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cenca
08-27-2001, 08:16 PM
I know this is probably going to make some people...well...offended, but it does say anything goes here. And so I feel it is right enough to ask the question...What are your opinions about the Big Bang Theory and anything else that you think ties up with it(example: Basic Theology). I'm going to say my thoughts on this. Please tell me what you think about this.

~Qwi

Uutont Fær Uulion
08-27-2001, 08:52 PM
The Big Bang Theory is totally ludicrous
and is totally false. Everything in the Universe was originally evenly spread throughout the entire universe. Then one of the particles decided to move causeing the ones next to it to be pulled in by its gravity. and slowly the particles began to pull together thus forming the universe as we know it to day.
here is a link you might want to follow
Schott in the Head: Cosmos (http://www.xmission.com/~sith/Cosmos.html)

Boba Rhett
08-28-2001, 12:30 AM
Big bang. LOL. Yeah, in the beginning there was nothing.... which then exploded..... :rolleyes:

Hannibal
08-28-2001, 01:01 PM
Originally posted by Boba Rhett:
<STRONG>Big bang. LOL. Yeah, in the beginning there was nothing.... which then exploded..... :rolleyes:</STRONG>

LOL. HeHeHe. Your funny Boba!
:D :D :D

andy_nighthawk
08-28-2001, 01:09 PM
didn't think this thread would say scientific for very long :D

i would lend my weight......but i'm not a physicist.

BeastMaster
08-28-2001, 01:12 PM
As was Douglas Adams (whom Rhett was quoting). ;)

To really say anything about the Big Bang theory, you'd have to choose between a "closed" or "open" universe, and right now, I don't think we (as a species) have enough data to do that.

My personal theory kinda tends from the Close-Universe school. Before the Big Bang, there was another universe, which collapsed (like a sine wave crossing the 0-line) into this universe.

Most likely, this universe will eventually stop expanding, and collapse into another universe.

This, of course, is only a half-baked theory, and doesn't take into account any quantum effects that may happen as the universe approaches "perigee" (I forget the technical term). In other words, it's possible that time might accelerate as the universe stops expanding, effectively "locking it open."

You should boot this over to XWA.net; I know Zoom Rabbit would have something to say, but he doesn't post here anymore.

StormHammer
08-28-2001, 02:26 PM
Originally posted by BeastMaster:
<STRONG>My personal theory kinda tends from the Close-Universe school. Before the Big Bang, there was another universe, which collapsed (like a sine wave crossing the 0-line) into this universe.</STRONG>

There is only one fundamental problem with that theory - where did the first universe come from?

Unless, of course, this supposedly infinite universe is in some kind of infinity loop, where the end of time and the beginning of time are at exactly the same point.

The universe itself could ultimately turn out to be proof of the ultimate paradox - it collapses into itself, creating the moment of the big bang, which recreates the universe again exactly as it was before.

Essentially, the universe could exist in every possible state at the same moment in time, because both space and time are infinite. This might go some way to explaining why we experience deja vu, where a temporary blip in the fabric of space/time basically means you have a memory and an event occuring at the same moment.

Of course, I tend to like the theory shown at the end of the film Men In Black, where our universe is actually just a marble used by a bunch of titanic aliens to play a silly game. ;)

BeastMaster
08-30-2001, 03:40 PM
Originally posted by StormHammer:
<STRONG>Unless, of course, this supposedly infinite universe is in some kind of infinity loop, where the end of time and the beginning of time are at exactly the same point.</STRONG>

Well, according to some theories, space and time are curved, so the infinite could conceivably end up right back where it began (to paraphrase G'Kar ;) ).

<small>Where's Wally the Space Dolphin when we actually need him?</small>

andy_nighthawk
08-30-2001, 06:13 PM
wow, i never realised everyone here was so intelligent :D

Uutont Fær Uulion
08-30-2001, 08:22 PM
we're not we just make it up as we go along.

LoganakakWolverine
08-30-2001, 10:39 PM
I for one believe in the Big Bang Theory. They did find the remnants of it didn't they?

BeastMaster
09-01-2001, 06:28 PM
Sort of.

Judging by (current) understanding of electron decay, everything seems to have come into existence at about the same time. Astronomers have also been able to chart galactic drift, and think they've found evidence of most galaxies (in the Local Group, anyway) moving in the same direction away from a certain point.

But you realize that this is all based on current models; it's fully possible that one finding could someday force the scientific community to completely readjust their theories.

