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View Full Version : Whats so great about MMORPGs?


kipperthefrog
10-26-2004, 05:35 AM
first you have to buy the game for 50 bucks, then you have to pay the monthly online fee.

in other words, they don't want you to OWN software anymore...

they want you to pay online to BORROW it from them!

is it realy worth the money to play those?

bneezy
10-26-2004, 05:40 AM
Not really. Sure, you can meet some cool people and have some good games. I had a LOT of fun in City of Heroes and Star Wars Galaxies. After a while, it's the same old crap. It eventually turns into a $14.95 a month IRC chat w/ moving avatars. Unless you have a good group of 8-10 friends that all have the game, it isn't worth it. You can get the same experience on XBOX Live! (and I'm not talking about Phantasy Star Online). You have to pay $50 bucks a year, but at least the games work for free.

TheOutrider
10-26-2004, 05:45 AM
What about Earth and Beyond that was a pretty cool online game.

bneezy
10-26-2004, 05:46 AM
Never played it.

kipperthefrog
10-26-2004, 06:32 AM
never HEARD of it!


originally posted by bneezy

You can get the same experience on XBOX Live! (and I'm not talking about Phantasy Star Online). You have to pay $50 bucks a year, but at least the games work for free.

If you have to pay 50 bucks a year, how is it free?

do you mean 50 bucks a year for all the games you want, and you dont have to pay per game?

Prime
10-26-2004, 07:47 AM
Originally posted by kipperthefrog
first you have to buy the game for 50 bucks, then you have to pay the monthly online fee. You expect all those massive servers that host thousands of players to be run and maintained for free? Not freakin' likely. You aren't going to get something for nothing.

Originally posted by kipperthefrog
in other words, they don't want you to OWN software anymore... It is extremely unlikely that you own any piece of software that you have (unless you wrote it yourself). Instead, you agreed to the conditions stated in the End User Licensing Agreement (EULA) which licences you to be able to use the software. This contract specifies how the software (games in this case) can and cannot be used and what restrictions the developer puts on you. For example, most specify that you can't share the software with others, etc.

Originally posted by kipperthefrog
they want you to pay online to BORROW it from them! Again, you never owned games to begin with, and you only pay for online games like MMORPGs because of the extremely prohibitive cost of the servers those games requires. If you didn't pay a monthly fee, those costs would have to be gained through the initial price which would mean those games would cost hundreds of dollars.

It has been this way for decades.

kipperthefrog
10-26-2004, 08:03 AM
Here is the way it has been for decades:

you pay JUST the initial price of the game and thats it! you can lay it as much as you want after that!

NOW they are trying to set things up like this:

Pay the initial price AND the game will be USELESS unless you pay a monthly fee. for example:

Star Wars Galaxies cost 50 bucks to buy! the you have to pay at least a 15 dollar fee! Thats 65 dollars! a lot of money for a game you can only play for a month!

they think the can invent another monthly bill on us like cable and internet!

Now do you get the picture?

EDIT
(call me cheap, but the most i'd pay for a game is 40, and thats with limitless access to them!)


originally posted by Prime

It is extremely unlikely that you own any piece of software that you have (unless you wrote it yourself). Instead, you agreed to the conditions stated in the End User Licensing Agreement (EULA) which licences you to be able to use the software. This contract specifies how the software (games in this case) can and cannot be used and what restrictions the developer puts on you. For example, most specify that you can't share the software with others, etc.

another thing: we don't own COPYRIGHT to software. We own copies of the software to use! I paid for KOTOR and as far as i'm concerned, it's MINE! I'm just not suposed to PIRATE software!

