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Admiral
03-27-2001, 10:25 PM
I have been wondering who do we know that it goes against the laws of physics the things can go faster then the speed of light.

I know about the experiments on who they tried to get light to move faster by going towards it a source (something like that) but if you think about it, there is a possiblity that the speed of light can only be a constant or something similar to water were the solid form is lighter the the liquid.... What are your thought.

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"Dulce bellum inexpertis."
(Sweet is war to those who have never experinced it.) Roman Proverb

Admiral Zaarin
03-27-2001, 10:33 PM
*tries to think about it, brain short-circuits*

Poor Bastard
03-27-2001, 10:41 PM
Originally posted by Admiral:
What are your thought.

I think that this thread is boring.

Admiral Zaarin
03-27-2001, 10:45 PM
Hmm. What do you think are the exact physical conditions necessary to fry 23 taco shells in the main reactor of the Death Star?

JR2000Z
03-27-2001, 10:50 PM
Technically, you need Taco Bell tocos to do that.

Admiral Zaarin
03-27-2001, 10:55 PM
I've already tested the experiment in the backup reactors of one of my ISDs, and it worked out quite nicely. I just wanted to know, since I'm considering building a Death Star, based on the original plans, but I want a ship that can destroy planets and cook tacos.

Keyan Farlander
03-27-2001, 11:53 PM
There are some theories that the speed of light is not consant. I have no idea how much truth there is to that, though.

Admiral Zaarin
03-27-2001, 11:58 PM
What I could never understand (forgive me if this sounds stupid, I know next to nothing about physics) is how the speed of light could be some kind of limit. Surely, theoretically, if a powerful enough engine/whatever was constructed, it could move an object to FTL speeds?

Rogue 9
03-28-2001, 12:02 AM
the speed of light is a constant in real space, but whos to say there isn't another plain of space exsisting at the same time and yet invisible to us. http://www.xwingalliance.com/forums/biggrin.gif, that is my thought

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"The truest measure of a society is how it treats it's Elderly, It's Pets and It's Prisoners."

Commander 598
03-28-2001, 12:37 AM
The hyperdrive is an engine - powered by fusion generators - which allows a spacecraft to enter hyperspace, an alternate dimension where travel at many times the speed of light ceases to be an impossibility. Journeys that would require months or years in normal or "realspace" zip by in a matter of weeks or hours, making distant star systems easily accessible.

Travel through hyperspace is a serious and very delicate operation. Objects in realspace cast a hyperspace shadow, acting as obstacles in hyperspace as well. While the pilot of a starship hurtling through realspace might have enough time to react to a planet or asteroid in his craft's trajectory, the incredible speeds reached by a spacecraft in hyperspace render human reflexes absolutely useless. Hyperspace-travelling starships are thus equipped with a nav computer or an astromech droid, whose job is to calculate with the utmost precision the entry and exit coordinates, as well as the speed and duration of the trip, based on hyperspace maps. Should a previously uncharted space body show up on the ship's itinerary, mass shadow sensors would detect its hyperspace shadow and automatically shut down the hyperdrive, bringing the ship back into realspace.


http://starwars.com/technology/hyperdrive/img/hd1_sm.jpg

Entering Hyperspace


Basically what a hyperdrive does is thrusts you into an alternate dimension where things mover reeeeaaaally fast.

So light speed or more would require a place without physics.

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Official Forum Nuclear Terrorist

Rogue 9
03-28-2001, 01:20 AM
actually objects can remain still in hyperspace, Items such as static probes remain in a stable postition in hyperspace, dropping out only to scan an area, transmit and enter hyperspace again.

Keyan Farlander
03-28-2001, 02:59 AM
Originally posted by Admiral Zaarin:
What I could never understand (forgive me if this sounds stupid, I know next to nothing about physics) is how the speed of light could be some kind of limit. Surely, theoretically, if a powerful enough engine/whatever was constructed, it could move an object to FTL speeds?

No. As you get closer the speed of light, your mass actually increases, and so it takes more and more energy to go faster and faster. In theory, if you were traveling at the speed of light, you would have infinite mass. It would take an infinite amount of energy to get you up to that speed. That's why it can't be done. Or so they say...

edlib
03-28-2001, 03:01 AM
Back to the original intent of this post: Nothing in the macro world can ever exceed the speed of light. However, at the quantum scale all bets are off. Relativity doesn't apply to quantum events. There's a phenomina called "Quantum Tunneling" that has been tested in a lab experiment that shows how particles may "Jump" to the other side of a solid barrier and may do so faster than light can travel the same distance. I forget the exact details of the experiment, but it involved a recording of Mozart I belive.

edlib
03-28-2001, 03:10 AM
I forgot to add; There's a couple of amazing books on these matters that I believe every human being should read:

"The Elegant Universe" by Brian Greene
and
"Hyperspace" by Mihio Kaku

Keyan Farlander
03-28-2001, 03:12 AM
That one's too much for me. I'm an engineer - that means I know physics, but I ignore it and do everything by trial and error http://www.xwingalliance.com/forums/biggrin.gif

