PDA

View Full Version : Who do you think ordered the clone army? (SPOILERS)


BlacKnight
05-17-2002, 03:13 PM
My friend and I were talking about this and we think it may have somthing to do with quigon because of the various references to him that had no real purpose.
It probably wasn't palpatine because yoda said that it would have to have been a jedi that erased the files from the archives. While it's true that he could have had dooku do it, it is unlikely for 2 reasons.
a)It's unlike palpatine to leave loose ends like this lying around for the 4-7 years that had to be between maul's death and dooku's joining of the darkside.
b)Dooku had no idea where the clone army came from. It is unlikely that he would not have put 2 and 2 together when he saw the army if his master had previously ordered him to erase the files. This would have kept the cloners in his mind and he would have guessed the truth.

HertogJan
05-17-2002, 03:42 PM
Spoiler??!!

Jedi_Monk
05-17-2002, 04:10 PM
It's pretty obvious the clones were ordered by Palpatine under an assumed name. Qui-Gon's name wasn't thrown out there for no reason--Dooku was Qui-Gon's master, Qui-Gon was Obi-Wan's master. Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan had been together 10 years before Qui-Gon died in TPM and had been like a father to his Padawan. Dooku was pulling on Obi-Wan's heartstrings, trying to manipulate his feelings in an effort to turn Obi-Wan against the Republic.
A) Dooku obviously erased the files.
B) Dooku did know about the Clone Army. He was trying to start a war, and in order for there to be a war of any substance, both sides had to have an army. The longer the war, the more Palpatine can secure his place as dictator. Dooku created the Droid army by making promices to the Trade Guilds and the Geonesians, and Palpatine had the clone army created--both knew about the other's efforts. The Sith were behind both army and they knew it and that was the whole point of this movie.

Lord_FinnSon
05-17-2002, 05:43 PM
When Kaminoans mention Sifo-Dyas, the Jedi master who ordered clone army to be made for Republic, Obi-Wan remembers that he died ten years ago.

There could be two possibilities:
1. Darth Sidious/Palpatine killed Sifo-Dyas ten years earlier and then imposing himself as this master, ordered clone army.
2. Darth Sidious/Palpatine invented this character just to distract the Jedi Council and even somehow made them to remember that he actually once was the member of the Jedi Council; Mace Windu even asks Yoda, should they tell the Senate about their decreasing ability to use The Force.

Because clones were "discovered" just in time to use them againts Count Dookus' and Confederacy's forces(there were no other choice), the Jedi Council probably starts to argue who knew about this order and it might grow dissension inside the Council. At the same time they don't watch over the Senate and Palpatine controlling the clone army; remember that they didn't believe in the truth that Count Dooku told to Obi-Wan.

StAtilXl
05-17-2002, 09:14 PM
I think that Colonel Sanders did...
otherwise why would KFC have taken over

ed1371
05-17-2002, 09:24 PM
If I did it my way...burger king style


*Mysterious cloaked man pulls up to "drive thru", opens canopy of ship

*voice from aged speaker:
"Welcome to McClones, how may we be of service?"

*Cloaked Man looks over the menu and then responds with a raspy, bodeing voice:
"Yes, I would like to order a number II and a diet Coke..."

*Voice from speaker:
"Exellent choice sir, Would you like to make that a combo and SuperSize that order? It comes with fries and a larger drink."

*Cloaked man weighs heavy on the newly posed option, it is clearly visible that the inner turmoil taking place is so great that his discipline is affected and he is literally shaking. He calls upon the force to quell the tremors.
"hmmmm, I shall take that proposition. The journey will be long and a larger beverage will quench my enormous thirst."

*Voice from speaker:
Thank you sir, your total will be 2,500,000 credits, please pull up to the first window.

*The myterious customer slowly pulls his ship to the first window, he peers in and sees a figure coming over to it. The window is opened with a startling WHOOSH. The strange creature inside speaks:
"My apologies sir, but the clones aren't ready just yet, would you please move your ship forward and over to the designated waiting area? It should only take 10 years or so"

*The Mans eyes are alight with a rage even the sun could not match. The hatred and anger well up so quick that he felt he might explode into a supernova if he did not do something right then and there. It takes every bit of strength to maintain control of himself, blood trickles out the corner of his mouth and he realizes he is biting through his lip. He glares at the creature, and thinks about how easy it would be to crush the fragile windpipe of the attendent or how pleasing it would be just to blast the entire structure with an array of weaponry matched by no other ship in the galaxy. It is time to decide the fate of another pathetic life form.

*He throws a switch and slams the canopy shut, the engine roars as the man almost gives the ship full power, and then moves over to the waiting area.
He hisses to himself:
"Damn, happens every time I go to a drive thru, now my fries are going to be cold."

Kyth'emos
05-17-2002, 09:48 PM
god dammit warn us before you post spoilers !!!! :mad:

Nebelwerfer_
05-18-2002, 09:56 PM
You're lame if you haven't watched the movie yet, and don't say the lord's name in vein cause nobody wants to read it.

