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-   -   Realism in KOTOR 3 (http://www.lucasforums.com/showthread.php?t=151549)

THE MANDALORE 08-28-2005 10:00 PM

Realism in KOTOR 3
 
Ok, how realistic do you want KOTOR 3 to be?

There are alot of things to be changed. For example, instead of automatically healing when you get to the Ebon Hawk, you should go to the medical room and heal over there. Or, just take a nap on the dormitories.

Also, the ability to see your character change with acquired feats.
For example: If my PC learns the Conditioning feat, then I should see a difference on the PC (more muscular, etc, etc). If the PC learns the Toughness feat, then he should look tough, etc, etc.

Also, the ability to do jobs in the beginning. I know that in TSL you can just take the credits off of dead corpses, but in the beginning you have very little money, so it would be helpful to do little jobs [ie bounty hunting, dueling ring (like the one on Taris)].

What do you think?

lukeiamyourdad 08-28-2005 10:06 PM

Going to the dormitory or to the medical room every time you board the Ebon Hawk with less then 100% of your VP can get annoying.

I agree about the rest.

fresnosmokey02 08-28-2005 10:30 PM

Sounds OK to me with the exception of having to go to a specific place to heal. Medpacs and force heal are usually enough for me anyway.

I wonder if there might be a way to have to "learn" feats and force powers and not just acquire them when you level up without bogging the game down?

THE MANDALORE 08-28-2005 10:49 PM

^^^^

You mean like going to Kreia and having her teach you stuff?

MdKnightR 08-29-2005 07:26 AM

I would like to see a better, more realistic way to handle encumbrance. Ever since I started playing KOTOR, I thought it was rediculous that you were able to carry every last thing that you collected since the beginning of the game. This unrealistic aspect was further exploited in TSL when characters that were not linked to you yet (such as Mira in the Jekk Jekk Tar arena) could use your items. I think there should be a limit to how much you can carry with you and let the members of your party share in the burden. That way, it would be more of a challenge to put together a party for a given situation based on items that you have had them carry throughout the game.

tsunamipunk 08-29-2005 08:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by THE MANDALORE
Ok, how realistic do you want KOTOR 3 to be?

Very realistic is some ways, not so much in others. I would love complex facial animations, changing bodies, and flying limbs from saber strikes. This would require a new graphics engine though.

I would not like real time combat, though.

Quote:

... instead of automatically healing when you get to the Ebon Hawk, you should go to the medical room and heal over there.
This would become boringly repetitive very quickly. Games need to save the player from tedious tasks, not force them on the player.

Quote:

Also, the ability to see your character change with acquired feats ... (more muscular, etc, etc)
This would require a new graphics engine but would be real cool if they implemented it.

Quote:

Also, the ability to do jobs in the beginning.
I would like that as well. Revan had to earn a living, and did so in an interesting and fun way. The Exile was just a bum and a thief, who stole from the dead no less. Cool if your PC's darkside, but REAL lame if she's light side. Good guys and gals do not steal from the dead. In KOTOR I you had options for money, in KOTOR II they took alot of the options away. I hope they put them back in KOTOR III!

tsunamipunk 08-29-2005 08:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MdKnightR
I would like to see a better, more realistic way to handle encumbrance.

So would I. Encumberance is built into D20, and it's built into Aurora, so I may be wrong, but it must be in Oddessy as well. It's not that hard to implement and I wish they had. I guess they felt that Star Wars fans didn't want to be bothered by something so dungeons & dragons, even though KOTOR uses the D&D rulebook.

rhinomatt 08-31-2005 03:24 PM

i think you should be able to walk around in the ebon hawk in space!

Sabretooth 09-01-2005 06:20 AM

They should make the characters clumsy and they'll drop their weapons when fighting!

*runs*

Vibro 09-01-2005 07:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by THE MANDALORE
There are alot of things to be changed. For example, instead of automatically healing when you get to the Ebon Hawk, you should go to the medical room and heal over there. Or, just take a nap on the dormitories.

I think this would get very annoying very quickly, but I do like your other ideas.

Quote:

I wonder if there might be a way to have to "learn" feats and force powers and not just acquire them when you level up
I like this idea alot.

montnoir 09-01-2005 11:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MdKnightR
I would like to see a better, more realistic way to handle encumbrance. Ever since I started playing KOTOR, I thought it was rediculous that you were able to carry every last thing that you collected since the beginning of the game. This unrealistic aspect was further exploited in TSL when characters that were not linked to you yet (such as Mira in the Jekk Jekk Tar arena) could use your items. I think there should be a limit to how much you can carry with you and let the members of your party share in the burden.

The encumbrance is the most annoying thing I know of in rpg-s. Someone spoke of tedious tasks. "Beaming" back to a merchant every 15 minutes because your backpack is full, is no fun.

I am currently playing Dungeon Siege 2. It has a limited inventory and random item-drops, a lot of random item-drops. So with your limited inventory you must go to a merchant every 10 minutes. Needless to say it takes you out of immersion and it also is rather annoying.



Oh and MdKnightR. No one stops you to roleplay your inventory. Just decide what is in your characters inventory and use only that. No need for the engine to force a limited backpack on you.

Darth333 09-01-2005 11:30 AM

Definitely, encumberance should not be added. While it can make sense in a long game like Morrowind where you can play for hundreds of hours, it can be pretty annoying in a relatively short game like Kotor. Not only we would end up to visit shops all the time as mentioned by Montoir but we would also have to do constant party members swapping (as if it was not enough with the TSL influence system).

