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Darth Groovy
05-16-2009, 01:55 AM
I guess you are all too scared to post a Star Trek thread in the Swamp. Usually this subject becomes a huge debate...well so be it.

I will take the initiative here. I know many LFers have seen this movie, and since it is the number one movie in the USA right now, it deserves a thread!

I saw the movie and it was even better than I thought it would be. I will get into details later.

I have only a few requests. When discussing key points from the movie, PLEASE USE SPOILER TAGS! They ARE in your HTML editor, but if you can't find them, it is like this blah blah blah . Ok?

Discuss!

Lynk Former
05-16-2009, 02:04 AM
I loved it, though even with all those juicy trek references it felt more star wars than star trek at times.

Commander Obi-Wan
05-16-2009, 02:09 AM
I went in having not watched or really knowing anything about Star Trek. And came out quite pleased. I'd say it was definitely a good introduction to Star Trek, for me anyway.

I'd probably ranked it the best movie so far this year. Taken is not far off.

Darth Groovy
05-16-2009, 02:22 AM
This will not spoil anything.

I was glad to see they were wearing the traditional yellow, blue, and red sweatshirts that they used in the original series.

While the Crimson uniforms used in most of the previous Star Trek movies were pretty, they were in my opinion very impractical. They looked like marching band uniforms. Having served in the Navy, I must say that comfort while on duty is very important. Having served on a Helicopter carrier, most of the main officers wore color coded turtle neck shirts indicating what department they came from. The rest of us enlisted people wore either coveralls, or dungarees during active duty. It just makes more sense.

Also, I was very happy with the look of engineering. I saw lots of cranks, wheels, and latches that looked very similar to a Navy vessel. Instead of the usual flashing lights and toggle switches that you saw on the original series. In my opinion, it made that ship look that much more believable!

IG-64
05-16-2009, 02:59 AM
It was fantastic.

The only thing I wasn't too happy about was

the alternate timeline aspect. It didn't bother me too much, but I never like when alternate timelines are introduced.

Once I got past that though, the rest of it was amazing. The whole cast did a great job. Very fun to watch.

Kain
05-16-2009, 03:23 AM
Doesn't it strike anybody as odd that they showed more action in the previews than they did in every other Star Trek movie ever.......combined?

Lynk Former
05-16-2009, 04:27 AM
It was fantastic.

The only thing I wasn't too happy about was

the alternate timeline aspect. It didn't bother me too much, but I never like when alternate timelines are introduced.

Once I got past that though, the rest of it was amazing. The whole cast did a great job. Very fun to watch.
Makes a great excuse to explain why things are different when restarting a series though. Plus this movie is a really good bridge between the old Trek universe and this new one... kinda like how Star Trek Generations bridged the original series with the next gen.

EnderWiggin
05-16-2009, 07:23 AM
It had a few minor issues, like all movies, but overall I liked it.

It felt Trek. I took my girlfriend (admittedly someone who has never seen anything Trek) and she liked it as well, so I think that bodes well when it comes to the 'restarting the series' goal.

_EW_

edlib
05-16-2009, 09:44 AM
It was better than I expected. Didn't hate it... but didn't love it either. I'll probably see it again, (this weekend, in IMAX, actually) but I do have a couple of minor complaints.
I hated the music soundtrack. I found myself annoyed by the music more than once.

They played fast and loose with the transporters. I understand this was to solve issues that they wrote into the script... but no Trek ever had transporter technology that can do what they did here.

I DIDN'T like the look of engineering. Looked like the inside of a Costco to me...

They never let anything sit for a second. Every scene had SOME major action going on. I could have used a breather to absorb what was happening.
That's kind of a J.J. Abrams thing, I think... and which is probably why I've never been a fan of anything he's directed.

Very little Enterprise screen time. Seriously... I don't think I really got a great shot of the outside ship for more than a second or 2 before something exploded. Every other Trek always had an extended glamor-shot sequence of the ship leaving Space-Dock where we could really see the exterior. I missed that this time.
But I did like it. The characters were all well established without being slavish clones. They are all pretty note-perfect to the originals, and yet still unique. Tricky to pull off... and I have to give them all credit for nailing it so well.

