View Full Version : Why on earth did they nerf "Death from Above"?
05-30-2002, 12:25 AM
Strong Saber Style is dead now... It's SO hard to kill anyone with that move now since it was nerfed. Now the other two style moves are strong as hell!!! You know what I'm talking about, if you don't then your a newbie.
05-30-2002, 12:40 AM
It was for the better. The DFA was too powerful, so everyone just spammed it. Once again, I don't understand why people complain about the patch. We all created it. It was this forum, if anything, that made the patch. More specifically, people's whining. Well, we got our way.
(I'm not refering to you, Hellbane916. I'm talking to everyone. This is one topic that is talked about a lot when refering to the patch. Just so you don't think that I'm being mean to you or something like that.):)
05-30-2002, 12:44 AM
cuz people whined and couldnt adapt.
05-30-2002, 12:47 AM
hmm lets see, not only was it one hit kill but you couldnt block or dodge it unless you were well away from the impact point.( rolling out of the way while he is in mid air still kills ya)
and people would do NOTHING but dfa.. hell i still enter dfa and see people act like a bunch of frogs.. i even fought a guy last night in a duel server who kept doing dfa over and over.
05-30-2002, 01:00 AM
a few choice words replaced in that post and we have 1.03.
except, dfa could be dodged. it also couldnt kill peole pulled to the ground
05-30-2002, 01:02 AM
Overpowered?...It was buggy, that much is true, but it certainly wasn't overpowered. I don't know why they decided to nerf it so. I miss it.
Don't get me wrong, I've never actually done DFA, not even once, but I loved DFA spammers, they were SO easy to kill. Much like the backstabbers of today (though I have run into two backstabbers who were very skilled at using it). I want them to de-nerf it so more people will spam it--it always feels so good to kill a DFA spammer, it's like smiting a fool...
It was this forum, if anything, that made the patch. More specifically, people's whining. Well, we got our way.
No we didn't. No one got their way, because Raven didn't have enough time to test these random fixes asked for. They just tried to reason it out, and they failed, becaus they lacked the time to do it right. Suggesting that 'we' created the patch is rude and absurd. Each of us had our own opinions, no one asked Raven to implement virutally ALL of the suggestions.
The fact of the matter is that most of the people who will read this weren't even here back then, most of those people found other things to do. Most of the people that are still here were the reasonable, intelligent people who requested some bug fixes and that's it.
I don't mean to continually get on your case, Danny, it's just that you have a way of saying things that I find insulting to me :p I know you're not trying to--I'm not trying to be mean either :) In fact, I recall someone else saying something almost exactly like that a few days ago...or was that you? lol I don't know, it's all one forum blur...
05-30-2002, 02:58 AM
I dunno about the rest of you, but this is getting quite tiresome.
DFA the brutal truth:
DFA was bugged, I never minded that it was a one hit kill move except that if you have a one hit kill move or something truly powerful in some way, make it dangerous to perform. In other words it needs to be balanced... Otherwise it will be Spammed, abused and Exploited.
Just because some people felt the DFA was easy to avoid (I felt it was easy to avoid by itself also), doesn't mean it was balanced. Before due to the buggyness of the move, countering it was downright dangerous. Sure you could dodge it all day long without even staring at the screen half the time... but where does it say anywhere that that equals fun? you could hop up right at the end of the animation and do it again, and if you knew how to turn yourself the hit scored full damage throughout the animation...
You could DFa into a pack of people and kill as many people as you can kill now assfighting.
However I agree... all I wanted to see was the bugs removed, not nerfing the move. I knew in my heart if they simply made it so the hit detection was on target, and so that you couldn't turn yourself in mid move, I could own just about anyone spamming that move...
To be honest I'm not afriad to use that move now, because it requires a lot more skill to hit with it than before. Now you truly have to time the jump to hit the target. If I do it right I can recover in time to do something else. But if I miss I can be backstabbed or get a saber swung across the back of my neck.
So now the move is balanced.
Maybe a little on the nerfed side though... but still balanced.
As for 1.03?
The backstab was always there, I used it a few times before... I even combined it with pull and push before 1.03. Hell before 1.03 pull was almost never used! It was always pushes!
