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View Full Version : Vader more powerful than Yoda?!


Katarn07
02-12-2003, 06:38 PM
Yup. I got to thinking and I think he is.

Anakin in AotC says he will learn to stop people from dying. He demonstrates that power on the old, decrepit Palpatine and even on himself. I mean, he was thrown into lava and is more machine than man!

Luke says to Yoda in RotJ that Yoda can't die. Yoda responds he is strong in the Force, but not that strong.

Vader's got the power. Yoda doesn't.

To answer Luke's question about the Darkside being stronger: Yes, yes it is.

Your thoughts?

JediNyt
02-12-2003, 07:57 PM
Interesting theory. I dont know. We will find out. But if that is true then Luke would have to be more powerful than Yoda. Throughout Ep5 and 6 it shows pretty clearly that Luke is not above Yoda in any way.

wassup
02-12-2003, 10:00 PM
Anakin has a midichlorian count of 20,000. I read somewhere that Yoda has a midi count of 18,000. So, technically, from the statistics, Anakin is stronger than Yoda...

Boba Rhett
02-12-2003, 10:03 PM
Oh yes, he definitely has the potential to be much more powerful but as to wether he ever became moreso, I don't know. Maybe he did. I'd like to think he did.

Fraydenz
02-13-2003, 12:34 AM
Originally posted by Katarn07
He demonstrates that power on the old, decrepit Palpatine and even on himself. I mean, he was thrown into lava and is more machine than man!

He was thrown in lava? So thats how he got that way. Was that ever in a Starwars novel? If so I would love to read it, or about it...

Anyway, I always figured Palpatine was more powerful than any of them, otherwise why would Vader serve him? Plus Yoda never knew what was up with Palpatine until it was too late - just my thoughts, not actually backed up with any facts other than what you see watching the movies. :)

Devil Doll
02-13-2003, 01:09 AM
in ep2 mace windu said anakin was the one who the profecies said, that he´s a very powerful jedi.

it doesn´t mean he know how to use the force at all, maybe he is the most powerful character (remembering the midichlorian count ) but he never knew how to act and how to use the force

Lynk Former
02-13-2003, 01:16 AM
Originally posted by Devil Doll
midichlorian count

Damn that stupid midchlorian crap... the force a mystical energy field reduced to some tiny microscopic lil critters... unk

Boba Rhett
02-13-2003, 01:24 AM
Wait, the force still is a mystical energy, aint it? The Medichlorians are just and indicator of how attuned someone is, right?

JediNyt
02-13-2003, 04:29 AM
Originally posted by Boba Rhett
Wait, the force still is a mystical energy, aint it? The Medichlorians are just and indicator of how attuned someone is, right? Right. Thats how they select infants to be padawans, by their midiclorian count.

leXX
02-13-2003, 05:14 AM
Then if power is judged by Medichlorians, Anakin is more powerful but I don't think you can judge power by that. I think it is who saves the universe or takes over the universe to be the most powerful and both Yoda and Anakin had a part to play in that. Ultimately is was Anakin who brought balance to the force, therefore I consider him the more powerful one.

Clemme w/Stick
02-13-2003, 09:58 AM
Originally posted by leXX
Then if power is judged by Medichlorians, Anakin is more powerful but I don't think you can judge power by that. I think it is who saves the universe or takes over the universe to be the most powerful and both Yoda and Anakin had a part to play in that. Ultimately is was Anakin who brought balance to the force, therefore I consider him the more powerful one.

Yeah, that sounds logical. Hmm, I dont really have a theory, but I think that Anakin is stronger than Yoda (Physically), but on a mental plan Yoda is stronger.

-Clemme

Wraith 8
02-13-2003, 02:25 PM
Its not the size thatc ounts... its how you use it :p :p
*runs*

C Shutt
02-13-2003, 03:17 PM
Originally posted by wassup
Anakin has a midichlorian count of 20,000. I read somewhere that Yoda has a midi count of 18,000. So, technically, from the statistics, Anakin is stronger than Yoda...

Bah. "Midichlorians". Bollocks, more like.

Katarn07
02-13-2003, 03:59 PM
Originally posted by Fraydenz
He was thrown in lava? So thats how he got that way. Was that ever in a Starwars novel? If so I would love to read it, or about it...

Anyway, I always figured Palpatine was more powerful than any of them, otherwise why would Vader serve him? Plus Yoda never knew what was up with Palpatine until it was too late - just my thoughts, not actually backed up with any facts other than what you see watching the movies.

You sound as if I was referring to Palpatine. I was actually referring to Anakin/ Vader. I am sure it is in the RotJ novelization and they do go into graphic detail about it. Obi-Wan tells Luke about it on Dagobah after Yoda's passing... But then again, the novels say Owen Lars is Obi-Wan's brother....

But if GL doesn't add this scene into EPIII, the battle between master and apprentice near lava, I will be so pissed and hate the PT. Everything is buliding up to the one we all wanna see!

Oh, and midichlorian count just measures your potentila of using the Force... Just because I one has more than another, it doesn't neccesarily make them stronger.

Hence the mystical ways and training that makes Jedi and the Force so cool.

But I am talking physical strength and use of the Force.

