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[KOC]Qui-Zan
02-12-2003, 04:50 PM
I personally really hate bullies, they create misery. Speaking from personal expericence it isn't at all nice to be bullied. If you have ever (properly) bullied someone, then i pity you. Whats your opinion?

RoguePhotonic
02-12-2003, 04:57 PM
The way I see it if you are not willing to stand up for yourself then you are willing to be bullied...

[KOC]Qui-Zan
02-12-2003, 05:07 PM
Originally posted by RoguePhotonic
The way I see it if you are not willing to stand up for yourself then you are willing to be bullied...

Two questions: Ever been bullied? Ever Bullied?

RoguePhotonic
02-12-2003, 05:11 PM
Yeah I have been....and since he was twice my size I got a baseball bat:D

And no never bullied anyone....can't see the point.....

__CKY__
02-12-2003, 05:21 PM
Exactly if you are willing to let them bully you then maybe you should be picked on lol :D

Mandalorian54
02-12-2003, 05:27 PM
no bullying is not right, of course it's wrong.

I never really had a problem with bullying though. But my pastor did, he had like 20 escape routs from his school. but one day, he said to the bully that even if the bully punched him he would not hit him back because it was wrong. The bully punched him and when he didn't puch back they became friends. And that bully said if anyone ever hurt my pastor he would beat them up.

bullys just don't know how to express themselves, and they usually have abusive fathers.

RoguePhotonic
02-12-2003, 08:07 PM
Originally posted by __CKY__
Exactly if you are willing to let them bully you then maybe you should be picked on lol :D

You missed my point....I was getting bullied so I kicked his ass....if you do nothin then well....your fault..

ET Warrior
02-12-2003, 08:09 PM
Originally posted by RoguePhotonic
The way I see it if you are not willing to stand up for yourself then you are willing to be bullied...

That's a horrible thing to say. Bullying is wrong, no two ways about it. Nobody has the right to make another human being feel inferior or worthless just because they are different, or small, or "nerdy"

daring dueler
02-12-2003, 09:32 PM
i agree with rouguephotonic or whatever his name is. i think he makes a good point but ive been "bulied" not badly though but i do know what its like and i admit there is one kid whom i pik fun at and im not sure why, i call him glossy cuz hes shiny ,now im not a bully but its mean i must admit.im not sure why i do that but i am no bully i cant even make myself torment people . when i was bullied the most that happened was they called me gay chronicaly and finally i gave up fighting it and they stiopped i have never been beaten up or anthing, and i find my self sympathetic for those who are bullied but if all they do is whine about it , im not saying they deserve it noone does, but they are askin for it if they do nothin.

munik
02-12-2003, 09:34 PM
Yeah it's wrong, but it won't happen if you don't let it happen. This is a unique thing. People bully others because other people let them bully them. If you didn't let someone bully you, then you wouldn't be bullied. Simple as that. It's a mutual thing, to bully and to be bullied.

Best advice is grow a sac and do something about it.

Reborn Outcast
02-12-2003, 09:56 PM
Of course it right. Its good to weed out all the stupid meek and nerdy people and let only the strong survive... (I hope you caught the sarcasm.)

Of course bullying is wrong. But don't beat the bully up until you've tried settling it in others ways first such as talking to him/her or your boss or principle or whatever. If none of that works, beat him.

daring dueler
02-12-2003, 10:16 PM
we have a guidence councler were supposed to tell-plus they used to say get a group of frinds to confront him they can work but arnt as effective as a good ol' beat down:p

SkinWalker
02-13-2003, 12:50 AM
People who bully others are generally attempting to compensate for some loss of power somewhere else. Perhaps they have an abusive or neglecting parent. Perhaps they've always been last and discovered that they have a size advantage over small, more physically weak individuals.

These people only have physical power and lack intellectual power.

Or they may have emotional power over another, but still lack any sense of honor.

If one is being bullied, one may indeed encourage the behavior by not standing up for oneself. But, by no means, does this mean the bullying is acceptable.

Bully's are dishonorable slugs of humanity, but worthy of pity for the sadness in their lives.

Still..... I like to see a bully get his @ss kicked once in a while, too.

SkinWalker

ShadowTemplar
02-13-2003, 03:36 AM
Bullying is a complex problem:

1) You can't just kick the bully's arse, because then you'll have an angry parent fileing a police report in no time flat. And it doesn't matter how much bullying you've suffered; if you beat him up (even assuming that he doesn't gather all of his friends and take revenge) it's your butt that the cops will bust.

