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View Full Version : Poll #2: More new civs to vote on.


jcb231
07-02-2002, 02:28 AM
More civs, vote and vote. Maybe we'll take the top choices from each after a few days and crown our champion, most-wanted civ.

Duke Straykker
07-04-2002, 08:29 PM
Sith Empire would be interesting...

BTW, I'm back :D

Xirion
07-05-2002, 11:34 PM
i wabt
New Republic
Vong

Fishflesh
07-06-2002, 10:05 PM
What the hell is this????

this are no civs

what about the Mon Cal civ?????????

:mon:

jcb231
07-06-2002, 10:39 PM
There are three of these polls...Mon Cal are in the first one. The poll system only allows ten options per poll, and nearly 30 civs had been suggested in these boards, so I had to make three polls. Vote for Mon Cal over in poll #1 if you like......someday soon I'll take the top ten and have another round of voting to determine the most-wanted-civ

Teabag
07-07-2002, 12:40 AM
What are the chances that they will actually make a second expansion pack?

Fishflesh
07-07-2002, 12:47 AM
1 at the 10000000000000000000000000000000 :)

jcb231
07-07-2002, 02:09 AM
I disagree. I think that given the good sales of GB and of CC, a second expansion might make its way to us sometime within the next year. If after six months or so we've heard nothing, I'd say there won't be one. But Gaber did seem to indicate that GB would continue to expand as long as the fan base was there, so who knows?

stormtroop
07-10-2002, 11:52 PM
i wish lucas brought out an exspansion including more than two new civs like the one out now

Kryllith
07-11-2002, 02:40 AM
Ok, just want to say this: being a Star Wars purist, I want the civs in the game to be canon civs. Forget all the EU civs. :P

jcb231
07-11-2002, 09:10 PM
The wookies are a non-canon civ as Chewbacca and a couple wookie senators were the only elements of that civ to ever appear in the movies.

I'd like to see Mon Calamari, as several ships, etc of that race appeared in Return of the Jedi....certainly more than the wookies. Ewoks, Bespin, etc also all had clearly movie-visible civilizations.

Kryllith
07-11-2002, 10:24 PM
Nah, I'd count the wookies as canon simply because of Chewbacca (after all, his race came from somewhere). I'm talking about races and things that were only presented in books.

I agree with Mon Calimari; I'd love to see them in the game. I'm not sure I'd really include Bespin as a "civ" though I'd probably expand on it and turn the whole trading/mining/etc colonies as a civ with aspects of Bespin as potential units (the air-cars, guards, uggnaut workers, etc).

Kryllith

jcb231
07-12-2002, 10:37 AM
Well, I still think that the Wookie culture is weakly portrayed in the movies (with no cultural, architectural, vehicular, or other aspects seen other than Chewie), and that a clear Cloud City cultural style is seen, with many different types of structures, vehicles, workers, guards, costumes, etc to pull from or expand on for unit creation. Certainly as much as was shown for the Gungans in ep 1, and as much as was shown of the Confederacy in ep II, seeing as how all the "Confederate" buildings are Geonosian structures...Geonosians should have been treated as a seperate civ from the Confederacy, in the same way that the Gungans and Naboo were seperated.

Other civs that I think would not require "making up" tons of stuff, seeing as how the movies gave a good head start, could be the Ewoks or perhaps a Tatooine based culture or Tusken Raiders, although I really have no interest in any of those three but the Ewok one. Mon Calamari are certainly better elaborated on then Wookies, and I'd like to see them as a civ as well.

Check out the sequel thread for much more discussion of possible sequel civs, and hopes and wishes for future games.

Compa_Mighty
07-12-2002, 11:59 AM
I've suggested a few times it would be a good move to do another x-pack with 6 civs, new units, terrains, etc, at full price. ($45- $50 USD) And it would be yet a better move to do it for holiday time this year.


This poll is harder than the other 2....... Number one, I definitely like Mon Cal best, in number 3, I don't really find the point of any of those civs.

But in this one, I'm between Karrde's org. and the Chiss....... well, my vote goes to the Chiss.

