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View Full Version : Lack of Rebel Units?


Shadow_015
10-11-2006, 02:55 PM
From what i've read on many different sites online the confirmed new units for the Rebels in Forces of Corruption are:

[list=1]
B-Wing
Mon Calamari MC30 Frigate
Luke Skywalker
Yoda
Rogue Squadron
A6 Juggernaught
Gargantuan Tank
Canderous-Class Assault Tank
Gallofree H-TT Transport

Is it just me or does it seem that the Rebel forces seem a little bit cut short in space? I mean we already found out that Admiral Piett will keep the Accuser and now we have the the Arc Hammer, Executor AND Admiral Thrawn in the Admonitor for the Imperials as well as the Zann Consortium getting a lot of new units anyway including Hero space units such as the Merciless (Tyber Zann), the Eclipse, the Hound's Tooth (Bossk) and the IG-2000 (IG-88). Since the Imperials now get TWO Imperial Star Destroyer Hero units and the Rebels only get a Mon Calamari frigate, wouldn't it be fair to at least let the Liberty be a Hero unit? I know you're all gonna say 'the rebels already have a lot of heroes anyway' but still...the Home One and the Sundered Heart are the only two really powerful heroes for the Rebels atm and they should at least have another capital ship hero to offset all the new units.

Darth Anarch
10-11-2006, 04:36 PM
You're actually being a little generous with the Rebel units. The Juggernaut belongs to the Empire, while the Canderous is the Zann Consortium's heavy tank. :D

Obviously the Zann Consortium is getting most of the new units, since they don't have any already. If you count hero units on all sides, however, you'll find that the Consortium has fewer heroes than the other factions.

And so what if the three sides aren't all alike in the number and types of units? That just makes them play different from each other, which is the point of having different factions to begin with.

Valter
10-11-2006, 05:07 PM
The Rebel Alliance relies on it's heroes for victory over the other 2 factions. The Alliance is the underdog faction not a mighty superpower or military might competing with the Empire. The rebels were heavily overpowered in EAW so since Petroglyph is giving the Empire more units the game will be more balanced.

Besides, it's not like the rebels are helpless. Their MPTL's are extremely powerful and they still have the best infantry of all the factions (in my opinion). They have 10 hero units for God's sake! (Including Kyle Katarn)

Shadow_015
10-11-2006, 05:17 PM
Whoops, I guess I misread wikipedia because it mentions something about the Rebels with these units. Still though...to me it seems like the Rebels will be harder to play with all these new kick-a** units going to the other sides. I gotta admit I would be psyched to see the Liberty in action for the Rebels though...

popcorn2008
10-11-2006, 05:24 PM
From what I hear, the rebels will be a HUGE hero based team in the expansion. In other words, like in the movies the rebels will rely more so on their hero units than ever before. In part because Luke and Yoda will be added they have a nice land advantage. I imagine (and hope) rouge squadron will be a lot stronger than red squadron.

Otherwise, I do think the rebels were really ripped off in the space areas of battle.

Shadow_015
10-11-2006, 06:19 PM
I think you're right because that must be why they correctly resized the Home One, because that'll be their main weapon against the Executor with its 'redirect all firepower' and shield regeneration abilities (plus more hardpoints). Hopefully it also gets some fighter squadrons and a hangar this time, although im not holding my breath on that...

gswift
10-11-2006, 06:57 PM
One of the Petro guys said that the Wookipedia article isn't correct and/or complete. I believe they are still holding back on parts of the complete unit list. Two more weeks and we'll know for sure.

Edit: IGN claims to have the 'official' complete list of 'new' units here: http://pc.ign.com/articles/738/738196p1.html

Keep in mind that not only are new units being added, but we'll see changes to existing units, structures, and tech upgrades as well.

Darth Ablett
10-11-2006, 08:28 PM
One of the Petro guys said that the Wookipedia article isn't correct and/or complete. I believe they are still holding back on parts of the complete unit list. Two more weeks and we'll know for sure.

Edit: IGN claims to have the 'official' complete list of 'new' units here: http://pc.ign.com/articles/738/738196p1.html


From that article, you can see that rebel heroes on the ground will rock the socks. Luke is healed by blaster fire, and Yoda can reveal the whole map.

Does Luke fly in Rogue squadron though? If yes, that'll be a bit weird if Luke is on Dagobah and Rogue Squadron is on Kessel, for example.

