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View Full Version : End to the rumours about no next patch ( official )


Ascari
05-15-2002, 03:20 PM
I read on a thread that someone mailed Mr. Gummelt about a next patch and he said that there wasnt going to be a next patch. So I decided to write an e-mail to mr. Gummelt myselve and here is how he responded:

E-mail:


Thank you for your time and quick response,
This might put an end to the rumours on the forums.

Sincerely,


Paul Rispens


>From: "Gummelt, Mike" <******@ravensoft.com>
>To: 'Paul Ris' <paul_rispens@hotmail.com>
>Subject: RE: Jedi Knight 2
>Date: Wed, 15 May 2002 11:14:50 -0500
>
>Can't say either way, that kind of decision is not made by me. If there is
>not a patch, I plan on working on a mod on my own time. And you *can* quote
>me on that if you like.
>
>Michael Chang Gummelt
>Gameplay Programmer: Jedi Knight II
>Raven Software
>www.ravensoft.com
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Paul Ris [mailto:paul_rispens@hotmail.com]
>Sent: Tuesday, May 14, 2002 7:59 PM
>To: ******@ravensoft.com
>Subject: RE: Jedi Knight 2
>
>
>Let me start of by saying Hi!
>
>I just read the most disturbing news on the lucasforums moments ago in which
>
>they quoted an e-mail from u, in which u said that there will be no more
>official patches for JK2.
>
>
>I certainly hope this is just a hoax created by this user.
>
>
>
>In awaiting for your response,
>
>
>Sincerely,
>
>
>Paul Rispens
>
>
>

DrazMan
05-15-2002, 03:23 PM
Thanks for your time in trying to clear that up. I too emailed mr. gummelt to question this. I've heard nothing from it though.

Ascari
05-15-2002, 10:48 PM
bump

Demise_SOK
05-15-2002, 11:44 PM
How does this end the rumor?

All I see is a vague answer to your question and a certain 'yes' answer to making mods if Raven doesn't patch again.

flippo
05-15-2002, 11:51 PM
A mod from the company that made the game? Why not just IMPROVE THE GAME! Why did they change it in the first place, all that was needed was a few bug fixes...

NewBJedi
05-16-2002, 12:28 AM
Thanks.

[Dom_Pmd]
05-16-2002, 12:32 AM
Pffftttt....


I never believed the rumor in the first place... so I'm totally indifferent on the subject.

:jango:

ShockV1.89
05-16-2002, 01:10 AM
Agreed, Dom. Although this email just reinforces my beliefs.

ShockV1.89

JAtM Trev
05-16-2002, 01:26 AM
It's comforting to know. The reason about the official patch is that it is not Raven's call entirely. LucasArts has a say in it. Though I wouldn't think either company would leave a faulty product out there (the backstabs are oversights, they were supposed to be nerfed along with the rest of sabers as comforting at that is, ugh)

So even if no official patch makes it out, we'll get our fixes. I think by mod he means self-created patch.

Woohoo is all I have to say.

Owen
05-16-2002, 01:59 AM
Raven does not seem to release a lot of patches for their games. They only released 2 for Elite Force and the second was used for the expansion pack to bring the original up to the same version number. I would say we may get 1 more patch if we are lucky but I do not think we will see it too soon.

ArmchairAthlete
05-16-2002, 02:02 AM
Just when I'm thinking we'll never get a patch, even WORSE happens.


They actually go and make a patch that really *(*@#'s things up.

Thanks once again.

And no, i'm not a newbie that has trouble killing by any means. If they wanted to get rid of "1 hit kills" they just made that situation three times as bad with other problems thrown in.

ShockV1.89
05-16-2002, 02:07 AM
They actually go and make a patch that really *(*@#'s things up.

I'm not sure what you're saying. Either you're talking about 1.03, in which case thats old news. Or.....

You're talking about an as yet nonexistent patch (1.04?), in which case you have no real grounds to be saying this, as we havent the foggiest idea what's going to be in this patch.

