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View Full Version : Why no love for Darth Sion and Kreia?


DarthExile27
10-15-2007, 04:35 PM
Greetings everyone I was wondering, why so many people don't like Sion and Kreia? Personally I think they are far more interesting than that over-rated Darth Nihilus. I liked having Kreia around me, I really did feel like her student. Even though she gets annoying at times, but nonetheless she was a well thought out character and her voice is great. As for Sion he was pure brutality, and he was also pretty deep in terms of story with a great voice and look. I also like the fact that it's his hate that's keeping him together. As for Nihilus they make him sound like such a badass, but yet they never show him doing anything. I know Visas says he consumes planet, but they never show him actually doing it. He just stays in his ship waiting for you to kill him.

So in closing I don't mean to start a flame war, I just want to know why most choose Nihilus over Kreia and Sion?

Cheers.

Alexander the Great
10-15-2007, 05:12 PM
I've got nothing against Sion, but Kreia always finds some way to reprimand you at every turn until the end.

Gargoyle King
10-15-2007, 05:38 PM
:lol: Funnily enough i must be somewhat of an "anomalie" then since my fav. Sith Lord from TSL was Sion.

Jediphile
10-15-2007, 05:40 PM
Lots of people like Sion or Kreia more than Nihilus. I'm surprised they haven't answered this yet, but I suspect they will. Personally I do tend to favor Nihilus, since he is mysterious and menacing, an evil force of nature in a similar vein to Dracula and his ilk, while Sion is little more than a brute who can't die.

Kreia is a fantastic character, however. She is by far the strongest and most complex character in the KotOR games, and the voice-acting by Sara Kestelman is just breathtaking. "It is such a quiet thing to fall... But far more terrible is to admit it..." Ooooh, still makes me shiver... ;)

Lots of people don't like her because she's such a bossy old hag. I think many overlook that they dislike her so much exactly because she is so perfectly done in the game. And I like her complexity. I mean, in the end, is Kreia really a hero or a villain? It's up to the player, since it depends entirely on your own perspective. That's good writing in my book.

Gargoyle King
10-15-2007, 05:55 PM
Lots of people don't like her because she's such a bossy old hag. Yeah, just think of Bastila about 60 years into the future, jeez! :lol:
Kreia was an interesting character, as is her alter ego of Darth Traya. My opinion of her in game was that she was evil as she was trying to destroy the force, of course this is the canon aspect of her character but with the TURC by team-exile will be restoring the part where you can redempt Kreia (of which Atris then becomes the new Traya) so i'd love to see how this pans out.

DarthExile27
10-15-2007, 06:09 PM
I also forgot to mention that this topic isn't directed to anyone in this forum, it's just that Nihilus has always been the poster boy for KOTOR 2, and Sion and Kreia are left in the dust. So I'm just trying to understand his appeal over the other two.

I agree Kreia was somewhat annoying, but that just added to her mentor aspect early in the game; but I agree she was a well written character.

adamqd
10-15-2007, 06:48 PM
it's just that Nihilus has always been the poster boy for KOTOR 2, and Sion and Kreia are left in the dust.
True, a lot of the concept art and stuff are of Atris and nihilus, who are not figured in the story as much as others. Personally, I don't mind Nihilus, the masks crap but he's an interesting character to a point, I've no time for Hag and sleeps with vibroblades, but I am a bit of a K1 fanboy...

Master Shake
10-15-2007, 09:29 PM
Sion was always my favorite sith lord in TSL. I think if his character had been more developed he would be more appealing to others.

as for Kreia, she is one of the best characters ever developed for any game IMO. I never saw her as evil but doing her job of getting the exile ready to go into the unkown regions.

Totenkopf
10-15-2007, 10:15 PM
Nihilus never seemed to be anything more than a force wielding cancer, about as intersting as the Blob. I think that, as Jediphile seems to indicate, he seems more interesting to some b/c he's "mysterious" (ie. not overly developed, at least w/in the confines of the game). Sion may have been an "indestructable" brute, but at least you got some idea of who/what he was.

