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View Full Version : The Draft to be re-enacted in 3 weeks


MysticSpade
02-11-2003, 03:38 PM
yes it's tru...well not tru it's a very possible rumor goin around where i live. it says the Draft might be back up in 3 weeks. for once i'm glad that i have a severely cracked kneecap and can't be taken cuz i'm not physically able to perform many tasks. as of right now i can barely walk for an hour without my knee tryin to bend the other way.

so what is your thoughts on the draft. basically it applies to men who are 18-24 and physically fit.

Eldritch
02-11-2003, 03:53 PM
The draft sucks. Service to your country should be voluntary, not forced. There are many people that disagree with the war, and for those people to be forced between fighting a war they hate or fleeing the country (otherwise they face jail time) is not much of a choice at all.

I've already served my time in the USMC, so I won't be going, but if I was eligible to be drafted and received draft notice, I'd move to Europe.

Reborn Outcast
02-11-2003, 03:58 PM
I thinks its all a rumor. The US has plenty of people AND many allies. But yea its would suck... my cousin would be taken away and many of my college friends. (I'm in 9th grade.) :( :(

MysticSpade
02-11-2003, 04:00 PM
i totally agree. when i first heard that the draft may be an issue. i was seriously contemplating movin to Canada or somethin like that. because why should i a 19 yr old who is married and has a Daughter on the way be forced to be sent to his undeniable death sentence. i just am glad that i will not be goin if they do pick me. i am strongly against war in any fashion. i think Bush is a boob and is only doin this for oil. if we want this war to be over with before it even starts i suggest gettin Sadam and Bush to sit down and smoke a duby with each other. problem would have a better chance of gettin resolved that way than the way it's going. and it's sad when half the peopl in our country would rather be marked for High-Treason the fight a war be have no belief in. i would rather go to the pen or leave this country and never look back if need be.

obi
02-11-2003, 05:13 PM
I'll carry your books, I'll carry a torch, I'll carry a tune, I'll carry on, carry over, carry forward, Cary Grant, cash and carry, carry me back to old Virginie, I'll even hari-kari if you show me how, but I will not carry a gun.


That should tell you my answer :)

ET Warrior
02-11-2003, 05:29 PM
Originally posted by obi-wan13
I'll carry your books, I'll carry a torch, I'll carry a tune, I'll carry on, carry over, carry forward, Cary Grant, cash and carry, carry me back to old Virginie, I'll even hari-kari if you show me how, but I will not carry a gun.


That should tell you my answer :)

What he said.

ImmolatedYoda
02-11-2003, 05:30 PM
hmm...i think maybe this belongs in the Senate...but i dont think that service should be mandatory.

CagedCrado
02-11-2003, 05:57 PM
Im not a crazy liberal like the rest of you no war even if it means we all die people, but i believe armies shouldnt be drafted since they dont fight as well.

obi
02-11-2003, 06:08 PM
Originally posted by CagedCrado
Im not a crazy liberal like the rest of you no war even if it means we all die people, but i believe armies shouldnt be drafted since they dont fight as well.

Easy fella, I'm republican, and I support Bush, but I ain't goin to fight no stinkin war for anybody.

HBK
02-11-2003, 06:09 PM
Draft is a bad idea. We don't need people fighting who don't want to fight. Doesn't make sense. I am conservative/Republican. Draft will not happen.


forums are slow tonight 4 me

munik
02-11-2003, 07:09 PM
There's no way the draft would be reinstated. I'm pretty sure the armed forces are at or near their quotas. And any upcoming war with Iraq has very few chances of depleting the current amount of men in the armed forces.

If we go to war, and are still fighting in a year or two from now, then maybe I'll believe a rumor about re-instating the draft.

Aru-Wen, if you did 4 years active, and the 4 years inactive required of the usmc, and had a discharge that wasn't a bcd or less, I'm pretty sure you can still be drafted. But you'd be pretty old for service then, even if you enlisted the first time at 17. So I figure you're the minority here and you got a few years under your belt. ;)

Eldritch
02-11-2003, 07:30 PM
I was actually active for 2 years before I busted my knee and was medically discharged with honor, so I'm not "physically fit" for service anymore, even if they did draft me.

