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Emperor Devon 09-17-2006 03:52 PM

Exile: Male or Female?
 
What the title says, and there wasn't a thread about this already. Do you think the Exile is best as a man or a woman?

I myself like her as a woman. The scenes with Sion were much better than they were a male Exile (It made him seem much more original than a normal Sith Lord to love the person he wanted dead), Atton had a bit more personality, the Disciple was a better party member than the Handmaiden, and for some reason I can't place my finger on, the whole game seemed better. I thought the only pro for a male exile was how Atris' hatred was better explained.

Thoughts?

Diego Varen 09-17-2006 03:57 PM

I've played as both and I don't mind if the Exile is a Male or a Female. Revan on the other hand has no chance of being a Female though.

The Doctor 09-17-2006 04:15 PM

Female. I don't know why. For the longest time, it was Male, but then I RPed with FFWM as a female Exile. :xp:

goldberry 09-17-2006 04:39 PM

I generally feel that the cannon setup gives you the most gameplay-wise. LS Male Revan in K1 made me feel the game was more complete, same with LS Female Exile in K2.

Nema_Suneimi 09-17-2006 05:07 PM

Female Exile, most definitely -- there's an element of nurturing in the Exile's effect on her party, gathering up the Lost Jedi, what-not, and gender-affinity as Kreia's successful protege (after Kreia was subjected to "indignities" by Sion and Nihilus). And I like Atton and the Disciple's silly crushes on the femme Exile.

Plus, what other guy could rival Revan? There's a yin and yang to Revan and the Exile. [In K1, I prefer female Revan for the Carth romance, but do agree that male Revan fits better for canon.]

Jediphile 09-17-2006 05:29 PM

The male exile is better precisely because Sion's "love" for the female exile is just stupid to the point of insult to me. Besides, the Handmaiden's sideplot is much more interesting than the Disciple's plot, which seems more like a non-plot to me, since it's just a connection back to the exile's day at the enclave, which doesn't even have any impact on the plot. Whether you love or loathe Brianna, she grows a lot as a person in the male Exile's plot, and her sideplot ties in with Atris' relationship to the exile, which seems more potent for the male Exile to me. Mical, on the other hand, has no plot and at most just gets to finish his abandoned jedi training and provide a bit more insight into the exile's special powers, which you learn from other character's anyway.

Melly 09-17-2006 08:54 PM

Female. And I think the less I say on that the better. Suffice to say I agree with everything Emperor Devon posted. ;)

Davinq 09-17-2006 10:07 PM

Female, for multiple reasons, of which most are already posted.

1. It's canon

2. There seems to be a passion involved in doing what you're doing in the game that I can't picture a male doing.

3. Sion is made special. (Everyone wants the Exile this way, just like how everyone wanted Trin in the Matrix :D)

4. Feels more complete to me.

More or less the same reasons as everybody else.

DQK out

Jae Onasi 09-17-2006 10:40 PM

Female.
I just don't get turned on by a half-naked Brianna. Disciple's good for lab stuff and medpaks, too. Some of the cut scenes and discussions with Disciple explain a few things that you don't get from Handmaiden. They're not critical to the plot, but it's nice to have those puzzle pieces.

Emperor Devon 09-17-2006 10:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jae Onasi
I just don't get turned on by a half-naked Brianna.

Since you're most likely a heterosexual, I would expect not. But then again, I wasn't either.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jediphile
Mical, on the other hand, has no plot

There actually are a number of cutscenes with him and Kreia that relate to the main plot. You can also have some talks with him about the Republic and his thoughts on the Jedi. I found him to be more interesting to talk to myself. :)

Melly 09-18-2006 01:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Emperor Devon
Since you're most likely a heterosexual, I would expect not. But then again, I wasn't either.

The reason I didn't find Handmaiden attractive was because she is way too skinny (that and I'm a Bao girl ;P ). I think this about Mira too, but Mira makes up for it in personality, IMO Handmaiden doesn't, however. I mean even as a girl I can recognize and appreciate feminine beauty and I think the only one that really wins in that category is Visas. And she has no eyes!

I said I wasn't going to talk about this, but I can't help myself it seems. :roleyess: Though I liked playing a male Exile I didn't like the relationship between Handmaiden and the Exile. It seemed too much to me like she was looking for a replacement for her father in him. And, again like Emperor Devon, I find Disciple much more interesting to talk to, but then people have told me I should be a philosopher. :roleyess: It also seems to me that Di and the Exile would have more in common than Handmaiden and the Exile. Except for their knowing Atris there is nothing (which in of it's self I find odd that the Jedi would have these handmaiden "servants". )

Vegard Aune 09-18-2006 01:17 AM

Female is canon, so I'll have to say that, though I just about always play as a male, and really, I think that Sion's personality is the only REAL advantage females have.

