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LegoRevan
10-03-2005, 07:47 AM
Hey All,
Here's Another Poll For Ya All To Vote On...

I Thought About This Idea For A Fair While And Thought It Would Be A Cool Addition For KOTOR 3. Anyway, How Cool Would It Be To Customize Your PC's Face? Like The Eyes, Hair, Mouth, Colour, etc. For Those Who Have Played The Sims 1 Or 2, You Know What I'm Talking About. No More Just Picking Already Pre-loaded Faces. Argree Or Disargree I Think It Would Make A Big Difference To The Game.

Well That's What I Hopes In KOTOR 3.



What Do You Guys Think?

Prime
10-03-2005, 09:14 AM
I'd like to see it...

Venom750
10-03-2005, 09:23 AM
intresting idea because then no two characters are the same very good

Darth Covetous
10-03-2005, 09:28 AM
Sounds cool to me.

Bob Lion54
10-03-2005, 09:28 AM
I think it would be pretty cool.

fresnosmokey02
10-03-2005, 10:38 AM
Sure, why not? I already customize my characters looks, at least as much as I am able, by graphically altering the templates for the faces i.e. creating my own DS transitions, putting makeup on the females, etc. Heck, I can't play the game more than a couple of minutes without wanting to change/mod something. LOL.

Kain
10-03-2005, 11:14 AM
Sounds like a sweet idea. Of course, given the way things are going I doubt it'll happen. I'd say the closest they'll get is giving us like 3 more heads to choose from. Oooh. Ahhh.

Kensai
10-03-2005, 12:41 PM
It would be good, but UI doubt it will happen, considering it's not new or anything. Saying that, immense detail could be used on the 360 and/or new PC's...

MdKnightR
10-03-2005, 01:36 PM
It was such a good idea, I mentioned myself a few weeks ago in another thread. ;) I think it would add a great amount of diversity to the game.

Vladimir-Vlada
10-03-2005, 05:21 PM
Great idea. Custiomizable faces sounds great. Also, insert some head models from KOTOR 1 and 2 (please from KOTOR 1 the neck-length hair guy and a Pierce Brosnan head to add. :( ).

chaleur
10-03-2005, 05:32 PM
I guess there's a quantitative question here, too. I mean, it'd also be great if you could renovate the Hawk, and make HK-47 wear a pink tutu. However, I'm pretty sure I'd rather have the programmers working on things other than engine mods.

That said, I still really like the idea (and voted yes). It's just a question of priorities, and ideal worlds :).

Shrub91
10-03-2005, 06:00 PM
It'd be good to see Alderaan in K3, and to have Bioware at the helm again.
It'd be cool to see the gangs from K1 & K2 along with some new guys too.
It'd also be good to actually hear the PC's voice for once too.
And need I say....... MAKE IT FOR MACINTOSH TOO!!!!!!!!!

TheExileReturns
10-03-2005, 06:16 PM
Yes, Have a voice for the PC. They'd just need a male and female actor to read out the lines and cover all the bases. Also I like the customizeable faces idea- hair style, hair color facial features etc. The more options the better.

chaleur
10-03-2005, 06:22 PM
And need I say....... MAKE IT FOR MACINTOSH TOO!!!!!!!!!

Totally behind you, but I don't think Aspyr will pick it up again, after ATI screwed up the drivers to make Doom work better. They totally screwed up KotOR. In any case, it's not up to Obsidian, basically what happens is they sell the rights to port the game to Aspyr (or the like).

Vladimir-Vlada
10-03-2005, 07:20 PM
Yes, Have a voice for the PC. They'd just need a male and female actor to read out the lines and cover all the bases. Also I like the customizeable faces idea- hair style, hair color facial features etc. The more options the better.
I'll give you a medal for that. :)

To Developers:

MAKE THE PC HAVE A VOICE ALREADY!!! I WANT TO FEEL LIKE A CHARACTER, NOT A PUPPET!!!!!!!!!!

ForceFightWMe12
10-03-2005, 07:27 PM
I Thought About This Idea For A Fair While And Thought It Would Be A Cool Addition For KOTOR 3. Anyway, How Cool Would It Be To Customize Your PC's Face? Like The Eyes, Hair, Mouth, Colour, etc. For Those Who Have Played The Sims 1 Or 2, You Know What I'm Talking About. No More Just Picking Already Pre-loaded Faces. Argree Or Disargree I Think It Would Make A Big Difference To The Game.


That's a pretty cool idea. But I would rather it be like the Sims 2 where you get to customize absolutly everything about your character's face. Maybe even their clothes...

Yes, Have a voice for the PC. They'd just need a male and female actor to read out the lines and cover all the bases

That would be AMAZING. I agree with Vladmir, I'm tired of not being able to actually hear my character talk. Reading script and actually hearing the voice of a player makes game expirience (to me anyway) a lot more enjoyable. Its one of the reasons why I like KotOR over Morrowind or some other RPG.

chaleur
10-03-2005, 07:30 PM
I'm tired of not being able to actually hear my character talk.

I'm not sure I want to have the PC speak every line (what if I don't like the voice?), but even the little "Hmm?"s that the KotOR I PC made when you clicked on her (okay, maybe him) added a lot. As I recall, KotOR II was missing this.

lukeiamyourdad
10-03-2005, 08:34 PM
I don't want a voice for the PC. I feel it's better for immersion if I imagine his/her voice. Revan's voice in K1 didn't really fit the character, sounded a wee bit too young to me.

