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View Full Version : Kyle - are you gonna miss him?


Darklighter
04-05-2003, 09:38 AM
So? Do you think JK3 will be better without Kyle Katarn, or was his role too important to give up, do you think?

leXX
04-05-2003, 09:44 AM
I won't miss him at all. It's time for new blood.

obi
04-05-2003, 09:54 AM
Seeing how Dark Forces series is *about* Kyle, Jedi Academy shouldn't even be called "Jedi Knight III."

Of course i'm goin to miss the ol chap. He was the main character!

boinga1
04-05-2003, 10:46 AM
another one of these? sure, i guess i will.

Agen
04-05-2003, 10:52 AM
Yep, i will.
Got pretty used to him.

HertogJan
04-05-2003, 11:21 AM
Haha, it's great that you included the exact thing I was thinking in your poll: the beard was getting on my nerves :D

I don't really hate Kyle, and he's an interesting character, falling to the dark side and all, but I hate the beard and his clothes. I want Jedi robes!!

And I like the 'create your character'-feature :)

DeTRiTiC-iQ
04-05-2003, 11:32 AM
taking the game in a new direction is probably a good idea, not sure if i'll miss Kyle or not.

Spider AL
04-05-2003, 11:35 AM
I won't miss Kyle for the simple reason that even if they never make another game with him in it, I'll make a Single-Player campaign that continues his story. I've had a few interesting ideas over the years about how to kill him off in a heroic manner. :) Don't get me wrong, I think Kyle's great. And every great hero deserves a hero's death.

Katarn07
04-05-2003, 11:41 AM
GOOD RISANCE TO BAD RUBBISH! I AM FED UP WITH THAT LOSER...






























j/k, must I post my thoughts? I'm just glad he'll play an important role in the game. I read that somewhere... I hope it's true.

The_One
04-05-2003, 12:18 PM
I'll miss him. Let's just hope he's back for JKIII, if they ever make it...

Hekx
04-05-2003, 12:23 PM
I won't miss being him, that much. :D

I suppose he was cool. It would be nice to see him as an active NPC at the Temple and on missions.

Let's hope his hair's less grey. ;)

Wacky_Baccy
04-05-2003, 01:03 PM
Of course I'll miss him :(

But I realise he's getting 'old', so it's time for a new direction... Not without him at all, just not with him as the main character, which is what JA has done :)

It would be nice to have th DF series continue directly, perhaps with us taking on the role of Kyle and Jan's kid(s)... Keeping it the family, so to speak :p :D

I just hope they don't forget about him after JA...

AJL
04-05-2003, 01:12 PM
Hmm... I have understand that this JEDI ACADEMY is not JK3 and
that Kyle is going to be the character in JK3 if/when it comes...

Am I wrong ??

HertogJan
04-05-2003, 01:17 PM
Well, the new game's called:

Jedi Knight: Jedi Academy

So it's not a real JKIII. The developers thought that a game without Kyle isn't really a Dark Forces sequel!


I hope Kyle is going to die in JA, a very heroic death. And then you, as a padawan, you must avenge him in the most horrible way... MWUAHAHAHHAAA!!! Let the blood of your enemies flow... MWUAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAA!!!

Anywayz, I'd like to see that happening ;)

SettingShadow
04-05-2003, 02:19 PM
Well, I've never been a real Kyle fan, but I guess he's cool. In DF I really liked him. I've only played the Demo for JK (didnt even finnish that, brrrrr, too hard) but from what I've seen he seems to been pretty cool...

In JO though, I must say he's boring, I dunno why but theres something I dont like with him. Wait I know, AHHH THOSE CLOTHES THOSE HORRIIIIIIIIIBLE CLOTHES!!!!! ;)

All in all... I dunno, I really like the idea to create you own character, though it wont feel like a game of the DF series really (bah, I've only played 2 anyway).

Silent_Thunder
04-05-2003, 02:23 PM
I think Jedi Knight: Jedi Academy is fine without Kyle.

But I also think that it would be a major mistake not to focus on Kye for all of the Dark Forces series (Am I the only one that thinks that Dark Forces III: Jedi Outcast sounds better then Jedi Knight II: Jedi Outcast? Too many jedis!).

