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View Full Version : Why in the heck are they using the Galactic Civil War?


boranchistanger
01-10-2005, 01:10 PM
Why are they using the Galactic Civil War? Why aren't they using the Clone Wars? In the Clone Wars you had actual battles between the massive armies of the Republic and the Seperatists. In the Galactic Civil War you had a bunch of Guerrilla cowards (Rebellion) and the big, mighty Empire. I can tell you that I'd rather be commanding Republic forces at Geonosis than a couple bums fireing hopelessly at AT-AT's at Hoth. Give me a break. Does this disturb anyone else, or is it just me?

-Boran

Shok_Tinoktin
01-10-2005, 02:15 PM
Guerrilla warfare requires much more tactics then taking two big armies, making them bigger and bigger, then trying to make them clash in the middle. Also, if done right, a guerrilla war can set up the two sides to be in dynamic equilibrium, and add more variety to the game. The Republic and Seperatists are pretty much the same except one uses clones and the other used droids.

FroZticles
01-10-2005, 02:30 PM
No a lot of people share this view but I put it down to the fact you are drawn in by the better visuals. There will be a Clone Wars RTS somewhere in the future but right now they are focusing on OT.

OverlordAngelus
01-10-2005, 03:34 PM
I agree, having the Rebels vs the Empire will give the game a lot more depth.

Personally, I think that a clone wars rts would be the kind of game where the person with the biggest army wins.

The other thing is, the huge amount of EU material that has been created around the OT that can be drawn upon. Look at the screenshots and you see ships like the Interdictor Cruiser and I really hope they read the Thrawn Trilogy while creating this game.

PR-0927
01-10-2005, 03:46 PM
I'm sorry if you don't like EU, but they had larger battles. And...Hoth...and the Battle of Endor (in space)...

:fett:

El Sitherino
01-10-2005, 08:18 PM
I can hardly see the rebels being called cowards, the people stood up to the massive empire. That takes a lot of guts.

Anyway, this takes place during the OT because they ( Lucasarts ) want it to. Besides as said earlier, guerrilla fighting takes more strategy than those whoever has the biggest military and better weapons wins.

Nokill
01-10-2005, 09:26 PM
Galactic Civil War
the real stuf ^.^

Jan Gaarni
01-10-2005, 09:58 PM
Personally I enjoy the OT much better, so way to go LucasArts for excellent choice. :)

Pho3nix
01-11-2005, 03:56 AM
CLONE WARS CLONE WARS!!! :emodanc:

*Krhm* Yeah, Clone Wars are more interesting than the GCW.

Nokill
01-11-2005, 04:47 AM
why is there no butten to fote all 3

CW GCW and EU

stingerhs
01-11-2005, 06:41 AM
i think having the civil war adds a lot to the strategy of the gameplay. it makes it so that whenever you play one side or the other, you have to come up with different tactics to achieve victory. kind of reminds me of c&c: generals, except you had three sides to choose from (that required different tactics for each side) rather than two.

starmark2k
01-11-2005, 08:23 AM
I think because of the space battles there is more that can be done with OT.

Alegis
01-11-2005, 09:59 AM
More strategy as a few stated already in this topic, but also because OT is one big war, for the 3 episodes.

In clone wars the clones only come in the end of EP II, and then again it's more like one massive army vs another on a big plain. Can't do much there rather than swarm the enemy.

swphreak
01-11-2005, 11:04 AM
Because OT has more starships.

LucasArts will probbaly release an xpac for the PT...

boranchistanger
01-11-2005, 01:11 PM
Because OT has more starships.


There were epic space battles during the Clone Wars. For goodness sakes, Episode 3 opens with the greatest space battle in the entire Star Wars saga for goodness sakes.

i think having the civil war adds a lot to the strategy of the gameplay. it makes it so that whenever you play one side or the other, you have to come up with different tactics to achieve victory.


Same with the Clone Wars. The Battles of the Clone Wars were very diverse and massive. Kamino, Geonosis, Rhen Var, Kashyyyk. All kinds of terrains, all kinds of strategy involved. Those battles were a heck of alot better than Hoth or Endor or Yavin 4. Those were all pathetic.

-Boran

lukeiamyourdad
01-11-2005, 01:26 PM
I am an OT fan. Always have been. I saw Star Wars for the first time when I was 5 and it has hooked me up ever since.

Endor will always be the greatest space battle ever for its epic scope and the way it touched you straight to your heart.

