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View Full Version : Reflections and Force (Mindtrick/Persuasion)


The Truthful Liar
02-22-2002, 11:24 PM
oooookayyyy, a couple (few) questions:

I am sure there will be reflections in JK2 just like Q3 - but how extensive will that be?

Like:

-Could you see yourself in water (me wants alot)

-How about on polished or shiny surfaces such as a desk or a window maybe

-Mirrors (of course, pretty sure)

-And how about seeing reflection in someones eyes? (would be most spectacular, but probably not availiable)


Now, just a tiny force issue:

Force... Jedi Mind Trick in Single Player for JK2 will be like 'Woooooo, I wave my hand - now believe whatever I say' to different degrees or something very similar. Now how precise would it be? (I'm considering using the fact of including those force levels [goes up to 3 I think] For you to get a more of an idea what I'm talking about...)

-"I waved my hand and now you will not attack me [for a while]" (good as a minimal level force mind trick)

-"Ha! I have now made your memory scrambled, now give me those secret access codes to the control panel!" (nice [as a medium level force mind trick] this would be good so as to not kill everything - you must extract info first)

-"I mumble some jumbo and you now surrender and will not attack me throughout the game" (would be good, maybe as a high-end force level mind trick)

hmm? So what do you think/know? :)


Then, same Force but in Multi Player - I've heard it will be the same as JK1. Meaning you kinda... disappear *ugh* I usually found that really really really annoying when playing with Sabers, I couldn't see where I was aiming!! :(

Go figure the different levels, I guess it would be how more 'transparent to invisible' you will be.

Or... something different maybe? Like you do that mumbo jumbo to your opponent, and he can't see you - leaving you peacefully hacking away without going into 1st person or trying to aim properly.

- okies... JK2 Will still be an Ace Game, but With some more info I shall be appeased,

Cheers ;)

Mithandril
02-22-2002, 11:32 PM
-How about on polished or shiny surfaces such as a desk or a window maybe



I believe somewhere i read about reflections on shiny walls and such, can anyone confirm. I think it was in a preview but that may have changed.

The mind tricks are still sketchy, i have read all sorts of things. Such as; as basic mind trick you use it and then they cant see you as you pass or getting them to pull a switch. Also read about targeting it at the wall or something around a corner and a sound being made like in a New Hope with Obi Wan when hes in the death star. I want to be able to go "I am not the hairy jedi you are looking for" and them repeating it but i dont think we will be that lucky. Also you have to realize that some races withstand the mind tricks like that flying slaver dude in EP1.

All in all i think it will prove to be a pretty good SP skill and in MP it is just like disappearing, so keep the seeing on!! I would love to sneak up behind and cut off your saber arm or something like that.

Bar_Tender
02-22-2002, 11:39 PM
I believe the first level would probably be something like what Obi-Wan did to the stormtroopers on his way to the tractor beam: Momentarily distract them so you can slip by unnoticed. Level 2 is probably the "I'm not the hairy Jedi you're looking for," and level 3 is probably the one where they actually fight on your side.

The Truthful Liar
02-22-2002, 11:52 PM
lol, okay - make a storm trooper fight by your side, sounds suicidal ;)
___________________________________________


Player with level 3 force mind trick: "okay... you will now aid me in the struggle for galactic peace..."

Trooper: "yessir, aye aye cap'n"

Player: "uh oh, there's a 'reborn' waiting for us, Sick 'im stormie!"

Trooper: "On your command"

*You hear gun blasts and a short "vrroooom" hum type sound...*
.....
Nothing more....

Player: "whoops, oh well :D"

*You continue on with the mission/game*

__________________________________________

-Interesting concept... But that's kinda sad... :(

Any more?

Cheers ;)

Cyclone
02-23-2002, 12:11 AM
http://www.lucasarts.com/products/outcast/images/screens/4.jpg

I don't know about you, but this looks pretty darn shiny to me. Must be the Imperial Strenght Mop 'n Glow.

Cyclone

rolsen
02-23-2002, 01:16 AM
Originally posted by Cyclone

I don't know about you, but this looks pretty darn shiny to me. Must be the Imperial Strenght Mop 'n Glow.

Cyclone

LOL!!! :D

StormHammer
02-23-2002, 05:43 PM
There have been a number of screenshots showing reflections, so I think it's safe to say they will be used...but how extensively is not a question that can really be answered until we actually get to play the game. I certainly hope reflective surfaces are used more than they were in Unreal (which sort of set the standard for gorgeous graphics at the time). Unreal introduced several beautiful effects...but only used them in certain parts of the game. It would be disappointing if JKII failed to use it's full arsenal of graphical effects throughout.

