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AoErat
08-26-2001, 01:46 PM
Lately I've been thinking about a good way to set up a sort of SWGB League.

This is my "design doc", if you want to call it that. :)

I am open to suggestions, comments, and criticism. This idea is still being formed, so there are no set things that *have* to be done, etc.

SWGB Gaming League: Galactic Supremacy
<<------------------------------------------------------->>

I. Premise
----------

Six Factions are arranged equally on a 12x10 grid, each controlling 20 spaces. Each faction's goal is to control the galaxy (grid).

The purpose of the league is a dual one: First, to provide a competitive atmosphere, and a common goal, and second, a player-matching service.

The basic grid layout at the start of the league:

http://www.heavengames.com/angels/aoerat/league/grid.gif

Red: Rebellion
Blue: Empire
Tan: Trade Federation
Light Green: Gungans
Dark Green: Wookies
Aqua: Royal Naboo

II. Objective
-------------

The objective of Galactic Supremacy is to conquer each of your faction's five (5) rivals. This is accomplished by attacking adjacent, enemy-occupied spaces. To determine the winner of each conflict, a multiplayer game of SWGB is played.

III. Battles
------------

Battles are planned and carried out as follows:

a) Select a opposing, bordering territory to attack. This places a "challenge" to the opposing team. Other members of your faction can join you on your challenge. The number of challengees is limited to the number of sector sides that face the enemy faction. The most would be four (4).
b) Someone on the other team will take up your challenge. If there is more than one (1) challengee, an equal number of players on the other team must take up the challenge. This makes for 2v2, 3v3, and 4v4 games. Challenges can only be accepted if the other player is within your skill level. Skill levels are calculated by your ratio of wins to losses. This insures fair, competitive games.
c) A game of SWGB is played to determine the winner(s) of the conflict.
d) The winning faction occupies the sector.

IV. Game
--------

Game rules and procedure are as follows:

a) All players must agree on the map type to play on. If no agreement can be met, the map type [default] must be used.
b) Game must be recorded.
c) A/The winner submits results to website, and the loser verifies the claim. If the winner is disputed, refer to recorded game. If no recorded game available, the match is replayed.
d) Games are played over TCP/IP or whatever built-in multiplayer system is included.

V. Joining
----------

Each player registers with the league, and enters some information: Username, Password, E-mail, Play Times (when the best time is for you to play.), and Other Information. Then, the player can join any of the factions. A recommendation is given to join the faction with the least members.

VI. Other
---------

- Player skill levels are determinded by a wins/losses ratio, and allowable games are dictated by that.
- According to skill level, ranks are determined. They are as follows:

1. Ensign
2. Officer
3. Lieutentant
4. Captain
5. Commander
6. Admiral
7. Grand Admiral

- Players may only set forth one (1) challenge at a time. It can be recalled and recast at any time prior to an enemy accepting the challenge.

- Sectors are referred to by their grid coordinates. Alphabetical along the X-axis, and numerical along the Y-axis. (example: Sector A-7)

----end doc

Anyway, that's about it.

There are some additional questions for you, though:

1. Is it to complicated? If so, how?
2. Is it not complicated enough? If so, how can it be improved?
3. Would you be interested in participating in such a league?
4. Any other suggestions, comments, and/or criticsm.

Thanks,

~ AoErat

Clefo
08-26-2001, 01:50 PM
Originally posted by AoErat

Anyway, that's about it.

There are some additional questions for you, though:

1. Is it to complicated? If so, how?
2. Is to not complicated enough? If so, how can it be improved?
3. Would you be interested in participating in such a league?
4. Any other suggestions, comments, and/or criticsm.

Thanks,

~ AoErat

To answer:

1. Not really, no. I can dig it.

2. The system itself is fine...

3. Sure

4. Yeah: Shouldn't Factions be able to ally with each other? That would make it much more interesting

crazy_dog
08-26-2001, 02:11 PM
Hmmm... about the critism/ideas thing..., you could have map(s0 for every territory, going back to conquered maps to build structures/units amy be an idea, setting it in a time period with certain events/ civs are available. I mean Naboo vs Allieance is really :confused: . can you also have hero/character units as well.



Hey, just an idea, how about mixing in my Scenario with your game? (I keep saying this to everyone)

Tie Guy
08-26-2001, 02:44 PM
looks fun, i'll consider doing it.

One question, wouldn't this game take a very long time. Maybe you should shrink the grid, or maybe i'm wrong, i've never done one of these before.

Also, i think that you should be able to to ally, then you could have 2 v 2 battles, or even 4 v 4 battles, and it would be much more interesting.