Melly 09-18-2006 01:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vegard Aune
Female is canon, so I'll have to say that

So? What does "canon" have to do with what gender you see the Exile as? I see Revan as female, and they made Revan canonically male, but that doesn't change my opinion one bit, she's still female to me. And it shouldn't change yours about the Exile either if you see him as male. :)

RedHawke 09-18-2006 02:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Melly
So? What does "canon" have to do with what gender you see the Exile as?

Exactly!

So to keep the potential harassment to the minimum I issue this thread warning to everyone;

Any further posts attempting to shove canon into this will be deleted as off topic. This topic has nothing to do with the 'canon' Exile...

The topic is your thoughts on which gender for the Exile is better. ;)

Jediphile 09-18-2006 03:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Emperor Devon
There actually are a number of cutscenes with him and Kreia that relate to the main plot. You can also have some talks with him about the Republic and his thoughts on the Jedi. I found him to be more interesting to talk to myself. :)

Yes, but you learn nothing from Disciple that relates to the main plot that you don't learn from other characters anyway, and I found his whole "I couldn't be a jedi after you left"-plot a very disappointing sob-story. I don't really dislike Mical, but in that case, I really did go, "cry my a river, why don't you?" By comparison I found Brianna's "betrayal"-plot far more powerful.

Mical has some nice comments along the way, but it's all just talk.

Vegard Aune 09-18-2006 09:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Melly
So? What does "canon" have to do with what gender you see the Exile as? I see Revan as female, and they made Revan canonically male, but that doesn't change my opinion one bit, she's still female to me. And it shouldn't change yours about the Exile either if you see him as male. :)

In that case, I'll say male instead, as the game seems more completed for males. (It seems like most of the stuff that could make Disciple a good character was cut...)

Gavroche 09-18-2006 02:57 PM

Mmm... Female.. Or Male, I'm not sure of my choice.

I like the passion Visas feels for the Male Exile, and the consequences it implies in the battle against Dth Nihilus. And Kreia's plan seems more complete with Brianna (she knows the feelings she has for the Exile, so she manages to make the Handmaiden taking her to Atris after the confrontation with the Jedi Masters).
Also, the Handmaiden, with a Female, is doomed to stay The-Lastest-Of-The-Echani-Sisters while she has the potential to become a great Jedi.

The Disciple... Mmm... He is useful as a lab, and then... ? There isn't the same story of betrayal. And his classes Soldier>Consular, that's stupid (not enough WIS to make him a good Consular).
And, to compare with Brianna if the Exile is a Male, he preserves a good job with the Republic, and more important doesn't care about becoming a Jedi because it was HIS decision not to persevere in this way.

Sion. Mm. Yes, he is really more interesting with a Female Exile. Too bad she has to kill him. Not enough development with this idea.

What else ?
...
I prefer play a whole hour with a Female in underwear in Peragus that with a Male XD ..

mimartin 09-18-2006 05:58 PM

Before Stoffe’s mod “Handmaiden choice for females” I’d have to go with my Exile being male, but since that mod I’d go with female 99% of the time. I didn’t really like any of the male skins, plus dislike Disciple enough to play as male without Stoffe’s wonderful mod. So my vote is female as long as Disciple isn’t invited to the party.

Emperor Devon 09-18-2006 07:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jediphile
Yes, but you learn nothing from Disciple that relates to the main plot that you don't learn from other characters anyway,

True, but I found talking to him about the Republic to be more interesting than sparring with a half-naked Echani. :)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jediphile
and I found his whole "I couldn't be a jedi after you left"-

That I think was made solely for the purpose of making him a Jedi.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jediphile
By comparison I found Brianna's "betrayal"-plot far more powerful.

I don't know about you, but the Handmaiden didn't seem to think she betrayed Atris when she went back to Telos. She's really just a personality-devoid servant who you supposedly turn to your side. :)

But even so, the Disciple is just part of why I like a female Exile. There's Darth Sion, Atton, the huge lack of female Sith Lords and strong characters, etc...