IMO, Hoth and Endor were more fun to watch. When both armies are nothing more then just mindless beings wacking each other, it's kinda boring.

Besides, the average gamer is 29, the average Star Wars fan is a bit older, guess what war they usually like more.

Sithmaster_821
01-11-2005, 04:08 PM
Very simple: they needed something to save for the (inevitable) x-pack.


Come on, you think they'd try and add Clone Wars now when they can shamelessly cash in on the post-RotS wave with a timely expansion?

Shok_Tinoktin
01-11-2005, 04:13 PM
Originally posted by boranchistanger
The Battles of the Clone Wars were very diverse and massive. Kamino, Geonosis, Rhen Var, Kashyyyk. All kinds of terrains, all kinds of strategy involved. Those battles were a heck of alot better than Hoth or Endor or Yavin 4. Those were all pathetic.

You can't compare Clone Wars EU and movies to Galactic Civil War movies only. If you include EU material then there is much, much more EU to be taken from the GCW era, and massive amounts of variety. And regardless of the amount of strategy involved in CW battles, the point remains that the two sides are very similar. I also prefer GCW due to the fact that I know it better, and I've known it longer, so I prefer to play games during that time period.

Prime
01-11-2005, 05:46 PM
They chose OT because everyone loves the OT.


Hey, look at the poll.

jokemaster
01-11-2005, 06:45 PM
'Cause the space battles are cooler.....

CodeDrifter
01-11-2005, 08:47 PM
Because if it's the OT they have to do far less of incorporating the Jedi and Sith into the game.

And a melee unit that can block ranged attacks would be difficult.

Shok_Tinoktin
01-12-2005, 12:26 AM
Originally posted by Prime
They chose OT because everyone loves the OT.


Hey, look at the poll.

Quoted for emphasis.

Revan Solo
01-12-2005, 02:29 AM
I like Clone War time! It has the best characters (of course, Han Solo is best).

stingerhs
01-12-2005, 04:17 AM
Same with the Clone Wars. The Battles of the Clone Wars were very diverse and massive. Kamino, Geonosis, Rhen Var, Kashyyyk. All kinds of terrains, all kinds of strategy involved. Those battles were a heck of alot better than Hoth or Endor or Yavin 4. Those were all pathetic.

-Boran
this is how i view the clone wars:

mindless droids with blaster rifles vs mindless clones with blaster rifles

and you were saying something about diverse tactics.....:dozey:

now i'll give you point that the battles were on a larger scale, but the point was that both sides can use similar tactics. thus, in a game, it wouldn't really matter what side you chose since the only battles you'd be fighting is large-scale and both sides would be using similar tactics each time. like i said before: droids vs clones. :dozey:

boranchistanger
01-12-2005, 06:30 AM
Someone had to control those mindless droids and midless clones. The Jedi commanded the Clone forces while the greatest military genius of all time General Grevious led the Seperatist forces. They were some of the best commanders in the history of the Star Wars universe.

Also keep in mind that these mindless clones were Stormtroopers!

-Boran

lukeiamyourdad
01-12-2005, 07:03 AM
Who commanded them doesn't really matter since you will be the one commanding your troops. It is irrelevant.

However true that the Clones=Stormtroopers(or maybe clones + recruits), in this case, both sides are made of mindless troops. On the other hand, you have the Rebels who have feelings and are alive and even the Imperials who show a degree of personality. They have officers and stormtroopers who seem capable of free thinking.

Nevertheless, the Clone Wars was a greyish war. No one was the good guy, no one was the bad guy. Sure one could say it's the Clones but since they've been tricked by Sidious, we're not so sure.
On the other hand, you have the Galactic Civil War, a war where both sides are clearly defined, one is good, one is bad.

To take a real life exemple, I'll give you the WWII games and the Vietnam War games. One of them became very popular, one of them hit a big wall of flops. None of the Vietnam war games have been able to get the popularity of similar WWII games, no matter how good they are.
The reason? I'll let you figure it out yourself.

Prime
01-12-2005, 07:15 AM
Originally posted by boranchistanger
the greatest military genius of all time General Grevious What are you basing that on?

And in the end he lost.

