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K_Kinnison
10-22-2008, 05:41 PM
What is the point of playing Jedi when you have to follow rules and are limited in what you can do

Yet a Sith only should have to worry about other sith who might see them as a threat.. yet I doubt we will ever see that happen in the game.. we certainly didn't see that in SW:Galaxies.

So in short, SIth get to do whatever they want, with no restrictions, and would think becoming a Jedi as punishment. Yet Jedi have to be Galactic Boy scouts or risk becoming sith themselves.

seems kinda unfair

Ztalker
10-22-2008, 05:45 PM
Sith:
-Yah. I'd love to compete to the death with fellow classmates for the function of apprentice.
-Yah, I love the wrinkles and corrupted body you get when you go DS.
-Yah, you can't heal yourself with the Force. Seems unlucky in a war.
-Everyone will be preying on your position. The strongest one wins.

Not a nice environment. :xp:

RoxStar
10-22-2008, 05:53 PM
So in short, SIth get to do whatever they want, with no restrictions, and would think becoming a Jedi as punishment. Yet Jedi have to be Galactic Boy scouts or risk becoming sith themselves.

seems kinda unfair


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Morality :D

In all seriousness it's been made clear that the Jedi feel a calling in their lives much like priests, monks, and others that dedicate themselves to an ideal. They believe in peace and only use fighting as self-defense. While a Jedi believes in discipline and restraint the Sith lust for power and domination.

Plus we all know that the Sith have way higher insurance premiums on their cruisers with such aggressive drivers :p

Ztalker
10-22-2008, 05:59 PM
O yeah,

being Sith does not come with dental care in it's insurance package...

http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j176/AgentDragon/Maulsnarl.jpg

RyuuKage
10-22-2008, 06:28 PM
jedi tend to live longer XD

tKon
10-22-2008, 06:43 PM
They live longer as a whole yes, but individually I'd say vice versa. That is to say that you would be striving to become the strongest Sith. If ya don't you're a goner :D While Jedi will accept any body that plays by the "rules".

K_Kinnison
10-22-2008, 07:16 PM
Do you really think the game designers will create a perma-death for Sith characters? Otherwise it is rather pointless to use it as an argument

RyuuKage
10-22-2008, 07:32 PM
Do you really think the game designers will create a perma-death for Sith characters? Otherwise it is rather pointless to use it as an argument

it was a joke, but now that you bring that up....

how exactly would the constant struggle against your Sith associates work when everyone respawns? You might beat one guy in a fair fight, beat a second, and then all of a sudden out of nowhere the first guy comes in and whollops your severely weakened self...the Sith mentality kinda requires perma-death to function properly or it's just an endless civil war. Maybe they'll judge by the number of victories or something...

Web Rider
10-22-2008, 07:35 PM
it was a joke, but now that you bring that up....

how exactly would the constant struggle against your Sith associates work when everyone respawns? You might beat one guy in a fair fight, beat a second, and then all of a sudden out of nowhere the first guy comes in and whollops your severely weakened self...the Sith mentality kinda requires perma-death to function properly or it's just an endless civil war. Maybe they'll judge by the number of victories or something...

They won't have perma death for that exact reason. Nobody wants to get ganked after a hard fight by an annoying player and have to start the game all over from scratch.

They will probably have something like WoW's arena system. Battles between players of the same faction will be pitted, non-deathmatch events. And yeah, this is gonna run contrary to the Sith idea of kill or be killed, but lets face it, they're gonna have to do it that way if they want to keep players happy.

RyuuKage
10-22-2008, 07:37 PM
They won't have perma death for that exact reason. Nobody wants to get ganked after a hard fight by an annoying player and have to start the game all over from scratch.