CorranSec
07-12-2002, 03:16 PM
Mhmm. Good. Go Smuggling people!
(i voted for them)
But on another note.... you seem to be discussing how much is shown of each civ in movies- I wish to consider how much is shown of the race in EU.
Take Smugglers Guild. The Thrawn trilogy was packed with em. Almost every book has featured Mara Jade or talon Kaarde, and as such provided detail on their ships and the way their organisation works. Even the way they look- something about crosshatch patches on the side of their ships.
Chiss, on the other hand- I admit they'd be a cool civ, but where'd you draw the material from?
The Thrawn trilogy. Yay. A single Chiss. What does it show about them? Or more appropriately, about this single chiss? He's a freakishly good war tactician who likes art.
The Hand of Thrawn. Ok, some more chiss. I read it ages ago, but what does it show? Some more freakishly good Chiss warriors. And a big hand thingy. (correct me on that if I'm wrong)
Other than that- a bartender in JK2, Jedi Outcast. Shows there are all kinds of Chiss. Including seedy, corrupt, incomprehinsible bartenders. I'm sure they'd make a great unique unit. :D
Not to diss the Chiss- or any other civ- but for some of the less mentioned ones, WHERE are you going to base all the GB stuff for them on???????

jcb231
07-12-2002, 08:24 PM
I totally agree with you. I don't like the idea of a Chiss civ as there is virtually no material to draw from. But, people seem to want one so who am I to argue?

Regarding EU civs...I think they are fine and that a Smuggler's Union civ would rock, but I'd rather see the movie civs dealt with first.

CorranSec
07-13-2002, 07:08 AM
Thanks for the support Jcb. :D
Funny, we can totally disagree in one thread and totally agree in another. :cool:

Which movie civs are you thinking of that 'haven't been dealt with?'

Compa_Mighty
07-13-2002, 09:00 AM
Corran, I agree with you in the "given material" question, anyway, LA has proved they can be quite inventive (see Wookiees) and I think it would much more logical to have a Chiss worker, than a smuggler worker, I hope you understand what I mean.

CorranSec
07-13-2002, 09:10 AM
I'm not sure i get what you mean. Smugglers could have droid workers.
Yes, LA did a good job on the Wookies. But they could do an even better job on the Smugglers.
What do Chiss use as weapons? What kind of ships do Chiss pilot? I remember some crazy one from Hand of Thrawn, that sort of zipped around sending weird messages. That contained Thrawn's full name, not just his core name.
I remember the weirdest things.
But anyway, the fact is, that the Chiss are a very weird society and the LA people would have to dream up some crazy stuff for them. The Smugglers use normal stuff- troopers are people with guns, ships are freighters and the like, etc. etc.
This is not to say that they're a boring civ- i'm sure there'd be some very interesting possibilities in terms of unique unit, trade bonuses, and so on.
And maybe the smugglers could get the Lady Luck :D That would be good.

Compa_Mighty
07-13-2002, 09:23 AM
What I mean, is I don't find it real that smuggler's have buildings, an established economy, an organized army, defensive structures, farmers?

That's what I mean.

CorranSec
07-13-2002, 10:12 AM
Oh. I see.
That's a rather good point...
But I can't see the Hutts with that. Or black sun with that. Or many of the suggested civs farming.
Get droids.

jcb231
07-13-2002, 12:29 PM
Movie Civs "Not Dealt With"--

As per request of above post....

-Ewoks (buildings and troops are shown, as well as catpults, etc that could be a basis for heavier weapons...gliders are shown as a basis for air...Ewoks ride horselike animals in some concept sketches for ROTJ...perhaps simple items like wagons and balloons could be incorporated, as well as items from the 2 Ewok movies or the cartoon series...shaman medicine men could heal wounds, etc....unique units might include some other sort of creature from Endor...bonuses could be some sort of camoflage or forest walking ability for special troops)
-Bespin/Cloud City Culture (shown to have quite a specific style and organiztion as well as a ton of architectural elements to pull form...could offer great play value like floating buildings, etc, as well as Ugnaught workers, Bespin Security troops, a multitude of air options, the only thing they are not represented by in the movies is heavy weapons, mechs, and naval forces, but very few civs have their navies or heavy weapons seen anywhere outside this game)
-Hutt Crime Organization (Tatooine architecture and Jabba's palace could provide inspiration....Skiffs as Mechs, swoop bikes as scouts, Jabba's Skiff and Starship (EU) could inspire some vehicles, fighters could be craft seen in other video games, etc used by criminal organiztions, troops could be a motley band of palace/skiff guards, pig guards could be a unique unit....great trading/crime bonuses, etc)
-Geonosians and Confederacy not given seperate dues (they could be split up into two civs....geos are shown as a complete society in ep II....all confeds would have to "make up" for the game to be their own civ is navy, air, and some buildings)