That's the thing, we all have our version of how our character sounds like.

It's a bit like Gordon Freeman in Half-Life. If he had a voice, he wouldn't be as cool or loved. Or even Mario, but that's actually unexplainable...

TheExileReturns
10-03-2005, 08:51 PM
You could have an option to turn off the PC's voice if that's not your thing. I think it would be a nice addition to the game.

Wampa
10-03-2005, 08:55 PM
I really hope the voice AND customization happen, I personally dont like many of the preset faces :(

TheExileReturns
10-03-2005, 08:59 PM
Also I think adding scars to the PC throughout the course of the game would be cool too. Kind of like what they did in Fable. Sort of like what Luke Skywalker's face had with the battle scars. I would imagine nicks from a lightsaber would leave scars right? How about losing limbs in a lightsaber fight? You'd have to get cybernetic replacements etc.

lukeiamyourdad
10-03-2005, 09:02 PM
How about losing limbs in a lightsaber fight? You'd have to get cybernetic replacements etc.


I like the idea of some battle scars but losing limbs might be a little too much. You'll end up being Robocop or something.

chaleur
10-03-2005, 09:26 PM
How about losing limbs in a lightsaber fight? You'd have to get cybernetic replacements etc.

You kinda got the scars if you went DS in TSL, no? I did like Bao-Dur and his arm. Though it pissed me off the first time Kreia's hand got cut off, and the cool vibrosword I'd given her to use disappeared from the galaxy. GRRR! I never made that mistake again -- I didn't have much of anything that early in the game!

Though once again I'd rather they put the manpower into story scripting than funky interface feeps and character decorations. I REALLY don't want another game with a premature ending. The engine is pretty mature. I'd rather they just used it more or less as-is, and put the effort into CONTENT! CONTENT! CONTENT! The pretties are nice, but a distant second in what makes KotOR great (IMHO).

Shrub91
10-03-2005, 10:38 PM
Ok ok, please get back on subect, sorry I started this off-topic thing.

TheExileReturns
10-03-2005, 10:38 PM
Right, they definitely need to work out a story that doesn't have all the plot flaws, dead ends and abrupt ending TSL had. although this was because the game was RUSHED to meet the holiday purchase deadline. Also more NPC development. More interaction and conversation trees with the NPC's. And if there is going to be a love interest, for God's sake- show a kissing scene make it worth the trouble.

Shrub91
10-03-2005, 10:44 PM
Totally behind you, but I don't think Aspyr will pick it up again, after ATI screwed up the drivers to make Doom work better. They totally screwed up KotOR. In any case, it's not up to Obsidian, basically what happens is they sell the rights to port the game to Aspyr (or the like).
Well, there's a VERY simple fix for this:
Go into SWkotor.INI (use Spotlight/Search)
and put "Disable Vertex Buffer Objects=1"
under
"[Graphics Options]"



for God's sake- show a kissing scene make it worth the trouble.
Hallelujah!!
Couldn't have said it better myself!
LOL!

chaleur
10-03-2005, 10:58 PM
Well, there's a VERY simple fix for this:
Go into SWkotor.INI (use Spotlight/Search)
and put "Disable Vertex Buffer Objects=1"
under
"[Graphics Options]"

Wow :). I will definitely give that a try, thanks. My Dantooine was nearly unplayable, but it's been okay since then. I did read that if you revert to a previous version of Panther, it worked better, but I've been kinda hoping that if I upgrade my PowerBook to Tiger, it'll fix. In the meantime, I got past Dantooine, and it's only been a little ugly a couple of times.

I want Tiger anyway :).

TheExileReturns
10-03-2005, 11:20 PM
What actors would you like to do the voices of the PC in Kotor III? I'd like to hear Hugh Jackman (in his normal Australian accent) and Famke Jansen as the female version of the PC.

TheExileReturns
10-03-2005, 11:27 PM
also if Revan and the Exile appear in Kotor III- as NPC's, they would need voices too. You would have to choose their gender in the beginning of the game as well as what their faces looked like to you. Name some actors that you would like to hear do their voices.

MdKnightR
10-04-2005, 03:28 AM
What actors would you like to do the voices of the PC in Kotor III? I'd like to hear Hugh Jackman (in his normal Australian accent) and Famke Jansen as the female version of the PC.

Yeah, I could go for that, but I have a better suggestion...

Male - Michael Rosenbaum
Female - Jessica Alba

As for other characters, I think that John Glover should do the voice of a Jedi Master or Sith Lord. Michael Wincott would also make a great voice for a Sith. Rene Russo would make a good voice for one of the party members (or maybe a female Revan). Daniel Day Lewis would be ideal (imo) for a male Revan.

Prime
10-04-2005, 09:46 AM
I hope they don't have voice actors for the PC. Everyone has a different view of what their PC should sound like, so whatever actor is used won't satisfy everyone. I like it as it is personally. I can use my imagination for what my own character sounds like.

fresnosmokey02
10-04-2005, 09:54 AM
Yeah, I could go for that, but I have a better suggestion...

Male - Michael Rosenbaum
Female - Jessica Alba

As for other characters, I think that John Glover should do the voice of a Jedi Master or Sith Lord. Michael Wincott would also make a great voice for a Sith. Rene Russo would make a good voice for one of the party members (or maybe a female Revan). Daniel Day Lewis would be ideal (imo) for a male Revan.

