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Nancy Allen``
08-10-2007, 06:39 PM
There's something I want to get off my chest, laugh at that and you'll be.... I think we can do without something that descriptive.... --Jae
Something that has always been around is using sexuality to market a product, whether it be Basic Instinct to spice up an otherwise decent movie, sexy women marketing on TV or Lara Croft and Dead or Alive in videogames. Now I'm all for the strong female in games, sci fi, ect. Joanna Dark, Resident Evil, these are great examples. However I do think there are some instances where the phrase 'sex sells' is taken too far. Tomb Raider and Dead or Alive would be the main culprits, the latter in particular feeling that they have to cheapen the game through overt sexualization to make it appeal. And games such as Hot Import Nights takes away from how good the game might be by making the focus on having women for gamers to oogle at. I'm not saying there should be softcore magazines or games for girls but given how much of a push there has been in portraying women in this way maybe some thought should be made on making the product better.

Emperor Devon
08-10-2007, 06:56 PM
Of course it sells. People buy things like they like. Hot girls are one of those. Unless you start filtering things out of the economy companies are going to keep selling stuff their customers like.

stoffe
08-10-2007, 07:11 PM
Something that has always been around is using sexuality to market a product, whether it be Basic Instinct to spice up an otherwise decent movie, sexy women marketing on TV or Lara Croft and Dead or Alive in videogames. Now I'm all for the strong female in games, sci fi, ect. Joanna Dark, Resident Evil, these are great examples. However I do think there are some instances where the phrase 'sex sells' is taken too far. Tomb Raider and Dead or Alive would be the main culprits

Why would it be taboo or a bad thing to make a video game character that looks good? Granted, if it's their only quality then it might be a bit shallow and diminish the fun of the game while bumping up the cheese factor, but I don't understand why good-looking characters in games should be a bad thing if it's just one of the character's traits and not their only attraction.

Since you mentioned Tomb Raider I'd say there is more to Lara Croft than a set of over-sized frontal assets. Admittedly I have only played TR:Legend so far (with TR:Anniversary in queue for when I have the time), but at least in that game I'd say there are other things going for the character than appearances alone: A strong, intelligent, determined personality who knows what she wants, quirky sense of humor, strong confidence and an interesting backstory. You could change the character model of the protagonist in Legend and I'd still find the game just as worthwhile to play.

So, why would adding good looks to the personality trait of the protagonist suddenly make the game worse? It's not like that's the reason you play the game, though I certainly don't think it hurts. It's not like you're running around the game in underwear or the like:

http://img47.imageshack.us/img47/8247/perutombhalldaylightqm4.th.jpg (http://img47.imageshack.us/img47/8247/perutombhalldaylightqm4.jpg) http://img267.imageshack.us/img267/526/nepaltemplehall1wk1.th.jpg (http://img267.imageshack.us/img267/526/nepaltemplehall1wk1.jpg)

As far as sexualization goes I'd say it's pretty tame, I'd easily see worse by randomly zapping among the channels on TV an average evening at prime time, or going for a walk around town on a sunny summer's day.

John Galt
08-10-2007, 09:02 PM
Its a proven fact that sex DOES sell, and as long as they're not breaking any laws (actual or ethical), I'm perfectly okay with whatever marketing techniques companies use to sell their products.

Nancy Allen``
08-10-2007, 09:40 PM
Relying on looks alone, or just making basically the same game because the first one was popular, very nearly did in the Tomb Raider series in until it was revamped, and I must say that Anniversary is quite a breath of fresh air as Lara seems more real, less gratuiously portrayed. On the other big one that is, shall we say, sexpoitation, take Kasumi for example. The intro for one of the Dead or Alive games gave background to her and Ayane, which I thought was great. Sadly most of the time the game developers seem more interested in using sexism to market what is a shallow game, particularly the volleyball titles that are actually offensive in how far they push the envelope. Now take the Joanna Darks, the Jill Valentines, the Alyx Vances and the like, sure they look good but it was thought, rightfully so, that playing on this wasn't necessary (or portraying them as bimbos the way a few titles insultingly portray women), instead working on their personality or the game itself rather than putting forth the idea that something is good because of the female lead.

