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igyman
02-02-2006, 02:22 PM
I've read a lot of different opinions on the main character in KoTOR 3. Although I think Revan should again be the main character, there are some who think that should be the Exile and some who think we need a completely new character. Well, the easiest way to know for sure what the majority wants is a poll. So, vote for your prefered character and maybe give an explanation for your opinion.

Vladimir-Vlada
02-02-2006, 02:28 PM
I'd prefer either Revan or the Exile as the main character. Or you can have both to choose: they ahve different story course and still one of them is a party member. But I'm fine if it's a new character.

Diego Varen
02-02-2006, 02:30 PM
I think that there should be a new character. This is because, Revan and the Exile will be too powerful to use and a new character would make KOTOR better. I think.

JediMaster12
02-02-2006, 04:54 PM
I voted for a new character because I think KOTOR 3 would be more involved in tracing the steps that Revan and the Exile walked in the Unknown Regions

Hallucination
02-02-2006, 09:49 PM
New character, just because I don't like recycled characters.

Palpatine_dc
02-02-2006, 10:12 PM
A new character. Building your character is is essential to an RPG. Both Revan and the Exile are powerfull characters at the end of the games. Reusing them would be forced, I mean does anybody want to see Revan or the Exile mindwiped or cut off from the Force again?

Commander Obi-Wan
02-02-2006, 10:13 PM
Completely new Character. I pretty much agree with Palpatine_dc said.

Maverick5770
02-02-2006, 10:39 PM
I agree with palpatine_dc, new character definatley. However th e new character need to meet up with Revan and the Exile.

Darth Sun_Tzu
02-03-2006, 03:28 AM
I voted for Revan because i liked the character and would like to play him again BUT this would not be practicle for the reasons that others have already stated, so it should be another character. Yet another super powerful jedi, WOO HOO! :zz1:

Both Revan and the Exile are powerfull characters at the end of the games. Reusing them would be forced, I mean does anybody want to see Revan or the Exile mindwiped or cut off from the Force again?

On this point, if that were to happen, i think the most believeable would be the exile. Heres why, the exile regained his abilities through force bonds (especially with Kreia), so when he goes off by himself to find Revan he looses many of his abilities as he has no force bonds to rely on. So when the game starts and he has people join the party he can start to regain his abilities again. A bit lame i know but (i think) believeable.

FiEND_138
02-03-2006, 03:32 AM
New PC.

RedHawke
02-03-2006, 03:47 AM
^^^^
Ditto! ;)

bolsen
02-03-2006, 08:38 AM
A new PC, Revan and The Exile are Jedi gods now, and I will not be happy if we do have one/both of them and they return to level one that would be bull****. Also, I want to be a REAL Jedi, not an exile or ex-Sith Lord who has amnesia.

Darth InSidious
02-03-2006, 09:44 AM
Revan!
No one else will do.

Vladimir-Vlada
02-03-2006, 09:59 AM
Revan!
No one else will do.
Agreed.

Jeremia Skywalk
02-03-2006, 10:31 AM
Eh you can vote what you want, but i know what it will be. It will be what i voted- a new PC. come on it's right in front of your nose, dont u get it.

John Skywalker
02-03-2006, 10:32 AM
i agree with bolsen i want to be a pure jedi this time but at the start of my training, possibly a jedi padawan.:)

Vladimir-Vlada
02-03-2006, 10:36 AM
come on it's right in front of your nose, dont u get it.
No, I don't get it.

One thing about a new PC: If anyone chose this option because it 'doesn't make sense', then it isn't a good enough reason. If someone voted because he wants a new PC, that's fine.

Darth Sun_Tzu
02-03-2006, 10:37 AM
i agree with bolsen i want to be a pure jedi this time but at the start of my training, possibly a jedi padawan.

I think that would be a good idea infact its close to one of my ideas for k3.

Like i said i'd like to play Revan again but its not going to happen.

Prime
02-03-2006, 11:14 AM
Completely new character.

The last thing we need is some lame excuse why Revan or the Exile are back at level 1.

Darth Sun_Tzu
02-03-2006, 11:18 AM
Completely new character.

The last thing we need is some lame excuse why Revan or the Exile are back at level 1.

How about this lame excuse?

The exile regained his abilities through force bonds (especially with Kreia), so when he goes off by himself to find Revan he looses many of his abilities as he has no force bonds to rely on. So when the game starts and he has people join the party he can start to regain his abilities again. A bit lame i know but (i think) believeable.

Vladimir-Vlada
02-03-2006, 11:22 AM
Good point, Sun_Tzu.

How about this lame excuse:

Revan, when arriving to the Unknown Regions, faces Nilhus. Nilhus knocks Revan's defense and syphons the force out of him. Being that Revan has a dark taint, Nilhus becomes what he is now. Revan falls unconciouss, since Nilhus nearly sucked his life force out. I know it's a long shot, but it might (I hope) work.

Darth Sun_Tzu
02-03-2006, 11:29 AM
Well it is lame. :thmbup1:

igyman
02-03-2006, 02:17 PM
At the risk of being over-repetitive I'm gonna quote a part from my own post at the ''KoTOR 3 Storyline ideas'' thread:

A scene begins on the Dark Planet located just outside the galaxy. That planet doesn't have its own sun, so it's always night. We are taken to a huge throne room where Revan (in his famous robes with the mask) meets the Sith Lord who will be the main bad guy in KoTOR 3. The Sith Lord tells Revan that he/she made a big mistake by coming there and says that Revan will die as the exile if he persists. They engage in combat and the Sith Lord triumphs. Instead of killing him the Sith Lord decides to spare Revan's life because Revan did weaken the Republic. He strips Revan of the armor and his memories of the Dark Planet's location and sends him/her in a small aircraft straight to Coruscant. At this point you are taken to the character creation screen and after that you take Revan's role once more in his quest to rally his companions and find the Dark Planet.

If you don't like it, say so, but do me a favour and don't call this lame.

The Doctor
02-03-2006, 02:48 PM
New character. If Revan or the Exile are the PC, I will scream.

RobQel-Droma
02-04-2006, 02:35 AM
One thing about a new PC: If anyone chose this option because it 'doesn't make sense', then it isn't a good enough reason. If someone voted because he wants a new PC, that's fine.

I voted because of both. For one, I want a new PC. For two, I don't want to have some lame reason to be one of the same characters, yet level one and weak again - and with no items that I got in the last game. I would also prefer if my history is not already discovered, which can not be said of either Revan or the Exile.

JediKnight707
02-04-2006, 02:38 AM
I wouldn't mind a new PC :)

Sith_Reven
02-04-2006, 12:59 PM
Reven. The storyline wouldn't be bad if perhaps Revan was nearly defeated by the sith in the unknown regions....(for a circumstancial reason of course; we wouldn't want to think Revan weak now would we). But all the same he should be back to claim his new party and then the game goes on.

innerfears
02-04-2006, 04:34 PM
As much as I'd love to play as Revan again, the whole point of each game was to start from nothing and build your way up. That's what makes it so fun. To take that away and start immediately as a great Jedi/Sith, where's the fun in that? Also, to play as Revan or Exile, wouldn't the game somehow need to know which path you took? The only way it'd work is if you were stripped of your powers AGAIN, and that would just be ridiculous.

Definitely a new character with emphasis on facing the "true Sith" and following Revan and Exile to the Unknown Regions.. that would be badass.

igyman
02-04-2006, 05:05 PM
In response to the current poll results (and since I feel my wish to play as Revan again is being threatened by the wishes for a new character) I am forced to quote myself yet again, hoping to change your minds on this matter (in favour of Revan as the main character).

Some say they don't want Revan as the main character again because they don't want some lame excuse for him losing his powers again, to them I pose a question: Would that excuse really bother you that much, if the rest of KoTOR 3 story is great?

Clone L68362
02-04-2006, 05:47 PM
Always gonna choose Revan, no matter how small the chances are.

igyman
02-04-2006, 06:10 PM
That's the spirit!

innerfears
02-04-2006, 06:56 PM
Yeah but Revan losing his powers for a second time? Come on.. how good of a Jedi can you be to lose it twice? lol. I could only see it as being in the Unknown Regions around the true Sith, their force energy being so strong that it clouds your own, and you don't lose your power but can't focus on it.. and would gradually come back the more enemies you defeated.. I could see that.

igyman
02-04-2006, 07:47 PM
My idea for a KoTOR 3 intro was similar to what you wrote here. I quoted it on this thread, if you want to read it just scroll up (assuming that you've set your display properties to show the most recent posts last) and you'll see it.

Clone L68362
02-04-2006, 09:53 PM
Yeah but Revan losing his powers for a second time? Come on.. how good of a Jedi can you be to lose it twice? lol. I could only see it as being in the Unknown Regions around the true Sith, their force energy being so strong that it clouds your own, and you don't lose your power but can't focus on it.. and would gradually come back the more enemies you defeated.. I could see that.

Heeeey! I think that could work! You haven't lost your powers, you just are weakened by the strength of the True Sith. Of course, you wouldn't just get chunks of FP back by defeating enemies, the power you gain from them would be in the form of XP, which would help you level up.

RedHawke
02-05-2006, 02:31 AM
(Copied from the other thread you posed this question in)

Some say they don't want Revan as the main character again because they don't want some lame excuse for him losing his powers again, to them I pose a question: Would that excuse really bother you that much, if the rest of KoTOR 3 story is great?
Because it breaks an RPG convention by doing so... We will start with a Level one PC, how can you possibly explain reasonably that Revan or The Exile are level one again? You can't as it is a plot point that has already been used.

Revan's and The Exile's days as our PC are quite over... You cannot play a game starting with a Level 20 character either, this eliminates your ability to customise and buld your character, RPG players can be broken down into groups, I won't go into them here, but suffice it to say by starting at level 20+ you would alienate a full 1/4 to 1/3 of your audience if you do this, right off the bat.

The stories of Revan and The Exile are already told as well, what else is there to learn other than their fates.

We will start with a new level one PC.

New Addendum: No matter what the "excuses" for Revan or The Exile to lose their levels again, all of them are not acceptable as good 'Game of The Year' RPG story points. Revan had this done in KotOR it was the great twist in the game too, the Exile had this done in TSL to a lesser extent, but only for history points, to do this to those exact characters again would lose the game any chance at any possible accolades.

pokejedi123
02-05-2006, 02:51 AM
Reven. The storyline wouldn't be bad if perhaps Revan was nearly defeated by the sith in the unknown regions....(for a circumstancial reason of course; we wouldn't want to think Revan weak now would we). But all the same he should be back to claim his new party and then the game goes on.agree,BUT he would be with those KOTOR 2 membersm who stayed alive (atton especially and he and exile should be married)

(for a circumstancial reason of course; we wouldn't want to think Revan weak now would we).then he would force lighting us!*LAUGHS*but revan and exile should be as party members with KOTOR 1 and KOTOR 2 party members
but we need a new sith lord maybe: Darth Android

Clone L68362
02-05-2006, 03:26 AM
Well, if playing as Revan from the start is impossible, there's always my idea:

Looking back on my explanation of how playing as Revan would work, I think I have a better idea. How bout around the time in the game when you should be level 20, there's an event going on that you need Revan to take part in (like some bad evil Sith guy) and he becomes a main charcter? He/she would have to be in DS/LS Revan robes. Like Mandalore, you can't take em off. Genius or what?

That's good right? :)

RedHawke
02-05-2006, 04:04 AM
Nope sorry Clone... I know that some want this to be so, quite badly I might add, but it just isn't really possible.

Revan will likely be 'seen' only in cutscenes, at best Revan will have the trademark masked outfit on, either the Black Sith ones or a Brown Star Forge version, but we also may never actually 'see' Revan in KotOR III at all.

We will not likely even 'see' the Exile in KotOR III, just too many possible appearances.

The dialogue to set the previous games is going to be obvious enough as it is...

Revan...
Good or Evil?
Male or Female?

Exile...
Good or Evil?
Male or Female?

That is now upwards of 4 obvious questions the devs will have to work into the game, these 4 will add a ton of dialogue complexity as well.

Now to actually be able to play them at a point in the game you will need to add...

Revan...
Non-Jedi Class?
Jedi Class?
Prestiege Class?
Saber Color?
Saber Style?

Exile...
Jedi Class?
Prestiege Class?
Saber Color?
Saber Style?

Now you have increased the questionaire to 13 total questions, not to mention the dozens of additional appearance questions for The Exile would completely ruin any semblance to something that can be reasonably worked into a conversation. What are they to do? Mugshots? No way. Whatever they did it would have to be really good or else we would start feeling more like taking a quiz than playing a game. :xp:

Also if we did get to play Revan, like people seem to want, how would you explain them having feats that we didn't take, to play a Revan different from my own would remove me from the story somewhat. This is suicidal to do in an RPG anyway, as your main character is to be the stories focus, and not an old character from a previous campaign.

The 4 necissary LS/DS, M/F questions and having in-game places to tell us what happened to Revan and The Exile will be quite enough to finish their stories. I think of Revan and the Exile as the story points that will guide our neophyte Jedi through KotOR III. Kind of like the marks left by Arnie Saknussem that were followed by the main characters in Journey to the center of the Earth. ;)

Vladimir-Vlada
02-05-2006, 05:41 AM
Revan...
Good or Evil?
Male or Female?

Exile...
Good or Evil?
Male or Female?

That is now upwards of 4 obvious questions the devs will have to work into the game, these 4 will add a ton of dialogue complexity as well.

Now to actually be able to play them at a point in the game you will need to add...

Revan...
Non-Jedi Class?
Jedi Class?
Prestiege Class?
Saber Color?
Saber Style?

Exile...
Jedi Class?
Prestiege Class?
Saber Color?
Saber Style?

This isn't exatcly that hrad to determine. You can use the dialogues to make a certain party member: Sealed apperance and personality. And if you don't like the apperance, mod it or deal with it. That is the policy all RPG games made.

This is suicidal to do in an RPG anyway, as your main character is to be the stories focus, and not an old character from a previous campaign.
Now I have to make a remark that Revan and the Exile are the stories focus. It has been stated time and time again through TSL in dialogues, datapads, quests, acts and decisions of the bad guys, as well as the story.

Here is an explanation on the example of the Exile. And if required I will make one for Revan as well.

(Taken from the thread 'Revan and the Sith'ari')

Could you please tell us?

I only know that the Sith we know are just dark jedi, and only cary the name.
It is so easy that I don't think that I need to say it. But anyway:

Who were the Sith sent to kill?
Easy, the last of the Jedi, the Exile (Ry'ghol as they call him/her)
Let me explain:

Nilhus, Sion and Kreia... The trio of the last Sith Lords in the Galaxy. But they were only in hte known regions. Their fanaticism and determination to complete their goals no matter what, points out to something more than just to kill Jedi and crush the Republic. To sacrifice yourself just in order to kill someone or turn them to your side is stupid... Unless there was something more to do there.

From what we saw in KOTOR 2, and from what we heard it is certanily something more.