Dath Maximus
02-11-2003, 07:34 PM
i got a heart murmer, so i would get a discharge for a medical disorder

*talks to chest* good irregular heart beat.

he he he

munik
02-11-2003, 07:35 PM
ahhh, so you're not as old as I thought. Get medical benefit? That'd be sweet.

Eldritch
02-11-2003, 07:37 PM
Of course. Paid for all the bills and stuff, but I was a little upset about leaving. Ah well, once a Marine, always a Marine.

Rogue15
02-11-2003, 09:55 PM
I kinda hope so...i mean it's the only chance i'd get to be a soldier...cause i live near my friends and all, who are too young to be drafted. hehe and it's something i've kinda dreamed about, wondering what its like and all and if i could handle it, etc....but if i am drafted, I'll make the most of it!!! :D

ET Warrior
02-12-2003, 12:02 AM
Originally posted by Rogue15
it's something i've kinda dreamed about..................but if i am drafted, I'll make the most of it!!! :D

:disaprove

That makes me sad :(

MysticSpade
02-12-2003, 12:27 AM
anyone who is for the draft is a sad soul indeed. cuz in the end you're gonna wind up dead.

just to let you guys know our president is gonna get us all killed

ZePhyR
02-12-2003, 04:39 AM
I don't agree with it, but we have to protect our country if a time of war does come about. If drafted, I'd fight til I died, but I'd need to get laid before I went. I'm 17 now, and turn 18 in May, so it's possible that'd I'd be going if the draft came back.

MysticSpade
02-12-2003, 10:47 AM
just because you'll be 18 don't mean you'll be goin. you have to be physically able above all else. i won't be goin cuz you have to hike with 60 pound packs and my knee buckles under the weight of a bag of kitter if held for over a minute. plus i get migraines that would probably make half the people here burst into tears. they are dibilitating. when i get one i can't do anything at all.

munik
02-12-2003, 02:30 PM
Rogue15, you can always enlist on your own accord. Don't have to wait for a draft that is never gonna happen.



Originally posted by ET Warrior
:disaprove

That makes me sad :(

YOU make me sick. If you ever needed the protection of the U.S. Military, everyone and his brother knows you would be begging for it. But since you don't need it now, you think you can belittle those who wish to join the service. That is disgusting. Those who fight know they do it even though they know it's for people such as yourself, those who would rather spit on them then look at them.

Man, if you aren't gonna serve your time in the military, at least don't give those who go above and beyond your contributions to this country a hard time.

JediNyt
02-12-2003, 02:35 PM
Sometimes it may be nessesary in dire situations but this is not one of them and there are plenty of military forces already. I wouldnt want to fight this war, theres too much controversy and holes in the truth. I dont know who to really believe. I want to stay out of it. I want the world to find good alternatives to oil and stick with them. I know oil is a large factor of this impending war and its not something I would fight for. I would fight for life, for world piece, and for prosperity but not this. This is all too suspicious.

MysticSpade
02-12-2003, 02:55 PM
i agree. but i still wouldn't do it even if i could. cuz it's something that i am STRONGLY against. i can't imagine fighting for somethin that i don't believe in.

C'jais
02-12-2003, 02:57 PM
Originally posted by MysticSpade
i can't imagine fighting for somethin that i don't believe in.

One should never be forced to do this.

It's like cooking food you detest yourself.

...or sumthin'.

munik
02-12-2003, 03:06 PM
Nobody is down in a fighting hole in the middle of the night under artillery fire thinking about what a great cause they are fighting for.

Nobody is squeezing rounds into frightened young men because they believe it's for a righteous cause.


Those who join to fight do it for the fight. You don't have to believe in anything to be elligible to fight. Hell, you don't even have to have the desire to kill, that's included in the training as well. :)

BlackDove
02-12-2003, 03:08 PM
So out of fourteen voters I was the only one answering how it's an excellent idea?

wow...

munik
02-12-2003, 03:11 PM
The draft is an outdated idea. So I didn't even vote, as it's sort of irrelevant. Maybe if he asked this question 40 some years ago when it was actually applicable, I'd have an opinion.

MysticSpade
02-12-2003, 03:16 PM
well i was just posting to hear your opinions on it. cuz basically it is relevant cuz sooner or later some of us will be forced to fight for an unknown cause.

nova_wolf
02-12-2003, 03:18 PM
Dude - draft sucks.