And Scotty is STILL the best character in all of Trek canon... Simon Pegg was amazing!

It was fun picking up on all the Trek references. Although anybody who never saw ST II: Wrath of Khan missed out on a lot when watching this one.

MrWally
05-16-2009, 12:48 PM
I hated the music soundtrack. I found myself annoyed by the music more than once.

They played fast and loose with the transporters. I understand this was to solve issues that they wrote into the script... but no Trek ever had transporter technology that can do what they did here.

I DIDN'T like the look of engineering. Looked like the inside of a Costco to me...

They never let anything sit for a second. Every scene had SOME major action going on. I could have used a breather to absorb what was happening.
That's kind of a J.J. Abrams thing, I think... and which is probably why I've never been a fan of anything he's directed.

Very little Enterprise screen time. Seriously... I don't think I really got a great shot of the outside ship for more than a second or 2 before something exploded. Every other Trek always had an extended glamor-shot sequence of the ship leaving Space-Dock where we could really see the exterior. I missed that this time.



I should start this by saying that I am a HUGE J.J. Abrams fan. LOST is quite possibly my favorite story with my favorite characters, much less my favorite TV show, around right now. I will also add that I was never a "Trekkie", but I have seen all of the films and some of the TV show episodes.

To begin,

I loved the music. I can't recall if it's very "Trek" or not, but it had the same music director as Lost, and I found that to be very exciting, because I love his style and the emotion you can feel in all of his work.

Just letting you know, Edlib, while I can see exactly what you mean when you say that there never really was a breather, I should tell you that this is not a "J.J. Abrams thing." It may be reminiscent of Cloverfield, but one of the reasons I like J.J. Abrams and Lost is because of his ability to just sit down and do so much character and story development without having high-strung action sequences constantly. I think the reason he did have so much intense action in Star Trek was in hopes of bringing over new fans to to the series who simply wanted a nice "action flick"--I think they definitely got what they had hoped for (and more), and J.J. Abrams accomplished his goal successfully.

Agreed with the lack of Enterprise screen time. Interesting when you compare that statement you made to watching the original trailer, where he took advantage of every Trek fan's desire to see those glamor shots of the Enterprise. While I did expect more of this, I wasn't displeased."

Now, for some of my own notes:

I laughed at first when they made it obvious that they were introducing an alternative time line, but I think they pulled it off wonderfully, and if anyone can work with timelines, it's J.J. Abrams (it's a Lost thing, I won't put any Lost spoilers in here).

The new Spock meeting old Spock scene was awesome.

Speaking of Spock, Zachary Quinto was incredible. I was afraid that I'd only be able to see him as Sylar, and while that happened for the first couple minutes, it all got washed away as the film progressed. He was a perfect Spock.

And as for the opening scene . . . that's the first time a film has caused me to nearly tear up five minutes into the movie. That's all I have to say about that.


Final Review:

I loved it. A++++ Would watch again.

I might actually be seeing it again today on the IMAX. If any opinions change the second time around, I'll post them here.

edlib
05-16-2009, 01:19 PM
Well... I saw part of Cloverfield, and the Mission Impossible film he directed... and I had a lot of the same issues with both films... so I assumed that was his "thing." Almost non-stop wall to wall action, and a lot of jump cuts in editing, and swoopy camera work.

It wasn't a deal breaker with Trek... but a couple of quiet moments would have been nice.

I have yet to see a single episode of any of his TV work, so I have no frame of reference there. I hear good things... but I'm just not that interested in watching more TV.

Darth Groovy
05-16-2009, 02:03 PM
It was fun picking up on all the Trek references. Although anybody who never saw ST II: Wrath of Khan missed out on a lot when watching this one.

Are you referring to the Kobayashi Maru? I got a kick out that as well!

edlib
05-16-2009, 02:28 PM
Yeah, mainly. There was also: Kirk eating an apple while he took the test. Remember he was doing the same thing while explaining it to Savvik.

There's also the 'mind-control with insects' torture technique.

And Spock saying "I have been and always will be your friend."

