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View Full Version : Israel or Palestine: Who belongs?


Heavyarms
03-11-2002, 11:19 AM
Well, since this thing has escalated into a fight where tens of people are killed a day by both sides. Who is right?

Personally, I think the israelis are right, and not just cuz I am jewish. Because you know of another jewish state? How many do the muslims have? Also, they need to stop up their attacks on these terrorists, or their problems will not go away.

Crazy_dog no.3
03-11-2002, 12:16 PM
The territory really belongs to Palestine, but u are right; The Jews only have one state.

So why can't they just share? The terrorists are thick because they are fighting for a cuase that isn't really going anyware and leads to slaughtering of more muslims.
The Irali army is thick too, becasue them attacking villages and setting up buffer zones is only gonna provoke more attacks.

Sherack Nhar
03-11-2002, 12:21 PM
No one is right IMO. I still believe that a planet-wide government is needed if the human race is to continue progressing. The concept of "nations" and "countries" seem to provoke too much conflict :(

Rogue15
03-11-2002, 12:59 PM
The Israelites are right.

digl
03-11-2002, 01:19 PM
as Sherack Nhar says non of them is right

Artoo
03-11-2002, 01:27 PM
personally the Jews used to be right but now since they've been blowing each other up in acts of terrorism then they just need to stop and share otherwise there just gonna keep killing each other. Stupid zealous religious devotion that causes them to kill each other over a small parcel of land. A global community is the only way to go.

Kylilin
03-11-2002, 02:19 PM
It doesn't matter anymore who is right or wrong, Israel and Palestine are like two big babies fighting over the same toy, one grabs it, the other cries, hits the other, then grabs it, which causes the other to respons similarly, then so on and so forth...Israel and Palestine are the reason why World War III will break out.

Someone needs to smack some sense into both groups..really...

Rogue15
03-11-2002, 02:21 PM
if they shared palestine would be a ass and do some bad stuff...like getting all the land. why the hell does palestine want the land for anyway? what do they find in it that is so darn important?

Zygomaticus
03-11-2002, 02:50 PM
Personnaly i think no one is right, and also that it was a great mistake on part of whoever did it to call Israel a Jewish state completely.....and i think something that sucks the most is coutries that dont allow more than one religion. That is one of the major causes of all these fighting. Why can't everyone just go where they want and settle there.

Tie Guy
03-11-2002, 05:42 PM
Well, i think that the Israeli are right. It is clear that Jerusalem should belong to Israel. It has been their capital since bible times.

Personally i can't believe that Israel tolerates Palestine. They come in and blow up their civilians, they throw rocks at troops that aren't provoking them in any way. Palestine should conisder themselves lucky that Israel doesn't destroy their entire "country" right now.

Gaming Nut
03-11-2002, 05:45 PM
You guys are nuts NO one and I mean no one will go for a world goverment you want WW3 try to make a world goverment. these guys won't start WW3 and your of your rocker if you think they will china will 10 to 1 and they'll lose for sure russia hate them india hates them and we ahte them if they attack anyone they'll die their army looks though on papaer but's it joke vompared to the U.S. and with more funding for the militray china will fall even futher behind and if we get the ballstic missile sheild online they'll lose their only equalzier. Dam I just rambled on I don't think either is right I also think that planstine will lose and get nothing if they keep fighting.

idiot00001
03-11-2002, 06:11 PM
Isreal because they have lived there longer and the Palestinians have lots more land than Isreal so lack of land isn't a problem. I think it would be very one sided if Isreal actually used their military fully against the terrorists. And Isreal isn't only a Jewish Country they have religious freedom just like the United Sated of America.

Heavyarms
03-11-2002, 06:14 PM
remember: we do not fight muslims, but terrorists and fundamentalists who use suicide bombers as martyrs.

Clefo
03-11-2002, 07:39 PM
That region is fickle indeed. Although neither side has the moral majority in my book, I would give Jerusalem to Israel, and Gaza and the West Bank to Palestine.

I say Jerusalem to Israel because all other religons have their own holy cities. The Muslims have Mecca, the Christians have the Vatican etc. We should give them their holy city....

BTW Tie, its Palestine not Pakistan :D

Zygomaticus
03-11-2002, 08:08 PM
Originally posted by Tie Guy
Well, i think that the Israeli are right. It is clear that Jerusalem should belong to Israel. It has been their capital since bible times.