Rogue 9
03-28-2001, 03:17 AM
*Hehe*, Blind Jumps rule...remember this line,
we're loosen the main deflector, strap yourselves in, I'm gonna make the jump to lightspeed... that was a trial and error jump http://www.xwingalliance.com/forums/biggrin.gif

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"With only two parents and a handful of siblings, Is it any wonder that humans are so obsessed with finding love?" -- Fragment of a Than-Thre-Kull anthropology text

Jabba The Hunt
03-28-2001, 04:07 AM
there is a theory about using those quantum particles to teleport people, however you have to destroy the orignal and what you get out the end is just a copy which mean to teleport yourself you have to die.

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iM. diSleXIc. sO. pLeaSE. tRanSlaTe. AnY oF tHe mmistypes/SpElLinGs
jabbathehunt@hotmail.com

Rogue 9
03-28-2001, 04:20 AM
if your talking about the Australian Experiement, it was conducted on Photons not Quantum particles, unless they are the same thing that is in which case I'm a Moron http://www.xwingalliance.com/forums/biggrin.gif, but only for a few minutes

Fondas
03-28-2001, 04:56 AM
Is as simple as that :

Unless we have someone with Phd in Physics among us, no one can really answer that. You may get some popularizing views, or copied and pasted stuff, but not a real answer.

Even if someone could give a scientifically justified answer, I bet none of us could fully understand it !

So frankly, I do not know !

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"No matter how pretty the bait,
a hook is still a hook !"
TZG+7

Nute Gunray
03-28-2001, 05:12 AM
The answer is:
*
*
*
*
*
*
*
*
*
*
*
Does it matter? we'll all be dead by the time they COULD develop faster than light travel and make it worth using.

Rogue 9
03-28-2001, 05:14 AM
dang, the government edited nutes post, all I see is asterisks http://www.xwingalliance.com/forums/frown.gif

Zoom Rabbit
03-28-2001, 08:26 AM
I'm not a physicist. I'm a cook. I'll try to explain it anyway. http://www.xwingalliance.com/forums/smile.gif

E=MC2

Now, we've all seen this equation before. It's Einstein's theory of relativity, and basically it states that each of the variables (which I'll get to) retain a constant relationship with one another in precisely the way described. Since the theory concerns those relationships, it is called 'relativity.'

E= energy.
M= mass.
C= speed of light.
2= squared (math function.)

Now, since that relationship remains constant, changing the value of one will distort the others. Basic algebra. http://www.xwingalliance.com/forums/wink.gif This theory was tested by taking two perfectly coordinated atomic clocks, keeping one on the ground and flying the other around the world at supersonic speed, then checking to see if the difference in speed created a difference in time; it did. One clock had run a few fractions of a second faster than the other.

So we take this relationship between speed and time, and apply it to our acceleration question. As we go faster, time will slow down...and mass will increase dramatically. In fact, before we reach the speed of light, our mass will become infinite and our time will scale down to nothing.

Light is the only thing that can go that fast because it is a wave, and therefore has no mass. (Although I recall hearing that there was some reasearch that suggested light photons did have some mass, and also that tachyons were supposed to go faster than light, but I'm not up to date on any of this stuff.) http://www.xwingalliance.com/forums/smile.gif

So that's my answer. You want fries with that? http://www.xwingalliance.com/forums/biggrin.gif

Zoom Rabbit
03-28-2001, 08:30 AM
I forget precisely where time factors into all that. I'm not sure, but I think that time is a function of 'C' since speed, space and time are all intertwined right there...

Dammit, somebody dig up Einstein to explain this for us! http://www.xwingalliance.com/forums/wink.gif

Gold leader
03-28-2001, 10:09 AM
I'm afraid you've kinda missed the point, Zoom.

Like Keyan said, the mass of an object is related to its velocity. This is the relation: http://members.tripod.com/wmhxbigguy/pics/formula_m.gif
The link ain't workin of course. I mean this formula: m = m0 / (1 - v/c)^1/2
with m0 being the mass at rest, v the velocity, c the speed of light.

As you can see, and object's mass increases with its velocity. A larger mass causes a greater curvature of space/time, hence the difference in time on your two clocks.

There are many sites that try to explain the theory of relativity. Just use a search engine. For those too lazy to do that: this (http://www.perkel.com/nerd/relativity.htm) is a nice one.

[This message has been edited by Gold leader (edited March 28, 2001).]

Zoom Rabbit
03-28-2001, 10:45 AM
Time is an illusion, being a function of space itself. Simply because it can't be the same time everywhere, time becomes a means of measuring space.