2) Many bullies are case-book psychos. You can't talk sense into them.

3) Gang-structures are almost impossible to break.

Conclusion: Prevent (by maintaining strict diciplin), because you can't cure.

Luc Solar
02-13-2003, 03:45 AM
That's like asking "is beating someone to death right or wrong"?

Of course it's not any less wrong even if you could do something about it.

Bullying is pathetic.

Personally I've never really been bullied (it's not like anyone could've beaten me up :D ), but I know people who have...and it can scar you for life.

Teachers should do something about it. And I mean REALLY do something about it. Bullying is something that would not exist if teachers did their job right. :mad:

Bring in humiliating punishments!
Isn't there some judge in the US who makes people do all sorts of stuff? --> walk around town carrying a big sign that sais: "I am a DRUNK DRIVER and a LITTLE GIRL almost got KILLED because of my actions! Please SPIT on me!

:D

ShadowTemplar
02-13-2003, 06:07 AM
Originally posted by Luc Solar
Teachers should do something about it. And I mean REALLY do something about it. Bullying is something that would not exist if teachers did their job right. :mad:

The lowest norm sets the standard. If the parents tell their kids that the teachers can kiss their hairy butts, then the kids won't respect the teachers... But way too often it's the teachers who teach the kids that they can behave any way they want and then those same teachers come crying to the parents... Talk about hypocracy.

Originally posted by Luc Solar
Bring in humiliating punishments!
Isn't there some judge in the US who makes people do all sorts of stuff? --> walk around town carrying a big sign that sais: "I am a DRUNK DRIVER and a LITTLE GIRL almost got KILLED because of my actions! Please SPIT on me!

That is just Dark Age... One of the benefits of living in a democracy is that that kind of punishment is taboo. And I will not give up the benefits of democracy because of bullies. They simply aren't worth it. Personally I'm more for containment: Simply keep the bullies on the school for a couple of hours longer than they otherwise were supposed to. This will serve as both protection and deterrent (because if they sit in the school until 5 o'clock in the afternoon then they can't get to work, and then they loose in pocketmoney.

FunClown
02-13-2003, 07:20 AM
I don't like bullying either. I've never really been bullied before since I always had really tough people who would be willing to defend me and I would do the same for them.

My school had 1800 students and basically everyone watched out for each other. If people were getting bullied you wouldn't just do nothing.

It was interesting actually, we sort of had unwritten pacts with the people near us. When me and a few friends were playing marbles one morning (I was in grade 11 :D ) these big grade 12'vers started throwing there football at us. We just kind of ignored them, but they kept doing it. However, the Yugoslavs who sat near us said if they did it again they would help us and the homies at the basketball courts said the same. So thats kind of how it worked, you watch out for each other. But any nazis at the school got no such help.

Here's a question. What happens when its the teachers making the threats?

EDIT: I would suggest those people making excuses for bullies and giving us the old sad story tell us why bullies are so justified? As opposed to making the same old 'poor me' excuses.

ShockV1.89
02-13-2003, 08:43 AM
Teachers should do something about it. And I mean REALLY do something about it. Bullying is something that would not exist if teachers did their job right.

Oh, I do things about it. My kids know that if I catch them bullying ANYBODY at ANY TIME, they will be punished beyond belief.

The problem is catching them. A lot of these kids are sneaky, and bully in ways that are either subtle and unseen by anyone but the bully (often in the halls between classes) and the recipient... or it's done in a way that doesnt, at first glance, seem like bullying. I can usually catch the second one (i know I liar when I see one), but the first one is tough.

I was bullied at an early age. I never really stood up for myself, and as a result, I went through a lot of rough years. I agree that kids should stand up to bullies. But it's very difficult to do when half the class decides that the "in-thing" to do is pick on this kid here. Asking a 9 yr old kid to stand up to 15 kids is pretty outrageous.

But now I cna give back a little. As a teacher who's experienced it, I can see it when it happens, and at least make my class a safe haven for the bullied.

ShadowTemplar
02-13-2003, 10:48 AM
Originally posted by ShockV1.89
But now I cna give back a little. As a teacher who's experienced it, I can see it when it happens, and at least make my class a safe haven for the bullied.

More power to you. But the saddest thing is that many teachers are loath to get off their fat butts to do something. And unless the school has a strong leadership, those who do something risk getting bullied by their collegues (I've seen this happen, so don't call me a conspiracy theorist).

Here's a question. What happens when its the teachers making the threats?

That's next to impossible to counteract.

