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grumpycrab
02-24-2002, 03:09 PM
In the interest of good conversation I'm going to put a spanner in the works and say what I DON'T like about the Jedi Knight world.

Don't get me wrong, I like "Star Wars" stuff, but I don't think all of the Star Wars "stuff" translates well into a First-Person-Shooter game.

First off the light-sabre. I HATE it with a capital H. Give me a standard blaster any time. Reminds me of the Indiana Jones trick (the bad guy with the sword?). Just shoot the bugger. Much more fun :-)

Then there's the Force Powers. What are pain in the a*rse these are. For a start, you have all the extra keys to learn. (I had similar problems with Undying although I thought it was a very good game.)

Now that damn ?caster weapon whose name escapes me. What use is it to anybody. As slow as thick mud and as exciting as stamp collecting.

Of-course, like all good games, (Deus Ex, Undying...) variety is the spice of life and you play the game the way you like it. But surely the above are not THAT exciting?

--
Grumps
Here comes Summer!

CaptainRAVE
02-24-2002, 03:14 PM
Many would disagree with you. It is indeed exciting which is why it got 92% in one review, and 9.8 in another. And that weapon is the bowcaster weapon which even the reviewers say is rubbish.

Anyway, if you dont like the lightsaber or force powers, then quite simply, dont use them. Raven have made it so you can play either with the force and lightsaber or without :D

Fardreamer
02-24-2002, 03:16 PM
You give Bantha Fodder a whole new meaning :D

Justus
02-24-2002, 03:22 PM
I never really found much of a problem with force powers, I just binded keys to each and memorized them in no time... now it's like second nature, although I'll have to do this process all over again once I get my hands on Jedi Knight Outcast. I admit the bowcaster is pretty useless in MP, and didn't serve much purpose in single player, however I did use the weapon a fair amount in single player... although I always seemed to use the secondary fire and never the primary (and charge) function. The lightsaber, well that's my kinda weapon although I'll take a good guns battle anyday also. The game just gives you alot of variety, and creates an atmosphere in the Star Wars universe... and alot of people like prentending they are in it.

CaptainRAVE
02-24-2002, 03:27 PM
Originally posted by grumpycrab
In the interest of good conversation I'm going to put a spanner in the works and say what I DON'T like about the Jedi Knight world.


^I think he does like it....this is just hypothetical :p

[SWS]Strider
02-24-2002, 03:31 PM
Gosh guys lay off. He has a right to express his opinion as much as you do. While I may disagree with him, I'm not gonna make rude remarks to him. Lets keep these forums a place where people feel welcome, ok? Grumpycrab, sorry about all this.

Strider

CaptainRAVE
02-24-2002, 03:34 PM
Everyones entitled to their opinions anyway. I just dont think this is a very good place to say what a bad game JK2 will be :swear:

Master Sam
02-24-2002, 03:37 PM
geez, some people complain too much. What would a good Star Wars game (with the technology we have now) be without the saber and force. If you can't handle a few keys for your force, just don't use it.

[SWS]Strider
02-24-2002, 03:40 PM
I think he was talking about the original JK. I could be wrong though.

Strider

Pedro The Hutt
02-24-2002, 03:42 PM
Well the bowcaster sure was a fave for picking off stormtroopers and other assorted baddies that were quite a distance away from me, it's accurate and packs quite a punch. (or at least enough to get rid of one stormtrooper with one round
) so it did have it's use. (altough I rarely did that.. usually I never use any other weapon than the lightsaber ^_^" )
And the force powers sucking.. I dunno.. those are the reason why I still love JK today. It makes DMing much more interesting and unique. (same goes for the lightsaber)

CaptainRAVE
02-24-2002, 03:42 PM
^Well if hes talking about the original then I agree with him. But you have to take into consideration it was the first game of its type, was made by LEC, and was out well before Half-Life, Deus Ex and all those :)

DigitalVapor
02-24-2002, 03:58 PM
And that comment about the Indy Jones trick with the gun is not exactly relevant in this game considering that If he tried using a blaster against someone with a saber, he would find that shot comming right back at him. That was one of my favorite things about the lightsaber, It is <B>ALMOST</B> unmatched. And without the saber and force powers its just another high quality FPS ripoff.

CaptainRAVE
02-24-2002, 04:03 PM
Originally posted by DigitalVapor
And without the saber and force powers its just another high quality FPS ripoff.

Exactly......they are the whole point..if anything weapons are added just to pad the game out and give it some depth. Without the lightsaber and force powers it would be pointless and would just be called Dark Forces, instead of Jedi Knight :D

The Bothan Spy
02-24-2002, 04:03 PM
Don't know about anyone else, but the main reason I'm so excited about the release of Outcast is the whole saber and Force Powers thing. I'd still buy it even if it was like the original Dark Forces (.e just guns), but knowing that I can use a lightsaber in Deathmatch (a proper saber this time hopefully!)really gets me going!!

