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Fortnox
09-11-2005, 08:22 AM
do they? they've had Windu alive in the temple attack, they have Jango on the battle for Kashyyk, they call the galactic marines "clone commander", and the actual commander, commander Baacara, "Heavy Trooper" >_> they gave Luke a green saber on Hoth (lazy buggers) and gave Aayla Secura two sabers (there must be a reason for this), even had 501st troopers on Utapu. and ofcorse, they gave the magna gaurds guns. and, they might even have the BOH. WHY would you want the BOH in a battle front game?! it's not designed for Jedi dueling! and apparently, Rebels that have LAAT's (Republic Gunships) in space. W. T. F. Yoda has his saber on Dagobah (altho that is cool, fighting as him in Degobah) somehow they have Palpatine on DStar2 WITH his red saber
let me re-phrase the title, have the dev team watched ANYTHING to do with Star Wars- ever?

so I ask you, dose the team just go on instinct, or guess work? did some one have to explain to them what Star Wars is when they signed up? or do they know more about Star Wars than we think, but are too lazy to skin a different trooper for each planet?

*edit* and I just heard that they have removed Rhen Var and Bespin, dammit they were some of my faverote maps, I love the bespin platforms map!

Darth Arrow
09-11-2005, 08:34 AM
Well the game must be released with the Ep III DVD apparently so they have to get the game down ontime. Instead of adding all the features they can, they are perfecting what features they have now (new and old) and the new features that they miss will be added to Battlefront 3 with alot more detail and timing because it wont have to have a certain release date..

This all makes alot more sense now but hopefully it doesnt take too long to add all new features and perfect the clone trooper batallions/colours and get all the precise information down.

Fortnox
09-11-2005, 11:13 AM
good point, I hope a SWBF3 is made. it would rule if you actualy had different legions, and on the galactic conquer screen you could decide where to send each legion

Leviathan
09-11-2005, 12:26 PM
Wait for SWBF II, first... After, you'll see if a prequel is needed...

TK-8252
09-11-2005, 01:24 PM
Totally agreed... you made the rant thread that I wanted to but I'm too afraid of upsetting the fanboys. >_>

BTW, what's BOH?

ParanoidAndroid
09-11-2005, 01:35 PM
Yeah lets see how BF2 is before we start talking about a BF3.

I'm a bit dissapointed at the clone skins too, but I don't think the devs think that players will really care, they probably think that we care more about balanced classes and cool maps then if a clones armor fits the enviroment it is. Well at least they got the pilot droid right this time around, but then again now they have got the death star gunner as the imperial technician...

Sure the games not going to be exactly true to the movies, but they change stuff to make the game more playable and fun. I mean BF has always been a bit of a "what if" game anyway. What if the rebels and the empire fought on Dagobah? What if the rebels managed to win the battle of Hoth? I could understand not wanting these kind of inconsistancies in the campaign, that's supposed to reinact the movies. But in single player and multiplayer they can be a little more lenient.

and I really hope they include at least Bespin and hopefully Rhen Var in BF2

DarthMuffin
09-11-2005, 01:48 PM
Totally agreed... you made the rant thread that I wanted to but I'm too afraid of upsetting the fanboys. >_>

Is that me? :D
If it is, you didn't upset me, I swear. :) We're having a real nice little debate in the other topic.

That being said, I am 150% against the 2 sabres thing. All the dual-wielding is just destroying what Jedi duels are supposed to be.

And on the galactic marines/commander thing : they didn't even get the right colors for the battle droids in BF1, so I suppose you're asking a bit too much.

Rebel_Trooper
09-11-2005, 02:44 PM
This is all so right, it's painful to read. These are my EXACT feelings. Especially what they have done to the clones. I've said this before, but it needs to be said again. WHAT DRUGS ARE THE DEVS ON!? Don't worry about space and Jedi, make sure the game is correct first, then add the features. The devs have taken 2 steps forward then 10 backwards!

MachineCult
09-11-2005, 03:20 PM
I haven't seen Jango on Kashyyyk, and i saw a Hoth screenshot and lukes saber was BLUE im sure of it.

TK-8252
09-11-2005, 03:56 PM
Is that me? :D
If it is, you didn't upset me, I swear. :) We're having a real nice little debate in the other topic.

Well I don't know... I just know you're not against playable Jedi, but that doesn't make you a fanboy IMO.

Fanboys are like... the ones who are just... liek ogm tis gaem wil b r0xor fi yuo dont liek it yuo sux!11

:xp:

zerted
09-11-2005, 05:21 PM
...Don't worry about space and Jedi, make sure the game is correct first, then add the features. The devs have taken 2 steps forward then 10 backwards!
Are you sure they aren't standing backwards, thus moving 8 steps in the correct direction?

Darth Alec
09-12-2005, 04:35 AM
Are you sure they aren't standing backwards, thus moving 8 steps in the correct direction?

Its more like that. Looking back at previous mistakes, then mostly fiksing them. I dont really know the difference between galactic marines and commanders, but that isnt whats importent is it?
No, its the eksperience of the game, not so much looks, but eksperience.

Fortnox
09-12-2005, 03:04 PM
seems I'm not alone on this, alot of pepole are annoyed at the whole universe being messed up.
and the difference between galactic marines and commanders is big, there is only 1 commander of Baacaras type, now there will be 10 or 15 in a match >_>

and what I meant by the dual sabers, is that Aayla has 1 saber, but for some reason she has 2 sabers in SWBF2

Micahc
09-12-2005, 06:34 PM
:mad: Well if you can find a better Heavey trooper skin and Commander skin let us know. I don't really care what the clones look like as long as they can still fly a few hundred yards. But I HATE how the Magna guards are the CIS commander, thats just screwed in every way shape and form

TK-8252
09-12-2005, 07:51 PM
:mad: Well if you can find a better Heavey trooper skin and Commander skin let us know.

Uh, take a Clone Trooper, and put some spare equipment on his back. Tada, instant Heavy Trooper. And uh... Commander skin would be either Cody, Bacara, Bly, etc. depending on what map you're on.

It's not that hard to figure out, so stop being an apologist.

But I HATE how the Magna guards are the CIS commander, thats just screwed in every way shape and form

No more screwed up than having Galactic Marines as the Clone Commander.

DarthMuffin
09-13-2005, 11:44 AM
:mad: But I HATE how the Magna guards are the CIS commander, thats just screwed in every way shape and form

Sorry if I missed something, but where did you get this from? Does it also talk about the "classes" of the rebels and empire?

Commander Obi-Wan
09-13-2005, 02:00 PM
No more screwed up than having Galactic Marines as the Clone Commander.

?????????????????????? They are not the clone commanders!

Micahc
09-13-2005, 02:52 PM
Sorry if I missed something, but where did you get this from? Does it also talk about the "classes" of the rebels and empire?
It's in screen 3 of the PSP section on the official site. It might just be a PSP exclusive tho

TK-8252
09-13-2005, 04:10 PM
No more screwed up than having Galactic Marines as the Clone Commander.

?????????????????????? They are not the clone commanders!

In SWBF2, yes, they are. Of course, that is seriously screwed up.

I don't think it's actually confirmed that the MagnaGuard is the CIS Commander, because I've also seen yellow-marked Battle Droids.

Fortnox
09-13-2005, 04:17 PM
I've heard that its confirmed, plus theres that picture of a Magna gaurd with a gun. THAT is really, really ****ed up. the dev team is getting everything wrong.
personaly I thik the droid commander should have been a yellow-marked clone, or perhaps different on certain planets, like a crab droid on Utapau, but then again Crab Droids are probbably vehicles on Utapau

ParanoidAndroid
09-13-2005, 05:35 PM
Let's just hope they don't make the yellow marked droid the Heavy weapon class, or somthing equally inncorrect.

DarthMuffin
09-13-2005, 05:59 PM
In SWBF2, yes, they are. Of course, that is seriously screwed up.

I don't think it's actually confirmed that the MagnaGuard is the CIS Commander, because I've also seen yellow-marked Battle Droids.

Pilots weren't blue in BF1. The developers obviously don't look at the movies often.

...if they ever saw them, that is...

Commander Obi-Wan
09-13-2005, 07:31 PM
In SWBF2, yes, they are. Of course, that is seriously screwed up.

Actually the Clone sixth commander aren't not Clone Marines...look:http://lucasarts.com/games/swbattlefrontii/indexFlash.html#GamePlay.Republic.Characters

TK-8252
09-13-2005, 08:32 PM
In SWBF2, yes, they are. Of course, that is seriously screwed up.

Actually the Clone sixth commander aren't not Clone Marines...look:http://lucasarts.com/games/swbattlefrontii/indexFlash.html#GamePlay.Republic.Characters

Way to prove that you have no clue what you're talking about.

http://www.starwars.com/databank/character/commanderbacara/img/movie_bg.jpg

See those guys with Commander Bacara there? Those are the Galactic Marines. And that is what they made the Clone Commander.