That's about it for unrepresented movie civilizations...Mon Calamari are shown only slightly more than Wookies in the films, although I'd still like to play them. They could have B-Wing fighters, Mon Cal cruiser style air cruisers and transports and buldings that resemble that bulbousy, curved style...Mon Cal alien troops, and a great navy. Their mech forces and some other elements would have to be made up, but they certainly have a better head start than the wookie civ did.

By the way, don't thik I'm bashing the Wookie civ in these posts....I like wookies, I just think a movie civ would have been a more logical choice for the first release (non sequel or expansion pack) of the game.

CorranSec
07-13-2002, 12:39 PM
Ah. I see.
I agree with you on the Wook issue... I made a suggestion about merging them with the Rebels or some such.
I think they should have done Mon Cals instead. It would've been a Mon Cal/Quarren sort of thing though, quarren handle the navy, mon cals in the air.
I've mentioned that elsewhere.
As for the movie civs, thanks for clarifying. :D
Ewoks and bespin already have some footing in the game.... ewoks would be hard to balance. Other than the single
*Wraith Squadron SPOILER*


















genetically modified Ewok in one of the Wraith Squadron books (not Lieutenant Kettch ;) ), ewoks can't handle flying devices. Or blasters.
They're too short to reach the controls of their ships.... lol!
What about navy? Endor doesn't seem to have any seas. And i don't think floating rafts would cover it.
Unless there's some storyline about the Rebels teaching the Ewoks everything, they just can't handle technology.

Compa_Mighty
07-13-2002, 01:00 PM
I agree, also the Hutt Clan and even the Black Sun are the same case. So maybe it'd be better to stick with Alien races such as Mon Calamari and Chiss.

jcb231
07-13-2002, 01:01 PM
Ewoks use blasters in ROTJ...watch closely. They can certainly handle technology with ease...watch the Ewok fly the speeder bike, or the Ewoks start to operate the AT-ST...before Chewie kicks them out of the drivers seat.

Also, Ewoks fly in ROTJ and the Ewok movies....they use gliders. Heck, if Gungans can go to war on flying animals Ewoks could use wooden gliders....maybe in combination with some sort of gas blimp-like objects. :)

Also, Ewok structures and units would obviously be built to suit them. I propose that only a few, if any, elements of "outside" or Rebel cultures influence the Ewok civ in a possilbe GB addition. If the gungans can use energy balls the Ewoks could use flaming arrows. Sure, the "realism" would be stretched a bit, but GB already has stretched it in spades....I'd like to concentrate on fun, and I think it would be super fun to lead an army of Ewoks to battle.

Also, only a very small portion of Endor was shown in the movie....who says there are no seas? How could a world like that possibly exist? In the ROTJ concept art and the art of the galaxy books there are sketches of a Ewok lake city that was proposed. And yes, floating rafts or wooden ships would be cool....stick a catapult or flame cannon of some sort on them and you've got a little thing going, buddy. Maybe naval power would be weak for Ewoks, but it could be real cheap. Ewok strengths could lie in cheap workers and units, carbon bonuses, quick foraging bonuses, some abilites to pass through trees, shaman healing, special trap setting units, maybe mech unit stealing, etc. Thier weak points could be air, navy, nova/ore collection, or whatever.