CaptainRAVE
02-24-2002, 04:08 PM
^same here. First time I play it will be just using lightsaber and force......then the second time I will use everything :D...its going to be sooooooo much fun. I would buy it however bad it was though because I buy most Star Wars games anyway (or download the older ones that I cant get in the shops).

Belgirion
02-24-2002, 04:21 PM
my you are a grumpy crab!

Justus
02-24-2002, 04:21 PM
Originally posted by DigitalVapor
And that comment about the Indy Jones trick with the gun is not exactly relevant in this game considering that If he tried using a blaster against someone with a saber, he would find that shot comming right back at him. That was one of my favorite things about the lightsaber, It is <B>ALMOST</B> unmatched. And without the saber and force powers its just another high quality FPS ripoff.

We saw Han Solo use a blaster against Vader, and we found out how well that worked out...

Eternity
02-24-2002, 05:21 PM
Er, Grumpy Crab, without the force powers and sabre:

As stated, this game is going to suck for you. It's just not going to be a ripoff, it probably will only be a mediocre rip-off.
You better start to like them, because without a sabre, you can't survive. Jedi Duels are going to suck for you when they get personal, and you won't be able to solve puzzles without it.


I really don't understand what you don't like about force powers and a sabre, or really, why you are even here if you hate the sabre so much. :confused: I'm confused, because really, these features are the selling points of the game. Without them, and if you hate them, this game has nothing for you. Plus, I don't even understand why you hate these things; what's there not to look forward to when you wall walk past a Jedi Knight and then slash him? :D

Heh, maybe he's talking in the interest of debate or something.

grumpycrab
02-24-2002, 05:41 PM
Originally posted by Eternity
...what's there not to look forward to when you wall walk past a Jedi Knight and then slash him? :D

Heh, maybe he's talking in the interest of debate or something.

To answer the second paragraph first, yes! And to the first, I'd rather shoot him between the eyes with a blaster.
--
Grumps

Pedro The Hutt
02-24-2002, 05:53 PM
Well it's not that just because only you think that way that Lucasarts should take out the lightsaber and force powers ^_^" Most of the people are looking forward to using the lightsaber and the Force again in a game. But hey like they said, if you feel like just gunning that's fine :) It's not that you won't be able to complete the game with just using guns. And hey, it'll make an interesting challenge for the saber fans in the MP game.

Eternity
02-24-2002, 05:57 PM
Yeah, who knows, if you are really serious about it, you might fare pretty well. But, like I said, in close combat, you might be screwed. :/

Anybody like my new signature? :D

JR2000Z
02-24-2002, 06:31 PM
Its not going to be much of a game without the lightsaber or force powers.:rolleyes:

ScummyRAT
02-24-2002, 07:04 PM
Honestly, I can see a lot of where you're coming from. I almost never use any of the non-neutral Force powers. I do like the Bowcaster, though... Filling a room with bouncing green bolts was fun. As for lightsaber battling, I like it so/so. I use it for most of the Dark Jedi in JK. For Boc, I cheat, using Fly Mode to drop Sequencer Charges down on the center of the arena, and when he jumps on them....well, he becomes one with the Force. It's just for a bit of comic relief because I don't like the last few levels very much in JK or MotS.

Lord Zen
02-24-2002, 07:08 PM
Originally posted by grumpycrab


To answer the second paragraph first, yes! And to the first, I'd rather shoot him between the eyes with a blaster.
--
Grumps

thats pretty stupid u will neva get him in between his eyes..especially since he is gonna have a lightsaber 2 blast the laser rite bacc in ur face:D. u'll neva have a chance 2 beat the game..:rolleyes:

Lightlance
02-24-2002, 08:14 PM
I know various people have said all this before but i just wanted my two pennys worth :)

Personally i love lightsabers and i intend to go through the whole game using only a lightsaber (Mabey not the first time though :) )

And force powers yey as well.

I think a jedi with the force as his ally and a sturdy lightsaber would me match enough for most enemys with a gun.

But if you like playing it with guns, go ahead, doesnt bother me in the slightest just make sure whicheber way you play it, you have fun. that is the main object of playing a game. :)

Darth Lunatic
02-24-2002, 11:38 PM
Look if he doesn't like lightsabers he can go play another game. Lightsabers and force powers is what makes this game unique, and stand out from the rest of the pack. That's a fact that cannot be denied. Without those features, it would simply be another first person shooter.

First off the light-sabre. I HATE it with a capital H. Give me a standard blaster any time. Reminds me of the Indiana Jones trick (the bad guy with the sword?). Just shoot the bugger. Much more fun :-)

I'd like to see you try the indiana jones trick on a Jedi Knight. Slicing an opponent up with the coolest piece of technology conceived for the Star Wars universe is a heck of a lot more fun than shooting someone. Shooting people can be done in any other first person shooter, i prefer to kill in style.