ShockV1.89

Chanke4252
05-16-2002, 02:10 AM
1.04 will include penile implants.

Kyth'emos
05-16-2002, 02:29 AM
I really dont see how this proves anything ...

JAtM Trev
05-16-2002, 03:26 AM
well in general, Raven has realeased mostly bug-free games. Most patches are to clear up bugs. Since there weren't enough bugs, Raven decided to mess with the game play. I like 1.02 better, but 1.03 ain't horrible.

flippo
05-16-2002, 10:30 AM
um yeah

m64253
05-16-2002, 10:50 AM
That was a bit unclear if you ask me

May its not as simple as yes or no ?

Borf
05-16-2002, 11:02 AM
yeah, bit iffy : /

Crusader
05-16-2002, 11:13 AM
I've a feeling Raven will release at least one more patch.

At least, I hope they will, after I informed them of two bugs, one of which could be considered a cheat. And no, I'm not going to go into details until I hear whether there is a v1.04+ or not.

Vestril
05-16-2002, 12:48 PM
I think Raven would have to be pretty ignorant and foolish and inconsistent to not release another patch, so I have a good deal of faith that they will. That being said I'm not sure how much stock I put into this email, as I've read a few fabrications at this point...

Xombie
05-16-2002, 01:53 PM
I'll say it again for those who are deaf... (vestril, flippo, i'm looking at you)
Almost NO developer does a patch unless they are getting paid for it. It is the decision of the owner of the license wether or not the game gets patched. The fact is, a developer cannot stay in business if they use their valuable company time doing things that they aren't getting paid for.

Mike being dedicated enough to actually take his own personal time to improve the game is definitely a rare thing in gaming.

Ascari
05-16-2002, 02:01 PM
Originally posted by Xombie
I'll say it again for those who are deaf... (vestril, flippo, i'm looking at you)
Almost NO developer does a patch unless they are getting paid for it. It is the decision of the owner of the license wether or not the game gets patched. The fact is, a developer cannot stay in business if they use their valuable company time doing things that they aren't getting paid for.

Mike being dedicated enough to actually take his own personal time to improve the game is definitely a rare thing in gaming.


Exactly, that's why I cant understand why some people would fake e-mails of him saying that their will not be another patch.

Vestril
05-16-2002, 07:22 PM
Originally posted by Xombie
I'll say it again for those who are deaf... (vestril, flippo, i'm looking at you)
Almost NO developer does a patch unless they are getting paid for it. It is the decision of the owner of the license wether or not the game gets patched. The fact is, a developer cannot stay in business if they use their valuable company time doing things that they aren't getting paid for.

Mike being dedicated enough to actually take his own personal time to improve the game is definitely a rare thing in gaming.

I'm sorry, I seem to be missing your point? What exactly am I deaf about?

Should I be more appreciative that Raven patched in the first place? I'm very appreciative, their intentions were marvelous--their execution was piss poor.

Am I supposed to believe that this will be the last patch Raven puts out? If that's what you think you really haven't been paying attention. When Raven released 1.03 and tweaked the game around they set a precedent--they essentially said 'we are willing to tweak this game' and by making the changes so drastic, and so obviously related to the complaints of the community at large, they also said 'we are going to make it a game tailored to you, our users'

This was a mistake, I believe--it's impossible to satisfy the community, because no matter what they patch, someone will be pissed off, but because of 1.03, they would be out of line if they didn't patch it--that was a buggy and imbalanced release, and again, our precedent on the matter is that Raven will cater to our needs.

Was I deaf because I ignored the noble actions of our friendly neighborhood programmer? First off, you must be deaf if you're ignoring the strong possibility that someone just made this up. I mean no offense to anyone here, it's just that there have been a [i]lot[/] of emails from Mike Gummelt that weren't really emails from Mike Gummelt. Secondly, I agree that its an amazing thing, where in my email did I say I thought it was a usual thing?... I think it would be a remarkable thing, and it shows an amazing level of dedication to customer service--IF it's real (and to my mind that's a big if).