Surely the US have a large enough armed forces as it is youd think.

Had this discussion with my g/f.

After Sept 11th, the cocky No-one is gonna get us on our turf theory dissolved.

This draft is to ensure safety at home.

Its like after Vector Prime in the NJO series - after ******************* gets *********, the bubble of invincibility that had always seemed to te there was gone, and harsh reality hit home like a proton torp on Spice!

C'jais
02-12-2003, 03:20 PM
Originally posted by MysticSpade
some of us will be forced to fight for an unknown cause.

Whadya mean unknown?

Don't worry man, it's the age old "kill them and take their stuff". It applies to each and every war.

Every war has an underlying shady motive of profitting from winning. There are no just wars, however needed they may be.

munik
02-12-2003, 03:23 PM
Originally posted by nova_wolf

This draft is to ensure safety at home.



I'm pretty sure that the 2nd Ammendment is there to ensure safety at home. At the very least it would do the trick much better then instituting a draft.

nova_wolf
02-12-2003, 03:49 PM
No idea about the Ammendments (sorry - Im a Brit)

Just figure that those drafted will need time to be properly trained before being sent anywhere, so they would be better as a domestic defense team.

That, or it is a sign of the losses that your government is expecting.
Not a nice theory I know, but it does stand to reason...

munik
02-12-2003, 04:06 PM
2nd Ammendment is the one about having a militia and bearing arms and such. We also have a branch of the service called the National Guard, as well as the Coast Guard, so the armed forces already have servicemen in place at home. It also only takes about 3 months to train someone for war.

nova_wolf
02-12-2003, 04:13 PM
Then by process of elimination, that leaves the replacing their loses theory... Ouch! :(

HBK
02-12-2003, 04:59 PM
That, or it is a sign of the losses that your government is expecting.
Not a nice theory I know, but it does stand to reason..

The draft theory is actually a ploy by the anti-war movement in the US. They want to put the idea into the heads of the people making the decision to go to war that their children/grandchildren will go fight and possibly die. They are also trying to influence the public to rally against the war. The draft issue right now is a political scam.

xwing guy
02-12-2003, 05:59 PM
Yeah, the rumor about the draft being reinstated is just that, a rumor. The draft ain't gonna happen folks, don't worry about it, the war with Iraq will be like the war with Afganistan, it'll be over in a matter of weeks with minimal caustlities. So stop worrying.

ET Warrior
02-12-2003, 07:24 PM
Originally posted by munik
YOU make me sick. If you ever needed the protection of the U.S. Military, everyone and his brother knows you would be begging for it. But since you don't need it now, you think you can belittle those who wish to join the service. That is disgusting. Those who fight know they do it even though they know it's for people such as yourself, those who would rather spit on them then look at them.

Man, if you aren't gonna serve your time in the military, at least don't give those who go above and beyond your contributions to this country a hard time.

I'm not belittling his desire to join the army to protect people, i'm belittling the fact that he seems to be amazingly excited about the prospect of being able to go to war and kill people. If I'm drafted, I'll make the most of it :D and THAT makes me sad. I dont really care if I make you sick because I hate everything about killing.
Nobody is down in a fighting hole in the middle of the night under artillery fire thinking about what a great cause they are fighting for.
Nobody is squeezing rounds into frightened young men because they believe it's for a righteous cause.
Those who join to fight do it for the fight.
that makes ME sick.

munik
02-12-2003, 09:40 PM
Fine then. Not everyone wears panties. Accept that some people like to do what comes natural. Nothing wrong with that at all.

xwing guy
02-12-2003, 09:43 PM
Yeah, that the way to tell em' munik. :cool:

XERXES
02-12-2003, 09:50 PM
im in college, cant get drafted (as far as i know) and im moving to greece after i graduate with a friend.


and ill put it this way...i would NOT go fight voluntarily for this war we have going on, there is no aparent cause for the fighting except to lower oil prices and kill sadam:rolleyes: it would be different if it were a situation like in world war 2 if some big event or invasion happened and it threatened my existance.