Nokill
01-12-2005, 08:24 AM
thay all lose on some time
but ho is then the real leader...?
i think its palpatine becouse he killed the jedi council and ruled over all
*exapt for the rebel's that have a lot of luck*
and the clone emperors will keep his legasy go on living :D

El Sitherino
01-12-2005, 08:36 AM
I think another reason why they chose it is because people will be coming off of RoTS and they'll be like, "I wanna continue the battle!" it makes perfect sense. Not to mention the Galactic Civil War IS the biggest war in the entire Star Wars universe. Just look at it's context. Small groups of freedom fighters joining together to fight a universally massive Empire.

boranchistanger
01-12-2005, 12:45 PM
On the other hand, you have the Rebels who have feelings and are alive and even the Imperials who show a degree of personality. They have officers and stormtroopers who seem capable of free thinking.

So did the Republic. The clones were very capable of free-thinking, that was why, after all, they were superior to droids.

On the other hand, you have the Galactic Civil War, a war where both sides are clearly defined, one is good, one is bad.

Clearly defined? I'd argue that the Imperials were the good guys in the Galactic Civil War. At least the Imperials brought a sense of order to the Galaxy, the Rebels just brought chaos.

El Sitherino
01-12-2005, 12:52 PM
Originally posted by boranchistanger
So did the Republic. The clones were very capable of free-thinking, that was why, after all, they were superior to droids.

The clones had limits on their thinking abilities, they were "programmed" to take orders and not question it.

Originally posted by boranchistanger
Clearly defined? I'd argue that the Imperials were the good guys in the Galactic Civil War. At least the Imperials brought a sense of order to the Galaxy, the Rebels just brought chaos. The empire was a dictatorship laid down on blood and death. Definitely not the good guys. The Rebels did not just bring chaos.

Anyone who thinks the imperials were the good guys is a fool and should be beaten in the crotch severely.

stingerhs
01-12-2005, 12:56 PM
Originally posted by boranchistanger
Clearly defined? I'd argue that the Imperials were the good guys in the Galactic Civil War. At least the Imperials brought a sense of order to the Galaxy, the Rebels just brought chaos.
that would be defined as good vs evil.

palpatine & vader: evil

luke & leia: good

and to bring more definition: when you rule with an iron fist backed by a massive military, its actually pretty easy to bring order. after the rebel victory at endor, there was still a war to be fought, thus the so-called "chaos" that you mention.

don't forget that it was a civil war. if you need a reminder as to the consequences of civil war, by all means refer to the american civil war from 1860-1865. the reconstruction period immidiately after the war was definately one of the more chaotic periods in american history.

darthfergie
01-12-2005, 09:19 PM
I'm quite glad it's the galactic civil war. It's far more developed with a WHOLE lot more depth. They have ships set out already classified and everything. They even have descriptive events in the EU books that show space battles, etc in great detail.

Also I'm glad because I'm pretty much about to give up on the Prequels. I'll buy the last prequel and have the whole collection...I just may end up crying because it's so unfulfilling. :)
Sry, I'm a biased nut. I like the OT and I've been playing fleet battles through in my head with Star Destroyers and Mon Cals since my early childhood. :D

OverlordAngelus
01-13-2005, 09:46 AM
Me too. When I was playing TIE Fighter, I always wanted to be the one who was planning the missions and coordinating the battle. After 9 years of waiting, I will finally be able to.

Raxor
01-14-2005, 06:05 AM
i thought it would be good if they also had the new republic and the Vong. but its nice for them to start with the galactic civil war

lonepadawan
01-15-2005, 01:46 AM
Lucasarts will never make a NJO game. Thank god.

Shok_Tinoktin
01-15-2005, 01:54 AM
Originally posted by lonepadawan
Lucasarts will never make a NJO game.

What makes you so sure? It is clear that they have no problem with going deep into the EU, and it is obvious they have no issue acknowledging NJO. So its not much of a stretch to suggest they might center a game around it.

lukeiamyourdad
01-15-2005, 10:48 AM
What makes you so sure they have no issues acknowledging the NJO?

Don't bring up the KOTOR argument. KOTOR is a universe they themselves created using what people loved about the movies and turning it into a whole new game.

Just the fact that there is a large amount of NJO haters or simply non-lovers( >_> ) or even simplier, people who don't know what the hell that is, can easily justify their reasons NOT to center a game around that particular (horrible)section of EU.

swphreak
01-15-2005, 11:33 AM
Let's discuss why or why not LA will or will not make a NJO game in another thread in the off-topic forum. Besides, we've already had this discussion a million times before.

Someone will mod EaW and put the Yuuzhan Vong and New Republic in.

OverlordAngelus
01-15-2005, 11:35 AM
Actually, there NJO referrence in KOTOR. Talk to the Mandalore bounty hunter and ask about his stories. Eventually he will tell you about how he saw an asteroid come to life and then fly off into hyperspace.