I think I'd rather look at Jessica Alba than listen to her. As for voice overs how about Michael Dorn, Tony Todd, Edward James Olmos, and/or Christopher Judge. They all have awesome voices and great potential for voice overs. As for females, how about Rachel Luttrel, Jery Ryan, or Jolene Blalock. I know these are already all sci fi people, but sci fi has a way of recycling their actors/personages a la Ethan Phillips of K1.

I mean for NPC's...I don't think the PC needs to say anything but "Huh?" "What?" or "Done!". And you don't need a famous voice for that.

MdKnightR
10-04-2005, 12:59 PM
I think I'd rather look at Jessica Alba than listen to her. As for voice overs how about Michael Dorn, Tony Todd, Edward James Olmos, and/or Christopher Judge. They all have awesome voices and great potential for voice overs. As for females, how about Rachel Luttrel, Jery Ryan, or Jolene Blalock. I know these are already all sci fi people, but sci fi has a way of recycling their actors/personages a la Ethan Phillips of K1.

I mean for NPC's...I don't think the PC needs to say anything but "Huh?" "What?" or "Done!". And you don't need a famous voice for that.


Those would all be great choices for voices, but I still say that Michael Wincott (he played "Top Dollar" in The Crow) has a very Sithy voice and should be considered for a character in the game somewhere. Clancy Brown (Kurgan from Highlander) would also make a good darksider. In fact, I think he would have made a better choice for Darth Sion.

Bob Lion54
10-04-2005, 01:21 PM
....As for voice overs how about Michael Dorn, Tony Todd, Edward James Olmos, and/or Christopher Judge. They all have awesome voices and great potential for voice overs. As for females, how about Rachel Luttrel, Jery Ryan, or Jolene Blalock. I know these are already all sci fi people, but sci fi has a way of recycling their actors/personages a la Ethan Phillips of K1.


Michael Dorn has one the best game voices. I was thinking of that before I read your post. So for that, I definetly agree. (for those who do not know who he is, he played Worf in Star Trek The Next Generation and DS9)

Ethan Philips is another great voice! I was pretty exited when I heard him in K1.(he was the scared bounty hunter in Ahto.)

The one voice I need to add is Cam Clarke (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0164682/) !!! When I heard his voice in K1 I literaly jumped out of my chair. If you grew up in the 80's you will definetly know his voice! Heres a hint: he was a Ninja Turtle (from the original cartoon).

Check out Cam Clarke's official site. If you click on "voice samples" you can hear some of the great voiceovers he has done! http://www.camclarke.com/ (and you can here him sing. He is pretty good)

For further proof he needs to be in the game:
K1: he was in the game. The game rocked
K2: no Cam! The game was not as good! :lol:

Darth333
10-04-2005, 01:22 PM
I hope they don't have voice actors for the PC. Everyone has a different view of what their PC should sound like, so whatever actor is used won't satisfy everyone. I like it as it is personally. I can use my imagination for what my own character sounds like.
I agree 110% on this. Moreover, it would be a bit weird in terms of gameplay: we would have to read all the possible answers and then make our selection and hear the answer afterwards...I bet most of us would just click to skip it. It's just a loss of ressources IMHO.

As for face customization, it would be cool but it is far from being a priority to me. I prefer to have a solid storyline and well written dialogues than tons of goodies.

MdKnightR
10-04-2005, 01:34 PM
I agree 110% on this. Moreover, it would be a bit weird in terms of gameplay: we would have to read all the possible answers and then make our selection and hear the answer afterwards...I bet most of us would just click to skip it. It's just a loss of ressources IMHO.

I would have said the same thing yesterday, but when I decided to install and play Vampire the Masquerade - Redemption last night, I thought it was cool that the character repeated the dialogue you chose. I think it would be good for KOTOR 3 as well.

Bob Lion54
10-04-2005, 01:45 PM
HEHE

I like the Christof charactor in Vampire, his overacting was awsome! While I agree its cool for some games, I have to agree with Prime and Darth333 on this one. It's just not something I would want in KoTOR.

The thing about games like Vampire is that you are playing a charactor made by the delvs. With kotor, the idea that that each charactor is unique to the player.

I will say that PC voices worked well enough in Neverwinter Knights. You could select from a few different voices, but they only had battle crys and such. I wouldn't mind that in KoTOR, but its not a major thing. I wouldn't want them to repeat every line of dialogue you chose, though. The reasons are already stated by D3.

Vladimir-Vlada
10-04-2005, 03:12 PM
It's a bit like Gordon Freeman in Half-Life. If he had a voice, he wouldn't be as cool or loved. Or even Mario, but that's actually unexplainable...
He's a FPS character, and it's Half-Life. In FPS's it isn't neceseary to have great voice acting to enchance the gameplay while it is mostly focused on shooting up aliens and goverment special forces.

This is STAR WARS. :D

You could have an option to turn off the PC's voice if that's not your thing. I think it would be a nice addition to the game.
That's the most thoughtful thing I have heard on this topic. Great idea!

Jery Ryan, or Jolene Blalock.
:indif: * Whistles carelessly...

You mean her:http://www.moveleft.com/moveleft/images/jeri_ryan_light_blue_sweater.jpg and her: http://www.csiguide.com/images/jolene_blalock_7.jpg

Well... How about those tow as head models AND voice support? :dozey: * Whistles carelessly... *

The one voice I need to add is Cam Clarke !!! When I heard his voice in K1 I literaly jumped out of my chair. If you grew up in the 80's you will definetly know his voice! Heres a hint: he was a Ninja Turtle (from the original cartoon).
I agree, he would make a good main character voice support.