Jae Onasi 09-18-2006 09:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Emperor Devon
True, but I found talking to him about the Republic to be more interesting than sparring with a half-naked Echani. :)

I think some of the reason people like Brianna better (besides looks) is that a. her hair is better (Mical has this Ken-doll hard plastic blond thing going) and she doesn't say "You have left me an OH-pening!!!" every .36 seconds in battle.

However, I still like his story better, and there's a mod to get rid of his 'battle cry'. :)
Every time I see a half-naked Brianna, the only thing I can think is (rolling eyes) "Yeah, yeah, LA/Obsidian's attempt to keep the interest of hormonal males...."

Emperor Devon 09-18-2006 09:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jae Onasi
Every time I see a half-naked Brianna, the only thing I can think is (rolling eyes) "Yeah, yeah, LA/Obsidian's attempt to keep the interest of hormonal males...."

They certainly thought poorly of us.

What's even more amusing and ridiculous about those "sparring" matches is that Brianna claims stripping to almost nothing is to put no restrictions upon movement, yet her sisters in the academy say the same thing while wearing the same outfit she does during the matches...

Diego Varen 09-19-2006 01:50 AM

Thinking about it now, I think both the Handmaiden and the Disciple should've been in the game. G0-T0 could be replaced (I tried using him and he weren't that great) and he didn't add much to the story, except see the Remote at the end. That could still happen though. Also both the Handmaiden and the Disciple are needed to advance the story.

Handmaiden's reasons:

1. To advance the story with Atris and her downfall.

2. Kreia seems to be interested with the Handmaiden.

3. Become one of the Jedi to help rebuild the Order.

4. Soon become better than her sisters.

5. Show the relationship between her and Visas (If Male PC).

Disciples's reasons:

1. To show more relationship between him and Carth.

2. Kreia seems to be interested with the Disciple.

3. Become one of the Jedi to help rebuild the Order.

4. Help find out about the Sith.

5. Show the relationship between him and Atton (If Female PC).

Jediphile 09-19-2006 03:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Emperor Devon
True, but I found talking to him about the Republic to be more interesting than sparring with a half-naked Echani. :)

Well, the sparring bit is pretty low, I'll agree. But I still find Brianna more interesting than Mical. The love story isn't so good, since Brianna seems to see far too much of her lost father in the male Exile for it to be a healthy relationship to me. Then again, the same is true for Mical, who seems to follow the female Exile only out of some lovestruck schoolboy mentality, which is not the case for Brianna - she was ordered to join the Exile's party by Atris. There are actually voiceacting for this in the soundfiles, pointing to yet another deleted cutscene, where Atris orders Brianna to the quest to Brianna's surprise.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Emperor Devon
That I think was made solely for the purpose of making him a Jedi.

You could be right, but that actually makes it worse in my eyes, because then it's just bad (=forced) plot instead of poor characterization.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Emperor Devon
I don't know about you, but the Handmaiden didn't seem to think she betrayed Atris when she went back to Telos. She's really just a personality-devoid servant who you supposedly turn to your side. :)

Well, she does say that she is willingly betraying Atris when you train her as a jedi, which then prompts Kreia's "Betrayal!", which echoes onto a cutscene with Atris on Telos. I really miss that "Betrayal!" in the female Exile's story - that was just so cool!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Emperor Devon
But even so, the Disciple is just part of why I like a female Exile. There's Darth Sion, Atton,

The whole love-interest is just stupid for Sion, if you ask me. When I played male, he was a dark, ominous enemy with incredible powers. When I played female he turned into a love-confused puppy :(

Quote:

Originally Posted by Emperor Devon
the huge lack of female Sith Lords and strong characters, etc...

What does that have to do with anything????

Not that I disagree, really - generally Star Wars could do with more strong female characters, but it's not an issue here. Besides, the Exile is scarcely a strong character in that sense, seeing as how he/she goes through the whole plot unaware of his/her true nature, while all the other jedi knew all along. Add to that the exile has been fleeing his/her choice at Malachor for a decade, and we have a very anti-heroic protagonist. I like that, but it certainly doesn't point to a strong leading character. If you want a strong female lead, then Revan would be a much better choice than Exile. In fact, most Star Wars protagonists probably would be, since the Exile is about the most timid and cowed protagonist I've ever seen.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Emperor Devon
They certainly thought poorly of us.

What's even more amusing and ridiculous about those "sparring" matches is that Brianna claims stripping to almost nothing is to put no restrictions upon movement, yet her sisters in the academy say the same thing while wearing the same outfit she does during the matches...