Micahc
09-13-2005, 11:57 PM
In SWBF2, yes, they are. Of course, that is seriously screwed up.

I don't think it's actually confirmed that the MagnaGuard is the CIS Commander, because I've also seen yellow-marked Battle Droids.

this could be because of two things:
A: Your right and the Magna Guards are heroes.
B: They did the coloration write

MachineCult
09-14-2005, 07:37 AM
The Commander classes probably change for different maps.
Magnaguards aren't heroes they are a normal unit you can see it on one of the videos posted here:
http://www.lucasforums.com/showthread.php?t=152199

TK-8252
09-14-2005, 08:04 AM
The Commander classes probably change for different maps.

Probably not. I have seen, however, those camouflaged 41st troopers on Kashyyyk (most clones are still 501st though), and I haven't seen the Galactic Marines on Kashyyyk, so maybe at least one map has a different skin.

But it still makes NO SENSE, because the Commander should be Gree.

Redtech
09-14-2005, 08:16 AM
I do believe 2 things:

1) Changing my avatar is needed
2) Most retarded thread so far. Think about this s-l-o-w-l-y and logically. Do you realise how short the time is for BF2 to be made and what the deadline is? It's still a lot of work with balancing, map design etc, etc ad-infinitum. Also, they don't have the benefit of reading the books constantly (I'm thinking technical manuals) and watching the movies non-stop going "hey, that guy has a scorch on his shoulder plate!" At the end of the day, you, THE FANS demand a game that is going to be released within deadlines that would have Hideo Kojima commiting Hari-Kari.

Anyway, you want to wait another 2 years, and make a next-gen game based on the UT2007 engine, BF2 would get "Best game ever" award or something silly like that, but if the demo is co-inciding with the release of Ep3 on DVD, things have to get dropped along the way. It's called "games development". Pandemic are pros at making games. They'll deliver if people will stop crying that SBDs don't really have rockets etc.

Fortnox
09-14-2005, 02:46 PM
just like KOTOR2 then? it really wouldn't be that hard to re-skin and add accesories to the models they have already done (they already have Baacara but have him as a "heavy trooper"! they should swtich them round possibly) it'd only take about 6 months at the most for the dev team to make the new skins+model edits and add them on, I'd rather wait a lil' longer.

zerted
09-14-2005, 03:21 PM
SWBF2 is SWBF1 with a few addons. The modes of play are the hardest (and take the longest) to add to the game. The developers have to make the modes, then reprogram all the AI units to work with those modes. Adding one unit to each faction is not too hard. Its just adding a skin to a template and makeing a new AI. Adding new maps is not programming, its graphic design and a different department. The AI programming and testing/debuging of the entire game is what will take the longest.

Micahc
09-14-2005, 03:54 PM
Probably not. I have seen, however, those camouflaged 41st troopers on Kashyyyk (most clones are still 501st though), and I haven't seen the Galactic Marines on Kashyyyk, so maybe at least one map has a different skin.

But it still makes NO SENSE, because the Commander should be Gree.

If the commander was Gree wewould have people complaining about how Gree should be a Hero instead of a normal unit

TK-8252
09-14-2005, 04:09 PM
If the commander was Gree wewould have people complaining about how Gree should be a Hero instead of a normal unit

Well then there shouldn't be a "Clone Commander" class. But having Gree, Cody, etc. is the only way for it to at least be a Clone Commander, even if yeah, it does mean that there would be multiple Gree's and such running around. But actually, if you do notice, there were several other clones on Mygeeto with the Bacara design, but only one of them was the real Bacara.

Redtech
09-15-2005, 07:26 AM
Remember, they are called "clones" for a reason!

HordaK
09-15-2005, 09:30 AM
They are not just called Clones :-P

Commander Obi-Wan
09-15-2005, 02:05 PM
do they? they've had Windu alive in the temple attack, they have Jango on the battle for Kashyyk, they call the galactic marines "clone commander", and the actual commander, commander Baacara, "Heavy Trooper" >_> they gave Luke a green saber on Hoth (lazy buggers) and gave Aayla Secura two sabers (there must be a reason for this), even had 501st troopers on Utapu. and ofcorse, they gave the magna gaurds guns. and, they might even have the BOH. WHY would you want the BOH in a battle front game?! it's not designed for Jedi dueling! and apparently, Rebels that have LAAT's (Republic Gunships) in space. W. T. F. Yoda has his saber on Dagobah (altho that is cool, fighting as him in Degobah) somehow they have Palpatine on DStar2 WITH his red saber
let me re-phrase the title, have the dev team watched ANYTHING to do with Star Wars- ever?

so I ask you, dose the team just go on instinct, or guess work? did some one have to explain to them what Star Wars is when they signed up? or do they know more about Star Wars than we think, but are too lazy to skin a different trooper for each planet?

*edit* and I just heard that they have removed Rhen Var and Bespin, dammit they were some of my faverote maps, I love the bespin platforms map!

The reason why all this was done was to creates a little more excitement, more realistic, and better..there is nothing wrong with what they did!

Micahc
09-15-2005, 02:44 PM
The reason why all this was done was to creates a little more excitement, more realistic, and better..there is nothing wrong with what they did!

Um.. Explain how 501 troopers on Utapau, Magna guards on the front lines, Jango on Kashyyk, Boba on Yavin IV, and the Rebels having a Republic gunship make the game more realistic. There's nothing realistic about it! The 501 was never on Utapau, Magna guards are freaking body guards, Jango died on Geonosis, Boba never fought with the Empire on Yavin, And the Rebels never had gunships!

MachineCult
09-15-2005, 03:56 PM
We don't know that Boba wasn't on Yavin, and the Rebels could have got gunships from the same manufacturer.
Would someone please tell me how you all seem to be sure that Jango is on Kashyyyk because i don't believe that he is.

P.S. The MagnaGuards and the 501st look great i don't care if they aren't historically accurate.

Micahc
09-15-2005, 03:57 PM
There's a picture of Jango on Kashyyk on the official website. Yes the Clones look cool but it still isn't realistic

Redtech
09-15-2005, 04:25 PM
Anyone care to post where all this info about "weird units" is from? Although yeah, Rebel Gunship is out of character, unless it's in camo colours!

TK-8252
09-15-2005, 04:30 PM
We don't know that Boba wasn't on Yavin

Except that we do know that he wasn't.

and the Rebels could have got gunships from the same manufacturer.

Sounds like a stretch to me.

Care to show where you got your information?

Fortnox
09-15-2005, 05:23 PM
the "same manufacturer" is the kamino's >_> besides, even if you could get a gunship and use it in space, IT WOULD BE TOTALY USELESS! you can't use one is space! it isn't designed for it! IT CAN'T DOG FIGHT! it is designed to move like a helicopter, not really fast as needed for dog fighting! plus, the cock pit isn't sealed, the pilot would go flying out! its stupid.

DarthMuffin
09-15-2005, 06:10 PM
the "same manufacturer" is the kamino's >_> besides, even if you could get a gunship and use it in space, IT WOULD BE TOTALY USELESS! you can't use one is space! it isn't designed for it! IT CAN'T DOG FIGHT! it is designed to move like a helicopter, not really fast as needed for dog fighting! plus, the cock pit isn't sealed, the pilot would go flying out! its stupid.

*Expects an EU freak to jump out of the shadows and smack you on the head, stating some crazy reasons on why gunships are the best space-superiority fighters*

If I were one of the Rebel's commanding officer, and I knew about the Kaminoans, I would order something else than a couple of gunships.

Anyway, having a gunship flying around in space, dodging shots from star destroyers and TIE fighters is just not right. I really hope the devs have a little more imagination.

TK-8252
09-15-2005, 06:12 PM
the "same manufacturer" is the kamino's >_>

Actually it's Rothana Heavy Engineering... the Kaminoians just contracted them. :)

zerted
09-15-2005, 07:06 PM
...plus, the cock pit isn't sealed, the pilot would go flying out! its stupid.Buckle-up. Its the law. :smash:




Explanation: joke for all the USA people whoose states require wearing seatbelts.

MachineCult
09-15-2005, 07:27 PM
Care to show where you got your information?

What information? I only gave a suggestion, the only information i had was that Rothana Heavy engineering made them.

Except that we do know that he wasn't.

We never saw the Rebels on Cloud City or Mos Eisley, and when were Green lightsaber Luke and Vader ever on the same battlefield? Why question Boba Fett being playable on Yavin (which is cool) and not all the inconveivable things that happened with BF1?

P.S. Gunships in space just ain't right, the only explanation that i can think of is that they put them in because they hadn't finished the Rebel space transport that is going to be in the full game.

TK-8252
09-15-2005, 07:33 PM
What information? I only gave a suggestion, the only information i had was that Rothana Heavy engineering made them.

Don't suggest things that you just made up right on the spot that you know are wrong.

We never saw the Rebels on Cloud City or Mos Eisley, and when were Green lightsaber Luke and Vader ever on the same battlefield? Why question Boba Fett being playable on Yavin (which is cool) and not all the inconveivable things that happened with BF1?