And to Andy; I'm an SF writer, so astronomy, philosophy, biology, social theory, history, and mythology are matters of somewhat professional interest. :cool:

felix
09-01-2001, 06:30 PM
What books have you written?

Sub-Zero
09-02-2001, 02:00 AM
I believe that the whole universe was created by God. All that Big Bang theory is just a waste of time.

brashin99451
09-02-2001, 02:45 AM
i just like to beleive every neutron contains a universe which expands into a universe of neutrons. i knew that isn't scientific.

but does anyone have anything to say about shadow galaxies?

BeastMaster
09-03-2001, 03:04 PM
Originally posted by Felix29:
<STRONG>What books have you written?</STRONG>

At this point I'm unpublished (except for a coupla' poems), but I have a few short stories waiting to find a "slushpile," and several novel ideas on the backburner.

As for Shadow Galaxies, I'm of the school that thinks that Dark Matter coexists within galaxies, perhaps in some stage of quantum flux (which is why it has weight and mass, but doesn't seem to exist :eek: ).

Rogue15
09-03-2001, 05:57 PM
well, this is what i know.


1 In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. 2 The earth was without form and void, and darkness was upon the face of the deep; and the Spirit of God was moving over the face of the waters.


3 And God said, "Let there be light"; and there was light. 4 And God saw that the light was good; and God separated the light from the darkness. 5 God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And there was evening and there was morning, one day.


6 And God said, "Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it separate the waters from the waters." 7 And God made the firmament and separated the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament. And it was so. 8 And God called the firmament Heaven. And there was evening and there was morning, a second day.


9 And God said, "Let the waters under the heavens be gathered together into one place, and let the dry land appear." And it was so. 10 God called the dry land Earth, and the waters that were gathered together he called Seas. And God saw that it was good. 11 And God said, "Let the earth put forth vegetation, plants yielding seed, and fruit trees bearing fruit in which is their seed, each according to its kind, upon the earth." And it was so. 12 The earth brought forth vegetation, plants yielding seed according to their own kinds, and trees bearing fruit in which is their seed, each according to its kind. And God saw that it was good. 13 And there was evening and there was morning, a third day.


14 And God said, "Let there be lights in the firmament of the heavens to separate the day from the night; and let them be for signs and for seasons and for days and years, 15 and let them be lights in the firmament of the heavens to give light upon the earth." And it was so. 16 And God made the two great lights, the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night; he made the stars also. 17 And God set them in the firmament of the heavens to give light upon the earth, 18 to rule over the day and over the night, and to separate the light from the darkness. And God saw that it was good. 19 And there was evening and there was morning, a fourth day.


20 And God said, "Let the waters bring forth swarms of living creatures, and let birds fly above the earth across the firmament of the heavens." 21 So God created the great sea monsters and every living creature that moves, with which the waters swarm, according to their kinds, and every winged bird according to its kind. And God saw that it was good. 22 And God blessed them, saying, "Be fruitful and multiply and fill the waters in the seas, and let birds multiply on the earth." 23 And there was evening and there was morning, a fifth day.


24 And God said, "Let the earth bring forth living creatures according to their kinds: cattle and creeping things and beasts of the earth according to their kinds." And it was so. 25 And God made the beasts of the earth according to their kinds and the cattle according to their kinds, and everything that creeps upon the ground according to its kind. And God saw that it was good.


26 Then God said, "Let us make man in our image, after our likeness; and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the birds of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creeps upon the earth." 27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God he created him; male and female he created them. 28 And God blessed them, and God said to them, "Be fruitful and multiply, and fill the earth and subdue it; and have dominion over the fish of the sea and over the birds of the air and over every living thing that moves upon the earth." 29 And God said, "Behold, I have given you every plant yielding seed which is upon the face of all the earth, and every tree with seed in its fruit; you shall have them for food. 30 And to every beast of the earth, and to every bird of the air, and to everything that creeps on the earth, everything that has the breath of life, I have given every green plant for food." And it was so. 31 And God saw everything that he had made, and behold, it was very good. And there was evening and there was morning, a sixth day.


Chapter 2

1 Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them. 2 And on the seventh day God finished his work which he had done, and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had done. 3 So God blessed the seventh day and hallowed it, because on it God rested from all his work which he had done in creation.


*trips over paulpet and falls on the floor*

Crys
09-03-2001, 08:54 PM
:rolleyes:

ESE_Sithlord
09-03-2001, 09:51 PM
????? Crys? what?

BeastMaster
09-04-2001, 01:26 PM
Originally posted by Rogue15:
<STRONG>1 In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. </STRONG>

*BANG*

Universal replication in progress.

