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View Full Version : For the record concerning a certain swing. (exploit report)


RpTheHotrod
07-13-2005, 05:02 AM
Maybe people ask this question, so I am making this clear.

There is a swing where you "glide" in the air. You swing as you land, and your upper torso gets frozen in animation. A few seconds later, suddenly your saber jolts to the end of the animation.

This is a bug. Pretty much, those who use it are able to swing with no swing animation outside of the final part of the swing.


This is officially an exploit if used.

An exploit is a bug that is abused. Normally, that exploit is used to gain an advantage over others.


If you ask why this is an exploit, the answer is simple:

Common sense

Using this exploit allows you to swing without ever actually swinging. It's practically a teleport from two points with your arms. This cannot be done in real life in any form or fashion. Yes, this is star wars, but the actual swings were designed to be as realistic as possible.


However, many people still use this and claim that it is not an exploit, but remember, it IS officially an exploit. They can claim all they want, but it is an exploit.

Kurgan
07-13-2005, 05:33 AM
I'm not quite sure which one you're talking about. How about providing a demo showing it done?

And I hope you aren't going to say "well I want to keep it a secret so it won't be used." You brought it up in the first place, so only fair! ;)

And I assume you're referring to something in basejka...

riceplant
07-13-2005, 05:33 AM
Originally posted by RpTheHotrod
An exploit is a bug that is abused. Normally, that exploit is used to gain an advantage over others.
I would say that an exploit is a bug that is used at all, not just abused.

Kurgan
07-13-2005, 05:37 AM
Originally posted by riceplant
I would say that an exploit is a bug that is used at all, not just abused.

Or a bug that when "used" confers some kind of benefit? An advantage?

If it doesn't help you, or it's just strange looking, then I wouldn't call it an exploit...

Alternately an exploit could be a bug that could be used to cause harm to the server, if the exploiter so desired. That's another definition.

razorace
07-13-2005, 03:25 PM
Agreed. From what was discribed, it sounds more like a animation glitch than an actual problem.

riceplant
07-13-2005, 04:06 PM
I don't know, it would be pretty hard to block or dodge a swing you can't even see.

RpTheHotrod
07-13-2005, 06:33 PM
Many people use it...so no... a video wouldn't be a problem.

Lemme make one real quick.

RpTheHotrod
07-13-2005, 06:49 PM
http://include.dls-clan.net/exploit.avi

You can also exploit this with side swings.

As you can see, almost the entire swing animation is missing...and you can easily get a swing into people. If you look DOWN towards the ground during the swing, your saber will literally start halfway inside of their body.


Whether or not you think it's just an animation/bug...it's officially an exploit.

razorace
07-13-2005, 07:05 PM
Ah. Well, from the looks of it, the animation isn't properly transitioning from the land animation to the "swing start" animations before the attack animations. It's not much of an bug since the return animations don't normally do damage anyway.

I suppose this could be an exploit, but it's not nearly as bad as basejka's instant-bounce-attack-swings which really hurt the sword play.

Is this a basejka bug or something JA+ based? If it's basejka, I can look into creating a fix for it.

RpTheHotrod
07-13-2005, 10:40 PM
Razor, it's a large exploit because you can use it, and charge right into your enemy for an instant kill. It bypasses their defenses entirely. You cannot block the incoming swing simply because there really is no incoming swing...it's just POOF...inside of you. (it's blockable unless you do it a certain way, which some have discovered. It does make it indeed unblockable.....if the exploiter knows how to exploit it "just right")

Again though, you can also use this for side-swings...not just an overhead.

This is a basejka bug. I'd definetly like to see a fix. I also have some bugs that need fixed that have been corrected in ja+ but not in other mods. Get with me in MSN and we can discuss some stuff to correct so the community gets the fix, not just 1 mod.

razorace
07-13-2005, 11:16 PM
If you're talking basejka, it doesn't matter at all as saber blocking is basically random. There is no "saber block bypass" because you don't have saber defenses! The game just rolls the dice whenever the saber physically touches a player.