In my opinion focusing on and playing as a child of Kyle and Jan would be really lame, to put it bluntly. But I have a sneaking suspicion that that's where we're heading for JKIII... I just hope I'm wrong.

But on the other hand, I think that the character of Kyle Katarn was unrepairably ruined in JKII. Not that the ENTIRE character of Kyle was destroyed, but what was destroyed can't be gained back, I believe. Now some people like the character progression in JKII, that's fine. But I think it really wussified Kyle's character, and damaged the possibilities for sequals.

First of all, why did they have the Valley of the Jedi invaded?? In Jedi Knight they made it seem like the person who got to the Valley of the Jedi would have the power of a "Super-Nova, within a whisp could be within his power". Now, not only do they have Desann actually GO to the Valley of the Jedi and have an unspecified ammount of time their, but they also have thousands of troops get "reborn in the glory of the force", AND Kyle uses it like nothing... Didn't he listen to Rhan at all?

But the main thing I dislike about Kyle's character is how close he seems to be working with the Republic. Yeah, he did the same in MotS, but for some reason he still seemed to have a bit of a gruff mercenary attitude intact. In JKII he seemed too much of just another one of the Alliances' heros. In Dark Forces he was just a mercenary for hire. In Jedi Knight he was just an 'content old man' in a bar trying to forget the past who happens to stumble along a fateful journey. It seems Jan also left the New Republic too, after the Empires' defeat. He went through the whole game without any interaction with the Republic. Now in JK II he's good friends with Lando (?) and even Luke! I'm surprised they didn't add Han Solo, Boba Fett, Chewie, Leia, and the rest of the gang too while they were at it.

Aynways, I got alittle side tracked... I mean to say that, I think Kyle's character may be too ruined to salvage for another true Kyle sequal... Maybe if a real JKII isn't made by Raven, but Lucas Arts they might be able to pull it off (no offense to Raven, but they just can't seem to do Star Wars as good as LEC in my opinion!).

nova_wolf
04-05-2003, 02:32 PM
He was a real lovable scoundrel - Han if he turned out to be Force sensitive.

He'll be missed, but I am sure that his wisdom and guidance (and hopefully quips) will be with us all the way.

Besides, he has saved the galaxy enough now to have earnt some major holiday time away with Jan, just the two of them... ;)

ryudom
04-05-2003, 02:51 PM
yeah, i won't really miss the JO kyle heh, but the JK kyle, well thats a differant story. i like character customization as well. :D

RabidPanda
04-05-2003, 04:53 PM
I hated that Mother ****er

The_One
04-05-2003, 05:43 PM
Originally posted by RabidPanda
I hated that Mother ****er

Bah.

Kyle, come here honey bunny :) He's such a looker with that beard and all :p

Ol-Gil
04-05-2003, 06:42 PM
I gotta admit, Kyle has been one of my least favorite characters ever in a video game.

He's just so bland, that same outfit/beard/haircut...nothing really exciting about his character [he's like Han with a lightsaber!].

I think Dark Forces had a good idea for Kyle in the cutscenes, as far as look and demeanor, but come JK, it was perverted into the sweater-wearin' yawn pile we have today.

In my opinion.

I'm just sayin', thank god there are SP mods...and now, JA.

Taos
04-05-2003, 07:14 PM
I'm really not going to miss him at all. I had no attachment to him. If you keep on having the same character all the time the game gets kinda stagnet...there needs to be new characters to spice things up a bit and keep it fresh. So the change is a good thing IMO. :)

Jedi Apprentice
04-05-2003, 07:22 PM
Kyle is a very cool game character and has become one of my favorites, but I think his time is up.

I just hope he is still in the game. :)

legameboy
04-05-2003, 07:43 PM
i like kyle, and i will sorta miss him, but like everyone said, same outfit, same face, he was VERY bland, i wont mind SEEING him, but i dont want to play him again

Silent_Thunder
04-05-2003, 07:45 PM
Speaking of that sweater...

Am I the only one that sorely misses that DarK Forces suit? I'm glad it made a modified appearance, but it's just waaaaaaay too ugly to be in any more games ;).