Rev7
10-15-2007, 10:27 PM
I really don't know what to think about Nihilius, Sion or Kreia. They all die in the game, and we don't know all that much about them. I would have to say the best "sith" out of the three would have to be Darth Sion. He had the most hatred out of all of them. He was strong and weak at the same time though. He showed mercy to Kreia on the Harbinger, and let the Exile go, and did not follow him/her to finish the job on Korriban. He was strong ( because of his hatred), but he was also weak. I only chose him only because he used his pain and his hatred to keep on going. If he hadn't had the hatred he would be nothing more than a Dark Jedi. (to me) :)

Jae Onasi
10-15-2007, 11:17 PM
Other than the totally idiotic 'I'm going to stand while mortally wounded and monologue you to death or until you run out of dialog tree options, whichever comes last, before I finally fall over and die' ending, I loved Kreia. She's my favorite 'bad guy' (except for maybe HK) in TSL.

Nihilus--so much potential, so under-utilized, that he became nothing more than a cookie-cutter semi-boss with a really cool mask and this cool force-sucking power, but not nearly enough hit points.

Sion--Sleeps-with-vibroblades is gawdawfully ugly. Yes, I know it's by design that his eyeball is hanging off his cheek and his limbs are falling off in chunks, but blech. However, I sure enjoyed the final fight with him (I thought it was the best of the three), and the dialog with a female Exile makes it really interesting.

Bee Hoon
10-16-2007, 01:19 AM
You'll find e lot of people who like Kreia, really:) She is an absolutely awesome character, but naturally they wouldn't really wanna advertise "Hey! I'm Kreia and I'm the final boss!" Who else would be mad enough to want to kill the Force?

I thought that Sion was ok, but I'm not mad about him. He gets really confused when you play a female exile, although I suppose that "I'll kill you myself before I let Kreia ruin you" is romantic in a bizarre Sith way:p

Nihilus...gargles. He could have been so much better, if the developers had gone more into his background (which Jediphile was spot on about;)) And for goodness' sake, couldn't they have given some other voiceover/sound effects? Even tacky telepathic voices would have been better than the Sith mouthwash endorsement.

Sephira
10-16-2007, 03:39 AM
I dont like sion because hes a bull sh!t overrated character, as for nihilus and kreia, i dont like them because they have no depth in their backstory.

Out of these 3 nihilus is the most boring as he doesnt speak a clear word, his backstory and origin are all speculation


Lots of people like Sion or Kreia more than Nihilus. I'm

Kreia is a fantastic character, however. She is by far the strongest and most complex character in the KotOR games, and the voice-acting by Sara Kestelman is just breathtaking. "It is such a quiet thing to fall... But far more terrible is to admit it..." Ooooh, still makes me shiver... ;)


Shes the strongest kotor era character? No, revan and exar kun are

His greatest feat > kreias.

Remember when he walked the surface of malachor? The dark side plundered on him and attempted to consume him, and instead of that happening due to revans strength in the force, he reversed the effects and instead fed on malachors dark side as kreia admitted.

Now when kreia said she stepped on its surface for the first time, she got overwhelmed by the dark side energies and gets consumed, and the end result is that malachor has broken kreia and turned her into what she is

As for exar kun he could instantly freeze hundreds and thousands of people in the senate instantly with sith magic and he is also strong enough to use the dark side energies of yavin iv to overpower a post DE luke and tear his spirit from his body as well as instantly killing gantoris with his black lightning from the inside out

Lance Monance
10-16-2007, 07:59 AM
Nihilus never seemed to be anything more than a force wielding cancer, about as intersting as the Blob.
My thoughts on Nihilus exactly.

Sion is somewhat interesting, but nothing more than a minion.

Kreia on the other hand has a motive behind her actions (albeit that motive could've been better imo). Still she's by far the best character in Kotor 2. Complex and intriguing.

@Sephira
I think Jediphile is not talking about her actual power, but about how well writen her character is.

Prime
10-16-2007, 09:58 AM
I liked Sion more than Nihilus. Kreia was by far the best though...

Jediphile
10-16-2007, 02:01 PM
Other than the totally idiotic 'I'm going to stand while mortally wounded and monologue you to death or until you run out of dialog tree options, whichever comes last, before I finally fall over and die' ending, I loved Kreia. She's my favorite 'bad guy' (except for maybe HK) in TSL.

