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View Full Version : What race do u think can't be Jedi?


antilles
07-21-2001, 01:09 PM
So what do u think? How about a Noghri Jedi?

MadPoster
07-21-2001, 01:48 PM
I think NASCAR can't be jedi...

Garindan
07-21-2001, 01:58 PM
vornskr can't be jedi since they HATE jedi.

Tie Guy
07-21-2001, 02:08 PM
They don't HATE jedi, they just try to eat them because they use the force to hunt.

So, they kinda are like untrained jedi.

Garindan
07-21-2001, 02:59 PM
in mots manual it says 'unnatural hatred of jedi' so, they can be sith i guess.

Boba Rhett
07-21-2001, 05:00 PM
It's pretty hard for Hutts to become jedi.

Garindan
07-21-2001, 06:31 PM
Yuzzum Vong cannot become jedi or sith.

Tie Guy
07-22-2001, 02:00 AM
Hutts can be jedi! Haven't we already covered this?

JediMasterHorn
07-22-2001, 07:17 AM
Hutts are supposed to be Force Blind. Obviously, Barbara Hambley didn't notice that when she made a Hutt a "Jedi". But that book was crap anyway....

BeastMaster
07-22-2001, 11:58 PM
:rolleyes:

The point was made in the book (by Leia herself, IIRC) that Beldorion was an exception; a mutant.

It makes sense to think that, even among a Force-blind species, there would be maybe one out of 1 000 000 000 000 000 000 000 000 000 000 000 000 000 000 000 000 000 000 000 000 000 000 000 000 000 000 000 000 000 000 individuals might have a random mutation. Especially if they happened to be living on that particular planet; the whole place was like a Force-capacitor.

ESE_Sithlord
07-23-2001, 02:59 AM
A Full Droid cant be a Jedi or a Sith

Garindan
07-23-2001, 03:32 AM
Falleen can't become Jedi.

ESE_Sithlord
07-23-2001, 05:38 AM
yup

JediMasterHorn
07-23-2001, 06:49 AM
Beast, thanx, I had forgotten about that. :) It has been years since I read that book, and i hated it so much I haven't bothered to buy it. (One of the very few I haven't read more than once and don't own.)


And the book is still crap. :D

antilles
07-24-2001, 07:26 AM
Well...a droid once become a Jedi(R5-D5, Spikky the Jedi Droid) and why can't fallean be a Jedi?

Garindan
07-24-2001, 12:33 PM
falleen can't understand the force, it's too hard for them. the info is probably invalid since it came from swcombine.

obrian93
07-25-2001, 04:40 PM
I'm not sure but I think Irish people are Force-blind. Darnit, Irish people!

BeastMaster
07-26-2001, 11:23 PM
Nuh-nuh-nuh.

Us Eireanach actually have a very high rate of Force-sensitivity. It comes from most of us having diluted Sidhe blood. :cool:

Boba Fat
07-29-2001, 01:27 AM
Wookies and Tusken Raiders can't because they are too angry and rely too much on physical strength to be one with the force and gungans probably cant either. Oh and Ewoks too they so dumb they dont uderstand the use of a hat! see ROTJ

:D :( :cool: :rolleyes: :eek: ;)

MadPoster
07-29-2001, 04:52 PM
I have Klingons and Terrans can't be Jedi, but excel at being Sith.

JediMasterHorn
07-29-2001, 08:19 PM
Wookies can be Jedi...

Redwing
07-30-2001, 03:52 AM
Originally posted by Boba Fat:
<STRONG>Wookies and Tusken Raiders can't because they are too angry and rely too much on physical strength to be one with the force and gungans probably cant either. Oh and Ewoks too they so dumb they dont uderstand the use of a hat! see ROTJ

:D :( :cool: :rolleyes: :eek: ;)</STRONG>

Yes, they COULD be Jedi unless stated otherwise officially. Never make assumptions. And Terrans and Kilingons don't exist in the SW universe, so we don't know.

Droids cannot be Jedi, as they are not living things. Midichlorians, remember? I have no idea where R5-D5 or Spikky came from, but they're NOT canon, and they could not have been Jedi unless they were made of organic material.

Boba Fat
07-30-2001, 06:32 AM
Never make assumptions and you will never find out for you must philosiphise otherwise you will use your brain and not your spirit for the jedi relies on many things body, mind, soul, spirit, truth and the guidance and help of the force. I am very intelligant but too much thinking and you will not act on impulse. You need impulse sometimes (see Mara Jade in Dark Force Rising) (book) :o

Boba Fat
07-30-2001, 06:37 AM
Maybe droids can be Jedi.