So...let me know if I missed your point or something :)

NerfYoda
05-16-2002, 08:53 PM
Originally posted by Chanke4252
1.04 will include penile implants.

Hah wanna bet ppl would find it too big & flood the forums with whiny diatribes? :)

NewBJedi
05-16-2002, 09:07 PM
I have $50 + saying JK2 better be patched.

I have another $50 + that can either go toward SOF 2 or another non-Raven or non-LucasArts game.

Raven/LucasArts will make my decision for me - patch the game or I buy games from other dev teams and publishers.

I don't care how much money it takes ..

How much does a reputation cost?

Is it up to Raven or LucasArts?

I don't care who is responsible at this point.

Raven is developing the game and LucasArts is publishing it - whether they pay or beg LucasArts to accept another patch is their problem, not mine.

I'm tired of who is to blame or what. Whether it be LucasArts or Raven.

If I don't see another JK2 patch that fixes the problems, I will not purchase another game from either of them again - it's that simple.

Agen
05-16-2002, 09:20 PM
Lucasarts pushed it out quickyl as possible i think and raven din't get all the ubgs flattened, becuase their own games are usually bug free.

Xombie
05-17-2002, 01:19 AM
Originally posted by Vestril
Should I be more appreciative that Raven patched in the first place? I'm very appreciative, their intentions were marvelous--their execution was piss poor.
No, no. That's not what I'm saying. I'm more saying the opposite. That developers do not patch out of the goodness of their own hearts, (although people at Raven seem to be dedicated enough to)

Am I supposed to believe that this will be the last patch Raven puts out?
No, I'm saying just don't dog on Raven in the situation that they stop patching. Between doing Quake 4, SoF2, JK2, and probably a billion other things, they probably don't have the free company time to spend making unsupported patches.
It's all up to LucasArts when and if the game gets patched.

Was I deaf because I ignored the noble actions of our friendly neighborhood programmer?
Actually, I just meant that I shouldn't have to be repeating this in so many threads. It just seems far too often that players who hear there won't be patching think that it's all the fault of the developer. They are people, and it's not fair to them.

I hope that clears up what I was trying to say.


Originally posted by NewBJedi
I have $50 + saying JK2 better be patched. I have another $50 + that can either go toward SOF 2 or another non-Raven or non-LucasArts game. [/b]
Wow. That's a whole 5 cents in royalties for each dev, who happened to work on the game you buy, IF they had an amazingly good contract and Johnny Cochran doing the negotiations when they signed it.
As opposed to the regular salary they would be getting for working on a game that the a publisher is paying them for, instead of making unsupported patches.

Raven/LucasArts will make my decision for me - patch the game or I buy games from other dev teams and publishers.
Threatening them with the lack of royalties from ONE SALE isn't going to phase them.

I don't care how much money it takes ..
Of course you don't. You're not the one who has to feed their families/fiance's/dogs/turtles/rabbits with REAL money.

How much does a reputation cost?
About as much as it took them to make Hexen, Heritic, Soldier of Fortune, and Elite Force.
And with that resume, with Quake 4 about to be added, I'd have to say that their reputation is pretty damn secure.

Is it up to Raven or LucasArts?
LucasArts. Unless Raven is so completely kickass as to spend their FREE TIME doing unsupported patches for the sake of us gamers, or they spend company time doing it in order to go the same way of Loki Games.

Raven is developing the game and LucasArts is publishing it - whether they pay or beg LucasArts to accept another patch is their problem, not mine.
They're a contracted developer. They're paid to jump for LucasArts, who publishes it and owns the license.
And you do seem to be making it YOUR problem. It isn't a problem for them to go make another game.