The Jedi Masters, who we saw in KOTOR 2, always said that training Revan was a mistake they will never make again, and they always said that they were wrong when training Ry'ghol and that bad things happen and so... But none of them, never said that training Ry'ghol was a mistake. Instead they thought that it was dangerous to keep him connected to the Force, because of what he had, of what he was...

The Sith Lords, however, thought differeantly: They hunted him, fanaticly and determined. Why did they do it?

What I am about to tell, might not be accurate, but very strange at some point... Let's look at what were the goals of the Sith.

The Sith Lords, being so determined, could have only acted to do something, that by doing something with the Chosen One, they would control the Force. But they needed many things to do:

They had 2 primary objectives:

1. DESTROY THE REPUBLIC:

This objective was pretty obvious when Nilhus attacked The Telos Restoration Project AND when Vaklu decieded to ally with the Sith (and got their support). It was said many times in the game that the Republic depends on the sucessfulness of the Telos Restoration Project, and the situation on Onderon. And it wasn't such a surprising thing to attack the thing that was mostly defended: The Project was weak; Czerka was halting it; the Station was running out of fuel; And one torpedo was enough to blow it to hell. So I don't think that it was such a problem to do this.

And they did... They destroyed the Telos Station. Destroying the Republic; Forever...

2. KILL ALL OF THE REMAINING JEDI:

Now this objective was far more complicated to do, since the Jedi were too numerous. This objective became obvious when Nilhus destroyed Katharr, in order to exterminate all Jedi. Regretablly, some survived. But the main objective, the last of the Jedi, was no where to be found.

They had only ONE lead: THE EBON HAWK

Sion was sent out to search for Ry'ghol (Will be refered as Ryan Pano from now on). He found out that Kreia, was on the Ebon Hawk, and thought that he could lure the Republic to them. Kreia and Sion found Ryan. And so it went on. But they still had to use Atris, who was on their side to make Ryan a bait, so that he could lure out the Jedi Masters. Atris turned to the Dark Side willingly, to make Ryan a bait to lure the Sith out, so that she could turn against them and defeat them; but she failed in her attempt. There were to variants to completing their goal:

A) If Kreia managed to convert Ryan to the Dark Side to join the Sith, all they had to do is destroy the Republic and have Ryan kill all of the Jedi Masters.

Regreatably, the conflict between Kreia and Sion, which lead to it that Sion wanted to kill Ryan in order to have his revenge on Kreia; and Nilhus' determination to become the wielder of what Ryan held inside himself, turned out to be their end. And that is what occured.

B) BUT If Ryan chose to walk the path of the Light, then he was supposed to be killed so that Nilhus would wield what Ryan carried inside himself.

But the disagreements between the Sith Lords was their undoing, and so that ended up with their deaths.

They needed him, because he had the power to control through the Force, making him independent of it. He could control others through the Force... But it was also possible that he could control the Force himself.

Now, I'll need to stop here because I said too much already. I'll have to tell you more later, because there is so much more to tell, that it makes my head spin.

That's all I had to say...
************************************************** ********
As you see, I have focused on the plot points and the more than obvious leads that Obsidian left in order to make this.

igyman
02-05-2006, 02:22 PM
To RedHawke:

1) I never said KoTOR 3 should start with a level 20 character (that would be pretty stupid, I agree), just that Revan should be the main character.

2) Revan lost his powers in KoTOR 1 when the Jedi Council stripped him of his memories. In KoTOR 2 Kreia was only stripped of her powers (her background story), not her memories. What could work in KoTOR 3 is what I already said - Revan was defeated in the battle with the leader of the ''True Sith'', his life was spared as ''payment'' for weakening the Republic, but to keep the location of their capital secret, the Sith Lord stripped Revan of his powers and the memory of the planet's location (only that one memory), after that he sent him in an automated pod into Republic space (or something like that).

So, from my point of view I'm not suggesting a rerun of the original story, but simply a logical reason for Revan's second loss of his powers. Revan would know who he is this time and what he needs to do, but this time the player would lead him on his search for the ''True Sith''.

RedHawke
02-06-2006, 03:36 AM
^^^^
We will be playing a new level one PC, no amount of ideas for having us play Revan or the Exile again are acceptable, seriously.

You can type all the justifications you want for our playing Revan or the Exile again but it just isn't done. If it were we done then we would have played Revan in TSL and the Exile would have never been, but it isn't done, you just don't continue characters like this, so we will have a new PC in KotOR III.

Savior, conqueror, hero, villain. You are all things Revan... and yet you are nothing. In the end you belong to neither the light nor the darkness. You will forever stand alone.
Revan as a PC is written out with this one line... Revan is nothing. So is the Exile actually, the Exiles un-importance was hinted to by Kreia if I'm not mistaken. (I'm sure Shem can find the line for this ;))

Such is the way of these kinds of RPG's and why Malak said this line. It leaves the next part of the story open to a new character.

We will hear about Revan and the Exile's fates/futures as we progress through KotOR III via dialogues, datapads, etc., but you better not expect much more or else you will set yourself up for a great disappointment.

I understand that this is important to you, and I'm not saying anyones ideas are bad or anything, but this just isn't a viable option for a developer to consider.

Vladimir-Vlada
02-06-2006, 06:22 AM
We will be playing a new level one PC, no amount of ideas for having us play Revan or the Exile again are acceptable, seriously.
By whose judgement?

You can type all the justifications you want for our playing Revan or the Exile again but it just isn't done. If it were we done then we would have played Revan in TSL and the Exile would have never been, but it isn't done, you just don't continue characters like this, so we will have a new PC in KotOR III.
I believe I said this before, but I will say it again:

Take a look at the story of KOTOR 2... Many things point out that both of those guys are in the center of the story. If Obisidan didn't make KOTOR 2 like this, with the Sith Empire that is supposed to be defeated before they destroy everything, I wouldn't be complaining now and everything would be fine.

Obsidian made this mess... They will have to clean it up. No offense.

Revan as a PC is written out with this one line... Revan is nothing. So is the Exile actually, the Exiles un-importance was hinted to by Kreia if I'm not mistaken.
What? Are you saying that these two guys were for nothing? They are the protagnists. The entire series so far is focused on these two.

Such is the way of these kinds of RPG's and why Malak said this line. It leaves the next part of the story open to a new character.
I know that it is the way of RPGs. But the way TSL was ended, I doubt that it will be able to do it as it was written.

We will hear about Revan and the Exile's fates/futures as we progress through KotOR III via dialogues, datapads, etc., but you better not expect much more or else you will set yourself up for a great disappointment.
It's not too late. But if it happens, I'll deal with it.

but this just isn't a viable option for a developer to consider.
That hurts. :whacked:

RedHawke
02-06-2006, 07:16 AM
By whose judgement?
If they were going to have a continuing character we would have been Revan in TSL.

I believe I said this before, but I will say it again:

Take a look at the story of KOTOR 2... Many things point out that both of those guys are in the center of the story. If Obisidan didn't make KOTOR 2 like this, with the Sith Empire that is supposed to be defeated before they destroy everything, I wouldn't be complaining now and everything would be fine.

Obsidian made this mess... They will have to clean it up. No offense.
Obsidian made no mess, as a matter of fact after reading the cut content, I can start to see the method to their madness, from a plot perspective they left all the right doors open for a bang-up third installment. Is there a lot unanswered? Yes there is, and it was intentional.

Finding out what happend will be how we are drawn into the next chapter.

What? Are you saying that these two guys were for nothing? They are the protagnists. The entire series so far is focused on these two.
So will our third PC become a focus... just like the Exile in TSL.

Vladimir-Vlada
02-06-2006, 07:27 AM
Obsidian made no mess, as a matter of fact after reading the cut content, I can start to see the method to their madness, from a plot perspective they left all the right doors open for a bang-up third installment. Is there a lot unanswered? Yes there is, and it was intentional.
Of course there was a lot left unanswered. And some of these questions directly connect to both Revan and the Exile (although most concern the Exile, because there are more questions concerning him).

How did the Exile become this echo in the Force? Was it really Malachor V?
Why did the Sith Lords strive so hard to destory or turn the Exile that they went into their death?
What is the point of killing one, if you are going to die yourself?
Did the Sith Lords act on their behalf or by orders?

So many questions, so few answeres that raise even more questions.

So will our third PC become a focus... just like the Exile in TSL.
How? It was easy with the Exile. He was neceseary. But now it is too entangled and complex. How can you hope to insert another character if the previous one (two) are so involved in the entire thing already?

RedHawke
02-06-2006, 07:51 AM
Of course there was a lot left unanswered. And some of these questions directly connect to both Revan and the Exile (although most concern the Exile, because there are more questions concerning him).

How did the Exile become this wound in the Force? Was it really Malachor V? Yes, and it was because of the natural Force Bonds the Exile formed with others, with so much death at Malachor V it hurt the Exile in unimaginable ways, enough that the Exile cut him/her self off from the force.
Why did the Sith Lords strive so hard to destory or turn the Exile that they went into their death? Kreia led/tricked them into what she wanted them to do. She turned them into a test for the Exile.
What is the point of killing one, if you are going to die yourself? You lost me there.
Did the Sith Lords act on their behalf or by orders? Kreia was manipulating the whole thing.

So many questions, so few answeres that raise even more questions.
After reading this it is apparent you haven't played TSL enough to have gotten these story points. I did post short answers in red.

You have to actually talk to Kreia at the end of the game to get closure. You also need to play the game in more than one way to discover other points, this was done on purpose as well.

I played the Xbox version 6 times through and still learned about other story points I had missed once I got the PC version.

This is the problem people have with TSL, the story isn't spoon-fed to people like KotOR I was, so they cry foul or go on about Obsidian making mistakes after they play it once and don't understand much.

How? It was easy with the Exile. He was neceseary. But now it is too entangled and complex. How can you hope to insert another character if the previous one (two) are so involved in the entire thing already?
How would a new character be any different than the Exile was? It wouldn't. The new character would also be just as necissary.

igyman
02-06-2006, 07:52 AM
If they were going to have a continuing character we would have been Revan in TSL.

If Bioware was in charge of making KoTOR 2, Revan would have surely been the main character again - Obsidian is a completely different team and though they had to continue where the original story ended, they wanted to make their own vision of KoTOR which is why they came up with the Exile.
They knew no one would like a story completely unrelated to Revan, but they wanted to try telling it through their own character (and judging by the results of this poll they have failed miserably). Furthermore, though the Exile had his own story, KoTOR 2 was filled with references to Revan and his whereabouts, so KoTOR 2 in its entirety was made into a prelude for the big finish (where they could bring Revan, or the Exile back, or bring out a new character, based on how much the fans like the TSL's Exile).

Obsidian made no mess, as a matter of fact after reading the cut content, I can start to see the method to their madness, from a plot perspective they left all the right doors open for a bang-up third installment. Is there a lot unanswered? Yes there is, and it was intentional.

Ofcourse there's a lot of unanswered questions! Ofcourse it was intentional!
Unfortunately Obsidian did make a certain mess and by ''mess'' I'm refering to the cut out content. It's one thing to cut out some content due to a short deadline, but it's a completely different thing to launch a game that the player can clearly see is missing some things.
I heard that some content was cut out from KoTOR 1 too, but while I was playing it I never noticed it was missing anything, I had no idea anything was cut out from KoTOR 1 until I read about it somewhere on the forum.
Like I said, the mess in TSL is its VISIBLITY of its cut out content. Everyone saw that the game is missing the HK factory, the part of Nar Shaddaa docks that is visible on the map, but the doors leading there can't be opened, etc.
My point is that if they were forced to cut out some of the content, they should have adapted the story apropriately.

RedHawke
02-06-2006, 08:19 AM
If Bioware was in charge of making KoTOR 2, Revan would have surely been the main character again
Nope, even if Bioware had done the sequel Revan's story has been told. Continuing PC's are not parts of these types of RPG's. Revan getting his/her levels and powers taken away in each installment is really a lame thing to do. That is why it isn't done. I'm not saying it is impossible but it is close to it.

You have to cater to all your player types, and the same character alienates the Character Builder (Achiever) types, and hampers the Role Players (Socializers)... this is 2/3 of your target audience right there. The only ones who are left are the the Explorer player types, the same character over and over would also get to them.

Unfortunately Obsidian did make a certain mess and by ''mess'' I'm refering to the cut out content. It's one thing to cut out some content due to a short deadline, but it's a completely different thing to launch a game that the player can clearly see is missing some things.
I heard that some content was cut out from KoTOR 1 too, but while I was playing it I never noticed it was missing anything, I had no idea anything was cut out from KoTOR 1 until I read about it somewhere on the forum.
Like I said, the mess in TSL is its VISIBLITY of its cut out content. Everyone saw that the game is missing the HK factory, the part of Nar Shaddaa docks that is visible on the map, but the doors leading there can't be opened, etc.
My point is that if they were forced to cut out some of the content, they should have adapted the story apropriately.
Yes Obsidian didn't have time to clean up the stragglers, but this is not their fault LA was responsible for all Q&A testing, not Obsidian.

Honestly those two things you mentioned are not "Visible" cut content from TSL, the Nar-Shadaa docks don't count as elements of the game sometimes are reduced especially for a console game, perhaps too many placeables or NPC's caused Xbox slowdown. But it was nothing that made me say "missing content" when playing the game.

Neither does the HK factory levels, that is simply a door you cannot open in one part of the game, it says 'sub-level' not 'HK factory', nothing felt missing with these two things, especially with all the doors you can't open in KotOR I... it is only after reading about such things that we go "hey!"

Seamhainn
02-06-2006, 10:43 AM
New PC as thats the game concept, and Revan and Exile making appearances...

Anyway as KotOR III will be published, I don't care that much.

Take care

igyman
02-06-2006, 02:30 PM
Honestly those two things you mentioned are not "Visible" cut content from TSL, the Nar-Shadaa docks don't count as elements of the game sometimes are reduced especially for a console game, perhaps too many placeables or NPC's caused Xbox slowdown. But it was nothing that made me say "missing content" when playing the game.

Neither does the HK factory levels, that is simply a door you cannot open in one part of the game, it says 'sub-level' not 'HK factory', nothing felt missing with these two things, especially with all the doors you can't open in KotOR I... it is only after reading about such things that we go "hey!"

Sorry, but Nar Shadaa counts since you can clearly see on the map that there is something behind those doors. I'm saying that since they've cut that part of the docks out, they should have removed it from the map - that isn't such a complicated job and doesn't require more than 15 minutes of somebody's time.

The same goes for the Telos sublevel - you can't open that door even though the map shows that it leads to a new area. I agree though that you can't be sure the HK factory is there, unless you've read about it on a forum, but you can be sure that something is there (should have been there) and you can't visit it.

Vladimir-Vlada
02-06-2006, 03:50 PM
How did the Exile become this wound in the Force? Was it really Malachor V? Yes, and it was because of the natural Force Bonds the Exile formed with others, with so much death at Malachor V it hurt the Exile in unimaginable ways, enough that the Exile cut him/her self off from the force.
Why did the Sith Lords strive so hard to destory or turn the Exile that they went into their death? Kreia led/tricked them into what she wanted them to do. She turned them into a test for the Exile.
What is the point of killing one, if you are going to die yourself? You lost me there.
Did the Sith Lords act on their behalf or by orders? Kreia was manipulating the whole thing.