Wes Marrakesh
02-12-2003, 09:51 PM
ET, back the hell off. It's people that act close minded, like you appear to be doing now, that are the cause of more than a few wars or at least tradegdies.*points at the Spanish Inquisition*

He has a valid opinion. Life throws you a lemon, make lemonade. Same applies here. Life sends you into the army, you be the best soldier you can be.

obi
02-12-2003, 10:03 PM
Speaking of wars, don't turn this thread into one. ;)

Wes Marrakesh
02-12-2003, 10:25 PM
Yes. sir! :D

ET Warrior
02-12-2003, 10:31 PM
Originally posted by Wes Marrakesh
ET, back the hell off. It's people that act close minded, like you appear to be doing now, that are the cause of more than a few wars or at least tradegdies.*points at the Spanish Inquisition*

Yes, my complete and total desire to never EVER kill another human being will cause wars..........:rolleyes:
ET, back the hell off.
In the words of StrongBad..."Holy Crap!"

I haven't done ANYTHING besides point out that the fact that people who think killing is exciting or that want to be a part of wars makes me sad. That is all. I was not being close minded, i did not condemn rogue 15 to hell for his thoughts, i simply told him that it made me sad to see people happy about the prospect of war.

As I already mentioned, joining the army because you feel that you are serving a grand cause brings me no sadness, I respect that fact that you are willing to kill to protect people. So perhaps you all should just calm down mebbe?

Wes Marrakesh
02-12-2003, 10:48 PM
Oy. I had an argument in my head and it has killed itself in being typed. I withdraw my case.

BUT.

It would be nice if your comments were a little less pointed.

Rogue15
02-12-2003, 11:27 PM
by 'making the most of it' i didn't mean i'd want to kill people!!!!

If i get drafted i'm not going to be a whiny little bitch, i'm going to accept it, and not let it get me down.

War sucks. =/ I voted 'draft sucks' btw.

Kain
02-12-2003, 11:37 PM
HAHAHAHAHA!!! Draft in 3 weeks...wow...that rumor is sooooooo invalid.

My Contemporary History teacher is likea Captain or Lieutenant or some high rank in the Armed Forces and he said the draft ain't comin back anytime in the next...ever.

If worse came to worse, and I got drafted, I'd flip a coin

Heads - Shoot off a toe
Tails - Go to war, learn to aim*better*, and be damned if I come out without a Purple Heart...or if I got worried, I'd shoot off a toe...:D ah, loop-holes...how do I live without thee...

MysticSpade
02-12-2003, 11:42 PM
HAHAHAH LOL

that is funny. glad to hear bout no Draft though.

ET Warrior
02-12-2003, 11:50 PM
Originally posted by Rogue15
by 'making the most of it' i didn't mean i'd want to kill people!!!!

If i get drafted i'm not going to be a whiny little bitch, i'm going to accept it, and not let it get me down.

War sucks. =/ I voted 'draft sucks' btw.

Well, in THAT case.......Sorry, i merely mis-understood yew.

:D



*tries to sneak away before feeling more estupid*

Rumor
02-13-2003, 12:30 AM
Originally posted by obi-wan13
Easy fella, I'm republican, and I support Bush, but I ain't goin to fight no stinkin war for anybody.


will you fight for you and your family?

AutoCept
02-13-2003, 02:18 AM
You're probably making a big deal out of nothing.
First with all the people and countrys I don't think draft will be reatived.
Second they normaly draft people without jobs that are not in collage or married first. So you probably don't have anything to worry about.

ShockV1.89
02-13-2003, 08:18 AM
You know, I'm scared here. I actually agree with what Munik is saying.

It seems a bit ungrateful of some of you that you would take advantage of the rights and privileges bestowed upon you by the country and the people who protect it, but you are unwilling to stand up and give back a little.

I've always supported the idea of making at least two years military service mandatory. I've seen some total losers go into the military, and come out clean cut, straight edged guys. Not only does it help your country, it helps you too.

SmartDragon
02-13-2003, 10:50 AM
not sure about that I used to live with an ex-armed forces bloke and I'm sure that he can't have been that big an arsehole when he joined at 17. scary thing is hes now at med school (I really don't want him as my Dr).
But it does help some people better themselves but its definaty not for everyone. I'm not against the forces as I'm thinking of joining after I graduate, can't make me kill anyone then (that would be braking the hypocratic oath).:)

ET Warrior
02-13-2003, 05:41 PM
Originally posted by ShockV1.89
You know, I'm scared here. I actually agree with what Munik is saying.