WE own movies, but we dont own COPYRIGHT to the movies! to add a mothly fee on games is like adding a mothly fee to make a purchased movie to work!

stingerhs
10-26-2004, 08:20 AM
^^^^
well, like prime said, it does cost the company money to maintain the servers that host 1000+ users at a time. your isp does the same thing. if you compare that to a dedicated server for unreal 2k4, well, you're talking about maybe 32 people on the server. thats not that much, even for a small server with maybe a T1 connection. it would probably lag a bit for most of the 32 people, but it could handle it with little or no maintenance. with the servers they use for the mmorpg's, they use the really big servers, that already require tons of maintenance, plus they have to use a T3 or better connection. all of that costs a lot of money.

sure you have to pay a montly fee plus the cost of the game itself. however, if they offered them for free, then the company would pile up tons of costs for free, and thats not good business. hope that helps. :)

kipperthefrog
10-26-2004, 08:35 AM
I do see your point, but the warcraft 3 Battle.net works with thousands of players playing Warcraft and IT'S free!

stingerhs
10-26-2004, 08:41 AM
when it all boils down to it, its up to you to decide whether or not you'll play the mmorpg's to begin with. if cost is a factor, then perhaps sticking to the non-mmo games would be a good thing. and don't forget, those types aren't disappearing anytime soon. :D

kipperthefrog
10-26-2004, 08:55 AM
Agreed!

I'm going to look into the online playstation 2 think! it seems to be cheaper! Elder Scrolls Oblivion seems is going to be KOOL! Its like MMORPGs without Online stuff! more like a single player RPG game!

BTW

What do YOU think of MMORPGs?
Do YOU think its worth it?

What do you think of ELDER SCROLLS games? Have you played them?

stingerhs
10-26-2004, 11:30 AM
^^^^
me? well, so far none of the mmorpg's have really caught my attention.

planetside initially caught my attention when it first came out because it was all in the style of a fps with tons of vehicles (the vehicle combat is STILL unparalleled to any other game, including unreal 2k4). however, the objectives in the game wasn't very clear. it made for some very intense battles composed of about 500+ people involved in a single engagement. but in the end, it was all quite pointless, so i just quit playing it.

otherwise, swg has come very close to getting my attention. however, i'm at a point in life that devoting all of my attention to something other than school is definately a bad thing. whatever copy of swg that awaits me is still sitting in a store somewhere collecting dust. :rolleyes:

Aleggy
10-26-2004, 02:43 PM
ok not wanting to go into copywright or licensing laws here is how i view having to pay a monthly fee for the mmorpg's when you buy a normal game i.e. kotor you get a game a plot and an end. even if you buy a game oh lets say unreal tournament you get a game without a plot but a lot of fun to play at home or online but it still has bounderies, with the mmorpg's you get a game but its more like access to a virtual world wich you have to pay a kind of rent because the programmers are continually updating and adding if they made a kotor version i would happily pay a monthly fee for unlimited level ups new force powers and new weapons on a monthly bases not just having to wait for the next game to be written so i think its worth the money 'if' they do a mmorpg that suits you

kipperthefrog
10-26-2004, 03:25 PM
I Understand!

The difference between jedi knight multiplayer and Star wars galaxies id that SW Galaxies has contsant updating, changes, events, and is like a "real World"! things are evolving,

Jedi Knight multiplayer is written "as is" and never changes, and doesn't "move" like a real world, and is just a shoot fest.

Is THAT correct?

bneezy
10-27-2004, 05:06 AM
I DID see the screens for the new Elder Scrolls game. Not EVERYONE needs to jump on the online RPG bandwagon. I swear, they do the RPG like an artform. I loved III. But it does get lonely knowing you're the only real person in the world. But that goes for any game that isn't online.