If I don't see another JK2 patch that fixes the problems, I will not purchase another game from either of them again - it's that simple.
:rolleyes:

Jedi-Bert
05-17-2002, 12:53 PM
LoL, 1.03 was bugfix, it fixed the bug of the MP sabers not properly colliding with eachother

the 1.02 saber play was a BUG, sabers were supposed to block more often, but through poor hit detection they didint

Jedi-Bert
05-17-2002, 01:03 PM
"If I don't see another JK2 patch that fixes the problems, I will not purchase another game from either of them again - it's that simple."

Would you be so kind as to follow through with this? That way I wont have to listen to your inconsequental threats, thanks. :D

Your $50 never gets to Raven. EVER. It goes to the store, supply chain and the publisher. Raven gets a set amount for every some odd thousand unit sold, in fact, most of their money is forwarded them to make the game, which last time i checked they already did.

BlackDove
05-17-2002, 01:18 PM
Originally posted by NewBJedi
I have $50 + saying JK2 better be patched.

I have another $50 + that can either go toward SOF 2 or another non-Raven or non-LucasArts game.

Raven/LucasArts will make my decision for me - patch the game or I buy games from other dev teams and publishers.

I don't care how much money it takes ..

How much does a reputation cost?

Is it up to Raven or LucasArts?

I don't care who is responsible at this point.

Raven is developing the game and LucasArts is publishing it - whether they pay or beg LucasArts to accept another patch is their problem, not mine.

I'm tired of who is to blame or what. Whether it be LucasArts or Raven.

If I don't see another JK2 patch that fixes the problems, I will not purchase another game from either of them again - it's that simple.

Lets play the game "How many times can you quote your own thread, and not try and bother to write something new"

els.DarkLord
05-17-2002, 01:41 PM
I'm really beginning to LOVE those guys over at Raven Software...

I already thought that it's not completely their decision to make a patch for this (LucasArts-) game. But saying to make a Mod on his own during his free time.... well, I love those guys :)

Vestril
05-17-2002, 05:50 PM
No, no. That's not what I'm saying. I'm more saying the opposite. That developers do not patch out of the goodness of their own hearts, (although people at Raven seem to be dedicated enough to)


Ah...ok

No, I'm saying just don't dog on Raven in the situation that they stop patching. Between doing Quake 4, SoF2, JK2, and probably a billion other things, they probably don't have the free company time to spend making unsupported patches.
It's all up to LucasArts when and if the game gets patched.

I'm sorry, is it just me or were those two statements somewhat unrelated? All you needed to say was:
'No, I'm saying just don't dog on Raven in the situation that they stop patching. It's all up to LucasArts when and if the game gets patched'
At the same time, if this is the only patch they were going to release, then I will still be dissapointed with Raven, they knew it would be the only patch and still pushed it out too fast. I'm sure you'll argue that Lucas Arts pushed them to get a patch out fast, but if they were aware that it could be the only one (which they would be, if it was), they should have taken a little longer than a month to dump the patch out..

Actually, I just meant that I shouldn't have to be repeating this in so many threads. It just seems far too often that players who hear there won't be patching think that it's all the fault of the developer. They are people, and it's not fair to them.

I hope that clears up what I was trying to say.

It doesn't clear up why you decided to specifically finger me...I haven't been posting in the threads you are in--this is the first time I've noticed your name. I only read a few threads on this subject...

Wow. That's a whole 5 cents in royalties for each dev, who happened to work on the game you buy, IF they had an amazingly good contract and Johnny Cochran doing the negotiations when they signed it.
As opposed to the regular salary they would be getting for working on a game that the a publisher is paying them for, instead of making unsupported patches.

If that's the way you treat customers 'I don't need your stinkin money, there are plenty of other people in line' you'll wind up alienating a large customer base, and find yourself losing money.

Threatening them with the lack of royalties from ONE SALE isn't going to phase them.

Probably not, but in general where there is one opinion, there are others. It gets the idea out that there is a group of people who are very sorely dissapointed with the games state of affairs.

Of course you don't. You're not the one who has to feed their families/fiance's/dogs/turtles/rabbits with REAL money.