So many questions, so few answeres that raise even more questions.
Yes, I understand all this. But why would she test the Exile? Tests are made to prepare people for something. Kreia was obviously preparing the Exile for something. And would she really go that far, even though it would kill her? She may be devious. But she's definately not a lunatic.

How would a new character be any different than the Exile was? It wouldn't. The new character would also be just as necissary.
Actually, it would. Look at the endings of KOTOR 1 and 2:
After KOTOR 1, it was obvious that Revan can't be the PC in the squel. His work for some time is done.
After KOTOR 2, the only one that could continue the began story is the Exile. Inserting another character would make the Exile's story pointless and entire Obisidan's work on TSL's story for nothing.

I think I am starting to understand how you see things. Even though you are right about a lot of things, I think that none we came to a point where we can't really say which continuation is the one that should be done:

We can't insert the Exile or Revan, because they are already level 20.
We can't insert another character, because the first two are tied too deeply into this.

This looks like a situation where we are in a maze. We dig our own way through, but we reached a wall that blocks us from the exit and each other.
If you ask me, I think that it's now up to Obisidan. It's not our decision anymore.

igyman
02-06-2006, 03:58 PM
No it's not our decision, but it doesn't have to be necessarily Obsidian's decision either.
I mean there's no guarantee that Obsidian will even be the one to possibly make KoTOR 3.

Vladimir-Vlada
02-06-2006, 04:02 PM
I know that. But since we can't decide (mainly because both sides have good reasons), I think that Obisidan (or Bioware or both) should decide on it.

igyman
02-06-2006, 04:05 PM
They should and they will, but they should bear in mind what most of the fans want.

Vladimir-Vlada
02-06-2006, 04:08 PM
Yes, I know. But if you look around the forum a little... You'll see that it is pretty much divided into half.

Eelyn Tikalm
02-06-2006, 05:10 PM
Hey, who would like to play Revan in KOTOR3, but with the story placed in the time just before KOTOR1? It'd be fun to see what made Revan turn to the dark side, and we could see Kreia (she trained Revan)?? I know that the realisation of this idea isn't not possible, and the future of the Revan would be defined already, but still...?

Ej Vladimire mi smo susjedi

Vladimir-Vlada
02-06-2006, 05:16 PM
O, i ti si sa ovih prostora? Pozdrav brate. I igyman je sa ovih prostora.

Hey, who would like to play Revan in KOTOR3, but with the story placed in the time just before KOTOR1?
Not bad. But still you have to wait for the current plot to finish. Then maybe we could think of that.

JediMaster12
02-06-2006, 05:27 PM
I'm up for a new PC. I really can't see anyway clearlyas to explain why Revan/Exile is at level 1 again. I'm up for seeing them maybe be a temporary character but I just can't see it.

Eelyn Tikalm
02-06-2006, 06:04 PM
Only me and somebody else have voted for Exile. I liked the Exile character and story more than the Revan story.
We all know that they'll put a new char in KOTOR3, that's how the RPGs are. You have to start from a scratch. That's sad. I mean, you just get into the char, and then you have to do that all over again in the next game sequal with the new one.

Btw Vladimire, trebao si reći pozdrav sestro :)
Drago mi je vidjet nekog iz blizine.

Vladimir-Vlada
02-06-2006, 06:10 PM
{snip} These are English Language forums

Only me and somebody else have voted for Exile. I liked the Exile character and story more than the Revan story.
I didn't vote, because I liked both Revan and the Exile. So I can't really decide.

Eelyn Tikalm
02-06-2006, 06:27 PM
Yeah, both chars are interesting.
I've been trying to figure out what makes a character interesting. So I noticed this cliche (that I like): he/she's always got to have some big traumatic experience (Revan=memory&force power loss as an indirect result of Malak's betrayal, Exile=force power loss as a direct result of tragedies from Malachor V etc)
so I guess that the K3 new char will also have one that will force him/her to start from scratch. I rally can't wait to see what will that be.
I agree with anyone who thinks that it would be boring to see yet another reason why Revan/Exile would lose all powers or/and memory, but I'd like to have them in K3.

igyman
02-06-2006, 06:40 PM
I'm glad to see more and more different opinions and though I want Revan, I'm still glad the Exile is starting to get some votes.

{snip} These are English Language forums

Eelyn Tikalm
02-06-2006, 07:12 PM
{snip} These are English language forums

It would be fun to play with both Revan and Exile, and a new PC in K3. I wouldn't mind chosing all the feats, skills, f powers etc all over again for them at the begining of the game.

Vladimir-Vlada
02-06-2006, 08:36 PM
It would be fun to play with both Revan and Exile, and a new PC in K3.
I wish that it happens.

igyman
02-07-2006, 02:58 PM
I'm not sure how that can be done, but who knows?

Darth InSidious
02-07-2006, 04:03 PM
Simple. The plot alternates between the two people, like scenes in a film or a TV show. "Act 1", the Exile sets off. "Act 2", Revan is stuck in a dungeon, maybe? Eventually, both characters meet, and you decide which to leave behind...?

Frankly the argument "an old PC re-appearing makes no sense in terms of plot" is not really an argument. Neither is yet *another* Jedi anointed by fate/the Force/whatever, to save or condemn the Republic. Neither argument is stronger.

Vladimir-Vlada
02-07-2006, 04:25 PM
Simple. The plot alternates between the two people, like scenes in a film or a TV show. "Act 1", the Exile sets off. "Act 2", Revan is stuck in a dungeon, maybe? Eventually, both characters meet, and you decide which to leave behind...?

Frankly the argument "an old PC re-appearing makes no sense in terms of plot" is not really an argument. Neither is yet *another* Jedi anointed by fate/the Force/whatever, to save or condemn the Republic. Neither argument is stronger.
I strongly support and agree with everything Darth InSidious said.

Prime
02-07-2006, 04:38 PM
Simple. The plot alternates between the two people, like scenes in a film or a TV show. "Act 1", the Exile sets off. "Act 2", Revan is stuck in a dungeon, maybe? Eventually, both characters meet, and you decide which to leave behind...?Why would I want to spend a good chunk of the game to develop a character only to have to ditch him for the rest of the game? And remember, a lot of people got upset with TSL when they were forced to use another character...

Frankly the argument "an old PC re-appearing makes no sense in terms of plot" is not really an argument. Neither is yet *another* Jedi anointed by fate/the Force/whatever, to save or condemn the Republic. Neither argument is stronger.But Star Wars is riddled with characters that have a huge affect on the galaxy at large. The whole "character reset" thing is much more cliche.

stingerhs
02-07-2006, 04:48 PM
Frankly the argument "an old PC re-appearing makes no sense in terms of plot" is not really an argument. Neither is yet *another* Jedi anointed by fate/the Force/whatever, to save or condemn the Republic. Neither argument is stronger.you're right, neither arguement is stronger. however, you're still not completely on track. it would be difficult to come up with yet another excuse to explain why Revan or the Exile has lost their abilities and has to re-develop them. yes, it is possible, but it would be a bit too cliche for most players.

if you start with a new character, you're only limited to the writer's vision for the character. in other words, the sky's the limit. ;)

Vladimir-Vlada
02-07-2006, 04:54 PM
And remember, a lot of people got upset with TSL when they were forced to use another character...
Yes. But the way Obisidan constructed the story, the only way to continue it, is through the characters about which it was always talked about.

you're right, neither arguement is stronger. however, you're still not completely on track. it would be difficult to come up with yet another excuse to explain why Revan or the Exile has lost their abilities and has to re-develop them.
I know that it is hard to determine that. I said that several posts above. It was easy to insert the Exile. That was the only course of action at the time. But think how hard it will be to insert a new character NOW. Obsidian constructed it for Revan and the Exile (or just the Exile). I can't really see a place for a new character.

igyman
02-07-2006, 04:58 PM
Simple. The plot alternates between the two people, like scenes in a film or a TV show. "Act 1", the Exile sets off. "Act 2", Revan is stuck in a dungeon, maybe? Eventually, both characters meet, and you decide which to leave behind...?

That's a concept used in Legacy of Kain Defiance, the only difference is that there wasn't a point in the game where you can chose which character will you use to finish the game. The only thing is that LoK Defiance wasn't a RPG, it was an action adventure.

It's a good idea though and it would be interesting to see it realized in a RPG, but I don't think it will be done.

igyman
02-07-2006, 05:02 PM
I can't really see a place for a new character.

Me neither.

P.S. I know I've bored a lot of people to death by repeating this over and over, but I just had to do it again (and will probably continue to do so).

Darth InSidious
02-07-2006, 05:10 PM
Why would I want to spend a good chunk of the game to develop a character only to have to ditch him for the rest of the game? And remember, a lot of people got upset with TSL when they were forced to use another character...

*shrugs* If you don't like that character, then don't. The point is you choose. Anyway, it was just a suggestion.

But Star Wars is riddled with characters that have a huge affect on the galaxy at large. The whole "character reset" thing is much more cliche.
Over a long period of time. You don't generally get a long string of people saving and destroying the Republic constantly, do you? You don't find that Naga Sadow's apprentice then seeks a shadow war with the Jedi, or that Ulic Qel-Droma's half-brother seeks vengeance and then destroys Cinnagar, do you?

@stinger: you are limited by the fact that they have to be as 1337 as Revan and the Exile. You are limited by the necessity for this character's backstory, for the reason we have this brand new character, etc etc. Neither situation is especially practical.

Timberwolf 21
02-07-2006, 06:18 PM
{snip} These are English Language forums

I voted for Revan because it"s my childish desire after playiing Kotor ( my favorite game ever ) but I know that I would equally enjoy Kotor 3 if Obsidian or Bioware decides to create any other character or continue the story with exile,.It"s up to their good will and patience with creating the game with quality of its predecessory and creating the story which would be interesting and loveble to play.I just cant wait to play Kotor 3 what ever will be

Vladimir-Vlada
02-07-2006, 06:30 PM
Jos jedan? E sad smo svi na okupu. :p

I think I proved my point after several posts.

igyman
02-07-2006, 06:30 PM
{snip}English please -d3

Thanks for giving Revan your vote (That'll show those new character supporters!!).

stingerhs
02-07-2006, 06:58 PM
@stinger: you are limited by the fact that they have to be as 1337 as Revan and the Exile. You are limited by the necessity for this character's backstory, for the reason we have this brand new character, etc etc. Neither situation is especially practical.practical: no. essential: yes.

to change the format of the character you play is not something that's very desireable in the gaming industry. consistancy is the name of the game when it comes to sequels. in this case, it is essential that whoever the PC is has a definate backstory and a reasonable excuse for having (or lack there of) the abilities they have. its also a reasonable requirement that the PC be a very powerful character since that has been the established standard of the two previous games.

like it or not, whoever develop's Kotor 3 is very likely to abide by those established necessities just because it is a sequel.

Darth InSidious
02-07-2006, 07:06 PM
practical: no. essential: yes.

to change the format of the character you play is not something that's very desireable in the gaming industry. consistancy is the name of the game when it comes to sequels. in this case, it is essential that whoever the PC is has a definate backstory and a reasonable excuse for having (or lack there of) the abilities they have. its also a reasonable requirement that the PC be a very powerful character since that has been the established standard of the two previous games.

like it or not, whoever develop's Kotor 3 is very likely to abide by those established necessities just because it is a sequel.

Y'know, these arguments can be applied the other way around. Bringing Revan back would create a link between the three games.

Timberwolf 21
02-07-2006, 07:13 PM
I agree,but no character will be ever powerfull as Revan was ( and is ?!)
His storyline was most interesting and most schocking ( the cut-scene in Kotor 1 where you find out that you"re Revan is one of most powerfull moments in PC Games
I was very much suprised,it was totally unpredictable

JediMaster12
02-07-2006, 10:35 PM
Really? You must have been oblivious to the hints given to you along the way before the revelation. Anyways I said a new PC because I just can't find a justified reason for bringing in Revan as the Pc. Should there be some mentionof him? Yes because it would complete the storyline, the same for the Exile because he's connected somehow to the whole thing that began in the Mandalorian Wars.

stingerhs
02-07-2006, 10:40 PM
Y'know, these arguments can be applied the other way around. Bringing Revan back would create a link between the three games.to which i quote my own post...it would be difficult to come up with yet another excuse to explain why Revan or the Exile has lost their abilities and has to re-develop them. yes, it is possible, but it would be a bit too cliche for most players.you have to understand that i'm looking at this from two perspectives: first the development and writing process. second, i'm looking at how both the hardcore and the average gamer are going to perceive things.

from the developer/writer's standpoint, creating a new character makes more sense because you aren't limited to an established charater. you also aren't constrained to explain why a character has suddenly lost not only their powers, but also whatever they stood for (in this case being lightside or darkside).

from a gamer's perspective, a more cohesive and reasonable storyline is what makes the difference. in this case, you really can't use amnesia since its been done. you can't use being shut off from the Force because that's been done. you also can't look backwards and try to use Revan's or the Exile's backstory because we already know the backstory to those characters. so, now you really aren't left with much options unless those options include the insane and over-the-top ideas, and quite frankly, hardly anybody that goes through Kotor 3's storyline is going to want that.

RedHawke
02-07-2006, 11:03 PM
you have to understand that i'm looking at this from two perspectives: first the development and writing process. second, i'm looking at how both the hardcore and the average gamer are going to perceive things.

from the developer/writer's standpoint, creating a new character makes more sense because you aren't limited to an established charater. you also aren't constrained to explain why a character has suddenly lost not only their powers, but also whatever they stood for (in this case being lightside or darkside).

from a gamer's perspective, a more cohesive and reasonable storyline is what makes the difference. in this case, you really can't use amnesia since its been done. you can't use being shut off from the Force because that's been done. you also can't look backwards and try to use Revan's or the Exile's backstory because we already know the backstory to those characters. so, now you really aren't left with much options unless those options include the insane and over-the-top ideas, and quite frankly, hardly anybody that goes through Kotor 3's storyline is going to want that.
Thank you stingerhs, you nailed it. :D

@ Vlad to answer your questions you posed to me...

But why would she test the Exile? Tests are made to prepare people for something. Kreia was obviously preparing the Exile for something. And would she really go that far, even though it would kill her? She may be devious. But she's definately not a lunatic.
Kreia was preparing her apprentice so as to challenge her, she used everyone around her to achieve this goal. She knew full well what she was doing. Her happiest moment was when the Exile defeats her, that was everything she worked for. It is the Dark Sith way. The apprentice and master must have a face off at some point. The strong must rule.

Revan's story ended with either reclaiming the Sith Throne or saving the Republic.

The Exile defeating Kreia was the end to the Exile's story.