Actually I do believe in the EU there were some Alliance troops who liberated Cloud City after the Empire fell but the garrison was still there. Yeah though there wasn't any Rebel vs. Imperial battles in Mos Eisely. And like I've been saying, Luke and Vader on the battlefield are wrong, just like having Boba is.

MachineCult
09-15-2005, 07:50 PM
Don't suggest things that you just made up right on the spot that you know are wrong.

You don't have to be so hostile, this is a discussion board and i was merely atemping to discuss what was being talked about, i see nothing wrong with what i said.

TK-8252
09-15-2005, 07:52 PM
You don't have to be so hostile, this is a discussion board and i was merely atemping to discuss what was being talked about, i see nothing wrong with what i said.

I fail to see how you're discussing something by making up something on the spot, basically being an apologist.

MachineCult
09-15-2005, 08:03 PM
This is supposed to be a place where people can talk to each other about Battlefront and Battlefront II and all you are doing is stopping me from doing that.
If you don't agree with me tell me in a civilised way.

TK-8252
09-15-2005, 08:21 PM
If you don't agree with me tell me in a civilised way.

I did.

Don't suggest things that you just made up right on the spot that you know are wrong.

See?

MachineCult
09-16-2005, 09:28 AM
What you said was rude and unnecessary.

Fortnox
09-16-2005, 11:41 AM
*uses a fire extinguisher on the thread* we don't wnat to turn this into a flame argument ppl, lets forget it.

P.S. Gunships in space just ain't right, the only explanation that i can think of is that they put them in because they hadn't finished the Rebel space transport that is going to be in the full game.
good point, hopefuly it was a temporary model repalcement for a A-Wing, B-Wing or something

MachineCult
09-16-2005, 01:40 PM
Well there are already A wings in the game so hopefully it's a B wing.

ParanoidAndroid
09-16-2005, 02:54 PM
Well the gunship if it was used as a temporary model would probably be used to represent the rebel transport, not a B-wing (although I still hope that this is in the game) which is a starfighter. They will probably just use some obscure EU ship or maybe just make one up. I would prefer either to the clone gunship for the alliance.

MachineCult
09-16-2005, 03:52 PM
I know what you mean the Rebels having a gunship is just lazy on the developers part. The Clone Gunship isn't even a space craft so im pretty sure that they'll have replaced the gunship, and it must be EU because i can't think of anything from the movies that could be a Rebel shuttle. Maybe just an Imperial shuttle? (Tyderium) but i doubt it.

TK-8252
09-16-2005, 04:23 PM
What you said was rude and unnecessary.

Nope.

I've been here for years. I know what's acceptable to say and what's not. :)

MachineCult
09-16-2005, 04:44 PM
We've dropped it ok? I just didn't like the way you were talking to me.

DarthMuffin
09-16-2005, 04:58 PM
It's amazing to see how TK is talented when it comes down to starting bloody debates :)

We don't want to get this locked, so we'd better go back on topic.

Debating over whether or not the gunship will fly in space is, as of now, pointless. We don't even know if it will be like that in the retail version of the game. Like someone must have said since the creation of this thread, we should continue this after the game is released.

ParanoidAndroid
09-16-2005, 10:20 PM
A captured imperial shuttle, maybe marked with the rebel logo, might work. It would certainly make more sense then the Rebublic gunship, although would it really be to much to ask for them to give the rebels there own unique transport?

Fortnox
09-17-2005, 04:26 AM
though the imperial shuttle would be totaly useless. slow, weak, low weapons, not designed to dog fight, just to get important pepole from A to B.

zerted
09-17-2005, 10:21 PM
Any unit or vehicle may be in space. The units just might be dead, and I don't think dead units are good at flying ships, but I could be wrong.

Fortnox
09-18-2005, 03:58 AM
rofl, tho on a side note you can only have pilots and basic toopers in space (as in, Storm Pilot + Storm Trooper, Rebel Pilot+ Rebel, Droid Pilot+ SBD, etc.)

HordaK
09-18-2005, 05:37 AM
and the Pilots have Timebombs, i saw that in one of the videos

ParanoidAndroid
09-18-2005, 06:37 AM
yeah, and for some reason they gave the soldier class a rocket launcher during space battles.

Redtech
09-18-2005, 08:04 AM
They are not just called Clones :-P
Well, technically they are genetically modified on the germline (and possibly somatic cell line) which means their DNA is different from Jango, so technically, they are GMOs. :P

Fortnox
09-23-2005, 04:58 PM
http://www.gamespot.com/ps2/action/starwarsbattlefront2/media.html
we have more examples of the teams stupidity, Magna Gaurds holding weapons, 501st on Felucia, Aayla with 2 sabers... when will the blatant disregaurd for Star Wars end?

Redtech
09-25-2005, 10:14 AM
"Cry me a river." All opffence intended, but GET A LIFE. BAttlefront isn't a sim, it's an arcade team-based shooter.

Fortnox
09-25-2005, 12:22 PM
your point? its a very stupid team-based shooter. geeesh, a Star Wars sim? thatd suck. "yay my stormtrooper got +1 cooking! now I can cook raw Bantha!"

HordaK
09-25-2005, 02:02 PM
Well i really think he didnt mean sim in meaning of the little sucky "Sims" i think he meant it as Star Wars Simulation....but dont say it 2 loud....maybe some day LA tries to get more money with a new Game "The Star Wars Sims"...."Create ur own imperial Family, get a job in Darth Vaders Star Destroyer and meet ur neighbours for new Friendships...." Well a Sims clone based on Star Wars....anyway it would be fun to phone Vader and invite him to ur Stormtrooper Party :vsd:

but this wents to much off topic

TK-8252
09-25-2005, 02:16 PM
now I can cook raw Bantha!"

Tasty.

Fortnox
09-25-2005, 03:21 PM
Tasty.
not really, have you ever tasted raw cooked Bantha? its worse that Bantha Poodo, partaly because Banthas eat Bantha Poodo.

YourBestFriend
09-25-2005, 11:58 PM
P.S. Gunships in space just ain't right...

Just to chime in on this, they had Gunships in space in the Clonewars cartoon. Just close the side doors and you're ready to go! Of course they would suck in a dogfight (slow and low HP), but being a transport ship, that is the point.

ET Warrior
09-26-2005, 12:32 AM
raw cooked Bantha? Contradiction of terms, neh?

Cows eat grass, cows taste > grass. Your logic doesn't hold up.

Redtech
09-26-2005, 03:56 AM
Cows=tasty!

Fortnox, I meant that BF2 is not going to be a realistic simulation of the events of Star Wars, because the movies aren't realistic. In a three on one fight, the US Marine corps would out gun any Storm trooper that even tried to lift it's blaster. The rebels would always win in the end, the droids would always loose...ho-hum.

The way I see it, the best thing is to screw history and let it play out, what if the CIS had claimed Kamino, or Grievous had won the battle of Coruscant, so on and so forth. It's much more entertaining.

But with realism, all soldiers would be fighting on a level that would make the Iraq wars look pleasant. I mean, in real life I should be able to make suicide rebels rigged with thermal detonators, or for Storm trooper armour to actually be effective, or for the CIS to have developed some anti-human WMDs against unsuited clones, so on and so forth.

There's "Star Wars" realism, which is to say, little, or there's "Real-life" realism, which is messy, bloody and cruel, although personally, if I was Grievous, I would have ordered all ships to neutron nuke Coruscant and win the Clone Wars in less than 10 minutes, but that's just me.

TK-8252
09-26-2005, 07:59 AM
In a three on one fight, the US Marine corps would out gun any Storm trooper that even tried to lift it's blaster.

Except that Stormtrooper armor is bullet-proof, and the bullets would never even penetrate.

or for the CIS to have developed some anti-human WMDs against unsuited clones, so on and so forth.

Actually they did. They put it inside these big droids and had them do suicide runs at the clones. Clones blow up the droid, boom - toxin goes everywhere.

Pho3nix
09-26-2005, 08:10 AM
They screwed up, end of story.

Redtech
09-26-2005, 09:41 AM
Hey Pho3nix, you read VGCats too? Cool.
-------------------------------
TK, just adding...

Wait, suicide bombers in Star Wars? You'll be telling me there's a 911 scene in Ep 3 now? It wasn't something Lucas created I'm sure. *shrugs*

Can't say that Stormie armour gives much protection if even stones dropped from height can brain one, (Ewok power!) and a decent machine gun round can penetrate vehicles. Heck, a heavy assault rifle will kill anything bar a tank and non-grounded aircraft. (OK and ships, to be fussy).

Pho3nix
09-26-2005, 10:22 AM
Hmmh, yes. :P

TK-8252
09-26-2005, 04:54 PM
Wait, suicide bombers in Star Wars? You'll be telling me there's a 911 scene in Ep 3 now? It wasn't something Lucas created I'm sure. *shrugs*

Early in the war, that trait was employed in suicide runs by octuptarra droids towards clone trooper enemies. The Separatists had developed biological weapons that specifically targeted the identical genome shared by all the clone troopers. The central hollows within the ball-shaped brains of the octuptarra droid stored the virus in gaseous form, earning these droids the nickname of virus droids.