Kreia rules. No doubt about it. I don't agree with people who say she had no depth in her background. On the contrary - she is by far the character with the richest background in the KotOR games, I think. The only possible exception is really Revan, but that's only because Kreia goes to great lengths to hide her past. Most of it is revealed during the game, however, although some of it is highly speculative (chiefly whether she is Arren Kae or not...)

Nihilus--so much potential, so under-utilized, that he became nothing more than a cookie-cutter semi-boss with a really cool mask and this cool force-sucking power, but not nearly enough hit points.

In terms of game stats, yes, Nihilus sucks (and not just force power, I mean ;) ) - he should have been much, much more powerful. Had I been the game programmer, I would have just let the fight continue without reducing his HPs at all until the exile and friends lost, then have Nihilus try to drain the exile thereby "recharing" the exile and draining Nihilus. Then he gets killed. It should be dictated by plot, not stats, IMHO.

It's true that Nihilus doesn't have much background, but I think it's very unfair to label him as a bad character for it, since it was by design and not by omission. Reading Bram Stoker's Dracula, you also found out virtually nothing about Dracula's background, but it just makes him more menacing since it makes him the evil force of nature that you cannot hope to understand. Nihilus is just the same. To know him is to die.

Sion--Sleeps-with-vibroblades is gawdawfully ugly. Yes, I know it's by design that his eyeball is hanging off his cheek and his limbs are falling off in chunks, but blech. However, I sure enjoyed the final fight with him (I thought it was the best of the three), and the dialog with a female Exile makes it really interesting.

Sion's "romance" with female exile sucks. Period! Honestly, it is so out of the blue and incredibly cliché that it almost made me long for Malak's phoney laughter... I half expected him to pour out stuff like "your eyes are the only thing that shines in the darkness that is now my soul" or some equally overly sentimental and romantic nonsense. It's just so cliché it hurts... Actually, I take that back. To call Sion's "romance" cliché is an insult to the word "cliché" :(

@Sephira

Lance Monance is correct. Although if Revan and Exar Kun are the strongest, then why does Kreia tell the exile he/she is the greatest student she ever taught, when she thaught Revan as well? ;)

Emperor Devon
10-16-2007, 07:13 PM
Even tacky telepathic voices would have been better than the Sith mouthwash endorsement.

I think any text, legible voice, or means of understanding Nihilus would've spoiled his atmosphere. He's supposed to be something a sentient mind can't understand, more a force than living being. Adding something familiar that we can understand to something as alien as him wouldn't have been very fitting IMO.

Other than the totally idiotic 'I'm going to stand while mortally wounded and monologue you to death or until you run out of dialog tree options, whichever comes last, before I finally fall over and die' ending

What would you have preferred, her saying "It was great knowin' ya, Exile!" before falling over dead? :P

In terms of game stats, yes, Nihilus sucks (and not just force power, I mean ;) )

*Watch as ED's mind plummets into the gutter...* :P

it just makes him more menacing since it makes him the evil force of nature that you cannot hope to understand. Nihilus is just the same. To know him is to die.

Well, that's not quite the same now that we've heard from Avellone about it. (While his opinion isn't technically canon it's as good as IMO.)

Sion's "romance" with female exile sucks. Period! Honestly, it is so out of the blue and incredibly cliché that it almost made me long for Malak's phoney laughter...

That I think is subjective given his relatively unknown background. Coming from a random Sith Lord who's never known the player it is a tad facetious, though if he'd served under/trained with/whatever'd the Exile previously it would make more sense. My own theory is that they'd served in the wars togther, but alas, we have no real idea.

*Wishes he'd asked Avellone*

Sephira
10-16-2007, 11:40 PM
@Sephira

Lance Monance is correct. Although if Revan and Exar Kun are the strongest, then why does Kreia tell the exile he/she is the greatest student she ever taught, when she thaught Revan as well? ;) Because 1) Kreia never trained exar kun

2) She said greatest not strongest

garm_bel_iblis
10-17-2007, 09:06 PM
Jae Onasi: Other than the totally idiotic 'I'm going to stand while mortally wounded and monologue you to death or until you run out of dialog tree options, whichever comes last, before I finally fall over and die' ending, I loved Kreia. She's my favorite 'bad guy' (except for maybe HK) in TSL.