Jae Onasi
08-10-2007, 11:56 PM
Well, (most) people like sex, and (most) people like looking at sexy things. Associating a pleasurable activity with an item does encourage people to purchase it. I think sometimes it can backfire, however. In the ad awhile back where Hilton or whoever it was who was making love to the car while washing it just annoyed me no end rather than making me actually interested in the car. All I could think of the whole time was "Who the heck washes their car in stiletto heels? That's just Dumb with a capital Duh". My other thought was "Geez, Paris, you and the car need to get a room."

Totenkopf
08-11-2007, 02:55 AM
Well, (most) people like sex, and (most) people like looking at sexy things. Associating a pleasurable activity with an item does encourage people to purchase it. I think sometimes it can backfire, however. In the ad awhile back where Hilton or whoever it was who was making love to the car while washing it just annoyed me no end rather than making me actually interested in the car. All I could think of the whole time was "Who the heck washes their car in stiletto heels? That's just Dumb with a capital Duh". My other thought was "Geez, Paris, you and the car need to get a room."


Actually, wasn't that dopey commercial supposed to sell you on a Burger King product (the Whopper, maybe)?

JediKnight707
08-11-2007, 03:28 AM
Actually, wasn't that dopey commercial supposed to sell you on a Burger King product (the Whopper, maybe)?
Yes it was. I think that Jae was pointing out the fact that she was more focused on the commercial then the product it was pushing.

As far as sex selling, of course it does. Why do you think all movie stars are hot? People would rather watch hot people act out a movie then ugly people. That's a fact. Would I be more willing to buy a product that's got Hillary Duff in a bikini then say a normal person? Yes. And I proudly admit that.

Pho3nix
08-11-2007, 06:04 AM
As far as sexualization goes I'd say it's pretty tame, I'd easily see worse by randomly zapping among the channels on TV an average evening at prime time, or going for a walk around town on a sunny summer's day.
QFT.

The same could be said about men, Nancy. How many thin geeks are the heroes in an action game? ;) It's not all always women who are given a 'false' image of what one should look like.

Totenkopf
08-11-2007, 06:27 PM
I think sometimes it can backfire, however. In the ad awhile back where Hilton or whoever it was who was making love to the car while washing it just annoyed me no end rather than making me actually interested in the car.

@JK707--yeah, I understood her point about the style of the add interfering with the product id, just sounded like she remembered it as a car ad rather than a burger ad. No biggie.

Nancy Allen``
08-11-2007, 09:06 PM
The same could be said about men, Nancy. How many thin geeks are the heroes in an action game? ;) It's not all always women who are given a 'false' image of what one should look like.

Oh, a few. Gordan Freeman. Simon Pegg in Hot Fuzz isn't the stereotypical bodybuilder action hero. Peter Parker, Luke, Han, Anakin, okay sure they're a far cry from...oh I don't know, Dennis Franz. Having a hot guy or girl isn't a crime, I do think making it the focus of the game detracts from the quality, if any, the product might have.

Just on that some portrayals of how men and women are meant to be can be damaging. By that I mean people see this and feel they have to be like that, they feel impotent and unhappy for not being like that and feel they have to go to extreme lengths to make themselves so thin Calista Flockheart looks overweight and breasts so big Tifa Lockheart would be envious.

SilentScope001
08-12-2007, 12:58 AM
Sex sells, but we have to blame Evolution for it. For some strange reason, evolution want us to have sex so that we can reproduce, but they realize that we want to be happy, and if sex does not make us happy, we would be discouraged from having sex. Therefore, evolution inspired us to have sex by making it seem pleasurable.

Thanks to Evolution, we are stuck with these ads that use sex as a marketing tool, because those people want us to associate the happiness with sex with the happiness of a Whopper. Great marketing tool, but it just seems...well, unpleasent.

I agree with you fully, but we have to thank God for "Intro Vito Feterlization" and Cloning. The natural way seriously is overrated and wasteful, it's time we take control of our reproduction. Well, um, sorry for the rant, I guess.

To note, in the Middle Ages, it was actually a badge of honor to be fat or stinky. If you were fat, you must be rich to afford all that food, and if you were stinky, you must not be a dirty Muslim who takes bathes every day. Maybe that badge of honor also leads to those same people being seen as sexy? If sexuality can evolve, who knows, maybe nerds may soon have girls?