Lord JayVizIon
08-26-2001, 03:04 PM
a question i have is that you mentioned players of the same level can only attack each other. i don't know about you, but in the zone, most of the time advanced aok players only like playing other advanced players, and the same goes for rookies. therefore, why would an ensign want to enlist in a game where grand admirals are playing? on a 12 X 10 map, wouldn't that be a long game?

Booya2020
08-26-2001, 03:11 PM
I think its a good idea so far. An idea for it would be to play it for a week and then decide who the winnin faction is by who has the most territory. It would be qicker that way.

JEDI_MASTA
08-26-2001, 03:41 PM
ok im deffinately in but i think the zone is much easier to play on than ip so lets play it there ..... each faction shoud have a tourney before the start of the game to decide rank also the grand admiral of your faction should have control over who goes into the game to play as long as rank is the same as the opposing players this would make a good game :D i think certain squares should be qualified as planets with certain map types for each square allready assigned this way it would be easier to decide on a map well thats about all i can think of but ill certainly play do we have any volunteers for making up a tourney to decide rank there should probably be like 20 players in a faction that way you would have more ensigns than grand admirals so u only have one or two leaders and everybody has a superior player if u tell me how many players we can get for each faction i guess i could make up a tourney or someone else because im not going to have tons of time in the next few weeks but ill deffinately help you chould also be able to have allies with different factions so if somebody dosent show up for a game u could use a player from an allied faction to play in his/her place :bdroid2: well thats about it for now giv me some ideas and ill deffinately help making it

darthfergie
08-26-2001, 03:51 PM
AoERat...um...wow...I'm stuned...you have been working on this.:eek:

AoErat
08-26-2001, 04:20 PM
Hi all, thanks for the replies.

Clefo: Factions should not be able to ally because if they did, they could easily overpower the rest, since there are only 6. (OT: we both live in Tucson!)

crazy_dog: Using premade maps (ie not random maps) is a hassle because everyone who plays will have to have each map, and have the correct version, etc. That's why I decided it was best to go with the generic "random map" type.

Tie Guy: I think it will depend on the number of players in each faction on how long it will take to complete. I would estimate perhaps a month or two. Anyway, the winning conditions can be easily changed, ie "Control X sectors", etc.

When two people challenge the same sector, the game to determine who controls that sector automatically becomes a 2v2 game. So, if you want to play a 2v2 game, all you have to do is find a sector that one of your teammates has challenged, and challenge it also. Same idea for 3v3. 4v4 can only happen when a faction has only one sector left.

Lord JayVizIon: A lower-skill player can still be an asset to the entire faction/team because they can defeat other lower-skill players, and still gain a sector. Also, they do not have to fear facing someone way above their skill level. If they get better, their rank increases (wins:losses), so they then are automatically qualified to play with higher-ranked players. The rank names are mostly there so you can say "I'm a Commander", instead of "I'm ranked 12/23", etc

The "galaxy" is a 12x10 grid, but that doesn't mean that the game you actually play will be on a map that large. The grid just represents how many sectors your faction controls.

Booya2020: This would be a good idea, if people want it to last shorter.

JEDI_MASTA: I put "whatever built-in multiplayer system" in the design doc because we do not know if SWGB will be played over the Zone or not. Whatever multiplayer matching service available to use will be fine. It doesn't really matter where the games are played.

Ranks are determined as the league progresses. This means at the very beginning their may be some unfair games because everyone will have a 0/0 skill level. But, as more games are played, people who win more will rise in skill and therefore a seperation will occur. Of course, it could be set up so you can enter your estimated skill when you sign up. Something to think about ...

I am currently building planets into the system I'm setting up. Each faction will probably have a planet related to their faction in their beginning sectors - ie the Empire would have Coruscant, Wookies Kashykk, etc.

darthfergie: Thanks! :)

Compa_Mighty
08-26-2001, 05:16 PM
So there are some people from Tucson here...

It's a shame Jo Jo left his home there, for some California grass... :D

Gamma732
08-26-2001, 06:22 PM
Great idea. I especially like the ranking...it gets pretty annoying with the current system on the zone with AOK. This would make it easier for more people to start/join games that will be closer fought and more fun.

Darth_Rommel
08-26-2001, 07:51 PM
How soon will this be set up... I'm definatly joining!

Clefo
08-26-2001, 08:16 PM
I'm automaticly in. Before you ask: Naboo.

As for ganging up: Not necessarily. If you play Civilization or Alpha Centauri or something like that 2v1 isn't always unfair.

If not alliances then there should be cease fire treaties or Temporary non agression...