Okay, my list:

Males:

1. Rino Ramano (he voice acted the main character [Alexander Munro] in Star Trek Voyager Elite Force and Elite Force 2).
2. Pierce Brosnan (head model AND voice support [if Exile])
3. David Duchovny
4. Harrison Ford

All I cold think for them.

Females:

1. Jessica Biel
2. Jeri Ryan
3. Jolene Blalock

That's all I can think of for now.

Darth InSidious
10-04-2005, 03:50 PM
No, don't add a voice for the PC, unless you are going to record a voice for every language and every country! I'm English. I don't want yet another character from North America! I don't want my Jedi Weaponmaster from Alabama, and my Sith Lord from Minnesota, and I'm sure people from America don't want brummie Sith Marauders, and cockney jedi.....Not only is it unworkably difficult to do, it excludes other languages than English, and it doesn't allow for the fact that not everyone likes some people. Also, the Exile or REvan or whoever is meant to be YOU. How can any actor be YOU? It would remove the idea that you are the character....

Vladimir-Vlada
10-04-2005, 04:07 PM
No, don't add a voice for the PC, unless you are going to record a voice for every language and every country! I'm English. I don't want yet another character from North America! I don't want my Jedi Weaponmaster from Alabama, and my Sith Lord from Minnesota, and I'm sure people from America don't want brummie Sith Marauders, and cockney jedi.....Not only is it unworkably difficult to do, it excludes other languages than English, and it doesn't allow for the fact that not everyone likes some people.
True. But it won't be much of a loss to do it now would it?

Also, the Exile or REvan or whoever is meant to be YOU. How can any actor be YOU? It would remove the idea that you are the character....
Oh, my friend! What a mixup. RPG characters aren't really YOU. They are a... creation or shape of yourself, they sort of represent you as a character. They lead the story which is decieded by you, but it doesn't meant that that person that leads the story is you, it is a mere FORM, PRESENTATION of yourself.

That's what I think. :D

Darth InSidious
10-04-2005, 04:18 PM
All I'm saying is that to find that many voice actors to do that many lines would take millennia ;)

chaleur
10-04-2005, 04:49 PM
I'm sure people from America don't want brummie Sith Marauders, and cockney jedi.....Not only is it unworkably difficult to do, it excludes other languages than English, and it doesn't allow for the fact that not everyone likes some people.

I think you're mostly wrong about North Americans. In general, we (read: me) love people who talk pretty. Cockney (even the rhyming stuff), New Zealand, South Africa, even a singing Cork Brogue (the kind the BBC likes to subtitle). However, I will agree you're right about people in other parts of the world being less tolerant. The French hate our Quebec accents (I'm Canadian), and the Spanish can't stand Mexican dubs.

It just doesn't seem to work the other way round (new world folks being intolerant of old world accents). At least, not in my experience, whatever that's worth. Maybe you all just sound better than us, or something ;).

lukeiamyourdad
10-04-2005, 05:10 PM
He's a FPS character, and it's Half-Life. In FPS's it isn't neceseary to have great voice acting to enchance the gameplay while it is mostly focused on shooting up aliens and goverment special forces.

I don't think so. Sure, voice acting is more important in an RPG, but it still plays a great role in any game. In GTA:SA, there's pretty good voice acting, yet that's not the purpose of the game. In every game, voice acting is important.


Everyone:

I don't know if you've noticed, but there's been a lot of different actors with very different voices mentionned here for the role of the PC. Doesn't it mean something? Does anybody see it?

It merely shows how different our vision of the PC is. From one person to the other, the choice for voice actor is different. It shows how unique to each other the PC is.

TheExileReturns
10-04-2005, 06:15 PM
Actually if Revan and/or Exile appeared in this new game they would have to be NPC's. You can't start out with a PC who is 30th Level Jedi Weapon Master or whatever they ended up being in your game. You would be starting out again with a 1st Level Jedi character. So as NPC's they would require voice actors to read their parts.

"Would it help if I got out and pushed?"

RedHawke
10-05-2005, 12:53 AM
Everyone:

I don't know if you've noticed, but there's been a lot of different actors with very different voices mentionned here for the role of the PC. Doesn't it mean something? Does anybody see it?

It merely shows how different our vision of the PC is. From one person to the other, the choice for voice actor is different. It shows how unique to each other the PC is.
I agree 110% LIAYD! :D Hence why it is bad for certain types of games to give the main character a voice, as each of us want or imagine our PC's having a different voice. ;)

So my vote goes for no PC voices! :)

Jackel
10-05-2005, 01:53 AM
As for face customization, it would be cool but it is far from being a priority to me. I prefer to have a solid storyline and well written dialogues than tons of goodies.
I agree, story first but if it was an easy thing to implement and oculd be done without taking resources from other aspects of the game.
I agree 110% on this. Moreover, it would be a bit weird in terms of gameplay: we would have to read all the possible answers and then make our selection and hear the answer afterwards...I bet most of us would just click to skip it. It's just a loss of ressources IMHO.
Also due to the fact we would need a two copies of every line spoken (male and female) and voices for every possible line in the game it would take up a heck of a lot of space on the disc's. Space which could be better used for other things like story, cinematics, items etc etc.

Jackel
10-05-2005, 01:57 AM
I don't know if you've noticed, but there's been a lot of different actors with very different voices mentionned here for the role of the PC. Doesn't it mean something? Does anybody see it?

