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-   -   Sentient Rights and Clone Troopers. (http://www.lucasforums.com/showthread.php?t=165908)

PoiuyWired 06-08-2006 01:40 PM

Sentient Rights and Clone Troopers.
 
This may be a funny question, but do the Clone Troopers enjoy full Sentient Rights as per other citizens of the republic???

I know the republic is a s huge place and laws and rights varies alot between planets, but do the Clones confirm to any of these rights?

It seems like even the Jedis consider them to be a weapon in many places, rather than brave warring people, which annoys me.

MachineCult 06-08-2006 02:50 PM

They seem to treat them as they would treat droids, which means they probably don't have full sentient rights as per other republic citizens.
They don't have names for a start, they are refered to as Trooper by the Jedi, or whatever their rank is.

Darth Alec 06-08-2006 04:37 PM

Why should they have rights? They aren't sentient as per. They are clones, bred for war, incapable in anything else.

boinga1 06-08-2006 08:47 PM

They're still sentient. Training doesn't change that.

MachineCult 06-08-2006 08:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by boinga1
They're still sentient. Training doesn't change that.

It's not just the training, it's the genetics, they're not normal independent thinking humans, they are tools of war and thats exactly how they see themselves and how others see them.
It is shown in the Clone Wars comics and series, they are treated like organic droids.

Darth Alec 06-09-2006 07:10 AM

Yeah, they aren't much more then organic droids. And incapable to think independantly, other than matters of war.

Redtech 06-09-2006 08:50 AM

Well, arguably, people only ultimately think about matters referring to sex with a bit of culture as excess baggage...

*Been reading the Selfish Gene*

urluckyday 06-11-2006 09:04 PM

I wouldn't assume they would have the same rights...besides, they are probably kept away in some barracks away from most of society unless they're on guard duty...

Darth Alec 06-12-2006 01:18 PM

They probably don't even know what beer is...

PoiuyWired 06-12-2006 03:02 PM

well... there is always Juma Juice.

It is interesting how close their training are to many warrior species, and yet many of those species have full republic sentient rights.

Also, can clones be discharged, and live a life in the civilian sector?

Steve-O Kreesh 06-12-2006 05:28 PM

If you read James Luceno's Dark Lord: The Rise of Darth Vader, you would know clones are not discharged or imprisoned. They are killed on the spot by their superior. A.K.A. - Lord Vader.

ExileRevan 06-15-2006 05:04 PM

heh, i read that also.

I think they have the rights of dogs in a pound. I dont beleive that they could go to a bar or anything. I think they were constantly on duty, eating and sleeping. Just My opinion.

MachineCult 06-15-2006 05:30 PM

They don't want to go to a bar, they want to serve the Republic in it's Grand Army. Normal troopers have limited independant thought, like Battledroids but a little more talkative and a little less drone-like.

ExileRevan 06-15-2006 09:16 PM

Thats what I meant, they're main objectives are programed at a young age. Searve Palpatine, and your masters.
Sounds like thats about it.

PoiuyWired 06-17-2006 04:40 AM

Well, but lifeforms with a mind of reasonable processing power generally pick up traits along the way, with variants in personality. IF a little astrodroid can do it a clone sure can, and I think the Jedis, of all people, would have thought of that also.

And, Vader's treatment of clones does not count, thats the Empire for once, and Vader would choke anything from Admirals to his own breeder to little puppy that pooped in his lawn.

Elukka 06-17-2006 08:12 AM

From what i remember, Obi-Wan and maybe some other jedi were kinda hesitant or not so willing to use the clones, but what other choice did they have against the CIS?

ExileRevan 06-17-2006 12:03 PM

From what I saw Obi and Commander Cody were best buddies until Cody shot that huge cannon at him. And again, Dark Lord: Rise of Darth Vader, a clone battalion refused to follow this order and Vader executed them all. allowing the Jedi to escape.

Lantzen 06-17-2006 04:06 PM

Dont think the clones think like other humans, they just follow orders and so on. In Ep3 when the order to kill Jedi come, all know what they suppose to do, so they have inprogramed orders.

ExileRevan 06-17-2006 07:13 PM

But, they obviously have some sort of shred of free will. Afew of the clones you could tell that they didnt want to execute the order, ex. Plo Koon's clones, Obi's clones. Shrine's Clones (Rise Of Darth Vader) on the other hand disobeyed the order completely.

Lantzen 06-18-2006 05:36 AM

I dont belive the EU do be cannon, they just mess up a lot of things. But that just my opinion

MachineCult 06-18-2006 07:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ExileRevan
But, they obviously have some sort of shred of free will. Afew of the clones you could tell that they didnt want to execute the order, ex. Plo Koon's clones, Obi's clones. Shrine's Clones (Rise Of Darth Vader) on the other hand disobeyed the order completely.

They don't have as much free will as a normal person, they have some free will obviously, which is what makes them better than droids, they choose not to die.
If you told a battledroid to go run into an enemy base, it would say "roger, roger", trot out onto the battlefield without question completely upright and it would get taken out.
A Clone Trooper faced with the same order may or may not question it, and if he did go he would take cover and try to protect himself.
The Clones have free will and Independance the higher their set rank is. In EU the ARC Troopers were so close to unaltered, that the ARC Trooper Alpha began to have some of Jango Fetts memories and went rogue.

PoiuyWired 06-18-2006 07:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zat
I dont belive the EU do be cannon, they just mess up a lot of things. But that just my opinion

I do believe that is a cannon shooting at Obi-Wan.

Ad since you can't mind wipe a Clone, won't they acquire more and more personality over time?

ExileRevan 06-18-2006 07:25 PM

Just like the 501st. From Battlefront2.


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