EDIT: I would suggest those people making excuses for bullies and giving us the old sad story tell us why bullies are so justified? As opposed to making the same old 'poor me' excuses.


Soo right.

griff38
02-13-2003, 11:53 AM
They keep you on your toes!


Just kidding I hate bulles, I was bullied so bad in the 9th grade I failed a class. (1rst & last time) He was 22 and in the 9th grade (go figure), even the coaches and teachers got out of his way.

I eventually joined the Marines at 17 (go figure) and now I am BullysBane.:)

SkinWalker
02-13-2003, 12:02 PM
Bullies aren't just kids. A bully is anyone who abuses their power or authority over other people. Some people are minor bullies, some people are mega-bullies.

In my line of work I see both kids and adult bullies. The adults usually bully kids, but sometimes its other adults. I firmly believe that more than a few teachers are in their profession because of the power they can have over a less powerful group of people (students). They enjoy the feeling of creating, setting and enforcing rules as they see fit. They stick out becuase they are frequently unfair and inconsistent.

I've known, and know now, people who work with juveniles that will be extremely firm with the kids they know will respond with submission, but never say a word to the kids they know will respond with defiance. Unless, that is I, or some other, experienced staff member is around. If it's me, they're usually in for a disappointment. I'll support their observation of a rules violation, but they will still have to sort it out with that kid.

Power. Status. These concepts are universal with humans. Some people seek status in honorable ways, some try to take it. A dictator will rule a country with fear through execution and physical torture. A dictator can rule a classroom or a workplace with fear of expulsion and mental torture.

Standing up to a bully could mean acting professionally. Don't give reason for them to point out mistakes you can control. Standing up to physical bullies could mean self defense.

SkinWalker and his $.02 :cool:

Mandalorian54
02-13-2003, 05:28 PM
The way I see it if you are not willing to stand up for yourself then you are willing to be bullied...

dude this isn't the fiftys man. we don' t tell people that they brought it apon themselves when bad stuff happens to them.

bullying usually starts when kids are young, and you know kids, almost no disernment, they don't realize they are hurting other kids feelings. And at that age kids who get bullyed really can't defend themselves.

then they grow up to be pathetic nerdy wimps. It's a normal cycle of life it's not that hard to grasp.

RoguePhotonic
02-13-2003, 06:53 PM
Yeah not the fifty's...we have that new system of raising weak and pathetic people....people that cannot handle conflict...I kinda forgot about that.

ET Warrior
02-13-2003, 08:29 PM
Originally posted by RoguePhotonic
Yeah not the fifty's...we have that new system of raising weak and pathetic people....people that cannot handle conflict...I kinda forgot about that.

Right, make the kids defend themselves, it's good for the smallest kid in class to get the crap beat out of him so much when he's young that he has a ruined self-image and strong feeling of worthlessness. Heck, let's just let it continue all through school and maybe he'll end up feeling so horrible that he'll commit suicide! [/immense sarcasm]

I was actually never really bullied, but i still think that it's not up to the kids to handle bullying.

FunClown
02-14-2003, 12:32 AM
Yeah not the fifty's...we have that new system of raising weak and pathetic people....people that cannot handle conflict...I kinda forgot about that.

Feeling tough now?? :D

C'jais
02-14-2003, 09:07 AM
Originally posted by Mandolorian54
dude this isn't the fiftys man. we don' t tell people that they brought it apon themselves when bad stuff happens to them.

bullying usually starts when kids are young, and you know kids, almost no disernment, they don't realize they are hurting other kids feelings. And at that age kids who get bullyed really can't defend themselves.

then they grow up to be pathetic nerdy wimps. It's a normal cycle of life it's not that hard to grasp.

I find joy in the fact that we can finally agree on something, man ;)

Bullies lack empathy, or maybe just sympathy. Whatever it is they lack, they're too disgusting to behold.

Our society is running dry of good morals when bullies can bully as they see fit, and getting told it's wrong. Or get punished.

Bullying does not improve self-esteem, or hardens you in any way. It's no effort to overwhelm a lone person by numbers alone. It doesn't "harden" a person to get 7 people to beat him up. It doesn't harden you if I shoot you with a 9mm in your kneecaps.

munik
02-14-2003, 10:09 AM
I don't think bullying is all about physical violence. If someone kicks your ass on a consistent basis, and you do nothing, or can't do anything, about it, you are someones bitch. In which case any intervention by an adult or friends will only put off the inevitable.