Yadda yadda... http://www.xwingalliance.com/forums/rolleyes.gif

Actually the theory of relativity is Ernie is (=) My second Cousin (2.)

http://www.xwingalliance.com/forums/biggrin.gif

edlib
03-28-2001, 10:47 AM
Originally posted by Rogue 9:
if your talking about the Australian Experiement, it was conducted on Photons not Quantum particles, unless they are the same thing that is in which case I'm a Moron http://www.xwingalliance.com/forums/biggrin.gif, but only for a few minutes

Like I said, I don't remember the exact details of the experiment, only that it's possible. Either way it's still a quantum level event.

AceAzzameen
03-28-2001, 03:13 PM
Originally posted by Jabba The Hunt:
there is a theory about using those quantum particles to teleport people, however you have to destroy the orignal and what you get out the end is just a copy which mean to teleport yourself you have to die.


Jabba has been reading Michael Crichton's Timeline. Admittedly, that was one great book and it brought to light some interesting theories. Although it may have taken the fiction a bit too far at some points. The quantum theories are most exciting because, as pointed out, they do throw many of the old rules out the window. And I can't recall which parts of the book were fact, and which were bent a little bit, but I thought there have actually been quantum teleportation experiments performed successfully somewhere?

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"With the blast shield down, I can't even see. How am I supposed to fight?"

Rogue Leader 3
aceazzameen@yahoo.com
or manofstele@yahoo.com

[This message has been edited by AceAzzameen (edited March 28, 2001).]

Poor Bastard
03-28-2001, 04:53 PM
I thought this thread was boring. It's nice to see I was right.

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"I felt like putting a bullet between the eyes of every Panda that wouldn't screw to save its species. I wanted to open the dump valves on oil tankers and smother all the French beaches I'd never see. I wanted to breathe smoke."

Keyan Farlander
03-28-2001, 06:13 PM
Originally posted by AceAzzameen:
Jabba has been reading Michael Crichton's Timeline. Admittedly, that was one great book and it brought to light some interesting theories. Although it may have taken the fiction a bit too far at some points. The quantum theories are most exciting because, as pointed out, they do throw many of the old rules out the window. And I can't recall which parts of the book were fact, and which were bent a little bit, but I thought there have actually been quantum teleportation experiments performed successfully somewhere?


I think they teleported light or something.

Jabba The Hunt
03-28-2001, 06:42 PM
firstly ive never even heard of that book and secondaly i watched a BBC tv programme about time and teleportation what they said was

if you take 2 twined quatum particles (that is two quatum particles that were created at excatly the same time and are excatly the same) then they can copy other partilces from one of the quantums to the other however this destories the orignal, the other interesting thing is this happens instantanistaly (sp - meaning right away, no time taken) and can be done with electrons therefore you could have a Quantum Computer thats speed would be infinite, now that would produce some nice graphics!!!

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iM. diSleXIc. sO. pLeaSE. tRanSlaTe. AnY oF tHe mmistypes/SpElLinGs
jabbathehunt@hotmail.com

Zoom Rabbit
03-28-2001, 07:33 PM
I read that in a magazine, though it was a few years ago and I'll never remember which one! The quantum computer (which was just an idea, a few decades short of ever being built) was supposed to use the teleportation trick to calculate simultaneously all possible results. Tricky, tricky stuff.

Can you imagine what that would do to the science of ballistics? We'd be able to determine everywhere the shell could go before firing it...

http://www.xwingalliance.com/forums/biggrin.gif

Rogue 9
03-28-2001, 07:53 PM
that sounds like something out of Popular Science http://www.xwingalliance.com/forums/biggrin.gif

AceAzzameen
03-28-2001, 10:00 PM
Well, ok Jabba, then the show you watched is getting its info the same place Michael Crichton did. Because all the things you mention are in the book. There's actually a thread about it here somewhere, I think, from way back when a few of us were reading it...

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"With the blast shield down, I can't even see. How am I supposed to fight?"

Rogue Leader 3
aceazzameen@yahoo.com
or manofstele@yahoo.com

Jabba The Hunt
03-29-2001, 03:52 AM
how do i get hold of that book?

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iM. diSleXIc. sO. pLeaSE. tRanSlaTe. AnY oF tHe mmistypes/SpElLinGs
jabbathehunt@hotmail.com

Rogue 9
03-29-2001, 04:19 AM
Maybe you should try going to theis mythical place known only as "Amazon.Com http://www.xwingalliance.com/forums/rolleyes.gif

Redwing
03-29-2001, 04:31 AM
In Popular Science they documented an experiment in which scientists actually slowed down light. How funny is that?

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At last we will reveal ourselves to the Jedi.
At last we will have revenge.

Zoom Rabbit
03-29-2001, 09:11 AM
Pfft--! I can do that with a piece of paper...!

http://www.xwingalliance.com/forums/rolleyes.gif

Zoom Rabbit
03-29-2001, 09:14 AM
Gold Leader: that was a joke! http://www.xwingalliance.com/forums/wink.gif

Gold leader
03-29-2001, 09:37 AM
Pfweh! You scared me Zoom. Please do it again. I like it.

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It's the punctuation, stupid!