Not seen in the movies but still just a little story... ;)

Can't say that Stormie armour gives much protection if even stones dropped from height can brain one, (Ewok power!) and a decent machine gun round can penetrate vehicles. Heck, a heavy assault rifle will kill anything bar a tank and non-grounded aircraft. (OK and ships, to be fussy).

I'm sure .50 cal would do the trick, but a standard M16 couldn't puncture it. And hey, the armor may be strong, but it ain't impact-resistant. Rocks don't count! :)

zerted
09-26-2005, 09:36 PM
...I'm sure .50 cal would do the trick, but a standard M16 couldn't puncture it. And hey, the armor may be strong, but it ain't impact-resistant. Rocks don't count! :)
Simple solution: Its a type of a Goa'uld design. Lasers and bullets move fast, so they are stopped. Rocks are slow and get through. (Though the lasers burn through after a few shots. Afterall, its the enegry shield in the form of wearable armor, not an energy bubble)

"<i>Goa'uld Energy Shield
All Goa'uld capital ships and some Goa'uld leaders utilize energy shielding for protection. In the case of personal shielding, the shield's power is directly proportional to the kinetic energy of the projectile it is blocking. This makes the shield powerless against slow moving projectiles, like arrows.</i>" from Stargate at Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Technology_in_the_Stargate_universe#Goa.27uld_Ener gy_Shield)

I don't think we can compare laser based weapons with bullet guns. We do have laser weapons, but nothing like Star Wars'.

MandaloreBIC
09-26-2005, 11:46 PM
un... why are we talking about stargate, this is a starwars fourm, and alough bulletguns for BF2 would bee cool, how would the jedi delect bullets? unless suddenly lucasarts give jedis Neo/Matrix powers, but you don't want me to get into that....

added later... and besides, they will have heros other then jedi, like leia, han, commander cody and other people covering for luke and vader on the battfield, oh and did i say veers?

TK-8252
09-26-2005, 11:48 PM
un... why are we talking about stargate, this is a starwars fourm, and alough bulletguns for BF2 would bee cool, how would the jedi delect bullets? unless suddenly lucasarts give jedis Neo/Matrix powers, but you don't want me to get into that....

They couldn't deflect them, just burn them up with the blade. And actually, there were Matrix moves in JK2 and JA for Force-users...

MandaloreBIC
09-26-2005, 11:51 PM
actually the lightsaber prodouced a light blade taht is thinner than a few moucloes of atoms put together, so it can cut through anything, so if someone shoots towards a jedi's forhead and the jedi cuts the bullet, it would split in half and have the effect of 2 bullets instead of just one on the jedi's forhead... not a good idea....
but still it would be cool if jedis had matrix powers! i know it would be totally messed up and stuff but still, coolness is everthing and luke does have a blue saber on hoth!!!!
oh you mean like the JA side wall run and stuff, taht move is cool.

Kurgan
09-27-2005, 01:10 AM
do they? they've had Windu alive in the temple attack, they have Jango on the battle for Kashyyk, they call the galactic marines "clone commander", and the actual commander, commander Baacara, "Heavy Trooper" >_> they gave Luke a green saber on Hoth (lazy buggers) and gave Aayla Secura two sabers (there must be a reason for this), even had 501st troopers on Utapu. and ofcorse, they gave the magna gaurds guns. and, they might even have the BOH. WHY would you want the BOH in a battle front game?! it's not designed for Jedi dueling! and apparently, Rebels that have LAAT's (Republic Gunships) in space. W. T. F. Yoda has his saber on Dagobah (altho that is cool, fighting as him in Degobah) somehow they have Palpatine on DStar2 WITH his red saber
let me re-phrase the title, have the dev team watched ANYTHING to do with Star Wars- ever?

so I ask you, dose the team just go on instinct, or guess work? did some one have to explain to them what Star Wars is when they signed up? or do they know more about Star Wars than we think, but are too lazy to skin a different trooper for each planet?

*edit* and I just heard that they have removed Rhen Var and Bespin, dammit they were some of my faverote maps, I love the bespin platforms map!

Well it's a beta, so I expect some of that stuff to change, but bear in mind these were the guys who did Battlefront. Movie accuracy doesn't seem high on their list. There were no Dark Troopers anywhere in the movies, and yet we have them in every major Imperial battle for example. Likewise since when are ARC Troopers on Geonosis, much less as Rocket Launcher users? Super Battle Droids fighting on Naboo? Etc.

You could rationalize some of the stuff as "what if" battles and including material freely borrowed from EU sources (the LAAT's in space comes from the Clone Wars series), but still. ;) It's a game, they're taking all sorts of shortcuts. Sadly, movie-purists won't get their fix this way, without mods...

I wasn't too fond of Bespin (horrible to play single player.. bad hot spots for example). But Rhen Var I liked a lot, and I never even heard of it before I played this game. The Clone Wars versions were some of the most fun in the game I thought. Here I thought this game was supposed to "replace" SWBF1... leaving the only reason to play SWBF1 on the PC at all was for the AOTC style clone troopers. If they start deleting maps that kinda defeats the purpose... :P

Hopefully they'll add them back in the (inevitable) first patch...

Kurgan
09-27-2005, 01:23 AM
Wait, did somebody mention "jedi duels"?

Are those even POSSIBLE in this game? I thought you either were limited to one Jedi per map (so one side doesn't get them?)... and even if that isn't true, how about the actual combat.

In SWBF1's playable Jedi Mod the Jedi have exactly ONE SWING since that's all the AI Jedi got, an instant kill move. So how do you duel with that? Are they being given a repetoire of moves and blocks? If a Jedi is based on time (and not damage, somebody correct me if I'm wrong, doing it with both seems sensible enough), what good is a duel? You'd just have two invincible warriors hacking into each other constantly, until their time was up and they walk off the map. What's the point in that?

Or am I wrong and did they add in the ability for two Jedi to fight one another on the battle field rather than just distract each other?

HordaK
09-27-2005, 03:02 AM
U ever played JK (doesnt matter which one)? Jedi Battles are exactly what u said, 2 Peeps with a saber hacking each other until 1 dies (is the same like leaving the battlefield), but back to ur Question, in the Chatlog (dunno which thread the link is) they mentioned a Celibrity Deathmatch Mode, where everyone can be a Hero, so in Fact it means on a 18 Peeps Server in the worste case
9 Obi Wans Vs. 9 Jango Fetts or even lets say 9 Windus Vs 9 Dookus, to the question about the duels, well its not like in Moviebattles 2 where u have Attack on 1st Mouse Button and Block on 2nd Mouse button, in SWBF Jedi share the first button for attack and Block, and switching the mode is more difficult to just press another button, anyway since Swinging the Lightsaber doesnt cost anything u can swing a lifetime until ur time runs out, so the one who blocks first may wait forever until the other one stops attacking and start blocking himself...
any Special Moves, no just the normal rolling like the troops in SWBF i think and Force Jump...if the Jedi are immune to forces like push, pull, choke and Lightning there wont be much funny duels like in other games, than its just a stupid "Who hits first, wins" ok thats realistic but wont be much fun in the case of duelling....well it would even su** if the jedi cant lose their Lightsaber, otherwise they would just Saberthrow spam each other...That Saberthrow Spam is not possible in Movie Battles 2, if u throw ur opponent will block it in 97% of all cases and u lose ur lightsaber, and in some cases ur force resistence so u can get pushed or chocked around, etc...the SWBF2 Team (if they really want to add good Jedi) they should play Movie Battles 2 and copy some things, cause MB2 Jedis/Sith are the best ive ever seen in a Star Wars game...

and to all this "Jedi are overpowered in MB2" Cryers....i played MB2 long enough i know they are everything but not overpowered...even a single Soldier can take out some Jedi/Sith alone...get Reinforcements so u have 3 lifes, get a Grenade so u can 1 hit kill the Saberman with some skill + luck and if u are getting pushed around, try the walk or crouch button....walking or crouching gunner are immune to push and pull (atleast they dont fall over, they just get pushed back or pulled a bit closer) and a force using jedi is very very easy to damage, he cant deflect if he uses push, pull or whatever he wants..but thats a different game, too bad in my eyes....a combination of Battlefront and Moviebattles may become the best selling star wars game ever imo

Kurgan
09-27-2005, 03:19 AM
U ever played JK (doesnt matter which one)? Jedi Battles are exactly what u said, 2 Peeps with a saber hacking each other until 1 dies (is the same like leaving the battlefield),

No way. I have played JK1 (played it for 3 years, along with MotS!). The saber fighting in JK1 was much more complex than just one swing. Likewise it was a double swing so you could time it to hit your opponent at different parts. The saber in SWBF1 is like your typical FPS "no ammo" weapon.. your crowbar, axe, fist. It's a single strike no range hit. There's no blocking whatsoever (in SWBF1 the Jedi simply block everything, regardless of if it hits their blade or not, or else they block nothing, as in the Killable Jedi mod). In JK1/MotS you additionally had the primary swing which had 7 swings (6 plus the swing you used while swimming in water) that you could use in battle. And in MotS you could throw your saber! This is a far cry from the simplicity of SWBF1. SWBF's version is like having a crowbar duel in Half Life 1.