Having said that...I don't expect to see reflections on water - or in the eyes of your opponents. As far as water is concerned, I don't think any game has managed to really capture the complex nature of water (although a few screenshots of a game called Chrome have some pretty amazing water effects, showing reflections, shadows and the bottom surface within a certain field of view). Sadly, the Quake series of engines have always been quite poor when it comes to water effects.

You're right about the Mind Trick making you invisible in the MP portion of the game if this preview (http://gamespot.com/gamespot/stories/previews/0,10869,2842216-2,00.html) is anything to go by. Here's the snip from the article...


The Jedi mind trick, for example, will make you completely invisible in multiplayer games, while it serves only as a distraction for computer-controlled opponents in the single-player campaign.

In the PC Gamer UK article, it also does mention more about the SP version of Mind Trick...

For instance, the superb Mind Trick, when in it's most basic form, can be used to briefly distract an enemy; at treble strength the hapless hypnosis victim will fight alongside you, turning on his colleagues...

So there you have it. At 3rd level, you will be able to turn some enemies to your cause...and if nothing else, they will become targets for enemy fire, I would imagine, and you should be able to use them as a shield... :)

Graphicsgod
02-23-2002, 06:15 PM
Ok AB_Legion, heres what is and isn't possible with the Q3 engine.

-Could you see yourself in water (me wants alot)

Nope sorry, not with the Q3 engine. But you can have a screenshot of the suroundings and have that environment maped as a shader for the water. Alice had some sweet shader effects for the water.

So in other words you can't see yourself or other objects that aren't a perminent part of the level in the water, but it is possible to see the level itself in the water.

-How about on polished or shiny surfaces such as a desk or a window maybe

LOL, all too easy! This was one of the most used shader effect in Q3 and all other games using it.

-Mirrors (of course, pretty sure)

Yep, not a problem here. Just don't expect large mirrors, or mirrors in places with a lot of action or detail. Nobody wants to go from 90+ FPS to 20-30 after looking into a mirror ;).

-And how about seeing reflection in someones eyes? (would be most spectacular, but probably not availiable)

Were dreaming here right, LOL. As far as I know, it isn't impossible to place a mirror on a model, let alone a section of the skin of a model. Sorry, but keep dreaming.

It is possible to have a cheap shader reflection (done the same way as described above), if the models head had enough polygons and/or the area of the eyes were large enough to add such a reflection. But if were talking about the glass lenses of say a storm trooper helmet, then it would be doable. But it would be easier to just give it a cheap Q3 environment map thats used for glass or shiny surfaces. Since the area would be so small you wouldn't be able to tell the difference between a pic of the level or a pic of say misc. shiny objects.



Hopefully that clears up your reflection ques.

Redwing
02-23-2002, 06:52 PM
Originally posted by Graphicsgod
Nope sorry, not with the Q3 engine. But you can have a screenshot of the suroundings and have that environment maped as a shader for the water. Alice had some sweet shader effects for the water.

So in other words you can't see yourself or other objects that aren't a perminent part of the level in the water, but it is possible to see the level itself in the water.


Hopefully that clears up your reflection ques.

You mean...if you were swimming in water in multiplayer, people wouldn't be able to see you from outside the water? :confused:

Bio Warrior
02-23-2002, 07:02 PM
there goes my idea of makin a map thats just all mirrors (including the floor and ceiling)

Pedro The Hutt
02-23-2002, 07:23 PM
Originally posted by Bio Warrior
there goes my idea of makin a map thats just all mirrors (including the floor and ceiling)
That would most likely crash your computer anyways, think about it, place two mirrors right in front of each other and then have a peek, how many times do you see a reflection? An infinite amount of times, all good and fun there.. but then in a game that would mean that the level-and any objects that are between the two mirrors) would also have to be rendered an infinite amount of times.. which probably is more than any current (& any near future) processor and/or graphics card can handle.

Graphicsgod
02-23-2002, 07:39 PM
LOL Redwing, no I ment "reflected" in the water. Not objects in the actual water itself.

WhytePony
04-04-2002, 04:37 AM
that screenshot with the stormtrooper line on the buffed reflective floor, where/what level in the game is that taken from?
after finishing it, I didnt notice any reflective floors of any type and that screenshot came to mind but couldnt place it anywhere.

tia

fune
04-04-2002, 05:06 AM
The shiny floor is either a hoax (Microsoft-style), or they removed it because it effectively doubles the amount of polys. Then again, it's not like you're *forced* to use it on a slower setup. Oh well.