A couple of other minor ones, too...

coupes.
05-16-2009, 02:31 PM
I've never been a Star Trek fan... to be honest I don't think I've seen any of the movies in their entirety, or any of the TV episodes for that matter. I am however, familiar with the mythology and I have some general knowledge about the main characters and overall story of the series. Having said that, I really enjoyed the movie, I thought it was well directed and very well cast as well.

I really liked the alternate time line twist they introduced and thought it was a clever way of rebooting the series. I'd be very interested to watch any subsequent movies they release in the series.

leXX
05-16-2009, 03:28 PM
I saw it the Saturday after it came out, and my eyes were transfixed to the screen for every second of this movie. I thought it was utterly fantastic.

It had such a good pace to it, introducing the characters nicely, then slowly building up to the kickass non-stop action. I would have preffered for Scotty/Bones to have more screen time though, we definately did not get to see enough of them.

The casting was spot on, especially Kirk and Spock. I love how all of them did their own version of the characters, instead of trying to copy them. It felt like being introduced to them all over again, which gave the movie such a fresh feeling it was great.

I did think the story could have been slightly better, but for the most part it was good. I did have the advantage of reading the Star Trek Countdown graphic novel before I saw it, so I was pretty clued up on the whole Nero plotline already.

I think J.J. Abrams is the man. I love everything he has done so far. Lost and Fringe are two of my favourite TV Shows, and Cloverfield was a great movie. I really hope that a TV Series is made off the back of this movie's success.

swphreak
05-17-2009, 01:23 PM
I've actually seen it twice. The second time was at an IMAX, and it was pretty awesome.

I enjoyed the movie. Lots of action and pretty special effects. Plus Sylar as Spock,

I actually can't wait til the next Trek film.

Darth Groovy
05-17-2009, 05:26 PM
I got a free ticket from Fandango.com. I may go again today.

Totenkopf
05-18-2009, 10:57 PM
Also, I was very happy with the look of engineering. I saw lots of cranks, wheels, and latches that looked very similar to a Navy vessel. Instead of the usual flashing lights and toggle switches that you saw on the original series. In my opinion, it made that ship look that much more believable!


Yeah, that did give it a whole different feel. I'll probably see this one again before the end of the summer. Despite the violations of ST canon, it was a fast pace and fun movie.

Jeff
05-18-2009, 11:13 PM
I thought it was awesome, I'm probably with Commander Obi-wan that it's the best movie I've seen this year. Was not previously a huge trekkie, I have only seen one of the movies and barely any of TOS, plenty of TNG though. Definitely looking forward to a next movie or even a TV series with this cast would be amazing.

edlib
05-18-2009, 11:59 PM
Just watched ST II (Khan) again... and I'm still convinced that is the superior movie... at least in terms of emotional impact.

The last 15 minutes of that one still choke me up to this day... and I've seen that film dozens of times.

The new one was very good (I'm probably going to see it in IMAX tomorrow night...) but I'm convinced that 2 is still a bit better.

And I consider it ESSENTIAL viewing to anyone who liked the new one.

Totenkopf
05-19-2009, 01:00 AM
Just watched ST II (Khan) again... and I'm still convinced that is the superior movie... at least in terms of emotional impact.
The new one was very good but I'm convinced that 2 is still a bit better.
And I consider it ESSENTIAL viewing to anyone who liked the new one.

Truer words are rarely spoken. :thmbup1:

narfblat
05-19-2009, 01:48 AM
I would have voted for "Khan" if it was spelled correctly. :p You're lucky this is LF; a Trek forum would have skinned you alive for that.

I have to agree with those who've said Zachary Quinto truly became Spock for this, not a pointy-eared Sylar.

Now for spoilerish stuff

some fun moments:
The Kobayashi Maru test.

Scotty's excitement for being on the ship.

When old spock says to young Spock "My standard farewell would seem self-gratifying, so I will simply say, Good Luck."

Odd thoughts:
While events are quite different, the main crew of the enterprise came together. Is history doing what it can to right itself?

V'ger and the whale-seeking ship will still come, will that be shown in movies? Will old Spock help any, or assume this timeline will work out the solutions?

Red matter? So, the essence of Communism collapses everything?