JK2/JA are an entirely different animal of course. While some people do just swing randomly and other people use only one move, you'd be hard pressed to prove that all duels are won only by one move and there is no skill involved (just watch, a huge debate will erupt, I'll sit that one out if that's the case, thanks!).

So my question is, will it be possible to have an actual duel in SWBF2, or not? Unless they modify the Jedi combat to an advanced degree, I hazard to say it won't be anything close...

but back to ur Question, in the Chatlog (dunno which thread the link is) they mentioned a Celibrity Deathmatch Mode, where everyone can be a Hero, so in Fact it means on a 18 Peeps Server in the worste case
9 Obi Wans Vs. 9 Jango Fetts or even lets say 9 Windus Vs 9 Dookus, to the question about the duels, well its not like in Moviebattles 2 where u have Attack on 1st Mouse Button and Block on 2nd Mouse button, in SWBF Jedi share the first button for attack and Block, and switching the mode is more difficult to just press another button, anyway since Swinging the Lightsaber doesnt cost anything u can swing a lifetime until ur time runs out, so the one who blocks first may wait forever until the other one stops attacking and start blocking himself...

Interesting. This would imply that the heroes are killable (unless the goal is simply to complete your objectives before your characters all run out, but then the title "deathmatch" implies your goal is rather to kill the enemy). The question still remains, can the Jedi "duel" or just hack each other until one person runs out of health?

any Special Moves, no just the normal rolling like the troops in SWBF i think and Force Jump...if the Jedi are immune to forces like push, pull, choke and Lightning there wont be much funny duels like in other games, than its just a stupid "Who hits first, wins" ok thats realistic but wont be much fun in the case of duelling....

My point exactly. The Jedi as is either block everything (pointless) or block nothing (no duel possible). Just run up to the guy and swing first, you win!

Honestly it would not bug me heavily if it was not possible to duel in this game, but they shouldn't advertise it (and fans shouldn't hope for it) if it's indeed just your usual one hit kill no range one swing and that's it.

well it would even su** if the jedi cant lose their Lightsaber, otherwise they would just Saberthrow spam each other...That Saberthrow Spam is not possible in Movie Battles 2,

Saber Throw spam isn't possible in basejka (Jedi Academy 1.01) either, because the move uses up mana. The trouble happens only on servers where screw with forceregentime, making all moves that use up mana spammable.

if u throw ur opponent will block it in 97% of all cases and u lose ur lightsaber, and in some cases ur force resistence so u can get pushed or chocked around, etc...the SWBF2 Team (if they really want to add good Jedi) they should play Movie Battles 2 and copy some things, cause MB2 Jedis/Sith are the best ive ever seen in a Star Wars game...

Honestly? The trouble with Jedi is you have to balance them vs. gunners AND against other Jedi. And this too in a game where you make Jedi "special" as a class that's not allowed to use other weapons (in the JK series the Dark/Jedi were generally the everyman soldier who just happened to have the ability to use force and saber when the situation called for it).


and to all this "Jedi are overpowered in MB2" Cryers....i played MB2 long enough i know they are everything but not overpowered...even a single Soldier can take out some Jedi/Sith alone...get Reinforcements so u have 3 lifes, get a Grenade so u can 1 hit kill the Saberman with some skill + luck and if u are getting pushed around, try the walk or crouch button....walking or crouching gunner are immune to push and pull (atleast they dont fall over, they just get pushed back or pulled a bit closer) and a force using jedi is very very easy to damage, he cant deflect if he uses push, pull or whatever he wants..but thats a different game, too bad in my eyes....a combination of Battlefront and Moviebattles may become the best selling star wars game ever imo

The thing is, if the Jedi in SWBF2 are bonuses, and HEROES they they would be expected to be STRONGER than your average soldier, not "balanced." A powerup is called a powerup for a reason! Honestly Jedi should be stronger than your average soldier (the stupidity of the Prequel movie Jedi nonwithstanding of course). The fact that they made them a powerup rather than a class you could regularly pick allows them to beef up the character a bit if they want. Saying the Jedi should be balanced in SWBF2 is like arguing that the Quad Damage should be "balanced" with the players who don't have it in Quake3.

As I see it the Jedi are more powerful than your average soldier, but weaker than a player in a combat vehicle, so it's fine. Unless the person who's the Jedi has no idea what they're doing, they should have a (temporary) advantage. That's the point.

HordaK
09-27-2005, 03:38 AM
well if u see the heroes as a powerup/bonus (like they are) it would be useless to make em stronger than the normal gunner, since Vehicles are not the bonus or powerup u have to earn like a hero for a period of time, if the gunner is underpowered, he will jump into a vehicle and "hide" there until the jedi runs out of time or just help him to leave the battlefield quicker, with his guns.

back to the CD Mode, dunno if its there a special Arena or map, cause i think it would suck if u have 9 Yodas Vs 9 Vaders...if they make such a mode they should free it from the Map Limitations, that means, EVERYONE can choosen EVERY Hero he wants, so in conclusion it may be Luke, Ben, Leia, Han, Chewbacca Vs. Vader, Boba, etc. u know? that would be a great game mode otherwise it really just would be a "Clone Wars" game mode...

I just saw 1 Duel in 1 Movie that was Griev Vs. Obi, and it didnt look like a funny duel since both were just standing around, Obi Instant Blocking unable to attack, and Griev swinging like mad without any exhaustion...im sure there will be some servers where u can try to duel, and i hope then it would not be such a dissapointment like it looks now

Redtech
09-27-2005, 03:44 AM
I'm sure .50 cal would do the trick, but a standard M16 couldn't puncture it. And hey, the armor may be strong, but it ain't impact-resistant. Rocks don't count! :) Well, I can assure you, that most "decent" assault rifles have a higher penetration and impact force than a rock. Anyway, I believe George was making it up as he went along.

As I see it the Jedi are more powerful than your average soldier, but weaker than a player in a combat vehicle, so it's fine. Unless the person who's the Jedi has no idea what they're doing, they should have a (temporary) advantage. That's the point.
Interesting point, although in many FPS there is the problem of people just lurking around the powerups or just finding the quickest route to get the most pick-ups in the easiest way (I'm guilty of that, I'll never attack at below 110 health!) I dunno if this might make online play too dominated by people wanting to be the Jedi and just killing for the bonus, rather than actually as part of a team.

HordaK
09-27-2005, 03:55 AM
Thats why i want em balanced and not to be uber compared to the grunts

again the time to compare SWBF with MB2, in MB2 the SaberFighters are balanced and they are not that uber used like everyone thinks, beeing a jedi there is not a guarantee to win, if u rush ur enemy (even if they are just 2 soliders) u will surely lose until ur not the mega Skiller and the gunners suck...Jedis without teamplay in MB2 are doomed just like anyone else who thinks he is a 1 man army and can kill the whole team alone..if u force em to be teamplayers there wont be pure Jedi Vs. Sith servers, if they hold em like they are, Invincible Monster Instant Kill Tanks, there wont be any teamplay from the hero player, he will just go on a rampage until his time runs out....

anyway here the quote from the devchat about the CD :

RoakanaZombie: Think of it more like Quad Damage or a boss unit in other games. Its a cool and unique experience but rare. The one exception to this is Celebrity Deathmatch where everyone can be a hero. That is pretty cool.

and heres the link to the whole Log :

Click me, Im a Link (http://theoverkillnation0.tripod.com/devchat.html)

Kurgan
09-27-2005, 03:57 AM
well if u see the heroes as a powerup/bonus (like they are) it would be useless to make em stronger than the normal gunner, since Vehicles are not the bonus or powerup u have to earn like a hero for a period of time, if the gunner is underpowered, he will jump into a vehicle and "hide" there until the jedi runs out of time or just help him to leave the battlefield quicker, with his guns.

But it's also true that not every map has vehicles, and there isn't a vehicle for every player on a team, you often find yourself without access to one. A Jedi can appear "anytime" or "anywhere." If a Jedi can be taken out easily by a single guy with a gun, what's the point of granting it as a bonus? You actually would be becoming weaker, because instead of a guy with a ranged attack you're now a guy who can only kill by getting right up in somebody's face.

I just saw 1 Duel in 1 Movie that was Griev Vs. Obi, and it didnt look like a funny duel since both were just standing around, Obi Instant Blocking unable to attack, and Griev swinging like mad without any exhaustion...im sure there will be some servers where u can try to duel, and i hope then it would not be such a dissapointment like it looks now

Ah, more movie unrealism, since the two can't fight the way they did in the movies! (no whipping out blasters or electrostaves or getting into vehicles)

Anyway, doesn't sound like a duel to me, more like what I was saying about SWBF1's Jedi given controllability. Sounds like people will try it at first until they realize it's no fun and then give up. The only reason I can see to attack another melee weapon Hero would be just to distract them from your teammates.