JEDI_MASTA
08-26-2001, 08:20 PM
ok i guess ill take the TF or the gungans but im now sure whitch just in case there is not room but im deffinately in

AoErat
08-26-2001, 11:07 PM
Darth_Rommel: I'm programming the framework for it right now.

General Nilaar
08-27-2001, 12:43 AM
Nice to see someone had the same idea I had. This saves me the trouble of having to do it myself;)

As for how long it takes to complete, there's no reason for it not to take a couple of months. Just a couple of weeks is too short, you would be constantly resetting the league, and there would be a feeling of pointlessness about it. In a plantetary league, length can be a good thing;)

Sign me up for the Imperials. Assuming there's a leader for each faction in the league, I'm volunteering for the Imperial leadership. Making a central website for Imperial players would be no problem for me. And there's few who are more loyal to the Empire than me;)

One thing I'd like to see is an emphasis on playing the part of your "general". With a role-playing forum for the league. In fact the fourms used by this site would be the kind I'd like to see used by the league as well. The Avatars are great and the Private Message feature would facilitate back room dealings between the different factions without having to give our e-mails out.

I see you've already checked out the original GB league thread, there's lot's of good ideas there as well.

crazy_dog
08-27-2001, 04:47 AM
I'll have a think about it....

God
08-27-2001, 07:46 AM
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Clefo
[B]

To answer:

1. Not really, no. I can dig it.

2. The system itself is fine...

3. Sure

i'm in with clefo on that but could the sectors have a planet in them to make a map of?

God
08-27-2001, 07:55 AM
hey, couldn't we use a map of the galaxy from rebellion or something. that would make gmeplay more fun. you could refer to planets by their name not their grid piont.

Paragon_Leon
08-27-2001, 10:44 AM
Aoerat,

looks awesome...
so awesome in fact, that it sounds like the kind of league we'd want combined with the Senate-idea.
If you're interested in having that done, make it known and we'll work on that. The Senate would then serve as sort of a 'newscast' and 'political battleground' for that league.

JEDI_MASTA
08-27-2001, 06:54 PM
good idea leon:D

JEDI_MASTA
10-21-2001, 10:48 AM
HEY GUYS I FOUND THE THREAD TAKE A LOOK AT IT

PhantomMenace
10-21-2001, 04:28 PM
THat is an awesome idea for a league AOERAT...you're a really imaginative and intelligent person to think all that up out of nothing! I would definitely join a leauge like that...however i got 2 concerns...first, i agree with that other guy...i think the grid should be just a tad bit smaller, becuase you know if a faction takes ground the loosing faction or other factioins will try to take it back. So you gonna see a lot of back and forth battles and a lot of lost and regained ground and a huge grid like that will take forever to conquer. Also, like say noboyd likes the Naboo, and say the Imperials are top heavy in members...that would the talent pool for other sides a bit lopsided...how bout giving the factioins names instead of the civs in the game that way people can use the civ they like and still support various factions...you can name em like,,...red faction or wolf faction or another name maybe derived somewhere from the star wars universe. great concept idea!! i cant wait til you get it runnin!

Darth_Rommel
10-21-2001, 05:38 PM
The Naboo will gain pouplarity after people try them out! They seem to be the POWERFUL civ in the game :)

I think THEY will be the top- heavy ones :)

DSEmperor Viper
10-21-2001, 07:34 PM
thats a great idea the galactic empire will regain the universe under my command*sinister laugh*wuhahahahahaahahahahahahaha

PhantomMenace
10-21-2001, 09:36 PM
I disagree Rommel...unlike the surrealistic Starcraft where airpower can wipe out a base, its different in the realistic SWGB. In SWGB, air power does not take ground,...you gotta use it the way real airpower is used, for ground support, harrasment, and flanking. It is mech's in this game that rule the ground and take ground and the Naboo dont even get an upgraded heavy mech so you gonna find the Imps and the Trade Fed ownin a lot of peeps. Once again the league idea that Aoerat cooked up sounds awesome! Also, maybe you could put little planets inside the grids and give them a name like Hoth, Naboo and Tatooine and such. Maybe you could put a grid in the middle that is worth more to own than the others..like it could give you control of all adjacent grids by owning that one...just some ideas...also what does AOErat mean? Area of Effect rat?

AoErat
10-21-2001, 09:47 PM
Hi all:

Thanks for bringing this up again. :)

I've been thinking about it lately, and there is one large problem. A player could cheat the system by registering two names, one to each faction, and then falsly report a battle between his two accounts, thus gaining a square without actually fighting a battle.