HAHAHAHAHAAHAHAAA

Anyway, I agree with everyone who thought Kreia was a great character. I thought she was really deep and I liked her background. The fact that she's a Grey Jedi and she now despises both the Jedi and the Sith for the dogmatic teachings they arrogantly preach was pretty cool. Her objective of trying to find a way to break the Force and wipe it from the galaxy was also really original. It was kind of nice that the central conflict wasn't a villain trying to take over the galaxy with a huge army *yawn. I remember the dialogue written for her was really great, too. "There were ambitions. And my will was not law." Or something very similar to that.

Ben Bryddia
10-18-2007, 01:05 AM
As far as why Sion and Kreia are concirned, I liked both more than Nihilus. In a way, the two (Nihilus and Traya) are psuedo-Sith, they are concirned not at all with the actual goal of galactic domination, nor do they hold true to integratel Sith teachings (example: The Code of the Sith, the Rule of Two{Which Revan beleived in according to the holocron he left behind on Lehon. [source, Darth Bane: Path of Destruction]})

Nihilus is more concirned with feading himself then, conquering, training apprentices, experimenting with Sith alchemy and sorcery, gaining a deeper knowledge of the Dark Side, or subjecting others to oneself. We all know Kreia's insane monomania, so I won't elaborate on that here. Sion, by contrast, is actually a bit more of a true Sith than his mentor and peer in that he actively hunts and destroys Jedi. However, he is also a pseudo-Sith. Due to his tollerating of those above him in power and his lack of other charictaristic Sith traits.

Personaly, I thought Kreia had the most memorable and villianous character because we learned a ton about her, her world veiw (which I dispise) and her history, far more than Sions of Nihilus dark pasts are expounded apon.

Yes, if anyone asks, I do know that it was most likely through desire for power and playing around with Sith teachings of arcane nature that Sion and Nihilus became who they are, they sense seem to have abandoned true Sith dogma. (And true Sith dogma is what distinguishes Sith from dark Jedi.) Kreia herself states during the final monologue that what we fought here ("beasts" I think was one of the modifyers she used.) were not the true Sith, that the true Sith waited for us in the dark.... *not intending to start another "True Sith debate, merely saying what seems pertinant in a discussion of the "Sith Lords".* ;)

-Bearer of the Krijinia.

Totenkopf
10-18-2007, 01:26 AM
*Watch as ED's mind plummets into the gutter...* :P

*still waiting for the sound of water splashing deep in the bowels of the sewer* :xp:

Master Zionosis
10-18-2007, 08:16 AM
Well actually Sion and Kreia were two of my top favourtite characters in KotOR II, I like the character of Kreia and I thought that her character was one of the more thought out party member story lines.

As for Sion, well I just really liked the menacing manor about him, and I really liked his appearance as well, not to mention what made me like him even more was that he was Kreia's apprentice.

As for Nihilus, well, to me he just seemed to boring and appeared like a poser of a sith, thinking himself all powerful, which I thought got old really quickly, I like his appearance yes, but he was just to dull.

Anyway, just my thought on the subject :)

Jediphile
10-18-2007, 03:38 PM
As for Nihilus, well, to me he just seemed to boring and appeared like a poser of a sith, thinking himself all powerful, which I thought got old really quickly, I like his appearance yes, but he was just to dull.

Meh... "I find your lack of faith disturbing..." ;)

Master Zionosis
10-18-2007, 04:27 PM
Meh... "I find your lack of faith disturbing..." ;)

I realise your trying to be funny, but I have no 'faith' in Nihilus, :p he was just so dull, I mean you couldn't even understand what he says, so... For me just way to boring ;)

Breger
10-18-2007, 05:00 PM
Hmm, I'm not sure what I think.
Sure, Sion is one evil-badass-always-dead-and-still-not Sith, with a nice agenda (I think?), but I like Kreia and Nihilus more.
Kreia, no need to say what I like about her, since all has been said, or at least most of it. Her depth of character was the best. I think her dialogues I continued to listen to, even on my third playthrough, while I sped through most of the other characters dialogues. :halo2:

And Nihilus, I had no problem hearing what he said. After all, I'm used to that wierd toilet-flushing speech (Don't ask why), so I had no problem at all hearing what he said. His dialogue was SOOO much better than Kreia's, even if it only where a few minutes of a mixturing of toilet-flushing and a barking dog and an old broken piano-synth.