Personally i can't believe that Israel tolerates Pakistan. They come in and blow up their civilians, they throw rocks at troops that aren't provoking them in any way. Pakistan should conisder themselves lucky that Israel doesn't destroy their entire country right now.

why do you say 'pakistan'

all muslims arent from pakistan

Zygomaticus
03-11-2002, 08:10 PM
Originally posted by AU_heavyarms
remember: we do not fight muslims, but terrorists and fundamentalists who use suicide bombers as martyrs.

your extremely right too!

its not the religion or the people....its the bad group...and these people claim to do it in the name of religion...even when their religion says no such thing.

Its all just bad interpretation of what they were taught.

Tie Guy
03-11-2002, 09:12 PM
Originally posted by Clefo
BTW Tie, its Palestine not Pakistan :D \

Your right, my mistake. I'll edit that. I obviously know which is which, i don't know why i messed that up.

The rest of my statement stands.

Heavyarms
03-11-2002, 09:16 PM
well, pakistan has civil problems. Palestine does not exist. It exists in their heads as something that is not...

Crazy_dog no.3
03-12-2002, 02:38 AM
Me also believes in planet-wide goveerment. How else is the Galactic Empire made to be?;)

Redwing
03-12-2002, 02:59 AM
Israel was there first, historically. But in this day and age, that doesn't necessarily denote ownership.

IMO a one world government is pretty much a horrible idea.

Kylilin
03-12-2002, 11:40 AM
these guys won't start WW3 and your of your rocker if you think they will

no one thought World War I could have started over an assassination, but it did...

Gaming Nut
03-12-2002, 05:52 PM
Didn't really start over that it was an excuse for guys that wanted a war to have on. Give me a way anyway it could and i might belive that opioin.

Kylilin
03-12-2002, 06:55 PM
but you see its the same situation, Israel is a powder keg waiting to go off, they are just looking for an excuse for an all out war...

Heavyarms
03-12-2002, 08:19 PM
It is too late for that comment...

They are in all out war... sending battalions of tanks into cities and returning maching gun fire with tank shells.

Did anyone see the guys that got targeted because they thought they were snupers, but were reporters? It was on ABC news.

xwing guy
03-12-2002, 10:34 PM
The only way there will ever be peace between either side is if one side or the other is wiped out, totally. There has been peace talk after peace talk and truce after truce and compromise after compromise, it what have those things fixed? Nothing! They've even given the Palestines land but has that satisfied them, no, they want more and they won't stop until they've taken over Isreal. Also, why are we at peace with the old Axis powers, Germany, Japan, and Italy? Because we waged a war on them until they couldn't take anymore and they signed a treaty saying they surrender, not we cease fire or a peace treaty. So I think Isreal needs to stop the small attacks of revenge and just declare war and get rid of the Palenstines in order to get rid of the problem they have now.

Kylilin
03-13-2002, 12:44 AM
i shouldn't have said WWI started over an assassation, what I meant to say was that WWI was started by an assassination. There are too many causes for me to go into without writing a full length research paper (which I have written several on the topic), but in a nutshell: Archduke Ferdinand of Austria gets killed while in Sarajevo, Bosnia, in turn Austria declares war on Russia (ally of Bosnia), then Germany declares war on Russia, then Germany declares war on France, the Great Britain declares war on Germany, and so on and so forth. My point is this: the conflict between Israel and the PLO is potentially a beginning of a new World War, because all the allies of the PLO could declare war on Israel, causing the United States and its allies, to back Israel, hence, WWIII...I'm not saying its going to happen, but it is in the realm of possibility...

Crazy_dog no.3
03-13-2002, 02:47 AM
And that would put u in a bad situation, Americans. U would have to choose between not getting involved and letting Israel get wrecked or getting involved and that would break the already crappy relations between the Middle East and the USA.

duder
03-13-2002, 04:38 AM
Originally posted by xwing guy
...I think Isreal needs to stop the small attacks of revenge and just declare war and get rid of the Palenstines in order to get rid of the problem they have now.

*Prays to God that xwing guy never becomes involved in politics*

Heavyarms
03-13-2002, 06:30 AM
well, xwinguy is right, duder. one side must go, whether it is the israelis or the terrorists. The terrorists need to be dealt with harshly and quickly, cutting off the head of the viper before it has a chance to strike.

duder
03-13-2002, 07:23 AM
Unfortunately people arent a disposable problem. Besides I dont agree that one side is right and the other wrong. There is no clear line. Murder is murder, everyone wants that to stop.

To assume the Good guys/Bad guys scenario is naive.

Understandably you are biased towards Israel, but from a neutral point of view, they have caused some atrocities too.

