View Full Version : Jedi Knight vs. Jedi Outcast **SPOILERS**

04-09-2002, 12:31 AM
I've noticed quite a few differences—and similarities—between our old, battered Jedi Knight and the pristine, sparkling Jedi Outcast.

We'll start with the sparkly pristine one. Jedi Outcast has undeniably stunning graphics, whereas Jedi Knight's graphics are blocky, entirely polygonal, and, to sum it up, a shadow of JO's graphics. Raven gave exceptional attention to the lightsaber, whereas Jedi Knight's design crew just made a long triangular polygon and put what looks, to me, like a flashlight in the characters' hands. That's why JO saber battles are so much more worth it than JK battles: it's also why so many people wield sabers in JO multiplayer, and everyone runs around shooting each other in JK multiplayer. And finally, some levels are downright lousy.

However, for all those graphical and technical faults, JK makes up for it in story. Why? In JK, you start out trying to find out who killed Kyle's father. Turns out it was Jerec, a Dark Jedi who wishes to harness the power of the Valley of the Jedi: now Kyle wants to avenge his father using the Force. However, somewhere along the line, he almost succumbed to the Dark Side. Assuming you're playing the Light Side, he resists the temptation and slays Jerec, successfully avenging his father.

In JO, Kyle and Jan are sent off to investigate an old Remnant post on Kejim. This post is actually a laboratory, where sick experiments are performed on prisoners. Then you go to a crystal-mining-colony to destroy it. But once there, Jan is killed by a Dark Jedi named Desann and his apprentice, Tavion! A furious Kyle takes the power of the Valley of the Jedi to go get revenge. But, after defeating Tavion, he learns that Jan may still be alive. He ends up back on Yavin 4 after saving Jan from Admiral Galak Fyyar. Then Kyle slays Desann, and JO is over.

Ok, so they seem like good stories. Why is JK dominant? Simple.

JK's story is about Kyle's journey to avenge his father and save the Valley of the Jedi. Once on the Valley's planet, the Dark Jedi Maw taunts him about his father's death. And during this quest, you eventually become entangled in Kyle's quest, and when Kyle is infuriated, you get mad too. In JK, you become involved in the game in an emotional sense: as in, you become mad when Kyle becomes mad.

JO's only weakness in story is that Jan never was shown dying. This ruined the emotional effect of JK: you don't get entangled in Kyle's quest to revenge Jan's death. Had they shown Jan dying, or cleverly appearing to die, you would be angry too, and would wholeheartedly agree with Kyle's decision to use the power of the Valley. Kyle's fight would be yours too. And, when Kyle discovers that Jan may still be alive after all, you'll be just as optimistic and eager. However, because you never see Jan die, you know she's probably still alive.

As far as guns, I think JK is better. All the weapons in JK will, eventually, have some sort of use, whereas some weapons in JO are useless: other weapons can perform the same task, and sometimes more efficiently. Your fists work to take out pedestrians if you wanna be on the Dark Side and conserve ammo. The Bryar Pistol is an excellent sniping weapon, and the Stormtrooper Rifle is a great melee weapon. Thermal Detonators are wonderful calling cards to send down lifts, and the bowcaster is another great sniping weapon, as well as a melee weapon itself. The repeater allows you to keep resilient foes busy, and the sequencer charges let you damage things like Kell Dragons. The rail detonator is the only really effective weapon against Kells and AT-STs, and the concussion rifle allows you to take out large groups of enemies.

However, in JO, the Flechette Weapon is practically useless: all it does is spray weak metal shards everywhere. The detonator packs also do the same task the flashier and more efficient lightsaber can perform: removing obstacles. The trip mines take time to place, and you don't know if enemies will pass by them. The repeater is only useful against Galak: the concussion projectile will punch through his shields. The DEMP 2 is also useless; the lightsaber is better if you really wanna take out droids, and it takes several shots to down a droid with the DEMP 2, unless you charge your shot and waste more ammo.

However, I can't decide which is better. What do you think?

edit: --Please use the spoiler tag--

Crack 6K
04-09-2002, 12:43 AM
Next time, could you post *SPOILER* in the thread title? Thanks for ruining things for me.

04-09-2002, 12:46 AM
Originally posted by Crack 6K
Next time, could you post *SPOILER* in the thread title? Thanks for ruining things for me.

I agree he should have put a spoiler notice, but it's your fault for reading it. When you see the first sign of a spoiler you could just stop, not keep reading.

It's like those stupid parents who buy M rated games for their 10 year old kids, then when they see how violent it is, they go and complain to the developers. It's their fault for buying it! Same as it's your fault for reading the spoilers.

04-09-2002, 12:48 AM
note about the demp2 gun: it wastes walkers like those pecock guys EASY! at-st's takes some more ammo but still gets them.

04-09-2002, 12:54 AM
personally i think that jk1 was alot better for multiplayer, i think if JO just made it so that force speed and jump are like they were in jk1 then JO would be better in everyway, other than the speed and multiplayer.....ide have to say JO is better, but if jk1 had JOs graphics it would be the ultimate jedi game.....those graphics with that speed and fun in multip...i hope theres a great mod like that...

04-09-2002, 01:01 AM
Yeah I was thinking about this whole subject the other day. I know that at least now, JK and JO are to me sort of like the trilogy and Ep 1. Ep 1 is more flashy, necessary, and all around very cool, but it's not what the trilogy was. The classic trilogy was just that: classic. It goes beyond just a being a movie and becomes a part of life. The characters are larger than life, but you can connect with them. The story is groundbreaking and even the little details are incredible. The Millenium Falcon. Could there be a more perfect name for a smuggler's starship? It's things like that that make the classic trilogy a legend, and Ep 1 just good.

It's the same with JO and JK. JO does right all the things that JK did wrong, but, IMO, lost some of the things JK had going for it. Don't get me wrong. I much appreciate being able to use a lightsaber as it should be used, being a powerful Jedi, and looking at a true star wars environment, but the story was not as engrossing in JO as JK. Maybe it's not the story though. Maybe it's the contrast between SP and MP. SP is so incredible in its gameplay and graphics that MP can't compare. I liked the game much more before I tried to play MP. It was kind of a letdown for me.

04-09-2002, 01:04 AM
BTW, Trueforce you are CRAZY if you think JK's speed and jump should be in JO! THAT WAS THE MOST UNBALANCED THING EVER!!

In JK with 4 star force speed you could literally run at speeds over what would be 60 mph, making you like impossible to hit with guns or your lightsaber. If this was in JO, we'd all be running around with force speed moving 60 mph using the heavy stance to try and hit each other, and it would be just like JK.

04-09-2002, 01:06 AM
It's only a spoiler if you haven't played the original Jedi Knight. It's been out for how long? If you haven't beaten Jedi Knight by now, then you aren't going to. Sheesh, he didn't spoil anything about JK2.

04-09-2002, 01:51 AM
The JO storyline was 100% spoiled
I added the spoiler tag

Crack 6K
04-09-2002, 02:56 AM
I've gone through the first part of JO, and beaten both sides of JK1 a long time ago. Naturally in the original post it was a good read because it brought back memories and helped me review what I've gone through in JO. I wasn't anticipating it to go so far into the storyline though, and I read a little too far. Thanks for editing that post :D