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View Full Version : FBI tells cartoonist to "go ghost"


JediAthos
09-17-2010, 10:30 AM
A Seattle cartoonist who stirred up a religious storm with a tongue-in-cheek encouragement to draw images of the Muslim prophet Mohammed has gone into hiding after a threat to her safety.

According to Seattle Weekly, which originally published an illustration by cartoonist Molly Norris entitled "Everybody Draw Mohammed Day," Norris was told by the Federal Bureau of Investigation to "go ghost."

"On the insistence of top security specialists at the FBI," Norris is "moving, changing her name and essentially wiping away her identity," a Seattle Weekly report said on Thursday.

The Seattle office of the FBI did not immediately return a call seeking comment.

Anwar al-Awlaki, a U.S.-born Muslim cleric linked to al Qaeda and thought to be hiding in Yemen, said this summer on a website that social satirist Norris was a "prime target."

Norris originally launched her mock campaign in protest at threats of violence issued against those who depict Mohammed, which is considered blasphemous in Muslim culture.

The issue became a flashpoint five years ago when a caricature by Danish cartoonist Kurt Westergaard sparked sometimes violent protests. U.S. cartoon TV series South Park stirred up controversy and more threats earlier this year with its depiction of Mohammed in a bear suit.

source: http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20100917/us_nm/us_usa_cartoonist


Interesting news tidbit I thought...kinda scary at the same time. I can't imagine the FBI/government whisking this woman into hiding if the threat wasn't credible.

Sabretooth
09-17-2010, 10:39 AM
I suppose that's lenient. The Mossad would probably have killed her and blamed al-Awlaki. And the Palestinians.

Det. Bart Lasiter
09-17-2010, 02:38 PM
Palestinian children are a known terrorist organization, duder.

Ztalker
09-20-2010, 10:47 AM
Like a comedian over here said: "When you can't criticize anything anymore out of fear for the results, it becomes...scary."

I'm raised Christian myself and I've never been angry about the way some cartoons portray Jesus, god, or anything else related. When others threaten people to such an extend the FBI must take action, because they draw cartoons, it becomes insane, now doesn't it? Because a select group decides what is good and bad by force. Maybe this is a Kavar-worthy thread by itself..

swphreak
09-21-2010, 12:09 AM
I hope the movement keeps going. Eff everyone in Pakistan or wherever that are protesting and getting their robes in a bunch over this. It's Freedom of Speech. Something they don't have.

I think Anonymous should take up the Draw Mohammed cause and roll with it. It'd be more productive than DDoSing MPAA/RIAA websites.

jrrtoken
09-21-2010, 08:05 AM
I hope the movement keeps going. Eff everyone in Pakistan or wherever that are protesting and getting their robes in a bunch over this. It's Freedom of Speech. Something they don't have.Godless Muslims and their backward-ass, rag-wearing, 1.5 billion-strong, shari'a-spreading, terrorist hivemind; we should spread the noble virtues of democracy, Christianity, and bikinis to them all. :nvr4get:

Sabretooth
09-21-2010, 08:08 AM
I hope the movement keeps going. Eff everyone in Pakistan or wherever that are protesting and getting their robes in a bunch over this. It's Freedom of Speech. Something they don't have.

al-Awlaki is Yemeni, it says so in the article, which makes no reference to Pakistan. But I suppose your post was some sort of a multi-layered comment on free speech in America.

Liverandbacon
09-21-2010, 08:36 AM
Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't the main reason depictions of Mohammed were banned (or simply discouraged, based on where you look), fear that they might cause idolatry?

If that's the case, I really don't see why even extremists would care about non-believers depicting Mohammed. The only thing that they should be upset about (as extremists) is that non-believers exist.

JediAthos
09-21-2010, 10:13 AM
The way I understand it, its some sort of insult or sacrilege...but I'm not familiar enough with the tenets of Islam to know the difference between an actual rule and an extremist view.

I think its incredibly sad that this poor woman essentially has to give up her life for what amounts to a satirical view, but like I said before I don't think the FBI would have gotten involved if there weren't some type of credible threat.

swphreak
09-21-2010, 01:01 PM
Actually, I'm the godless one ;)

I was speaking broadly about all the protests that were taking place throughout the region. From what I've read, Danish and Belgium flags were burned, Pakistan or wherever blocked the internet for awhile, and stuff like that. I just don't believe the rest of the world should cower before Muslims because they find something insulting.

And I don't give a flying **** if we spread democracy to them. We need to stop backpedalling whenever they huff and puff.

jrrtoken
09-21-2010, 01:06 PM
The way I understand it, its some sort of insult or sacrilege...but I'm not familiar enough with the tenets of Islam to know the difference between an actual rule and an extremist view.Basically, it's meant to be a safeguard against the cheapening effect that comes with visually rendering a person/concept. It's designed to be antithetical to the idolatry practiced by pre-Islamic Arabia, as in a representation seems to earn more admiration than the ideal or essence behind it. This hasn't always been interpreted as a total ban depictions of any living thing or any holy figure, for that manner, as throughout Islamic history there have been various visual depictions of Muhammad. Arabic calligraphy has also been rather beautifully utilized to create images, weaving around aniconism.