Gravimetric eddies congealing; accretion disks of stellar matter forming along orbital planes.

<STRONG>2 The earth was without form and void, and darkness was upon the face of the deep;</STRONG>

Condensation of solar accretion disk proceeding; planetary bodies forming.

<STRONG>and the Spirit of God was moving over the face of the waters.</STRONG>

Gaia field detected.

<STRONG>3 And God said, "Let there be light"; and there was light. 4 And God saw that the light was good; and God separated the light from the darkness. 5 God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And there was evening and there was morning, one day.</STRONG>

Solar ignition!

Outer (gaseous) planets formed, and absorbing meteoric input to shield inner-system development.

<STRONG>6 And God said, "Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it separate the waters from the waters." </STRONG>

Planetary crust forming.

Geologic stresses decreasing.

WARNING: Meteoric impact imminent!

Collision.

Planetary cohesion lost: re-establishing.

Auxiliary orbital body detected, orbit stabilizing. Designate: moon.

<STRONG>7 And God made the firmament and separated the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament. And it was so. 8 And God called the firmament Heaven. And there was evening and there was morning, a second day.</STRONG>

Atmosphere forming. Eccess accretion material withdrawing into deeper gravity well.

<STRONG>9 And God said, "Let the waters under the heavens be gathered together into one place, and let the dry land appear." And it was so. 10 God called the dry land Earth, and the waters that were gathered together he called Seas. And God saw that it was good.</STRONG>

Atmospheric precipitation cycle complete. The planetary surface is now cooled. Mean sea-level established.

Forming climactic regions: Polar (arctic), Equator (tropical).

WARNING: bacterial forms detected!

<STRONG> 11 And God said, "Let the earth put forth vegetation, plants yielding seed, and fruit trees bearing fruit in which is their seed, each according to its kind, upon the earth." And it was so. 12 The earth brought forth vegetation, plants yielding seed according to their own kinds, and trees bearing fruit in which is their seed, each according to its kind. And God saw that it was good. 13 And there was evening and there was morning, a third day.</STRONG>

Bacterial forms have formed photosynthetic systems. Genus: vegetable. Species: various (algae, plankton, lichens, mosses).

WARNING: photosynthetic systems failing.

<STRONG>14 And God said, "Let there be lights in the firmament of the heavens to separate the day from the night; and let them be for signs and for seasons and for days and years, 15 and let them be lights in the firmament of the heavens to give light upon the earth." And it was so.</STRONG>

Atmospheric gasses thinning. Atmosphere reaching translucency.

Solar radiation now reaching surface. Photosynthetic systems re-establishing.

<STRONG> 16 And God made the two great lights, the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night; he made the stars also. 17 And God set them in the firmament of the heavens to give light upon the earth, 18 to rule over the day and over the night, and to separate the light from the darkness. And God saw that it was good. 19 And there was evening and there was morning, a fourth day. </STRONG>

Atmospheric composition has reached acceptable level.

Solar input at maximum. Lunar albedo at maximum.

Inner planets complete. Planetary formation complete.

<STRONG>20 And God said, "Let the waters bring forth swarms of living creatures, and let birds fly above the earth across the firmament of the heavens."</STRONG>

Bacterial systems forming groupings of advancing complexity. Trans-genus boundary reached: animals detected. Species: various aquatic.

Vegetative life advancing onto land.

Solar radiation causing mutations. Bio-matrix and genepool diversifying.

<STRONG>21 So God created the great sea monsters and every living creature that moves, with which the waters swarm, according to their kinds, and every winged bird according to its kind. And God saw that it was good. 22 And God blessed them, saying, "Be fruitful and multiply and fill the waters in the seas, and let birds multiply on the earth." 23 And there was evening and there was morning, a fifth day. </STRONG>

Advanced lifeforms detected. Seas fully populated.

Animal life beginning extra-oceanic migration.

<STRONG>24 And God said, "Let the earth bring forth living creatures according to their kinds: cattle and creeping things and beasts of the earth according to their kinds." And it was so. 25 And God made the beasts of the earth according to their kinds and the cattle according to their kinds, and everything that creeps upon the ground according to its kind. And God saw that it was good.</STRONG>

Animal life adapting to land-based life.

Further radiation-spawned mutations developping.

Bio-matrix diversifying: amphibians => reptiles => endotherms => mammals & avians.

Some mammals returning to aquatic life. Designate: cetaceans.