It merely shows how different our vision of the PC is. From one person to the other, the choice for voice actor is different. It shows how unique to each other the PC is.
Also not every game head would fit with the voice, a mean tough type of guy wouldnt fit with a more "civilised" voice, a black head wouldnt fit a white voice*, different heads wouldnt even fit the voice actor selected. And doing mor then one voice per sex of character would again take up to much space, time and effort and wouldnt be as immersive as imagining the voice of your character.


*black voices seem to have a deeper sound to them then white voices so a higher pitched voice wouldnt sound that great.

chaleur
10-05-2005, 05:17 AM
Hence why it is bad for certain types of games to give the main character a voice, as each of us want or imagine our PC's having a different voice. ;)

Did you ever play Planescape: Torment? I think it is widely considered to be one of the best story-strong RPGs of all time. The Nameless One certainly had a voice, and it really didn't take anything away. In fact, it worked really well. As I recall, it was Michael T. Weiss, the same actor who played Jarod in The Pretender television series. He was quite good.

That said, I'd still only vote for small vocal sound effects (not full lines) for the KotOR III PC. It'd be too much of a break from the previous games, and I've gotten used to it. I just wouldn't exclude the possibility of it working for a story-strong RPG.

Jackel
10-05-2005, 05:44 AM
Did you ever play Planescape: Torment? I think it is widely considered to be one of the best story-strong RPGs of all time. The Nameless One certainly had a voice, and it really didn't take anything away. In fact, it worked really well. As I recall, it was Michael T. Weiss, the same actor who played Jarod in The Pretender television series. He was quite good.
I also believe in PST every single line wasnt spoken and you still had to do a hell of a lot of reading.

Its fine for a set character to have a voice, good on them for doing so. But as I said above, I choose a black character with a surfer type voice. It doesnt fit. oops there goes immersion ;)

Another problem with a full voice set is how the voice actor puts the inflictions on the sentances, it could be completely different to how you do it when you read the sentance in yor mind. Again breaking immersion.

Bob Lion54
10-05-2005, 08:57 AM
Did you ever play Planescape: Torment? I think it is widely considered to be one of the best story-strong RPGs of all time. The Nameless One certainly had a voice, and it really didn't take anything away. In fact, it worked really well. As I recall, it was Michael T. Weiss, the same actor who played Jarod in The Pretender television series. He was quite good.

Like I said above, that works in Planescape because The Nameless One is a charactor created by the Delvs. It works for him to have a voice.

Kotor is about making the charactor your own. It wouldn't work.

I wouldn't mind Battle Cries simular to Bastila's "The force fight with me!" If they did that, they would have to have different sets of voices you could choose. They would also have to include the ability to turn them off if you don't want to use them. (or what would be cool, the ability to easily add your voice to the PC. Talk about making the charactor truly your own!)

Personally, I would rather the delvs spend time on more important things, though.

chaleur
10-05-2005, 01:47 PM
Kotor is about making the charactor your own. It wouldn't work.

I would say that KotOR is about giving you the illusion that the character is your own. Your character's background, actions, etc, are all predetermined. You only have a small amount of freedom in how you go about things -- you still have to do all the same things, follow the same story, and end up in the same place.

That's really not that much different than The Nameless One. Just because they let you choose one of six poly models to represent your character doesn't make that much of a difference.

Personally, I would rather the delvs spend time on more important things, though.

Complete agreement, as I said. Don't mean we can't discuss a thing, Cap'n ;-).

lukeiamyourdad
10-05-2005, 10:04 PM
I would say that KotOR is about giving you the illusion that the character is your own. Your character's background, actions, etc, are all predetermined. You only have a small amount of freedom in how you go about things -- you still have to do all the same things, follow the same story, and end up in the same place.

And one of those freedoms is how your character looks like. Like Jackel mentionned, voices are different from one culture to another.
Even the form of your face could affect your voice. You'd have one voice for every possible head. Considering we all want to be able to customize our faces, it'll be pretty hard to make a voice for every single possible combination...

That's really not that much different than The Nameless One. Just because they let you choose one of six poly models to represent your character doesn't make that much of a difference.


Yes it does. Like Jackel said, which I just repeat, nobody has the same voice. It really depends on how they look like.

chaleur
10-05-2005, 10:40 PM
Yes it does. Like Jackel said, which I just repeat, nobody has the same voice. It really depends on how they look like.

Of course no one has the same voice? I'm not sure what that has to do with how they look, though. Perhaps you could explain a little more? I'm not disagreeing with you here, I just don't understand your point.

lukeiamyourdad
10-06-2005, 12:00 AM
From here (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_voice):

"The human voice is a complex instrument. Humans have vocal cords which can loosen or tighten or change their thickness and over which breath can be transferred at varying pressures. The shape of chest and neck, the position of the tongue, and the tightness of otherwise unrelated muscles can be altered. Any one of these actions results in a change in pitch, volume, timbre, or tone of the sound produced."

chaleur
10-06-2005, 05:04 AM
^^^
Though we do have intuition about what someone will sound like (or conversely, what someone we have heard will look like), that intution seems often wrong. Test it out: turn to a random radio station, get a picture of the person speaking, and then see if you're right. I really can't speak for anyone but myself and my experimental subjects (aka the other grad students in my lab I dragged over to try this ;-), but we're usually wrong, and I really don't think we're all outliers in this case.

