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View Full Version : At what point are things taken too far


GarfieldJL
10-28-2008, 09:48 AM
I know about the story concerning people planning to kill Obama, and I'll agree that's way over the top, and I'm glad those people have been caught.

However there have been some other incidents on the left that are pretty dispicable too:
Effigy of Palin Hanging by Noose Halloween Fun, Owner Says (http://elections.foxnews.com/2008/10/27/effigy-palin-hanging-noose-halloween-fun-says-owner/)

I don't mind that people disagree with Governor Palin, I do mind when someone pulls a stunt like the example above.

ET Warrior
10-28-2008, 10:19 AM
I think that is in very poor taste. I don't think any real repercussions are necessary, but I would hope he takes it down. (The John McCain emerging from a chimney of fire however, I think is funny and well within the spirit of the season)

GarfieldJL
10-28-2008, 10:21 AM
I think that is in very poor taste. I don't think any real repercussions are necessary, but I would hope he takes it down. (The John McCain emerging from a chimney of fire however, I think is funny and well within the spirit of the season)

That's out of line too, as it would if we were to substitute Obama in for McCain.

Web Rider
10-28-2008, 12:53 PM
There's no law against burning effigies, torturing dolls or executing scarecrows with a palin mask on. It's not tasteful, but a lot of things are, they'll either take it down under pressure, or keep it up as a protest, which they're welcome to do unless their neighbors start objecting to it.

GarfieldJL
10-28-2008, 02:42 PM
There's no law against burning effigies, torturing dolls or executing scarecrows with a palin mask on. It's not tasteful, but a lot of things are, they'll either take it down under pressure, or keep it up as a protest, which they're welcome to do unless their neighbors start objecting to it.

Uh huh, if it had been a effigie of Barack Obama, he would be in jail being charged for a hate crime.

Achilles
10-28-2008, 02:47 PM
1) That's speculation on your part.
2) Even if it were true, it's more of a commentary on the ridiculousness of the concept of "hate crime" than anything else.

For the record, I agree that the stunt was in poor taste.

El Sitherino
10-28-2008, 03:47 PM
Uh huh, if it had been a effigie of Barack Obama, he would be in jail being charged for a hate crime.

Wrong, there has been an effigy of Obama and it's still out in the guys lawn.

Clicky (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MBgR6uO1E_A)

I lol'd at the Star of David that was sharpied on the head as well, since he's supposed to be muslim and all.

And we all know how this (http://newsbusters.org/blogs/noel-sheppard/2008/10/23/ap-skeptical-mccain-volunteer-claims-attacker-cut-b-face) one turned out.

GarfieldJL
10-28-2008, 03:51 PM
Wrong, there has been an effigy of Obama and it's still out in the guys lawn.

Clicky (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MBgR6uO1E_A)

I lol'd at the Star of David that was sharpied on the head as well, since he's supposed to be muslim and all.

I don't agree with that either, though if you were to take the Obama sign off there would be no way to identify it as directed towards Obama.

And the man is still being called racist, what's surprised me though is that cops aren't dragging the man out of his home.

ET Warrior
10-28-2008, 03:54 PM
I don't agree with that either, though if you were to take the Obama sign off there would be no way to identify it as directed towards Obama.And if you made that Palin effigy look less like Palin there would be no way to identify it as directed toward her. Sooooo what's your point?

GarfieldJL
10-28-2008, 04:12 PM
And if you made that Palin effigy look less like Palin there would be no way to identify it as directed toward her. Sooooo what's your point?

I'm saying both are stupid, but the Palin one you can obviously tell without the sign is directed at Governor Palin. Neither situation is acceptable in my view.

jrrtoken
10-28-2008, 04:20 PM
I'm saying both are stupid, but the Palin one you can obviously tell without the sign is directed at Governor Palin. Neither situation is acceptable in my view.Uh...I'm not sure about you, but when the effigy had an inverted Obama sign on it, and that the "ghost" has a noose around its neck. He also has a McCain sign on his front yard as well. I think you missed this part of the interview:In an off-camera interview, the homeowner, Mike Lunsford, said that the effigy isn't a political statement; he did it because he said that he doesn't want an African-American to become president, and he doesn't consider Obama a full-blooded American.The point is, it was directed towards Obama, and he even admits it.

GarfieldJL
10-28-2008, 05:47 PM
Uh...I'm not sure about you, but when the effigy had an inverted Obama sign on it, and that the "ghost" has a noose around its neck. He also has a McCain sign on his front yard as well. I think you missed this part of the interview:


And I condemned what he did as well.