How can this be solved? I'm in need of suggestions - otherwise the idea will be too flawed to use.


PhantomMenace: By making the grid larger, I thought to expand the time it took to complete one session of the league.

Your idea to give factions more generic names is a good one. I will definately consider it.

Also, the "AoE" in my name is for "Age Of Empires" (SWGB based in it's engine)

PhantomMenace
10-21-2001, 10:19 PM
Ahh...i see. I'm so used to people callin it AOK (Age of Kings) by now hehe.:)

PhantomMenace
10-21-2001, 10:34 PM
Hmm...that sounds like a tough problem to solve...but i got an idea.. What you could do is have each faction leader control the descision for attacks and defenses and what member he will assign for each battle. You could then have that leader submit his attack plan and his member(s). Either to you, or to the target faction leader if you dont have time to manage this. They could make their attacks known on a form of message board that is reserved for strikes. Then the other faction leader prepares to defend and who he will assign to defend on that attack. One of the rules could be that leaders could not assign people to attack or defend back to back. Also the message board thing would be a good way for everyone including the other faction leaders to know who is doing what so they can make their own descisions.
Hopefully, one guy wont be in control of two factions. With a faction leader callin the shots, they will make sure that one guy isnt throwing battles, or loosing battles on purpose against their team. Once again a league manager would be great, but if that is too time consuming, the presence of a faction leader, and forcing leaders to alternate players is good because then even if a guy is playing two sides, he wont be able to do it all the time. This is just an idea, its a tough topic..maybe somebody can build or add from this idea.

Clefo
10-22-2001, 09:26 AM
One way to do it, although this may be inconvinent, is to have a witness to every battle.

Paragon_Leon
10-22-2001, 09:28 AM
that is actually a solid suggestion. That person could be something like a Games Master. It's a very solid way of monitoring the League-games. If you have about two / three Games Masters like this, you can put up a very workable system.

dlayers
10-22-2001, 11:25 AM
Instead of a witness, just have them record the game and send that to a 'governing body/committe' for review, maybe a Senate appointed "Gaming Commission" :)

dlayers
10-22-2001, 11:31 AM
I agree you should go generic and I also think you should allow other types of 'leagues' so that you could have specialized leagues of Imperial vs Rebels, Naboo vs Trade Fed, Imperial vs Wookies, Gungun vs Trade Fed and then some sort of 'twisted/alternative universe leagues' where you could have Rebels vs Trade Fed, Imperials vs Naboo, or even Rebs vs Naboo, Imperials vs Trade Fed to give Roleplayers a chance to write scenerio type leagues with story lines to make the leagues more interesting.

:fett:

crazy_dog
10-22-2001, 01:37 PM
Huh? :confused:

This thread is like really old but it suddenly cropped up..

Oh, well, I geuss it's one of those things.:D

What do u mean by combinig it with the senate, Leo?

PhantomMenace
10-22-2001, 02:11 PM
well i bet when this thread first started the game was too far out, now that everyone has a demo and is playing the idea of a leauge comes to mind again. Any kind of league moderator sounds like a good idea.

dlayers
10-22-2001, 05:44 PM
This still is being pursued isn't it?
Phenominal idea with lots of possibilities.

AoErat
10-22-2001, 06:24 PM
Hi all. Again, thanks for your suggestions. :)

I've thought up several methods to catch abusers of the system by their IP, which should foil all but the most computer-savvy people who have lots of time on their hands. They can also be caught by checking how many games they have "won" in a row, and then asking for the recorded version of one or two. If they don't have them, you know they cheated.

I am also thinking about having a solo-league, where the basic concept of conquering the grid/galaxy is present, but it is done on an individual basis, instead of team-based.

dlayers: Yes, this idea is still being pursued.

Paragon_Leon
10-22-2001, 07:34 PM
...what i mean by combining the Senate with the league, is as follows:

- The League takes place outside of the Senate
- In the Senate, games are reviewed and discussed
- Maybe even a code for league-gaming could be determined in the Senate
- The Senate could pitch Senators against each other in the League to solve any conflict that might arise.. :D

jediaoe
10-22-2001, 07:42 PM
im in just zm or somethin at bluewave_2 or instant message me at jediaoe
I am Rebel all the Way. :biggs:

dlayers
10-23-2001, 10:21 PM
You got a website up yet?

I'm interested in the Feds :bdroid2:

:)

AoErat
10-24-2001, 09:04 AM
I am working on the site right now.

Clefo
10-24-2001, 10:25 AM
It may be a good idea to make recording games manditory, So only the really "Good" cheater an get past it...

I think the Map is the right size