I am no expert, and since you write without qualifiers, I'll assume you know more than me. I am therefore completely willing to accept the authority of your wikipedia article (and as you interpret it) for the purposes of this discussion. However, like a good little mindless student, I must raise a few things before I go on:

I believe the wikipedia article is talking about how you use your chest, neck and tongue, more than about how they are built (though I acknowledge a relation between the two). Further, the accuracy of those statements is questioned on the discussion page for the article, so it seems that at least some people disagree. Finally, it's hard to judge who is right, because there is no source quoted for the statement.

That said, by your interpretation the following things affect voice:


shape of the chest
shape of the neck
shape of the tongue
musculature around the above areas


I'd even be willing to grant a separate list, not in the article, that could possibly affect the vocal chords:


size
body fat content
age
gender
health (including smoking and the like)


My next point would be, however, that apart from gender, the PC poly models in KotOR do not differ substantially in any of these respects. There is nothing in either list to differentiate the male models, or the female models.

Regardless of the appearance-voice correlation, I still don't disagree with you about a full voice for the PC, though I still like Bob Lion54's idea of a partial Neverwinter Nights like solution. But as I said earlier, I'm not in favour of the full voice for other reasons. However, I also maintain that a full voice can (and has) worked in a story-driven RPG. And I will now add that I think it can work in an RPG where you pick the PC's poly model, in case that wasn't clear :-).

RobQel-Droma
10-06-2005, 10:54 AM
I agree 110% on this. Moreover, it would be a bit weird in terms of gameplay: we would have to read all the possible answers and then make our selection and hear the answer afterwards...I bet most of us would just click to skip it. It's just a loss of ressources IMHO.

Yeah, I would be a little bit wierd. I mean, I have played games like this before- Anybody ever played that puzzle/adventure (at least I think that is what it is considered) game, Legacy of Time? You would talk to people and be given a set of questions you could ask. Then, your little "guide" ( a head on the right) would say a short version of what you said, just so if it was a long question he would only say a few summarizing words. It was cool, but I didn't really think it added anything.

I am for putting voices back in for the lines out of conversation like "Didn't work", "The force fights with me!", "Damn, - Poison!", or "That had to hurt". I think that made your character quite a bit better as you actually have a voice. Of course, -->

I agree 110% LIAYD! Hence why it is bad for certain types of games to give the main character a voice, as each of us want or imagine our PC's having a different voice.


As he has said, we all imagine our voices to be different. But, I still think that they should have a voice, or even maybe a couple of choices of voices you can have. For me, it adds a lot, even if I am playing as a certain character and their voice is a bit different than what I thought it was.

You could have an option to turn off the PC's voice if that's not your thing. I think it would be a nice addition to the game.

And if I really hate it, I want to be able to turn it off, that would be a nice feature. Anyways, I'm sure some people will be so into a fight that they might be talking to the enemy saying stuff like "take that!" or putting the "Damn!!!" exclamation in by themselves when they can't open a door (I know I have before..... "CHEATER!!! You better not use death field on me again!!" hehehe...).

As for face customization, I want it to a point. I still want to have basic head models that you can maybe change hair color, skin tone, and eyes, stuff like that, but I still want to just be able to pick a default head from KI and II.

Kain
10-06-2005, 11:05 AM
A PC voice would be dumb, and here's why: You don't want to sit there and read the options you have JUST to click one and listen to it read back. It kind of makes the player out to look like an idiot.

RobQel-Droma
10-06-2005, 11:37 AM
^^^^

Yeah, I don't think that would be good, but I want one for out of conversation.

TheExileReturns
10-06-2005, 12:07 PM
How about you just read the line out loud to yourself? That way you are your own voice. Your family & neighbors might think you've finally cracked up but hey... who cares right?

j3di_sean
10-07-2005, 12:47 PM
YUP. No need to voice act the PC's conversation (Guy Threepwood in Monkey Island style)...

Back on topic. The face customization would be a very cool bonus if included. You'd be able to make ANYONE be in the game... including yourself, which is the coolest.

SW1
10-07-2005, 07:08 PM
face customization: good and bad. i've played a few wwe wrestling games.
some of them have had face templates (more than kotor though, they had something like 70 something faces), and the player could then choose from hair templates and facial hair templaces. this was pretty cool.
they've also had completely customizable faces. eyes, eyebrows, nose, mouth, hair length, everything. it took forever.
i think the simplest thing to do would just be to stick with face templates, but have more.
dark side transitions i thought were really great. i played LS a couple times first. when i first got the DS faces i freaked out.

TheExileReturns
10-07-2005, 08:38 PM
It looks like the overwhelming majority of us have voted for face customiziation, but are split on this whole PC voice acting.

PoM
10-12-2005, 07:29 AM
Yes, Have a voice for the PC. They'd just need a male and female actor to read out the lines and cover all the bases. Also I like the customizeable faces idea- hair style, hair color facial features etc. The more options the better.

Doing that for just K1 would make it cover more than two DVD:s! :smash:

Hallucination
10-13-2005, 12:48 AM
Yes to face costumization. No to voice acting for the PC. 'Why?' you ask? Because for one thing it would take a lot longer than it does now to get through a dialogue, every player has a different vision, and because D333 said no. If you can't agree with a Quebecoise (Je m'excuse pour aucun des accents et mal grammaire) lawyer you can't agree with anyone.

Samurai DD
10-29-2005, 09:38 PM
YEAH!!! YEAH!!!! YEAH!!!!!!!!!! I want a red eyed sith! And a handsome lightsider! And a scarred evil doer! And an alien jedi!