Now, if this was MB2 or OJP, yeah, it would be more of a problem since blocking is more reflex-based.

As for additional bugs, how about you post in the bugs thread over in the OJP forums?

Kurgan
07-14-2005, 01:53 AM
Ok watched it... so the "wind up" is missing, just the forward swing is there because the "wind up" animation is "playing" during the jump (you can't see it), also a slight pause as you land.. then the hit.

Of course the guy you hit doesn't have any defenses so this doesn't show it being "unblockable"but it makes your point at least.

If the guy had his saber up and aimed at you, and you still killed him in one hit (from full health) that would make the point even better, just saying ;)

Anyway, thanks for bringing this to my attention (and more importantly, to razor's).

Razor, RP has some good suggestions, please work with him and see what you guys can hammer out!

RpTheHotrod
07-14-2005, 02:03 AM
You are close.

I never clicked attack until the split second as I landed.

The windup flat out never happens...at all. The jump is just a jump. I click attack as I land.


Razor. It is a problem because it's a basejka bug...meaning you can do it in other mods...as well...where you CAN control your blocking.


You don't have to just jump straight at someone. I just did it that way to show the easiest "how it happens" way possible.

Red is SUPER strong, correct? What is the disadvantage of it? Slow swings...which leaves you open. Using this, you completely remove the disadvantage.

razorace
07-14-2005, 02:33 AM
Oh, ok. I thought you were indicating that it was a major exploit in basejka. :)

Anyway, in theory it shouldn't be a huge deal in OJP's system because you can't block/dodge/etc while jumping and players will still block that sort of instant attack without having to do anything. However, this might be a bigger problem in MB2.

RpTheHotrod
07-14-2005, 03:13 AM
and in ja+


and bwn


and xmod

and in JR


even basejka

If you know a swing is coming, you can jump back. With this, you can jump in to attack and suddenly die...even tho the opponent was never swinging, it seems.

Kurgan
07-14-2005, 04:21 AM
Originally posted by razorace
Oh, ok. I thought you were indicating that it was a major exploit in basejka. :)

Anyway, in theory it shouldn't be a huge deal in OJP's system because you can't block/dodge/etc while jumping and players will still block that sort of instant attack without having to do anything. However, this might be a bigger problem in MB2.

Of course it's not out of character for OJP to fix basejka bugs. ;)

I assume you're talking about OJP Enhanced's system right? OJP Basic obviously would be affected since it doesn't change the basejka sabers...

If you guys want me to move this thread to the OJP forum for easier access, just let me know!

RpTheHotrod
07-14-2005, 04:57 AM
Well, it's not really an issue with the project. It's a JKA exploit. A lot of people use it claiming it's an intended feature. I made this post here to clear it up that it is in fact an exploit.


Common sense would show that no animation swings that remove the disadvantage of using that particular style is an exploit.

Razor and I will deal with it in MSN.

Lathain Valtiel
07-16-2005, 11:58 AM
Huh? Kurg, I've shown you this bug before...

Yes, this is pretty much a bug/exploit. That said, it is only useful for people using single saber, particularly red. The other styles don't really have a significant windup.

On the other hand, it is fairly easy to see coming, BUT there are two ways to execute it. (Hint: Try jumping backwards. If you don't somersault in midair, and you are leaning forward, as you land, swing. Cue bug.)

Kurgan
07-16-2005, 09:32 PM
Originally posted by Lathain Valtiel
Huh? Kurg, I've shown you this bug before...

Yes, this is pretty much a bug/exploit. That said, it is only useful for people using single saber, particularly red. The other styles don't really have a significant windup.

On the other hand, it is fairly easy to see coming, BUT there are two ways to execute it. (Hint: Try jumping backwards. If you don't somersault in midair, and you are leaning forward, as you land, swing. Cue bug.)

If you did I'm sorry, I just don't remember... I obviously never told anyone about it. Anyway, hopefully this time, if it can be fixed, it will be in OJP...

Good to see you again Lath btw. ;)