They will probably have something like WoW's arena system. Battles between players of the same faction will be pitted, non-deathmatch events. And yeah, this is gonna run contrary to the Sith idea of kill or be killed, but lets face it, they're gonna have to do it that way if they want to keep players happy.

yeah, that would work. Plus, they could always be a little divergent from the usual Sith...I mean, they probably want as much cannon-fodder Sith as possible for the war, after all. XD

Sabretooth
10-23-2008, 12:28 AM
Well for one, Sith would be vulnerable to both Jedi and Sith. So if we're in a Jedi-Sith fight, one Sith may just slaughter the other. The Jedi, on the other hand will work together in a team.

But I'm sure there will be some sort of balancing mechanisms anyways. :/

knight 12167
10-23-2008, 04:56 AM
I have he perfect soloution

a grey jedi

Ztalker
10-23-2008, 05:04 AM
Well for one, Sith would be vulnerable to both Jedi and Sith. So if we're in a Jedi-Sith fight, one Sith may just slaughter the other. The Jedi, on the other hand will work together in a team.

But I'm sure there will be some sort of balancing mechanisms anyways. :/

You have a rather good point here :(

The dev's did mention the 'Sith training.' And everyone remembering the Kotor 1 Sith training knows how that goes...being rewards for killing fellow classmates...it's the essence of the Sith. But how to put it in the game? Like you said, balance is lost is the Sith turn on each other.

Tommycat
10-23-2008, 05:37 AM
Why bother with being either when you can be a scoundrel and have fun without being killed by both. er well hunted...

wait... darnit.. bounty hunters.... and other smugglers... and disreputable buyers... and reputable buyers... and....

SW01
10-23-2008, 09:45 AM
Just play as a Jawa and hide from everyone! :xp:

Maybe the thing will be arranged so that only so many people get to become Sith every...week? Month? Whatever, anyway - maybe there will be, as suggested, non-deathmatch contests, tournaments, to decide who gets to ascend in that cycle.

Istorian
10-24-2008, 06:41 AM
I'd personally like to play as a Jedi, and co-operate with the other Jedi to kill Sith...The master-apprentice system that works in SW Galaxies is a very good example of how the relationship between master and apprentice should go...But that's just my opinion.

|I|

Darca Lar
12-09-2009, 04:17 PM
jedi tend to live longer XD

Non-force users like smugglers live longer since they avoid confrontations when possible. Jedi are always battling Sith and weighed down by restrictions; while the Sith face everyone and themselves.

RC-2067 "Evo"
07-29-2011, 12:01 AM
Sith are awesome, don't get me wrong, but it comes down to power or doing what's right. It feels good to do the right thing, even if it's in a game.

LordVader1
07-30-2011, 06:42 PM
I dont agree. JEDI ROCK.

Master Finch
08-23-2011, 10:33 PM
To be honest, the Jedi will always be the winners. You don't need fancy lightning skills or fancy choking skills when you've got Stasis Field to freeze people and Force Wave to stun people.

That was seriously overpowered in KotOR. I even Force Confusion'd Sion and he didn't hurt me.

DarthJacen
08-25-2011, 11:20 PM
Wow, this was a huge necro! Some of the posts from the top are from the first day! I, think, the devs have covered this content in their recent E3 interviews, so if anyone needs reminding. It's on the Internet somewhere.

berryla
10-26-2011, 03:40 AM
Everyone will be preying on your position. The strongest one wins.

Scorge
10-26-2011, 08:14 AM
To be honest, the Jedi will always be the winners. You don't need fancy lightning skills or fancy choking skills when you've got Stasis Field to freeze people and Force Wave to stun people.

That was seriously overpowered in KotOR. I even Force Confusion'd Sion and he didn't hurt me.

I agree on that

Hallucination
10-26-2011, 02:37 PM
Sith:
-Yah. I'd love to compete to the death with fellow classmates for the function of apprentice.
. . .
-Everyone will be preying on your position. The strongest one wins.

Not a nice environment. :xp:
O yeah,

being Sith does not come with dental care in it's insurance package...

http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j176/AgentDragon/Maulsnarl.jpg
So, are you saying that the Sith operate in a fully free market and the Jedi are unionised? :confused:

Droma Nise
10-26-2011, 09:05 PM
I think every class will have it limitations

Ascended_Mike
10-27-2011, 09:44 AM
I reckon that sith killing sith will be done in dialogue choices and campaign etc, killing NPCs as you train? But that's just me...

