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LukeDavis93
04-08-2008, 08:58 PM
why does he hold his lightsaber in such a fruity way? see here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HfdifzbRP-U

Qwerty Uiop
04-08-2008, 11:06 PM
I actually think it looks pretty cool, even though it's not my favorite.

Still, I won't worry about something like that in a game where you can toss crates into an oncoming TIE Fighter.

Zerimar Nyliram
04-09-2008, 12:10 AM
What strikes me as "fruity" the most is how the AI constantly hang onto each other as you're lifting them through the air. I mean, yeah, it's cool that they could design such realistic mechanics and all, but they do it entirely too often.

Nedak
04-09-2008, 12:40 AM
Yeah it doesn't seem very realistic if you were to deflect lasers or even defend yourself against other sabers.

I also agree with Zerimar, they do it way to often.

Jeff
04-09-2008, 01:37 AM
Well I think no matter how often two stormtroopers get lifted off the ground they are always going to try to save themselves.

They gave him the unique lightsaber grip just to make his style different and probably just to show that he's not your typical Jedi.

Rabish Bini
04-09-2008, 05:39 AM
I love it, cos it reminds me of the cyborg ninja from MGS, he holds his katana in the same way, and is an absolute beast to play with.
But, I don't see it as fruity, I think its pretty cool. :D

Ztalker
04-09-2008, 05:56 AM
The style isn't unique. It's called

The variant form known as Shien is a rarely seen style that, while effective, is almost a topic of controversy among lightsaber masters due to the drastically different grip taught by practitioners of the form. The style calls for the Jedi to hold the lightsaber horizontally with the tip of the blade out away from the body, and all strikes are made by sweeping the arm forward as though throwing a punch while whipping the blade forward quickly in a broad arc. Adi Gallia was one of the few Jedi around the time of the Clone Wars known to actively practice the form, as was the Anzati Jedi called Nikkos Tyris. It may also have been used by Vader's apprentice during The Great Jedi Purge.

Not to be confused with the standard Form V variant of Shien.
It was introduced with Kotor 2...but Kotor 2 didn't use different animations for the fighting styles. Or else it would have been a like in TFU as well.
And by the way, the newly released video's also show Vader for a second having his saber in this style before switching. This possibly means there are multiple styles. :)

adamqd
04-09-2008, 10:23 AM
the newly released video's also show Vader for a second having his saber in this style before switching. This possibly means there are multiple styles. :)


Lets hope so, That would be cool

Ztalker
04-09-2008, 10:56 AM
adamqd wrote:
Lets hope so, That would be cool

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=57Q2Sa9Qio8&eurl=http://www.forceunleashed.net/

1:02 - 1:04 : Apprentice holding the saber in a normal way, slashing a monster (just pres pause)
1:24 - 1:29 again, fighting a AT-ST
1:39 - 1:42 Two Jedi fighting, different stances
2:10 - 2:22 Several Jedi are 'selected' in the menu and show their different opening stances. Last seconds shows Luke vs Apprentice, obviously two different saber styles
4:48 - 4:50 Vader using APPRENTICE (backward saber) stance

Seems enough proof for me :)

littleman794
04-09-2008, 12:41 PM
ya, they kind of made it so when the apprentice was running, walking, or using the force, he held it in the "unique" way. But if you watch him fighting he holds it normally, and as soon as he stops swinging his light saber it "FLASHES" back to the "unique" position.

Nedak
04-09-2008, 01:36 PM
ya, they kind of made it so when the apprentice was running, walking, or using the force, he held it in the "unique" way. But if you watch him fighting he holds it normally, and as soon as he stops swinging his light saber it "FLASHES" back to the "unique" position.

If that's still the case, it's still pretty stupid. There is no real advantage of having it like that

littleman794
04-09-2008, 04:02 PM
except to look good. I have to admit, it is one heck of a cool stance...

on some article that i read, it said that he held it like that because he would punch, and the light saber would happen to hit people on the side, it was a pretty weird article...

but ya, in the videos i have watched it does that "FLASH" way...kinda stupid if you ask me...