<STRONG>26 Then God said, "Let us make man in our image, after our likeness; and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the birds of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creeps upon the earth." 27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God he created him; male and female he created them. 28 And God blessed them, and God said to them, "Be fruitful and multiply, and fill the earth and subdue it; and have dominion over the fish of the sea and over the birds of the air and over every living thing that moves upon the earth." 29 And God said, "Behold, I have given you every plant yielding seed which is upon the face of all the earth, and every tree with seed in its fruit; you shall have them for food. 30 And to every beast of the earth, and to every bird of the air, and to everything that creeps on the earth, everything that has the breath of life, I have given every green plant for food." And it was so. 31 And God saw everything that he had made, and behold, it was very good. And there was evening and there was morning, a sixth day. </STRONG>

Hominid brain development exceeding necessary limit. Expanded brain capacity manifesting in auxiliary processing power.

Sapience has been achieved.

WARNING: Species wide psychological imbalance detected. The hominids have been traumatized and are out of balance with the planetary Gaia field.

Unable to proceed with intended advancement.

Abort sapient species? Y/N

Kurgan
09-04-2001, 01:33 PM
My personal opinion? The big bang theory is (so far) our best guess as to the origins of the universe as we know it, and I don't pretend to have all the scientific papers to explain it, but what I've read of it sounds reasonable enough to me.

Now of course it doesn't really answer the question of where that matter came from in the first place, or what it was doing at a certain point BEFORE the 'explosion' so we don't know every single detail.

I don't find that as in necessary conflict to a belief in an intelligent Cosmic Designer (tm).

Kurgan

[ September 04, 2001: Message edited by: Kurgan ]

darth terrat
09-04-2001, 03:35 PM
aha.. :rolleyes: :D

Rogue15
09-04-2001, 05:32 PM
our universe is but a bead of sweat on God's forehead. he could wipe us out in any moment. :D

Gabrobot
09-04-2001, 11:13 PM
God must have a strange sense of humour.... :D :rolleyes:

Answer to BeastMaster's question:
yes. :D ;)

StormHammer
09-06-2001, 01:00 AM
Of course, there is a slight problem with the God theory, as with any other theory expounded in this thread...

Where did God come from? If God is a being, even a being of pure energy, that energy must exist somewhere in space/time.

Furthermore, if God is an omniscient energy force, it could be argued that God actually is the Universe, creating and destroying him/her/itself as the space/time continuum curves in on itself. Therefore, the idea of God the Creator would be correct, because God would be the universe.

Of course, isn't there another problem - that the multitude of galaxies within the universe, that apparently all originated from the same point in space, are actually accelerating the further apart they get, rather than slowing down?

I don't really buy into the theory that Dark matter is the cause of this - especially if dark matter exists throughout the universe anyway. I mean, it could be argued that the dark matter should actually contribute to these galaxies slowing down in their trajectories.

Of course, if space/time is curved - has an infinite number of curves - it may be the case that these galaxies are, in fact, being attracted to each other, and are racing to meet at the same point - an origin that exists in multiple places, while occupying only one place.

Heh, this subject messes with your head after a while. ;)

Rogue15
09-06-2001, 01:20 AM
well, i've always wondered where God came from, heh, i'll ask him when i get to heaven. :D then call up john edwards and tell him.

Gabrobot
09-06-2001, 01:43 AM
If there is a god, why did he create dinosaurs? :D

Nope. I don't think there is any "god".

[ September 06, 2001: Message edited by: Gabrobot ]

Uutont Fær Uulion
09-07-2001, 10:41 PM
as to what beastmaster said
Do you think that all happened by chance?
Somebody was in charge making sure nothing went wrong? God created the dinosaurs for a very specific purpose. OIL! As to where did God came from well he came from a planet much like the one that we reside upon and it was ruled over by a God and that God came from a planet much like the one that we reside upon and it was ruled over by a God et cetera all the way back to the original God who started out as pum as do we all. He found that something was wrong(nothing was happening). He thought it out and understood exactly what had to happen, and understood that it was the only way it would work. He knew the end from the beginning. He then took a supreme leap of faith, and moved. many of the other pum around him had realized that something was wrong, but they had not realized what had to happen. When he moved some of them understood and they to moved. He taught them and they taught others. some stove to be a God like Him others became subatomic particles, others became atoms, molecules, cells, rocks, etc. Pum is often called spirit. Each spirit used othe spirits and in turn they helped other spirits. all the way up to the supreme spirit, God. God orginized the matter into planets, solar systems, and galaxies, so that the spirits wishing to gain bodies could do so. He taught them. Some followed his commandments and learned others didn't. Some that followed became Gods with their spouses for one of the commandments he set for was that man marry. Others did not follow all of the commandments and they gained lesser places: angels, etc. Some chose not to gain bodies andthey were cast out becoming devils for they can never be happy like those that followed what God taught. These devils are striving to bring men down to the stat that they are in. Eventually each spirit must be seperate from their body and be judged. They then go to the kingdom they have been granted. And they gain Godhood. They then create their own planets, galaxies, etc where they can help other spirits and they will be filled with joy. We eventually will gain Godhood if we follow the plan, there will never be an end, there is an infinite amount of space, so space is not a problem, there never was a beginning for even though God's first action was a beginning there was existence before then. It merely was not doing anything.