PD: And yes for voice acting. There could be a list of voices for male/female and that you are given the option to choose the one you want. How about a scary voice for a dark lord? Or a seductive voice?

fresnosmokey02
10-29-2005, 11:22 PM
I don't see why they couldn't do PC appearance customization. I am playing a game right now that lets you customize face/hair style, skin color, hair color, body build, tattoos and tattoo colors, and even lets you choose the clothes you start with. Since the game is based on the same engine as KOTOR, I don't understand why they didn't do this in the first place.

Samurai DD
10-30-2005, 10:07 AM
Well, yes, theres a lotta games with full face and body customization, theres no reason why KOTOR shouldn't.

Jeff
10-30-2005, 10:22 AM
Yeah, I think K3 should have face customization. The way I see it, the less need we have for mods (to make different heads in this case), the better the game is.

LegoRevan
10-31-2005, 04:19 AM
well i've made another thread about PC Voice Acting Since this thread has gone a little off track.

darth_yanstrol
11-14-2005, 09:47 AM
The Customization of your face and body was introduced in Fable, but I would love it if in Kotor 3 you could have tatoos, battle scars, customized haircuts, you name it. Because Kotor 3 will probably be coming out for XBOX 360 the game should be as customized as possible.

Cygnus Q'ol
11-14-2005, 11:17 AM
This would be too sweet as long as it's development and application has no negative affect on the gameplay.

Lady Vader
11-14-2005, 02:12 PM
The Customization of your face and body was introduced in Fable, but I would love it if in Kotor 3 you could have tatoos, battle scars, customized haircuts, you name it. Because Kotor 3 will probably be coming out for XBOX 360 the game should be as customized as possible.

Being able to customize the player's appearance would be great indeed, as long as we don't take it too far. I wouldn't want to waste my time having to eat, sleep, or use the bathroom fo example; that would be a little too much (if I wanted that much customization, I could just play The Sims).

And btw, Fable was a disappointment to say the least.

Ztalker
11-14-2005, 02:25 PM
I think face and nody customisation only increases your bond with the character.
I think it will be a good idea, since it will add some extra gameplay options.
conversations with NPC's will be more personal, and the developer can use that in their advantage.

Liit Orda
11-30-2005, 09:43 AM
Definately on face customisation. Say goodbye to mods with various new skins and say hello to countless formulas and screens posten on how to make the perfect Obi Wan or Anakin... Loving it...

JediMaster12
11-30-2005, 08:11 PM
I personally thought the selection they gave for the PC were fine. To customize the PC would be a good modding project for modders.

Soogz
11-30-2005, 08:15 PM
Yeah same. As long as they keep the asian male one with the crop cut, I am fine. He looks exactly like me. Odd, but true.

JediMaster12
11-30-2005, 08:26 PM
Now that's a scary thought. Thanks for the Support.

Soogz
11-30-2005, 08:41 PM
Yeah. Scary, but as I mentioned before, true.

Sabretooth
12-01-2005, 04:44 AM
Yep. I definitely want face customization in KotOR III. However, the engine will have to support dynamic facial changes, as the player constants makes facial expressions and when he/she goes to the dark side, he/she turns pale, the veins and the eyes and all that.

My vote: Yes.

Prime
12-01-2005, 10:37 AM
Yeah, I think K3 should have face customization. The way I see it, the less need we have for mods (to make different heads in this case), the better the game is.Indeed. The best game is one we don't want to mod at all.

JediMaster12
12-02-2005, 02:25 PM
But then where's the fun in creating something that the devs haven't come up with?

OoMandaloreoO
12-11-2005, 01:28 AM
betta the the plain faces on kotor j/k

Jae Onasi
12-11-2005, 02:03 AM
I'd like face customization, but I don't want to have to spend too much time on it before getting going on the game itself. I'd like to see race/hair color/hair style/eye color/skin color. I don't want to get to the point where I'm telling the customizer to do something like 'place a mole 2 cm below the eye on the left cheek 5 cm away from the nose'. I appreciate details and like the chance to alter some things, but I don't want to spend hours creating a 'look,' I want to play the game.
And if the choice is the ability to have good looks or have a good story, I'll take the good story any day and just use one of the basic faces.

JediMaster12
12-12-2005, 12:56 PM
Good point there. But I personally was happy with the generic look the devs created. if you want to customize a face, try it as a modd project.

Darca Lar
12-17-2005, 07:20 PM
Hey All,
Here's Another Poll For Ya All To Vote On...

I Thought About This Idea For A Fair While And Thought It Would Be A Cool Addition For KOTOR 3. Anyway, How Cool Would It Be To Customize Your PC's Face? Like The Eyes, Hair, Mouth, Colour, etc. For Those Who Have Played The Sims 1 Or 2, You Know What I'm Talking About. No More Just Picking Already Pre-loaded Faces. Argree Or Disargree I Think It Would Make A Big Difference To The Game.

Well That's What I Hopes In KOTOR 3.



What Do You Guys Think?
That would be a really good addition to KOTOR 3, that way there is more of a variety to the character, and it gives you a real PC rather than the 'here's a list of precreated heads, now pick thing.'

Samurai DD
01-03-2006, 12:43 PM
I was thinking now while playing EVE Online, they have a very interesting face customization thingy. The options for faces are various, but they are a little limiting. What isn't, are the sliders for adjusting the size and shape of different parts of the face. More jaw, less nose, etc. City of Heroes has these sliders too, but in a different way, and it also has sliders for the body. More shoulders, less muscle, longer legs, etc. That is the future of RPG customization, and that is: complete control. KotOR III should have a system like this, at least for the face.

