PDA

View Full Version : Time Travel...the impossible possibility


ET Warrior
01-13-2003, 11:19 PM
Well, again i'll go into the realm of physics to discuss another interesting thing, and that is time travel. Just wondering whether any of you think we'll advance enough to actually travel through time. The physics of it have been figured out basically....however at the moment the ability to do it is completely and totally impossible.
First, we must locate Quantum foam, which we aren't sure exists, and then we must be able to locate the wormhole IN that foam, THEN we have to figure out how to enlarge the wormhole big enough for a person to pass through, accelerate one end of the hole to nearly the speed of light which we of course cannot do, and then we need enough exotic matter equalling the mass of Jupiter to hold the wormhole open long enough to prevent being smashed in it while going through (exotic matter is matter with a negative charge...it is not found naturally in nature, and is not easy to create even small amounts of it)

So there it is ladies and gentlemen, as easy as me jumping to the moon tomorrow morning :D

TheWhiteRaider
01-13-2003, 11:26 PM
as easy as me jumping to the moon tomorrow morning

Wow are you going to do that? I got to see this! J/K:D

ET Warrior
01-13-2003, 11:27 PM
Well i do need some more moonrocks.............;)

But seriously, with all those above necessities, does anyone think we'll get to that technology level?

Xylan
01-13-2003, 11:29 PM
Thats not going to happen for awhile.......Defintely not in my lifetime, by then DVD players would be 50 cents. It would be fairly cool though, hopefully it'll happen in the next 500 years, but, anythings possible. Yet again there is another book about this by the same person who did Universe in a Nutshell. Forgot the name of the book....

Andy867
01-14-2003, 04:20 AM
Einstein said nothing can be accelerated up to the speed of light because it will infinitely gain mass, however, what if something was going the speed of light already, or faster? For example, researchers have proven that tachyons fired in a containment can reach the speed of light without accelerating to it, and they can move faster than the speed of light, up to 1.5 times faster with today's technology. However, time travel is another story. As Dr McCoy put it, Just head towards a supergiant at maximum warp acceleration and slingshot around it, praying you don't burn up in the process. (or something like that). I believe that one day in the very distant future, we will be able to study time and achieve time travel, but by then, who knows what else will be happening. How many world/galactic wars will have taken place. How many times mankind has been on the brink of annihilation. What species we may discover.

Wacky_Baccy
01-14-2003, 09:13 AM
I'd just like to point out that we already travel through time, albeit in an uncontrollable direction :D
Posted by Andy867
Einstein said nothing can be accelerated up to the speed of light because it will infinitely gain mass, however, what if something was going the speed of light already, or faster? For example, researchers have proven that tachyons fired in a containment can reach the speed of light without accelerating to it, and they can move faster than the speed of light, up to 1.5 times faster with today's technology.Eh?? Tachyons always move faster than light - they can't decelerate to below the speed of light! :eyeraise:

Do you have a souce for that "up to 1.5 times faster" bit?

C'jais
01-14-2003, 09:27 AM
"Reality is just an ever present now."

I'm no good on the physics of this, but if there's one thing that history has told us, it's that whatever might seem impossible in the current event of things, might very well be possible in the future.

I can't imagine going back in time. Forward is fine, but backwards would likely create some serious paradoxes.

Andy867
01-14-2003, 01:12 PM
Yea I do, McMillan's Earth Science for my 7th grade year ;) . I never said it to decelerate below the speed of light. I just said when fired it would reach the speed of light without having to accelerate as in going from 0- speed of light.

Originally posted by Cjais
I can't imagine going back in time. Forward is fine, but backwards would likely create some serious paradoxes.

Strange how you mention that because I was watching "There will always be Paris" episode from the first season of Star Trek: TNG last night/this morning, and they were dealing with time and the time constant and how gravity can affect it, etc. and how there were many paradoxes/dimensions. Of course it was at 3am, so if I mess up a part of the description of the episode, please feel free to correct me.

ET Warrior
01-14-2003, 01:18 PM
Originally posted by Andy867
Einstein said nothing can be accelerated up to the speed of light because it will infinitely gain mass, however, what if something was going the speed of light already, or faster? For example, researchers have proven that tachyons fired in a containment can reach the speed of light without accelerating to it, and they can move faster than the speed of light, up to 1.5 times faster with today's technology.

But tachyons don't have any mass do they? (i honestly don't know)

Because anything with no mass can conceivably go at the speed of light, and can go faster. But something with mass has two problems. First, distance dilates as you approach relativistic speeds. Something moving at 87% of the speed of light appears to be half as long, at 99.5% it looks one tenth the size, but AT the speed of light length is zero.....which makes one wonder what happens to a person. Another problem is Momentum. A person moving at the speed of light would require infinite momentum to propel them, and to have infinite momentum you must have infinite impulse (impulse is force times time, so to get infinite impulse, you would need an infinite force) which is completely impossible as we understand physics today.