Now, I think bullying is the use of physical threats, intimidation, and mental abuse. In the sense that I see this thread discussing, being children bullies in school. Yes, if some child is constantly harassed, I could understand intervention by a teacher. But mostly I think that a child should be left to handle it on their own. Not everyone is gonna grow up to be a well adjusted, affluent, succesful, popular person. Some people will grow up never being able to adjust or adapt to situations. Who are you to think that you need to right every wrong, to avenge every injustice?

I would advise and instruct my child on how to handle a situation with a bully, but only in extreme cases do I think I would intervene. Teaching self sufficiency would be more of a priority then protecting them from the negative side of reality.

I see people bullying people at work quite often. I don't do anything then, either. If someone asked for my help, I would, but to this date no one has ever asked. Do children ever ask for help in the case of a bully? None that I can remember from my childhood.

ShadowTemplar
02-14-2003, 12:48 PM
Originally posted by munik
But mostly I think that a child should be left to handle it on their own.

Sorry, it doesn't work that way. The problem is that the child can't handle it. If it could then the bullies wouldn't target it.

And please, anyone who has posted anything along these lines: 'Bullies have low self esteem, so you should feel sorry for the bully too', has obviously never seen the effects of bullying.

ShockV1.89
02-14-2003, 01:57 PM
Agreed, Munik (time to go play the lotto). Constant intervention on a teacher or parents part will do nothing but further alienate the abused student. Empowering said student should be the main goal. When the bully sees that this is not a student to mess with anymore, they usually go somewhere else. (note: this may or may not be the case with older kids. I work with grades 7 and under. Older kids may simply hold a grudge and work harder to make life miserable for the kid who stood up)

Sadly enough, this is often accomplished through physical violence, as it's the only thing that is going to get through to the bullying types. Trust me, I've sat them down and talked to them about the effects bullying can have, and how they're really, really hurting someone here. They tell me what they think I want to hear and leave, then do it again. I've seen kids try to talk to their bullys, asking them why they do what they do. They only receive more teasing.

Usually, the only time a bully learns his or her lesson is with a good left hook to the chin. Although I'll break up the fight, a big part of me is cheering on the kid who finally stood up for himself.

RoguePhotonic
02-14-2003, 02:03 PM
Originally posted by ET Warrior
Right, make the kids defend themselves, it's good for the smallest kid in class to get the crap beat out of him so much when he's young that he has a ruined self-image and strong feeling of worthlessness. Heck, let's just let it continue all through school and maybe he'll end up feeling so horrible that he'll commit suicide! [/immense sarcasm]

I was actually never really bullied, but i still think that it's not up to the kids to handle bullying.

I mean people should not fear anyone for any reason...even if it is the smallest kid in the class he should run over and start swingin at the bully....if he gets his ass kicked well...least he put up a fight...

The idea is to change the kids state of mind all together....

So much fear in our world....and for what?....

ShockV1.89
02-14-2003, 02:13 PM
Supposing he did get his ass kicked. Over and over and over. Do you think he would continue to run up and attack this bully?

Even monkeys can learn not to hit the button that gives you the electric shock...

RoguePhotonic
02-14-2003, 02:23 PM
Well when that happens you move to the next level and pick up a non lethal but still very good weapon:D

ET Warrior
02-14-2003, 06:04 PM
Non-lethal weapon such as.....?

A Baseball bat? Methinks that if a young kid were weilding a baseball bat against a bully and managed to knock him down, it's quite possible that the kid would be very unrational with said bat, and all the years of torment would come flooding out and bully would end up broken and bleeding, maybe even dead.

I don't think that kids should just tuck their heads down and recieve the torment from bullies, but many times there is nothing they can do against it. They will always be smaller and therefore will always be bullied unless someone else steps in to stop it.

So much fear in our world....and for what?....

So much fear is a direct result of the so much violence in the world. If all violence were answered with violence, humanity would make no progress, we would alway be fighting each other.....even more than we are right now.

Psydan
02-15-2003, 01:05 AM
*cough* Turn the other cheek *cough* Matthew 5 *cough*
But seriously what do we have all of those "monitors" and various other school staff out for? Aren't they the ones the little kids are suposed to tell if there is a bully? Oh, yeah, the majority doesn't want to get in trouble, so there is a negative implication to reporting bullying, "tattling" seems to always be an effective deterent from informing a teacher. I personally have seen two examples of bullying at my school this year, that turned into fights, and thankfully both times someone slipped passed a staff member and anonomously reported that they might want to go check out what's going on, and one kid was suspended, and another expelled. But, seriously, why be afraid of bullies? There is always a way out.