LukeDavis93
04-10-2008, 12:18 AM
If that's still the case, it's still pretty stupid. There is no real advantage of having it like that
exactly,
and it doesn't look good, it looks complicated. the saber style better be customizable or I will be mad

Astor
04-10-2008, 04:23 AM
the saber style better be customizable or I will be mad

I don't understand why people are getting so worked up and upset about things like this - The story is, and should be the most important thing in the game - not the way someone holds a saber.

And how is it complicated? You simply hold it 'upside down'. You see people do this in action films with knives and such.

And what is 'good' is different depending on people. I quite like it - it looks 'feral'.

Nedak
04-10-2008, 03:29 PM
^
Of course the story is the most important, but the whole game is suppose to launch you into the Star Wars Universe. It's suppose to make it feel like those things are actually plausible. With all these canonical mistakes Star Wars Fans won't feel like they are doing anything realistic based on Star Wars.

I personally won't whine over the saber style but it does make the man look like an idiot of a Jedi.

Also, Action films? Come on, don't get into that. You can't deflect bullets with a knife buddy, nor do you sword fight other people with knives. That's why it's called "Sword fighting". Kinda goes with Light Saber because it's "A saber" very similar to a "Sword".

mrpanicy
04-10-2008, 03:47 PM
Its the same style that the Dark Jedi that killed Corran Horns father used, if I am not mistaken.

Though that Jedi held the hilt down and in front. But I would imagine this would give him an easier way of using the force. Move his arm quicker without fear of cutting it off. Also, this would allow for some cool and quick motions for attack and defense. It's more feasible that you may think.

Nedak
04-10-2008, 03:52 PM
Though that Jedi held the hilt down and in front. But I would imagine this would give him an easier way of using the force. Move his arm quicker without fear of cutting it off. Also, this would allow for some cool and quick motions for attack and defense. It's more feasible that you may think.

Jedi also know where their blades are, to avoid hurting themselves. If this were even the case the same claim could be made for cutting his legs off.

Both and attack wouldn't work. Try holding a sword that way and you'll see what I mean. It limits your hand to a slashing motion. No stabbing, no blocking, and it puts your hand at a weak point.

Astor
04-10-2008, 04:03 PM
Also, Action films? Come on, don't get into that. You can't deflect bullets with a knife buddy, nor do you sword fight other people with knives. That's why it's called "Sword fighting". Kinda goes with Light Saber because it's "A saber" very similar to a "Sword".

I know very well that 'saber' is a type of sword. I was using the knife thing to demonstrate a different grip, that was all.

I think that this might be more an issue of familiarity than anything else. Every Jedi we see in the films, and basically everyone in the EU uses it in the 'traditional' sense - who's to say he can't use it that way?

Nedak
04-10-2008, 04:59 PM
I think that this might be more an issue of familiarity than anything else. Every Jedi we see in the films, and basically everyone in the EU uses it in the 'traditional' sense - who's to say he can't use it that way?

Of course you can, but it just leaves the person at a very low advantage.

It would be the same issue if a fencer tried to hold their sword backwards and fence.

He might as well fight with a mini-knife-like Lightsaber, it would be the same thing.

JoeDoe 2.0
04-10-2008, 05:04 PM
Every Jedi/Sith has their own fighting style that suits them (how they hold their blade for certan techniques), like the stance Dooku uses when he fights, they may feel comfortable like that. ( I wouldn't)

littleman794
04-10-2008, 05:40 PM
the thing is, like i said earlier:

ya, they kind of made it so when the apprentice was running, walking, or using the force, he held it in the "unique" way. But if you watch him fighting he holds it normally, and as soon as he stops swinging his light saber it "FLASHES" back to the "unique" position.

so what now?

SecretVader
04-20-2008, 02:31 PM
Now let's think here for a minute. He's been trained to hold his saber like that (or it was just his personal preference and has still been trained to do it like that) for several years. That means he should have enough experience holding it like that to be able to use it effectively.