You seem to foster some false pretenses on just what the characters mean in these games, Revans story is finished, the same applies for the Exile, I'm sorry, these characters story arc's are quite done, all that remains is to answer the questions of their fates... all that is left is to find out weather Revan and The Exile lived happily ever after or died a Sith or Jedi death.

You can very much build a game story for a new PC on this question of our previous 2 characters fates alone, add to it the True Sith Empire and their threat to the weakened Republic, and lastly with the Jedi Order being in a wrecked state and unable to do much... that sounds like a heck of a game to me. Talk about overwhelming odds for us to beat in the third installment!

igyman
02-08-2006, 05:23 AM
Kreia was preparing her apprentice so as to challenge her, she used everyone around her to achieve this goal. She knew full well what she was doing. Her happiest moment was when the Exile defeats her, that was everything she worked for. It is the Dark Sith way. The apprentice and master must have a face off at some point. The strong must rule.

Revan's story ended with either reclaiming the Sith Throne or saving the Republic.

The Exile defeating Kreia was the end to the Exile's story.

You seem to foster some false pretenses on just what the characters mean in these games, Revans story is finished, the same applies for the Exile, I'm sorry, these characters story arc's are quite done, all that remains is to answer the questions of their fates... all that is left is to find out weather Revan and The Exile lived happily ever after or died a Sith or Jedi death.

You can very much build a game story for a new PC on this question of our previous 2 characters fates alone, add to it the True Sith Empire and their threat to the weakened Republic, and lastly with the Jedi Order being in a wrecked state and unable to do much... that sounds like a heck of a game to me. Talk about overwhelming odds for us to beat in the third installment!

I agree with you about the ''Kreia testing the Exile'' matter and I agree that the Exile's story is most probably over.

On the other hand, no matter what you say, Revan wasn't insignificant, nor did his story end in KoTOR 1. If that were the case, he wouldn't even be mentioned in TSL and he was mentioned a lot, mostly in reference to what happened to him after KoTOR 1 and that wasn't resolved in TSL.
You are right - the question of their fates is what remains to be answered, in what way will it be answered is a different question. Revan could return (sorry, but I'm a lost cause on this until an official announcement arrives), he could only be mentioned, or (and I think this is highly unlikely) the new PC might run into Revan somewhere in the game.

And at last the fact that the Jedi Order was in disarray in TSL doesn't mean it will still be so in KoTOR 3. The Sith Lords who were after the Jedi were defeated in TSL, so there's no reason for the Jedi Order not to be restored.

RedHawke
02-08-2006, 06:40 AM
I agree with you about the ''Kreia testing the Exile'' matter and I agree that the Exile's story is most probably over.
Progress! Woot! :elephant: (Any excuse to use the dancing pink elephant smily!) :D

On the other hand, no matter what you say, Revan wasn't insignificant, nor did his story end in KoTOR 1.
I never said that Revan was 'insignificant' now did I? :rolleyes:

I said Revan's story is done, all that remains is to find out Revan's fate.

If that were the case, he wouldn't even be mentioned in TSL and he was mentioned a lot, mostly in reference to what happened to him after KoTOR 1 and that wasn't resolved in TSL.
You couldn't not mention Revan in TSL, that would be like saying Revan meant nothing at all, Revan meant something as the deciding factor for KotOR I, and Revan's decision altered the path of the whole galaxy, it will be similar in KotOR III as we will see what the Exile's journey and decisions will have altered the galaxy further. That is all they are needed for.

I expect in KotOR III we will hear/read a lot about Revan and the Exile, since I do believe we will be following their paths once we find out about this new threat.

You are right - the question of their fates is what remains to be answered, in what way will it be answered is a different question.
It will be answered no differently than we found out things about Revan in TSL, RPG's like this are dialog driven games. We will find out things about Revan and the Exile by dialogs and found datapads in KotOR III.

Revan could return (sorry, but I'm a lost cause on this until an official announcement arrives), he could only be mentioned, or (and I think this is highly unlikely) the new PC might run into Revan somewhere in the game.
You can count on Revan being mentioned... Personally, I suspect Revan will be a big topic in KIII.

Though if we actually 'see' Revan it won't be any more than the 'vision' we got in TSL, possibly in cutscenes. With a minor texture tweak to the trademark outfit for a possible LS Revan, but it can never be more than that. ;)

igyman
02-08-2006, 06:48 AM
Though if we actually 'see' Revan it won't be any more than the 'vision' we got in TSL, possibly in cutscenes.

Are you refering to the vision of Revan in Ludo Kressh's tomb, or is there another vision I'm not aware of (I sure hope there isn't 'cause I recently finished TSL for the 4th time and I don't want to play it again just yet)?

RedHawke
02-08-2006, 06:53 AM
Are you refering to the vision of Revan in Ludo Kressh's tomb, or is there another vision I'm not aware of (I sure hope there isn't 'cause I recently finished TSL for the 4th time and I don't want to play it again just yet)?
That would be the vision... ;)

igyman
02-08-2006, 06:58 AM
Suspected as much, but thought I should check just in case.

Eelyn Tikalm
02-08-2006, 02:09 PM
{snip} These are English Language forums

I've been thinking about the Revan and Exile stories (that RPG gaming system). Isn't it just sad that in K1 you put all your life efforts to save/destroy the galaxy, and then in K2 you are just being mentioned as some misterious guy...? That'll probably be the same case in K3. I mean, you spend let's say 70 good hours in K2 to spread the good/kill everybody, and then you are GONE in K3, or at least mentioned as "that guy"...

Vladimir-Vlada
02-08-2006, 02:59 PM
Kreia was preparing her apprentice so as to challenge her, she used everyone around her to achieve this goal. She knew full well what she was doing. Her happiest moment was when the Exile defeats her, that was everything she worked for. It is the Dark Sith way. The apprentice and master must have a face off at some point. The strong must rule.
Then why did she mention the True Sith? Why did the Exile leave?

Revan's story ended with either reclaiming the Sith Throne or saving the Republic.

The Exile defeating Kreia was the end to the Exile's story. <----Wrong

If the Exile's story had ended with him defeating Kreia, the story would have ended with him staying to reform the Jedi Order. But instead of that, Obsidian chose that the Exile must fight, and therefor, must remain.

You seem to foster some false pretenses on just what the characters mean in these games, Revans story is finished, the same applies for the Exile, I'm sorry, these characters story arc's are quite done, all that remains is to answer the questions of their fates... all that is left is to find out weather Revan and The Exile lived happily ever after or died a Sith or Jedi death.
The way Obsidian made the ending and the entire hidden plot of KOTOR 2, it seems more likely that their stories have only begun.

You can very much build a game story for a new PC on this question of our previous 2 characters fates alone, add to it the True Sith Empire and their threat to the weakened Republic, and lastly with the Jedi Order being in a wrecked state and unable to do much... that sounds like a heck of a game to me.
What Republic? What Jedi Order?
There are two quotes that strongly barrel down that 'Republic and Jedi are in peril' theory. They were in KOTOR 2.

According to the entire calculus, the Republic will collapse in, approximatley, one month. Mainly due to the lack of both law integrity and economic crisis.
The room of the silver fountains remains empty, because there are no Jedi.
Surely, you must remember these words. So that means that there will be NO Republic or Jedi Order to be in crisis in the first place. The only option that remains is to get the two characters that want to fight against the True Sith: Revan and Ry'ghol.

Talk about overwhelming odds for us to beat in the third installment!

RedHawke, I don't want to insult you or be in conflict with you. I respect you, but please let's not take this too personally.

The Source
02-08-2006, 05:43 PM
I am tired of Revan and Exile. I think there will be a 100% new character. I hope so anyway.

JediMaster12
02-08-2006, 06:26 PM
But Revan and the Exile will be involved in the storyplot. That is a must!

Darth InSidious
02-08-2006, 06:34 PM
I like the idea someone I've forgotten came up with: You can play either as a new character, or as either Revan and/or the Exile.

igyman
02-08-2006, 06:38 PM
That means you'd have three separate character campaigns and I don't think the developers will bother themselves with making a game that complex, I'm not even sure they could.

Vladimir-Vlada
02-08-2006, 06:47 PM
I like the idea someone I've forgotten came up with: You can play either as a new character, or as either Revan and/or the Exile.
That idea came out a long time ago. I was one of those that supported it (I am even now). That would be for the best. Too bad no one would do it.
I thought of this when I considered that when choosing Revan or the Exile in the character creation screen, they have different campaigns. Then I added in my thoughts that maybe even a third character could be inserted along with them.

It's a long shot... But it would be great, also that they come in contact with each other and become party members (depending on the PC).

igyman
02-08-2006, 06:51 PM
This would, first of all, mean that the PC would have to get a voice, including male/female Revan/Exile. I mean whoever you chose, if you meet the other two and they become members of your party, you'll have to be able to talk with them just as with the rest of the party members.

The Source
02-08-2006, 07:02 PM
That idea came out a long time ago. I was one of those that supported it (I am even now). That would be for the best. Too bad no one would do it.
I thought of this when I considered that when choosing Revan or the Exile in the character creation screen, they have different campaigns. Then I added in my thoughts that maybe even a third character could be inserted along with them.

It's a long shot... But it would be great, also that they come in contact with each other and become party members (depending on the PC).
That would be an excellent idea. Therefore, you will be able to control the fates of both characters. At the beginning of the game you will be the Exile, and you free Revan from something. When you setup your characters, at the very beginning, you will be able to choose both of their head pieces, gender, alignment, etc... After you get both characters in your party, it would only be a matter of playing the game out. If you think about it, the characters in KotOR I and II are allready setup that way. Except, this time you will be able to control two character's design and outcome.

stingerhs
02-08-2006, 07:09 PM
^^^^
yeah, and then we can get caught up in a storyline that will numb our butt-cheeks for 80+ hours. :rolleyes:

what you're talking about is an absolutely massive game. games with an epic feel are one thing, but the scale you're talking about is beyond epic.

Vladimir-Vlada
02-08-2006, 07:11 PM
what you're talking about is an absolutely massive game. games with an epic feel are one thing, but the scale you're talking about is beyond epic.
Exatcly, my man! :D :D :D

The Source
02-08-2006, 07:17 PM
^^^^
yeah, and then we can get caught up in a storyline that will numb our butt-cheeks for 80+ hours. :rolleyes:

what you're talking about is an absolutely massive game. games with an epic feel are one thing, but the scale you're talking about is beyond epic.
You could do this in 40hrs.
1. You would know the Exile's fate, for you are playing the Exile.
2. The only two other mysteries would be "Where is Revan?, "What is the new threat?"

Simple. If you remember KotOR I, you had to figure out two things. "Where are the Star Maps?" and "What is the StarForge?".

Revan could be your key to finding out what this threat is. The only addition to Revan will be a voice over that will be determined by his/her gender.

Edit: Add:
Oh wait. In KotOR I, Revan did have a voice over.

stingerhs
02-08-2006, 07:55 PM
^^^^
and you can do that without having to play as Revan and the Exile. it wouldn't be out of the scope of a story to include Revan or the Exile at some point as NPC's.

Jackel
02-08-2006, 07:55 PM
Originally Posted by Kreia
The room of the silver fountains remains empty, because there are no Jedi.

Surely, you must remember these words. So that means that there will be NO Republic or Jedi Order to be in crisis in the first place. The only option that remains is to get the two characters that want to fight against the True Sith: Revan and Ry'ghol.

"No Jedi". Yet we find Jedi through the game. Seems like someone was doing a little bit of lying there. No Jedi indeed. So what were Vrook, Zal etc if not Jedi.

Vladimir-Vlada
02-08-2006, 08:04 PM
Yes, but they all ended up dead, now didn't they?

Jackel
02-08-2006, 08:22 PM
Yes the council ended up dead bur when Kreia said there was no Jedi there was. She is a lier. So who knows how many more Jedi are still hanging around.

Vladimir-Vlada
02-08-2006, 08:24 PM
As far as I remember; after the Jedi Masters were killed, the Exile was the only Jedi in the Galaxy. She may be a liar, but the Exile is still the only Jedi left.

JediMaster12
02-08-2006, 10:53 PM
Those three she killed at Dantooine were not the only ones. Remember Vrook and Zez Kai Ell said that they have scattered. The devs only put those significant few in because they were pertinent to the story. You hear alot in EU about how there were Jedi hidden from the galaxy. Jolee himself was "lost" in the woods for forty years or something like that.

RedHawke
02-09-2006, 01:35 AM
RedHawke, I don't want to insult you or be in conflict with you. I respect you, but please let's not take this too personally.
Where did this come from? :eyeraise:

My statements are quite valid. The Exile's story is done with the Death of Kreia.

According to the entire calculus, the Republic will collapse in, approximatley, one month. Mainly due to the lack of both law integrity and economic crisis.
G0-T0's quote is an appraisal of what happens if things progress as they had been, once the Sith Lords were defeated the problems to the Republic would diminish, it would take time to rebuild things. G0-T0 was a patriot of sorts who wanted galactic stability he didn't care if it were Jedi or Sith stability.

The room of the thousand fountains remains empty, because there are no Jedi.
Kreia's quote is taken entirely out of context, as that is from earlier in the game. The Jedi were all in hiding at that point. The Order is fractured, but not gone. See Jackel's posts above.

I have said all I need to. Your choice of questions prove to me that you haven't played the game nearly enough to figure out what is actually going on, especially at the end. Or else you just want to argue for fun. :xp:

JediMaster12
02-09-2006, 03:19 AM
I think some like a good argument RedHawke; they can't live without it :D

I believe I said something similar that not all the Jedi were gone and I've pointed out the fact that they were scattered. We have lots of tales in EU about Jedi that escaped from the Emperor or were lost.

As to G0-T0, he compared the Republic to a dejarik boards where one cannot see the opponent. I took that to mean he was making a comparison to the darkness manifesting beyond the Outer Rim. Then again he said he liked predictable games after all he was a droid and droids operate in calculations and binary codes. Still even Kreia referred to the events as a game of dejarik.
No game of dejarik can be won without pawns and this may prove to be a very long game-Kreia

Vladimir-Vlada
02-09-2006, 07:31 AM
G0-T0 was a patriot of sorts who wanted galactic stability he didn't care if it were Jedi or Sith stability.
But in the end there were no Jedi or Sith, right? So the Republic will most likely fall. And the only thing that could happen is that the True Sith form an Empire.

Kreia's quote is taken entirely out of context, as that is from earlier in the game. The Jedi were all in hiding at that point. The Order is fractured, but not gone.
You sound like that instead of a few, there are thousands of Jedi that survived. It was stated clearly in the game several times that most of the Jedi were killed during the war and, after that, slaughtered on Katharr.

JediMaster12
02-09-2006, 01:10 PM
The planet is Katarr. The ones that weren't killed during the Jedi Civil War ended up switching off the lightsabers. The bounty didn't help either. I don't think RedHawke was implying that there were thousands still left. Not many were left but they were in hiding. I know that Dorak and Zhar died on Katarr but nothing said about Vandar so there is the possibility that there were others besides those on the council.