RoguePhotonic
02-15-2003, 03:22 AM
:rolleyes: I can't stand that in our world...the whole break up fights....used to be two people could go out and handle their business like men...now nope can't do ****....

I can see the future....the day legal age of becoming an adult is pushed up to like 25...

ShockV1.89
02-15-2003, 09:45 AM
How old are you? Do you even know anything about the world?

No, no, I'm not gonna continue, I'll say something I'll regret.

RoguePhotonic
02-15-2003, 12:22 PM
18...and I know to much about our world...that's the problem....knowing to much is a bad thing..:(

[KOC]Qui-Zan
02-15-2003, 03:08 PM
Originally posted by RoguePhotonic
I mean people should not fear anyone for any reason...even if it is the smallest kid in the class he should run over and start swingin at the bully....if he gets his ass kicked well...least he put up a fight...

The idea is to change the kids state of mind all together....

So much fear in our world....and for what?....

I'd really hate to meet you :mad:

And for those of you who think bullies just need to be comforted, this is my story:

When i was about 12 i used to go on the bus to and back from school, once in the morning and once in the evening, these journeys lasted about 40mins. Now i got on at one of the last stops and always had to sit next to this guy named craig because it was the only seat left. After about 3 days he started pushing me of the seat, onto the floor and i had to go stand up. Then he became friends with another kid on my bus (can't remember name) and the used to sit behind me and flick my ears, slap me round the face, hit me and throw their bags at me. I told my mum once and she complained to the school, but nothing was done. one day i was sat on the inside on the seat, next to craig when the other guy got on. There were no seats left so he had to sit on the end of our bench seat thing. They dicided they didn't want me to sit there so they treatened to put yogurt in my face if i didn't move. I said "NO" and they then covered my face in yogurt as i tried to stop them, but couldn't. Then they BOTH pushed me against the side of the bus and i couln't breathe (i'm asmatic [sp?]) and they did this until i started crying (it really hurt that much)

Now you tell me RoguePhotonic about why people should be bullied? :mad:

ShadowTemplar
02-15-2003, 07:39 PM
Originally posted by [KOC]Qui-Zan
Now you tell me RoguePhotonic about why people should be bullied? :mad:

Yeah, I'd like to hear that too. To me it sounds like social darwinism, which I do not support.

But seriously what do we have all of those "monitors" and various other school staff out for?

Yeah, I've been asking myself that same question for the last 10 yrs.

Oh, and ditch that bible stuff. Like someone said once: "I very much support this "turn the other cheek" stuff, but I only have two cheeks".

I ran out of cheeks a long time ago, and those I have left I save for those whom I find worthy of them. Bullies don't fit in that cathegory.

ET Warrior
02-15-2003, 08:00 PM
Originally posted by RoguePhotonic
:rolleyes: I can't stand that in our world...the whole break up fights....used to be two people could go out and handle their business like men...now nope can't do ****....

Yes, violence is the answer to our problems

munik
02-16-2003, 01:26 AM
Qui-Zan, that is an unfortunate situation. So, how was it resolved? Did you do something, or did someone intervene? How would someone be able to intervene and help you in that situation?

I too had one incident when I was younger with a group of bullies. Me being a few grades lower then them, they picked on me. Then one day I did something about it. All I needed was the balls to do it, and in fact afterwards my confidence was higher then before. I alone averted those thugs, and from my action they ceased to harass me. And I feel I'm a better man today because of it.

ET Warrior
02-16-2003, 02:09 AM
When i was in kindergarted in got picked on, and my parents told me that i should stand up for myself. So one day i knocked the bully down and sat on him. (I was actually pretty chunky back them.....i'm now very scrawny....go figure) But after that he never picked on me......but i dont think that changed my life that much...........I was actually pretty upset about the whole thing, because i had to go stand by the wall for recess......very sad.

ShockV1.89
02-16-2003, 11:39 AM
I was actually pretty upset about the whole thing, because i had to go stand by the wall for recess......very sad.

Now that will ruin a kid for life! You poor, poor boy... :D ;)

Luc Solar
02-16-2003, 04:16 PM
I'd just like to say one thing about this whole "stand up for yourself"-stuff.

As a rule the bully is twice the size of the bullee (Bullee? Is that a word?? :D)

The bully has 10 guys backing him up, the bullee has no-one.

Who the hell stands up to that? If you can stand up for yourself then usually you won't be the one who gets bullied (for Real, that is).
I've been 175cm and 65kg (=not a big guy) for the last 10 years and I've never been bullied. Why? >> Because everyone knew that I'd practised martial arts before I went to school. I did something "special" one time when I was ~8 years old and that's it; no bullying, ever.