It seems a bit ungrateful of some of you that you would take advantage of the rights and privileges bestowed upon you by the country and the people who protect it, but you are unwilling to stand up and give back a little.

I've always supported the idea of making at least two years military service mandatory. I've seen some total losers go into the military, and come out clean cut, straight edged guys. Not only does it help your country, it helps you too.


I have no problems with service, so long as it won't require me to kill people. I CANT DO IT. The thought of it makes me physically ill.

AutoCept
02-13-2003, 05:44 PM
And this is why you have the bond smilie in your sig?

Eldritch
02-13-2003, 05:48 PM
Movies are entirely different from actual combat, AutoCept.

Remember, there is a debate on whether or not young children can separate movies/tv violence with real violence. I'm not saying ET Warrior is a young child, but it's good that he can make that distinction.

ShockV1.89
02-13-2003, 07:13 PM
Originally posted by ET Warrior
I have no problems with service, so long as it won't require me to kill people. I CANT DO IT. The thought of it makes me physically ill.

I respect that, to some degree. But there's more than one way to serve. When I was looking at the Navy, I was offered the position of avionics and aviation electronics, as well as a spot on the nuke program for submarines and the reactors on the Nimitz carriers. None of those involved killing anyone.

It takes all kinds to keep a military running.

MysticSpade
02-13-2003, 07:18 PM
i agree with ET very much so. i will not support anything that deals with the detruction of another human being in any way. meaning workin on planes that drops bombs or something like that.

ShockV1.89
02-13-2003, 08:49 PM
Even if not doing so will result in the invasion and hostile takeover of your country?

MysticSpade
02-13-2003, 08:57 PM
i'm a strong believer in whatever happens happens. but i honestly doubt that we will succumb to a hostile takeover.

ShockV1.89
02-13-2003, 09:03 PM
I'm talking about a hypothetical situation. Suppose our army abroad is wiped out, and everyone is needed to keep the invasion off the mainland. You mean you wouldnt go? :disaprove

If you live in the USA... very sad... If you're not willing to defend it, then you dont deserve to live here.

MysticSpade
02-13-2003, 09:13 PM
basically if worse came to worst i would support my country and yes i do live in the US. i live in TX as a matter of fact. but until they absolutely need my skills i won't volunteer for anything.

AutoCept
02-13-2003, 09:42 PM
Originally posted by Aru-Wen
Movies are entirely different from actual combat, AutoCept.

Remember, there is a debate on whether or not young children can separate movies/tv violence with real violence. I'm not saying ET Warrior is a young child, but it's good that he can make that distinction.
You really can't take a joke can you?

Pedantic
02-13-2003, 11:03 PM
If it is needed, I think the draft would be a good idea. How else are they going to get more soldiers if needed? O_o And, yes, I would serve if called and not skip off to Canada or wherever. I find it sad that people would not wish to defend this country and what it stands for.

Kain
02-13-2003, 11:05 PM
okay ET and everyone else who says they can't kill, you'll serve, but you won't kill. Okay, worst case scenario that everyone is trained for...

Suppose you're at your base/ship/whatever, and the alarm goes off? Alarm? Means THEY got in. You get handed standard issue firearms*M16*and told you are gonna die here except for in the slim chance, and you're told to take as many of them as you possibly can. What then? Do you cower and die like a coward or do you fight back, albeit in vain?

I've got issues when killing too. But obviously, the enemy has issues PERIOD.

I say shoot first, ask questions later. Give me my M16 with Grenade Launcher attatchment, set me down in a city, and watch a Al-Queda muk-muk get blasted is how I see it...and if his wife and 20 children decide they wanna come at me with sticks, I fire my grenade into their hut and watch em all go BOOM! The only problem I have is killing innocent civilians. Unfortunantly, the enemy dosen't seem to have the same problem. Swear to God some little camel-jockey kid comes at me with a damn AK and I'll fire first...

PS - Sorry for all the ethnic slurs and racist comments. I'm peace loving and what not, but I'll throw my instinct aside if the right to live in peace is threatened and I will kill to maintain that right. I'm obliged too. Just like every other American.

ShockV1.89
02-13-2003, 11:10 PM
Well said, Mydnight.