EDIT: IGN say he is a skilled pilot, so maybe he is his own X-wing, along with Rogue squadron?

Rust_Lord
10-11-2006, 08:58 PM
IGN seems more complete and accurate than wooki but we wont really know until we play the game. I agree with Valter and Popcorn; the rebs are going to be and should be a hero driven faction; as they were in the movies. My only concern for the rebels is how they will play if you turn heroes off; especially on land. I always felt the rebs only had a minor advantage in space (but an advanatge nonetheless) but a big advantage on land with the proton launchers (avail at tech 2) and speeders. If the info on IGN is correct, there is a couple of Empire units that jam/counter missile weaponry. Im interested to see the effect of these.

The Empire does get a heap of cap ships but Arc Hammer/DS2 are certainly only available in GC and the rest are all going to be expensive. On IGN it classifies the Eclipse as an Empire ship but we all know the Empire will not get to use it. The Mon Cal torpedo frigate thing looks VERY nasty. Combined with B-wings (and Mon Cals) and the rebs will slaughter cap ships. Lets face it, as much as I love interceptors, Phantoms and Defenders will be all an Empire player uses because the standard TIEs get cut to pieces by corvettes.

A lack of units/heroes doesn't mean a faction wont be effective. They all look fairly balanced now; except for the Rancors...if they are as tough as they are as neutral critters then they had better be very expensive.

Darth Ablett
10-11-2006, 09:05 PM
If the info on IGN is correct, there is a couple of Empire units that jam/counter missile weaponry. Im interested to see the effect of these.


This will certainly be a good thing; I play both factions but damn, those MPTLs are too strong. With Phase II Darktroopers, the Imperial MDUs, and possibly the Lancet, there are viable counters to Rebel Artillery.

This is a good thing, as Rebels will now rely on their heroes (good) instead of silly overpowered missile launchers (bad).

I'm also not that worried about the Rebels in space with their new units, but I do wonder whether or not they'll make the Rebel fighters last longer than 4 seconds against a Tartan. They are shielded, after all.

darthcarth
10-11-2006, 09:40 PM
I have to say i agree with making the rebels a weaker and hero dependent how long did the rebel troops last against stormys maybe 10 seconds?

Rust_Lord
10-11-2006, 10:00 PM
I have to say i agree with making the rebels a weaker and hero dependent how long did the rebel troops last against stormys maybe 10 seconds?

Even the commandoes in ROTJ got owned...You can see them lying dead on either side of the bunker. Poor bastards....the were rough odds! :) It is a shame stormtroopers arent as good as they should be but it wouldnt be very balanced then.

Im glad isnt not just me Ablett, if you also find them overpowerful. I played a land mission on medium last night and things were under control (about even) until two proton launchers appeared then it went to hell. 2 companies of T4-B tanks at once..not a problem....a pair of those damn launchers...ouch! I just hope the new units/abilities dont render them totally useless although I must say I would not miss them. Your right, Darktroopers with jet packs will make great arty killers.

I cant see the rebel fighters getting tougher. Bwings will prolly have ion ability to stun corvettes but the fighters will never be as resilient as they were in other games, even with max shield upgrade (which for an Xwing would see its shields only nearly double).

Executor1608
10-11-2006, 11:08 PM
Yes, I am very much for the Idea of Rebels being Hero based. Now they will be balanced and not stronger nor weaker. I am a huge Empire supporter, but I like to have a fun time tormenting the little buggers ;)

I agree also on the MPTL's. These things in mass groups will take out many AT-AT's and armies and I am hoping that this new improved AI will fight more tactically than just spamming hundreds and hundreds of MPTL's and airspeeders... grrr

ImpElite
10-11-2006, 11:37 PM
Captain! Yes sir? Prepare to take total control of the galaxy! With heroes and new units at my side I shall have no problem claiming the galaxy.... MUAHAHAHAHA!!!!!

Valter
10-12-2006, 12:17 AM
I noticed that Luke has the innate ability to be healed by blaster fire. This could be a balance problem in my opinion. If blasters can't kill Luke then what weapon can? Missiles are ineffective against infantry and the Empire doesn't have any torpedo based weaponry for their ground forces. If Luke is immune to TIE maulers' laser fire as well then Luke will be nigh invincible.