There would be no point at all to "teamplay" among Jedi because you only ever get one per team. Unless you mean a Jedi supporting a group of grunts. But what's the point... all things being equal, a grunt with a gun is more useful than a grunt with a melee weapon. So being a Jedi would be a disadvantage under your system methinks...

HordaK
09-27-2005, 04:04 AM
well the point of granting em as a bonus should be then a skill question not a "if u get the 2 first kills u will be God over a period of time" thing... dunno how about u but i would like a bonus that i can make my team stronger with helping em as a balanced jedi more than a God Mode One Person Rampage Bonus..

well if that griev Obi thing doesnt sound like a duel for u, i think we both will be dissapointed in the point of duelling since that was the only scene where 2 Saberfighters are close to eachother in SWBF2 and "fighting"

Kurgan
09-27-2005, 04:26 AM
well the point of granting em as a bonus should be then a skill question not a "if u get the 2 first kills u will be God over a period of time" thing... dunno how about u but i would like a bonus that i can make my team stronger with helping em as a balanced jedi more than a God Mode One Person Rampage Bonus..

Actually the "skill" is earning the Jedi in the first place. Why bother making being a Jedi require greater skill after that?

Take the game Rune for example. You deal enough damage and suddenly you get BLOODLUSTED! This means you're invulnerable and your strikes do HUGE damage, plus you're scary as hell because you make sound noises when you walk and your eyes glow read, etc. It's awesome. And it's completely skillless because you can just burn through anybody nearby, they'd be smart to run away! It's on a timer, and once it runs out you're back to normal. Getting hit just shortens your "bloodlust bar" a bit more. I don't see what's so objectionable about making the Jedi the same way.

Are the Jedi in MB2 "earned"? If they're not, then they can't be in any way compared I think.

Getting a Jedi in SWBF2 is akin to grabbing the Quad Damage in Quake3. People around you should go "oh s***" rather than "oh, he's just as weak us us he just can't shoot now."

Jedi already can be taken out easily by combat vehicles, why do we need to balance them with individual blaster carrying grunts? Is it to makeup for a lack of teamwork against them? Unlike Jedi Academy, this isn't a deathmatch game, so unless we're setting up a duel mode, I question the "wisdom" you're suggesting here, no offense!

well if that griev Obi thing doesnt sound like a duel for u, i think we both will be dissapointed in the point of duelling since that was the only scene where 2 Saberfighters are close to eachother in SWBF2 and "fighting"

Yeah. Was this a developer demonstration or just some players messing around? Because if they were demonstrating it you'd think they'd show us everything they had, ie... something done that they intended people to do. This sort of "dueling" is pathetic. I mean at least if you have two guys circle strafing around each other firing their rifles that's something. One guy slapping the other in the face and then the other slapping the first guy, that's not what we think of when we think of saber duels in the movies or the JK series, it's just not acceptable.

HordaK
09-27-2005, 04:50 AM
I think it was the second OFFICIAL Trailer which was showing that "Duel"

Dont tell me it takes skill to make the first 2 kills to become the hero, u just have to be the first on the server, get into a vehicle and rush the enemy, ok the Vehicles now have weak point and the engineers can slice peeps out of their vehicles but a vehicle remains stronger than a gunner so its not that difficult to "earn" the hero even if u raise the kill amount needed.... You dont have to be God to be scarry, even your skill can scare the enemy, if u got some, and even if the jedi would be balanced they wont be as weak as the grunts, the Force makes the difference, Force jump dont make em less balanced cause grunts have the jetpack as kinda equivalent even if u cant use it all the time...even a balanced class can be superior in the right hands...

which Jedi may become faster boring to play

1. the one with his god mode that doesnt need skill and his anti teamplay emphasis

or

2. The Jedi which can be a strong weapon and help for the Team if u have earned enough skill with it maybe in single player but without a frustrating godmode for the enemy


In my opinion would become the first 1 faster boring because if a Gunner sees a God Mode Jedi he will run into a vehicle and blast me until my Bonus leaves the battlefield....thats not fun to any side, neither the jedi player nor the grunt cause he cant kill me with his gun

In MB2 their not a bonus in that way of thinking, but if an unskilled jedi joins ur team its kinda useless for the team, so the Jedi/Sith in Movie Battles is a Bonus if u are skilled with it cause, how mentioned above, the force makes the difference, even if the jedi are balanced amongst the gunners

and of course the jedi/sith are not melee only in SWBF2, cause they have the force, u can even Lightning, Choke, Push or Pull the Grunts over a certain distance and throw ur saber so u are not doomed to melee only

zerted
09-27-2005, 06:18 PM
...ok the Vehicles now have weak point and the engineers can slice peeps out of their vehicles...
What is this?

Kurgan
09-27-2005, 08:11 PM
Who knows... I imagined the "weak point" would be like on the space maps if you shoot a craft in a certain area it takes more damage than elsewhere (sort of like in JKA where you could destroy a wing to destroy a craft, rather than just shooting it all over). Area damage on vehicles is kind of a neat idea, but there's no way to defend against it... So essentially they're trying to make vehicles easier to destroy.

As to an engineer slicing somebody out of their vehicle, that sounds like the Pilot using his fusion cutter on a vehicle and the person inside it "pops out"... Is that correct?

How many times is that going to happen? Is it difficult? Wouldn't they notice the guy standing right next to them for a minute or so? Then again, perhaps not... and couldn't they jump back in?

Or does "slicing" a vehicle mean that the enemy becomes unable to use the vehicle anymore? More info please...

ParanoidAndroid
09-27-2005, 08:16 PM
here (http://ps2.gamespy.com/playstation-2/star-wars-battlefront-2/649845p1.html) is some information about vehicle weak points and "slicing".

Kurgan
09-27-2005, 08:40 PM
It's for the PS2, but surely relevant to the other versions (from your above link on Gamespy):

Those of you familiar with the original Battlefront will probably remember the behemoths we called vehicles. You know, those vehicles that took two rocket-launcher units nearly their entire stash of rockets to destroy. The same vehicles that could stay alive long enough to see the fall of the Empire (or the Rebellion, depending on how you played it). We've learned our lesson, and we've made a few improvements that will make both ground units and vehicle pilots very happy.

Let's start with making the infantry players happy. Have you ever dreamed of destroying an AT-ST with one well-aimed shot? Getting hoisted on the shoulders of your comrades as they chanted your name, dubbing you the "Chicken Killer?" Well, guess what? You can't. BUT, you can do it in less than two hits thanks to our new critical hit locations! Most of our ground vehicles are equipped with shiny new critical systems that will allow various weapons to dish out massive damage. Keeping the AT-ST as my test subject, a skilled Rebel Vanguard (the Alliance's rocket launcher unit) can cause some serious trouble if they discover and target the AT-ST's critical hit location. With just one well-aimed rocket, they can potentially tear through 75 percent of the AT-ST's health! I did say that a skilled Vanguard could do this. Finding the critical systems on each vehicle is one task. Hitting them is another.




Now, before I introduce you to some new vehicle features, I'll bring up one last bit of infantry information: slicing. Slicing is hacking, and hacking is car-jacking. Pull out your fusion cutter and rip your enemy out of their own vehicle! Take 'em out, steal their AT-ST (this sounds awfully familiar to an Endor moment, doesn't it?) and use their own vehicle against them!

I can already see those of you who pilot vehicles frowning. Do not fret! First of all, you're still incredibly deadly against infantry units, if not more so now. Secondly, critical systems can work in your favor as well. If you catch an enemy vehicle off guard, and you have a clear shot, you're more than welcome to send them home packing. Unlike infantry units, several vehicle ordnance types have the ability to cause enough critical damage and destroy another vehicle in just one attack.

I am just skimming the article here, but here's another interesting bit at the end:

We know everyone has their own style of play, and we like to think that Battlefront II caters to a wide variety of gamers. So going along with that logic, we thought it would be a great idea to diversify our starfighters. We've split them up into four categories: Scout, Multi-Purpose, Bombers, and Transports.

Scouts, like your A-wings, are fast and deadly dogfighters. Multi-Purpose starfighters, like your ARC-170 starfighter, are capable of both dogfighting and assaulting capital ships with equal effect. Bombers are your heavy hitters, so starfighters such as the TIE bomber are your best source of damage when targeting frigates and capital ships. Finally, we have Transports, such as the droid gunship. These mammoths allow you to successfully board enemy ships.

Any starfighter can land in an enemy hangar, but Transports have a few added perks. One such perk is being able to load up on passengers. Some of these ships can carry a crew of six from one capital ship to another with several gunner positions (each Transport is equipped with a Remote Rocket position) to man while making the trek. If that wasn't enough, once the ship docks in the enemy's hangar it becomes a mobile spawn point. As long as your Transport remains intact, you'll always have a spawn point right in the heart of the enemy's headquarters!

