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-   -   Did the Empire continue cloning after the Clone Wars? (http://www.lucasforums.com/showthread.php?t=156217)

RobQel-Droma 12-01-2005 03:05 PM

Did the Empire continue cloning after the Clone Wars?
 
This is something I have been a bit unsure about for a while. I know that during the clone wars, the Republic was recieving shipments of clones from Kamino, but afterwards did the Empire keep cloning more troops? Or did they just use the troops they had left? I know that they stopped using clone officers and starting recruiting, but did they do the same with the stormtroopers?

Mono_Giganto 12-01-2005 05:14 PM

Well, the clones of AotC and RotS would be in their 30's (60's-70's with the modifications.) By that time, they probably wouldn't be used too much. So I doubt they just used what they had left.

TK-8252 12-01-2005 05:20 PM

http://www.starwars.com/databank/org...roopers/?id=eu

"Following the rise of the Empire, the military cloning program expanded to include new clone hosts. By the time of the Empire consolidated its power by dissolving the Senate, the ranks of the Imperial stormtroopers would include cloned infantry from multiple sources as well as birth-born conscripts and recruits from various worlds."

MachineCult 12-20-2005 07:54 PM

So I guess it's yes.

Darth_Extas 12-20-2005 11:17 PM

K so they did this answers the question even before I could ask it...lol

Soogz 12-21-2005 01:05 AM

Hmm. I just thought they started recruiting random people after the Clone Wars. Guess I was wrong..

CadmiumRED 12-26-2005 01:56 PM

I don't know about the whole cloning after the Empire formed thing, because if you listen VERY closely to the stormtroopers' voices in the old movies, they all sound different and not the same, unlike the clone troopers (whereas their voices sounded the same).

TK-8252 12-26-2005 04:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CadmiumRED
I don't know about the whole cloning after the Empire formed thing, because if you listen VERY closely to the stormtroopers' voices in the old movies, they all sound different and not the same, unlike the clone troopers (whereas their voices sounded the same).

Read my post and you'll know. ;)

Darth Andrew 12-26-2005 11:42 PM

I asked generally the same question when I joined months ago: http://www.lucasforums.com/showthread.php?t=147006 This was in pre-Episode III days, hence all the spoiler tags.

PoiuyWired 01-03-2006 04:13 PM

Well, I think 501st still use exclusively the original clone seeds/models.

Don't ask me why they are still such lousy shooters though.

Justus 01-24-2006 06:31 PM

The EU states that they did continue to clone, also in the EU it is stated the Emperor also kept cloning facilities around so he could remain in power so to speak.

Brings up another question, with the Star Wars universe being very successful in cloning, doesn't it seem weird that people get cybernetic replacements for limbs? Seems like they could just clone a body part or something.

MachineCult 01-25-2006 10:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Justus
Brings up another question, with the Star Wars universe being very successful in cloning, doesn't it seem weird that people get cybernetic replacements for limbs? Seems like they could just clone a body part or something.

You can't clone a part, you would have to clone an entire person, and cut off his arm.
I don't know about you but I wouldn't really like the sound of that.

Justus 01-25-2006 11:21 AM

True. Added that Two-Onebee stated in Tales of the Bounty Hunters that it is illegal, they can however, genetically re-grow damaged tissue as they did with Zuckuss in the Tales of the Bounty Hunters anthology.

Darth_Terros 01-25-2006 12:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MachineCult
You can't clone a part, you would have to clone an entire person, and cut off his arm.
I don't know about you but I wouldn't really like the sound of that.

Well you can grow parts i mean they managed to grow a ear on a mouse?

Who's to say what they can and cant do in the GFFA

MachineCult 01-25-2006 02:07 PM

You said clone not grow.

Justus 01-25-2006 02:28 PM

Not really wanting to get too heavy handed in real life topics, the Star Wars universe MIGHT have something similar to stem cell research.

lord ignarn 01-26-2006 07:25 AM

If they didnīt clone all the stromtroopers, the Emperor developed a great cloning technology. Remember his clone boied, and the Spaarti cilinders he used to grow clones very quickly, as seen in the Thrawn trilogy.

Also is said that he had several cloning facilities in Byss, Wayland...

