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View Full Version : *EP2 SPOILERS* Would a Sith REALLY bow?


Kanubis
04-20-2002, 03:37 PM
Okay, it's a bowing thread, but I don't think anyone has mentioned this point yet.

Think of Vader, Maul, Sidius and their ilk. They're evil. (No ****, you say.) The point being, someone who happily destroys an entire planet of people who can't defend themselves, or stands over their oponent as he dangles from a pit ready to just hack him down, or foregoes the fighting altogether and just fries with lightning, is not honorable.

So, whilst I condone the whole bowing thing, and do it myself (but don't expect it.. look, I'm just not starting that argument here, okay?), it seems entirely out of place for all the Sithsters out there to do the same.

This is not something I have a serious issue with, just a thought.

If anyone replies 'who cares, bowing is gay' to this, I will kill them. In real life if possible.

HertogJan
04-20-2002, 03:41 PM
No... It's just that *somehow*, honor is directly connected with Star Wars and duelling...

What did ben kenobi say again? Something like:
"The lightsaber, the elegant weapon of mire civilized times" (eh dont know exactly!)... Duelling is something like... classic, there's no honor in using guns...

Hard to explain, but I don't think it is ridiculous and it fits in well with SW and Sabers...

Eternity
04-20-2002, 04:14 PM
Who cares, bowing is gay.

Kanubis
04-20-2002, 04:15 PM
Right, now I just have to seaqrch the entire U.S. to find you.

Hmm.

I'll let you off this time.

DarthBalls BONG
04-20-2002, 05:01 PM
i dont bow. if my opponent bows i dont attack them either i just taunt. i play as reborn so when they bow he sort of sticks his hand out doing the "come get some" motion and laughs maliciously. i think its the sith equivalent of bowing. kind of "i mock you for your morals...now come get some you primitive screwhead"

or not

whatever dude

ArtifeX
04-20-2002, 05:05 PM
ditto. bowing is gay.

i love hacking down someone in mid-bow.

Kataarn
04-20-2002, 05:39 PM
No, a Sith would not bow.

However, like some pathetic people, they would not attack people in mid-bow. Hence, they would just taunt if their opponent bows.

SiTH[SAiNTx]LrD
04-20-2002, 05:49 PM
I don't bow, I don't bend my knees. I just stand up looking down. And taunt them.

I like nodding. :)

Soul-Burn
04-20-2002, 06:20 PM
like ^^ here...

I just nod, if the enemy bows...

Heh... if he bows with crouching I just say something like: "I see you know who your master is, prepare to be obliterated, pathetic weakling"

:D

HertogJan
04-20-2002, 07:15 PM
I don't bow crouched anymore (well sometimes), I just bow while standing... Is that the same nodding as you mean? And I also taunt at the beginning of the match, Hahahahahaa!

Assault3000
04-20-2002, 07:21 PM
I taunt, Im not cheap and attack bowing people. 'Hey, You there!"

Soul-Burn
04-20-2002, 07:26 PM
LOL at "hey! you there!"

btw, you saying "would a sith ever bow?"...

don't forget none of you are sith and neither the figures you're playing... There are only 2 Siths at a given time, and i'm pretty sure none of us are one of them.

Assault3000
04-20-2002, 07:29 PM
If you use the lightside you are a Jedi if you use the Dark Side you are a Sith. So basicly AT LEAST 75% of JK II players are Sith.

enDless_Deliriu
04-20-2002, 08:05 PM
no you're not.

If you use the light side of the force, you are a Jedi

if you use the dark side of the force, you are a DARK JEDI.

there are only two Sith Lords at any time, there are plenty of Dark Jedi though. I'm not quite sure the difference, probably Sith are the baddest of the bad, while Dark jedi are more like 'Fallen Jedi' or ones who started their training with the lightside and moved to the dark side.


As far as bowing, it doesn't go with Star Wars in my opinion. but it does go with DUELLING. In the movies, there aren't any duels, there are Saber fights, but they aren't out and out duels. Had someone else shown up, and not been completely dazzled by seeing two jedi go at it with lightsabers, then they could very easily shoot in and hit Luke or Vader in the middle of their fight (you'll note that Vader/Emperor has everyone leave aside from them and Luke).