Diego Varen
02-09-2006, 01:21 PM
I'm pretty sure that he died on Katarr as well JediMaster12. Otherwise he died on KOTOR if you were Dark Side.

JediMaster12
02-09-2006, 02:49 PM
True I suppose but I just don't buy it that it was just those we see on the holovid in TSL. There had to have been more but as Atton said, they switched off the lightsabers. Of course there are the Lost Jedi that the Exile trained but you know *shrugs shoulder*

Vladimir-Vlada
02-09-2006, 02:51 PM
I know that Dorak and Zhar died on Katarr but nothing said about Vandar so there is the possibility that there were others besides those on the council.

I know. But there are still not enough to bring back the Jedi Order and the Republic.

igyman
02-09-2006, 04:03 PM
@JediMaster12:
Actually Vandar did die on Katarr, one of the Jedi Masters (I don't remember which one at this point) says so in your conversation with him.

@Vladimir-Vlada:
1) There are plenty of them to restore the Jedi Order. All the other Jedi who were in hiding during TSL, Bastila and all your TSL party members who became Jedi.

2) The Republic will not fall until Palpatine (Darth Sidious) turns it into his Galactic Empire. That's the Star Wars universe history - the Old Republic, before the Galactic Empire and the New Republic, after Palpatine's death and the destruction of the second Death Star.

Vladimir-Vlada
02-09-2006, 04:11 PM
1) There are plenty of them to restore the Jedi Order. All the other Jedi who were in hiding during TSL, Bastila and all your TSL party members who became Jedi.
Who says that the party members will continue? And most of all, how would they manage to rebuild everything if the enemy already won?

2) The Republic will not fall until Palpatine (Darth Sidious) turns it into his Galactic Empire. That's the Star Wars universe history - the Old Republic, before the Galactic Empire and the New Republic, after Palpatine's death and the destruction of the second Death Star.
It doesn't have to be absolute. Two or five years can easily be forgotten after fourt thousand years. The archives of the Republic aren't always complete, you know.

igyman
02-09-2006, 04:25 PM
The enemy lost - the three Sith Lords that were hunting down the Jedi were defeated.
The Jedi Temple on Coruscant remains intact, all the Jedi have to do is to return there.

Darth InSidious
02-09-2006, 05:14 PM
...All the holocrons are missing, the galaxy hates the Jedi.

igyman
02-09-2006, 05:21 PM
The galaxy doesn't hate the Jedi (if you think that because the people of Dantooine hate them the whole galaxy hates them too, you are wrong) and what holocrons are you talking about? The ones Atris took to Telos were Sith holocrons.

P.S. This is my 100th post, hurray for me!:cheers:

Darth InSidious
02-09-2006, 06:03 PM
Not just on Dantooine, but on Nar Shadaa, Onderon, Telos, Peragus....just about every planet, in fact.

igyman
02-09-2006, 06:09 PM
Nar Shadaa? They were hunted by bounty hunters there, the people of Nar Shadaa don't hate them, though.
Peragus? The logs show that some workers wanted to sell the Exile to the Exchange and some were against it. Greed doesn't equal hate.
Onderon?? Telos???

JediMaster12
02-09-2006, 06:30 PM
True. In the words of Yoda, "Fear leads to anger, anger leads to hate, hate leads to suffering." The administration even laid down the law at Peragus that the Exile wasn't to be sold. The way I see it, people viewed the Jedi with suspicion or greed. To get back on topic, I believe I said I wanted a new PC.

Jae Onasi
02-09-2006, 07:38 PM
New PC.
I don't want poor Revan to have to lose his/her memory and force powers _again_! :-)

From a player point of view:
1. I want to try a new character. I've already played Revan and Exile. If I want to play them again, I can go back and play those games. While I do want to find out what happens to Revan/Exile in K3, I'm perfectly content to let my own character find out their story as a part of the game. That way, I don't have to deal with the 'lost the force issue'--I can just start as a new Padawan with incredible force potential who gets training and then goes out to save/conquer the universe.
2. I don't want someone pre-determining skills/feats/alignment/etc. for me on Revan or Exile, and the writers would have to do that to a certain extent. I sure don't want to spend an hour at the beginning of K3 building out Revan or Exile to get to the game. When TSL came out, I couldn't wait to get past the character creation screen and into the game itself, and I know I'll feel the same in K3. When K3 finally does come out, I don't want to spend a ton of time creating the character at the beginning based on who I thought my ideal Revan/Exile was in the first 2 games.
3. The game needs to be relatively stand-alone so that you can play K3 without having to have played the first 2. Not every player who will play K3 will have played 1 or 2 first. There are any number of people who have played TSL without having played K1 first. TSL and K3 are not modules of K1, they're separate games. These new players aren't going to have a clue on how to build out a Revan or Exile if they've never played those games before. While the games can be linked in a small (or not-so-small) way story-wise, they still need to all be independent games.

From a writing point of view--writing dialog trees is challenging. If you put Revan _or_ the Exile in the story, you have to come up with 4 variations of some dialog (M/F, DS/LS). If you have both Revan _and_ Exile, you have to have 16 variations of some dialog (four squared--if you draw out diagrams for each permutation, it's easier to picture). While I'm not a professional writer, I do enjoy writing to some degree, but I would find it really boring to write 16 versions of the same dialog in some places to accommodate the multiple choices and then try to write responses based on all 16 choices. If you have multiple responses to 16 different possibilities, it rapidly becomes a nightmare to write and track everything and maintain good story continuity. It's much easier to come up with a new 'clean' story that can stand on its own with or without Revan/Exile info, and then add some Revan/Exile stories in for those of us who've played before to satisfy our curiosity on how their stories played out.

Do I want to find out what happens with Revan/Exile? You bet. However, I want my own new character to go off adventuring in new ways. The SW galaxy's a big place with lots of cool things to do and people to meet. I don't want to be locked in to someone else's idea of who/what Revan and Exile were.

Vladimir-Vlada
02-09-2006, 07:41 PM
The galaxy doesn't hate the Jedi (if you think that because the people of Dantooine hate them the whole galaxy hates them too, you are wrong)
Actally, everyone does hate the Jedi. It was stated at many places... Especially on Nar Shadaa.

RedHawke
02-09-2006, 10:40 PM
But in the end there were no Jedi or Sith, right? So the Republic will most likely fall. And the only thing that could happen is that the True Sith form an Empire.

You sound like that instead of a few, there are thousands of Jedi that survived. It was stated clearly in the game several times that most of the Jedi were killed during the war and, after that, slaughtered on Katharr.
There happen to likely be far more than one surviving Jedi in the time of TSL. The Jedi went into hiding, hiding means no one knows you are there. Aspects of this will have to be explained in KotOR III yes, but it is far easier to do this story-wise than you think. ;)

I know. But there are still not enough to bring back the Jedi Order and the Republic.
Stop it man you are killing me! :rofl: Seriously this is pure comedy! :lol:

If we know anything about Star Wars it would be that only one Jedi needs to survive for the Order to come back... :lol:

In the case of KotOR II:TSL not all Jedi are confirmed dead, only rumored dead, there is a big difference.

The Source
02-09-2006, 11:25 PM
New PC.
I don't want poor Revan to have to lose his/her memory and force powers _again_! :-)

From a player point of view:
1. I want to try a new character. I've already played Revan and Exile. If I want to play them again, I can go back and play those games. While I do want to find out what happens to Revan/Exile in K3, I'm perfectly content to let my own character find out their story as a part of the game. That way, I don't have to deal with the 'lost the force issue'--I can just start as a new Padawan with incredible force potential who gets training and then goes out to save/conquer the universe.
2. I don't want someone pre-determining skills/feats/alignment/etc. for me on Revan or Exile, and the writers would have to do that to a certain extent. I sure don't want to spend an hour at the beginning of K3 building out Revan or Exile to get to the game. When TSL came out, I couldn't wait to get past the character creation screen and into the game itself, and I know I'll feel the same in K3. When K3 finally does come out, I don't want to spend a ton of time creating the character at the beginning based on who I thought my ideal Revan/Exile was in the first 2 games.
3. The game needs to be relatively stand-alone so that you can play K3 without having to have played the first 2. Not every player who will play K3 will have played 1 or 2 first. There are any number of people who have played TSL without having played K1 first. TSL and K3 are not modules of K1, they're separate games. These new players aren't going to have a clue on how to build out a Revan or Exile if they've never played those games before. While the games can be linked in a small (or not-so-small) way story-wise, they still need to all be independent games.

From a writing point of view--writing dialog trees is challenging. If you put Revan _or_ the Exile in the story, you have to come up with 4 variations of some dialog (M/F, DS/LS). If you have both Revan _and_ Exile, you have to have 16 variations of some dialog (four squared--if you draw out diagrams for each permutation, it's easier to picture). While I'm not a professional writer, I do enjoy writing to some degree, but I would find it really boring to write 16 versions of the same dialog in some places to accommodate the multiple choices and then try to write responses based on all 16 choices. If you have multiple responses to 16 different possibilities, it rapidly becomes a nightmare to write and track everything and maintain good story continuity. It's much easier to come up with a new 'clean' story that can stand on its own with or without Revan/Exile info, and then add some Revan/Exile stories in for those of us who've played before to satisfy our curiosity on how their stories played out.

Do I want to find out what happens with Revan/Exile? You bet. However, I want my own new character to go off adventuring in new ways. The SW galaxy's a big place with lots of cool things to do and people to meet. I don't want to be locked in to someone else's idea of who/what Revan and Exile were.
I knew I hired you as editor for some reason.... :yeldance:

Vladimir-Vlada
02-10-2006, 07:49 AM
There happen to likely be far more than one surviving Jedi in the time of TSL. The Jedi went into hiding, hiding means no one knows you are there. Aspects of this will have to be explained in KotOR III yes, but it is far easier to do this story-wise than you think. ;)
What do you mean by story-wise?

If we know anything about Star Wars it would be that only one Jedi needs to survive for the Order to come back...
Yes. Under the condition that it has an armada and army to support it. And under the condition that the one Jedi agrees to restore it (which in this case, didn't happen. Since the Exile left to fight).

In the case of KotOR II:TSL not all Jedi are confirmed dead, only rumored dead, there is a big difference.
I see... First there was the Great Sith War, which weakened them all in the first place. Then there was the Great hunt, to stop terentatek from eating the Jedi. Then there was the Mandalorian war, in which a third of (leftovers of) the Jedi Order to fight, in which also many Jedi died. Then there was the Jedi Civil War, in which were Jedi specifically killed along with millions of people. Then there were the slaughteres made by the remenants of the Sith. Then there was the slaughter on Katarr. Then there was the bounty and finally, the final assault of the Sith.
And after all that, there are still Jedi remaining.

Yeah. Those Jedi sure are invincible, aren't they? Better open a hunting season now. :p

Bastila
02-10-2006, 08:00 AM
I want to go back to being Revan and having the same party members and finsih the whole KOTOR stroy and maybe see the Exile on the way as well.

Eelyn Tikalm
02-10-2006, 04:11 PM
Hey guys!

{snip}This is an English language forum - Darth333

igyman
02-10-2006, 04:41 PM
@Vladimir-Vlada:
You seem to be forgetting Bastila. No, she isn't dead, she appeared in TSL on Citadel Station with Carth after the destruction of the Ravager (if you choose the LS KoTOR ending), or in that Sith holocron on Korriban (if you choose the DS ending), although in this version she doesn't appear personally in the game.

Yeah, I know what you're going to say: If KoTOR 1 had a DS ending then Bastila isn't a Jedi, but a Sith. Well, here's my answer - If that is the case (which I sincerely doubt), then we'll just have to rely on one of the Exile's party members, probably the Disciple/Handmaiden, or even Bao-Dur, if not on the surviving Jedi.

And when speaking of the surviving Jedi - you were somewhat sceptic about the Jedi being able to survive the wars, the Sith and the bounty hunters. How many Jedi do you think there were, since according to you all these events wiped them out completely? What do you think how many Jedi defied the Council and joined Revan and Malak and how many didn't? How can then be possible for the Jedi Order to still exist in the time of Obi-Wan and Anakin?

The Jedi are first of all smart. They know how to stay hidden and how to survive. How do you think Yoda and Obi-Wan managed to stay alive all those years under the Empire?

P.S. Al' kidam ovaj engleski, a?

Vladimir-Vlada
02-10-2006, 07:42 PM
You seem to be forgetting Bastila. No, she isn't dead, she appeared in TSL on Citadel Station with Carth after the destruction of the Ravager (if you choose the LS KoTOR ending), or in that Sith holocron on Korriban (if you choose the DS ending), although in this version she doesn't appear personally in the game.
Bastila Shan? She can't even buy a weapon without consulting someone. You saw her.

Yeah, I know what you're going to say: If KoTOR 1 had a DS ending then Bastila isn't a Jedi, but a Sith. Well, here's my answer - If that is the case (which I sincerely doubt), then we'll just have to rely on one of the Exile's party members, probably the Disciple/Handmaiden, or even Bao-Dur, if not on the surviving Jedi.
We could conut on the Handmaiden/Disciple, but Bao-Dur... I doubt it.

And when speaking of the surviving Jedi - you were somewhat sceptic about the Jedi being able to survive the wars, the Sith and the bounty hunters. How many Jedi do you think there were, since according to you all these events wiped them out completely? What do you think how many Jedi defied the Council and joined Revan and Malak and how many didn't? How can then be possible for the Jedi Order to still exist in the time of Obi-Wan and Anakin?
Anything can happen in 4000 years.

The Jedi are first of all smart. They know how to stay hidden and how to survive. How do you think Yoda and Obi-Wan managed to stay alive all those years under the Empire?
Because they didn't have a choice.

igyman
02-10-2006, 09:00 PM
Bastila Shan? She can't even buy a weapon without consulting someone. You saw her.

Well, I wouldn't exactly say that, but she is a little too arrogant for her own good (That's why I enjoyed annoying her).

We could conut on the Handmaiden/Disciple, but Bao-Dur... I doubt it.

Why not Bao-Dur? You train him into a Jedi, too. Yeah, he is more interested in mechanics, but a lot can change in a few years.

Anything can happen in 4000 years.

Yes, anything can happen, but if the Jedi Order is wiped out in this time, it can't just magically resurrect out of absolutely nothing.

Darth333
02-10-2006, 11:09 PM
I had to edit/delete about 15 posts in this thread... Keep it to English guys!

There are people from all around the world here and we can't let everybody speak in their own language (and that includes me ;) ) or it would become very messy. The common language here has to remain English. If you want to speak Croatian, Serbian, French, Spanish, Japanese or whatever, use the PM system or do it somewhere else.

RedHawke
02-11-2006, 12:37 AM
@ Vlad, I strongly suggest you actually attempt to play the game alot more before commenting further on this topic. Your apparent lack of actually playing the game, and your reliance on Wiki sites to tell you what was "supposed to happen in TSL" is severely clouding your judgement. ;)

Clone L68362
02-11-2006, 01:30 AM
Uh, just a quick question for all of you that want a new character. Say they manage to make a story that makes sense, and you play as Revan. Would you rather play as him or some new character. This is hypothetical...I really don't think it can be done, as I've said before, but I want to know if everyone agrees that Revan is one of the coolest characters ever.

