle/end of the thread, while in another dimension. Characters may or may not age in this time hiccup. This time skip may be as long as 18-19 years; anyone not with the group would be older by that number of years when the skip is over. This may affect people's future plans, and if that is going to be a problem then the skip can be delayed some time (even several threads, to put it near the end of the PtH chapters). The purpose of this skip is to leap over the twenty years required for the Holocaust timeline to end. (plus it's an interesting story idea.)

Just something to think about. :)

Also, everyone with their own story ideas may be interested to know that while I have (most of) the next PtH chapter planned out, (more details on this later), the chapter after that, Admiral and I have planned absolutely nothing for. :) (I have a couple ideas, but they could just be subplots.)

11-11-2004, 02:50 PM
Hmmmmmmm, Allessa and Hal need to stay together.

I was going to have Drago and his two mates dropped off.

That is, of course, unless everyone votes that he's so cool he has to stay!:D

I have something that needs doing before any time skips, it will probably involve a two day jaunt, depending on how fast the Asgardried is.

11-11-2004, 06:42 PM
BD. The Asgardried is to put it simply the fastest ship in the galaxy. The Slipstream drive is far faster then hyperspace.

Doesn't mean that the ship will be going where you want though. ;)

11-11-2004, 08:51 PM
I want Tanara's sister introduced before the time skip... she's gotta be younger than Tanara at all times... just gotta be that way, ok?:) Things won't work if it's not that way.

11-11-2004, 09:11 PM
Originally posted by Admiral
BD. The Asgardried is to put it simply the fastest ship in the galaxy. The Slipstream drive is far faster then hyperspace.

Doesn't mean that the ship will be going where you want though. ;)

Not necessarily. Warp-space travel can be far faster. On the other hand it can be slower...it's less predictable. :)

BD: I think it could be really interesting if Drago stayed with the group, for the time being at least. :D

wildjedi: I figured as much, which is why I'm mentioning this now. (Maybe I ought to just put 'Do we time-skip now or later?' up to a vote next thread :D)

11-11-2004, 09:34 PM
Red, the time skip doesn't have to be delayed long... just a few posts into the next chapter even... as long as it takes me to confirm that Tanara's sister (called Elaina, BTW) is going along with her sister... I've got a little plan for the two of them... if you want the details so you can plan it into the thread, PM me.

11-12-2004, 04:38 AM
The problem is I have an army of what amounts to mad Saxo-Celtoi-Vikings. If I don't give them some leadership they'll, well..... Viking.

11-12-2004, 10:34 AM
F***, let BD's forces join up with what remains of the Aesir forces for the duration of when the group is outside the dimension

IE: Drago and Allessa and Vidar (maybe??? i donno ^_^) come up with an agreement, due to the fact that the Sith armies are so large, and BD's and Admiral's armies basically have the same goal. reguardless of the situations, and/or opinions on how 'fit' each other's armies are (size and how trained they are...)

but thats just in my humble opinion

11-12-2004, 11:05 AM
Originally posted by wildjedi
Red, the time skip doesn't have to be delayed long... just a few posts into the next chapter even... as long as it takes me to confirm that Tanara's sister (called Elaina, BTW) is going along with her sister... I've got a little plan for the two of them... if you want the details so you can plan it into the thread, PM me.

The time skip won't happen, if it does happen next thread, until at least midway through the plotline. I'm guessing you mean the dimension jump? :)

BD: Would that be such a bad thing? :)

("You've been viking again, haven't you? I can tell by your hat.")

Oh, and just so you know Scar, the remainder of the Aesir's forces will be going along with the group across dimensions at this point, subject to Admiral's final decision.

11-12-2004, 11:18 AM
BD: I wonder if Drago will remember what he told Vidar when he first arrived on the planet.

Scar: Only a handful of Aesir are going to survive the encounter, and they are staying on the Asgardried which will be crossing dimensions.