Vestril
05-18-2002, 10:09 PM
Originally posted by Nebelwerfer_
You're lame if you haven't watched the movie yet, and don't say the lord's name in vein cause nobody wants to read it.

Hey, I want to read people offending your God. C'mon people, blashpheme away!!!

PS Just because someone hasn't seen the movie, it doesn't make them lame, it just means that they have a life.

Leagle
05-19-2002, 12:52 PM
Dooku does it under the name of a recently killed Jedi master, Cyfo-Dyas. From the looks Yoda and Mace give each other he was probably killed suspiciously. Dooku might have murdered him b/f leaving the order.
Dooku then recruits Jango under his real name, (his sith one) Tyranus.

It is all in the movie if you payed any attention at all.

Jah Warrior
05-19-2002, 12:52 PM
possibly osama bin laden

Vestril
05-19-2002, 08:16 PM
*thanks leagle* Maybe now, the argument can stop.

striderx2048
05-19-2002, 08:25 PM
Boba Fett lives!

Treacherous Mercenary
05-19-2002, 09:15 PM
There's a scene where you hear that Tryrannus ordered the clones by the aliens. If you notice in the end, Darth Sidious calls Dooku Tyrannus or whatever that is... There is reason to believe Dooku wanted this war to happen and you'll also hear about Anakin....

Nebelwerfer_
05-20-2002, 04:15 AM
I just can't get over how much "Cyfo-Dyas" and "sidious" sound the same.

PS (off the subject)

I thought there were going to be royal guards, tusken females, and aura sing in this movie... where were they?

Vestril
05-20-2002, 04:31 AM
Originally posted by Nebelwerfer_
I just can't get over how much "Cyfo-Dyas" and "sidious" sound the same.

PS (off the subject)

I thought there were going to be royal guards, tusken females, and aura sing in this movie... where were they?

Royal Guards were apparently in the scene where Palpatine discusses things with the Jedi Council--I missed it too. I guess Tusken Females look exactly like Tusken males...lol.
Aura Sing was going to be in it?...

DemonKing
05-20-2002, 04:47 AM
Forget who ordered it...who the hell PAID for it?

Food for thought.

DK

Vestril
05-20-2002, 04:51 AM
Originally posted by DemonKing
Forget who ordered it...who the hell PAID for it?

Food for thought.

DK

You don't need to pay for those clones

'You don't need to pay for those clones'

Move along

'Move along'

Treacherous Mercenary
05-20-2002, 12:16 PM
Originally posted by Vestril


Royal Guards were apparently in the scene where Palpatine discusses things with the Jedi Council--I missed it too. I guess Tusken Females look exactly like Tusken males...lol.
Aura Sing was going to be in it?...

I also believe they were behind Palpatine when you see the clone army march and such.

GreyJedi
05-20-2002, 03:24 PM
Originally posted by Jedi_Monk
It's pretty obvious the clones were ordered by Palpatine under an assumed name. Qui-Gon's name wasn't thrown out there for no reason--Dooku was Qui-Gon's master, Qui-Gon was Obi-Wan's master. Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan had been together 10 years before Qui-Gon died in TPM and had been like a father to his Padawan. Dooku was pulling on Obi-Wan's heartstrings, trying to manipulate his feelings in an effort to turn Obi-Wan against the Republic.
A) Dooku obviously erased the files.
B) Dooku did know about the Clone Army. He was trying to start a war, and in order for there to be a war of any substance, both sides had to have an army. The longer the war, the more Palpatine can secure his place as dictator. Dooku created the Droid army by making promices to the Trade Guilds and the Geonesians, and Palpatine had the clone army created--both knew about the other's efforts. The Sith were behind both army and they knew it and that was the whole point of this movie.

Agreed. Palpatine engineered the separatist movement as an excuse to gain dictatorial powers and eventually become emperor.

Vestril
05-20-2002, 03:24 PM
Originally posted by Sardaukar


I also believe they were behind Palpatine when you see the clone army march and such.

D'oh, just proves some more how utterly unobservant I am. Sheesh.

acdcfanbill
05-21-2002, 12:21 AM
i agree, sidious planned the whole war... crafty basstid...

and where was aura sing? she was supposed to be in this one... a bigger part i though i heard? was it all a conspiricy? or did it get cut from the flick? like the dooku two sabres thing...

Prowl lightstar
05-21-2002, 10:14 AM
Why does Dooku try and get obi wan to help him "destroy the sith"? And why does he tell obi wan that the senate is under the control of the sith? i know that the jedi don't believe him, they think he's just being deceptive. But what purpose does it serve Dooku. And i don't buy that he was just sowing seeds of distrust.

GreyJedi
05-21-2002, 02:34 PM
Originally posted by Prowl lightstar
Why does Dooku try and get obi wan to help him "destroy the sith"? And why does he tell obi wan that the senate is under the control of the sith? i know that the jedi don't believe him, they think he's just being deceptive. But what purpose does it serve Dooku. And i don't buy that he was just sowing seeds of distrust.