I guess that they - unlike Brianna and Atton - just didn't know the Echani etiquette rituals :D

stoffe 09-19-2006 07:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jae Onasi
Every time I see a half-naked Brianna, the only thing I can think is (rolling eyes) "Yeah, yeah, LA/Obsidian's attempt to keep the interest of hormonal males...."

Every time I see a half-naked stick figure Brianna the only thing I can think is "I wonder where she's concealing all those muscles she supposedly has as a strong melee brawler." :) Her underwear appearance just doesn't look very fit or muscular at all, which matches poorly against how she's portrayed in the game.

As for the Exile I prefer her as a female for a variety of reasons already mentioned by others in this thread, in addition to the appearance. I don't like how all the male characters in the KotOR games seem physically deformed with their torso proportionally too large compared to their legs and how they have no buttocks. It looks kind of creepy how they all have their legs directly attached to their lower back, and how they walk like they are badly constipated. (I guess that's a bioware thing, the same thing was true for the male models in NWN.) Shallow perhaps, but I can't connect with a character looking like that, nor stand to gaze upon them for 50+ hours. :) It just seems more effort has been put into the female models and animations.

mongerman 09-19-2006 10:22 AM

Thats funny. I prefer males over females for the same reason. The female models all look too gangly and loose limbed to me.

Gavroche 09-19-2006 02:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pottsie
2. Kreia seems to be interested with the Disciple.


Oh, yes, I forgot that. But it's something I always like to see these scenes with Kreia and the Dsiciple. After reflexion, it quite replaces the "Bretayal!" moment. And there is another scene with the Exile and the Disciple are meditating with Kreia, watched by Atton who is interrupted by Mira.

Emperor Devon 09-19-2006 07:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jediphile
There are actually voiceacting for this in the soundfiles, pointing to yet another deleted cutscene, where Atris orders Brianna to the quest to Brianna's surprise.

There's more cut content for the Handmiaden in 262TEL. She also has a short conversation with Kreia, a better confrontation with her sisters, some alternate dialogue for them to about her during their cutscenes, alternate lines in general, and a different reason for joining your party on the Ebon Hawk.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jediphile
You could be right, but that actually makes it worse in my eyes, because then it's just bad (=forced) plot instead of poor characterization.

You could say the Handmiaden's was as well. Her father could've loved any woman to have her.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jediphile
I really miss that "Betrayal!" in the female Exile's story - that was just so cool!

It is pretty cool. And there's some even better (cut) content for female Exiles on Malachor. Yes, it's not here now, but we'll all be able to enjoy it eventually. Atton killing Mical, being tortured to death by Sion, and lastly dying in the Exile's arms (well, more like on the ground but near her arms) adds some flavor to the game. :)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jediphile
The whole love-interest is just stupid for Sion, if you ask me. When I played male, he was a dark, ominous enemy with incredible powers. When I played female he turned into a love-confused puppy :(

I liked that. I've seen far too many "I'm gonna rule the universe and kill everyone, including you!!" Sith Lords. It gets repetitive, and Sion was something new. :)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jediphile
but it's not an issue here.

For me it is. I thought the Exile was a strong character, and if she's a female, that makes her a strong female character...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jediphile
seeing as how he/she goes through the whole plot unaware of his/her true nature, while all the other jedi knew all along.

That goes for Revan as well. :)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jediphile
Add to that the exile has been fleeing his/her choice at Malachor for a decade, and we have a very anti-heroic protagonist.

I wouldn't say that makes her any stronger or weaker a character. The Council exiled her, and she opportunities in the game to say that Malachor was a glorious and wonderful battle. That doesn't strike me as fleeing her choice. :)


Quote:

Originally Posted by Jediphile
I like that, but it certainly doesn't point to a strong leading character. If you want a strong female lead, then Revan would be a much better choice than Exile.

Revan I think is best as a male character. There are quite a few reasons I have for it, but they're not related to whether the Exile should be a male or female. :)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jediphile
In fact, most Star Wars protagonists probably would be, since the Exile is about the most timid and cowed protagonist I've ever seen.

There aren't many people who've gone on journeys of self-awakening while killing hundreds, defeating three Sith Lords, and saving/weakening the galaxy. :)

CSI 09-21-2006 01:45 AM

Male, makes me less feel g**, you know.

PoiuyWired 09-21-2006 01:18 PM

That is something immature to say.

Actually I prefer male Exile (yes I know canon Exile is female) Well for one I really dislike that creepy stalkiing perv scumbag of a jedi wannabe desciple. And, a male Exile does work better when it comes to Visas. With a female Exile, Atton looks too much like a Han Solo wannabe.