ChAiNz.2da 09-01-2005 11:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by montnoir
I am currently playing Dungeon Siege 2. It has a limited inventory and random item-drops, a lot of random item-drops. So with your limited inventory you must go to a merchant every 10 minutes. Needless to say it takes you out of immersion and it also is rather annoying.

Off Topic: Does Dungeon Siege2 have the "Transmute" Spell still? That was a timesaver for me during version 1... I'd just transform everything I found into gold unless I thought I might need it later on...

--------------

On Topic: I can definitely "feel the pain" of the examples given above... Having to go back to 'town' every so often was a major downfall of Diablo I & II for me (though it was inventory space related, not weight), but for games like NWN, I accepted it without a second thought. I'm not sure if it was just because I was use to it (playing the PNP version for so many years)... but I 'accepted' the fact of encumbrance.

I think my main issue with encumbrance was how relative it is with the amount of 'action' the game possessed. For Diablo, it was such a pain because you were constantly fighting.. and you'd have stuff strewn all over the place when you were on a good "killing spree" or was buffed with a time limited shrine...

For NWN, the action wasn't as fast paced, plus you had henchies that could take part of the loot load. If KotOR devs took the time to make a good encumbrance system, and an inventory alotment that made sense, I think I could accept it in the game without a hitch so to say ;)

MdKnightR 09-01-2005 12:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by montnoir
"Beaming" back to a merchant every 15 minutes because your backpack is full, is no fun.

I was doing this in KOTOR anyway and was constantly breaking down items whenever I found a workbench or lab station in TSL. I can't stand not being able to find my medpaks (or other necessary item) in the middle of a battle because of all the crap in my inventory. An encumbrance system would hopefully force you to make choices as to what is more valuable to you. Here's an example...You have no room in your inventory for the red Darth Bandon crystal from USM, but you do have a regular green crystal there that is just taking up space. You simply discard the green crystal to make room for it because it isn't as valuable. This is how we had to do it way back when we were playing AD&D.

montnoir 09-01-2005 07:05 PM

Play 3-4 hours a week and an AD&D adventure would take you and your friends everything from a month to a year to complete and you have a game master who won't let your character die if you botch a roll (unless you are a beyond-hardcore roleplayer). Also, how long did 1 fight take? We were 3 players and a GM and say we usually were at least outmatched 2 to 1. One such fight would take between 1 and 3 hours.

Now, how long did it take you to complete Kotor? I doubt it was more than a month. How long is a non-boss fight in Kotor? 3-5 minutes?

The dynamics are completely different. I have nothing against the roleplaying system. But I do dislike timewasters.



@ ChainZ: Transmute is still in the game... and the mule.

RedHawke 09-02-2005 02:12 AM

I have to agree with montnoir and Darth333 that encumbrance is a big pain in the backside for computer games... and has no place in KOTOR.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MdKnightR
I was doing this in KOTOR anyway and was constantly breaking down items whenever I found a workbench or lab station in TSL. I can't stand not being able to find my medpaks (or other necessary item) in the middle of a battle because of all the crap in my inventory. An encumbrance system would hopefully force you to make choices as to what is more valuable to you.

I see your point, but even with an encumbrance system this won't really stop... add in all the + to Strength items available and the encumbrance rules would be nullified anyway. Lastly, adding encumbrance rules to the game when you have to fully equip up to 10 NPC's and can only have 3 active at a time is a little harsh, especially if they lock out your NPC's and access to shops at certain points.

It would be a equipment tracking nightmare, the Main PC's invantory, and now 10 NPC's invantories to contend with... you can't find your medpacks now, just imagine the horror! "Kreia has all my medpacks and she can't come out of the EH on Korriban!" [Insert party getting pwnd sounds here] :eek:

Quote:

Originally Posted by MdKnightR
This is how we had to do it way back when we were playing AD&D.

I have found that the encumbrance rules only affect AD&D Player parties less than 7th level or so... the first Bag of Holding or Hewards Handy Haversack, or Girdle of Giant Strength, or Gauntlets of Ogre Power found by a party member and the party now has it's treasure mule... add more of these items into the mix and you can throw the whole of the encumbrance rules out the window anyway. ;)

DarthLinde 09-03-2005 09:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by montnoir
The encumbrance is the most annoying thing I know of in rpg-s. Someone spoke of tedious tasks. "Beaming" back to a merchant every 15 minutes because your backpack is full, is no fun.

I am currently playing Dungeon Siege 2. It has a limited inventory and random item-drops, a lot of random item-drops. So with your limited inventory you must go to a merchant every 10 minutes. Needless to say it takes you out of immersion and it also is rather annoying.



Oh and MdKnightR. No one stops you to roleplay your inventory. Just decide what is in your characters inventory and use only that. No need for the engine to force a limited backpack on you.

They could make a bank that holds credits and items.

BumpoTheHutt 09-08-2005 01:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarthLinde
They could make a bank that holds credits and items.

You have them. Any bin/footlocker will hold your stuff if you want to keep it somewhere. Almost every landing area in the game has a usable footlocker/storage device. Use "give item" to put your junk in one of these.

You also have the cylinders in the cargo area of the Ebon Hawk, I think. Anything you don't wanna haul around, dump in there.


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