My point is:
You think the bully wants "a fair fight"? You think he/they look for someone who is equal to them physically and mentally? You think they want to risk their "Tough-Guy"-rep by challenging someone who has the slightest chance of beating them in any way?

Well, do you...PUNK?

Hahahaha... ahem..sorry. Couldn't resist. :D

ShockV1.89
02-16-2003, 04:52 PM
You think the bully wants "a fair fight"? You think he/they look for someone who is equal to them physically and mentally? You think they want to risk their "Tough-Guy"-rep by challenging someone who has the slightest chance of beating them in any way?

But the bully often doesnt want to risk even the chance of being defeated. So he wont threaten someone who he perceives as a threat. Clocking the bully shows him that you're not going to lie down and take it anymore, and since the bully had a little bit come back at him, he's not likely to pick on that kid anymore...

But I agree it's not that simple. You might hit the bully, but then his ten friends might hold you down and he pummels you. Who wants to mess with that?

Psydan
02-16-2003, 10:09 PM
Originally posted by ShadowTemplar
Oh, and ditch that bible stuff. Like someone said once: "I very much support this "turn the other cheek" stuff, but I only have two cheeks".

I ran out of cheeks a long time ago, and those I have left I save for those whom I find worthy of them. Bullies don't fit in that cathegory.

Well, If you read that passage (Matt. 5) through, it says:
44. But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;
45. That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust.

And Romans 12:19 says:
19 Dearly beloved, avenge not yourselves, but rather give place unto wrath: for it is written, Vengeance is mine; I will repay, saith the Lord.

So, yah....I kinda disagree that you have to fight back, but if you don't follow the Bible, I guess you could argue otherwise...

FunClown
02-17-2003, 08:09 AM
Usually, the only time a bully learns his or her lesson is with a good left hook to the chin.

I did that once literally.

One morning in grade 7 a guy came up to me and slapped me on the face hard. Since he knew I was a pacifist and I wouldn't do anything back he slapped me again and laughed at me saying I wouldn't do anything back to him. This went on with him slapping me around seven times and finally out of the blue I grabbed him kneed him in the chest then gave him an uppercut with my left hand in the chin. Just like the quote above. He was knocked to the ground and his face was all red.

I must say it felt good for a few seconds. I can still remember the sound my fist made on contact. It was like dropping a block of steel on another block of stell like a thumping sound. Definitely different to the sound on the movies lol. He didn't bother me again after that.

Does that make me a bad Christian??? :confused:

ET Warrior
02-17-2003, 02:39 PM
Originally posted by FunClown
Does that make me a bad Christian??? :confused:

I dont think so. To simply sand there and allow yourself to be abused like that is wrong. You must be willing to fight back when necessary.

RoguePhotonic
02-18-2003, 03:15 PM
I never said anyone should be bullied...only that they should do something themself without help from anyone else....

In the end it will make you a better person if you handle it yourself....

ET Warrior
02-18-2003, 07:42 PM
Originally posted by RoguePhotonic
I never said anyone should be bullied...only that they should do something themself without help from anyone else....

In the end it will make you a better person if you handle it yourself....

Only if you manage to do it without getting the crap beat out of you.....getting beat up kinda makes you feel bad.......

Reborn Outcast
02-18-2003, 07:59 PM
Originally posted by RoguePhotonic
I never said anyone should be bullied...only that they should do something themself without help from anyone else....

So you recommend violence and that the bully should fight the weaker person "like men". :rolleyes: Thats not right. I agree that the person being bullied should stand up for themself and throw a punch maybe BUT ONLY AS A LAST RESORT AND IF NOTHING ELSE HAS WORKED.

RoguePhotonic
02-18-2003, 10:35 PM
Discussions and issues like this make me really like the world of about 150 years ago...getting bullied?..shoot the ****...and wont get arrested...

ET Warrior
02-18-2003, 11:28 PM
Originally posted by RoguePhotonic
Discussions and issues like this make me really like the world of about 150 years ago...getting bullied?..shoot the ****...and wont get arrested...

Yeah....right.....kill em......that's a good idea......*runs from RP*

RoguePhotonic
02-19-2003, 12:22 AM
:duel2: COME BACK HERE!!!!!

RpTheHotrod
02-19-2003, 12:48 AM
Problem about bullies is, they can beat up on you, but if you try to defend yourself, you get suspended from school due to starting a fight.