Hey, post 300. Woot.

Vladimir-Vlada
02-11-2006, 06:04 AM
@ Vlad, I strongly suggest you actually attempt to play the game alot more before commenting further on this topic. Your apparent lack of actually playing the game, and your reliance on Wiki sites to tell you what was "supposed to happen in TSL" is severely clouding your judgement. ;)
You're right. I'll play it thorugh again, starting now. But don't blame me if I find something that doesn't cling to your version of what happened. :xp:

Say they manage to make a story that makes sense, and you play as Revan. Would you rather play as him or some new character.
How come I didn't think of this question?

I really don't think it can be done, as I've said before, but I want to know if everyone agrees that Revan is one of the coolest characters ever.
I agree. I was very impressed with him.

Hallucination
02-11-2006, 12:59 PM
I'd still like to play as a new character, Revan's ship has sailed, and I don't want it coming back, even though I loved playing as Revan.

Darca Lar
02-11-2006, 07:07 PM
id like to play as a whole new character, and have another history in this story

igyman
02-11-2006, 07:21 PM
Uh, just a quick question for all of you that want a new character. Say they manage to make a story that makes sense, and you play as Revan. Would you rather play as him or some new character. This is hypothetical...I really don't think it can be done, as I've said before, but I want to know if everyone agrees that Revan is one of the coolest characters ever.

Hey, post 300. Woot.

Well, if it means anything the guy that started this thread - ME - agrees that Revan should be the main character in KoTOR 3 - why - because the story in KoTOR revolves around him and no new character can end that story better than Revan himself.

Phaedra36
02-11-2006, 07:32 PM
Ok I understand also why you want to try something new.. but.. this series seems like a movie so hypothetically speaking..
Why would you want a different main character each story? I don't think the Star Wars movies would have done half as good if it was not centered on first Luke and then on Anakin.
I mean I know a movie is different from a video game, but I was just wondering :)

Point Man
02-12-2006, 12:12 AM
Ok I understand also why you want to try something new.. but.. this series seems like a movie so hypothetically speaking..
Why would you want a different main character each story? I don't think the Star Wars movies would have done half as good if it was not centered on first Luke and then on Anakin.
I mean I know a movie is different from a video game, but I was just wondering :)
A series of movies can all be about one main character. That is a major strength of movie series. You get to see the character develop. However, playing a role playing game is a vastly different experience. In a RPG you start out at a low level and build yourself up. That is a major part of the fun (along with the interactions with NPC's). You cannot do that if you recycle an old character. While there is fun in maintaining a character over a long period of time, that is better suited to a table-top RPG. The limitations that a computer-based RPG bring to the game necessitate beginning each new game with a new PC.

RedHawke
02-12-2006, 02:19 AM
A series of movies can all be about one main character. That is a major strength of movie series. You get to see the character develop. However, playing a role playing game is a vastly different experience. In a RPG you start out at a low level and build yourself up. That is a major part of the fun (along with the interactions with NPC's). You cannot do that if you recycle an old character. While there is fun in maintaining a character over a long period of time, that is better suited to a table-top RPG. The limitations that a computer-based RPG bring to the game necessitate beginning each new game with a new PC.
Well said jimbo! :D

Diego Varen
02-12-2006, 05:52 AM
I said to be a new Character for a change. I don't want to be an ex-Sith Lord or be the Exile who just travelled around the Galaxy for ten years. I want a new Character for many reasons. Someone who isn't overall famous to KOTOR story. The new Character should learn the ways of the Jedi and go to find Revan and the Exile in the Unknown Regions.

Phaedra36
02-12-2006, 01:36 PM
A series of movies can all be about one main character. That is a major strength of movie series. You get to see the character develop. However, playing a role playing game is a vastly different experience. In a RPG you start out at a low level and build yourself up. That is a major part of the fun (along with the interactions with NPC's). You cannot do that if you recycle an old character. While there is fun in maintaining a character over a long period of time, that is better suited to a table-top RPG. The limitations that a computer-based RPG bring to the game necessitate beginning each new game with a new PC.

Ok, I get your point but another thing. Playing as a third pc is going to cause even more complications because of the simple fact of all the different conversations for LS F R, LS F R, etc. etc. Plus, voice acting. So there would be an extra 4 voice actors because many people still want Revan and Exile to be a major part of the game and so I assuming they either a) want them in their party or b) want them as a major npc..
But anyway, the only way I can think of it that would seem to work out (for party member unless people think of a better one) is pick a teacher when you become an apprentice. And there would be three different teachers and if you pick the Exile persay, then Revan and the other teacher (guessing it could be another person, probably Bastila to fill the 3rd place..about time she became a Jedi or Sith master >.>) would just be main npc's..

Hallucination
02-12-2006, 01:47 PM
...and so I assuming they either a) want them in their party or b) want them as a major npc..
In my case, you assumed wrong. How would having Revan in your party work out? Would it be like Kreia, no matter what you equip them with they still look exactly the same? If they were major NPCs what would they look like? I just want to have them referred to alot, and then you find out what happened to them.

Phaedra36
02-12-2006, 01:54 PM
In my case, you assumed wrong. How would having Revan in your party work out? Would it be like Kreia, no matter what you equip them with they still look exactly the same? If they were major NPCs what would they look like? I just want to have them referred to alot, and then you find out what happened to them.
Character customization >.> I rather just play Revan or the Exile to be honest.. But yeah, K2 did it like that for 3 characters anyway..Visas, Mandalore, and Kreia. If you think about it, why did the Exile want to get Nihilus' mask? I know it was supposed to be explained in TSL, but they cut that out so it could be anything now. Perhaps Exile and Revan will just wear those costumes (even though that would be kinda silly?) I dunno.. I am just speculating.
And if you just heard tales of what they did, tell me how would you plan on finishing their storylines with Carth/Bastila, etc.? At the end of K3, I just want to feel closure to every major person's story, you know?

Vladimir-Vlada
02-12-2006, 02:43 PM
If they were major NPCs what would they look like?
They would look like the way the developers thinks they look like. Just like party members were created. If someone doesn't like the face models, someone will mod it.

Character customization
Or that. Both variants work (will work).

igyman
02-13-2006, 02:39 PM
OK, character customization for Revan and Exile as NPC's:
- could work, but I doubt the developers would bother with that. If they don't give us back Revan/Exile as the main character, then Revan/Exile won't appear at all. They will only be mentioned (but I still hope they give us back Revan as the main character and not just invent some story about what happened to him and let us hear it).

JediMaster12
02-13-2006, 06:46 PM
Still what if they followed the same format as TSL, based on your answers you get the gender and alignment of both. It sounds bothersome I know but it seems to fit in for those who want a new PC and could help finish the Revan storyline.

igyman
02-13-2006, 06:54 PM
My previous post still stands - if they don't bring either of the two back as main characters, then the only chance of actually seeing any of them will be a vision (where they will wear masks, so you don't see their faces), but the most likely possibility is that you will hear some lame story of what happened to them (If Revan/Exile don't get to be main characters again).

Vladimir-Vlada
02-13-2006, 07:09 PM
It sounds bothersome I know but it seems to fit in for those who want a new PC and could help finish the Revan storyline.
There is a reason why it is called the Revan storyline, you know.

but the most likely possibility is that you will hear some lame story of what happened to them
Sadly, it seems like that we will.

Phaedra36
02-13-2006, 08:24 PM
My previous post still stands - if they don't bring either of the two back as main characters, then the only chance of actually seeing any of them will be a vision (where they will wear masks, so you don't see their faces), but the most likely possibility is that you will hear some lame story of what happened to them (If Revan/Exile don't get to be main characters again).
God, I hope not :(. This is the probably the last of the Revan series, I have high expectations for it.

andyfed83
02-13-2006, 09:21 PM
I think a new character would be cool. I mean, not to say Revan or Exile are dumb ideas, I just think a new game should be fresh. If I had my way, I would incorporate some of the characters from both 1 and 2 and have the new character meet up with Revan or Exile, or both. They'd help "New Guy" with his(or her) quest, probably to stop the Sith since that seems to be the theme. They wouldn't be NPCs that the main character commands, but rather mentors or guides like Obi Wan was to Luke.

...Or maybe it could be Revan. Just have him(or her) start with "some" Force Powers, feats, and skills and play from there. Besides, I sure would like to where the "romance" part of the story goes.

Terrific85
02-14-2006, 01:22 PM
i agree with bolsen i want to be a pure jedi this time but at the start of my training, possibly a jedi padawan.:)

i agree with bolsen and john- maybe your master dies for the twist in the story....

Phaedra36
02-14-2006, 01:54 PM
Well I don't care how they handle with the Exile and Revan, as long as they finish everyone's story that is connected to them. Carth,Bastila,Atton,etc. Ultimately I think they should still just be a major npc, but I guess be in some kind of robes to disguise themselves from the True Sith or something. I would like a few cutscenes wrapping up a story between Revan and the Exile's respective storylines with the major characters of I and II.

igyman
02-14-2006, 02:39 PM
I think a new character would be cool. I mean, not to say Revan or Exile are dumb ideas, I just think a new game should be fresh.

While I agree that the game should be fresh, I don't think a new (third) main character is necessary to make the game fresh - it can be fresh with an old main character and a great storyline.

If I had my way, I would incorporate some of the characters from both 1 and 2 and have the new character meet up with Revan or Exile, or both. They'd help "New Guy" with his(or her) quest, probably to stop the Sith since that seems to be the theme. They wouldn't be NPCs that the main character commands, but rather mentors or guides like Obi Wan was to Luke.

I'm starting to see a pattern here. You are not the first one to propose that idea, but all of you who want this just don't realize how illogical it is to put a character around which the entire story revolves in a side role.

...Or maybe it could be Revan. Just have him(or her) start with "some" Force Powers, feats, and skills and play from there. Besides, I sure would like to where the "romance" part of the story goes.

Yes, definitely. You could start as Revan that way - customize him/her all the way to choosing the force powers (you'd get level 20 at the beginning of the game) and attributes, then you play a small part of the game that way and in the end the main Sith villain drains you of your powers (check out my storyline idea at ''What would be the beginning of your version of the KOTOR 3 story?'' thread) and you are forced to start from level 1 (as you should).

JediMaster12
02-14-2006, 04:02 PM
We could start with Revan but then we would have to figure out where to start because Revan is supposed to be somewhere in the Unknown Regions and the Exile went to go help. That is one of the reasons that I voted for a new PC and the other was that I couldn't justify how to start with a level one Revan. Reading these posts have enlightened me to some ideas but I'm still not convinced that it is justified enough. I've read very little about the Exile and found that some want to kill him off right away. That blows in my opinion but still my same reasons apply to the Exile if say we were to start with the Exile instead of Revan.

igyman
02-14-2006, 04:10 PM
@JediMaster12
I've already figured out where to start. Remember my Dark Planet thing?
There's an updated version of that idea at ''What would be the beginning of your version of the KOTOR 3 story?'' thread, if you're interested.

Vladimir-Vlada
02-14-2006, 04:15 PM
That is one of the reasons that I voted for a new PC and the other was that I couldn't justify how to start with a level one Revan.
I understand that you are sceptic about Revan or the Exile starting as level 1. I agree about the Exile, the easiest place to put him in is as a party member. But you can see that there are tons of explanations of how Revan became level 1. He could have been captured and tortured (igyman's as far as I remember). Maybe Nilhus syphoned the Force out of him, nearly killing him (this one was my idea). And so on and so on.

igyman
02-14-2006, 04:18 PM
He could have been captured and tortured (igyman's as far as I remember).

Not exactly captured, but you could say tortured.

JediMaster12
02-14-2006, 05:03 PM
I understand that you are sceptic about Revan or the Exile starting as level 1. I agree about the Exile, the easiest place to put him in is as a party member. But you can see that there are tons of explanations of how Revan became level 1. He could have been captured and tortured (igyman's as far as I remember). Maybe Nilhus syphoned the Force out of him, nearly killing him (this one was my idea). And so on and so on.

Maybe. I'm just putting too much thought into this and I might blow a brain gasket. :D Those are valid explanations. I guess I just want to see someone new, one who has possibly gone through the restoration on the Outer Rim worlds and maybe remembers the Exile and learns of Revan or it could be the other way around. That was an idea I was toying with for awhile and I thought it the most plausible, IMO, since Revan and the Exile where suppose to 'disappear' into the Unknown Regions. Who knows? I'm just a rambling 21 year old fool who doesn't know anything. :D

igyman
02-14-2006, 05:21 PM
I'm not so sure they were supposed to disappear in the Unknown Regions, they definitely went there, though.

Aurora Merlow
02-15-2006, 09:41 AM
Would love to play as Revan again, that would be my preference. But even i who wants it badly has to admit the logistics just don't add up. There are ways to get around it as i've suggested like Baldurs Gate 1 and 2, but in the context of the Kotor story its just too hard. I won't be to disappointed if we get a new PC as long as the story is sound and we wrap up what happened to Revan and the Exile

JediMaster12
02-15-2006, 11:59 AM
I'm not so sure they were supposed to disappear in the Unknown Regions, they definitely went there, though.

Well the archives I read, whatever they are called, said that Revan did disappear and also mentioned that it was written that if the Ebon Hawk were to return, there would be disasterous consequences like a dark evil or something like that. That was before the blurbs that were part of TSL's storyline. Sooo I gues it comes to how history is interpretated Ja?

Vladimir-Vlada
02-15-2006, 12:03 PM
also mentioned that it was written that if the Ebon Hawk were to return, there would be disasterous consequences like a dark evil or something like that.
:confused: Where did you get this and what does it mean? :confused:

igyman
02-15-2006, 12:08 PM
Looks like it does. I just hope it gets interpreted my way (don't we all) - in favour of Revan being the main character in K3 (I know I'm becoming boring with this, but it has its purpose: you will all join the Revan Side in the end! Bwahahahahha!!!!)

JediMaster12
02-15-2006, 01:27 PM
@ Vlad: If I remember correctly it was at the official site for TSL. I can't remember how to get to it if it's still up but if I find it I'll let you know.


Edit: I found it and I misread it but here it is: http://www.lucasarts.com/games/swkotor_sithlords/indexLight.html
Its under Chronicles Part XII

Vladimir-Vlada
02-15-2006, 02:57 PM
Revan is focused with a single purpose: locating the source of the dark power on MALACHOR V. Those awaiting Revan's arrival, including members of the Sith and the Jedi, are shocked when he fails to return from this pilgrimage. It is unknown whether Revan destroyed or resurrected the primal Sith forces on this forbidden planetoid.
Hm... Seems like that this supports igiyman's and my theory. With just this, Revan can easily become a PC, starting level 1.

The other chronicles, seem to indicate towards something... Although I haven't read them all.

igyman
02-15-2006, 03:41 PM
I've seen those chronicles long ago, they do fill a few holes between KoTOR 1 and TSL.