Side Note:
and going viking means going on a voyage nothing about raiding and plundering. Although I have to wonder why these goodguys would be plundering in the first place. ;)

11-12-2004, 11:33 AM
I know what it meant, I just don't understand why it's a bad thing for the story. This is about the end of the universe, and BD's forces will not survive it anyway. ;)

11-12-2004, 01:21 PM
Originally posted by Redwing
The time skip won't happen, if it does happen next thread, until at least midway through the plotline. I'm guessing you mean the dimension jump? :)

Of course... I think :confused: :D Ya, before dimension jump... Elaina has to be with them through that so she's not left behind in the time skip... ok? (I've just totally confused myself... did I confuse you guys too?:D )

11-12-2004, 01:39 PM
Originally posted by Redwing
is about the end of the universe,
*Starts singing 'it's the end of the world and we know it'*

11-12-2004, 01:55 PM
Originally posted by wildjedi
Of course... I think :confused: :D Ya, before dimension jump... Elaina has to be with them through that so she's not left behind in the time skip... ok? (I've just totally confused myself... did I confuse you guys too?:D )

No, that's what I thought you meant. ;)

That's exactly the issue that might come up with everyone else, which is why I'm bringing it up (and am willing to delay it indefinitely if there are any issues) :D

11-12-2004, 03:04 PM
Admiral: Drago does remember. You don't think he'd "forget" do you. If he heard you say that you'd be in serious smelly brown stuff.

At any rate Vidar never said he was going to take Drago up on the offer and I'd say that if Allessa doesn't get off the planet then the deal will be off. (Along with a few Asier heads, if Hal has anything to do with it.)

As to Viking, you know as well as I do that the meaning of words gets twisted and while I've also seen it translated as port I think everyone got the meaning I intended.

Reference Scar's opinion of my forces, well, since he doesn't have his own army I think his opinion is moot.

In adition, for the purposes of my own reference I am compiling a tome on Agamar.

Brief History


Conflict between Commons Parliament and Noble Senate


A detailed breakdown of the military, including variations in Legionary formations, precise numbers for each territory and an illustrated weapons guide.

If anyone's interested maybe I could make it available for download.

11-12-2004, 03:14 PM

11-12-2004, 03:32 PM
I'm interested. :)

I'm doing something similar, mostly because I have to. >< A webcomic, a novel (first chapter written, need to write more to submit for next workshop class ^^;;), and the RPGs here...I need to keep my notes straight! :D

Although it's more of an outline than yours looks to be, BD; reason, because I'm constantly developing the world, through writing as well as art, and I like leaving room to add stuff.

I had the idea of making a sort of group world-building/revealing/describing-type project, since I have the Aether, you have Agamar, Admiral has the Aesir culture, and Deac has Mrear and [can't remember the name, am half-asleep :D] Deac's culture. (JM, Scar or whoever else wanted to join could make something else up. :D) We'd use something like the questions from here (http://www.sfwa.org/writing/worldbuilding1.htm), roughly, for example, and post a couple things per day, or something. Since everyone keeps saying how they need to finish writing/compiling/etc their 'world bibles', I'm curious to know what you of this idea :)

Second topic: As for the armies and Scar's opinions, I do think you are very much underestimating the Aesir. There is no way that, in a match between a force of Agamarians and Aesir of equal numbers that Aesir would win. The Aesir are all adults are between a hundred and hundreds of thousands years of age. They all are Force-sensitive, and have had all that time in their adult life to become extremely skilled and versatile with whatever they chose to. All that experience, plus superior military technology - better weapons and armor. Add in the fact that they are ultra-paranoid and thus likely to be much better prepared, and will likely know everything about their enemy forces if at all possible (and it's very much possible in this case). The Agamarian army has no possible edge over all this from what you've listed. Ignoring ranged weapons and eliminating the Futhark gives the same result.