Luckily, I'm in college and np there. If there are bullies, they get shot.

Reborn Outcast
02-19-2003, 12:42 PM
Originally posted by RoguePhotonic
Discussions and issues like this make me really like the world of about 150 years ago...getting bullied?..shoot the ****...and wont get arrested...

Ya ok so now killing people is a good idea, better than just hitting him right?... You're pretty sick minded in thinking these things.

RoguePhotonic
02-19-2003, 02:37 PM
:rolleyes: Fine shoot em in the leg....whatever works.....

Reborn Outcast
02-19-2003, 03:02 PM
Originally posted by RoguePhotonic
:rolleyes: Fine shoot em in the leg....whatever works.....

You have the wrong idea about society these days... :tsk: :disaprove

RoguePhotonic
02-19-2003, 05:08 PM
Fine go hide behind other people.....like I said...the system is made to make weak people....

I think it's a conspiracy...then one day they can take away all your rights and everyone will be to weak and pathetic to fight..

as for me:
:mob:

:p

ShockV1.89
02-20-2003, 06:26 AM
Yup, it's a conspiracy. People woke up one morning and decided "Hey, I'm gonna make people weak so they wont fight anymore. Sure, it'll take generations to do, and I'll be dead by the time it works, but it sure sounds like fun."

What are you, stoned?

ShadowTemplar
02-20-2003, 08:29 AM
Originally posted by ShockV1.89
Clocking the bully shows him that you're not going to lie down and take it anymore, and since the bully had a little bit come back at him, he's not likely to pick on that kid anymore...

Unfortunately not. Bully groups develop very, very sick codes of honour. If you had the indecency to down one of them, or even talk back to them, then it gets ten times worse, unless you actually have a chance of beating them. Such groups have a sixth sense of whether you are just boasting, and their structure, frankly, reminds me of a mafia group, and I think that they should be treated accordingly.

The problem with this whole "stand up for yourself" show is that you are damned if you do and damned if you don't. If you do, then the bully group develops a grudge, and are all the more nasty to you, but if you don't then you have marked yourself out as an easy target.

Well, If you read that passage (Matt. 5) through, it says:
44. But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;
45. That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust.

I actually have read that whole passage (I am currently reading the New Testament (just to know what is in this oh-so-precious book that people are willing to commit genocide over)).

And, basically, he outlines the rules of pacifism. But the problem with pacifism is that it's so damn one sided. And there is a limit to what you can take. At some point you will break. Trust me, you will.

So, yah....I kinda disagree that you have to fight back, but if you don't follow the Bible, I guess you could argue otherwise...

Depends on your definition of "fighting back". If you are talking about vigilante, then I agree that it is wrong. It destabilises society, and is, frankly, somewhat Wild West like. But I will do whatever I can, and I will pull on what limited resources that I have, within the rules of the situation, to make my bully's life miserable until he stops bullying me.

Since he knew I was a pacifist and I wouldn't do anything back he slapped me again and laughed at me saying I wouldn't do anything back to him.

That has been my problem too. I didn't do that, however. Partially because I'd get my ass kicked if I did and partially because I'd have an angry police officer standing outside my door faster than you can say "vigilante".

I work inside the system. This means that I have to stay on good terms with it. And the fact that I find it immoral to break laws (manmade, mind, I don't care about the godgiven ones) also contributes.

Discussions and issues like this make me really like the world of about 150 years ago...getting bullied?..shoot the ****...and wont get arrested...

That kind of society would actually make bullying much more differcult to handle. Believe me, I've seen both structures that are well-organised and where laws are enforced, and structures that were fairly anarchic. The organised ones were the best for the bullied.

RoguePhotonic
02-20-2003, 01:03 PM
What are you, stoned?


Naw I just analyze all aspects of this society and I have to wonder.

ShockV1.89
02-20-2003, 01:35 PM
Dude, you havent been around long enough to have analyzed all aspects of society. Hell, most people on this board havent (including me). I find it amusing how you seem to believe your opinion to be the end-all facts.

RoguePhotonic
02-20-2003, 03:09 PM
I never said that it was a fact......it's a fact that the system makes people weak....but was just thinking why.....

And what do you mean haven't been around long enough....only what's happening right now matters...not once apawn a time....

Reborn Outcast
02-20-2003, 03:26 PM
Originally posted by RoguePhotonic
IAnd what do you mean haven't been around long enough....only what's happening right now matters...not once apawn a time....

If someone shot and killed your mom 1 year ago... it doesn't matter that they did it now? 9/11 doesn't matter anymore?