And the amount of footing Bespin and Ewoks have in the game already is virtually zilch. I want a civ, not a couple random toybox units. The Hutt toybox units are such a tease. :)

CorranSec
07-13-2002, 01:05 PM
Ewoks try to use speeders and at-sts. If they're a civ, i seriously would not give them traditional technology.
But what you're proposing sounds great! You've won me over!
GO MIDGET TEDDY BEARS!

CorranSec
07-26-2002, 03:24 AM
Erm. Actually. reconsidering....... ewoks are still too weird. I withdrawn my support of the midget teddy bears.
(was i drunk or something when i wrote that.....):confused: ;) :D

jcb231
07-26-2002, 04:59 AM
<<jcb231 falls as his legs of support are cut from under him>>

NO!!!!! You backed out of the Ewok idea.....oh the humanity!! Why! Why!!!

<<sobbing>>

Well, at least I still have the support of all the rest of you right?

right?

fellas?

ladies?

<<crickets chirp>>

okay then....I'll just go cry in the corner for a while and play with my Ewok toys and dream of the civ that no one but me wants.

eizo131
07-26-2002, 06:09 AM
I said this before but THE MANDOLORIAN ARMY shall crush those teddy bears if it gets an expansion. It will be almost like wookies you will have to make it all up but.... murge it with the sith thing and would make a cool civis. How do you make the pictures bellow your name?:confused: :fett: :jango: :slave: :usa: :lsduel: :atat: :ewok:

jcb231
07-26-2002, 09:17 AM
Merging with Sith is a bad idea....they're two completely different things.

Now, do you mean the Jango Fett era Mandalorians or the ancient Mandalorians? The Jango Fett era ones have troopers and some vehicles shown in the current comics, and the ancient ones have lots of units shown in the Tales of the Jedi comics from a few years back. Both would require a lot of filling in on LA's part, but the foundations are there.

Altus_Thrawn
07-27-2002, 05:07 PM
somebody said there isn't any material to make a chiss civ out of, but I say there is.

1)Thrawn triligy
2)Hand of Thrawn
3)Some NJO books
4)Imagination

If lucasarts can make up wookie units like the kas tank, why cant they make up chiss units?

But above all, I'd like to see the vong.

eizo131
07-27-2002, 05:38 PM
Either sound good but since they have craft description that's better than wookies I think...MANDOLORIAN RULES! :fett: :jango: :slave:

CorranSec
07-27-2002, 07:01 PM
I know nothing about Ye Olde Mandalorians and very little about Jango Fett Mandalorian civilisations (is this in comics or something?) so if somebody wishes to fill me in that would be good.

Altus, that was me, and I brought up all the points you did. Um, all... four?

Go and look at my big post about Chiss in some other thread. Or I'll just copy-paste it here.
The main point is that those... four? just aren't enough! Also, in comparison to any other proposed/existing civ Chiss have the least material available!
Compare them to the Wookies, which everybody congratulates LucasArts about for an amazing work of imagination. Turns out there is data about the Wookie civ in the EU books and such, eg. the Han Solo trilogy, third book of the Black Fleet crisis, etc.

LucasArts could make up all these jolly nice Chiss units, but for me at least, they wouldn't appear Chiss at all. This is solely because we don't know anything about the Chiss as a species and in the NJO or whatever we are discovering more about them.... so anything LA makes up could be superseded.
What we have seen of the Chiss would have them unbalancing and impossible as a civ. If LucasArts does make chiss a civ, they will not be unbalancing and impossible (if they did their job) and as such, would not be like the Chiss we know!

Still following my delightfully fuzzy logic?

jcb231
07-27-2002, 08:45 PM
Yes, olde style mandalorians are from one of the installments of the excellent "Tales of the Jedi" series published in the mid to late nineties. Jango Fett mandalorians can be seen in the also excellent, but not quite as good, "Jango Fett: Open Seasons" comic which is in the middle of its series right now.

Most of the Wookie stuff was made up for the game, despite the little bit seen in EU sources.

I agree with the Chiss naysayers...not enough has been shown to make them feel really Star Warsy.

I'd prefer to see the remaining movie-based civs dealt with long before any Chiss civ, and I don't really care if there's ever a Chiss civ, to be honest.