Clefo
03-13-2002, 09:11 AM
Israel isn't really doing much to help peace either, and if they commited mass genocide on the Palestinians, that really wouldn't go well with me (And it shouldn't with everyone)

Everyone has a right to life (So you right-wingers say) There ARE many individuals in Palestinian controlled areas who probably have NOTHING to do with terrorism etc. Would you wanna kill them and trigger the wrath of another Osama? I think not.

Heavyarms
03-13-2002, 11:42 AM
well, we also must think of it this way: you also forfeit your life when you run into a cafe and blow yourself up, or you pick up that sniper rifle and start shooting, or when you pick up a machine gun and let loose.

everyone has a right to a life. DON'T GIVE IT UP!

Israel has caused atrocities, but no where close to palestinian atrocities. I saw machine gun fire returned with a couple tank shells.

Crazy_dog no.3
03-13-2002, 01:01 PM
Why can't they just split it, like Clefo said.

xwing guy
03-13-2002, 07:39 PM
Because the Palestines don't want half, they want all.

Clefo
03-13-2002, 07:41 PM
And Israel dosen't?

xwing guy
03-13-2002, 09:45 PM
It's Isreal's land, God gave it to them.

Kylilin
03-14-2002, 01:08 AM
God gave it to them, yet the Jews have never had possession of this land until that last 60 years or so, personally, I think Israel should remain intact, only because it would be impossible for the Israelis and the Palestinians to live together in one countrty...and I thought people hated each other in America, they take hate to a new level.

Crazy_dog no.3
03-14-2002, 02:40 AM
Well, u can have a Jerusalem Wall running through the middle of the country.

Redwing
03-14-2002, 03:05 AM
Originally posted by xwing guy
It's Isreal's land, God gave it to them.

That's not a very good reason, despite it's truthfulness.

duder
03-14-2002, 05:05 AM
Originally posted by xwing guy
It's Isreal's land, God gave it to them.

You make it sound so simple. I wonder how many Palestinians or Muslims agree with you, or share your belief in the bible.

I think the only realistic chance of peace is for Israel to share the land. Not to live together, but to give the Palestines some the land. And for goodness sakes get rid of that idiot Sharon!

Heavyarms
03-14-2002, 06:28 AM
do you guys remember someone by the name of Ehud Barak? He offered nice amounts of land to be set up as palestine, but they absoloutely refused, and that is where we are now. They want it all or nothing. Well, there is not much that you can do with someone that wants all or nothing.

Clefo
03-14-2002, 07:28 AM
Bah, if only it were that simple, Xwing. You seem to forget that there are other religons aside from Christianity and Judaism.

Rule 1 of Mediating

Don't take sides..

If there's gonna be peace
1. Moderate Isrealies and Moderate Palestinians have to lead the country
2. Palestine has to stop the terrorism and Israel has to stop invading Palestinian homes.
3. The mediator shouldn't take sides (AKA Xwing sure as hell shouldn't mediate)

Gaming Nut
03-14-2002, 08:47 AM
They need to stop killing each other but both fear that if they don't responed to one attack then one will let lose 100 sucide bombers and the other will just let losse a hunder bombers.

Heavyarms is right they did offer them some land and pulled out of other areas but that wasn't good enough. They want jersulm or atleast part of it and the isreals will NEVER give it up so this fighting my never end.


As for modrates coming to power not gonna happen both sides are at war and the people won't support people they see as weak.

Crazy_dog no.3
03-14-2002, 11:43 AM
Some stuff;

Historically, it is Isreal's land. However, then nieghboring Islamic countries got really p***ed and tried to invade Israel. Then Isreal struck back, and invaded a large amount of land. (Well it's not really large in global terms, but it is if u are on foot)
Then why don't Israel just give back that territory.

I'm not against Israel or anything, they keep the mainland, but just give back that land.

Heavyarms
03-14-2002, 11:45 AM
it did give back a lot of the land. It used to own the sinai peninsula.

captain_drake
03-16-2002, 04:03 AM
well Wc is right they want all or nothing and yasser won't stop untill then

i belive that if either try to start another world war we go in kick both their asses and prevent any possiblity of nuckeler war

xwing guy
03-16-2002, 07:35 PM
i belive that if either try to start another world war we go in kick both their asses and prevent any possiblity of nuckeler war

You see it is possible to destroy Palestine, but not Isreal, cause you see Isreal is under God's protection and they won't be destroyed. And I don't care if you don't believe in God but it's true.(and for those of you who don't believe in God, I couldn't care jack squat what you believe.)

captain_drake
03-16-2002, 09:05 PM
hey man i will not allow jerslum to come under seige okay thats the holy city for all the major relgions

but the jews themselves are not dirctly protectd by god look at WWII

Artoo
03-16-2002, 09:58 PM
refer to the ancient question of Job.