Saying you like Star Wars stuff, then saying you hate the lightsaber is a huge contradiction. Star Wars and lightsabers go together like peas and carrots. You can't have one without the other. I mean whos ever had peas without carrots? It's just not right :)

TarlSS
02-25-2002, 12:01 AM
Really, your hatred of the inclusion of the lightsaber makes little sense. The lightsaber being in the game doesn't preclude you from using any of the other guns in the game, does it? No, it does not.

If you really hate lightsabers and forcepowers, use a soldier class and guns in the game. I'm fairly certain they'll include soldier classes. If that's the case, just think of lightsabers as an extra feature for folks that want it, and will make challenging enemies in the game, eh?

DeathBoLT
02-25-2002, 12:53 AM
hehe I think grab is only posting this to get you all going :P

The Truthful Liar
02-25-2002, 04:06 AM
Anyway....

Being able to use sabers and force is what separates JK&JK2 from other FPS/3d shooters - Live With it, or don't.

(no, I don't mean for you to kill yourself - just don't play the game if you are unhappy with Force and Sabers, because you will get even more frustrated when playing and you get gripped to death by a person behind you... Over and Over... and Over again :D)

Cheers ;)

buzzfunk666
02-25-2002, 04:13 AM
Its not called having an opinion.

Its called Trolling.

Pedro The Hutt
02-25-2002, 07:47 AM
Originally posted by AB_Legion
Anyway....



(you will get even more frustrated when playing and you get gripped to death by a person behind you... Over and Over... and Over again

Ah personally I just hate grippers ^.^ They can't think of any other tactic to be able to hit their opponents. Shows of a lack of skill methinks. (but then again a rail detonator in their face usually fixes the problem of being gripped.. even if it is a bit kamikaze when the gripper is within a meter's range of you.

Desslock
02-25-2002, 08:01 AM
Not using Sabers and Force powers in a game with 'Jedi' in the title is like asking a 2 legged donkey to reproduce.

"Why?"

Kill the fridging traitor!!!

lonepadawan
02-25-2002, 11:18 AM
I know why he doesn't like them!
The add BALANCE.
Starting everyone off with one of the most powerful weapons in totally against most FPS. And in JK it was just so funny to see a new player who reckoned they ruled because they had played quake etc- and had settled down in canyon oasis for a nice camp when someone leaps up pulls their weapon away and cutsthem down... They hate it and soon the words "Force powers are lame" get shouted at you. Some people believe force powers are for newbies who can't play properly???? :confused:Personally I can't wait for someone to take a shot at me with a blaster while I'm wielding the saber..
Begone and trouble us no more!

Justus
02-25-2002, 07:18 PM
I've been cursed at so many times in MP games for using force powers... force pull is one that always gets gripes, blinding and/or force choke is the second.

DeathBoLT
02-25-2002, 10:38 PM
you won't hear complaints among competitive gamers about force grip and pull being cheap... and blind is typically ineffectual against competitive gamers because we always keep force seeing on 100% of the time. The biggest problem among competitive gamers is the paranoia over hacks.. im not talknig about blatent hacks, that are pretty obvious when someone is shooting destructions out of a repeater or using a fade hack agaisnt you, but the toggle hacks that a person can turn on god mode on and off, have enlarged sabers(the longer additions are invisisbile and are small enough not to arouse too much suspcision), .5 force speed that gives the user additional speed and is silent force speed.... the list goes on..

the worse part is that everyone is suspscious of everyone cheating, but few actually do..

Pedro The Hutt
02-26-2002, 07:35 AM
Yeah I noticed that the last time on the zone.. everyone was so suspicious.. so terribly suspicious.. I was just having a blast running around with a saber while the others were pondering if there was a hacker amongst them.. sheees ^.^

the_immortal
02-26-2002, 07:42 AM
OK OK, I Hate in the star wars world....

1) How slow lasers go, my god if the stu00pid stortroppers would only relize how big ass machine guns would work alot better than a crappy laser gun that shoots 4 mph lasers.

2) Queen Amadala, WHO THE HELL would wear clothes that would restrict movement when your life is in danger if it was me id rip all that heavy crap off, scream, and run for my god for saken life, or course if i was in the star wars universe id be a jedi and take some gungans apart...WOHHOOOOOO HEHEHEHE

sanpilou
02-26-2002, 08:01 AM
ok grumpycrab, im not a violent guy but u have just made me mad. BE READY TO EAT BFG SHOTS IN THE @$$ :mob:

The Truthful Liar
02-26-2002, 08:15 AM
ok grumpycrab, im not a violent guy but u have just made me mad. BE READY TO EAT BFG SHOTS IN THE @$$

- riiiiiight.......

IES_Horn_SWS
02-26-2002, 09:47 AM
Go out and kill himself?! That's exactly what he's doing!:edeaths:

Man, no saber or Force? Are you on something? The saber is the most recognized weapon in the SW universe. Without it, the game would be something like, oh, I don't know, Alien X (BORING!).

Just suck it up, use it when you have to, and blow them to Hell and back!:D