The point is, it was directed towards Obama, and he even admits it.

As I said I don't think it was appropriate and it should be taken down, just as the Palin hanging from a noose should be taken down.

ET Warrior
10-28-2008, 06:39 PM
And I condemned what he did as well.And in the next breath tried to make it seem as though it were a much less grievous offense than the Palin effigy.

GarfieldJL
10-28-2008, 06:50 PM
And in the next breath tried to make it seem as though it were a much less grievous offense than the Palin effigy.

ET the one you were referring to looked more immature than actually threatening, the added detail is what set it over the edge in my view. However both should be taken down.

Astor
10-28-2008, 06:59 PM
It's a mannequin, with no facial features whatsoever. It could easily be identified as anyone - in fact, over here for Guy Fawke's night we regularly burn effigies of popular figures for fun, and that's all this seems to be - fun.

Rogue Nine
10-29-2008, 07:41 AM
I think we can all agree this is taking it a little too far (http://www.cbsnews.com/blogs/2008/10/28/politics/horserace/entry4554416.shtml).

Oh those silly McCain supporters. :rolleyes:

Jae Onasi
10-29-2008, 10:00 AM
It's a mannequin, with no facial features whatsoever. It could easily be identified as anyone - in fact, over here for Guy Fawke's night we regularly burn effigies of popular figures for fun, and that's all this seems to be - fun.

The home owner said it was a representation of Palin, so he identified it.

I know Garfield was talking about just the mannequin incident in the OP, but it's worth expanding into a broader topic of other actions that are over the top, to clarify.

Astor
10-29-2008, 10:03 AM
The home owner said it was a representation of Palin, so he identified it.

I'm aware that the home owner has identified it as Palin - i'm just saying that it's pretty hard for it to be clearly identified as Palin unless told so by the person who created it.

Jae Onasi
10-29-2008, 10:08 AM
I'm aware that the home owner has identified it as Palin - i'm just saying that it's pretty hard for it to be clearly identified as Palin unless told so by the person who created it.

With the suit and the style of the glasses and other political items scattered around the yard, it's not that hard.

Astor
10-29-2008, 10:12 AM
With the suit and the style of the glasses and other political items scattered around the yard, it's not that hard.

I agree, it's not that hard to identify it with Palin, but, as with anything, there's still room for interpretation.

mimartin
10-29-2008, 12:16 PM
And the man is still being called racist, what's surprised me though is that cops aren't dragging the man out of his home. I believe it was a neighbor that implied the man was a racist. Perhaps the man presents himself as a racist.

The man said he did not want a “black man” as president. He did not say I disagree with Obama’s plans on Health, the Economy or any of the other issues facing this country. He is being quoted to saying he did not want a “black man” as president.

Also like El Sitherino pointed out, the man sharpie the Star of David into the head, seems the man does not African-Americans or Jews. It sure looks like the man is not a very smart racist to me. I jump to the conclusions of intelligence by the fact he made a public declaration without checking his spelling.

JediMaster12
10-29-2008, 03:31 PM
I saw both and while effigies are fun, a la pep rally style, some things can be over the top. However, and I don't mean to put a damper on your parade Garfield, the homeowners are entitled to free speech and is such protected by the First Ammendment. Now if it has the intention to incite violence and such it can be construed as hate speecha and therefore not protected by the amendment. The definition of hate speech though has been subjective considering that the fine thing called lawyers have managed to reinterprete half of the Constitution.

I am not saying that they are right. My opinion is that it is of poor taste and the owner with the Obama effigy just revealed his true colors which sadly is the face of a racist. I do have to say that I find it both saddening and amusing that people who are confident in their ignorance often do not distinguish differences between people.

All I can say is that we just have to grin an bear it until Nov 4 and find out who is the next president of the United States.

Rogue Nine
11-02-2008, 02:47 PM
The English do it better (http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/11/02/palin.effigy.burn/index.html).

I lol'd hardcore.

Corinthian
11-02-2008, 03:33 PM
First Amendment protects these guys. Tasteless? Yeah. But I'm glad nobody's trying to 'do something about it'.

jrrtoken
11-02-2008, 06:09 PM
**** yeah! Rest assured, if McCain wins, at least we'll know that the British will invade and overthrow the overlords. All Britons have now earned my eternal respect. :D