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GreggyShotokan
09-09-2006, 10:19 PM
After seeing Force powere pre-vis for a 1001 time I began to wonder if there is a possibilty of altering force push, whirlwind and wave so it may look like force powers in this great clip. I kno there are definitely heaps of restrictions that apply but still wud that be possible? If so than if there is anybody willing to work on this .... ppl will defitely appriciate that!

goldberry
09-10-2006, 05:22 AM
I'm sorry, could you please go over what you want done so we can understand?
I get that you want something done to force push, whirlwind, and wave, but from what clip? You would really need to give a link to said clip if you want help.

GreggyShotokan
09-11-2006, 08:45 AM
Righty ....here it is (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GSfWFQIDKS8) and yeah..... somthing similar....not exactly the same since I am aware Kotor is Kotor (2003) still.... some changes wud be more than welcome!

stoffe
09-11-2006, 10:40 AM
Righty ....here it is (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GSfWFQIDKS8) and yeah..... somthing similar....not exactly the same since I am aware Kotor is Kotor (2003) still.... some changes wud be more than welcome!

It would be very difficult to produce something even remotely similar in KotOR as far as I am aware.

Kotor does not have any world physics system or character ragdolls, and lacks a variety of flashy "casting" animations, which are what makes up the major parts of those effects from what I can see. That and it's semi-realtime turnbased with really clunky animation control, while that game in the movie clip look more like it's fully realtime with fluid animations.

If character animations could be modified it might have been possible (but tons of work involved) to make more flashy moves, but to my knowledge there are no tools available to to that, currently.

goldberry
09-11-2006, 01:39 PM
From the movie, that power is AMAZING. If only there were a way to get the placeables to fly around... Would it be possible to use a GetNearestObject script and then make that object move at a few co-ordinates a second and when it hits explode, dealing however much damage to the enemy, and destroying the object. It would have to be used sparingly, like Force Choke Anyone, as it could balls up your game.

But I digress, do you believe this to be possible with KOTORs (or TSL's) physics engine?

stoffe
09-11-2006, 02:45 PM
If only there were a way to get the placeables to fly around... Would it be possible to use a GetNearestObject script and then make that object move at a few co-ordinates a second and when it hits explode, dealing however much damage to the enemy, and destroying the object.


Placeables cannot fly/move around, they are stationary and cannot be moved from the position they are placed or spawned. The best you could do would be to make an animated placeable that gives the impression of moving, but it'd still be in the same place, and it'd only be possible to "move" in one way/direction. Or to make a creature that looks like a placeable. :)

There is also no hit/collision detection in the game, you cannot easily detect if an NPC is bumping a placeable, and if a projectile is going to hit or miss is determined as it is launched regardless of if it visually actually collides with its target. Performing intricate movement acrobatics with your controlled character has no bearing on if blaster bolts shot at her will hit or not, that is determined by dice rolls behind the scene entirely. You can even dive behind a wall as someone shoots at you from a distance and the bolt will go straight through the wall and hit you anyway.

But I digress, do you believe this to be possible with KOTORs (or TSL's) physics engine?

There is no what I'd call a physics engine in the KotOR games. There is no way to apply force to an object to make it react/move accordingly and affect other objects around it. There is not much of a gravity in the game; characters are always on the walkmesh, placeables can be spawned anywhere on the Z axis and will stay there for the duration of their existence.

The push/wave effects you currently see are just pre-existing animations being played, and the game engine moving the object in a predetermined direction and distance. You will notice that a pushed NPC falls over in exactly the same way every time they are pushed. They will not bounce off eachother, they will not bounce off solid surfaces or objects. Their path will at best be cut short by them and they'll just do their "fall to the ground" animation nearer to the push source.

From what I could make out of that movie clip those effects rely heavily on ragdoll physics to make the "victims" fly and move in a variety of realistic-looking ways that aren't preanimated, it relies on physics to apply force to them to make them fly away and collide with boxes and other objects. Objects seem to have different weight and react to the force accordingly. It relies on flashy, fluid character animations and stances to give more "oompf" to the effect when they are triggered. The nearest to that I've seen in a current game is in TES4:Oblivion where havok physics make objects and characters fly around when attacked with spells or weapons with enough force.

A lot has happened since 2002, when the KotOR engine was made. And even then some things that were possible back then were likely omitted since they wouldn't fit as seamlessly in a semi-turnbased game as they would in a realtime game, or would have bumped up the system requirements for little in-game gain other than eye candy. :)

In short, I seriously doubt anyone could fake something that looks even remotely similar to what is seen in that movie clip for the KotOR games. Though I'd love to be proven wrong. :)

goldberry
09-11-2006, 03:18 PM
I would very much love to prove you wrong also. :D

However, my hands are full at the moment, so I won't even entertain that possibility.

GreggyShotokan
09-11-2006, 06:44 PM
And I thought that wud be only a matter of changing the co-ordinates. Anyway thanks for exhausting answer.... and I hope your wrong as well :P