There is more to it than that but I can't remember the details.

Anyway, what he saw was a Yuuzhan Vong Coralskipper.

Shok_Tinoktin
01-15-2005, 04:13 PM
Yeah, that is what I was referring to, but that is all I'm gonna say about it, so I dont drag the thread off-topic.

jokemaster
01-15-2005, 06:09 PM
Overlord: He also mentioned it fired molten rock at them.

Don't forget, in Mysteries of the Sith, you play as Mara Jade, a character invented in the EU.

Anyway, if there's mod support there'll probably be lots of C&C and EU mods.

OverlordAngelus
01-16-2005, 05:29 AM
That was it.

Lets also remember that Rebellion used a lot of EU material. Infact I seem to recall an interview where they said they were inspired by the Thrawn Trilogy.

lukeiamyourdad
01-16-2005, 06:16 AM
Inspired is one thing. They'll still keep it as much like the movies as it is possible.

What a lot of people are against is a Star Wars game solely based on the NJO, the New Republic and the Vong. If they do so, they'll have to scrap the core of the movies.

OverlordAngelus
01-16-2005, 10:48 AM
I think the Jedi Knight series is more likely to get a game in the NJO than anything else.

lonepadawan
01-17-2005, 06:48 AM
Oh yeeeeeah. "Learn the ways of the force (Which doesn't effect these new enemies that you know nothing about) and build a lightsaber (Note: No lightsaber duels, instead you can fight against these guys with SNAKES! ISN'T THAT AWSOME!)

Curt-Man
01-21-2005, 04:58 AM
OT rocks, however the clones are pretty kick ass, why becuase they are just so cool, but i still prefer the OT.

DK_Viceroy
01-21-2005, 11:30 AM
Luke a NJO game would be a great Idea I have regularly said that you don't need to focus on the movies for it to be succesful KOTOR after all is a success and it uses not a drop of things from the movies.

as I have always said Trusim > Purism

and that is the way of all things totally and utterly completly irreversible:cool:

lukeiamyourdad
01-21-2005, 11:52 AM
Bull. KOTOR uses a lot from the movies.
KOTOR has everything the movie has.

The NJO has nothing the movies has.

DK_Viceroy
01-21-2005, 03:04 PM
I don't see Sith Fighters in Ep's 1 through 6 yet I see TIE Fighters in NJO:p

lukeiamyourdad
01-21-2005, 05:25 PM
oy...

Now, for people who have played KOTOR ONCE and never made a decent comparison between it and the movies, I'll do it for you.

KOTOR-You play a Jedi hero with a dark heritage.
MOVIES-Luke Skywalker is a Jedi hero who has a dark heritage.

KOTOR-There is a Jedi princess(Bastilla Shan), the hope of the galaxy, that you must rescue from thugs.
MOVIES-Leia is a princess that was rescued from the Empire.

KOTOR-A scoundrel(Mission Vao) who's accompanied by a Wookiee(Zaalbar).
MOVIES-A scoundrel(Han Solo) who's accompanied by a Wookiee(Chewbacca).

KOTOR-A protocol droid(Hk-47) and an astromech droid(T3-M4).
MOVIES-A protocol droid(C3PO) and an astromech droid(R2-D2).

KOTOR-A villain with an unknown injurie(Darth Malak).
MOVIES-A villain with an unkown injurie(until ep3, Darth Vader).

KOTOR-Republic forces fight masked Sith Soldiers.
MOVIES-Rebel forces fight masked Imperial Soldiers.

Note here that the Republic soldier's helmet in KOTOR is almost the same as the Rebel trooper's on the Tantive IV.

KOTOR-A hutt that organises the races on Tatooine.
MOVIES-Jabba organises the race in Ep1.

KOTOR-An apprentice to the Dark Lord of the Sith who wields a double bladed lightsaber(Darth Bandon).
MOVIES-An apprentice to the Dark Lord of the Sith who wields a double bladed lightsaber(Darth Maul).

KOTOR-Swarms of endless Sith fighters.
MOVIES-Swarms of endless Tie fighter.

Do I need to go further?

stingerhs
01-21-2005, 06:53 PM
Originally posted by DK_Viceroy
I don't see Sith Fighters in Ep's 1 through 6 yet I see TIE Fighters in NJO:p
if you really want to go that far, please realize that kotor takes place almost 5000 years before the movies. NJO starts almost immidiately after Ep VI. now, do you really think that you'd see 5000 year old fighters in the movies??? that's just absurd.

now, it actually makes sense to see TIE's in NJO because there's pretty much no time difference: TIE's are recent technology.

overall, that's one really bad comparison on your part.

swphreak
01-21-2005, 07:52 PM
Actually, the NJO takes place at least a minimum of 20 years after the movies.