Ztalker
10-28-2011, 06:45 AM
So, are you saying that the Sith operate in a fully free market and the Jedi are unionised? :confused:

Of course the Jedi are unionised.
Anakin instantly got an arm prosthetic after losing one. That's normally a huge pile of paperwork. Would you claim it was a work-related accident or clumsiness? Also, I bet a large number of Jedi survived order 66 but kind of lost the right to demonstrate when Palpatine took power and hid.
They're unionised, proven.

And name me a Sith without mental, physical or dental damage.

J4ngo
10-29-2011, 02:36 PM
Non-force users like smugglers live longer since they avoid confrontations when possible. Jedi are always battling Sith and weighed down by restrictions; while the Sith face everyone and themselves.

lol im gonna have a bounty hunter character,a trooper character,and if possible a imperial agent character :D
so the people who are looking to be a force user should watch their step...

J4ngo
10-29-2011, 02:40 PM
To be honest, the Jedi will always be the winners. You don't need fancy lightning skills or fancy choking skills when you've got Stasis Field to freeze people and Force Wave to stun people.

That was seriously overpowered in KotOR. I even Force Confusion'd Sion and he didn't hurt me.

noooooooo jedi's aren't always winners.no one profession or person is always a winner. i killed a few force users in some star wars games, I even killed a planet of soldiers in the star wars games so stop saying 1 prof is overpowered cuz it DEPENDS on YOUR play style.

Lynk Former
10-30-2011, 12:58 AM
From the looks of it, very few people are gonna end up being troopers... at least as their main character.

I feel so alone.

Mav
10-30-2011, 02:05 AM
From the looks of it, very few people are gonna end up being troopers... at least as their main character.

I feel so alone.http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-Qn8M6OJJQXQ/Th3KsCDZZQI/AAAAAAAAC04/zoh-Lkf_Ank/s1600/forever_alone.jpg

Ztalker
11-14-2011, 12:06 PM
From the looks of it, very few people are gonna end up being troopers... at least as their main character.

I feel so alone.

Which is ironic since they work in squads.
I still hope the balance will be allright...that people will think and play something else then Jedi. That's why I'm going for Sith...I bet the balance on Imperial side will be better considering tere's Bounty Hunters and snipers in there too, which will appeal more to people then Trooper and Smuggler...although that cowboy-hat-style smuggler looked cool...

adamqd
11-14-2011, 02:13 PM
From the looks of it, very few people are gonna end up being troopers...

If they didn't dress them like jobbing actors and extras from three thousand years in the future they may get a few more applicants.

Lynk Former
11-14-2011, 03:17 PM
Eh, I was wrong, there were plenty of troopers in beta... saw more troopers than I did smugglers on ord mantell and coruscant.

mattig89ch
11-29-2011, 01:23 PM
I choose jedi knight for my playtime in the beta.

I was going to go back and play as a councelor cause I saw them throwing boulders around like it was nothing. Really wanted to do some of that. but it seems the server is down indefenitally

mattig89ch
09-14-2012, 11:55 PM
belive it or not, i subbed to this game for a while, made a few sith toons. sith was a blast!

I was going LS, and some of the comment choices were awesome! I was such a jackass, and doing the right thing at the same time. I tell you, if you want to have fun and do good at the same time, sith is the way to go.

CrisG
10-24-2012, 04:20 PM
I think the Jedi class sucks, they are lousy in fights against tough enemies no mater how hard you try, Sith eat them for lunch. I think whoever designed the balances hated Jedi and made them a miserable class to play. I suspect that is one of the reasons so many people stopped playing the game. I am going to try again but i tell you being a Jedi is a really lousy way to go. You dont get a healer until the mid 30 levels and you suffer for it all along the way no matter how good you are at the buffs etc. at least that is my experience. Be warned. Jedi are pansies in this game.