Admiral Vostok
07-28-2002, 04:41 AM
NO EU!

I am a fanatical Star Wars purist and I am fully against stuff like the Vong, Black Sun and what have you.

Why the hell would anyone buy an expansion that featured the New Republic and the Imperial Remnant? They ARE the Empire and Rebel Alliance. That's why Rebels have good Jedi. Half of their stuff already is based on things from post ROTJ stuff.

Who suggested a Chiss civilisation? That would suck majorly. I challenge anyone to put forward a good argument for a Chiss civilisation. For one, they are entirely EU which gets my disapproval already.

Kaminoans are peaceful and have no army. Geonosians would not have a seperate army because they MAKE the battledroids, so that is their army.

The main problem with Mon Calamari as a civ is that they would have to be able to build underwater, which is too much like Gungans. They are supposed to be a peaceful people anyway.

The only ideas I would entertain are these:

Hutt Cartel - This would be pretty cool, expanding on some of the stuff they have already. Their architecture should be based around Tatooine, like the Tatooine Spaceport they have already and slave hovels as prefab shelters. They should have bonuses for bounty hunters and trade bonuses, and some workers would be slaves or something. Also interesting because the Hutts are warlike in nature.

Cloud City - Someone mentioned mining guild. If you paid attention to ESB you'll note that Lando says his operation isn't part of the mining guild. Anyway, I like this idea because they have only slightly less reference material than the Naboo, and they get their own civ. Definitely ugnaughts as workers and clod cars as fighters. They only problem is that they wouldn't really be good at anything, cloud cars would be crap as fighters and lets face it they just let the Empire walk in and take everything over.

OR... we could just wait and see what Episode III brings. The only logical expansion would coincide with that, perhaps encorporating major tweaks to Confederacy and Republic as we see more of them.

Sorry about the length... but I felt strongly against EU ideas. Lucasarts would be insane to release something with EU as a major element like that because there is no way it would sell as well as what we have got already.

jcb231
07-29-2002, 01:28 AM
The Mon Cal seen in the movies are pretty warlike.....and if you don't like EU I would think those would be where your impressions of them come from. I think they'd make a great civ, with B-Wings, Mon Cal style Cruisers, etc. Yes, they could build underwater, but they'd have great air and other bonuses which would seperate them from the Gungans.

I love the Hutt and Cloud City ideas whole heartedly, as I've said before.

I also think that Geonosians should be separate from Confeds, but only in a sequel coming out after ep III as it would screw things up too much in the current version of the game.

I'd also like to see Ewoks in the game, as along with the above mentioned civs they are one of the few civs expanded upon to any detail in the movies that is not already present in the game.

And for the last time...I'll admit that Imp Remnant and New Republic are not front runners for the bes tpossilbe civs for the game, but can we at least get off the notion that they are identical to Rebels and Empire? Anyone who's read a decent amount of the EU, read the comics, etc can tell that you could make entire civs based on them and not duplicate any units, have wildy different architecture, have different bonuses and research techs, all new campaigns, etc......Yes, they wouldn't be as fun as movie based civs but they ARE NOT THE SAME.

darthfergie
07-29-2002, 01:46 AM
The Karrde Organization/Smuggler\'s Alliance
Would be cool, but not in GB. Maybe in a game like C&C Generals (this would be similar to their terrorist civ)
The Corellians
Hmmm, wouldn't reccomend it. Just not enough to go on. Sure the system had a rebellion of it's own, but they still use the same traits as the Rebels.
The Sith Empire (ancient sith)
No. Sith have already been integrated into the GB gameplay so it isn't really recommendable.
The Chiss
YES PLEASE!!! Chiss rule...PERIOD!
The Jawas
YES PLEASE!!! JAWAS RULE!!! I want my Jawa Commandos ;)
The Tusken Raiders
erm...nah.
The Jedi Order (ancient jedi)
Once again the Jedi has been well integrated into all civs and the number of Jedi isn't much over a thousand or two.
The Bothans (spies)
Hmmm...Would deffinatly work. Have to be a sneaky civ though if you want to pull it off it would have to twist the norm quite a bit which was unfortunalty not done in GB.
Geonosians (split them off of the confed.)
Nah. They are well intrenched in the Confed lines.
The Kaminoans
Warlike? Cloners? These people look like if they had a war they would put as many machines in front of them as possible. They just look FRAGILE.