So, this alternate timeline went politically correct early? "...To boldly go where no-one has gone before." (and that still has a split infinitive!)

edlib
05-19-2009, 11:52 PM
I saw it in IMAX tonight. I liked it a bit better the 2nd time... probably because I could pay closer attention to all the little Trek in-jokes and details that escaped me on first viewing.

The main thing I noticed: Bones has all the best lines in this movie.

Tommycat
05-20-2009, 03:59 AM
The main thing I noticed: Bones has all the best lines in this movie.

Yeah kinda reminded me of the old series... Though I would say it was a kind of split... between Bones and Scotty.
I have to say that I too was tearing up during the first 5 minutes. Not many movies will I admit to that on.

Bones describing how his wife took everything except his bones haha...

Jim Kirk Swagger. He nailed it..

Kobayashi Maru First time we've seen how Kirk cheated it.

I was actually happy that they didn't show a lot of the enterprise...I just felt the exterior design lacked grace. I don't even mind that it wasn't MY Enterprise. It just looked gaudy.

I was a bit surprised by the Uhura Spock thing. But all in all. That was pretty well done

I thought the idea for how to reboot the series worked well... otherwise teh Canon Lawyers would be ALL OVER this movie.

Aside from the ship, I could easily see myself watching NEW REVAMPED REBOOTED Star Trek in weekly installments.

Jae Onasi
05-20-2009, 06:33 PM
Totally agree with edlib and Tommycat--great movie, Wrath of Khan still wins in my book, but this is a very, very close second.

@narfblat: I happen to really like split infinitives. :xp:

Totenkopf
05-20-2009, 06:47 PM
I'd say this broke the informal rule of thumb----Even's good/Odd's bad.

@TC--yeah, Urban had some good lines. Peg was all over the place, like Scotty on speed (but it worked, anyway). I think if they could keep up the pacing, chemistry and wed it to good stories, this could possibly be a worthy addition in serial form (or at least no worse than anything post-TOS).

Tommycat
05-21-2009, 05:30 PM
Yeah as a Trek fan, This one runs a VERY close second to Wrath of Khan. The only acting that made my skin crawl was Chekov.

Totenkopf
05-21-2009, 07:31 PM
Yeah as a Trek fan, This one runs a VERY close second to Wrath of Khan. The only acting that made my skin crawl was Chekov.

That's wery wery unfortunate. :D

MrWally
05-31-2009, 01:33 AM
Quoted from other thread:

tho i'm half expecting this to be J.J. Arbams huge pilot for the future series he's looking to do.

your thoughts?

This reminds me of everyone's reaction to the creation of the Lost Pilot--they all said it felt as if they were creating a feature-length film. This concept is really interesting to me, and I think that the movie could actually work very well as a sort of "Pilot Episode."

MysticSpade
05-31-2009, 01:23 PM
ok well i totally skipped over this thread and made a worthless one...LoL

anyways i'm never really been a trek person but in series form i prefer Deep Space Nine. As a movie i loved this film which says something from me as i tend to be a bit picky. I think J.J. used the alternate timeline aspect as a way to do things his way, which appeared to work. I have no complaints, but i also can't point out the inconsistencies since i don't know much about the source material.

Dath Maximus
06-01-2009, 10:56 AM
DATH LIKES TREK!!!

MrWally
06-01-2009, 12:57 PM
DATH LIKES TREK!!!



Context:

I was chatting with Dath before I left to see Star Trek and he was very clear that as a die hard Star Trek fan who has seen every episode, his opinion was the ultimate say in whether the new movie was a good Star Trek film or not.

I'm glad to hear he approves.

RoxStar
06-01-2009, 01:08 PM
Context:

I was chatting with Dath before I left to see Star Trek and he was very clear that as a die hard Star Trek fan who has seen every episode, his opinion was the ultimate say in whether the new movie was a good Star Trek film or not.

I'm glad to hear he approves.

More little known Dath Facts:

1. He is actually a big, soft, cuddly bear.
2. He used to work at a pre school.
3. His girlfriend's family thinks he a very nice guy.