If I see Kyle walking aound in that ugly brown, bantha herder uniform, that looks like it hasn't been washed in 6 years (and judging by the time-line, and the fact that Kyle is STILL wearing it leads me to that assumption), then I'm going to type in g_saberrealisticcombat 9 and have alittle fun...

Anyways... Kyle's old armor/jackett was incredibly cool in my opinion. I loved that backmandalorian armor and yellow-ish brown coat. That mercenary look is soooo much cooler then the farmer/jedi look, that I just can't understand why they didn't use it in JKII?! Heck, even the first concept art showed Kyle wearing it, and so did all the magazines with JKII on the cover! And it's not like Kyle threw that armor away... he wore a modified version (no jacket) in MotS.

Well... I guess I can only hope that Kyle gets his fashion sense back in Jedi Academy -- even if we can't actually play as him.

ckcsaber
04-05-2003, 08:22 PM
HIS BEARD WAS AWESOME!!

Anyways, Kyle was a truly great character. One of the best EU characters IMO. He's got a great story, and I don't think it will end. I have a feeling that Kyle will play more of a part than a cutscene model.....

CagedCrado
04-05-2003, 08:56 PM
Kyle is an awesome character, but im sick of playing kyles boring life, especially when theres a billion guys just like him in star wars. I guess he set the trend for new characters in a way.

Finalnight
04-05-2003, 10:13 PM
From what the makers are saying, they are probably gonna go back after JA and make a real JKIII with the DIII/QIV engine.

AlzWisHum
04-06-2003, 09:53 PM
Quoting Lethal Weapon: He is too old for that $@%#... :D

Tesla
04-06-2003, 10:05 PM
No i won't miss him niether do i hate him but he is gonna be in JA so with a saber disembantment cheat (if they have it) those who hate him chop him into small bits of space dust :D

BrodieCadden
04-08-2003, 02:16 AM
I like Kyle, yes even in JO. I thought the beard was pretty cool, it made his transition to a wiser person more, obivous I suppose. Anyway, I agree that the next game should be based around Kyle, with the PC being Kyle.

It would be cool if in the next game something happens to Luke on Yavin IV and, I dunno he gets kidnapped (not that lame, of course, but something must happen) and Kyle goes on a mission to save Luke. Maybe call it Jedi Knight III: Jedi Master.

Perhaps mid-game Kyle "rescues" Luke and they both embark on the mission together.

Hrmm.

Maybe it could be called Jedi Knight III: The Rapscallious Mis-Adventures of Luke and Kyle!

Sam
04-08-2003, 03:28 AM
If you could customize your own character why would you want to play as kyle?

HertogJan
04-08-2003, 07:56 AM
No... Kyle should die in Jedi Academy. And then you must kill his killers :D It's a perfect way to get rid of him in a friendly way.

toms
04-08-2003, 11:57 AM
He reached his peak in MotS... and became quite an interesting character. A jedi who had fallen to the dark side, but then come back. (And he got to wear black, always cooler).

Unfortunately they pretty much dumped these cool aspects from his character in JK2, didn't really explain why he didn't like the force... and then ruined one of the best teams (Kyle + jan) by making them discover their "feelings for one another".

i expect that risible plot twist came from some EU novel or something, but it still came out of nowhere and sucked :mad:

If they do JK3 they should do an alternate Kyle... the one that took the dark side in JK and killed jan.

Solo4114
04-08-2003, 02:38 PM
I won't really miss him. He's getting kinda stale as a character, and I think it's time for some new blood. He's been a cool character and all, but I think we're getting to a point where he's becoming less of a character and more of a charicature (not that he ever had all THAT much depth, but still).

Plus, from a gameplay perspective, I doubt it'd work. I mean, how many times can kyle learn to use the force, then give up his force powers only to relearn them? You'd have to start the game at basically full force powers from the end of JO, which would really kinda ruin the gameplay. It'd be like starting with cheats, and you'd need to either have HORDES of enemies to balance things, or you'd need to have incredibly tough monsters or other opponents for Kyle. I think he's basically played out.