MandaloreBIC
09-27-2005, 09:04 PM
ouch... i'm confused, do any of you have lives outside of BF and BF2? i mean then are great games and all, and i play them alot and like them, but it's not the end of the world if there are plot problem and bugs in BF2, and remember this quote... "the jedi are not all powerful." and so aren't the people at lucasarts and pandemic. and besides who cares about small plot errors, the game is fair and we all have fun, that's the point of a game, to play it and have fun... not to argue over how everthing will be, and remeber everthing will be reveled in time, young one....

added later... and did you know that if a invin jedi hero get into a vehicle in BF1 and the vehicle was destroyer, the jedi would die like a normal trooper?

TK-8252
09-27-2005, 09:08 PM
Believe it or not, some people, myself included, actually *gasp* care about realism in games! As in, it's not just one big jumble of crap that doesn't make sense.

that's the point of a game, to play it and have fun

Okay, then what's SWBF's point?

MandaloreBIC
09-27-2005, 09:14 PM
hey i'm impressed by realism in games too, but i'm also impressed with rich people, cool pics and tall buildings... so taht doesn't say much
un to have fun... don't tell me you don't have fun when playing BF!

TK-8252
09-27-2005, 09:25 PM
un to have fun... don't tell me you don't have fun when playing BF!

Depends on what you mean by "BF."

Star Wars Battlefront or the Battlefield series? Battlefield 2 is insanely fun... while Battlefront is not.

Commander Obi-Wan
09-27-2005, 10:45 PM
I am pretty sure it is Battlefront since this site is generally on battlefront.

MandaloreBIC
09-27-2005, 11:08 PM
of couse i mean star wars battle front, but i agree battlefield2 rocks!!!!!!!!

Redtech
09-28-2005, 04:08 AM
I knew there was a point playing games. To enjoy oneself. Personally, I'd prefer if the Empire and CIS always lost because they did in the films, and General Grievous died of asthma, as that's more realistic. ;)

Syzerian
09-28-2005, 06:57 AM
Or if you wanted to be really realistic we could all wear rubber suits and run around pretending we are shooting at eachother inside a blue room.

Blackrider27
09-28-2005, 07:26 PM
guys its just a fun game. Maybe it was just a coincidence that the galactic marines were with bacara he might just have elite clones i mean there is no reason to fight AM I RIGHT.

TK-8252
09-28-2005, 07:32 PM
guys its just a fun game.

Fixed.

Maybe it was just a coincidence that the galactic marines were with bacara he might just have elite clones

That doesn't make sense. Just use the analogy that someone else made... it'd be like putting a Snowtrooper in place of the Imperial Officer. It doesn't make sense, and the only reason people aren't all fighting the Clone Commander is mainly because of a lack of knowledge of which clone is really which. If it were something like a Snowtrooper switched with an Imperial Officer, more people might actually notice something's not right here. But even then, I'm sure there'd be the rabid fanboys coming out trying to defend something like that.

i mean there is no reason to fight AM I RIGHT.

I don't know. I guess not, because no way would the developers actually fix it. But we might as well bring it to the attention of potential buyers, am I right?

ParanoidAndroid
09-28-2005, 08:17 PM
But we might as well bring it to the attention of potential buyers, am I right?

Yep, your right, the buyers have a right to know about what's right or wrong about a game. But weather or not they decide to listen or even care is ultimatly their decision.

zerted
09-28-2005, 08:33 PM
I agree that the faults should be pointed out, but they should be with less emotion. Let the reader decide weather the game is good or not. Just point out the things that are wrong (such as color markings). Don't add emotions.

In response the vehicle weak points, looks like I need to pratice sniping more...

Blackrider27
09-28-2005, 09:18 PM
SURE TK JUST MAKE FUN OF ME ALL THE TIME nah jp, well we dont know what bf2 is gonnna be like but im sure whatever it is it'll be fun

Redtech
09-29-2005, 03:19 AM
So, how many "non-geek" Star Wars fans can tell Clones apart? I mean, Bacara's lot don't jog my memory at all even though I've seen the screenshot they're in. (And watched ep III). Most people who'll buy this game will be "WTF?" anyway, then learn, "Okay, clone commander" then they'll start blowing them away. It's called "not being a newb".
----------
Zerted, I'm guessing that this only because it's a Star Wars game. I mean, I hardly see a whole "let's list all the bugs of the game" even for Splinter Cell and MGS forums (well, not before at least half the forum have clocked it twice already).

BF2 is NOT marketed towards Star Wars Geeks. That's why they wont go into so much deatil with clone skins etc. They know the average gamer is under 30 (who doesn't clock up 24+ hours on messege boards ;) ) and who likes the films but isn't interested in the books, or many of the other Star Wars games.

Think about this logically, could you market a game to the outside world if it was so anal to detail that you'd put casual fans right off? You know that "credible media sources" like to advertise games and right now, the only realism is expected in "Kill the Muslim" war games, sadly.

Not to say that they couldn't get skins and so on done, but they wont, as ultimately, from their point of view (and the expected "bling" they'll soon receive) why bother.

TK-8252
09-29-2005, 08:02 AM
So, how many "non-geek" Star Wars fans can tell Clones apart?

0

Because there are no non-geek Star Wars fans. :xp:

maxloef
09-29-2005, 09:58 AM
OKE GUYS STOP WHINING IF U DONT LIKE WHAT THE DEVS DID THEN DONT GET THE GAME OR EVEN BE ON THIS FORUM!!!!!!!!!!
So dont whine u all!!!!!

AND ALSO
maybe the Clone Commander just wears the same armour as galactic marine same coutns with heave trooper and bacara sincen its not the ONLY armnour made of that type u also saw Commander Neya with another guy on treir speederbikes in ep 3 THEY BOTH HAD THE XACT SAME ARMOUR now stop whineing! i do agree on the 501st troops on Utapau that is completely WRONG!

Please don't double post, edit the first one to add your addendums. Fixin double posts makes me tired. Also, we can read just fine without using the caps lock key. Big letters aren't any easier to read. ~ET

Redtech
09-29-2005, 11:52 AM
0

Because there are no non-geek Star Wars fans. :xp:
Well, you ain't getting on MTV by being Geeky. You gotta be cool, rad, preferably black. "YouknowwhatI'msaying?"*

*Don't call me up on racial steroytyping, please. I'm the wrong side of 256 shades of Grey, according to the Bush admin.

Blackrider27
09-29-2005, 02:53 PM
RAD LOL jp. hes right its a game its not realistic and if you dont like what they are doing dont buy it

TK-8252
09-29-2005, 04:09 PM
OKE GUYS STOP WHINING IF U DONT LIKE WHAT THE DEVS DID THEN DONT GET THE GAME OR EVEN BE ON THIS FORUM!!!!!!!!!!
So dont whine u all!!!!!

What an intelligent and well-written post. Whining? I think you're the one whining. Whining about the critisism about SWBF2. So stop whining.

AND ALSO
maybe the Clone Commander just wears the same armour as galactic marine same coutns with heave trooper and bacara

May I ask if you have a source to back this up?

sincen its not the ONLY armnour made of that type u also saw Commander Neya with another guy on treir speederbikes in ep 3 THEY BOTH HAD THE XACT SAME ARMOUR

Neyo's armor is not in SWBF2.

Redtech
09-30-2005, 04:19 AM
Wait...is there even a Clone Commander? I mean, you have Jedi as Generals, but where does the millitary ranks come into this? Where are intel officers, paper-pushers, briefing and staffing crew? Who's giving the orders? What's the chain of command and where are all the lieutents?

Now the big question is what their uniforms are. Damn..

biny
10-06-2005, 01:31 PM
do they? they've had Windu alive in the temple attack, they have Jango on the battle for Kashyyk, they call the galactic marines "clone commander", and the actual commander, commander Baacara, "Heavy Trooper" >_> they gave Luke a green saber on Hoth (lazy buggers) and gave Aayla Secura two sabers (there must be a reason for this), even had 501st troopers on Utapu. and ofcorse, they gave the magna gaurds guns. and, they might even have the BOH. WHY would you want the BOH in a battle front game?! it's not designed for Jedi dueling! and apparently, Rebels that have LAAT's (Republic Gunships) in space. W. T. F. Yoda has his saber on Dagobah (altho that is cool, fighting as him in Degobah) somehow they have Palpatine on DStar2 WITH his red saber
let me re-phrase the title, have the dev team watched ANYTHING to do with Star Wars- ever?

so I ask you, dose the team just go on instinct, or guess work? did some one have to explain to them what Star Wars is when they signed up? or do they know more about Star Wars than we think, but are too lazy to skin a different trooper for each planet?

*edit* and I just heard that they have removed Rhen Var and Bespin, dammit they were some of my faverote maps, I love the bespin platforms map!