Anyway the point is, the patch really only hurt CTF and maybe FFA/TFFA gun servers... This can easily be fixed by p[utting back in the knock back effect of a saber hit, and making the total capable damage for each swing the same as before, BUT keep the new wide range of damage effect for more damage in the middle of the swing, and less at the beginning and end... Thus a grazing blow from the end of a swing won't do full damage like before, but if you get caught mid swing feel the burn!
fix the backswings so they are either risky to use somehow, or make them harder to spam (make all special/finishing moves require force power maybe?) Finaly make it so backstabs, and swings won't hit an enemy on the ground. sure it's a bit nerfish but it would work, and backstab and swing would still be useful in normal situations.
Ass fighting? doesn't bother me since they have to turn thier back to me. a simple saber throw fixes that right up. heck even a kick will do the job since you can usualy kick before they get the stab animation to start.
Saber throw? Make it so you can lose your saber like in SP. Saber throw will be fixed then. It won't really be a nerf though unless you look at it in the strictest sense. in reality though in my opinion it would be more easily described as fixing saber throw defense!
Dark siders got the shaft with 1.03... against light siders they are now more or less even (though I could argue that they always where). however NOW a dark sider has no defense against another dark sider like they did before. What do I mean?
go start a server witha buddy.
One of you max out drain. the other max out lightning...
the lightning guy should spam you with lightning. the drain guy spam with drain... The lightning guy should use nothing else but lightning...
It won't take anyone long to see that it's imbalanced.
why does this mater? because before and in the manual even, it states that drain should be the best counter to lightning that dark siders have.
Some would ague that you should use dark rage to counter lightning now. i would agree except that now drain doesn't really counter ANYTHING as was intended... Besides dark rage will only make you live through the lighting while your in the rage effect. as soon as it turns off you get lightninged for sure and it will kill you in less than a second!
1.03 wasn't perfect. I never expected it to be perfect.
What i DO expect is to see a mod sooner or later that will revolutionize JKII like counterstrike did for half life. right now I got my eye on the Kaibur saga... so should you...
till then just play the game... don't take winning or losing very seriously... and find a server with folks you can play with the way you want to play. heck there are plenty of 1.02 servers around, and even 1.03 can be made to run like 1.02 if you know what commands to enter (or so I am told).
05-30-2002, 03:09 AM
Allow me to easily give my reasons it was nerfed:
It was hated. Why? It was spammed by newbies, and people whou couldn't be bothered to learn the more delicate and complicated styles of the other stances. Heavy was basic, and boring. Matches would last minutes with players just standing and taking long, slow, tedious swipes at each other from accross the room, and frequently DFAing each other in the hopes for a kill. No more. No more.
05-30-2002, 04:41 AM
I don't see how DFA was so overpowered... I see it was SO easy to dodge.... just push or roll out of the way..... fine maybe make it less powerful but now DFA is totally dead. No one uses it anymore. I tried to adapt to the new DFA for hours and it's impossible to kill anyone... that wasn't a noob and just stood there.
05-30-2002, 02:53 PM
Originally posted by DannyJAllTheWay
We all created it. It was this forum, if anything, that made the patch. More specifically, people's whining.
And if we're lucky, we will get our wish of returning the game to an enjoyable experience in 1.04 IF there is a 1.04. I would be fine if there wasn't.
While some people who didn't know how to move out of the way of a DFA'er complained here before, it was nowhere close to the level of anger that this patch has created.
05-30-2002, 03:15 PM
you brought up some good points demangel
05-30-2002, 03:36 PM
At least some of us didn't whine.:D
05-30-2002, 05:22 PM
DFA was one of the easest moves to counter. How? You counter the move with DFA.
What so many people never realeased is that once you see what about to pull off a DFA, you start your DFA swing. Once they have lunged and have their saber burried in the ground, you lunge at them and nail them before they get back up.
It always works, and so many people cant figure it out. I've had matches where 3 people were doing DFA and I would cut them down within their first DFA attempt. But what I didnt understand is that they kept using it and not changing to another tactic.
Well anyways, the DFA move was too easy to countered and considered a free kill.
05-30-2002, 05:53 PM
And it isn't because people couldn't adapt and whined, it's because some punks used it over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over again, and were making playing the game an unpleasant experience for some.
Not me, I really didn't care. I'd just leave a server if it got on my nerves.
05-30-2002, 05:54 PM
And they didn't change tactics because it was all they could do.
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