Darth Ablett
10-12-2006, 12:34 AM
I noticed that Luke has the innate ability to be healed by blaster fire. This could be a balance problem in my opinion. If blasters can't kill Luke then what weapon can? Missiles are ineffective against infantry and the Empire doesn't have any torpedo based weaponry for their ground forces. If Luke is immune to TIE maulers' laser fire as well then Luke will be nigh invincible.

I had assumed this only means stormtrooper fire, but now I'm not sure. It would be a bit silly if he could stand there healing while he's surrounded by AT-ATs. Funny though...

Shadow_015
10-12-2006, 05:13 AM
Okay I do get what you guys mean now about the Rebels being Hero-based which does fit in with the movies...however there is one last qualm I have (and it was somewhat mentioned in an earlier post in this thread) - what happens if heroes are switched off during GC? What happens to the Rebel units then?

(PS. Bring in the Liberty for the Rebels!!! :x-wing: :helm2: )

Darth Anarch
10-12-2006, 07:45 AM
Does Luke fly in Rogue squadron though? If yes, that'll be a bit weird if Luke is on Dagobah and Rogue Squadron is on Kessel, for example.

EDIT: IGN say he is a skilled pilot, so maybe he is his own X-wing, along with Rogue squadron?
I remember one of the devs saying that Luke came in his own X-wing and would be available in space as well. This was some time ago, though, and it's entirely possible that the dev team changed their mind and made him a ground-only hero.

Shadow_015
10-12-2006, 08:23 AM
Thanks for posting that gswift, was very useful and gave me information of some of the units which wasn't available before. If you have anything else please post it here (Thanks). Anyway...if you look at the description of Luke and you see his special abilities on IGN you can clearly see that there are no specified advantages for a 'space-based luke' so therefore he can't really come as a space unit by himself. if he does it'll most likely be in a squadron or he stays as a ground unit. Afterall, Rogue Squadron only had Luke in it for a limited amount of time, then it was led by Wedge Antilles so I guess we'll have to see...

wedge2211
10-12-2006, 11:52 AM
I had assumed this only means stormtrooper fire, but now I'm not sure. It would be a bit silly if he could stand there healing while he's surrounded by AT-ATs. Funny though...
I imagine he wont be able to heal himself from the artillery-grade lasers like on AT-ATs and 2-Ms, and the Empire also has non-blaster weaponry like SPMA-Ts, Dark Troopers (phase Is with swords and phase IIIs with rockets), thermal detonators, T/Mauler self-destructs, heroes with lightsabers, and bombing runs. I'm sure they can find a way to deal some damage to Luke.

Darth Anarch
10-12-2006, 11:55 AM
If you look at Darth Vader, Obi-Wan or the Emperor you can see that they're all good at deflecting blaster fire of all kinds coming from the front. However, fire from any other direction, or when they're doing something else that shuts down their lightsabers (like damaging buildings with the Force) they get hit normally. The only difference between these heroes and Luke is that he will (probably) heal a little bit when he's successfully deflecting blaster bolts.

And remember, when he's using his "Throw Lightsaber" ability he can't deflect any blaster bolts with it...

Shadow_015
10-15-2006, 06:34 AM
I definitely think that Petroglyph is holding out on us in terms of units...I think we may be in for some surprises once we try the expansion out for ourselves :D

TearsOfIsha
11-10-2006, 08:05 AM
I definitely think that Petroglyph is holding out on us in terms of units...I think we may be in for some surprises once we try the expansion out for ourselves :D

Well, it looks like there wasn't much new stuff after all. Bit of a shame really. When you consider that the ZC are *all* new units, and the imperials hav recieved what is basically a new army..... the rebel new units are really not adequate. I wished petro had stated they were going to neuter the rebels beforehand, I could have just bought Extraction Point instead, or saved my money.

wherryj
11-15-2006, 06:17 PM
The Rebel Alliance relies on it's heroes for victory over the other 2 factions. The Alliance is the underdog faction not a mighty superpower or military might competing with the Empire. The rebels were heavily overpowered in EAW so since Petroglyph is giving the Empire more units the game will be more balanced.

Besides, it's not like the rebels are helpless. Their MPTL's are extremely powerful and they still have the best infantry of all the factions (in my opinion). They have 10 hero units for God's sake! (Including Kyle Katarn)

Isn't Kyle left out of this one? I haven't seen him appear yet in GC at least.