DarthSomething
10-18-2007, 10:43 PM
Quite a bit of people like Sion and Kreia. If there's any K2 villain that's not getting much love, it's G0-T0. Look at how many mods there are out there that replace him with another character.

Meowster
10-18-2007, 11:32 PM
Quite a bit of people like Sion and Kreia. If there's any K2 villain that's not getting much love, it's G0-T0. Look at how many mods there are out there that replace him with another character.

Now that is VERY true. Most people find (from what I've heard people tell me) G0-T0 a very dull, and simply evil character that they'll do nothing with. While G0-T0 IS evil, if you BOTHER to get influence with him, and take part in his quests, he can be quite the character.

Forgive my rambling...anyway's, in all honesty, I've always liked Kreia and Sion more than Nihlius (how do you say that by the way?) except for Nihlius' intro, that was...somewhat scary, and frightening to a sort (or at least when I first played.

Kreia was IMHO one of the BEST villians ever for all of the reasons listed. I liked Sion alot...except for the creepy romance out-of-nowhere.

Sephira
10-19-2007, 02:43 AM
Now that is VERY true. Most people find (from what I've heard people tell me) G0-T0 a very dull, and simply evil character that they'll do nothing with. While G0-T0 IS evil, if you BOTHER to get influence with him, and take part in his quests, he can be quite the character.

Forgive my rambling...anyway's, in all honesty, I've always liked Kreia and Sion more than Nihlius (how do you say that by the way?) except for Nihlius' intro, that was...somewhat scary, and frightening to a sort (or at least when I first played.

Kreia was IMHO one of the BEST villians ever for all of the reasons listed. I liked Sion alot...except for the creepy romance out-of-nowhere. One of the best villians kotor wise or entire SW wise?

Corinthian
10-19-2007, 03:25 AM
Kreia wasn't that good of a character. "Woo, I'm a Nihilist, I want to blow up the Force with my Superbomb." It's new for Star Wars, but let's face it, in every medium of fiction there's been a bad guy who wants to blow up the whole planet with his giant superlasergun cannon. Sion was just the typical "I hurt, and I wanna make everyone else hurt." and Nihilus was jut Kreia, except even less interesting.

adamqd
10-19-2007, 04:09 AM
I don't like any of them because there not really Sith, they didn't choose the Darkside they were left with no other choice... Nihilus created himself, he clung to the Darkside to save himself and then was trapped in limbo as a slave to power.
Sion could not face death or his decision's, and became a bitter Darkside zombie. (which in my opinion is far more ridiculous than Malak's so called cliche' characteristics)
Kreia went against what she had been trained, and was exiled by the Jedi, so she thought she'd piss them of by creating the Munsters Triumvirate... they told her to go away, so she turned on the force. She's just a bitter old women with abandonment issues.

while the characters are in depth and interesting to a point, I feel myself feeling sorry for them... And that isn't what I want from a Sith :)

Sephira
10-19-2007, 06:43 AM
Right and her attempts to "destroy the force" doesnt seem to fit any purpose, she planned to but even if she succeded in killing the exile or herself, what is there to indicate it will work?

Just because she say it would doesnt mean it would

DarthSomething
10-19-2007, 09:12 AM
I don't like any of them because there not really Sith, they didn't choose the Darkside they were left with no other choice... Nihilus created himself, he clung to the Darkside to save himself and then was trapped in limbo as a slave to power.
Sion could not face death or his decision's, and became a bitter Darkside zombie. (which in my opinion is far more ridiculous than Malak's so called cliche' characteristics)
Kreia went against what she had been trained, and was exiled by the Jedi, so she thought she'd piss them of by creating the Munsters Triumvirate... they told her to go away, so she turned on the force. She's just a bitter old women with abandonment issues.

while the characters are in depth and interesting to a point, I feel myself feeling sorry for them... And that isn't what I want from a Sith :)

Irreverent Declaration: Look at some of the reasons other characters became Sith.

Darth Vader: "Everyone close to me dies, it's NOT FAIR!"