About the rclones in the army, in EU books, like RPG books, is shown that (during Palpatine reign) the TIE pilots :atpilot: , army crew members, army officials... are recruited from the no cloned people. I believe that only the stormtroopers were cloned then. And some of the old clones were used in maintenance works, as is said in the visual guide to episode 3.

Kurgan 01-27-2006 12:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RobQel-Droma
This is something I have been a bit unsure about for a while. I know that during the clone wars, the Republic was recieving shipments of clones from Kamino, but afterwards did the Empire keep cloning more troops? Or did they just use the troops they had left? I know that they stopped using clone officers and starting recruiting, but did they do the same with the stormtroopers?


According to a George Lucas interview (a REAL one) from 2005, the Empire did indeed continue cloning troops. But, they branched out from just Jango clones (although Jango clones were still being used in the time of ANH for example*) to using multiple templates. Eventually, according to Lucas, the Empire also started mixing in non-clone conscripts into the Stormtrooper ranks. So there's your answer. ;)

Accoring to the C-Level canon ROTS Visual Dictionary released right before the movie came out, they had already started expanding into using multiple templates and more planets for clones than just Kamino about the time of Episode III. Of course we only saw two clone "faces" in Episode III, that of Temuerra Morrison and his "younger look alike" played by a different actor (Bodie Taylor, iirc).

*I base the "they still had Jango clones" thing on Lucas's statement on the Episode II DVD commentary, during the scene of Jango bumping his head on the door of the Slave I. He says he wanted the audience to draw a direct connection between the head bumping in that movie and the head bumping gaffe (which he added a sound effect to, effectively canonizing a goof) in ANH, showing us that Jango's clones retained a bit of his clumsiness (rather than the old joke explanation that they really couldn't see very well in those helmets, which also was used by fans to explain some of their poor accuracy).

TK-8252 01-27-2006 12:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kurgan
*I base the "they still had Jango clones" thing on Lucas's statement on the Episode II DVD commentary, during the scene of Jango bumping his head on the door of the Slave I.

He said in another interview that yeah, there's a lot of Jango clones still too. So yes, you would be correct. :)

The Source 01-27-2006 12:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RobQel-Droma
This is something I have been a bit unsure about for a while. I know that during the clone wars, the Republic was recieving shipments of clones from Kamino, but afterwards did the Empire keep cloning more troops? Or did they just use the troops they had left? I know that they stopped using clone officers and starting recruiting, but did they do the same with the stormtroopers?

Hint... Hint...

Episode IV: A New Hope

Princess: "Arn't you a little short for a Stormtrooper?"

Plus, I think there were EU books that covered how the Empire runs their cloning process.

The 501st were originally clones from the clone wars if I remember. Up until the Empire joined the New Republic. During 'Survivor's Quest', the 501st became deversified. Earlier in EU, the clones had there own cliche... Hehehe...

Kurgan 01-27-2006 12:37 PM

Bah, there's no evidence in ANH alone that they're all clones, or even mostly clones! The Empire may simply have had a minimum height requirement, much like real life militaries.

Of course we also see in ANH that Stormtroopers are clearly different heights when standing next to each other. ;)

The cloning process as described in the EU prior to AOTC (2002) had to be retconned, since it was in conflict with the new movies.

Justus 01-27-2006 03:24 PM

I would like to think that by the time of ANH they had a nice mix of clones and recruits.

TK-8252 01-27-2006 03:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Justus
I would like to think that by the time of ANH they had a nice mix of clones and recruits.

You would be correct.

Kurgan 01-27-2006 07:13 PM

Did they ever have recruits (as grunt Stormtroopers)? I don't remember ever hearing that they did (except what TK whispered to me when I was sleeping! hehe), taking Episode III into account...

MachineCult 01-27-2006 08:32 PM

I always believed that they did have recruits as Stormtroopers. They defiantely aren't good enough to all be clones.

TK-8252 01-27-2006 10:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kurgan
Did they ever have recruits (as grunt Stormtroopers)?

I can't say for sure. It's never really been confirmed. I believe that there is a bit of separation between clones and recruits in the Stormtrooper ranks, putting clones as Stormtrooper grunts and recruits as Stormtrooper officers. It makes sense to me that regular humans would be given priority over clones, who are likely to be less skilled at leading.