Edit: People, you are voting, but you aren't posting your opinions. I've read a lot of similar opinions as to why we should play as a new character in KoTOR 3 and some reasons for playing as Revan, but there are some who voted for the Exile and I would like to hear their reasons for that choice.

igyman, please refrain from 'bumping' threads as it is against the rules, (http://www.lucasforums.com/showthread.php?t=150980) bumping a discussion topic for a content update is one thing, but posting about "people not posting when they vote" doesn't qualify as a reason for a 'bumping' double post. Please use the 'edit this' post function if you have the last post in a thread and wish to add something. Thanks. -RH

andyfed83
02-16-2006, 09:18 PM
Yes, definitely. You could start as Revan that way - customize him/her all the way to choosing the force powers (you'd get level 20 at the beginning of the game) and attributes, then you play a small part of the game that way and in the end the main Sith villain drains you of your powers (check out my storyline idea at ''What would be the beginning of your version of the KOTOR 3 story?'' thread) and you are forced to start from level 1 (as you should).

Dude, that's catchy! The Force Powers are drained and Revan is exhausted, so he go to the Unknown Region to recuperate and gain his strength. I don't know if that fits in with your storyline, but it was just a thought.

igyman
02-17-2006, 06:04 PM
If you've checked my storyline idea at the ''What would be the beginning of your version of the KoTOR 3 story?'' thread I'd be glad to hear your opinion on it.

khawk
03-03-2006, 10:42 AM
O Boy, every forum wants to close my threads. Well. Here goes:

Sorry that I cannot post it in a poll. Too many options. Well, everyone get the idea right. Who would you want to have as the PC in Kotor III. This poll is also in place at the obsidian and bioware boards.

1) Revan
2) The Exile
3) Revan’s son/daughter born during the Mandalorian wars
4) Revan’s son/daughter born after the Jedi Civil war
5) Darth Malak’s son/daughter
6) Kreia’s son/daughter
7) One of the True Sith (with pure Sith blood)
8) A Jedi padawan grown up on a Republic world or someone discovered by the Jedi order and taken in for training*
9) A force sensitive grown up in the Outer rim or in the Unknown regions (not discovered by the Jedi) *
10) A non force sensitive (an assassin / bounty hunter / mercenary etc.) *
11) Someone related to Bastila
12) A non force sensitive who found a force anomaly who transferred you into one of the most powerful Jedi of this age *
13) A wound in the force, created by the Exile
14) A Jedi who followed Revan during the Mandalorian Wars and became Sith.
15) The son/daughter of Saul Karath
16) A Mandalorian Jedi
17) Other suggestions are welcome, please indicate on this thread.

Well, a lot more options for a new character I would say.
The one's marked with a * gives the possibility to play as another species.

igyman
03-03-2006, 02:00 PM
Hmmm, there are some very interesting options on that list, but I don't think they're good for KoTOR 3, they are much better for KoTOR 4 (if there ever gets to be any), so I think I'll stick to my original opinion regarding the KoTOR 3 PC - it should be Revan.

khawk
03-03-2006, 03:33 PM
Hmmm, there are some very interesting options on that list, but I don't think they're good for KoTOR 3, they are much better for KoTOR 4 (if there ever gets to be any), so I think I'll stick to my original opinion regarding the KoTOR 3 PC - it should be Revan.

Thanks for your vote Igyman.
Your vote off course goes to 1) Revan

marvidchano
03-03-2006, 04:29 PM
I couldn't really give a damn but i'd rather play as Revan to see where he ends up how he ends up with bastila... what he does etc

andyfed83
03-05-2006, 09:46 PM
I like the idea of assassin\bounty hunter\mercenary. New classes are cool.But to have then non-force sensetive? Kinda defeats the purpose of the name: KNIGHTS of the Old Republic doesn't it?

RedHawke
03-05-2006, 11:05 PM
New classes are cool. But to have then non-force sensetive? Kinda defeats the purpose of the name: KNIGHTS of the Old Republic doesn't it?
Yes, yes it does... ;)

TiGroundcrawler
03-06-2006, 11:07 AM
I didn't read the posts coz im in a hurry, so sorry if im stealing someone opinons.
I think that it should be a new character, maybe a young boy/girl maybe 10-15 years old. you are found by a jedi ' exiled maybe' this jedi begins to train you as you are a force sensitive. Or maybe not. Just a thought.

Edit: A Jedi padawan grown up on a Republic world or someone discovered by the Jedi order and taken in for training. Totaly gets my vote.

Prime
03-06-2006, 11:32 AM
I like the idea of assassin\bounty hunter\mercenary. New classes are cool.But to have then non-force sensetive? Kinda defeats the purpose of the name: KNIGHTS of the Old Republic doesn't it?You are right. However, such a game focusing on non-force-sensatives would be a lot of fun IMO.

igyman
03-06-2006, 05:00 PM
Thanks for your vote Igyman.
Your vote off course goes to 1) Revan

My vote went to Revan long ago, since I'm the guy who started this thread.

You are right. However, such a game focusing on non-force-sensatives would be a lot of fun IMO.

It probably would, but it wouldn't be Knights.

Non-false Jedi
03-12-2006, 07:01 AM
I've been thiking, origionally i believe i voted for a new character, but maybe it would be better to play as the exile? His(her) story was completly cut off at the end of TSL, and it would solve the problem of creating too many pc faces. Adn i think both Revan and the Exile would have to be major characters, so i wonder if 3 pc-ish characters would be too many for the story?

Mandalorian BH
03-12-2006, 11:13 AM
I think that you should be a completely new character and have Revan or the exile or both as party members.

Diego Varen
03-16-2006, 02:41 AM
Originally I think you should be a new character, but I think you should be the Exile. Why? Because his/her Story isn't finished. There is a way to bring the Exile back to Level 1. You can say that he/she was injured during the battle with Traya. Also as I've seen in previous posts, maybe three PCs are too much. After TSL (LS Story), the Exile has dropped off all the NPC's on Coruscant to start a new Jedi Order, while he goes into the Unknown Regions with T3 and HK (Who are also back at Level 1). Then later if Female, you play as a Level 20 Atton/Disciple and if Male you play as Visas/Handmaiden to find a Ship to get to the Unknown Regions. In the Unknown Regions, the Exile could find new Party Members. All of them being Aliens. You could have a Chiss and a Rakatan in your Party. My new idea.

Renegade Puma
03-16-2006, 03:53 AM
New character. I want to be a REAL Jedi, at the start of my training. The Republic is now facing total extinction. So the Order sends me off to find Revan and The Exile, with the fate of the galaxy in my hands.

DarkLord152
03-16-2006, 09:08 PM
I say NPC cause you can start off fresh and be a Jedi Knight in the making.

Beast-Thrasher
04-03-2006, 10:18 PM
I want to be a new character from Alderaan that would be pretty sweet and then he gets picked up by say Mira who feels him/her through the force bla bla bla...

Angelos Kumani
04-03-2006, 10:28 PM
Here are my two ideas that I would like to see for the new PC character in KOTOR 3...

Light Side Back Story
After defeating Darth Traya the betrayer, the Exile was ready to silence the echo of Malachor, this time prepared for the consequencese of activating the Mass Shadow Generator for the second time. Although Goto had programmed his droid to intervene in the case that the General gave the order he did not count on the Exile ordering HK-47 to assist Bao Dur’s remote in achieving its final task. Together, Hk-47 and the remote were able to defeat Goto’s droid. HK-47 returned to the Exile with the news that all the preparations were made and the generator was ready to be activated. After gathering his friends and allies from the prisons of the Trayus Academy, the Exile was able to use the force to bring the Ebon Hawk back form the core of the planet. Once all were aboard and the Ebon Hawk was in the planet’s orbit, the Exile again gave the order to activate the Mass Shadow Generator to Bao Dur. At last, both would be able to put the demons of their past behind them. Bao Dur simply nodded and the task was done. The echo of Malachor that had spread across the galaxy was finally silenced. Knowing that he/she would have no other choice but to follow Revan, the Exile quietly mediated alone. After some time the Exile emerged to inform his/her friends that they would return to Coruscant to rebuild the jedi order. The Exile along with those that he had trained to feel the force would become the new council. Their first charge would be to reopen the jedi temple on Coruscant and then start the search for the remaining lost jedi. After arriving on Coruscant and opening the jedi temple, the Exile explained to the rest of the council that the time had come for their separation. Brianna, Atton, Mira, Visas Marr, Bao Dur and the Disciple were to remain behind and begin the search for the lost jedi. They would be charged with rebuilding the order and ensuring that republic was strong. The Exile’s path now followed Revan into the unknown regions – the only companion that the Exile would take was T3M4. Before leaving the Exile finds the first of the lost jedi for the council (this will be your player character), he/she was a young citizen of Coruscant that came to the temple because they felt unexplainably drawn there. Your journey begins with the description of the Exile to the council and why you were told to come before them. Accompanying you will be HK-47 who has been ordered by the Exile to assist (your character) in finding the HK-50 droid factory and ensuring that they do not continue to hunt jedi.

Dark Side Back Story
After crushing Kreia and feeding her body to the core of the planet, the Exile felt the rush of power, power that Malachor only gave to the strongest. It was within the rage of this storm that the Exile saw that his/her path was clear, he/she must find Revan. To do so the Exile would need to rip one of the graveyard ships form the orbit of Malchor to be his new vessel. But first he/she would need to deal with the weakness that his followers had exhibited, none had been able to stand against Kreia and none would be worthy to travel with him/her again. Their punishment would be the same; weakness, stagnation. Those that had failed to show their strength would remain behind on Malachor, but they would not become completely useless. After being released from the cells of the Trayus Academy; Atton, Brianna, Bao Dur, Hanharr, the Disciple, T3M4 and HK-47 would learn their fate. The Exile explained that only those with strength would accompany him/her on the next journey and they had all failed that test. He/She told them that the echo of Malachor was what gave them power, the power to spread across the galaxy and influence all those that heard the echo. It was from this power that they would remain useful to the Exile. In time he/she explained those that hear the echo will seek you out – remain here wait for them, when they come train them and make them strong. Let them feel the power of Malachor flow through their bodies and teach them how to use that power to gain all that they desire. The Exile had one final order for HK-47, the Exile stated that there would be a man/woman that would come to this place – they would be marked by the force (this is your player character). When they are trained travel with them find the HK-50 factory and destroy it, they could not afford to have rogue droids hunting down soldiers of the Exile’s army. As the Exile traveled to the surface he/she was joined by Goto’s droid – the only servant to show strength. Goto’s droid was successful in preventing Bao Dur’s remote from activiating the Mass Shadow Generator again. The droid’s reward was to travel with the Exile to find Revan.

ScieX
04-04-2006, 08:38 PM
Revan all the way... i hated the exile.

Beast-Thrasher
04-04-2006, 11:47 PM
Here are my two ideas that I would like to see for the new PC character in KOTOR 3...
(Edited for space)
I have to say that both your stories are awesome, thanks to you the LS ending to K2 makes sense. When the Ebon Hawk reappears it has just the exile using the Force and smoothing out the dents. Lol it makes more sense to me now thanks! Anywho Besides the story there is one thing that I want to point out is wrong Goto's droid is GO-TO. It isn't some guy that looks through what the droid is seeing on some planet far away. GO-TO is Goto it's just a droid. The droid looked at holograms of actors for his personality, if people knew GO-TO was just a droid they would of killed him long ago. If you don't believe me go to Wikipedia and you have to look for some GO-TO information but its there. I was kinda surprised when I read it but it does make sense after you read it and think about it.

I'm making my own story on how K3 should start, I totally forgot about the HK-50 factory. Heck I forgot about Jolee and Juhani before I went into the Force ghost thread.

Angelos Kumani
04-05-2006, 11:58 AM
@Beast-Thrasher

Thanks.

Of course those story lines would only work well for a continuation of the plot/storyline from TSL. IF, they decide to jump ahead in the time line again - not sure that it would work or apply well.

Also, I understand what you're saying about GO-TO > I still felt like the droid in your company was a representative of GO-TO's not Go-TO himself. I still think that GO-TO is a droid (an excellent assumption that I read on one of the forums is that GO-TO is the missing Ithorian Droid), but I don't think that he would threaten to destroy himself (check out the dialouge when the droid first appears).

KOTOR 3 (if made) has the potential to have a great story line - the basics are all there, they just need to finish the Revan/Exile story.

igyman
04-11-2006, 06:18 PM
New character. I want to be a REAL Jedi, at the start of my training. The Republic is now facing total extinction. So the Order sends me off to find Revan and The Exile, with the fate of the galaxy in my hands.

So, you're saying that Revan and the Exile weren't real Jedi?

Revan all the way... i hated the exile.

That's what I wanna hear (read)!

...IF, they decide to jump ahead in the time line again - not sure that it would work or apply well.

They most likely will jump ahead in the timeline, so I suggest rewriting your story, or making a new one about 1-5 years after TSL.

...I still think that GO-TO is a droid (an excellent assumption that I read on one of the forums is that GO-TO is the missing Ithorian Droid), but I don't think that he would threaten to destroy himself (check out the dialouge when the droid first appears).

It's not an assumption, it's fact! G0-T0 (Goto) is the missing Droid Intelligence, he admits that himself when you gain enough influence to confront him about that. It's also when G0-T0 admits that he IS Goto.

Angelos Kumani
04-11-2006, 07:34 PM
@Iggy...I never got that far influencing GOTO - didn't think that he was that great of a droid, when I went dark side and took a droid I always went with HK, much better to hear "meatbag" and "statement", etc. (at least gives me a reason to try to max out influence with Goto)...

igyman
04-12-2006, 05:33 PM
HK is definitely the best droid character is Star Wars! As for G0-T0, I didn't take him with me much, either, but at some point I decided to try to find out what he has to say.

Shato Khan
04-19-2006, 03:46 AM
deafantly reaven a new charcter is ok

The_Catto
04-19-2006, 11:59 AM
id prefer a new PC, start the game when starting your training at the rebuilt enclave at Dantooine(perhaps some Force Sensitives took refuge there and honed thier skills and decided to teach others aswell ... always a possibility), But make cameo's by revan and the exile through out the game, but not as party members, too strong to be a part of your party.

igyman
04-22-2006, 11:33 AM
...start the game when starting your training at the rebuilt enclave at Dantooine...