Vaelastraz
01-04-2006, 01:56 PM
I'd really like it if they let you customize your character's face! Like in World of Warcraft. But apart from that.. i dont want to customize anything besides the face.
And letting the Player Character have a voice would be good too. There are RPGs out there where the PC has a voice, like Vampire II [which is great imo] and Gothic I and II. Especially in Gothic the PC voice is just extremely good. But i dont really know, if some of you actually know that game, it is a german game.

If the devs let u choose wether u want a voice or not it would be great.

Nedak
01-04-2006, 06:49 PM
I think besides the face customization they should let your character say realy mean stuff and funny stuff.

Darth InSidious
01-04-2006, 07:32 PM
I'd really like to be able to adjust the whole body - Toenails Of Death, here I come :D

Prime
01-05-2006, 10:32 AM
I think besides the face customization they should let your character say realy mean stuff and funny stuff.That doesn't sound very Jedi like...

JediMaster12
01-18-2006, 06:50 PM
You have a point there but what if you start off as an average joe like my young 20 something pilot that I mentioned in a different thread. Could give some humour but then again I can't define humour because I laugh at the romance portions in the game.

I definitely need to switch to decaf or something. Maybe get jumped up on juma.

Dark$eth
01-18-2006, 07:05 PM
No, don't add a voice for the PC, unless you are going to record a voice for every language and every country! .... Not only is it unworkably difficult to do, it excludes other languages than English, and it doesn't allow for the fact that not everyone likes some people. Also, the Exile or REvan or whoever is meant to be YOU. How can any actor be YOU? It would remove the idea that you are the character....

DarthRevan3 (A.K.A.) me has/have already come up with a solution for this.
A microphone comes with the game, and you speak into it and npcs and party members react to it. Somebody said that that would cost too much money, but devoloping companies have tons, more than enough for this technology. That's my idea, I think it's good. :D :D :D

LegoRevan
01-25-2006, 11:34 PM
DarthRevan3 (A.K.A.) me has/have already come up with a solution for this.
A microphone comes with the game, and you speak into it and npcs and party members react to it. Somebody said that that would cost too much money, but devoloping companies have tons, more than enough for this technology. That's my idea, I think it's good. :D :D :D

that is a good idea, but before you start the game i'd say you would have to do some kind of voice training for the game to understand what your trying to say, kinda what windows xp has... which i couldn't be stuffed doing.... but its something the gaming industry could look into...

Prime
01-26-2006, 10:25 AM
DarthRevan3 (A.K.A.) me has/have already come up with a solution for this.
A microphone comes with the game, and you speak into it and npcs and party members react to it. Somebody said that that would cost too much money, but devoloping companies have tons, more than enough for this technology. That's my idea, I think it's good. :D :D :DBut they aren't just going to spend money just because they have it (and they don't have as much as you might think). There has to be a return on investment. Is this feature going to cause a whole bunch of people to run out and buy the game? No. Not many players are going to buy this game just because of this.

JediMaster12
01-26-2006, 10:31 AM
That istrue. They would have to come up with a VERY good sales pitch to pull it off. Me, I would see it as a waste to spend extra just to hear myself talk? No way.

LegoRevan
01-31-2006, 04:52 AM
That istrue. They would have to come up with a VERY good sales pitch to pull it off. Me, I would see it as a waste to spend extra just to hear myself talk? No way.

me either......

Spartanghost220
02-03-2006, 08:09 PM
me either......
there is a point were maybe there is alittle too much in a game like it would be cool if you could talk to you NPC's but lets think oh it this way how would that really work out plus you proablly have to buy some crap to make it work. Maybe a better idea is to put a KOTOR3 univerve into place and play with other people online and talk to them, even through some may say this would be too much like galaxies and such but maybe if they firgued it out all right. Maybe you could play the game with one or two others online i beleive that would be pretty fun to play through the game with a friend even through they would have to change alot of game stuff.

Another thing was i wanted to talk about the whole face custom thing, I think you sould be able to make your character very speciallike with height, weigth, beard, no beard, mohawk, maybe mullet, just make the character look how you want him/her to look. Also to be able to pick clothes color and armor colors along with be able to wear no shirt to show off those buff jedi muscles

Master Kavar
02-03-2006, 10:49 PM
Yes, this is an excellent idea, and one that I've had since playing Star Wars Galaxies. If kotor 3 has the same or similiar character generating engine as Galaxies, that would be a hundred times better than a dozen static pre-rendered default heads.

JediMaster12
02-03-2006, 11:52 PM
Hey, I like those default heads. Well, except in TSL one of the male PC heads looks like my brother only with the stubble of a beard. It's disturbing but it's neat.

Eelyn Tikalm
02-06-2006, 06:29 PM
I like the customization idea very much. We should be able to pick a character, and then change it as well.

I think that character's appearence is very important because it helps us to get into the character. I tried to do modding (read the tutorials, downloaded kotortool etc) but I'm a total noob and don't understand it :(

But I really like the appearence of my avatar (KOTOR2)

LegoRevan
02-08-2006, 05:25 AM
Maybe you could play the game with one or two others online i beleive that would be pretty fun to play through the game with a friend even through they would have to change alot of game stuff.

2 Player? Now that would be awesome!

JediMaster12
02-08-2006, 11:38 AM
Yes but KOTOR is RPG and I think the idea was to keep it a single player game. I like it because I can do what I want and not have to worry about someone yelling at me for accidently killing them. What am I saying, I do it on purpose! :D