11-12-2004, 03:37 PM
I have no imaginacion/time/energy to come up with my own culture. :p

11-13-2004, 06:38 AM
While I broadly aggree with you I need to make a few points in defence of my people.

1. After you achieve mastery of a weapon you don't have much more to do. You can only know so many moves, combinations etc and you can only get so fast.

2. Agamarian Warriors train exaustivly with two or three weapons. For example.

Bow & Shortsword

Shortsword & Spear

Lance & Longsword & Shortsword

So although they're not as versatile they're highly specialized.

Added to this the Noble Orders (I refuse to use the word Knight, I'm actually leaning toward creating my own title) are fanatically dedicated warriors, thats why out of all the nobles there are only around 150-200,000 on the whole planet.

So although Admiral's Asier would win it would be really painful.

As to thw "World Bible" I should have something to show you around Christmas time.

11-13-2004, 06:39 AM
Santa BD is coming to town.....

11-13-2004, 11:07 PM
Originally posted by Redwing
I had the idea of making a sort of group world-building/revealing/describing-type project <<snip>>

We'd use something like the questions from here (http://www.sfwa.org/writing/worldbuilding1.htm), roughly, for example, and post a couple things per day, or something.

I prolly should have pointed out that this would be done in a new thread. :D

It could be treated like an RPG, answer one question a day (or several days). When complete, we'd have approximentations of world bibles, that could be used for RPGs.

Anyone interested in doing this? Coz I don't want to post this, and then be the only one replying in the thread! :D

(BD, if you want to do your Agamarian Bible on your own, you could do some other RPG world 'Bible'...like the End of the World RPG (a world which I find a tad confusing), as the list I referenced does allow for alternate Earths as well as "not Earth at all" worlds ;))

11-14-2004, 07:45 AM
Sounds fun. I'm in.

11-14-2004, 10:40 AM
I'm in but any answers I give in the thread will be subject to revision when I release my "final" version.

11-14-2004, 05:58 PM
Does seem like a good way to flush out my Aesir so I'm in.

11-15-2004, 02:27 PM
Woo. ^_^

BD: That goes without saying (and same disclaimer for me)

Will make said thread later on when I'm not supposed to be studying for a test that I have in an hour. :D

11-16-2004, 07:58 PM
Okay, PtH questions:

1) Do the undead Sith get their body parts reattached immediately when they're removed, or do they have to die before they fully reconstitute?

2) Did the Aesir make wing-armor for Aidan as well as armor for the rest of his body? [Not too far-fetched considering how light mithril is, but it woud require alot of extra mithril to cover all that...]

11-17-2004, 08:27 AM

1.) Yes a sith needs to die before they reconsistute. Until they die they cannot reform.

2.) Yes. Just like Raschel has armor for her tail.

11-17-2004, 01:58 PM

Originally posted by BattleDog
((I stand by my assessment of the swords, since they should have short swords, and daggers.

As to the helms, since the Heloki seem to be able to rip it apart anyway..... Well.))

Well mithril is (at least nearly) impenetrable by lightsabers, which is very important here as there are many more Sith than Heloki. Also, while the Heloki have armor-piercing claws, it still takes a moment to pierce the armor, I assume...imagine what would happen to a bare head.

Originally posted by Admiral
((Sorry but I have to run, tonight I plan on posting one of the indivdual fights in it's entirety (just to make things simple since I have a number of them) ))

I assume you mean fights between your own characters?

Also: See PMs.

11-19-2004, 09:32 AM
Red and BD: about that first part.

Yes it takes a second before the Heloki can puncuture the armor. And do not forget about the Fenris brood (they haven't played a large part since this battle doesn't play to there strenghts). Bare heads with a Heloki's claw could mean in short order a missing head.

Another thing about long swords. They have greater reach then short swords and can be designed for stabing. Also as the formations fail and one finds himself with more room you then can take full advantage of a longsword. Where Hal switched weapons, the Aesir do not and that is far better since they do not have to be defenseless even for a second.