Anyhow though, a Duel is a one on one fight, usually to defend ones...honor *gasp*. They start as a result of $h$* talking, or insulting someones wife or whatever, but a duel is almost always a matter of honor. In matters of honor, it is polite to be respectable.

I am not saying "j00 5h0uld 4ll b0w, g4y l4m3rS", but I am saying that at the least, let the person get ready for the fight. In a real duel, you would actually be seen as the loser(of the dispute, dead is dead stll) if you attacked while the person was bowing and not armed/ready.

Inter
04-20-2002, 08:17 PM
*ffffffttttt* I'll tell you what's goddamn 'G A Y' waiting 30 seconds for someone to type in 'ggood lick' [then] 'I meant goog luck' [then] 'sry - meant good luck'

Or EVEN BLOODY WORSE - some patronizing b'strd typing in 'Are you ready, sonny?' (or words to that effect)


Bowing takes 2 seconds - and to me it means - "I have my force config ok; I don't need to take a p*ss; I've lit my ciggy; ready; willing; able; good luck; all the best; lets cut the bloody typing and get the hell on with the fun stuff..."

You dozy machos who think that it is to do with 'honour and respect'!!??? And as for this goddamn sith "don't mess with me - I'm in character, darling"....why don't you go the whole hog and play with a black motorbike helmet on?? (Sorry that was a joke!)

BUT!! I hate to break it to you - but about the c**p that bowing is to do with 'honour' - 1 word - WRONG!!!

jeez -- go and be a goddamn Klingon in some Star Trek game...

Territo
04-20-2002, 08:18 PM
How did this bowing junk ever start, I just want to go in and fight.

Soul-Burn
04-20-2002, 08:40 PM
It adds a role playing side to the game..

btw:
http://www.starwars.com/databank/organization/thesith/eu.html

Assault3000
04-20-2002, 09:06 PM
Jedi Knight II does need more role playing to be honest. I see nothing amazing about going out there and just slaughtering everyone. Personally I would like a role playing mod to come out. That is what was good about Jedi Knight, people liked Role Playing. Don't get me wrong people still do in Jedi Knight II, the ones that bow but it could be a lot better with a mod.

Soul-Burn
04-20-2002, 09:11 PM
Dude.... I guess we all want SWG already ;) I know I do.

Assault3000
04-20-2002, 09:15 PM
Im not even CONSIDERING buying Star Wars Galaxies. I find P2P games boring and aimless running around killing things. To be honest to me its not worth $10 or more a month to play some online game with no plot just killing for exp and seeing what items you can get. You guys can play SWG all you want but dont expect to see me on it.

Kreuzader
04-20-2002, 09:35 PM
***SPOILERS FOR AOTC***
***SPOILERS FOR AOTC***
***SPOILERS FOR AOTC***

Last warning.

***SPOILERS FOR AOTC***
***SPOILERS FOR AOTC***
***SPOILERS FOR AOTC***


Ahem.


Anyway, in the duel with Yoda, Darth Tyranus (yes, a Sith lord) salutes him with his saber, which is analgous to bowing.

Assault3000
04-20-2002, 09:39 PM
Originally posted by Kreuzader
***SPOILERS FOR AOTC***
***SPOILERS FOR AOTC***
***SPOILERS FOR AOTC***
***SPOILERS FOR AOTC***
***SPOILERS FOR AOTC***
***SPOILERS FOR AOTC***

Don't read if you want to remain unspoiled for Ep 2.

***SPOILERS FOR AOTC***
***SPOILERS FOR AOTC***
***SPOILERS FOR AOTC***

Last warning.

***SPOILERS FOR AOTC***
***SPOILERS FOR AOTC***
***SPOILERS FOR AOTC***


Ahem.


Anyway, in the duel with Yoda, Darth Tyranus (yes, a Sith lord) salutes him with his saber, which is analgous to bowing.

YODA!?

Kreuzader
04-20-2002, 09:56 PM
Originally posted by Assault3000


YODA!?

Yeah, he fights. Also, you can see the scene I describe (just of the Sith lord saluting) in one of the trailers.