Darth Slayne
02-14-2003, 12:47 AM
The only way you would catch me in an army uniform and slinging a gun, is if somebody was invading the land in which I live (in my case Australia). Yeah, it is said that maybe we wouldn't last all that long but hey, one more rifle may just make the diference. But far as going off to some sand fly infested country to shoot at some other poor fool who may well prefer to have stayed home as well: You can bloody well count me out!

ET Warrior
02-14-2003, 01:01 AM
I think, put in a situation where it was ABSOLUTELY 100% necessary that I kill to protect the lives of the people I know and love, then I could do it.

Remember, there is a debate on whether or not young children can separate movies/tv violence with real violence. I'm not saying ET Warrior is a young child, but it's good that he can make that distinction.

I'm 17, just for the record ;)

munik
02-14-2003, 10:36 PM
Originally posted by MysticSpade
i agree with ET very much so. i will not support anything that deals with the detruction of another human being in any way. meaning workin on planes that drops bombs or something like that.
Does that mean you will refuse to pay taxes as well?


To put one more nail in the coffin of this supposed draft, let me remind ya'll of a time about a decade ago. The gulf war had just finished, and the U.S. was doing a little something called "reduction of force". Basically, dropping extra servicemen so they can again meet the pre-war quotas.

"But wait Munik," you may ask, "How could there be more people in the military after the war then before it?". Simply put, people wanted to help the country in her time of need. Uncle Sam had a bunch of extra bdu's laying around, and was more then willing to accept all those qualified and desiring to enlist.

This all happened without a draft. It also happened in spite of "peaceniks". Someone, somewhere, is willing to accept his civic duty. In fact, he will also accept yours. You don't have to join the military. You can cry "conscientious objector", and another young gentlemen will glady step up and do your job, as well as his own. And you can sit at home and be sad about it all you want. Maybe you could watch cnn and catch a glimpse of the young man who went in your stead, and then be sad about that. 'Cause he sure as sh*t isn't sad for you.


P.S. Shock, we seem to agree on two things already. I hope this isn't becoming a trend, I would be loathe to know that my opinion does not cause conflict and strife with everyone. At the very least, I could hope to piss you off :)

MysticSpade
02-15-2003, 12:24 AM
naw i'll pay my taxes if i ever have a need to get a job (trustfund baby). but again if someone is more than willing to get shot in my place i will gladly let them go.

munik
02-15-2003, 09:59 AM
Dude, I would think that someone who is 19yrs old would actually know that there are more taxes then just the income tax. I guess using the phrase "trustfund baby" is half right in your case. Also, being in the service doesn't mean you are a bullet catcher. The last war the US had against Iraq only had a few hundred casualties.

obi
02-15-2003, 11:43 AM
Originally posted by munik
The last war the US had against Iraq only had a few hundred casualties.

Only had a few hundred casualties?

That remark makes me sick to my stomach. You make it seem like there is nothing lost.

Lives are lives, no matter how you look at it. Please don't talk like life is just some thing that can be handed out at will.

ShockV1.89
02-15-2003, 12:07 PM
He means that, compared to previous military conflicts, a few hundred deaths is pretty low. Thats not to say it's nothing that hundreds died, but compared to thousands, or hundreds of thousands, or millions killed in previous wars... it's not really terrible.

I think it was also in response to "I'm not going to war because I'm not going to die for anyone, and if I go I'll get shot." Not every single person who goes off to fight gets killed, and the US has proven themselves to be able to keep their people alive in Iraq (Vietnam was a learning experience, dont bring it up. Long time ago).

obi
02-15-2003, 12:12 PM
Ah, ok. From that point of view, it is a smaller number. I thought he meant that nothing was lost.


My misunderstanding. ;)

MysticSpade
02-15-2003, 01:49 PM
no i know that there are sales taxes and such. i'll pay those gladly. when i get a job i'll pay my income taxes. but i will not fight for a war that i have no part in.

icefox98
02-15-2003, 04:53 PM
Wow....okay.

Here's the facts:

A: The draft is NOT going to be re-instated.

B:War is the worst possible thing imaginable.

C:People who think War could be beneficial to them as an individual, or they think they would like it, are extremely, extremely, ignorant to War, and are obviously not that old, and haven't had much experience with real life endeavours.