Well, Brianna can be done better also, but as least she is not creepy and annoying. As in, even if I get annoyed by her, I would not have the urge to jetterson her out of the airlock into hyperspace, nor would I enjoy shredding her to ribbons painfully.

And yes, Go-To should NOT be a playable character. His story is interesting yes, but for the most part he is just annoying. He can be on the ship, I have no problems with that, but playable? I think that is quite unnecessary. I rather tham give me a little pet gizka or something.

CSI 09-22-2006 09:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pottsie
Thinking about it now, I think both the Handmaiden and the Disciple should've been in the game. G0-T0 could be replaced (I tried using him and he weren't that great) and he didn't add much to the story, except see the Remote at the end. That could still happen though. Also both the Handmaiden and the Disciple are needed to advance the story.

Handmaiden's reasons:

1. To advance the story with Atris and her downfall.

2. Kreia seems to be interested with the Handmaiden.

3. Become one of the Jedi to help rebuild the Order.

4. Soon become better than her sisters.

5. Show the relationship between her and Visas (If Male PC).

Disciples's reasons:

1. To show more relationship between him and Carth.

2. Kreia seems to be interested with the Disciple.

3. Become one of the Jedi to help rebuild the Order.

4. Help find out about the Sith.

5. Show the relationship between him and Atton (If Female PC).

Pottsie is got a point. I agree on Disciple and Handmaiden should be both in game because both of them can be trained as Jedi Consular/Jedi Guardian. Well, one melee specialist, one cockpit pilot, one assassinate droid, one expert droid, 2 Jedi (Not counting Exile), one expert engineer, one historian, one bounty hunter, and a Maladore general (Who has a real army!) is perfect because everything is solved here--no more worries. But for 2 expert droids, exp. 1 of them is a *crime lord*, I hate this idea. Like I said before, if I want to play basketball with anybody, I'll first choose him.

Quote:

Originally Posted by PoiuyWired
That is something immature to say.
And yes, Go-To should NOT be a playable character. His story is interesting yes, but for the most part he is just annoying. He can be on the ship, I have no problems with that, but playable? I think that is quite unnecessary. I rather tham give me a little pet gizka or something.

I agree. Goto is pain in the a**. He sabotaged Bao-Dur's pet droid, and want Bao-Dur to upgrade for him? Forget it! If I were Bao-Dur, I'll borrow the lightsaber from Nihilus(My name to Exile) and shred him into thousands of piece-Even thinner than paper from shredder!

Vaelastraz 09-23-2006 05:43 AM

Female. Even though I'm male.

Out of all new NPCs in KOtor II, I liked Atton the best. I did never like Visasor the Handmaiden. Their personalities are so... unnatural to me :(

Anyway, Atton is a lot of fun and the interaction with him is just better when you're female. Additionally, Mical had a few interesting things to tell (apart from that I can't stand him).

bleachcreep21 09-23-2006 05:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pottsie
I've played as both and I don't mind if the Exile is a Male or a Female. Revan on the other hand has no chance of being a Female though.

I'm the exact opposite regarding KOTOR I - the game seemed much more interesting with a female Revan - especially where Carth, Malak, and Master Vrook was concerned. I like male Revan only for the fact that you can torment Bastila.

Allronix 10-09-2006 03:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Emperor Devon
What the title says, and there wasn't a thread about this already. Do you think the Exile is best as a man or a woman?


I play a LSF Revan, and can go on for pages about why that was, IMO the best story for Knights 1.

For Knights 2? Darksider Male - all the way.

First of all, Brianna had the closest thing anyone got to a full-blown story arc. She starts off the weakest, the shunned and despised product of an affair that destroyed both parents. And when she returns, she is the herald of doom for those who were stronger than her before. Mical, as great as he is for game mechanics, does not have that arc in his favor.

Second, Atris's jealousy and bitterness. OK, you could go for a Juhani and wonder if a female Exile could provoke the same reaction, but it makes more sense for her to get very bitter over someone she loved choosing Revan over her. Especially if you factor in how she could never say or do anything about her feelings to begin with because of the Order and her dogmatic approach.

Third, Kreia's speech about whether Visas's scars would "excitre" the Exile. That has to be the most freaking creepy thing I've ever heard in a game.

Fourth, Sion "loving" a female Exile makes little sense, but a couple guys jockying for power does - especially given Sion's approach to anything.


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