Saying that holding it like this is not logical brings us back to Darth Maul and Maris Brood. With a double-bladed lightsaber like that, Maul could have cut himself in half with just a flick of his wrist. And Brood's lightsabers have an obvious disadvantage on the handles, or she could swing them around and, just like that, she has no more arms. And let us not forget that the handles of all lightsabers are vulnerable in any fight. Is any of that logical? No.

What you've got to realize is that these people have been trained like this for years. They know how to do this because it's their own style, and they've been practicing it for years. Maul knew how to control his lightsaber because he practiced for years; this is undoubtedly the same with the Apprentice and Brood. So saying the form looks fruity just because he's holding it behind his back is not a really legitimate reason for hating it.

And the reason he "flashes" it back to behind his back is because, once again, he's been trained like that, and he probably feels comfortable keeping it there, since he's only known this style his whole life and nothing else. Besides, you all are missing the one big advantage of his saber position; suppose he's holding a stormie in mid-air, and one sneaks up behind him. Using his obvious mastery of the Force, he deflects the shots behind his back back to the stormie, killing the stormie and allowing him to kill the other one he's got in his grip.

Besides, there have been more erratic forms of lightsaber combat than this one (Yoda anyone?). Mace Windu style is also an example of the many erratic forms of saber combat there are in the Star Wars universe; Vaapad was Windu's creation, and he could use it to deflect the Force with his saber. That's sounds more exotic than this instance of holding a lightsaber the way the SA does.

In short, I think it fits his personality to hold the lightsaber like that. Besides, it gives him not only an awesome air, but a more hardcore air as well. And it's probably also the only time we've actually seen (not read, seen) someone do it like this, so it's awesome for me.

TKA-001
04-20-2008, 04:13 PM
Besides, there have been more erratic forms of lightsaber combat than this one (Yoda anyone?)
Yoda's style was the way it was because there's no other way he'd be able to use a saber at all.

Vaapad was Windu's creation, and he could use it to deflect the Force with his saber.
Deflecting energy attacks (in that case lightning) is just something a lightsaber does, not an ability granted by use of a lightsaber form.

In short, I think it fits his personality to hold the lightsaber like that. Besides, it gives him not only an awesome air, but a more hardcore air as well. And it's probably also the only time we've actually seen (not read, seen) someone do it like this, so it's awesome for me.
I suppose so, but Maris Brood's lightsabers are still as stupid as hell.

adamqd
04-20-2008, 04:25 PM
I suppose so, but Maris Brood's lightsabers are still as stupid as hell.

Agreed! You'd lose your elbows on the first parry

PoiuyWired
04-20-2008, 04:36 PM
Agreed! You'd lose your elbows on the first parry

Its a form that would nullify the advantages of BOTH the tonfa and the lightsaber AT THE SAME TIME.

Go try something like that at a sparring session and you can see how many times you would be pwn3d trying to use a weapon like that. That is why she deserves to be killid by SA I guess.

SecretVader
04-20-2008, 09:41 PM
I still think that if you're trained to use them, you will be able to use them with such eliteness that there's hardly any way someone will be able to stop you with them.

Still, they do have a stupid design, at best.

And when I'm talking about Mace using Vaapad and his saber to negate the effects of the Force, I'm talking about when he used it to block the Force Storm power. I know why he can block the lightning.

TKA-001
04-20-2008, 10:45 PM
He blocks the lightning because the saber blocks it.

Astor
04-21-2008, 04:22 AM
Yeah, it's nothing to do with what form they use. Mace Windu was the only one who used Vaapad (with the exception of maybe Sora Bulq), yet in AOTC Obi Wan can block lightning with a lightsaber.