Darth Zaius
02-13-2003, 04:06 PM
Im going to have to agree with you Katarn07 the Darkside is stronger, it rocks and how!!! so I suggest to all of you on this forum to join the darkside or else you shall be destroyed

Katarn07
02-13-2003, 04:12 PM
Originally posted by Darth Zaius
Im going to have to agree with you Katarn07 the Darkside is stronger, it rocks and how!!! so I suggest to all of you on this forum to join the darkside or else you shall be destroyed

Nah. I'm a Jedi guy myself. Join the Darkside, kill bunch of people's, die at a young age like Vader and Maul. Or worse, live to be a weak, old man like Palpatine who probably has Physical Therapists and the sort visiting him! Well, maybe not. He's got the Force...

Darth Zaius
02-13-2003, 04:18 PM
well hey its not my problem that vader and maul screwed up a bit (that eventually killed them) when they were fighting and that Palpie stopped using his body and abused it by rejecting opinions or suggestions from his chiropractor and physical therapist:p

you see I take my decisions, strategy and health wisely.

Reb Starblazer
02-13-2003, 04:47 PM
Anakin had a midichlorian count of around 20, 000 or more at the age of 10. Yet, he hardly had a clue as to what the Force even was, let alone how to use it. Midichlorians show someone's connection to the Force, and the extent of their ability to tap into it, nothing more. Without training, Anakin would have still had a midichlorian count of 20, 000 making him extremely powerful, but without an idea of how to use that power, the point is moot. Power is useless without the ability to control it. Was Anakin more powerful than Yoda? He had the potential to be for sure, but Yoda had about 800+ years of Force use on him, Yoda was highly trained and lived his life to serve the Force. Anakin however, was arrogant, prone to anger, thought his training was pointless and repetitive, and that probably made him "weaker" in a sense than Yoda. He didn't have the commitment to the Force Yoda did.


And a bit off topic: A lot of people think that Midichlorians are the dumbest thing ever added to the movie, saying it detracts from the mystical idea of the Force. But the mystical side is still there, it's still an energy field created by all life that flows through us, binds us blah, blah blah, yoda, yoda, yoda. Midichlorians secondary purposes in the movies are to show Force "strengths", and so that Jedi can find potentials. But they are mostly there as a limiting factor, to show that only certain people can be Jedi, only people with enough Midichlorians actually. A lot of people used to think that anyone in the SW Galaxy could be a Jedi, that all they have to do is learn to tap into the Force and presto, you're a friggen Jedi. By introducing MC's, George Lucas showed that not everyone could be a Jedi, only a select few. What, 10,000 or so in a Galaxy of hundreds of Trillions of lifeforms?

teutonicknight
02-13-2003, 06:56 PM
Originally posted by Reb Starblazer
Anakin had a midichlorian count of around 20, 000 or more at the age of 10. Yet, he hardly had a clue as to what the Force even was, let alone how to use it. Midichlorians show someone's connection to the Force, and the extent of their ability to tap into it, nothing more. Without training, Anakin would have still had a midichlorian count of 20, 000 making him extremely powerful, but without an idea of how to use that power, the point is moot. Power is useless without the ability to control it. Was Anakin more powerful than Yoda? He had the potential to be for sure, but Yoda had about 800+ years of Force use on him, Yoda was highly trained and lived his life to serve the Force. Anakin however, was arrogant, prone to anger, thought his training was pointless and repetitive, and that probably made him "weaker" in a sense than Yoda. He didn't have the commitment to the Force Yoda did.

:)

ZBomber
02-13-2003, 08:38 PM
Well, we know the Dark Side is more powerful. They can just use lightning, and everyones dead. :p
Good Theory thoguh, Katarn. ;)

Katarn07
02-13-2003, 09:22 PM
OK.

Maybe I should not have brought the Darkside into this. It is stronger, but in the long run no good. We all know that...

But Vader and Yoda as people, who is better? And if you all say Vader (lots do) then you're saying Luke is better than Yoda. Luke could have killed Vader than and there in RotJ after cutting his hand off, so ha!

boinga1
02-13-2003, 09:36 PM
if vader was about, oh 900 years old like :yoda:, sure, but after 900 years-about 18 times vader's life-flat NO WAY NO HOW. vader has the potential to be more pwerful, but i think the machine stunted his force. it could have, really. more midichlorians=more force, right? but since he is LESS ALIVE because he's so machine, then he would have less midis, no? and therefore less force. course :yoda: 's tiny anyway :)

Fraydenz
02-14-2003, 05:04 AM
Thanks, Katarn - I never did read the novels of the original trilogy - it seems I missed out by not reading them. Now I will be sure to go get them. :)

PS: I know you weren't referring to Palpatine - sorry to bring him up - I just kinda threw him in there because he always seemed to me (tho it's entirely possible I am wrong) to be the baddest of the bad, as far as force power goes...

Lynk Former
02-14-2003, 05:17 AM
Originally posted by Wraith 8
Its not the size thatc ounts... its how you use it :p :p
*runs*

That was uber lame of you Wraithy :p

Purple_Tentacle
02-14-2003, 07:10 AM
Originally posted by Katarn07
Or worse, live to be a weak, old man like Palpatine who probably has Physical Therapists and the sort visiting him!

yeah, he picks up but.

;)

Devil Doll
02-16-2003, 01:18 AM
Originally posted by Wraith 8
Its not the size thatc ounts... its how you use it :p :p
*runs*

I was going to say something about that, but as the little and cute girl I am I will not say anything :xp:

*deleting lines in her old siggys

Wraith 8
02-16-2003, 08:53 AM
thank you lynk and DD :p
*runs*

Lynk Former
02-16-2003, 09:13 PM
He likes to run doesn't he...