Lynk Former
10-24-2012, 06:02 PM
I think the Jedi class sucks, they are lousy in fights against tough enemies no mater how hard you try, Sith eat them for lunch. I think whoever designed the balances hated Jedi and made them a miserable class to play. I suspect that is one of the reasons so many people stopped playing the game. I am going to try again but i tell you being a Jedi is a really lousy way to go. You dont get a healer until the mid 30 levels and you suffer for it all along the way no matter how good you are at the buffs etc. at least that is my experience. Be warned. Jedi are pansies in this game.
I'm not trying to be mean here but... the Jedi class is just fine, it's just that you specifically seem to have a lot of trouble with it. With a player who has even mid-level skills, the Jedi Knight is a very effective class that can hit pretty hard and take quite a lot of punishment.

mimartin
10-24-2012, 06:58 PM
It just depends on your preference, but in PVE I find all the classes pretty balanced. Yes, there are easier class for solo leveling. I know Agent, Shadow and Scoundrel are easier, because they have stealth and longer CCs. However, with the knight I have found I don't need Stealth, CCs or even a healer. I just kill the bad guy before he kills me.

You will not get any sympathy from me. I solo leveled sawbones for my first toon with no knowledge of rotation, equipment and a kill everything mentality. I died out in every boss fight, had to farm credits just to pay for repair bills. I was just too stubborn or stupid to quit.

Miltiades
10-24-2012, 07:27 PM
I'm not trying to be mean here but... the Jedi class is just fine, it's just that you specifically seem to have a lot of trouble with it. With a player who has even mid-level skills, the Jedi Knight is a very effective class that can hit pretty hard and take quite a lot of punishment. Well... it can be tough during some of the boss fights until you get Doc. Especially as a tank. The many interrupts the Knight has help, though.

Lynk Former
10-24-2012, 07:59 PM
Well... it can be tough during some of the boss fights until you get Doc. Especially as a tank. The many interrupts the Knight has help, though.
The same applies for a lot of classes, but most people are generally able to adapt and come up with strategies to overcome any of these issues.

CrisG
10-26-2012, 12:19 PM
I am trying Hard Lynk...becoming one of "most people" is my earnest goal.... just seems tough at times when the enemies swat me down in seconds so i barely have time to try any of the buff chains i am studying and when i do they seem to do not much good at all.

You have said that before but i am studying the chains and the specific moves now and so far, they aint dont any good at all. I am not stupid or inexperienced just bieng honest.

If you have specific moves to suggest please do

some of the moves are very powerful and some of the elites seem just about unbeatable....but i am always open to suggestions and specifics.

Miltiades
10-26-2012, 12:52 PM
some of the moves are very powerful and some of the elites seem just about unbeatable....but i am always open to suggestions and specifics. Well, like I said, Guardians (which I'm guessing is the advanced class you chose) have a bunch of interrupts, which are incredibly useful against Elites. If an Elite has a powerful move, chances are it's a channeling move, which can be interrupted. It can make the difference between winning or losing. Force Kick is the only 'real' interrupt, but anything short of Champions and immune targets can be interrupted by Force Push, Stasis and more.

Other than that, the class has some difficult opponents, but it's definitely not a broken class. As Lynk said, it can be a very hard-hitting opponent or as a Tank it can take a lot of damage. But as it is with every class, there are right and wrong ways of playing it. I know I completely threw out my first rotation on my first toon when I hit 50 because I realised I was doing it wrong. And the same happened when I hit 50 with my Guardian.

Perhaps look up some videos on Youtube where people play the class, it can be very enlightening (it was for me, at least).

CrisG
10-26-2012, 01:53 PM
ok thanks, i am trying to find ways to make it work..i just need specifics..not just people saying I am bad at it.