It's just something the lightsaber does, about level with deflecting blaster bolts.

adamqd
04-21-2008, 10:27 AM
I understand where secretvader is coming from because a lot of sources state Mace Windu, with use of Vaapad, could reflect the lightning back to its source with a "superconducting loop" (ROTS Novel) which to me sound's like his style does afford him that skill. but my theory is that the Lightning would ground itself on the Blade ala Obi in AOTC.

anyway, on topic: Tonfa's are no good as Sabers IMO (In theory, TFU may make it work?) but the Reverse grip doesn't bother me.

holyhyan
04-21-2008, 04:52 PM
I've read somewhere the developpers gave him the reverse grip because the player mostly sees the back of the apprentice. Because the lightsaber is such an iconic weapon for the jedi/sith, they decided to give him the reverse grip so it allows the player to see it all the time in the hands of the apprentice. Plus it adds something new we've not really seen before and I think it looks rather nice.

littleman794
04-22-2008, 12:09 PM
Yes, i very much agree with holyhyan.....that makes a lot of sense....:xp:

Jeff
04-22-2008, 12:11 PM
That actually is what the developers said about his reverse grip, in one of the videos, can't remember which though.

littleman794
04-22-2008, 12:20 PM
^they do?....hmm, i will have so look into that....

thanks a lot...

Ali1392
05-01-2008, 04:49 PM
it would work quite well for stabing people and doing sallow slashes in front of you but not all that useful for sabre fightings as you would get your arm cut off but i really hope they do let you use the 7 different styles

JoeDoe 2.0
05-01-2008, 05:44 PM
^they do?....hmm, i will have so look into that....

thanks a lot...


PWND!!!

But, does it really matter how he holds the lightsaber? Unless it has an impact on dueling then I don't really much care

Ctrl Alt Del
05-01-2008, 08:31 PM
God, some people are just way too orthodox. What's it matter if he's not holding it on the usual way? It's cool. :doo1:

Gurges-Ahter
05-01-2008, 10:30 PM
God, some people are just way too orthodox. What's it matter if he's not holding it on the usual way? It's cool. :doo1:
Agreed, 100%. Additionally, and not that it matters, but lots of people in the real world do things differently. I've seen people hold pencils/pens all crazy in their hands, but they write just as well. Some pitchers have strange wind-ups or unorthodox ball deliveries but they pitch just the same, if not better. Left-handed people do everything weird, IMO. Who cares? Perhaps the SA feels like a total badass, and holds his saber that way to taunt his opponents. What does it matter? I think it looks cool.

Serpentine Cougar
05-01-2008, 11:18 PM
Just wait till they come out with an ambidextrous (http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/ambidextrous) Jedi with a p4wnz0r hand-switching style, the lightsaber dancing between his hands faster than the opponent can follow. It'd be like in Princess Bride: "I have something to tell you. I am not left-handed."

Sorry, Gurges-Ahter's comment about left-handed people just got me thinking....

Gurges-Ahter
05-01-2008, 11:27 PM
Good call, Serpentine. I'd never thought of that. I always thought it would be really cool if a quarterback was totally ambidextrous (and talented, of course), and could throw from either hand on the run. He would have no limits on plays to be run, unpredictability, and he would be especially effective on bootlegs. I guess the same could be said for a Jedi. Although I'd imagine many of them are pretty ambidextrous since they can wield two lightsabers pretty handily and the double lightsaber probably requires some ambidextrosity as well (ok so it's not a word, but it makes sense here).

Ztalker
05-02-2008, 06:40 AM
Too bad most Jedi use the saber in their 'off-hand' (or 'bad' hand) to defend themselves with...it's not really ambidextrous :)

Ctrl Alt Del
05-02-2008, 08:16 AM
Just wait till they come out with an ambidextrous (http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/ambidextrous) Jedi with a p4wnz0r hand-switching style, the lightsaber dancing between his hands faster than the opponent can follow. It'd be like in Princess Bride: "I have something to tell you. I am not left-handed."
That's harder than it looks.

I'm ambidextrous, and I can say that switching hands fast as if you didn't had any off-hand is kinda hard to do. We (at least I do) need ten seconds to fully change hands.

Serpentine Cougar
05-05-2008, 11:31 PM
That's harder than it looks.

I'm ambidextrous, and I can say that switching hands fast as if you didn't had any off-hand is kinda hard to do. We (at least I do) need ten seconds to fully change hands.
Oh. Well, you could always fall back on the "Well they're Jedi, they can do almost anything," card.

/exaggeration.