And I quote:
He's more machine now than man. Obi Wan Kenobi speaking about Darth Vader after all almost anything is possible in Star Wars. I know Darth was part human but maybe some droids were too. :(

darth terrat
07-30-2001, 11:41 AM
yah give them human parts !
:D

BeastMaster
07-30-2001, 02:14 PM
The droid thing is a subject of ongoing debate. It comes down to whether or not you believe in the Jedi's interpretation of the midichlorians. I don't; I think the Jedi are using questionable logic in making the midichlorian-Force connection (but then, I'm not Lucas).

Something you should know:

Every species has a Force-sensitivity ratio. Among humans, that ratio is around 1/100 --for every hundred humans, one will be Force-sensitive.

For some species (hutts, ssi-ruuvi, etc), the ratio is so low that it's not worth mentioning (say, 1/(1 X 10<sup>100 000</sup>), but in others it's very high (1/10).

What seems to make the difference is habitat. Humans tend to live in only moderately healthy environments (cities, space stations, towns). What life is around them is stunted and weakened.

Wookiees, ewoks, and even gungans live (mostly) in thriving environments; lush forests, swamps, and living seas. They're surrounded virtually since birth not just with life, but with healthy life. Because of this, they tend to have very high Force-sensitivity ratios.

Other species with high sensitivity ratios would be mon cals and quarrens (the seas on Mon Calamari are overflowing with living things), ithorians (Ithor was the very definition of "jungle paradise"), and perhaps humans on Alderaan (the place was a verdant nature preserve).

The difference is in how many of these Force-sensitives actually train as Jedi. A fair number of wookiees, but almost no gungans, and definitely no ewoks (they weren't even discovered until shortly before RotJ).

Each of these races has a Jedi-equivalent, though. The Wookiees have priests and sages, while the gungans and ewoks have shamans and sorcerors. That's where their Force-talent ends up concentrated.

(Again, this says interesting things about the yuuzhan vong, but that's another discussion.)

darth terrat
07-31-2001, 12:30 PM
so add medichlorians to bots

MadPoster
08-01-2001, 04:58 PM
Lets not, and pretend we never heard of them.

BeastMaster
08-01-2001, 10:38 PM
Originally posted by Me:
<STRONG>It comes down to whether or not you believe in the Jedi's interpretation of the midichlorians. I don't; I think the Jedi are using questionable logic in making the midichlorian-Force connection (but then, I'm not Lucas).</STRONG>

In case anyone was wondering what I meant, the Jedi have a certain instance of evidence:

Midichlorians are present in the blood of Force-sensitives.

The Jedi interpret that to mean that the midichlorians are one end of a causal chain with Force-sensitivity on the other. This would only be true if:

Every instance of midichlorians is an instance of Force-sensitivity.

The Jedi do not seem to consider the possibility that:

Every instance of Force-sensitivity is NOT an instance of midichlorians.

I see no way the Jedi could have actually tested that point. If they look at Jedi, of course they'll find that every Jedi has midichlorians, because that's the criteria for being identified and trained.

I believe it fully likely that there are "non-midichlorianated" Force-sensitives somewhere in the galaxy. Of course, the Jedi could never find these Force-users because they only test for midichlorians, and anyone without Jedi training would almost have to be too weak to notice (any Force skills they have would be atrophied to the point of charlatanism).

Unless another school existed and was seeking out those who don't show up on midichlorian tests.

Midis are blood-based, and (I presume) turn up easily in routine bloodwork. Therefor, almost anyone with a medical record in "civilized" space could be identified. Say, for instance, a prominent politician.

I can't help but think that if, say, a prominent senator was found to have midichlorians, he or she would be removed from office for fear of that senator using the Force to "cheat."

Of course, we know there can't possibly be Force-sensitives in the Senate, or their midichlorian counts would betray them. Isn't that right, Chancellor Palpatine?

<small>*cold smile*</small>

Hannibal
08-01-2001, 11:07 PM
Ok, you keep saying blood based. No where in the movie or novelization does it say midiclorians are blood based. Qui-Gon takes Ani's blood to test him but if you remember he tells Anikan on Coruscant that Midiclorians are in located in cells. Which means basically the whole body. Cells make up the whole body not just the blood. Look at it again he never said blood cells.

Think of it this way most tests done by real doctors are done through blood. Even non-blood diseases can be tested through the blood cause it's easy.

Pedro The Hutt
08-02-2001, 12:52 AM
Nicely put Hannibal. :)

darth terrat
08-02-2001, 11:24 AM
:D :D :D :D
:D :D :D :D

BeastMaster
08-03-2001, 06:33 PM
Which doesn't really have anything to do with my argument. Like you said, blood is the easiest tissue to sample.

My points about midichlorians and Force-sensitivity still stand.