RoguePhotonic
02-20-2003, 10:24 PM
hmm...when I think about it nope it doesn't matter...like 9/11 and stuff....because it happened in the past so **** it eh......

ShockV1.89
02-20-2003, 10:37 PM
Originally posted by RoguePhotonic
hmm...when I think about it nope it doesn't matter...like 9/11 and stuff....because it happened in the past so **** it eh......

*sigh* I give up... :disaprove :disaprove

FunClown
02-20-2003, 10:42 PM
The events of September 11, 2001, still do affect many people including the soldiers in Afghanistan their friends and families and the people of Afghanistan.

Maybe it doesn't affect you directly Rogue, but I would say it would affect many people who you don't know even today.

Whats with the tough guy attitude? Mercy is a sign of strength rather than weakness in my opinion.

RoguePhotonic
02-21-2003, 01:00 AM
Originally posted by ShockV1.89
*sigh* I give up... :disaprove :disaprove

lol me to...one thing I have learned about people is it's futile to try and get any sort of point through what so ever....though I don't even remember what the first point was:confused:


Sure it effects people but if it doesn't effect you than who gives a **** is the way I see it....

FunClown
02-21-2003, 05:13 AM
You make a good case Rogue. Who here remembers the explosion of a fuel plant in Nigeria that killed 3000-3500 people and occured a couple of weeks after September 11, 2001?

I didn't hear about any memorial the following year or anything for those people. Noone seemed to have cared.

Looks like you have the majority Rogue.

ShockV1.89
02-21-2003, 05:26 AM
Actually, I remember that. But there was no memorial here in the states because, quite frankly, it wasnt our people.

The argument isnt whether or not people DO pay attention to the past... (they clearly dont). The argument is whether or not they should. The basic purpose of history is to learn from our past so we dont make the same mistakes in the future. If we know about the history of a country, we are better equipped to make decisions regarding that country.

FunClown
02-21-2003, 10:31 PM
I wouldn't suggest the US have a memorial for the 3000-3500 people killed in Nigeria a couple of weeks after 11/9/01.

I was pointing out how noone really cares about it because it doens't affect them. We didn't get any memorial live a year on like September 11, 2001, nor did anything get said about it. It was on once and that was that.

That's why I was saying Rogue is in the majority. Whether you guys like it or not.

Reborn Outcast
02-21-2003, 11:33 PM
Ah Fun Clown if something bad happened to you or your family, 2 years later it wouldn't matter if you didn't have a mom... ok then.

RoguePhotonic
02-22-2003, 12:08 AM
I think your mom being killed would have something to do with you...does it matter to anyone else?...nope...

Reborn Outcast
02-22-2003, 12:55 AM
Originally posted by RoguePhotonic
I think your mom being killed would have something to do with you...does it matter to anyone else?...nope...

You're missing the whole point. You said

And what do you mean haven't been around long enough....only what's happening right now matters...not once apawn a time....

I say thats wrong. As an old saying goes, "Those who choose to ignore history, usually repeat it."

Ok you want something that will affect other people? Lets say you hear part of a conversation between two people and something is mentioned that catches your ear but you think nothing of it. Later (a week or so), a terror alert is announced because of a nuclear weapon illegally inside the country. You realize that you know where it is by overhearing that conversation. If you choose to ignore it, millions will die. If you choose not to and tell the government, everyone will be safe and you will be a national hero. Would you ignore it because it was in the past?


(I hope you see the point I'm trying to make.)

FunClown
02-22-2003, 01:22 AM
Reborn, it would matter to me, not to you. Thats what I'm getting at.

I'm in agreeance with Rogue

RoguePhotonic
02-22-2003, 04:23 AM
Yes I would ignore it....for allot of reasons....and I doubt if you told the government about it that would stop it.....you would probably be killed....but that's a different story :p

Lost Welshman
02-22-2003, 09:36 AM
This is a stupid title for a thread, but good topic.
Bullies are wrong, how could it possible be write to crush someones feeling, make them afraid or what ever it is they feel.

I hate it when people just pick their targets at random, like my friend. This person goes up to him and started making fun of him when all his freinds were around. My freind just spoke back in a calm tone, (this bully guy was a druggie) and then he pushed my friend and turned to laugh with his friends, when he turned back my friends fits went straight to his head, and shocked him for a bit. The next thing I knew they were down the back, There was a huge crowd and I was really worried, but he came out ok.


P.S. Im Invisible, so I gather anyway. Watch.