Yes I mean my own characters.



As a reminder, the Sith Interrogator would not pause in the middle of this fight to capture anyone. Since Cracern has been given what amounts to a death blow they would go past him onto the others to make sure no Aesir survive.

Also the Interrogator is at the bottom of the Sith Ranks and wouldn't have anyone under his command. Keep in mind when they captured Sir Vin they wanted to know how many others were on the planet. They don't want that information and turning them isn't high on their list of things to do.

11-19-2004, 10:26 AM
Also, what information could Cracern give that Misae can't? :)

11-19-2004, 10:31 AM
i donno, i wanted to throw him in somewhere

11-23-2004, 01:06 PM
Okay, I've been thinking: How about having one of the keys on Tarsis.

The main hook with this place is the total blanket "no tech" rule.

The idea being that anything you bring fails, so there's no point. They'd also be stuck there until a pre-aranged time or visual signal for the Asgardried to pick them up.

In adition the group would get hit with about every mythalogical creature we haven't yet seen and I really want to do a pitched battle with some of my legions.

11-23-2004, 07:26 PM
Mythological creature? Wait until you see next thread...

But, sure! I definitely like that idea. In fact, if you look at the draft framework for PtH, you see the plan goes something like this:

PtH 6: My universe (alternate Earth/Magic world)
PtH 7: ?
PtH 8: Fire (Phoenix Gate)
PtH 9: Eye (of Odin)
PtH 10: Ice (Unsure)
PtH 11: Time Matrix

So, PtH 7 really needs a setting...which could be, totally or partially, Tarsis. (Or Tarsis could be a setting in a later thread, of course.) That's from a purely plot standpoint. What do you think?

11-23-2004, 08:46 PM
Taris does sound interesting.

Although by the time the group returns to the current dimension The Sith will be in control of galaxy. Although I'm sure Drago and your legions would make a nice little resistance force.

11-23-2004, 09:02 PM
That depends. The 'Great Time Skip' doesn't HAVE to happen next thread although it's the most convenient place for it.

I don't think that would interfere with the group being able to go to Tarsis, though.

Side note: BD, do you want Drago to tag along to see Earth's magic world, or leave the group before they dimension-skip?

Oh, and incidentally I am posting that worldbuilding thread either tonight or tomorrow (er - *looks at clock* later today). :)

11-23-2004, 11:07 PM
I think Drago should stay with the Legions, I'm not quite sure at the moment since he should have conflicting responsibilities.

Like I said the hook with Tarsis is the no-tech thing, which leaves the Sith in the lurch without lightsabres. I can invisage the entire Lahara sector Legionary Force (whats left of it) hiding on Tarsis and using it as base. Since ships can land and take off and as soon as something leaves the planet it starts working again.

The reason you don't take tech there is incase the Tarsae capture it and then somehow get off Tarsis.

Flax will be going there in the Cantina next thread so you'll get a look at it anyway. Obviously I don't want to unravel the whole world now.

I'm not really happy with the time skip. 20 years is going to screw with the characters too much, I think. How about four or five smaller jumps.

If we do a twenty year skip Hal will just turn into his father.

11-24-2004, 05:44 AM
Well there are two ways to do this time skip.

1. Normal way everyone gets older. This could be interesting the group not getting anywhere with the quest and just chasing false leads.

As to Hal turning into Flax, that could happen but it is not very hard to see him turning into someone compeltely different.

2. The group gets caught in a time bubble where time moves slowly for them. The get out of the bubble and twenty years have passeed, for them it seems like a day or a week (etc).

This option in my opinion has a lot of fun possibilities to offer. With Hal & Drago: Hal thinking hes been out of touch for a week, not twenty years returns to find Drago who believed he was dead. Then finding the galaxy is now a giant slave labor camp to make things worse.

We've been leaning towards this one (at least in the past we have).

Also if you could start making an outline for what you would like to happen in Taris (Going to tie in anything from KOTOR?)