I suppose one final story for Kyle, along the Jedi Master line of thinking, could be where Kyle becomes an instructor at the Yavin academy, takes on a group of, say, 5 students, and then must face the "burden of command" and the challenges of teaching young students. You could play as Kyle as well as all 5 of his students in different levels, and, if Raven makes it, it could be a team-game like Elite Force was. As points of conflict, you could have students either be injured or die during training, or have students rebell against Kyle and turn to the dark side. Kyle could then be forced to either kill them or let them go. By letting them go, you could open up potential for another story, one in which the one student who turned declares a vendetta against Kyle, kills him, and it's up to Kyle's son or daughter (or both) to take out the rogue student or bring him to justice. Again, you could be faced with the choice of revenge (dark side) or mercy (light side). This would also open up the possibility to follow Kyle's students as they progress in their development as Jedi.

But I'd say that Kyle should either be retired, or given ONE more game as a playable character, and then either allowed to retire peacefully or killed (heroically).

greedo626
04-08-2003, 03:05 PM
at first I was going to say I wasn't going to miss him, but when I look back at all the stuff we've been through, and all the bad guys we killed, I feel kind of sad that he's gone:( ... I love you Kyle:crybaby:

on the other hand I'm glad to finaly get the chance to play as someone other than Kyle. I guess I wont have much time to miss him as I kill helpless little jawas:evil2:. MUWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!


:D

Prime
04-08-2003, 03:50 PM
I guess I'll miss him, but I liked him the most in Dark Forces and less in the later games. Not so much that I was getting tired of him, but just because the games had moved to the Force and Jedi Knights, and he is completely different from any other Jedi we've seen. When I play games about Jedi, I'd prefer it if they would at least slightly resemble/act like the Jedi I've seen in the movies.

He makes a great Special Ops guy though :)

Solo4114
04-08-2003, 04:50 PM
Very true, Prime. He's great as a special ops character. Remember when you had to break Gen. Madine (who I think was, at that point, a Col.) out of that imperial prison facility in DF1? That was a blast! I do think he's cool for the initial jedi stages, but now that we've explored and re-explored that, I think that it's best to move on. Unless you start out with full abilities and can have meaningful challenges to those abilities, you don't set up any kind of uphill battle for your hero (and thus, fail to make your hero a true hero). And I sure don't want to play ANOTHER game where Kyle has to learn how to do Force Jump AGAIN. :)

Andy867
04-08-2003, 05:04 PM
I personally wont miss him, like how I won't miss Stormtroopers if Raven doesn't put them in the game.. I felt that by Jedi Outcast's end, that if another Jedi Knight game would be made, a new character should be used.. Not someone who is getting as old as Yoda.:) Besides, with it being Jedi Academy, it provides 99% of us the chance that we've been wanting, our own characters, and not having to "replace" someone with a SP character mod.. Also, Kyle wasn't all that great. Maybe he was in Dark Forces 2: Jedi Knight, but, but Jedi Outcast, his character had diminshed so much, its like begging for a new character just to get rid of him.

Prime
04-08-2003, 09:56 PM
Originally posted by Solo4114
Very true, Prime. He's great as a special ops character. Remember when you had to break Gen. Madine (who I think was, at that point, a Col.) out of that imperial prison facility in DF1? That was a blast! I do think he's cool for the initial jedi stages, but now that we've explored and re-explored that, I think that it's best to move on. Unless you start out with full abilities and can have meaningful challenges to those abilities, you don't set up any kind of uphill battle for your hero (and thus, fail to make your hero a true hero). And I sure don't want to play ANOTHER game where Kyle has to learn how to do Force Jump AGAIN. :) Ah, great memories of Dark Forces. Thanks for the walk down memory lane :) I agree with you about the pretty weak story hooks to force Kyle to relearn how to use the Force all over again. Frankly, at the beginning of JO when he had given it up, my first thought was, "That's better, now Kyle is back to doing what he does best!"

Originally posted by Andy867
like how I won't miss Stormtroopers if Raven doesn't put them in the game..
Blashemy!!