You don't get it. It's always about blood! Blood is life; it's what keeps us going! It's why we feed. --Spike (BtVS)

Redwing
08-05-2001, 11:19 AM
Not the Palpatine argument again---

What makes you think that everyone is forced to donate their blood to wherever in the SW universe? What do we know about medical records in Star Wars? And who's to say Jedi don't use the Force to find little Force-sensitive kids?

Oh, and BeastMaster, (in fact everyone) I greatly encourage you to read this excellent article from theforce.net studying midichlorians: http://www.theforce.net/midichlorians/

By that theory everything fits together very nicely. :D

BeastMaster
08-05-2001, 05:27 PM
Thank you Redwing, that's exactly what I needed.

That page says it better than I could.

What if, instead of midi-chlorians create sensitivity to the Force, the Force creates midi-chlorians?

Y'see, what everyone seems to think is that the midichlorians are one end of the chain. I'm just suggesting (as is the article) that they're actually the other end of the chain.

They're not the cause of Force-sensitivity, they're a symptom of Force-sensitivity.

Therefor, it would seem to follow that it could at least be possible to be sensitive to the Force without (initially) a high midichlorian count.

As for the Palpatine argument:

If the Jedi are so worried about the Sith, why don't they round up a list of suspects (IIRC, Yoda or Mace commented that they suspected the Sith was someone "near them"), then test them.

Frankly, what you can't argue with is that we just don't know what Palpy's midi-count is. If it's revealed in ep. III that he has a higher count than Yoda, then I'll retract my argument.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that I don't like Jedi having all this technology/science to call upon. I'd rather see them testing for Force-sensitivity by telepathy rather than doing blood samples (which they somehow manage to teleport over comlink signals :rolleyes: ).

Redwing
08-07-2001, 08:15 AM
Cool, Beastie, I thought (hoped ;) ) you'd like that. It makes pretty much total sense (except for some EU stuff...but that's not that significant ;) ) and doesn't detract from the "mystic" quality of the Force itself.

As for the Palpatine argument, it's likely IMHO that alot of people in power just wouldn't want the Jedi nosing into their business. (Can I have a sample of your kid's blood, please? Why? Oh, he might be a being superior to you, and we'd just like to borrow him for the rest of his life if he is. Thanks) A lot of non-Force sensitive people might have Jar Jar or Han Solo attitudes towards the Force ("maxie big, da Force" and "hokey religion" ) and wouldn't want the Jedi nosing in their affairs. Look at the US today. People going mad about supposed government conspiracies....

Plus, as an influential politician, Palpy could've simply erased some medical records here and there. Or maybe his parents did. Maybe they were even Sith! (Or knew of them...)

Or even, perhaps it's just that when Palpy was a boy he for some reason didn't exercise his Force powers, thus not getting many (or any midis in his tissues. (Anakin did exercise Force powers as a child, if you remember) That would fit (basically) with your theory.

BeastMaster
08-07-2001, 09:48 PM
Another problem that's solved by putting the midis as effect instead of cause is the "Jedi X-Factor."

According to the midichlorian theory as given by the movie, all Force-sensitive children come from Force-sensitive parents. The only explanation Qui-gon has for such a disproportionate midi-count in Anakin is for him to buy Shmi's whole "immaculate conception" story.

(At some point, someone really should have explained to Qui-gon where babies come from. :rolleyes: )

If this is the case, and Force-sensitivity all comes through bloodlines, why aren't the Jedi doing some Bene Gesserit/Nietzschean style selective breeding?

For that matter, if it all comes from bloodlines, where did the first Force-users come from?

I believe that there's a certain random (or "X") factor in Force-sensitivity. I'd imagine that, occasionally, even Jedi/Jedi couples produce non-Force-sensitive children, while two Force-blind parents can produce Force-sensitive babies.

The odds would be against it, of course, but if science has taught us anything it's that we should be wary of the "implied 100%." Even if it's more like 99.999%, safe money says that that 0.001% is out there, just waiting to come around and bite you in your Jedi Temple.

Midichlorians make a good way of identifying Jedi medically, but they don't really seem to have any actual bearing on Force abilities.

[ August 07, 2001: Message edited by: BeastMaster ]

Darth Prime
08-12-2001, 02:12 AM
What about a Narn Jedi or a Membari Jedi?

BeastMaster
08-12-2001, 06:12 PM
Minbari, almost certainly.

The Narns, however, lost the appropriate gene thousands of years ago, making them effectively Force-blind.

I doubt there'll be any Narn Jedi until G'kar gets his chance to boink Lyta.

;)

oninosensi
08-12-2001, 07:58 PM
Why not toss in a few Klingon or New Comer jedi for good measure?

Or Chigg? That would be cool!