Darth Caedus: [broods a bit, discovers the above reason why his grandpa became a Sith, broods some more, decides to become a Sith].

Corinthian
10-19-2007, 09:41 AM
I can't imagine how you could feel sorry for any of the triumvirate. It's like feeling sorry for cardboard cutouts with Nihilus and Sion, and Kreia only has a little bit more depth. None of them really had any personality or character traits, Kreia was just all of Obi-Wan's "Point of View" crap integrated into a Sith.

adamqd
10-19-2007, 10:10 AM
Irreverent Declaration: Look at some of the reasons other characters became Sith.

Darth Vader: "Everyone close to me dies, it's NOT FAIR!"

Darth Caedus: [broods a bit, discovers the above reason why his grandpa became a Sith, broods some more, decides to become a Sith].


Funnily enough I was gonna point out that Vader was one of my favorite Sith, until his story was explained in the PT, then he became another excuse for Redemption... Darth Caedus is directly linked to Vader and his own fall is a product of his knowledge of Vader's Betrayal, plus they are only a few decades apart, hardly a sum of all the Sith's parts


while the characters are in depth and interesting to a point, I feel myself feeling sorry for them... And that isn't what "I" want from a Sith

I can't imagine how you could feel sorry for any of the triumvirate.

I meant pathetic more than pitiful, My kind of Sith are Naga Sadow, Darth Bane and Palpatine... Not broken Jedi Outcasts.

This doesn't mean I don't Love Ulic Qel-Droma and Anakin/Vader, in fact they are two of my favourite charactors, just not (for lack of a better word) true Sith

Diego Varen
10-19-2007, 02:22 PM
I agree with you, DarthExile27. Sion is my favourite Sith Lord in the KOTOR series and Kreia is one of the best written characters in the series.

I've never liked Nihilus, except in the concept art, where he was fighting Atris.

Corinthian
10-19-2007, 02:55 PM
Also, notice that they seem to have an intense desire to cram as much of Vader in there as they possibly could. Malak with the bad jaw and the grating voice was bad enough, then we had Sion and Nihilus. Two Vader Clones for the price of one.

Jediphile
10-19-2007, 03:29 PM
I can't imagine how you could feel sorry for any of the triumvirate. It's like feeling sorry for cardboard cutouts with Nihilus and Sion, and Kreia only has a little bit more depth. None of them really had any personality or character traits, Kreia was just all of Obi-Wan's "Point of View" crap integrated into a Sith.

I don't feel sorry for Sion, at least not very. It was a harsh fate, but he did little to avoid it, harsh brute that he is.

For Nihilus you just can't know. His strength of character lies entirely in the mystery that surrounds him. Should you feel sorry for him or not? You don't know... And that adds to the threat he represents. It's not bad characterization, but a genuine and intentional choice in storytelling. You can argue that you don't like it, fair enough, but I don't think it's fair to call him a bad character for that reason. The writers made a deliberate choice with the character. Whether we like that choice or not is down to personal taste. It's like saying the end of DS9's "Sacrifice of Angels" episode was "bad" because the writers had the prophets come in and do a deux-ex-machina solution. As the writers of DS9 have said in the past, it's annoying that people don't acknowledge the choice they made in the storytelling - they didn't HAVE to do a deux-ex-machina. It was not a cop-out. They did it because they chose it in light of the greater evolving plot. For Nihilus it's just the same, especially now that Avellone has confirmed that he did have a greater plot in mind for this character.

Kreia I do feel sorry for in a way, however. Because among all the Sith, she is the only one I have ever felt the slightest inkling of sympathy for. Most, if not all, of the other Sith do it for the power or because they think they are themselves the greatest ever or both (and yes, that goes for Anakin too - the whole love thing is just a euphemism he conveniently hides his intents behind). Kreia, however, does not do it for personal gain, but for the greater cause of freeing the innocents of the tyranny of the will of the force. You could call it madness, certainly, but you can say that of any crusader. Is Batman insane for fighting a war against the very concept of crime that can never be won? If so, then he is just as mad as Kreia is. Not that I approve of Kreia, mind you. She is hardly flawless. Most obviously, she's a hypocrite, since she holds the will of the force responsible for using innocent people to further its own wishes, while she resorts to doing exactly the same herself. A pretty big flaw, methinks. Kreia's intentions are good, however, yet in the end only serve to remind us that intentions are exactly what the road to Hell is paved with and - perhaps more importantly - why.