Your missing the greatest and coolest of all! The Vong. Admitedly you would also have to twist the norm drastically, but it's something that should have been done in GB to give each civ it's own originality instead of that feeling of almost sameness for every civ. Oh sure they look different and some don't have the same units...but when it all comes down to it there really are NO major differences in any of the civs. I would personally like the feel of a completely different experiance for each civ. Such as when playing the rebels thinking that EVERY UNIT COUNTS. We don't have the man-power that the Empire has so if we fight on their terms we're crushed. I'd like to use fertive and secretish tactics for the Rebels, but no. It's all head to head battles, throw a few hundred units at their few hundred and hope your guys preform well against them. If they don't...well don't worry because your producing a few hundred to replace them when they go down. Constant waves and masses of units are NOT NORMAL FOR A SMALL REBEL GROUP!!!

...boy I really went off there...

Admiral Vostok
07-29-2002, 09:56 AM
I forgot to comment about the Ewoks...

Love the idea of playing the Ewoks, except that those who complain the Gungans aren't likely to go planet to planet colonising wouldn't like the Ewoks at all.

My idea is this: has anyone played Age of Kings, the game whose engine is the basis for SWGB? If you have like me you'll know some stuff is only present in SWGB because it was in Age of Kings, namely the Cannons. No civ has a cannon that is canon (pun intended). You don't see anything resembling them in the movies, but they're in the game because of trebuchets.

Anyway back to my point. When the Age of Conquerors Expansion came out for Age of Kings, the Central American Civs of Mayans and Aztecs were unable to build cavalry of any type. I'm suggesting a similar thing for Ewoks, where they are unable to build mechs. At the very least it would be an interesting challenge to play.

And hows this for a unique unit... booby trap maker! The Ewoks brought down most of the Imperial Forces at Endor with booby traps, it would be cool to set an unseen trap (detectable only by stealth-detecting units), that when enemy units enter the area they loose a certain amount of health. Just a thought.

ESE_SithEmperor
07-29-2002, 01:32 PM
:D

jcb231
07-31-2002, 04:43 AM
Yup, Ewok trap maker has been discussed on this and other threads...its the logical (and funa s all get-out) choice for a unique unit. :)

Regarding darthfergie's post:

The Sith civ proposed here are not the type of Sith that are already integrated into the gameplay. The Sith Empire is the ancient order of the Sith, existing thousands and thousands of years before the movies and completely unlike anything we've seen in any game. The only place they have been represented is in the Dark Horse Comic series "Tales of the Jedi: The Golden Age of the Sith", but that provided a lot of info and could be the basis for the civ's design. They're not my first choice for a new civ (those are Ewoks, Bespin, Hutts, and Mon Calamari) but they'd be sort of cool. The lightsabers of this time had belt packs to provide them with power, although unless I'm completely mistaken the Sith Empire didn't use any lightsabers in the comic series, only the Jedi Knights in the "civilized galaxy" did.

The Jedi Order being proposed is the Jedi order of several hundred to a thousand years before the movies. The Jedi of that time were more warlike, more numerous, and more medieval in their organization...true Jedi "Knights" with an emphasis on battle against the Dark Side and the destruction of the Sith Lords (an order based out of Ancient Sith teachings and Dark Jedi ways, that would evolve into the Sith as we know them from the movies) of that time. Over the intervenening generations they "mellowed out" into the Jedi we know from the films. Again, there is a comic series "Jedi vs. Sith" which shows these type of Jedi Knights. They actually wore armor and had to deal with the possibility of being shot by projectile weapons of all things.

jcb231
07-31-2002, 04:45 AM
Oh, and darthfergie....check out the previous pages and try to find version 1 and 3 of this poll. Give me your opinions on those civs if you like. I'd be interested to hear your take. I piulled the civs for all three polls from various threads and the many discussions on this topic since the boards began. Its interesting to see what people really want in a new civ.