11-24-2004, 09:15 AM
Tarsis Admiral. Not Taris. :)

BD: I agree with you, which is why I don't like the idea of #1 at all and have always basically planned on #2.

By the way, there are a couple ways to do the 'time bubble' as well.

1: The schism happens because it's part of the quest itself. It is keyed to the 'quest-identifier' magic inside the group, and as time jumps forward for them it will jump forward for everyone with that magic - including Misae, and Drago if he stays with the group for much longer (long enough for the magic to transfer over).

2: The schism happens because of somewhere the group goes. It affects only those in that certain place/situation. Anyone separated from the group (ex: Misae) would stay in the normal time frame and age as such.

Reason it could most conveniently happen next thread is because #2.2 would work best there. So many ways I could have the group stumble into something to cause that in my dimension/while dimension traveling. Why do you think the Middle Ages of my world connects with Mrear, while 2000+ connects with the current SW universe? Schisms in time thanks to an unstable artificial dimension plane. :)

11-24-2004, 12:57 PM
I haven't played KOTOR, my PC is bellow the spec:(

Okay, well I have a rough concept of Tarsis, since I was going to send Flax there.

The world it's self is roughly Earth-like, there are four main continants and a lot of islands. Most of the equatorial region is desert and the polar caps are quite extensive. The planet has two moons which opperate on a 22 day cycle with the second, smaller, moon roughly 4 days behind the first.

Mostly the Agamarians work in the northern hemesphire becuase this provides them with the neccessary raw materials to make their weapons. (This is mainly to do with the longbows.)

I was thinking of having an army of around 90,000 on the planet.

This would compose 2 regular Northern Compact Legions, stats for those are in this thread; 4 war Levies. These are like legions but they have no house guards, about half the number of cavalvy and billmen and three times the longbow men.

In addition there will be a Cup of Winds Legion (Sophae's people), this Legion is roughly the same as a compact legion but with no billmen. Instead they have 800 heavy militia cavalry.

Then I was thinking a mixed Legion of the other peoples on Agamar, including Carr'nessa and Relinion. That should be interesting for Matt and Allessa.

Then I was going to have about 500 Noble Warriors (Heavy Cav) to make up the numbers.

As to what will happen when they land:

The normal MO is for a group to come in fast, offload in 15-20 minutes and then for the ship to get space bourne fast. As soon as they enter the atmosphere power levels will begin to drop, so speed is important.

As soon as the group land they will be attacked by whatever is near by. The only safe spots on the planet are stone circles. Something about the stones keeps the natives away.

Now a ship landing will obviously also attract the Agamarians.

My vision of the planet is mainly rough moorland and hills with thick forests, rivers, marshes. Think Dark Age Britain.

Now there are lots of ancient ruins around so the key is probably in one of those.

My general outline goes.

Group land ---> Group attacked and meet Legions. ---> Group get embroualed in 25-1 battle. ---> group go search for key in ruins with detachment of Housegaurds. --->

Thats as far as I've got with it so far.

Aside from that I have one thought.

River Styx.

11-24-2004, 01:03 PM
And how closely will you keep to the true "river Styx"

Something for you to think about for the purpose of this planet. are the three Drakes. I'm thinking about having them go with Drago as the Aesirian emisaries (sort of).

They could phycisally land ships, and bring them back to orbit.

11-24-2004, 11:12 PM
The issue then though would be that the ships reactors would be drained. I would say that sending the Drakes alone would be unwise.

Now I'll go into my thoughts on "Dragons"

There are three types:

A. Flightless Dragons, usually measuring 15-25m in length these are basicall lizzards with short, powerfull legs, they part and run part sliver accross the ground and are only about as fast as a man. They have very mobile tales with spiked ends and they breath fire. They are difficult to kill because of their armoured scales and because the only "weak" spot is on the belly. They usually have to be stopped by battledogs with force forged blades, unless you find a way to get at the belly.