stingerhs
10-27-2004, 05:52 AM
^^^^
indeed. but also consider that i'm not an rpg fan to begin with. as i've stated several times before, kotor is an exception. :)

i think i'd still prefer a real rpg instead of a mmorpg. its just so much more fun(although, that would definately depend on the game;) ) than having to do a million different tasks in order to level up. the things i've heard that they do in order to gain another level in these mmorpg's is almost nightmare-ish. when it comes down to it, mmorpg's rely on your ability to have patience when leveling up, and you don't really have a plot that can help maintain the patience. sure some things can be organized by other people, but it pales in comparison to a real rpg with a plot driven story(like kotor). a real rpg just rely's so heavily on plot and storyline, that leveling up is simply a part of the game, not the main focus. that's my largest criticism of the mmorpg's. everything has to be organized by the community, or events the programmers script into the game to make things happen. otherwise, its a bunch of meaningless level-ups. well, thats my opinion, anyway. anyone care to refute??? :D

RebelScum!
10-27-2004, 06:18 AM
Originally posted by kipperthefrog
first you have to buy the game for 50 bucks, then you have to pay the monthly online fee.

in other words, they don't want you to OWN software anymore...

they want you to pay online to BORROW it from them!

is it realy worth the money to play those?

Dunno why but i like them...They are just fun...lol

Prime
10-27-2004, 06:58 AM
Originally posted by kipperthefrog
I Understand!

The difference between jedi knight multiplayer and Star wars galaxies id that SW Galaxies has contsant updating, changes, events, and is like a "real World"! things are evolving,

Jedi Knight multiplayer is written "as is" and never changes, and doesn't "move" like a real world, and is just a shoot fest.

Is THAT correct? No.

The extra monthly does indeed help to pay for additional updates and content, but the major reason is the servers required to host all the players. JA has a max of what, 32 players? So a server for that game only needs to have the computing power to do the calculations for what 32 players are doing and the bandwidth to get the information for what they are all doing in a reasonable time. That is why you can allow people to set up their own dedicated servers on home PCs. There is enough bandwidth and computing power to handle the requirements of 32 players.

Compare that to Galaxies, where one server has thousands of players? Tens of thousands? That means a Galaxies server has to have 1000x more computing power to be able to handle all those players. Servers of that size can cost hundreds of thousands of dollars. Then there are the maintenance costs and salaries full time employees to manage them. And that is just for one server. How many servers are there for Galaxies?

Since Sony/Lucasarts are running the servers themselves, so they have to pay for them. If they didn't charge the monthly fee and only got $50 from each player, they would never be able to pay for and maintain the servers, let alone make a profit. The $50 does little more than recoup the initial development costs. That is why if they didn't charge the monthly fee the inital game cost would be in the hundreds of dollars range. I think you will agree it is better to get those who play the game longer to pay more.

In the end what you are asking for is for is Lucasarts to buy $100,000 servers, pay people to service them, pay the cost to maintain them, and pay for the ridiculous amount of badwidth for free out of the goodness of their hearts.

You can't expect them to lose money and go bankrupt. Like anything, if someone provides a service to you, you have to pay for it. You can't get something for nothing.

kipperthefrog
10-27-2004, 09:20 AM
.. so the difference is MMORPGs have thousands of players and require bigger servers with high maintenence reqiurements, and jediknight multiplayer is just 32 players that the standard computers can handle.

I have seen the light!

thank you, prime!

I didn't MEAN to offend anyone! I never heard of the difference before!

Prime
10-27-2004, 11:59 AM
Originally posted by kipperthefrog
I didn't MEAN to offend anyone! I never heard of the difference before! No offense taken. :)

The general rule of thumb is bigger = more $. :D

Aleggy
10-27-2004, 02:57 PM
hey dont worry when i first heard they were making games you had to pay a monthly fee to play online i was a bit gobsmacked to so i looked into it a bit more

i gave you the short and easy to understand version
which meant missing out vital details

where as prime gave you the full technical read out as to the reasons why

i have to admit when i first read those reasons in a magazine it gave me a headache just thinking about it

but it made sense eventualy

:D

another rule of thumb if something doesn't make sense check as many facts as you can until it does

this doesnt always means it will all make sense but then if something is wrong at least you know why lol :D

Cyborgninja
10-27-2004, 03:06 PM
I wish I had a good computer to play it on for one thing