Actually he is, and he lost 50 of it to what he considers to be a substandard game. I bet thats a comparable loss to hoiw much a company overall spends patching a game (I mean comparable in terms of ratio of money had/money spent)

About as much as it took them to make Hexen, Heritic, Soldier of Fortune, and Elite Force.

Never played EF or Hexen...Heretic I remember vaguely, and it struck me as a rip-off game. Soldier of Fortune, as I understood it, was a gory game that fans loved, that had an amazingly poor storyline...also not a game that I would consider to be very good.

It takes many games to build a reputation, and just one to break it. Mind you, I don't think JK2 would do that, it's a spectacular game. I'm just suggesting that if they completely mishandle the current situation they could wind up with a biggest multiplayer gaming mess yet...

LucasArts. Unless Raven is so completely kickass as to spend their FREE TIME doing unsupported patches for the sake of us gamers, or they spend company time doing it in order to go the same way of Loki Games.

It's still up to Raven to release a quality patch, when they do.

They're a contracted developer. They're paid to jump for LucasArts, who publishes it and owns the license.
And you do seem to be making it YOUR problem. It isn't a problem for them to go make another game.

It is his problem, he bought the game... Why would he want to buy other games from a company that missupported this one?

I'm really beginning to LOVE those guys over at Raven Software...

I already thought that it's not completely their decision to make a patch for this (LucasArts-) game. But saying to make a Mod on his own during his free time.... well, I love those guys

I agree, if that happens I will write the longest thank you email ever. I'm not sure I buy in to the validity of the emails that have stated that though...

NewBJedi
05-17-2002, 06:37 PM
Originally posted by =SSC=Kal-El


Lets play the game "How many times can you quote your own thread, and not try and bother to write something new"

If you insist:

I have $50 + saying JK2 better be patched.

I have another $50 + that can either go toward SOF 2 or another non-Raven or non-LucasArts game.

Raven/LucasArts will make my decision for me - patch the game or I buy games from other dev teams and publishers.

I don't care how much money it takes ..

How much does a reputation cost?

Is it up to Raven or LucasArts?

I don't care who is responsible at this point.

Raven is developing the game and LucasArts is publishing it - whether they pay or beg LucasArts to accept another patch is their problem, not mine.

I'm tired of who is to blame or what. Whether it be LucasArts or Raven.

If I don't see another JK2 patch that fixes the problems, I will not purchase another game from either of them again - it's that simple.

I have $50 + saying JK2 better be patched.

I have another $50 + that can either go toward SOF 2 or another non-Raven or non-LucasArts game.

Raven/LucasArts will make my decision for me - patch the game or I buy games from other dev teams and publishers.

I don't care how much money it takes ..

How much does a reputation cost?

Is it up to Raven or LucasArts?

I don't care who is responsible at this point.

Raven is developing the game and LucasArts is publishing it - whether they pay or beg LucasArts to accept another patch is their problem, not mine.

I'm tired of who is to blame or what. Whether it be LucasArts or Raven.

If I don't see another JK2 patch that fixes the problems, I will not purchase another game from either of them again - it's that simple.
I have $50 + saying JK2 better be patched.

I have another $50 + that can either go toward SOF 2 or another non-Raven or non-LucasArts game.

Raven/LucasArts will make my decision for me - patch the game or I buy games from other dev teams and publishers.

I don't care how much money it takes ..

How much does a reputation cost?

Is it up to Raven or LucasArts?

I don't care who is responsible at this point.

Raven is developing the game and LucasArts is publishing it - whether they pay or beg LucasArts to accept another patch is their problem, not mine.

I'm tired of who is to blame or what. Whether it be LucasArts or Raven.

If I don't see another JK2 patch that fixes the problems, I will not purchase another game from either of them again - it's that simple.
I have $50 + saying JK2 better be patched.

I have another $50 + that can either go toward SOF 2 or another non-Raven or non-LucasArts game.