Lost Welshman
01-15-2003, 02:20 PM
In My Opinion time travel (for humans/on earth) is not going to happen, If it is going to happen then surely someone would travel back in time and give us the technology or at least leave some record of timetravel, unless people can only leap forward in time thousands of years, but they mught be afraid of what they find.

Also I dont think you have to accellerate to the speed of light, maybe you could find something travelling that fast and hitch a ride?

Kstar__2
01-15-2003, 03:41 PM
well, i don't think we'll be able to travel trough time. for the reasons all listed above. teleportation however is already possible, and i think we'll be teleporting people by the end of my lifetime.

Andy867
01-15-2003, 05:57 PM
I believe teleportation of matter like humans and cargo will be possible in the next 100 years, so, unless any of us know the exact they are daying, then who knows if we will see it in our lifetime. or not

ET Warrior
01-15-2003, 06:58 PM
Originally posted by Lost Welshman
Also I dont think you have to accellerate to the speed of light, maybe you could find something travelling that fast and hitch a ride?

No, you couldn't, because anything that is already moving at the speed of light has no mass, and therefore has nothing to hook onto. Also, to go from non-motion to motion requires acceleration. There is no way to simply go from 0 to any speed instantaneously.

Reborn Outcast
01-15-2003, 07:17 PM
Originally posted by Cjais
back[/i] in time. Forward is fine, but backwards would likely create some serious paradoxes.

Yes I have to agree with you because who knows... what if some psyco gets a hold of a time machine, goes back in time and screws a ton of things up... But time travel will no occur for a VERY long time... sheesh I can't even get my TV to work.

matt--
01-15-2003, 07:38 PM
Originally posted by Andy867 For example, researchers have proven that tachyons fired in a containment can reach the speed of light without accelerating to it, and they can move faster than the speed of light, up to 1.5 times faster with today's technology.
Hey guys, last I checked, tachyons were theoretical particles, and I think they were disproven after a lack of the radiation they were thought to have produced in a vacuum...unless you can provide an article or other credible source proving these experiments.

Lost Welshman
01-16-2003, 02:50 PM
Yes I have to agree with you because who knows... what if some psyco gets a hold of a time machine, goes back in time and screws a ton of things up... But time travel will no occur for a VERY long time... sheesh I can't even get my TV to work.

Hey, maybe someone already did go back in time and thats why things are screwed up now

CaptainRAVE
01-16-2003, 04:15 PM
Sorry im spoiling these threads, but from a scientist...

Time travel is theoretically impossible. The only way to travel back in time it to travel faster than the speed of light, which is impossible :).

That ends that :D




AND TO ANYONE THAT SAYS ANYTHING ABOUT DAM TRANSPORTERS!!!!!!....

They did indeed transport a molecule of oxygen, however, they were not sure if it was the same molecule, fools.

Essentially what a transporter does it break down whatever is there into their molecules, and reconstruct the molecules in the same order somewhere else.......after that explanation im sure you wouldnt want to get transported somewhere :D

ET Warrior
01-17-2003, 12:39 AM
Originally posted by CaptainRAVE
Sorry im spoiling these threads, but from a scientist...

Time travel is theoretically impossible. The only way to travel back in time it to travel faster than the speed of light, which is impossible :).

That ends that :D


No, actually it doesn't really end that....because time travel is THEORETICALLY possible. It is impossible right now as we understand physiscs, but theoretically it could be done.

CaptainRAVE
01-17-2003, 03:16 PM
We could only ever travel back in time though. To travel forward in time hasnt even got a theory at the moment.

I said "The only way to travel back in time it to travel faster than the speed of light, which is impossible". I can now remember why isnt impossible :rolleyes:. At such speeds mass becomes infinite and nothing would survive it. Time travel is theoretically possible, but...you can only travel back in time very slowly. You cant just jump back millions of years instantly. With current theories it would take a very long time.

Andy867
01-17-2003, 03:33 PM
probably about a millenia or so to grasp and begin the process of working the physics into it.

And about transporters. It will be possible within the next 500 years to transport matter. We just don't have the technology to handle that complicated of "data." But once we begin researching and expanding and tweaking our technology, it will be only a matter of time till we hear, " Beam me up, Scotty."

CaptainRAVE
01-17-2003, 06:33 PM
Originally posted by Andy867
probably about a millenia or so to grasp and begin the process of working the physics into it.

And about transporters. It will be possible within the next 500 years to transport matter. We just don't have the technology to handle that complicated of "data." But once we begin researching and expanding and tweaking our technology, it will be only a matter of time till we hear, " Beam me up, Scotty."

Yes. But would you really want to be taken apart on the molecular level?? If you understand the physics of it its quite frightening :eek:

ET Warrior
01-17-2003, 09:24 PM
Originally posted by CaptainRAVE
We could only ever travel back in time though. To travel forward in time hasnt even got a theory at the moment.