Originally posted by Andy867
Besides, with it being Jedi Academy, it provides 99% of us the chance that we've been wanting, our own characters, and not having to "replace" someone with a SP character mod.. It really is amazing how many people have wanted to be able to do this. I know I have. I went as far as to make my own character Qui-Zan Buuzza (which I have had since X-Wing days) using the Mace Windu model. Really, we all just want to pretend we are Jedi for a couple hours.

master_thomas
04-08-2003, 10:22 PM
I really liked Kyle (although JO is the only Dark Forces game I've ever played). He was really unique. He was the first and only(that I know of) to combine the lightside and darkside and prove the Jedi's long held beliefs of the "aggressiveness+pain+fear=dark side=evil" were not completely correct. He remained mentally intact while using the dark and light side of the force openly.

He was pretty cool, but like you said about relearning the force more than once (once again, I've only played JO, so I haven't experienced the rest of the story. DF mod can fix that :)) got pretty redundant. Now he sticks with the force and it's hard to create challenges.

Maybe a true JK3 could be in which you play him as well as other important characters, but that won't focus around Kyle enough.

At first, it was a decent story (based on pieces of info I have gathered during JO times). Is this correct? I would never intentionally soil the great Dark Forces series with my misinformation.

He joined an imperial academy(Morgan, his father, was secretly a rebel). He was told that his father was killed by rebels and he joined the imperial Special Ops for revenge. He met Jan, who told him that Morgan was killed by Jerec so Kyle went to the rebels for revenge. He was a very important asset to the rebels in the galactic civil war and was the one to find the deathstar plans. Eventually, he went to avenge his father, but temporarily fell to the dark side of the force. He defeated Jerec and was scared of his turn, so he left the force and gave his lightsaber to Luke, come JO. Is this at all correct? Once again, I used the info about Jerec, the darkside turn, the meeting of Jan, and the demo level of the Dark Forces mod, to guess this. Is this at all the least bit correct or at least correct, but out of sequence?

Question: How old is Kyle at JO? He has greying hair, but about how old is he?

master_thomas
04-08-2003, 10:31 PM
Okay, I looked it up and I now know the story. here (http://www.jedilegacy.net/stormrunner/tech/kyle.html) is where I learned.

Andy867
04-08-2003, 10:46 PM
Originally posted by Prime
Really, we all just want to pretend we are Jedi for a couple hours


...A couple of hours? Thats it? Man, I'd want to be a jedi for awhile..:-D

BloodRiot
04-09-2003, 12:29 PM
I liked Kyle 'till JK1... When MotS came up and he fell to the Dark Side and back and became the Reluctant Jedi or JediPhobic if you will.. It started to get on my nerves.

Besides, JA offers me what i want and why i got into character modeling... customization.

I actually like Kyle but like I said... only till JK1. The JO Kyle was totally unappealing character.

txa1265
04-09-2003, 12:43 PM
I will miss him, as he became the character version of me - I molded his behaviour and so on, especially in JKII.

That said, I don't have any regret NOT playing him in Jedi Academy, and wouldn't mind if he was a NPC in JKIII if that ever gets made. (we may get Jedi Academy II instead)

Mike

toms
04-09-2003, 01:16 PM
hmmm.. there doesn't seem to be any way to bring him back as the player character when they do make JK3... unless they go for the alternate JK ending.

If I had to pick an alternate character to play in JK3 it would be Aurra Sing... it would be nice to have a dark side char for once, she has a reason to have low level powers at the start (quiting the academy), a reason to use weapons as well (being a bounty hunter) and a reason to fight a lot of jedi (collecting their sabers).

Or mara jade... but lots of people who are far too picky didn't think her being in MotS fitted the rest of the EU... like it matters. some people are so picky. :rolleyes:

But that is for if and when they ever make JK3

Solo4114
04-09-2003, 01:48 PM
Originally posted by Andy867
...A couple of hours? Thats it? Man, I'd want to be a jedi for awhile..:-D

Bah! You're all RPGing FANBOYS, I say!!! You're going to ruin quak--- er --- JA for all us COMPETITIVE players!! I scoff at you!! :)

Just kidding! (with apologies to many of the competitive players out there who actually do like playing in the Star Wars universe, and don't just want a quake clone with sabres and force powers) :D