Valdarious
04-20-2002, 10:21 PM
I wouldnt exatly say that a Sith would bow, but a short pause before a fight to show either respect or contemp.. yes. Look at the duel of the Fates. Door opens, Maul standing there, everyone is like... uh... lets go this way. Obi and Qui are like, we will take care of this, they take off their robes then everyone pulls out their sabers to signify OK, lets do this. Darth Vader and Obi Wan in Star Wars, circle each other and talk for a second then they start. Luke and Darth in Bespin, talk to each other before starting. Just some examples but you get the idea.

MankaCat
04-20-2002, 10:22 PM
Dooku != sith lord
he is a dark jedi
he's one of the 'fallen twenty' of the jedi order
as a sidenote: I blue stance lunge bowers in the face, then they stop
:O

Evan Nash
04-20-2002, 10:23 PM
Sith have no honor.

They'd chop you up first chance they got.

Kreuzader
04-20-2002, 10:24 PM
...to steer this back on topic a little, my answer is:

It depends.

Someone like Maul or Vader with a fanatical hatred of their opponent would probably not be inclined to bow to them. Sidious/Palpatine... well, I have no idea, since so far he's never wielded a saber period in any of the movies, and I doubt he will in III, but he seems like the type to perhaps bow or salute if only out of joking/mocking malice.

More AOTC discussion:

Tyranus/Dooku salutes because, unlike say Maul or Sidious, he was trained as a Jedi and has a past with his opponent (He was one of Yoda's padawans). Moreover, despite being a Sith now, he doesn't have appear to have a raging hatred of Yoda, hence the respect he shows. The salute is punctuated with a statement that shows Dooku is acknowledging Yoda's inherent honor as a Jedi master ("Master Yoda. At last we shall know who is the most powerful.").


As far as in-game bowing, I'll bow if the other person wants to, if not, I won't bother. This isn't kendo.

Kreuzader
04-20-2002, 10:25 PM
Originally posted by MankaCat
Dooku != sith lord
he is a dark jedi
he's one of the 'fallen twenty' of the jedi order
as a sidenote: I blue stance lunge bowers in the face, then they stop
:O

Moooore AOTC spoilers:


Yes, he is. He's the Sith lord Darth Tyranus, Maul's replacement. Look at theforce.net's spoiler section if you don't believe it.

Valdarious
04-20-2002, 10:27 PM
I would also like to add that if I do bow, which I will usualy just look down, I do it like Bruce Lee said "Never take your eyes off your opponent, even when you bow!"

XIII
04-20-2002, 11:52 PM
Bowing is 'G A Y' LOOOOOOOOOL.

I think it is more "G A Y" that someone can't leave the ship on BGJ in a duel map before a little $hithead tries to DFA him to death when he comes threw an exit. (and can't see it comming)

That is really 'G A Y'. I always bow. Yep.. respect and Yep ... letting your opponent see you are ready. I hate people who attack someone who isn't ready to fight. If you don't want to bow (which is your good right) at least have the descency to let other people do it and not attack them.

just my 2

Regards,

XIII
aka NTS_Archer
NTS Website (http://www.noghri.nl)

Trahern Valley
04-21-2002, 01:25 AM
IMHO, darksiders shouldn't bow, and lightsiders should only bow to other lightsiders. That's the only time I'd see it happening.

The only kind of salute a Sith would give is not attacking straight away, or not immediately lighting up the saber, or something. Assuming they mean it as a salute...

Jedi_Monk
04-21-2002, 04:35 AM
Vader sometimes salutes with his lightsaber. I think you can immitate this by switching to Heavy Stance, and then back to light and do a nice slash ;)

Kurgan
04-21-2002, 06:21 AM
Darth Vader knelt before the Emperor.. but then again, he's the Emperor, and that's what you do to show him respect!

I don't recall if Obi-Wan and Qui Gon ever "bowed" to anyone in TPM that wasn't a ruler of some sort, so I don't even know how well it fits into any kind of role-playing "Jedi" thing you can think of.

I don't see it as being in any way mandatory. I guess it can look cool, but so does the taunting or just fighting. ; )

If anyone replies 'who cares, bowing is gay' to this, I will kill them. In real life if possible.

Okay. Hold on a sec while I call the cops...

Demangel
04-21-2002, 07:09 AM
Would they bow? Probably not, not unless they actualy have respect. Even then they might only nod at them with a malicious grin on thier face.