B. Man Dragons, believed to be crossbred with some other creature. They are bipedal, with man like bodies and dragon heads with redused snouts, they stand around 2m tall, some have tales and wings, all breath fire. They are considered dangerous but most houseguards would be expected to take one down.

C. Winged Dragon, basically the classic European Dragon, standing around 10-15m tall and between 20-30m long in flight. The breath fire, they ruin your day. It is the privilage of the Dragonsbain to slay these creatures.

Dragonsbain: A subdevision of most Noble Orders these men are equipped in the same way as others but carry compound bows, the arrows for which are each Force-forged, they have the finest armour and the best horses.

When not fighting dragons they are a dominating and virtually undefeatable battlefield force. They can usually be recognised by their destinctive dragon's scale shields, which they earn after their first kill.

Of the 30,000 odd Battledogs only two tumae (80) are Dragonsbain.

So you can see why the Agamarians won't be too keen on the Drakes.

As to the Styx: The Homeric version.

11-27-2004, 01:51 PM
But would they be willing to work with the Drakes?

What about the other rivers of Hades BD:

Acheron - the river of woe
Cocytus - the river of lamentation
Phlegethon - the river of fire
Lethe - the river of forgetfulness

Those could also be entertaining...

Also I want the group to return to Coruscant after this time skip, and probably before Tarsis.

Couple of reasons why:

1. So knew people can join (that was the point of Yevoth)

2. The group has seen Corsuscant mainly untouched. After twenty years the planet will be in ruins for the most part. Think along the lines of many post-apocalypse movies. I think it would be interesting for the group to see first hand how much Coruscant has suffered.

11-28-2004, 08:18 PM
Admiral, I want to make sure Elaina joins the group before any time skipping happens... she is Tanara's younger sister, both physically and mentally. I want it to stay that way. If you're planning Coruscant after the skip, where can I have Elaina run into the rest of us?

11-29-2004, 12:29 AM
Agamarians are pragmatic, they'll be willing to work with the Drakes but they have to be brought round to it. If one just appeared then all hell fould break loose.

Admiral, have you read the Odyssey? Or even the Aeneid?

11-29-2004, 07:30 AM
WJ: At the beginning of the next thread. The group will be landing at a planet where they can meet.

BD: The Odyssey

11-29-2004, 01:59 PM
Off Topic: Admiral, what was your opinion of the resourceful Odysseus?

As an aside I wouldn't really recomend the Aeneid.

On Topic: That image is what I want the group to experiance. Having to meet theri dead relatives will be a real eye opener, I think, for all involved.

11-29-2004, 04:42 PM
It's been a coule years since reading it so I'm a little rusty on certain facts. Odysseus seemed to be very resourceful, and came up with some clever idea on how to escape certain difficulties (I paticularly like him adopting the name "Nohbody". Although if not for Athena he would have died early on.

His penchant for bragging was also interesting.

What about you? (and what version did you read? I read the translation by Seamus Heaney)

11-29-2004, 11:12 PM
I read E.V Rieu. I liked him but his willingness to hop into any bed while still being totally devoted to his wife was a bit.... odd. He certainly owes his survival (and his troubles) to the Gods.

The Scenes in the Palace are great and the ones in the underworld are genuinly creepy.

11-30-2004, 06:59 AM
I liked how it showed a double standard in society. Woman had to be chaste while men could sleep with whoever they wanted. The palace scene was nice and interesting, I liked how Odysseus took his revenge on the suiters.

I watched a movie based on the Odyssey and they butchered the story and Odysseus. They made him into an arrogant idiot who took delight in flipping off the gods.

11-30-2004, 12:46 PM
I saw oh brother where art thou....

11-30-2004, 01:00 PM
*Ignores JM*:D

Yes, the double standard it a good point. Whats more interesting is the beafy matcho characters, versus the effeminate Classical Greeks. As to film versions, bear in mind that the poem takes 36 odd hours to sing.