Jeff
10-19-2007, 05:24 PM
I definitely wasn't a big Nihilus fan. Sion was pretty awesome I thought, but I'd say Kreia was definitely the best character in TSL.

BattousaiCV
10-20-2007, 09:46 PM
At the end of my first play through (pure light side), I came to understand Kreia's POV and actually wanted to let her destroy the Force!

Shadow Talon
10-21-2007, 03:51 AM
Nihilus was to me the saddest character of the Sith. Come to think of it he wasn't a true Sith. His role reminds me of Galactus in Marvel comics. Destined to live forever but must feed on the force to survive or he will consume himself. Like the Miraluka saed he was a great man once. His image of a tall figure slowly crouching under the pain of his hunger truly makes me sad. Man, I really was sad when I had to stop him. And his end...
Slowly to be consumed into the empty void listening to the fugue of oblivion as I grasp for air is not how I would like to end. In some way killing him was mercy.
Rest in peace Nihilus:*(

Nancy Allen``
11-06-2007, 05:52 PM
Why no love for them? Easy, they're both Sith. To go into a little more detail, Kreia is manipulative and supports some rather dark sided options (such as convincing the Exchange to kill a sick refugee) and Sion, I always think back to Korriban.

spawn613
11-06-2007, 06:38 PM
so i was about level 25 when i fought the three sith's and they were a freakin push over. not to mention there was nothing to them. especially nihilus. he's made out to be the big baddie this whole time and he's the first one you fight. it should've been sion, kreia, THEN nihilus. he even had a pimp ship too. i've never thought of that concept for a ship to be barely together but floating through space and wailing on colonies. same thing for the concept of sion. i try to design a new slick lookin' sith lord, but they made one who is barely together and still kickin' your azzizzle (that was bad i know). they're pretty much the same in a way if you look at it. (sion and the ravager) but anyway, kreia's incredibly long speeches and everything still don't contain a story that sucked me in, although the writing throughout the game is beyond me. i would've given up at the second character if i had to write all that stuff and come up with different variables, etc. i don't know how to explain but it's just not the same with these sith and the sith in the first KOTOR.

Corinthian
11-08-2007, 11:55 PM
The big plot twist was pretty bad, too. "Kreia's evil?" Did anyone NOT see that coming?

Rev7
11-09-2007, 01:37 AM
I know that I saw it coming.....

Darth Chronus
11-09-2007, 06:15 AM
It seems that I am the only one who likes Nihilus much more the other Sith. Well...

I remember when I firstly played KotOR II, and I was never really interested about him until I saw the video of Traya's betrayal. He looked really cool, being able to cast down a Sith Lord by a force push, while Kreia states ''there are techniques within the force agianst which there is no defense''.

Also, his appearance looks great as his name. He is a Sith Lord with mysterious past and powers, and totally consumed by the hunger for power. A nearly living man with the ability to drain all life out from someone.

And his voice sounds pretty cool to me. I couldn't imagine him have a voice as Sion(he has perfect voice but fits only him) or Malak(Ha-ha-ha-ha....ha-ha-ha).

I think that most people criticize him because they played too much times the game and got bored of him. But try to remember the first time you played it.

And don't blame him for being so easy to beat and dies so early in the game. Blame the creators of the game.

Corinthian
11-09-2007, 12:51 PM
The first time I played him, I thought he was incredibly lame. His voice made less sense than the average opera.

Meowster
11-10-2007, 05:41 PM
Really? I thought Nihlius seemed..really dark. The way he choked Visas, and then spoke in the crazy 'Sith' language, sent me chills. The fight, however, was a major letdown.

Corinthian
11-10-2007, 05:48 PM
Oh, man, he choked Visas. Who cares? You know when I first saw that? THE ORIGINAL STAR WARS.

Meowster
11-10-2007, 05:55 PM
Meh. I think anyone whom is willing to choke someone merely over nothing is crazy, and scary, and Vader was simply insulted.

I'm not really that scared of Vader, seeing the PT first. Anyways, I'm going off-topic.