Jedi_Prophecy
08-12-2001, 09:39 PM
I know, Yslamari can't be Jedi!!!!!!!

Darth Prime
08-13-2001, 01:22 AM
or what about a Predator Jedi?

MadPoster
08-13-2001, 02:14 PM
They could never be Jedi, but xenomorphs build lightsabers all the time.

Jedi_Prophecy
08-13-2001, 09:05 PM
Was there ever a Trandoshan Jedi?? They would probably use the Force to paralyse you, then bite off your head!!

Boba Fat
08-14-2001, 07:37 AM
NOOOOO! They would use the force to paralise you or internally kill you if you were a wookie and skin you!

Boba Fat

Sub-Zero
08-18-2001, 01:30 AM
I know Wookies can be Jedi. Chewie's nephew became a Jedi. He befriended Jacen, Jaina, and Anakin at Luke's Jedi Acadmey, but that's almost all I remember about him.

antilles
08-18-2001, 12:24 PM
How about a Chiss Jedi? and the species of Watto?

MadPoster
08-18-2001, 10:21 PM
Dwarves, man. Dwarf jedi would be so cool... :D

cenca
08-19-2001, 01:16 AM
But hey, in the book Children of the Jedi wasn't that one half droid dude a jedi? what's up with that?

cenca
08-20-2001, 12:25 AM
But what about in Children of the Jedi when the half droid dude is a jedi? what's up with that?

BeastMaster
08-20-2001, 07:59 PM
You just said it yourself: half droid. He wasn't a droid, he was a cyborg.

Nicho was no different (physiologically), from Darth Vader.

Y'see, Nicho would've been born human. (He was human, right?) The cybernetic components would've been added to him, but his organic structure would've remained, and with it his Force talents.

The impossibility with CotJ isn't Nicho, it's Callista.

As long as Nicho retained organic components, he'd have been Force-sensitive, but when Callista was inside the Eye of Palpatine, her organic body would've been completely gone. According to the midichlorian theory as widely accepted, that'd be impossible (no body -> no midis -> no Force).

That bit of EU just adds more strength to the "midis as symptom" argument. :cool:

cenca
08-21-2001, 01:18 PM
freaking stupid ppl who don't know how to write! sorry, I get mad at ppl who disrupt the balance of a already existing theory or world.

brashin99451
08-21-2001, 08:23 PM
and even with palpatines body destroyed he was alive for 4-5 years in space getting to byss.

Kurgan
08-22-2001, 01:54 AM
Midichlorians just allow organics to DETECT the force (according to TPM). I like the discussion that began in this thread, pretty interesting.

The Force itself is an impersonal energy field "created by all living things." (and are replicants and AI "living" ? ) Though being impersonal, it is implied to have a "will" (Qui Gon). Natural law?

[cont'd]

[ August 21, 2001: Message edited by: Kurgan ]

Kurgan
08-22-2001, 02:21 AM
So just create an inorganic substitute for the midis and you can have inorganic force sensitives (ie: replicants, droids, etc).

True AI would be living, and so would be part of the Force just like "natural" living things, arguing philosophically...

And being a "Jedi" would just require certain learned behavior (training), so assuming that being could learn these things, they could become a Jedi.
[cont'd]

Kurgan
08-22-2001, 02:22 AM
Btw, I see somebody still doesn't understand the "immaculate conception" concept and what it is.

The IC refers to the doctrine of Mary (mother of Christ) being concieved in a state of spiritual purity (without the effects of Original Sin).

What people are probably trying to refer to when they talk about Shmi's supposed "giving birth to a son without a father" in TPM is rather the "virgin birth" (of Christ). Of course we don't know if Shmi was really a virgin or not, just that she was claiming to not have had sexual intercourse to get pregnant with Anakin (no father).

[cont'd]

[ August 22, 2001: Message edited by: Kurgan ]

Kurgan
08-22-2001, 02:22 AM
That doesn't rule out him being test-tube though... ; )

In TPM it is theorized that the midichlorians conceieved (impregnated Shmi) Anakin.

Anyway, it would be a real shocker to find out in Episode III:

1) Shmi lied, or had her memory tampered with.. Palpatine is Anakin's father.

2) Anakin is a young clone of Palpatine, and Shmi is just a surrogate parent! Maybe Palpatine was also a clone.. (trace back to Darth Bane or something).

Kurgan

Kurgan
08-22-2001, 02:24 AM
dag gun "anti-force-long-post" casting daemons.. ; p

cenca
08-22-2001, 10:22 AM
Oh woah! I never considered the option of Anakin being a clone or Palpatine being his father! if you think about it, it's kind of creepy. Anyway, I never did get the midiclorian thing. it intruiges me that so many do or think they do.