D: The war with Iraq will mostly be fought with "Urban Warfare," in which there will be a 50 Percent casualty rate. (Fighting building to building, and that's US casualty rate by the way, which is extrememly high compared to any other war the US participated in, ever.)

Saying that, I would also like to say that I'm not pointing fingers or anything, and not saying being ignorant about War is being stupid... I'm just saying it's too bad people would think that being a grunt in the military during war-time would be a positive experience. 50 Percent casualty rate. Do you have any idea how high that is? It's not just something I made up, either. Look it up. Yes, the US will be bombing the hell out of Iraq, and whatnot, but where the War will be won is on the streets of Baghdad, and other large cities in Iraq. So far, all I have seen on this board is vague generalizations and stated opinions.....no facts to back anything up, just emotion, except for ET Warrior, who has been doing a good job arguing his case...(and got warned for that too, interestingly enough).

When arguing a case follow these basic guidelines:

1) Stated Opinion.

2)Facts.

3)Facts.

4)Facts.

5)Closing statement/opinion.


I could see why some people may say War would be okay, considering this IS a video game forum, and I would assume these people have seen a LOT of glorified violence, may it be in game, movies, TV, etc...but if they want to be a grunt in the Military, more power to them, they may (sadly) learn the hard way what happens in War.


The real hard way.

munik
02-16-2003, 01:41 AM
You really think it will be alot of city fighting? I figure maybe one, or two cities will have to be taken like that. But I don't see the U.S. occupying Iraq for any amount of time, so I don't believe the cities will have to be taken by force. Just the last one, the one where everyone holes up. I agree that the casualties are extremely high in urban warfare, but ever since the assualt on Hue city in Vietnam, the U.S. has worked on developing a sound battle strategy for urban warfare. I'd say the U.S. is much more prepared to take it to the streets then the Iraq armed forces are.

Oh, yes, war is bad. But while everyone will decry war, no one here will decry the spoils of it. Look at how fast MysticSpade backpedaled when I called him on it. Yes it sucks, but if someones gotta do it, wouldn't you want that someone to at least enjoy it?

Lunatic Jedi
02-16-2003, 05:24 AM
Frankly, I believe the draft borders on forced servitude. I don't know how it was even deemed constitutional in the first place.

SmartDragon
02-16-2003, 08:00 AM
so long as they don't enjoy it too much

Kain
02-18-2003, 12:01 AM
HOLLERING AT ALL AMERICAN CITIZENS ON THIS FORUM!!!

IF YOU DO NOT LIKE THE IDEA OF A DRAFT, MOVE!!
IF YOU DO NOT WANT TO MOVE, GET DRAFTED!!
WE WILL NOT NEED A DRAFT FOR A WAR WITH IRAQ!!!

It isn't a demand to be in the military. But all you peaceloving shmucks, take this into consideration...

Iraq has somehow destroyed our forces and is now deciding to invade our shores. Not to kill, but to take over.

Peacelovers : What do you do? All you're freedoms will be taken and you'll be forced into military service or you will be shot dead. What do you choose?

I know the military is volunteer, which is why it's so powerful. But if in the worst situation, you should be forced into military action, its more of a duty to serve that country and fight and *if need be* die for that country and for those YOU love to continue to have that freedom to be peaceful and not have to pick up a gun to go to war. Saying 'I won't go to war and be killed' is *to me atleast* a way of saying 'I'm spitting on all of those who have died so that I can say I won't join our military'.

Serve your country if you're needed. Do it with pride and honor, not disguist and loathing.

And about the life is a life dealy. Sure a lifes a life, but do you think thats what they thought when they crashed a plane into a skyscrapper full of human lives, just because they hate our way of life...our freedom to be aloud to hate whoever and whatever we want? Go to Iraq and say you hate that way of life in the middle of a town and see how far you get before you get gunned down. Go to New York and say you hate this way of life and see how many people choose to express their freedom to ignore you, or throw stones at you. Cuss out Suddam while he's speaking and see what it gets you. Say the exact same thing to Bush. Decide which result you like more...

ET Warrior
02-20-2003, 12:17 AM
Originally posted by MydnightPsion

And about the life is a life dealy. Sure a lifes a life, but do you think thats what they thought when they crashed a plane into a skyscrapper full of human lives,

So I should lower myself to their level? I'm sorry, I would serve my country in any way that did not involve me actually killing someone.