FYI if Odysseus really existed he would have been over sixe feet tall.

11-30-2004, 01:07 PM
That is no excuse for destroying the story BD. The version I saw was horrid.

11-30-2004, 02:03 PM
Originally posted by BattleDog
*Ignores JM*:D

Yes, the double standard it a good point. Whats more interesting is the beafy matcho characters, versus the effeminate Classical Greeks. As to film versions, bear in mind that the poem takes 36 odd hours to sing.

FYI if Odysseus really existed he would have been over sixe feet tall.
They're ignoring me. NOW'S MY CHANCE
*Unleashes plan to take over the cantina universe*

11-30-2004, 03:38 PM
I liked Oh Brother Where Art Thou. I liked the Odyssey more, although I haven't read it in five-six years. =)

Saw the (an?) Odyssey movie a few years ago, didn't like it either.

12-01-2004, 12:58 AM
Originally posted by Admiral
That is no excuse for destroying the story BD. The version I saw was horrid.

That is exactly why it should never havre even have been considered for a film, look at what they did to the Illiad with Troy!

12-01-2004, 07:49 AM
Haven't seen Troy yet, so I really can't comment.

12-01-2004, 08:56 AM
It was pretty horrid. Despite excellent (and attractive ^_~) actors, the storyline was butchered. All the gods were taken out of the story for the sake of 'realism', and some important plot details were altered for (what I can only assume to be) the sake of drama. (especially the ending...gah) That, and the music was annoying and trying too hard to be 'epic' (along with, arguably, much of the dialogue). ;)

I'd love to see an Illiad/Odyssey movie done properly, for pretty much the same reasons I loved the Lord of the Rings films.

I shouldn't even be posting now, I have a major school project due later today :D

12-01-2004, 12:30 PM
Troy wasn't even realistic, armour, shields, helmets and weapons were all remenisant of Classical Greece, not the badass Mycenaeans.

So, like King Arthur, it fails in both catagories.

12-01-2004, 01:04 PM
I haven't seen the latest King Aruthor movie either but at least it had some celtic references from the trailers that I did see. Unlike some of the ones made.

I really like it when they make a movie with knights who wear armor so heavy that they cann't stand up when they fall.

12-01-2004, 10:45 PM
Originally posted by BattleDog
Troy wasn't even realistic, armour, shields, helmets and weapons were all remenisant of Classical Greece, not the badass Mycenaeans.

Ya, but I didn't mind or even really notice that (so I'll take your word for it ^_~). What really appealed to me were the Greek ships. They always were among my favorite designs as a kid (which is when I studied the Greeks...I was a bookish child :D) and so the opening scene of the trailer showing the vast fleet of beautiful Greek ships covering the sea...the cool music, the voiceover, the shots of the actors (I like pretty much all the major actors in this film, so shoot me)... It's just a real pity that the movie wasn't half as good as the trailer. :p

(Actually, there were some pretty good parts to the movie...couldn't save the overall piece, though.)

Oh, and curious, how were the Classical Greeks "effeminate"? Still not sure what you meant by that...please don't tell me you're from the school of thought that says anything in males resembling what Western culture now sees as 'feminine' is a bad thing ;)

Wow, we're way off discussing PtH by now. :D

Back on subject, superthrawn is really swamped and not able to post much right now (especially since he's got so much catch-up...) He'll probably have Ritchet pop back in apologizing for being pulled away, later on. Convenient when you have a character who can do that at a moment's notice...don't have to worry about another coma like Josine ;)

12-01-2004, 11:09 PM
Classical Greeks were gay, they didn't like women and thier ideal of beuty is the male form. In addition they spent a lot of time writing boks and bitching.

By Comparrison Ancient Greeks spent most of their time pillaging, killing, making war, and women appear alot more in art. They also had way cooler swords.

So really its a comparrison.