Why does everyone think the Dantooine enclave will be rebuilt. It won't! Kreia said so in both dark and light versions of Dantooine's future. If we get a new character and get to visit a Jedi academy, it is more likely that we will visit Coruscant.

bobogarcia
04-22-2006, 11:45 AM
I would like a new PC, but find out what happened to Revan. Maybe have a party member from 1 or 2 return

Dark Lord Revan
04-22-2006, 09:47 PM
Like Revan in Kotor but without the mind-wipe

A republic Soldeir who served in The mando wars with Revan and the Exile, then to set up the Class, jedi class. etc or revan and Exile another soldier asks him about the wars...of coarse there should be an option of nuetrality to get it rolling

Then later you become a jedi

There should also be 2 planets, along with others of coarse

1 for beong trained as a pure jedi, the other for pure sith...or something

zadi
04-22-2006, 10:15 PM
I still would like a two-part game ala Tomb Raider Legends. The main portion of the game with new characters and a new PC but the secondary part to be playable flashbacks of Revan right after s/he leaves Carth into the unknown and part be playable flashbacks of Exile after Malachore. In TRL during the flashbacks we get to play as Lara for a level to complete part of the story then it reverts to the present. It would be nice for KOTOR3 to have that and in certain worlds we get a playable flashback of either Revan and/or Exile on that world doing whatever they needed to get done. Make sense?

Atris2
04-22-2006, 10:34 PM
i would want a completely new character, its gets boring talking about revan and the exile non-stop

alanrha
04-23-2006, 01:12 AM
A new character. Building your character is is essential to an RPG. Both Revan and the Exile are powerfull characters at the end of the games. Reusing them would be forced, I mean does anybody want to see Revan or the Exile mindwiped or cut off from the Force again?

I completely concur.

tbl1
04-23-2006, 01:48 AM
i think this time it will be a new pc that starts his training as a new jedi or just finished it. The character has to be weak and neutral to start off with.

Darth InSidious
04-23-2006, 09:37 AM
ON the whole subject of amnesia/mindwipe, your character will have this regardless of whether they're Revan, the Exile or someone new. Otherwise, you'll be able to learn next-to-nothing about your character's personality - a la the Exile in TSL.

Blind Squirrel
05-05-2006, 02:01 PM
I think a new character is the way to go. The new character should tie in both Kotor1 and Kotor2. In my opinion, this could be done by making the new character the offspring of either Revan and Bastila or Revan and Carth depending on whether you chose to play as a male or as a female. Since all the Jedi masters are dead except for Atris (and she is deranged), the offspring would be sent off to find the Exile for training in the ways of the force.

Jasper_Kazai
05-05-2006, 03:22 PM
A new character. While I'd like to see Revan return (not sure about the Exile, haven't played TSL much), they'd have to power him down, and the story they'd have to come up with to power him down would probably be stupid. And he can't be a NPC... He's you.

RaV™
05-05-2006, 04:43 PM
Complete new character. If there was suppose to be a certain off spring, we'd have to find Revan and the rest in nursing homes.

igyman
05-06-2006, 05:50 PM
Anything, but an offspring! Please! If there is to be a new character, he, or she must be made from a better concept than this.

crimson_88
05-06-2006, 06:24 PM
You know, I was thinking, what if you could be Revan, the Exile, and a completley new character. Like you would start and finish the game off as a new character, but after you did that, it would be possible to play as either Revan or the Exile in a completley differn't story line until (if this even happens in the game) Revan or the Exile meet the new character. I think it would be pretty cool, and you would have 3 differn't story lines and multiple endings. What do you guys think?

Blind Squirrel
05-08-2006, 11:11 AM
It might be possible to play all three parts at different points in the game. Remember in Kotor2 on Telos when you as the Exile became B-4D4 in order to enter the Czerka mainframe to get the dirt on Jana Lorso? Portions of the Kotor3 game could be designed to allow you to also play Revan and the Exile for their respective roles in advancing the story.

Prime
05-08-2006, 12:08 PM
You know, I was thinking, what if you could be Revan, the Exile, and a completley new character. Like you would start and finish the game off as a new character, but after you did that, it would be possible to play as either Revan or the Exile in a completley differn't story line until (if this even happens in the game) Revan or the Exile meet the new character. I think it would be pretty cool, and you would have 3 differn't story lines and multiple endings. What do you guys think?Way too much effort/cost to create that kind of game. And it isn't much fun to build up a character only to have to play with another one for the rest of the game. Better to develop a more in indepth story for one character.

Lord_MalaKdoggk
05-08-2006, 02:38 PM
A new character only because my last 2 characters are both sith lords I wanna face them both at the end of k3 so I can become the one true sith lord (before palpatine's era)

igyman
05-12-2006, 05:05 PM
That's an even more subjective way of looking at things than mine (Revan all the way). When thinking of a new character you have to consider all the possibilities from TSL. Revan and Exile could have been males, or females, Sith Lords, or Jedi Masters. Until an official chronicle, or something is released we can only speculate on which combination of events is the right one.

Sanctuary
05-12-2006, 05:45 PM
Durge (http://www.starwars.com/databank/character/durge/index.html)

igyman
05-12-2006, 05:50 PM
Ummm... I think got the wrong thread when it comes to posting images.

crimson_88
05-28-2006, 06:14 PM
I wasn't saying that while your playin as a new character, you suddenly switch over to revan or the exile. I was saying that it would be like a bonus that after the main story you could play like a mini story of Revan or the exile.

Lord_Andre
05-29-2006, 07:11 AM
I voted for Revan,because it would be cool to have a master force user as a main character.In Kotor and Kotor TSL I understood why they were so weak at the begining, but now they are going after the real Sith and if your new enemies are comming to kill you what are you going to do? kill them with a Bothan stunner,no,we are going to kill them with Revan or the Exile. :vadar:

igyman
05-29-2006, 07:18 AM
... but now they are going after the real Sith and if your new enemies are comming to kill you what are you going to do? kill them with a Bothan stunner,no,we are going to kill them with Revan or the Exile. :vadar:

Exactly, though the main character will, one way, or the other, have to be reverted to level 1. Otherwise, what's the point of playing the game from the beginning with a level 50 (or so) character?

Lord_Andre
05-29-2006, 12:12 PM
Not necesarly Revan could start at level 20 or 25. :vadar:

Prime
05-29-2006, 12:32 PM
When thinking of a new character you have to consider all the possibilities from TSL. Not necessarily. There is nothing to say K3 has to have much if anything to do with the first games. Revan and the Exile could be mentioned in passing, without having them form the basis of a new story.

Not necesarly Revan could start at level 20 or 25.But that would kill most or all of the character development. And going to levels much higher than that is just munchkinism.

Arátoeldar
05-29-2006, 01:30 PM
Level one neutral padawan is what I want.

igyman
05-29-2006, 01:33 PM
Neutral, OK. New character, what for??

Diego Varen
05-29-2006, 01:34 PM
Neutral, OK. New character, what for??

For KOTOR III.

igyman
05-29-2006, 01:41 PM
Funny :xp:

I meant (for those with the urge to be funny) why would we need a third new character for KoTOR 3? A question I've already asked, but never got a satisfying answer.

Diego Varen
05-29-2006, 01:42 PM
1. For Character Development purposes.

2. Make it feel less like an expansion pack.

igyman
05-29-2006, 01:48 PM
Still not satisfied. And I'll never be, not until I hear a perfect reason as to why the story of Revan should not be finished by Revan, but instead with some third new face.

Diego Varen
05-29-2006, 01:52 PM
Still not satisfied. And I'll never be, not until I hear a perfect reason as to why the story of Revan should not be finished by Revan, but instead with some third new face.

Okay then. If it is a new Character, he/she could learn about Revan and then have dreams (visions) about him/her. It will show Revan doing things. If you meet him/her at the end, he/she can tell your new Character everything.

Atris2
05-29-2006, 02:51 PM
a completely new character that has a dark past

Diego Varen
05-29-2006, 03:06 PM
a completely new character that has a dark past

Sounds like Atton.

Hallucination
05-29-2006, 08:40 PM
But that would kill most or all of the character development. And going to levels much higher than that is just munchkinism.
Don't forget how annoying it would be to assign all those feats, skills, and force powers at once.

igyman
05-30-2006, 04:34 AM
No it wouldn't. Because you'd get new skills and feats in the new part of the game.

Cactus-Jack
05-30-2006, 06:07 AM
Hmm, i think it would be too hard to start you off as revan wouldnt it?

Unless it was along a similar theme, where revan had to travel aroudn 6 planets looking for the true sith/recruiting people to help him. But than that might feels a little too much like kotor1 and the star forge thing.

They could always have revan as a party member that you find? That way you travel as the new PC around a few planets recruiting peopel to help you in the search for revan, then you go and meet up with revan and join him in the fight against the true sith? But then that means giving him a voice, which might put people off. He would also need to wear his mask constantly to hide his face too.*

I wouldnt mind playing as revan again, but i think it might pose too many problems. How would they solve the problem of being level 1 again anyway?

I think i would personally like something along the lines of being recruited by the jedi order (which is being rebuilt, albiet slowly. Would be an excuse to bring back jolee for a bit-part as an old jedi ;) ). And the story would revolve around the jedi order trying to rebuild themselves to defend the galaxy against the new sith threat. Maybe even have the handmaiden/visas trainging jedi in an academy somewhere? (wasnt that the LS ending for k2?). But anyway, it could involve the jedi rebuilding their order, trying to build up ther number of jedi again to defand against the true sith, then you could either be sent/leave against their will to help revan/exile in the fight.

Having reven and the exiles fate shown in-game might be hard, maybe in one of the "big battles" scene against some of the true sith, you could see revan/exile fighting alongside other jedi.

Well, i totally went off on a tanget there, so i'll just stick with new PC as my answer ;)

*yes, i realise i referred to revan as "he" throughout this post :p

Lord_MalaKdoggk
05-31-2006, 12:22 PM
well, as the 'dark' Revan in K1 I killed off everyone in my party except (doh- mental block- whats her name ) in K3 it'd be nice if Revan and girly had baby and Revan trains baby to be like father, who then kills dad in climatic power struggle to be baddest baddie.
...who then has torrid affair with handmaiden and then K4

;)

igyman
05-31-2006, 02:53 PM
OH MAN!!! NOT AGAIN!!! WHY, OH WHY!?!? Why would you want a baby in the story?? That leaves a very big time gap between TSL ans KoTOR 3.

Prime
05-31-2006, 03:02 PM
Still not satisfied. And I'll never be, not until I hear a perfect reason as to why the story of Revan should not be finished by Revan, but instead with some third new face.Because the vast majority of players want to play a new character for all the reasons specified.

Lord_MalaKdoggk
05-31-2006, 03:26 PM
OH MAN!!! NOT AGAIN!!! WHY, OH WHY!?!? Why would you want a baby in the story?? That leaves a very big time gap between TSL ans KoTOR 3.

LoL, considering the gap between the first 3 films, and the 'original' films (SW:ANH,ESB,ROTJ) it's not unreasonable. And to train an 8-15 year old (child) character would explain why your character starts with no experience points AND would bring in a new genre to the game.

Clone L68362
05-31-2006, 04:15 PM
I've thought about this some more, and I've come to thinking that a new character is the only way to go, at least for most of the game. I'd like to see Revan later on, when you're more powerful, so that him being a level 20 whatever makes sense. Hopefully he joins as a party member or maybe you use him for a certain task, something.

RedHawke
06-01-2006, 12:04 AM
Hopefully he joins as a party member or maybe you use him for a certain task, something.
Won't happen for appearance issues...

Darth Manus
06-01-2006, 08:23 AM
Well, the appearance issue could be circumvented by keeping Revan in his usual robes, mask and all. But that would probably annoy some players.

Prime
06-01-2006, 12:46 PM
Well, the appearance issue could be circumvented by keeping Revan in his usual robes, mask and all. But that would probably annoy some players.It would annoy me. Why would my light side Revan go back to wearing his Sith Lord robes? And forcing him to do so would probably lead to me feeling he is no longer my character.

igyman
06-01-2006, 01:25 PM
LoL, considering the gap between the first 3 films, and the 'original' films (SW:ANH,ESB,ROTJ) it's not unreasonable. And to train an 8-15 year old (child) character would explain why your character starts with no experience points AND would bring in a new genre to the game.

Movies and video games are two very different things. You can make that kind of gap in a movie and tell the story properly, but it's a lot more difficult and less interesting to have it in a game. Why? Because, let's face it, most of the game we'll be playing as an adult, so why would we need to spend 1/8 (and probably less) of the game as a child? What's the point?

RedHawke
06-01-2006, 11:10 PM
It would annoy me. Why would my light side Revan go back to wearing his Sith Lord robes? And forcing him to do so would probably lead to me feeling he is no longer my character.
Exactly, and that is the Prime reason why I said what I said! ;)

I likely will need to pay some serious Pun Tax on this one! :xp:

witchfinder
06-04-2006, 03:17 PM
Hmm...I'd like to either play the Exile, and through a series of dialogue options, determine how Revan ended up, and then show him being killed off.

Clone L68362
06-04-2006, 08:05 PM
RedHawke, you made a mod that had a Star Forge-like version of Revan's Robes. Doesn't that look kinda LSish? They could always make some other kind of LS robe too.

Lord_MalaKdoggk
06-05-2006, 10:58 AM
Movies and video games are two very different things. You can make that kind of gap in a movie and tell the story properly, but it's a lot more difficult and less interesting to have it in a game. Why? Because, let's face it, most of the game we'll be playing as an adult, so why would we need to spend 1/8 (and probably less) of the game as a child? What's the point?

I suppose so, but as I've treated both k1 and k2 as seperate games with no connection to each other I was just assuming the same for the next game.

Besides, I have no intention of buying the next one until I play K2 with the restorations as I don't want to be disappointed again.

igyman
06-06-2006, 06:32 PM
Right, the Restoration Project. It's a little off topic, but does anyone know if it will be finished anytime soon?

Darth InSidious
06-07-2006, 04:53 PM
I am sure it will be finished within a time known as "soon" :D

@Lord_MalaKdoggk: How do you treat them as separate games with all the threads running between the two, linking them? Just curious to know how :)

Sith_Lord_Alzar
06-08-2006, 01:15 AM
it should be that the guy in the last game and visas or the handmaidan get married and have a kid and thats who yu play as

Hallucination
06-08-2006, 01:22 AM
Except for the fact that the Exile could also be female, and no matter how hard she and Visas/Handmaiden try, they won't be able to have a child. ;)

igyman
06-08-2006, 07:55 AM
:giggle1: Hallucination strikes again! :giggle1:

I think it's safe to say that we won't be seeing anybody's child in the potential KoTOR 3. A new character probably (unfortunately), but definitely no babies.

Prime
06-08-2006, 11:17 AM
Except for the fact that the Exile could also be female, and no matter how hard she and Visas/Handmaiden try, they won't be able to have a child. ;)You underestimate Star Wars technology!!

Lord_MalaKdoggk
06-08-2006, 12:49 PM
I am sure it will be finished within a time known as "soon" :D

@Lord_MalaKdoggk: How do you treat them as separate games with all the threads running between the two, linking them? Just curious to know how :)

It's all in MY head, but I could never get past re-using the ship.

gamr37
06-08-2006, 05:24 PM
I think you should start new and eventualy get Revan and/or The Exile in your party

SiTh_LoRd_ReVaN
06-11-2006, 02:38 AM
i agree with so many of you, getting a new character and building them up! i would LUV to see Revan and the Exile joining the party tho, jus because they are a big part of the series! Could be possible to see that but who knows!?!