Also: Wally and I saw Star Trek in a virtually abandoned theater the day before it came out o_Q

Jeff
06-01-2009, 01:20 PM
3. His girlfriend's family thinks he a very nice guy.If they only knew. :xp:

Dath Maximus
06-02-2009, 01:44 PM
More little known Dath Facts:

1. He is actually a big, soft, cuddly bear.
2. He used to work at a pre school.
3. His girlfriend's family thinks he a very nice guy.






fu ck you

swphreak
06-02-2009, 02:25 PM
* blinds everyone with lens flares *

The Seeker
06-02-2009, 07:25 PM
Okay, am I the only one that picked up on the fact that they didn't change the timeline at all. At the end, Old Spock clearly says that he lied to Kirk about universe ending paradoxes for the single reason to bring spock and kirk together as friends so that everything could progress as originally planned?

Also, the movie was brilliant. Breathtaking visuals, funny, heart wrenching, great action sequences. Saw First Contact and Generations and probably Wrath of Khan years ago, and that's then extent of my Trek knowledge. This one wins. It's just made of win.

Darth Groovy
06-03-2009, 03:51 AM
Upon seeing it the second time I got to thinking about a few things. I am going to save it for when Episode 7 of LucasCast goes live, as to not spoil my thoughts. Yeah we talked about Trek for a bit without any real spoilers.

/shameless podcast plug

MrWally
06-03-2009, 02:42 PM
Okay, am I the only one that picked up on the fact that they didn't change the timeline at all. At the end, Old Spock clearly says that he lied to Kirk about universe ending paradoxes for the single reason to bring spock and kirk together as friends so that everything could progress as originally planned?

Also, the movie was brilliant. Breathtaking visuals, funny, heart wrenching, great action sequences. Saw First Contact and Generations and probably Wrath of Khan years ago, and that's then extent of my Trek knowledge. This one wins. It's just made of win.


They definitely changed the timeline. Kirk's father died--clearly that changed things. I think when Old Spock said that he was specifically referring to the "universe ending paradoxes" of him meeting his young self. If anything this is proof of an alternative timeline because if he had traveled back into the same timeline then meeting himself probably WOULD have been a universe ending paradox, but because of the alternative reality there are no longer any repercussions.

That was my take on it, anyway.

Totenkopf
06-03-2009, 03:04 PM
They definitely changed the timeline. Kirk's father died--clearly that changed things. I think when Old Spock said that he was specifically referring to the "universe ending paradoxes" of him meeting his young self. If anything this is proof of an alternative timeline because if he had traveled back into the same timeline then meeting himself probably WOULD have been a universe ending paradox, but because of the alternative reality there are no longer any repercussions.

That was my take on it, anyway.

Mine as well.

narfblat
06-03-2009, 04:40 PM
My take on it:
A time raveller can change certain events, intentionally or not, but a timeline will do what it can to fix itself. You see it many movies with time travel messing up events; a series of coincidences puts the main aspects of the timeline right, though certain things change.

The Seeker
06-03-2009, 08:37 PM
See cause old Spock seemed mildly okay and familiar with all the events that were happening as if he expected them. Also, Kirk never would have met Scotty if things hadn't progressed as they did in this movie.

edlib
06-03-2009, 09:25 PM
Well,.. yes and no. Mostly no.

The original Trek timeline had Kirk being 1st Officer on another ship (forget the name) and the rest of the crew (sans Checkov... he came later...) on the Enterprise under Captain Pike.

Kirk was promoted after Pike disappeared on a mission. He was later found by the Enterprise crew crippled and unable to speak.

The entrance of the Romulan ship at the time of Kirk's birth apparently changed everything that followed from that point.

But it's changing one completely fictional future history with a different one... kind of a big "So What?" as long as it makes for good movies and entertainment.

The Seeker
06-03-2009, 10:52 PM
Well,.. yes and no. Mostly no.

The original Trek timeline had Kirk being 1st Officer on another ship (forget the name) and the rest of the crew (sans Checkov... he came later...) on the Enterprise under Captain Pike.

Kirk was promoted after Pike disappeared on a mission. He was later found by the Enterprise crew crippled and unable to speak.

The entrance of the Romulan ship at the time of Kirk's birth apparently changed everything that followed from that point.

But it's changing one completely fictional future history with a different one... kind of a big "So What?" as long as it makes for good movies and entertainment.

Good points and totally agree with the "so what" thing. Was a great movie that hopefully brings more great movies