PoiuyWired
05-07-2008, 01:03 AM
That's harder than it looks.

I'm ambidextrous, and I can say that switching hands fast as if you didn't had any off-hand is kinda hard to do. We (at least I do) need ten seconds to fully change hands.

Practice.

But its true that even for the ambidextrous few have "off-hand" when it comes to specific tasks. I can only write/fps well with my right hand.

But yes, switching hands is useful in swordfights. Remember, you usually get a few inches more if you stab with the left hand, amongst other things such as different attack angles and distance.

Da_man
05-07-2008, 08:59 PM
Practice.

QFE.

You can do almost anything if you practice enough. It's called "Learning."

Ryazan
08-20-2008, 04:52 PM
All you have to do to switch is grip the weapon with both hands for a split second and let go with the hand that was holding it before. It's useful for switching up your attack angles to catch the opponent off guard.

M@RS
08-20-2008, 04:56 PM
That's harder than it looks.

I'm ambidextrous, and I can say that switching hands fast as if you didn't had any off-hand is kinda hard to do. We (at least I do) need ten seconds to fully change hands.

I'm somewhat ambidextrous, I taught myself to play the drums left and right handed, it's fun :D

Ryazan
08-20-2008, 09:00 PM
Ctrl Alt Del, I'm sure you're exaggerating when you say 10 seconds. Unless your hands are partially paralyzed or something.

heartless
08-21-2008, 12:30 AM
Its a form that would nullify the advantages of BOTH the tonfa and the lightsaber AT THE SAME TIME.

Go try something like that at a sparring session and you can see how many times you would be pwn3d trying to use a weapon like that. That is why she deserves to be killid by SA I guess.

Whoever adapted the tonfa to be used as a weapon is turning in his grave every time Maris Brood's ludicrous weapons are mentioned.

Ryazan
08-21-2008, 02:48 PM
PoiuyWired, think about it. If tonfas are so ineffective and unsafe, all that means is that Maris Brood has some serious skill. And she could hold them like regular sabers if she wanted.

Da_man
08-22-2008, 12:12 AM
Whoever adapted the tonfa to be used as a weapon is turning in his grave every time Maris Brood's ludicrous weapons are mentioned.

I am a Balck Belt in karate, and using tonfas as a weapon isn't as hard as it seems. The saber tonfa is a little ludicrous, but with some training, it's doable.

heartless
08-22-2008, 12:21 AM
I am a Balck Belt in karate, and using tonfas as a weapon isn't as hard as it seems. The saber tonfa is a little ludicrous, but with some training, it's doable.

I'm a black belt in Matsubayashi Ryu Karate and I want to slap the newb who wanted to add tonfas as Jedi weapons. Wassup?

Edit: There is a difference between using tonfas and using lightsaber tonfas. If your teacher has ever tought you to use tonfas, picture lightsabers instead of tonfas. Picture trying to brace a lightsaber tonfa after a swing. Just do it.

I can tell you this much, I've studied okinawan karate since I was 11 years old, I'm 29 now, I've also been a huge Starwars fan. But as soon as I saw Maris Brood and her tonfa lightsabers I wanted to throw up. Simply because anyone who knows anything about melee combat will tell you that her weapons will be more of a disadvantage than anything else. And yes, I've studied tonfa combat.

The Dope Boys are in this. Wassup?

Da_man
08-22-2008, 12:26 AM
What is so different between tonfas and the other freaky lightsabers that make you people hate them?

Astor
08-22-2008, 07:51 AM
But as soon as I saw Maris Brood and her tonfa lightsabers I wanted to throw up. Simply because anyone who knows anything about melee combat will tell you that her weapons will be more of a disadvantage than anything else. And yes, I've studied tonfa combat.

The Dope Boys are in this. Wassup?

Sure, to an ordinary, earth-bound human they'd be a disadvantage. But you're forgetting about a certain magical energy called the Force.

And I don't see why all these martial arts people get so wound up about these things - it's a fantasy world - it doesn't have to follow real world norms and restraints.

If you forget about these things, and try to enjoy it, you might have a little fun by accident. :)