I said "The only way to travel back in time it to travel faster than the speed of light, which is impossible". I can now remember why isnt impossible :rolleyes:. At such speeds mass becomes infinite and nothing would survive it. Time travel is theoretically possible, but...you can only travel back in time very slowly. You cant just jump back millions of years instantly. With current theories it would take a very long time.

Actually, i read that physicists aren't so much concerned about mass increasing infinite....but they say the impossibility of moving at the speed of light is that Momentum will increase infinitely, and to have infinite momentum you need an infinite impulse, and for an infinite impulse you need an infinite force, which is impossible :D

razorace
01-19-2003, 05:33 PM
I believe time travel may be possible, but only if it obeys the law of cause and effect. This effectively rules out travelling to the past. However, this does make one-way trips to the future possible. If time travel is one-way, why even go in the first place?

obi
01-19-2003, 11:38 PM
You do realize we are traveling through time every second of our lives, don't you?

razorace
01-20-2003, 12:15 AM
We are?! :eek:

:D

Tzar Sectus
01-20-2003, 03:02 AM
My two cents on this topic... first of all, I can't comment on any of the technical aspects of this. I have no clue at all why travelling faster than the speed of light allows time travel to the past, or what the heck a tachyon is. But I can comment on the logic on travelling back/forth.

Anyway, let's say if a person (let's call him Joe) goes back into time when he was a little boy, and he kills his younger self. Thus preventing himself from getting older and going back into time to kill himself. This is a very clear paradox. Is this a reason why time travel isn't possible, or would this just be two different time dimensions, where in one Joe died as a young boy, and in the other he grew up to kill himself? Now then, if it's so that there are infinite amount of these time dimensions then life itself will seem almost pointless, where if time travel is allowed you (or anyone) can time travel and mess up time as you see fit, forging the universe into your own playground (hmm, perfect for megalomaniacs =p ).

Anyway, let's expand this a bit. We go back to Joe's situation, we have TD1 (time dimension 1) where he grew up normally and then went back into time, and TD2 where he died as a young boy (and obviously never got the chance to do any time travelling). Now then, if TD1's Joe decides to have some more fun, he travels back even further back into time and he decides to kill himself while he was a baby, what has happened then to TD2? In TD2 he died as a young boy, but how could he die as a young boy when he died as a baby? This means that these time dimensions must exist in threads, this new TD where he died as a baby will exist as a sub-dimension of TD1. And TD2 exists independently with it's chance of it's own subdimensions if someone gets the "smart" idea to mess up time more.

And then we have of course the obvious consequences of time travel, some guy may go really far back into time and do something drastic which will wipe out the entire mankind, or make the French take over the world (which would be even worse, think of that, everyone speaking french! eeek! =p ). And even the smallest thing a person does would have it's effect on the future. But then again, if time has infinite dimensions this wouldn't matter at all except for the man who actually did this. We would only be talking french in another time dimension =p

Another thing, if time has only one dimension with all the paradoxes that has for time travel and if time travel actually exists, why haven't we seen any time travel in our time? If time travel is going to be invented, then surely someone would have done a lot of it already and we would already have seen some results. After all, the present is the future's past.

For conclusion if time travel ever gets invented, I surely hope it gets banned immediately, and measures are done to prevent anyone from doing it. Even though it has some nice scientific purposes (for instance the chance to see how the past *really* was and finally document the entire mankind's history) it simply has too many bad sides with it.

Now I'll stop talking before my head explodes out of this silly babble...

-Remi

Luc Solar
01-20-2003, 05:27 AM
(Didn't read all posts, so someone might have pointed this out already:)

If time travel could be accomplished, don't you think we knew about it already?

Surely we would have had visitors by now...but since we (as far as I know) have not, time travel won't happen, ever. :(

The only way it might be possible is if someone inveted it but never used it. And somehow I doubt that.

And there's really no use in "waiting for someone to invent it", 'cause if someone had or will, time would seize to make any difference anymore.

Actually, there is no point in even pondering about the whole subject - time travel backwards is impossible. If it could EVER (no matter how far in the future) be done, we'd now about it today. See my point?

O.o - I think I managed to confuse even myself! :D

ShadowTemplar
01-29-2003, 12:54 PM
Originally posted by C'jais
I can't imagine going back in time. Forward is fine, but backwards would likely create some serious paradoxes.

Going forwards is simple: Invent Cold Sleep. As Jah said it is already happening. But then the present would be past, to which you cannot go back (due to the Grandmother Paradox).

Anyway, I know absolutely nothing about this subject, but Astronomy is still in R&D, IMO. Basically if you go onto interstellar levels you are approaching metaphysics at a freightening rate (or so I think, but again: I don't know enough to say anything of consideration).