A very good question. He was almost telling Obi Wan the truth - except for the part about helping him destroy the sith. Unless Dooku did want Sidious dead; perhaps to become the master Sith instead of the apprentice as he was.

Prowl lightstar
05-22-2002, 02:10 PM
Perhaps Dooku hates the sith, because one of them (Darth Maul) killed qui gon jinn, his one time padawan. He could be trying to undermine sidious like you say, that would be interesting.

Joner
05-22-2002, 02:53 PM
I think, he wanted to kill Obi-Wan anyway so he could tell him anything, even the truth.

GOTF_Nemesis
05-22-2002, 03:31 PM
*nods*

Vestril
05-22-2002, 04:07 PM
Originally posted by Prowl lightstar
Why does Dooku try and get obi wan to help him "destroy the sith"? And why does he tell obi wan that the senate is under the control of the sith? i know that the jedi don't believe him, they think he's just being deceptive. But what purpose does it serve Dooku. And i don't buy that he was just sowing seeds of distrust.

He wants Obi Wan to join him. He tells him this in the hopes that Obi Wan will go 'Well golly gee, that sure sucks!! Let's fight that evil senate.'

To Dooku, telling Obi Wan lead in two directions: 1) Obi joins me, yayyyy 2) Obi doesn't join me, so he dies (therefore the information I gave him is safely protected)

He didn't anticipate Obi Wan's escape, so I don't think he ever meant for the Jedi Council to hear that.

Lord_FinnSon
05-22-2002, 04:35 PM
I thought there were going to be royal guards, tusken females, and aura sing in this movie... where were they?
Just like few people already mentioned, Royal guards can be seen in couple scenes with Palpatine. Perhaps we'll see them fighting in Episode III, because they have always been described as elite soldiers, and if someone gets past those troops and tries to kill Palpatine after he has became Emperor, they'll be pretty busy. ;)

One rumour which I read earlier from TheForce.Net (www.theforce.net) revealed that Aurra Sing will be in Episode III(well, she has to be after her appearance in TPM) and that she will probably unite with Boba Fett. I don't know about you, but they could be really deadly pair(just like Zam and Jango) while fighting againts Jedi, especially Aurra Sing, who has her own lightsaber and knows how to use it because of her training. :D

DigitalGangsta
05-22-2002, 05:05 PM
Yeah why did Dooku tell Obi Wan the truth? Even if Obi joins him, they'll fight Sidious/Palpatine? But Sidious is Dooku's master, so why would he want to fight him?

Doesn't make sense. I guess the Dark Side really does cloud one's judgment!

Vestril
05-22-2002, 05:16 PM
Originally posted by DigitalGangsta
Yeah why did Dooku tell Obi Wan the truth? Even if Obi joins him, they'll fight Sidious/Palpatine? But Sidious is Dooku's master, so why would he want to fight him?

Doesn't make sense. I guess the Dark Side really does cloud one's judgment!

Not really, they would continue to fight the Republic, as Dooku had been doing. Eventually Obi Wan, under Dooku's influence, would do something bad and cross to the Dark Side--and then he would belong to Sidious.

Nathan Wind
05-22-2002, 07:03 PM
you get people to have no confidence in the senate/democracy then you have an easier time to get them to side with facisim.

its clear what is going to suade anakin to become vader and the emperrors bitch. he is first convinced that the senate/democracy does not work or is corrupted. A better looking alternative, facisim, is presented as efficient and just (by presenting the figure head as a just man).

That sides anakin with palpatine politically right there.

The fact that the nature of this form of government is based solely on the power of the figurehead, makes "self" become the ideology.

With some ego stroking and the resulting criminalization of "the light sided people who misunderstand and kept me down", it will be very easy to turn anakin to the dark side.

In fact that is how you turn anyone over, including obi-wan.

The first step is to convince them that the democratic system is flawed/ corrupted.

Cracked
05-22-2002, 08:04 PM
please excuse my ignorance, but who is Aurra Sing?

Vestril
05-22-2002, 08:20 PM
Originally posted by Cracked
please excuse my ignorance, but who is Aurra Sing?

It's an extremely forgivable bit of ignorance, she is mainly an EU character, but she had a few seconds of screen time in TPM, she's a bounty hunter.

_thr0ne_
05-22-2002, 08:39 PM
Can sombody explain to me why everybody thinks :lightning Sid is :joreth: Ty's master? Anybody here tell me why you people assume this?

Vestril
05-22-2002, 09:20 PM
Originally posted by _thr0ne_
Can sombody explain to me why everybody thinks :lightning Sid is :joreth: Ty's master? Anybody here tell me why you people assume this?

In the end of the movie he goes and reports to Darth Sidious, like an underling would.

Tank_Comie4545
05-23-2002, 01:28 AM
can somone send me a private message everthign is getting spoiled out that would settle the argument