If you really want to put it in perspective, then look at what Jesus has become today; he's been lampooned as a pop culture icon. When anyone thinks of Jesus, the first association is a long-haired, white-robed European male, rather than the values, teachings, and manifestation that Jesus represented. So, yes, The Beatles is just as or even more popular than Jesus.

Blix
09-21-2010, 06:16 PM
I just don't believe the rest of the world should cower before Muslims because they find something insulting.

And I don't give a flying **** if we spread democracy to them. We need to stop backpedalling whenever they huff and puff.

I agree with this :thmbup1:

Ztalker
09-22-2010, 04:51 AM
Actually, I'm the godless one ;)

I was speaking broadly about all the protests that were taking place throughout the region. From what I've read, Danish and Belgium flags were burned, Pakistan or wherever blocked the internet for awhile, and stuff like that. I just don't believe the rest of the world should cower before Muslims because they find something insulting.

And I don't give a flying **** if we spread democracy to them. We need to stop backpedalling whenever they huff and puff.

This. No Christian will pick up an AK-47 and kill you for drawing a cartoon of Jesus. It's an 'evolved society' thing where you respect oneother regardless of gender (burka's), color, age, job, etc. Not that we do that all the time, but we're light-years ahead of the Middle-East regardless.

swphreak
09-22-2010, 12:03 PM
This. No Christian will pick up an AK-47 and kill you for drawing a cartoon of Jesus. It's an 'evolved society' thing where you respect oneother regardless of gender (burka's), color, age, job, etc. Not that we do that all the time, but we're light-years ahead of the Middle-East regardless.

Yeah, but a crazy Christian will blow up an abortion clinic and stuff.

To be fair, every religion has crazy extremists. It just so happens the Muslim extremists are on the news more often, and they probably outnumber all the crazies in other religions.

Tommycat
09-22-2010, 12:22 PM
Yeah, but a crazy Christian will blow up an abortion clinic and stuff.

To be fair, every religion has crazy extremists. It just so happens the Muslim extremists are on the news more often, and they probably outnumber all the crazies in other religions.

Seeing as the Muslim religion has the greater(greatest?) number of practitioners worldwide(not so much here in the US) that isn't surprising.

Also... Who are the Buddhist extremists? "Give me peace or I KILL YOU ALL!"(hmm that kinda sounds like how the Muslim faith seems to be practiced by its extremists LOL)

But at least the Christian extremists seem to be preventing death of innocents(the theoretical innocent lives of the babies saved). Not going after someone simply for a drawing. I dunno though. There was some pretty extreme reaction to the cross in the jar of urine with, I think, feces as well? But Christians were told simply, "Shut up and accept it as free speech." Where in these cases, the artists are told run and hide.

Ztalker
09-22-2010, 12:34 PM
Yeah, but a crazy Christian will blow up an abortion clinic and stuff.

To be fair, every religion has crazy extremists. It just so happens the Muslim extremists are on the news more often, and they probably outnumber all the crazies in other religions.

Of course there are exceptions, you're right there.
But like you said it yourself, it's the numbers. Where 1% of the Christians would (for example) burn stuff and protest against abortion by force, I think 50% of the people in some countries would lynch me for drawing a cartoon.
Or stone women for no reason....

mimartin
09-22-2010, 05:26 PM
http://www.knuttbutter.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/11/serious-business.jpg

This has gotten a little SRS for Atho moved to Kavar's where SRS Business is okay.

Q
09-23-2010, 04:42 AM
And I don't give a flying **** if we spread democracy to them. We need to stop backpedalling whenever they huff and puff.
I agree. What they're doing is akin to blackmail.

Astor
09-30-2010, 04:18 PM
cartoonist Molly Norris

Why does this woman need FBI help? Is Chuck unable to take on al-Qaeda?

Darth Avlectus
10-09-2010, 01:27 AM
Or stone women for no reason....
Or worse, execute a woman for "committing adultery" when she was in fact raped... :(

urluckyday
12-11-2010, 09:34 PM
I hope more people make fun of that religion. Not because I have a problem with it...but because I can't stand how they're the only religion that CAN'T be made fun of without fear of being killed or other "repercussions." I'm religious (christian), and I don't laugh at all jokes made about my religion, but I certainly don't get mad...it's just words from someone who doesn't practice, so why do I care?