However even if they are afriad to die, they are not so cowardly to attack unarmed jedi unless the fight was already underway.

(for example a Jedi escaping down a corridor, turning off his saber to be more silent and waiting in ambush is a valid target saber drawn or not, if you spot him first)

Thus if the engagement hadn't started, bow or not the second you light your saber or make an offensive move, you are fair game... end of story.

But this isn't role playing either. so in game terms if I see a text in the chat thing that says: "wait my mouse is fouled up..." or something from the guy I am fighting, I would back off to a safe distance and wait it out.

So in role play sense ETC? Yeah they would at least allow the enemy jedi to be ready to fight. Maul didn't jump Gin or Wan, Vader never jumped Wan or Luke, even the emperor only did his thing after Luke I am sure knew it (whatever It might be) was coming...

Remember Jedi, Dark, sith or otherwise, I am SURE have some sense of honor. thereis Honor amognts thieves remember, But no honor for thugs...

Any Jedi like enemy has some sense of honor, and they are certainly not thugs. strom troopers? thugs.... sith/Dark jedi? Not thugs. End of story.

Cheap shots are still going to happen though, so don't expect a sith or dark jedi to have mercy on you just because you sheathed your saber. About the only measure of mercy you can expect, is a short delay before they attack you when you first spot them.

In the SP game, the reborn always let you know they are coming in some way, and even if they take you by surprise, they don't simply start hacking away at you for at least a few seconds.

In every instance of the reborn however you know they are there before they launch a real attack, even if they just taunt you, it is a split seconds worth of crucial data they don't have to give, but do anyway.

The shadow troopers don't just stay hidden till your back is turned then saber you to death do they? No... they leap down or make their presance known, light their saber, THEN attack... you still know it is coming.

thus I think a Dark Jedi or sith, Would at least give you a chance to prepare to die/fight. If you took ten minutes to bow or something then of course they would probably jump in and hack your guts out though...

So the next question is, would a Jedi bother to bow to a sith or dark Jedi? We already know they wouldn't attack you without due warning unless the fight was in full swing, even if just because that is the right thing to do.

So really would a jedi take the time to Bow? I doubt it. gin and Obi never looked at eachother and started hamering at Maul before he lit his saber either.

In fact the only time a Sith ever seemed to have tried to jump a Jedi was in Episode one, when Maul tracks down Gin on his bike thing. but even then gin had ample time to prepare, it wasn't like Gin didn't have his saber lit yet. Remember he tried to run Aniken down? gin told Anekin to drop to the ground?

so anyway regardless I feel this debate will rage for years... it's as bad as coke vs pepsi, PS2 vs Xbox, or Game cube, and democrat Vs republican... Opinions are like butts, we all have one and they all stink...

Mandamus
04-21-2002, 07:12 AM
I'm not sure how you guys are "bowing" in MP JK...

Saluting one's opponent in fencing is common...there are distinctive styles of salutes with a sword that shows what school of fencing you're from.

I'm in the habit of shutting off my saber between combats...it adds a certain dramatic flare to the game to approach (or be approached by) an opponent..face them, and light the saber...sometimes with a "muaahaahaaaaa...!" taunt...

Add a little roleplay to the game...it's fun.

M.

Darksider
04-21-2002, 07:14 AM
A sith would poke you in the eye with a pointy stick, or better yet, point past them and say "Hey, you there!" then disembowel you when you turned around. I have a pointy stick, dont push me.

igor
04-21-2002, 07:22 AM
I am sure that some Sith would bow. Think of Kyp Durron he was, Sith/Dark Jedi/Fallen Jedi, from what I remember he still had respect for other jedi. My facts might be messed up because I read those books back 5 years ago.
I am sure that some would bow because some would still have respect for other jedi, bad or not. I think that Darth Vader in the movie saluted Kenobi before he struck him down.
Just because you are evil doesn't mean you can't be respectful of other's abilities.

patchx
04-21-2002, 07:46 AM
vader and dooku were both former jedi who were raised with the discipline of jedi teachings so would probably salute or whatever out of habit.

on the other hand..

i think if u bothered to bow to darth maul he'd take the opportunity to slice of both your arms and stck them up your dot before your were finished.

-patch