I am trying to give the game a chance but it has been my experience so far that each stage of the path hits a wall with some tough boss or enemy and the upgrades and skills we learn we are just handed with no instruction..it would have been better to integrate some teaching into the upgrades instead of just buying the skill from the trainer, he dsent do any training at all and there is no way i know of to spar or learn from a teacher.

I have been using the interrrupts but what happened was I hit a battle in my main class quest there you have to defeat three Sith Harrowers and they do go immune to any attack for a time, and so they seemed unbeatable, since i am still new to the detailed use of the skills. So i will go back and try more interrupts. that helped a lot thanks for that advice, i really appreciate it.

i will look for videos i did not realize that anyone would take the time to share that way. I am NOT as much a internet person as many for i came from an earlier generation by quite a few. thanks again.

Miltiades
10-26-2012, 02:22 PM
I looked up the Harrowers. Seems like they get some kind of buff that you absolutely need to avoid. Run away when they become immune, then finish them off when the buff disappears.

mimartin
10-26-2012, 02:40 PM
I looked up the Harrowers. Seems like they get some kind of buff that you absolutely need to avoid. Run away when they become immune, then finish them off when the buff disappears.

hahahaha. Shows what I know about the fight. I did it within the post couple weeks. I killed them easily (overleveled) and never even noticed they went immune, CrisG, watch the video, you should be fighting only one at a time. This looks like a guardian too, so it may give you some idea as to what attacks to use and when. Guy seems to know what he is doing. Also make sure you are repairing your gear, using stims, medpacs and when needed use unity and heroic moments.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1xuwsUTpx-o

Lynk Former
10-26-2012, 05:03 PM
@ crisg: Don't think I'm picking on you because you're inexperienced. When mimartin and I started playing swtor, this was our first ever MMO and we started at 0 just like you did. The difference is that the two of us took time to read things. When we bought those skills, we read up about each one. And you don't need to really Google anything to read up about what they do because all of the information is inside the game itself.

The second thing is that you have PLENTY of time to test each move and how the moves combine with each other with their affects, buffs and debuffs before you actually reach a boss in your class story.

There are a hell of a lot of official tutorials inside the game, on the internet and a lot of guides created by regular people everywhere who play the game. The Internet is all about creation and sharing and all you really need to do is open up Google and ask for what you need and you will find the answers to your questions and the solutions to your problems and EXTREMELY detailed guides about everything you'll ever need to know.

That said... you're just levelling a toon through story, so the average player really only needs to pay attention to what they game tells you (and it does give you a lot of very good information if you're willing to pay attention to it) and occasionally seek help from the outside.

JasraLantill
10-31-2012, 09:18 AM
It just depends on your preference, but in PVE I find all the classes pretty balanced. Yes, there are easier class for solo leveling. I know Agent, Shadow and Scoundrel are easier, because they have stealth and longer CCs. However, with the knight I have found I don't need Stealth, CCs or even a healer. I just kill the bad guy before he kills me.

You will not get any sympathy from me. I solo leveled sawbones for my first toon with no knowledge of rotation, equipment and a kill everything mentality. I died out in every boss fight, had to farm credits just to pay for repair bills. I was just too stubborn or stupid to quit.

LOL! So there is hope for me yet, huh? I still can't believe I got my scoundrel to level 50. But, I still haven't finished my class story yet either and really need to respec her as a total heals. :) Think that'll be on my agenda for this week, but I liked the story so much and, since there's not a Chapter 4 yet, I didn't want it to end. :) (I'm such a dork, I know.)

mimartin
11-28-2012, 10:56 AM
I find that you play as a Jedi Knight for no other reason that the companion discussion with a certain member of our group. I will admit, what he/she/it told me pissed me off, but it really drives home that TOR is a part of the KotOR and TSL story line to me.

Plus Knight's kick butt. Jedi Knight Sentinel Watchman is quickly overtaking Shadow Infil for most fun game play and the story is SO MUCH BETTER than the consular.

the_raven
05-27-2013, 09:43 AM
because I wanna play as Sentinel and Shadow :P