I'd be more pissed if someone made fun of me and my family than I would if someone made fun of my religion because I believe in what I want to believe and don't worry about anyone else. Why is it free speech when they burn the American flag and make fun of Jesus, and it's a declaration of war when someone jokes about Muhammed? (ala South Park's episode that was censored for almost 30 seconds)

They seriously need to get over themselves and stfu and deal with it.

jrrtoken
12-12-2010, 11:08 AM
I like how you presume that Muslims everywhere are apart of some homogeneous hivemind. By your logic all of the protests concerning, say, the Danish political cartoons were representative of Muslims anywhere and everywhere, right? Maybe - I don't know - the focus was on the slim fraction of people angry and vocal enough to get involved, and perhaps isn't representative of the +1.5 billion Muslims in the world?

Nah, who am I kidding; they're all violent, misogynist, ass-backward pagans.

Sabretooth
12-12-2010, 11:42 AM
Why is it free speech when they burn the American flag and make fun of Jesus, and it's a declaration of war when someone jokes about Muhammed? (ala South Park's episode that was censored for almost 30 seconds)

Because Americans and American Christians have had the benefits of a stable government and decent education? While on the opposite end, somewhere in the Middle East, half-literate Kalashnikov-wielding "scholars" in Wahabbi madrassas are preaching Islamic revolution throughout the world because unstable, corrupt and impoverished governments cannot provide decent education?

jonathan7
12-12-2010, 11:58 AM
Because Americans and American Christians have had the benefits of a stable government and decent education? While on the opposite end, somewhere in the Middle East, half-literate Kalashnikov-wielding "scholars" in Wahabbi madrassas are preaching Islamic revolution throughout the world because unstable, corrupt and impoverished governments cannot provide decent education?

I don't think this is so much a matter of education as jealousy and the fact governments in many countries focus the blame for the countries problems on other countries (mainly America and the west). This is of course a veil for the fact that the country is actually a shambles because the government are selfish and are raping the country for what they can.

Given the number of intelligent Islamic Fundamentalists in the UK who have university degree's, I would also dispute the claim that better education would solve this problem, because I'm affraid that is not the case. Still, I'll be the first to say something controversial but seems to be blatantly obvious, that given pretty much nearly all the Islamic countries are an absolutely shambles, I wonder what exactly it says about Muslims that Allah has permitted the infidels of the West to be the predominant powers in the world for the past 500 years. And like it or not, if the west so choose we could wipe the Arabian peninsula off the map; fortunately unlike many Muslim fundamentalists the West is too civilised for such action.

Curious that Allah would give the power to those who exercise restraint. Of course I've always found it amusing that God would require people to kill on his behalf, given that if your God I'm pretty sure your capable of defending yourself, far more powerfully than mere humans.

urluckyday
12-12-2010, 02:13 PM
Curious that Allah would give the power to those who exercise restraint. Of course I've always found it amusing that God would require people to kill on his behalf, given that if your God I'm pretty sure your capable of defending yourself, far more powerfully than mere humans.

Might want to "go ghost" after a statement like that lol. Like for real, that wouldn't offend me in the least bit, but just for example, this is something I could say and I'd get threats for. Sensitivity at an all-time high.

Sabretooth
12-14-2010, 01:55 PM
Given the number of intelligent Islamic Fundamentalists in the UK who have university degree's, I would also dispute the claim that better education would solve this problem, because I'm affraid that is not the case.
I would be interested in knowing what degrees they have, and whether they are immigrants or not. It's a folly to assume that just because someone is madrassa-educated, they are not intelligent, just that they grew up with a vastly different set of philosophical ideas and morals.

What you get in higher learning institutions is largely technical learning, without much of a care for the core human building that goes on in the primary stages of education. This is something that is very present in Western schools, which (believe it or not) actually encourage rational thinking, tolerance, yada yada.

Still, I'll be the first to say something controversial but seems to be blatantly obvious, that given pretty much nearly all the Islamic countries are an absolutely shambles

Controversial? Maybe. Obvious? I'm not sure... The only Islamic countries I can of as being "in shambles" at the moment, are Pakistan, Afghanistan and Iraq.

The Middle-East is in fact, prospering with their oil sales and Saudi patronage. Iran is doing well for itself, political troubles notwithstanding.

I wonder what exactly it says about Muslims that Allah has permitted the infidels of the West to be the predominant powers in the world for the past 500 years.
That's easy - you can be powerful and rich, or you can be pious and virtuous, unlike the decadent and heretic West. Which do you pick, oh Muslim brothers? :p

And like it or not, if the west so choose we could wipe the Arabian peninsula off the map; fortunately unlike many Muslim fundamentalists the West is too civilised for such action.
Civility counts for little in global politics. There's a lot of people in the Middle-East, and it's always better to have more people around, because then you can turn them to your side. Waging a one-side war to eliminate a variable is very unprofitable...

Of course I've always found it amusing that God would require people to kill on his behalf, given that if your God I'm pretty sure your capable of defending yourself, far more powerfully than mere humans.
It isn't about that, God can kill everyone if he so wishes - he wants everyone to follow his Word by peace, and if they won't, that they be destroyed in his name.
/fundamentalism
//cleaning ak-47