:)
does that help. I know for a fact that that is the way it happened, and will continue happening for it is the only plan without flaws and if there are flaws in what I say the flaws are entirely errors in me

Gabrobot
09-08-2001, 03:28 AM
Proof? :rolleyes:

Uutont Fær Uulion
09-08-2001, 03:23 PM
If you want proof then why don't you ask God he's the one that told me and I have recieved proof, but I cannot share that proof only he can

Gabrobot
09-08-2001, 11:22 PM
How? :rolleyes:

:D

Gabrobot
09-09-2001, 02:21 AM
If "god" is all powerful, can he create an object that no one can lift?

BeastMaster
09-09-2001, 04:21 PM
Originally posted by Uutont Fær Uulion:
<STRONG>why don't you ask God he's the one that told me </STRONG>

That's proof you couldn't have spoken to God; God is a woman.

<small>It's the only way the Universe begins to make sense.</small> ;)

Uutont Fær Uulion
09-11-2001, 07:31 PM
if you want to talk to god just say his name:
God, Heavenly Father, Supreme Being
and start talking he'll listen and then he will tell you. When he tells you it is more like him removing all doubt and you know what you are supposed to, however sometimes you might here your answer from a friend, teacher, family member, or even a complete stranger. But he will answer.

just to straighten things out God is not a woman, his wife is. I will leave it up to them to decide who is in charge.

Kurgan
09-11-2001, 10:39 PM
If you believe in a god, I would start praying now, I think the world really needs it. : (

Darth_Lando
09-12-2001, 02:23 PM
Originally posted by StormHammer:
<STRONG>

Where did God come from? If God is a being, even a being of pure energy, that energy must exist somewhere in space/time.
</STRONG>


The same problem exists for people who don't believe in God except make the question the universe.

If humans came from monkeys which came from some other mammel which came from a reptile which came from an amphibian which came from a fish which came from a single cell organism which came from the primordial souop which came from chemicals and gases which came from the big bang which came from the Cosmic Egg where did the Cosmic Egg com from?

Another assumption I would like to add a point to ponder is if God created the universe and one of the fundametal components of the universe is time. Why would you assume that God is confined by time which he created?

Man created computers and computers are made at a factory yet I am sure computers don't ask themselves "If humans made us what factory did they come from?"

I know that is a really dumb, simplistic, and rough example but just tyring to offer another view.

[ September 12, 2001: Message edited by: Darth_Lando ]

BeastMaster
09-12-2001, 07:55 PM
Regarding Universal expansion (sorta):

http://www.theonion.com/onion3732/expanding_universe.html

<small>Courtesy of The Onion; America's Finest News Source.</small>

:D

Redwing
09-13-2001, 03:35 AM
Originally posted by StormHammer:
[QB]Of course, there is a slight problem with the God theory, as with any other theory expounded in this thread...

Where did God come from? If God is a being, even a being of pure energy, that energy must exist somewhere in space/time.

[b]

You're forgetting: God created matter, energy, space and time. Thus He would not be bound by those forces at all. The laws of nature wouldn't apply to their Creator.

Borg Collective
09-13-2001, 04:35 PM
a creation-spanning, ever-growing, omnipotent Blockbuster hive-mind

<FONT SIZE = "7">!?!</FONT>

This will not be permitted. :mad:

Kurgan
09-13-2001, 05:36 PM
Ah the onion.. they'd be a lot funnier if they kept their articles shorter. In most cases just the headlines would be sufficient.

Though I didn't find many of their satirical articles about killing babies very funny, and they were pretty mean to the religious folks, but I liked the "black guy photoshopped in" article about my university (though its likely they've never even been here).

Fark.com, on the other hand, rules!