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Leper Messiah
01-08-2005, 05:38 PM
Is Darth Vader supposed to be a completely seperate character to Anakin Skywalker? Obi Wan treats him like he is throughout the OT, he doesnt acknowledge Vader as Anakin at any point. I dont see it that way, i dont think they are two characters that take turns to surface i think Anakin and Vader are one character, i always believed that the whole point of ROTJ was that Luke was right and Kenobi was wrong - there was good left in Anakin/Vader, which would indicate he was still Anakin. George Lucas has said that the OT was in part about Anakin's redemption but if he wasnt really Vader i dont see how that works.

Shok_Tinoktin
01-08-2005, 07:42 PM
Originally posted by Leper Messiah
Obi Wan treats him like he is throughout the OT, he doesnt acknowledge Vader as Anakin at any point.

Originally posted by Leper Messiah
Luke was right and Kenobi was wrong

Whats the problem?

Skinkie
01-08-2005, 08:36 PM
I believe Obi-Wan said when Anakin turned to the darkside, he became Vader, and Anakin ceased to exist. That would make them the same. So would him being Luke's father. Its stated pretty clearly.

rut-wa jodar
01-08-2005, 11:44 PM
Obi-Wan and Yoda knew that luke could not destroy the emporer,alone, which means that he believed that Anakin/vader could be brought back from the darkside.

Leper Messiah
01-09-2005, 04:34 AM
well what got me started on this train of thought was that the character database on starwars.com seems to make a pretty clear distinction between the two, it seems to say Anakin just disappeared and then reappeared at the end of ROTJ which i think isnt the case i think Vader was always Anakin making the choices to do what he did, i dont think Anakin went away and Vader showed up and visa versa, otherwise theres just no point in his "redemption" because thered really be nothing to redeem

Prime
01-09-2005, 07:40 AM
Originally posted by Leper Messiah
well what got me started on this train of thought was that the character database on starwars.com seems to make a pretty clear distinction between the two, it seems to say Anakin just disappeared and then reappeared at the end of ROTJ which i think isnt the case i think Vader was always Anakin making the choices to do what he did, i dont think Anakin went away and Vader showed up and visa versa, otherwise theres just no point in his "redemption" because thered really be nothing to redeem

"You father was seduced by the dark side ofthe Force. He ceased to be Anakin Skywalkerand became Darth Vader. When that happened, the good man who was your father was destroyed. So what I have told you was true... from a certain point of view." -Kenobi

But of course, if you read the NJO then most of the above is pure nonsense. :rolleyes:

rut-wa jodar
01-09-2005, 11:56 AM
Originally posted by Prime
"You father was seduced by the dark side ofthe Force. He ceased to be Anakin Skywalkerand became Darth Vader. When that happened, the good man who was your father was destroyed. So what I have told you was true... from a certain point of view." -Kenobi

But of course, if you read the NJO then most of the above is pure nonsense. :rolleyes:


You just have to watch the last 15 minutes of ROTJ to see that Obi-Wan was wrong.

Shok_Tinoktin
01-09-2005, 03:50 PM
Originally posted by Prime
But of course, if you read the NJO then most of the above is pure nonsense. :rolleyes:

How do you figure?

Franchise
01-10-2005, 10:56 AM
Anainkin is the same as Vader because when Luke kills him, right befor he dies he actually has some comin sense to act human.

El Sitherino
01-10-2005, 06:50 PM
Obi-Wan refers to Darth Vader as being a second person because he knows Luke is not ready for the truth.

Vader and Anakin had always been said as two different people to keep that surprise in empire "alive". Seriously, you think Luke is going to avenge his friends and his father, then suddenly you're hit with "Luke, I am your father." You **** your pants and scream "no ****ing way!"

Also we know Anakin and Darth Vader are one in the same because we're told so. Watch Empire and Jedi. Bam.

Leper Messiah
01-11-2005, 07:58 AM
Originally posted by InsaneSith

Also we know Anakin and Darth Vader are one in the same because we're told so. Watch Empire and Jedi. Bam.


not quite what i mean though i know Anakin becomes Vader etc thats elementary, the difference im talking about is the nature of the change, does Anakins personality get replaced by a completely new one called Vader, or is Vader still Anakins personality except bitter angry twisted etc

El Sitherino
01-11-2005, 08:06 AM
Vader is partially Anakin, he's still Anakins wit, and combative skill, but other than that, he's a totally different personality. It's kind of like schizophrenia I would assume. Vader though becoming the dominant personality after the darkside took over him. It corrupted all that was good in him, nearly destroying all that was Anakin within. Vader takes over, but when Luke comes along you can see Anakin starting to fight back within.

Franchise
01-11-2005, 02:38 PM
Yeah, I said Darth Vader and Anikin are the same.

Leper Messiah
01-12-2005, 02:33 AM
Originally posted by InsaneSith
Vader is partially Anakin, he's still Anakins wit, and combative skill, but other than that, he's a totally different personality. It's kind of like schizophrenia I would assume. Vader though becoming the dominant personality after the darkside took over him. It corrupted all that was good in him, nearly destroying all that was Anakin within. Vader takes over, but when Luke comes along you can see Anakin starting to fight back within.

i like that explanation, im goin with that :)

Kurgan
01-21-2005, 01:35 PM
Originally posted by Shok_Tinoktin
How do you figure?

I think he's referring to the whole "there is no dark or light side, it's all intention!" BS spouted by some character in the NJO books. But correct me if I'm wrong, this character was finally shown to be full of BS by the end, right? So in a sense, the NJO doesn't contradict it, we just assume that chracter was wrong/crazy...