Kurgan 01-28-2006 03:19 AM

Ah, recruits as in officers, okay fine, sure the Academies would be volunteers. I keep forgetting that sometimes officers wear the armor (at least in theory, we never see this in the movies, but we'd never really know unless one of them took a line or took off his helmet to show us). I was thinking conscripts, since Lucas mentions "normal guys getting shanghaied" by the Empire to fill out the ranks later on. Conscripts tend to make the worst kind of troops, at least in our world.

It might be one of those sorts of deals where people volunteer in order not to get drafted though, as is eluded to in the deleted scenes for ANH (with Biggs) for example. So in a sense they're still being pressured to join up, but some jobs are better than others. The Empire is so big, chances are most soldiers aren't going to be doing much other than glorified guard duty, rather than getting shot at by Rebels or being ordered to quell uprisings, harass the populance or get choked by Darth Vader...

NL_Sudentor 02-27-2008 11:07 AM

I think the emperor still kept on cloning.
But the difficult part is that in the first 3 films they all have the same voice and length but in the last 3 films they don't.
George couldn't know when he maked this film how the clones would be almost 25 years later!

PoiuyWired 02-27-2008 03:35 PM

Well we know that at least some stormies are non-clones. This is especially true if you think about less combat oriented duties (such as inner city guard duty) which would not require the well designed clones, but some disposable farmboys from distant planets would work just fine. Remember, not every non-lone stormie goes thru those elite training as depicted, some probably recieve really basic training and then thrown into simple deadend jobs in those remote planets.

Also note that pilots and such contains quite a bit of non-clones.

Jediking12 04-29-2009 01:57 PM

Play Battlefront II The Raid in Kamino Level

mikrex 06-17-2009 02:42 AM

Yeah, what jediking said...

RSaks 04-24-2011 12:45 PM

I'm sorry for replying to an old thread, and this is probably old news, but in the game Force Unleashed II, this is written about stormtroopers in the databank:

Cody, Imperial Battalion Commander,
Operational Log (excerpt):

Since the Empire has redirected the
clone trooper program to other
pursuits and stepped up recruiting
inferior humans from the Outer Rim,
the operational effectiveness of this
army has declined significantly. The
stormtroopers in my own battalion
are expendable buffoons. They have
neither common sense, nor sense of
their own surroundings. Just today I
witnessed a new recruit hit his head
on a blast door during maneuvers.
Blasted idiots! What a disgrace to
the heritage and legacy of a once
truly incredible fighting force.

As one of the last clones in service
today, few others can share in my
disdain for these men. I'd sacrifice an
entire platoon of new stormtrooper
recruits for just one real clone
trooper. If the clone template were
still alive, I think he'd kill them all
himself.

SITH LORD 872 04-25-2011 11:18 AM

Even in the Battlefront 2 campaign, Cody makes a statement about new recruits not being of clone tech, And states that the new uniforms, which are Stormtroopers replaced the clone trooper armor, And he even mentions how there are few clones left, So i guess after the clones had been reduced the Emperor started recruiting humans from all over the galaxy.

To answear the question why stormtroopers are a lousy shot, because their laser rifles suck, I mean when i hold the mouse 2 button and fire multiple shots, you can clearly see every shot go in a different direction, Except straight!!

mfinnie 05-15-2011 04:24 PM

they continued cloning, but it was encouraged to use non-clone humans i the army i think

Car Gently 10-16-2011 10:33 PM

Clones cloning clones. Now that's pod-racing.

Antares Navaar 01-29-2012 06:02 AM

The empire was compromised of both a continuation of the cloning process using different bodies, and recruited individuals.

Gerevick 05-08-2012 09:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TK-8252 (Post 1955195)
http://www.starwars.com/databank/org...roopers/?id=eu

"Following the rise of the Empire, the military cloning program expanded to include new clone hosts. By the time of the Empire consolidated its power by dissolving the Senate, the ranks of the Imperial stormtroopers would include cloned infantry from multiple sources as well as birth-born conscripts and recruits from various worlds."

Recruits and conscripts are a risky prospect, unless they are reared from birth to be devoted to their own cause, as I was. If everyone could be as determined to take what they need as I, this would not be a cause for concern. The clones are more practical, but less diverse and inventive breed than the natural variety.


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