Raven/LucasArts will make my decision for me - patch the game or I buy games from other dev teams and publishers.

I don't care how much money it takes ..

How much does a reputation cost?

Is it up to Raven or LucasArts?

I don't care who is responsible at this point.

Raven is developing the game and LucasArts is publishing it - whether they pay or beg LucasArts to accept another patch is their problem, not mine.

I'm tired of who is to blame or what. Whether it be LucasArts or Raven.

If I don't see another JK2 patch that fixes the problems, I will not purchase another game from either of them again - it's that simple.
I have $50 + saying JK2 better be patched.

I have another $50 + that can either go toward SOF 2 or another non-Raven or non-LucasArts game.

Raven/LucasArts will make my decision for me - patch the game or I buy games from other dev teams and publishers.

I don't care how much money it takes ..

How much does a reputation cost?

Is it up to Raven or LucasArts?

I don't care who is responsible at this point.

Raven is developing the game and LucasArts is publishing it - whether they pay or beg LucasArts to accept another patch is their problem, not mine.

I'm tired of who is to blame or what. Whether it be LucasArts or Raven.

If I don't see another JK2 patch that fixes the problems, I will not purchase another game from either of them again - it's that simple.
I have $50 + saying JK2 better be patched.

I have another $50 + that can either go toward SOF 2 or another non-Raven or non-LucasArts game.

Raven/LucasArts will make my decision for me - patch the game or I buy games from other dev teams and publishers.

I don't care how much money it takes ..

How much does a reputation cost?

Is it up to Raven or LucasArts?

I don't care who is responsible at this point.

Raven is developing the game and LucasArts is publishing it - whether they pay or beg LucasArts to accept another patch is their problem, not mine.

I'm tired of who is to blame or what. Whether it be LucasArts or Raven.

If I don't see another JK2 patch that fixes the problems, I will not purchase another game from either of them again - it's that simple.
I have $50 + saying JK2 better be patched.

I have another $50 + that can either go toward SOF 2 or another non-Raven or non-LucasArts game.

Raven/LucasArts will make my decision for me - patch the game or I buy games from other dev teams and publishers.

I don't care how much money it takes ..

How much does a reputation cost?

Is it up to Raven or LucasArts?

I don't care who is responsible at this point.

Raven is developing the game and LucasArts is publishing it - whether they pay or beg LucasArts to accept another patch is their problem, not mine.

I'm tired of who is to blame or what. Whether it be LucasArts or Raven.

If I don't see another JK2 patch that fixes the problems, I will not purchase another game from either of them again - it's that simple.
I have $50 + saying JK2 better be patched.

I have another $50 + that can either go toward SOF 2 or another non-Raven or non-LucasArts game.

Raven/LucasArts will make my decision for me - patch the game or I buy games from other dev teams and publishers.

I don't care how much money it takes ..

How much does a reputation cost?

Is it up to Raven or LucasArts?

I don't care who is responsible at this point.

Raven is developing the game and LucasArts is publishing it - whether they pay or beg LucasArts to accept another patch is their problem, not mine.

I'm tired of who is to blame or what. Whether it be LucasArts or Raven.

If I don't see another JK2 patch that fixes the problems, I will not purchase another game from either of them again - it's that simple.
I have $50 + saying JK2 better be patched.

I have another $50 + that can either go toward SOF 2 or another non-Raven or non-LucasArts game.

Raven/LucasArts will make my decision for me - patch the game or I buy games from other dev teams and publishers.

I don't care how much money it takes ..

How much does a reputation cost?

Is it up to Raven or LucasArts?

I don't care who is responsible at this point.

Raven is developing the game and LucasArts is publishing it - whether they pay or beg LucasArts to accept another patch is their problem, not mine.

I'm tired of who is to blame or what. Whether it be LucasArts or Raven.

If I don't see another JK2 patch that fixes the problems, I will not purchase another game from either of them again - it's that simple.