Kotor did get some things from the EU and movies. There were a bunch of TotJ comments in the Kotor games.

They could easily make an NJO or EU (post ROTJ) game similar to Kotor. Perhaps KotNR.

Now back to the topic.

Star Destroyers > Republic Troopships.

Jan Gaarni
01-21-2005, 10:00 PM
Originally posted by StarWarsPhreak
Actually, the NJO takes place at least a minimum of 20 years after the movies.

Compared to when the KotOR events took place in relations to the OT, the NJO took place "immediatly" after RotJ, which is what I think he ment by that. :)

And KotOr takes place nearly 4000 years before the movies. ;)

H0WARD
02-10-2005, 04:20 PM
To answer the question first stated directly... why the Galactic Civil War? well, that's easy. The fights are better, and, aside from that, the Clone Wars was defiled by Cartoon Network's little gamble. Plus Episode I and II were insignificant next to the power of the OT... I find your lack of faith disturbing.:vadar:

{DHU}Screed
02-10-2005, 07:39 PM
Originally posted by boranchistanger
the greatest military genius of all time General Grevious led the Seperatist forces.
-Boran

You sir, have obviously never heard of Grand Admiral Thrawn, or General Garm Bel Iblis.

Thrawn being THE greatest military mind ever concieved of.

Dagobahn Eagle
03-04-2005, 05:40 PM
So did the Republic. The clones were very capable of free-thinking, that was why, after all, they were superior to droids.
Duh. I don't get the reasoning about clones being inferior to other humans. So you're identical to someone else, big deal.:rolleyes:

When people do get cloned, they'll get mistreated, have their rights taken away, and handled like sub-humans. Humans just never learn and need a minority group to pick on...:o

Back on topic:
They chose the Civil War because Episode I and II are widely regarded as horrible movies. Plain and simple. Episode 4 and 5, and to a degree Episode 6, had atmosphere, deep characters, and a fantastic mixture of fairy-tale/fantasy and science fiction. Whereas Episode 1 and 2 had horribly shallow characters, a Hollywood-style plot, and other weaknesses. It was just like every other movie in the genre (even the Force was explained away scientifically, DIE Script-writers!) Episodes 4-6 "pwn" 1 and 2. Any day.

Rebels=Pitful guerrila? Cough, Yavin IV, Cough, Endor, Cough...

Shok_Tinoktin
03-04-2005, 06:09 PM
Originally posted by Dagobahn Eagle
Duh. I don't get the reasoning about clones being inferior to other humans. So you're identical to someone else, big deal.:rolleyes:

For clones like Boba, yes I agree. The difference for clone troopers is that they are not identical to someone else (well, each other I guess), they have reduced independence, growth acceleration, and who knows what else.

Originally posted by Dagobahn Eagle
(even the Force was explained away scientifically, DIE Script-writers!)

Not really. The force is still as mysterious as always, midichlorians are just like a middle man or translator between sentients and the force.

jokemaster
03-04-2005, 07:32 PM
Originally posted by Dagobahn Eagle
Duh. I don't get the reasoning about clones being inferior to other humans. So you're identical to someone else, big deal.:rolleyes:

When people do get cloned, they'll get mistreated, have their rights taken away, and handled like sub-humans. Humans just never learn and need a minority group to pick on...:o

Back on topic:
They chose the Civil War because Episode I and II are widely regarded as horrible movies. Plain and simple. Episode 4 and 5, and to a degree Episode 6, had atmosphere, deep characters, and a fantastic mixture of fairy-tale/fantasy and science fiction. Whereas Episode 1 and 2 had horribly shallow characters, a Hollywood-style plot, and other weaknesses. It was just like every other movie in the genre (even the Force was explained away scientifically, DIE Script-writers!) Episodes 4-6 "pwn" 1 and 2. Any day.

Rebels=Pitful guerrila? Cough, Yavin IV, Cough, Endor, Cough...
I don't see why Eps 1 and 2 are regarded as horrible films. Inferior yes, but not horrible. I mean, let's compare how the 5 Star Wars movies have gone so far compared to, say, Rocky.

Also at Yavin and especially at Endor they used guerilla tactics, it's the nature of the battle, not something wrong with them.