Have you nothing better to do than complain!! theyve made 2 great games and all you can do is criticize them for doing somethings you dont like!!! Can't you just accept what you get!! :smash: :smash: :smash: :smash:


And games can't always be fairly judged by their screenshots!! The game could be totally different from the screens!! And does it have to be faithful to the movies if its fun! And how do you know Commander Bacara is the only one with that uniform!!!

Kurgan
10-06-2005, 01:53 PM
I don't know about you guys, but I can't tell the clones apart.

I mean sure, if you showed me a picture of a guy in yellow with those pipes coming out of his head and held a gun to my head I'd say "pilot" and I think green is sergant or something, but that's about all I can really remember without looking it up or somebody telling me.

I had no clue who "Bacara" was until I read the ROTS VD. His name is never mentioned in the movie (and the people who saw it 15 times can tell me if I'm wrong there!). I remember Commander Cody, he wore Orange, but he was really the only "Clone" with a speaking role (yelling indistinct orders in the background doesn't count!).

As far as "non-geek" I think he means people who don't obsessively read the guide books and own large amounts of merchandise, etc. so they "know every fact" about the franchise.

There are definatley levels of geekiness. Most of my "recognition" about what vehicle is what and what rank is what is based on playing the games over and over and over again... not from some inate knowledge I got from just watching the movies.

A baseline for a Star Wars fan is somebody who liked any Star Wars movie and thus calls themselves a "fan." They don't need to be a walking encyclopedia of Star Wars (and thus a geek!). ;)

Now some would say that "liking Star Wars makes you a geek" but I don't think that's true at all. Star Wars is not really a "cult" film (not anymore anyway), it's rather mainstream. Some fans are more obsessed than others. So the casual fan is not going to know or care when he sees a Clone Scout using the wrong gun or whatnot. And as far as the vehicles go, typically there are two names for everything.. a "technical name" and a slang name. So you for example you have the "Juggernaut HAVw A6" which is also called the "Republic Turbo Tank." Both names are official!

I know what people are arguing here about getting the details right, but I also recognize that there is probably a point where most people don't care, and so the developers didn't feel obligated to go that extra mile. They obviously aren't at the level of geek that some of us are. ;)

When it comes to Star Wars, if it's not in the games I play frequently or in the movies, I tend to not be very knowledgeable and need to look it up. I admit it!

Kurgan
10-06-2005, 02:03 PM
When it comes to SWBF2 I think it's OPEN SEASON for complaints, because the game is still in beta.

Guess what Pandemic did? They opened up the beta to the public. Which means WE GET TO CRITICIZE IT! They want us to question it, point out faults, flaws, problems, bugs, etc.

So no, we should NOT be "satisfied with what we get." Pandemic themselves don't want us to do that! Otherwise they would have just kept it an internal closed beta and ignored us.

So telling the whiners to shut up is undoing what the company is trying to do, which is solicite information from us to improve their product for us, because we're their target audience!

Is there something to be said for constructive criticism? Sure. But we need not be quiet about our complaints! And if some people are a little more aggressive, BUT IF THEY ARE RIGHT, why shoot the messenger?

Commander Obi-Wan
10-06-2005, 02:04 PM
I like the way they created SWBF2..I personally think they did a fantastic job!

Kurgan
10-06-2005, 02:13 PM
They're not done yet!

The other thing is, in this beta, some things may be different than the final game. So if something is in there you like, be ware, because they might change it before the final version!

I think it has improved in many areas, gotten worse in a few areas, and not changed (where it should have) in several more. So I hope they continue extensive work on it until it comes out, and continue to work on it through patches thereafter (as I'm sure they won't get everything done by that Nov1st rush date).

biny
10-06-2005, 04:18 PM
I'm glad someone understands!!! :king1:

But you know what you never see??? A COMPLIMENTS FORUM!!!

No one ever bothers to thank these guys for their hard work and for making such a great game!!! I hereby compliment them for a marvelous game, for such dazzling work and for such a wonderful inlet into the world of Star Wars!!

Thank you!

You're the :king1: :king1: :king1: :king1: s

DarkReborn
10-06-2005, 05:27 PM
yeah poor guys of panademic they spent a year and a half to make a game to enyoy us (apart of the money that they are gonna to have) and we are bla bla bla,not realistic,bla bla bla,this game sucks bla bla bla cmon be good persons guys
salutes from your spanish friend!! Panademic are da best!

Kurgan
10-06-2005, 06:00 PM
I'm glad someone understands!!! :king1:

But you know what you never see??? A COMPLIMENTS FORUM!!!

No one ever bothers to thank these guys for their hard work and for making such a great game!!! I hereby compliment them for a marvelous game, for such dazzling work and for such a wonderful inlet into the world of Star Wars!!

Thank you!

You're the :king1: :king1: :king1: :king1: s

Huh?

That's funny, I thank LucasArts and their third party developers everytime I create a website about a game they've created, without which the site would be nothing! (except for Boot Camp, which is done in character)

Next thing you know we'll be called ungrateful for criticizing problems in a beta (which is the JOB of beta testers anyway!). It doesn't make sense!

Anyway, you make a good point, since this is not a COMPLIMENTS FORUM forum (LucasArts and Pandemic don't even have anything like that), you need not worry about only expressing positive opinions about their work. We're a fan site, we wouldn't exist if we weren't fans. But that doesn't mean we have to keep our mouths shut about these things, even if they sound negative. But go ahead and start your own forum if you want, and put only compliments in it, if you wish. But, and not to ramble here, but why bother testing a game or creating patches at all? If everybody just accepts it in the first version, then there's no reason to solicite feedback or try to improve anything. Think about it...

Commander Obi-Wan
10-07-2005, 10:48 AM
Yesterday, I got to play the PS2 demo for SWBF2.....Utapau was kinda fun...even though I played for three and a half minutes out of eight. The Space Teaser was okay...IT'S ONLY THREE MINUTES!

ET Warrior
10-07-2005, 01:43 PM
and we are bla bla bla,not realistic,bla bla bla,this game sucks bla bla bla cmon be good persons guysI'm sure they can't even hear the complaints over the sound of the money piling up in their bank accounts

master_skywalke
10-07-2005, 02:26 PM
Yesterday, I got to play the PS2 demo for SWBF2.....Utapau was kinda fun...even though I played for three and a half minutes out of eight. The Space Teaser was okay...IT'S ONLY THREE MINUTES!
I heard there is a code that both levels are playable WITHOUT the TIME LIMIT.

biny
10-07-2005, 03:12 PM
Huh?

That's funny, I thank LucasArts and their third party developers everytime I create a website about a game they've created, without which the site would be nothing! (except for Boot Camp, which is done in character)

Next thing you know we'll be called ungrateful for criticizing problems in a beta (which is the JOB of beta testers anyway!). It doesn't make sense!

Anyway, you make a good point, since this is not a COMPLIMENTS FORUM forum (LucasArts and Pandemic don't even have anything like that), you need not worry about only expressing positive opinions about their work. We're a fan site, we wouldn't exist if we weren't fans. But that doesn't mean we have to keep our mouths shut about these things, even if they sound negative. But go ahead and start your own forum if you want, and put only compliments in it, if you wish. But, and not to ramble here, but why bother testing a game or creating patches at all? If everybody just accepts it in the first version, then there's no reason to solicite feedback or try to improve anything. Think about it...

I didn't mean this concernig you personally, but i think the point of the beta is to be able to criticize the gameplay, the graphics, etc, not the acurracy of its content. As I have said before, as long as its really fun (which it most certainly is) why does it matter if Commander Bacara is a heavy trooper? It doesn't make it less and he definately is cool! :clone: :clone: :clone:
I don't doubt that you and many other people compliment them. But there should still be a compliment (sticky) thread/forum.

Jan Gaarni
10-07-2005, 04:02 PM
Because it's not fun if the Devs keep crapping on the details. :)

This is Star Wars, not some random title.
There are rules and guidelines most Star Wars fans expect be followed. ;)

That's why.

DarkReborn
10-07-2005, 07:04 PM
yeah im sure that even 1 seconde they are hearing ''CLIIINGGG'' that means that they are winning money and oover ''CLIIINGGG'' more money, i think that the only ting that they want is winning and winning money (and dont says that these commentaries are from a 13 boy so i am a 13)

Commander Obi-Wan
10-07-2005, 07:20 PM
I heard there is a code that both levels are playable WITHOUT the TIME LIMIT.

Interesting......

Blackrider27
10-15-2005, 04:06 PM
you know what else bothers me i was playing the beta and then playing the magna guards and THEY DONT HAVE THERE STAFFS WTF

010_sWitch_010
10-17-2005, 04:27 AM
the current poll on lucasarts.com may help show the developers that Star Wars games MUST follow Star Wars in some way

Redtech
10-17-2005, 07:10 AM
*Yawn*

This is Star Wars, the name is an instant money maker. You want the best, try Westwood (before they were eaten alive by EA), or Epic, or ID. You know, people who DEPEND on the strength of their name being unsullied or they'd be down the pan.

You might as well argue "OMFG! There's bad things happening in the world today".