And the fact that he could kill worlds, people, and creatures in nearly no time at all, gave a few points to him.

Rev7
11-10-2007, 06:22 PM
No character is perfect. I think that Nihilihus was also a 'major letdown'.

Meowster
11-10-2007, 06:35 PM
Nihlius was indeed a 'letdown'. It went from building up...building up...to being killed by a Sith Apprentice and Mandalorian as I watch from the sidelines.

Honestly, I don't think anyone really hates Kreia. People just love to hate her...

Sion? He was a little interisting...but meh, I feel like Sion didn't really do anything towards the plot, aside from being Kreia's apprentice.

Corinthian
11-10-2007, 07:03 PM
You saw the Prequel Trilogy first? I'm sorry.

Nancy Allen``
11-10-2007, 07:16 PM
The fight, however, was a major letdown.

Give credit to the game being rushed out incomplete. Team Gizka are working on fixing this and other parts of the game in their restoration project and from whst's been seen it looks to rock.

Meowster
11-10-2007, 07:31 PM
Oh, I was not meaning that. Team Gizka isn't changing anything with this battle though. I understand why he was weak, because he could kill anyone whom was with the force. The Exile, was not, which gave him/her an advantage.

JoeDoe 2.0
11-10-2007, 07:38 PM
Why no love for the you ask? Because they are fugly and only fugly people get love when they pay for it. :xp:

Getting serious, I like both characters, although Kreia's and Sion's background history and characters should have been expanded more, and also Nihilus, and just because they are Sith doesn't mean they aren't cool. Dark Side FTW, but you know the DRUNK SIDE PWNS them all.

Nancy Allen``
11-10-2007, 10:47 PM
Team Gizka isn't changing anything with this battle though.

You sure? Here's what I found from the trailer (spoilers)

Atris meditating with the Sith holocrons, the HK factory, HK units on Dantoine I think, a bomber telling the Exile the base they're in will explode and wipe out the Genoharada, GOTO informing the bounty hunters that the Genoharada are of no concern, HK 47 contronting and killing GOTO, ordering all HK units to stop him, the Mercenary captain on Dantoine, ordering to prepare for war, Nihilous forcing the Exile and Visas to fight each other, Mical telling the Exile that it's not too late to change her path while trapped in a force cage on Malechor, Nililous lifting up and force choking the Exile and Visas, the Exile defeated before Sion and Kreia, and extra scenes with the bounty hunters. I think that's most of them.

Meowster
11-10-2007, 10:56 PM
From what I've read, all thats changed with Nihlius is that...you could lie, or tell the truth, and be his apprentice (not sure if they're adding it) and extra ways to kill Visas. I could be wrong...I'll check the site, and source myself.

EDIT: [R] Nihilus Fight expanded - Nihilus raises Visas and the PC up. PC then has the option of becoming his apprentice (lie or not). If lie then the PC and Visas attack Nihilus. If truth, PC turns on Visas and kills her. Either way, PC fights Nihilus. When Visas does die, Mandalore chips in with some dlg and the PC can just leave her to die alone or mercy kill her.


I guess we're both correct in a sense. The fight is expanded...but by dissapointment, I meant the battle. I think his character was very mysterious...

Lance Monance
11-11-2007, 04:30 AM
Give credit to the game being rushed out incomplete. Team Gizka are working on fixing this and other parts of the game in their restoration project and from whst's been seen it looks to rock.

Its kinda difficult to make the fight better/epic. More hitpoints on Nihilus is dull, more damage per hit on Nihilus likewise. Unfortunately the AI is total crap.

I suppose you could script some events though, to make it a better battle.

Sephira
11-13-2007, 11:59 AM
Oh, I was not meaning that. Team Gizka isn't changing anything with this battle though. I understand why he was weak, because he could kill anyone whom was with the force. The Exile, was not, which gave him/her an advantage.Excuse me? Any one with the force? Sorry but luke and sidious > nihilus. Both of them have the fallanasi technique which will defend against nihilus force severing ability.



And the fact that he could kill worlds, people, and creatures in nearly no time at all, gave a few points to him. Firstly he doesn't "kill worlds", He just feeds on whats on the worlds, and nothing indicates that he kills them "in nearly no time at all" other than speculation